test
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu I am receiving posts but do not seem to be able to reply. This is a test to see if it gets through this way In reply to Carol M in Michigan. We have had a very warm winter and not enough snow. The Fjords are now shaking huge clouds of hair. I am finally going to retire again in May and resume where things left off eight years ago when I retired for the first time. Long story. But my now mature fjords are looking at me with the clearly interpretable what---you want us to work?now? ha- ha Kathy in Southern Idaho 8 fjords including stallion BDF Titian Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l
Re: Decline in Fjord Foaling numbers
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu The downturn hit all horse breeders I think. I do the Coggins testing for many of the vets in SE Idaho. Over the last three years, it seems a large portion of the horses were marked for export to the Canadian Meat Packing plants ( Idaho borders Canada and Montana, routes to Canada). I was doing 2-3,000 coggins a year just in this area. Luckily I did not see Fjords come through. this dropped the price of good horses of all breeds to a ridiculously low range. I have seen an upsurge in interest recently and have sold three nice offspring ( all in the 4-5 year range) at relatively low prices but to good homes, but due to the markets have not been breeding any for about four years. I still have a Gjest/Maryka Stallion and four brood mares and am considering breeding one or two this year. All things are cyclical but when it come to it horses are a luxury and in a poor economy are not in demand. I do not think it is a function of the breed, just overall bad times. Hopefully the rising economy will bring interest back. On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 10:50 AM, Ursula Jensen ursu...@gmail.com wrote: This message is from: Ursula Jensen ursu...@gmail.com With the economic decline and the passage of time the number of Fjords being foaled each year is down. Europe has been experiencing similar declines in their foaling rates. A noted Western trainer mentioned to me that a lot of good Western Fjord stallions are now gone or gelded. Prominent Western Fjord breeders have now retired and sold off their mares. Two of our most active brood mares are nearing the end of their career, and some of our Fjord family are approaching retirement. This all a natural progression with time but gives me pause to think about the Fjord future as a breed, in America. I am hoping for a new younger generation of Fjord owners and breeders to step forward and continue on with the breed. Just an observation-food for thought. Brian Jensen Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l
Re: bring it back
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu I found my first fjord on the list. Still have a stallion and mares that I would like to breed this year. I have not in several years, but have made some converts in this area. Life intervened and some things had to be put on hold. but I am re-retiring this year and want to get my girls driving again. I think we are an aging group, and the last 6-7 years have not been kind to horse owners. On Tue, Jan 20, 2015 at 9:27 AM, ruth bushnell fjo...@frontiernet.net wrote: This message is from: ruth bushnell fjo...@frontiernet.net Glad there are yet Fjord horse enthusiasts hanging out on Steveâs list. He is to be commended for his long and faithful service to the Fjord horse, and their owners. Many Thanks, Steve. I was trying to figure out how long it has been since I joined on.. somewhere around eighteen years maybe..? As I know weâve been here on the ranch 16 years and it was before that. I havenât taken readily to Facebook either, although I finally did sign on.. not sure why itâs so popular. Mostly photoâs and âme tooâs.â I can see where it is an effective tool for mass notification; a tool for either good or bad..? Scarcely any dialogue, which may have an appeal for those who donât write. I canât handle a large download so limit numbers of friendâs. Serious changes here too, major down-sizing. Cutting our ranch in two and selling the largest portion. 118 acres of the best sub-irrigated natural pasture grass ever! Itâs fenced, 2 lrg barns, 2 houses, and good neighbors (thatâs us =)) Gene says he will throw in a stagecoach if someone buys it at full price. Five (permanent) Fjordâs left. January thaw has brought blue skies and sunshine. Our best to all of you, hope we continue to hear more. Ruth Gene Bushnell Bushwhacker Fjords NW MT US fjo...@frontiernet.net Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l
Re: bring it back
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu Don't know if this will go through, I lurk but haven't posted in years. I don't do Facebook and am glad to see some activity. On Mon, Jan 19, 2015 at 5:33 PM, Carol Makosky cmako...@sirentel.net wrote: This message is from: Carol Makosky cmako...@sirentel.net Steve, Your Fjord story is too too funny. Maybe we should change the subject to FB revolt. I to am not interested in how many times some one blows their nose in an hour. I and many others, I think, sure are so happy you did not pull the plug. To make this Fjord related. I just fed Heidi her evening meal of a good grass hay. She also gets 2 ears of corn along with her hay each morning at the suggestion of my very good friend farrier. He thinks the hard corn munching may help knock off points on an older horses teeth. Does any one else try this? OK Time to try out my leany back chair watch anything but the depressing news on the idiot box. On 1/19/15, 4:46 PM, Steve McIlree wrote: This message is from: Steve McIlreest...@carriagehorse.com I certainly wish we could bring back the List. the silly crap that goes along with Facebook so if I end this list I'll complete lose touch with everyone I've come to know since it started. I'll round this out with a short Fjord story- -- to eat his inadequate breakfast. -- Steve -- God forbid that I should go to any heaven in which there are no horses. R.B. Cunningham Graham Built Fjord Tough Carol M. On Golden Pond N. Wisconsin Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l
Re: RFDTV gentle giants
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu near the end of the parade, just as the fjords were passing the commentator indicated that he would have to do a segment on the fjords on gentle giants On Wed, Jan 1, 2014 at 10:39 AM, Me Kint me.k...@yahoo.com wrote: This message is from: Me Kint me.k...@yahoo.com I'm watching the Rose Parade the lady commentator hosts a program Gentle Giants. She features other horses besides the large drafts. She mentioned Friesians. Why not have the NFHR contact this program to feature Fjords--gentle giants downsized. Because of Fjord size, they can do more than the large draft breeds. Point her to those who farm, combined driving, eventing (of course lower levels), hunter/jumping, dressage, pleasure driving, western pursuits, therapeutic riding programs, trail competition, etc. I've probably left something out. Great way to give our breed exposure. NFHR could put out a memo for people to submit for consideration to be selected for being featured on the program as one of the areas or disciplines that they use or compete there Fjords. Lovely weather in So Cal Mary From Mary's iPad PLEASE REMOVE ALL E-MAIL ADDRESSES BEFORE SENDING OR FORWARDING THIS EMAIL. Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l
Re: Summer-fall
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu hair growth and shedding cycles are triggered by light/dark ratios. According to the astronomical definitions the first day of fall is about the 5th of august ( halfway to the fall equinox and where the loss of daylight becomes faster) In northern climes, where our horses came from by the calendar start of fall nights are cold . leaves have changed, grass has stopped growing and winter is coming. so hair growth needs to be well ahead of temps since it grows relatively slowly. I notice a change in my guys texture of their coat by about the first or second week in august and it is no longer the sleek summer coat by the first of september. The thoutoughbred and the mule do not really change until at least a month later but if you look closely you can see the winter coat coming in.. The fact that our temps are still in the 90s and have not been cooling off at night generally has no effect on hair growth. On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 10:02 AM, Gail Russell g...@zeliga.com wrote: This message is from: Gail Russell g...@zeliga.com I do not think of this as summer shedding. I think of it as a harbinger of winter coming on as the summer coat exits. I guess I am just a pessimist! Tunix has started his summer shedding. Zoe is usually a few weeks behind. Do all breeds do this summer shedding? I can't remember what my TBs Appys did. Any of you with better memories or currently have other breeds know about this? Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l
Re: Spook etc
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu my mule is nothing if not a long eared fjord. Self preservation, a certain need to be convinced rather than coerced and a love of food. both are extremely lovable and probably closer to the wild type of horse than the domesticated form, although they have been domesticated for ages. I recently sold one of my best fillies, who of all of my fjords showed the most pormise as a laid back kids horse. The purchaser returned her after three months. Although he cited helath reasons, in talking to him, I found out she had developed a habit of kicking when cornered, chasing his cows and his dogs, testing his fences and wanting to eat everything. all very mulelike. Of note, this was his only horse on the place. The mule is herd protector, taking on any thing that is not in her herd, whether coyote, dog or moose. He returned her as a suspicious high strung filly, but she is calming down. On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 9:13 AM, Me Kint me.k...@yahoo.com wrote: This message is from: Me Kint me.k...@yahoo.com A while back someone mentioned that fjords can have a little mule in their behavior or something like that. Not being familiar with mules, would someone explain? I have observed that my few fjords are different from the variety of horses I have hadmaybe I just know more now but seems that I have to work more with the fjord mind. Anybody have mules fjords? What similarities do you observe? From Mary's iPad PLEASE REMOVE ALL E-MAIL ADDRESSES BEFORE SENDING OR FORWARDING THIS EMAIL. Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l
Re: Spook etc
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu The comment about the filly being bored is probably very true. They will find ways to amuse themselves. There is a lot to be said for maturity. I sold two other fjords this spring, both of which were four and five years old, barely started under saddle. I get a call at least once a week from the owner, absolutely thrilled to death with them and their progress. She has taken them slowly and now is able to ride both of them out in the woods, on roads and her 10 year old daughter will be riding one in the 4th of July parade. I was reluctant to sell the younger filly - a two year old - and am glad to have her back. I tried to have him take one of the older horses but he wanted one he could start his way. IAll the youngsters have similar breeding and the same start. Re mules and watching other horses. I had a farrier that my horses loved and respected. The mule insisted on going first or her feelings were hurt. He was trained by the Amish who told him that with the mule, the first time you do it, let him watch the other horses, process the fact that they were ok and then they will be fine. I have problems finding farriers who are not afraid of the mule- she is a catalonian/thoroughbred and stands about 17 hands tall. After the first session, where he did her last, she was his buddy forever. On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 12:43 PM, Rovena Kessinger ro_k...@yahoo.comwrote: This message is from: Rovena Kessinger ro_k...@yahoo.com From the time I've spent with mine, I cannot imagine putting a young fjord by itself with a bunch of kids. That sounds like a disaster waiting to happen, which I guess it was. --- On Thu, 6/20/13, Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu wrote: From: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu Subject: Re: Spook etc To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Date: Thursday, June 20, 2013, 12:49 PM This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu my mule is nothing if not a long eared fjord. Self preservation, a certain need to be convinced rather than coerced and a love of food. both are extremely lovable and probably closer to the wild type of horse than the domesticated form, although they have been domesticated for ages. I recently sold one of my best fillies, who of all of my fjords showed the most pormise as a laid back kids horse. The purchaser returned her after three months. Although he cited helath reasons, in talking to him, I found out she had developed a habit of kicking when cornered, chasing his cows and his dogs, testing his fences and wanting to eat everything. all very mulelike. Of note, this was his only horse on the place. The mule is herd protector, taking on any thing that is not in her herd, whether coyote, dog or moose. He returned her as a suspicious high strung filly, but she is calming down. On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 9:13 AM, Me Kint me.k...@yahoo.com wrote: This message is from: Me Kint me.k...@yahoo.com A while back someone mentioned that fjords can have a little mule in their behavior or something like that. Not being familiar with mules, would someone explain? I have observed that my few fjords are different from the variety of horses I have hadmaybe I just know more now but seems that I have to work more with the fjord mind. Anybody have mules fjords? What similarities do you observe? From Mary's iPad PLEASE REMOVE ALL E-MAIL ADDRESSES BEFORE SENDING OR FORWARDING THIS EMAIL. Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw FH_L Shirts: http://tinyurl.com/8yky94l
Re: 24/7 for fjords?
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel spiek...@isu.edu On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 10:40 AM, S K windyacre...@yahoo.com wrote: Re self regulate feed? I have a herd of 11 Fjords and three brunettes. They will self regulate only within strong fences. Mine have access to pasture 24/7 and I now feed them a bale ( 60 lbs between them all) of coarse grass hay. My pasture ( 10 acres) is short and not lush but has remained green this year. REgardless of how much you feed them and how fat they are, they are such a food driven beastie that they will move heaven and earth ( and my buck fences) to get that piece on the other side . the mature mares get a little on the tubby side in June but the rest of them stay nice and trim. They all slim down in the late summer , fall and winter. Last week I had a three year old who found a hole in the fence between my pasture and the neighbors. It was left as a small gap to walk through with neither of us dreaming that a horse could get through. Well she did, and had to really force the issue and pigged out on the more lush pasture on the other side and then her fat gut would not fit through the hole again. Kind of like a snake eating a rat. I ended up having to jack out a fence post, peel back the fence and then dribble a line of grain to get her back on the right side. ( I had tried to lead her through the hole through which she had come but when the posts touched her sides she refused. and then would not come anywhere near the hole). The neighbor was gone and had a lock on his gates so I could not take her through his place and around. All the time the rest of the herd was eying the now wider hole and the tall grass on the other side, the neighbors horses were eying my pasture. I was alone trying to fend of the opposing camps at the same time trying to get the lone piggy back where she belonged. I could have cheerfully shot them all on the spot but it was funny later. Without electric fences, my crew will demolish just about any fence except five stranded barbed wire or steel pipe to get to grass. They just put their heads through and push hard, usually more than one at a time. I had 35 tons of hay delivered for the winter ( September-May) and they counted every one of the bales as they went into the stack. 20-22 lbs/day/horsein fall and winter keeps them in good condition and they have the pasture for exercise but there is no nutrition. Kathy in McCammon Idaho Important FjordHorse List Links: Subscription Management: http://tinyurl.com/5msa7e FH-L Archives: http://tinyurl.com/rcepw Classified Ads: http://tinyurl.com/5b5g2f
temperament
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have a mule, a thoroughbred, aTB/QH cross and a Fjord. I am enjoying the heck out of driving and riding the fjord and driving the mule. If I had it to do over I would stick with the mule and the Fjord, but it is not because they are easier.They are different and more demanding than the more traditional horses because they both force you to respect their exceptional strength and their personality. In reading the list, everyone sings the virtues of the Fjord as being very easy. I would suspect that they are very easy to train improperly and that much of the reputation for being ponyish or mulish is because their temperament is so forgiving and calm, as owners we are willing to forgive a lot of indiscretions and maybe do not get them to their full potential. For example, I have my mule driving but a professional trainer with mule experience could not get her to round pen. He told me to work with her until I found the key to moving her forward on command and then build on that, that to insist on her acting like a QH would not work. Advice I follow on the Fjord. For a trainer who depends on the roundpen method as the foundation for a training program ( most of the western trainers around here) she is stubborn. To me she is a sweetheart and as long as I respect her, I will eventually get her to learn what I need for her to learn.The fjord and the mule take everything in stride but when the mood strikes, they will push to the limit, including ground manners. When you let them know they have overstepped, the immediate contrition is funny to watch adn they are suddenly as pure as the driven snow. A driving trainer at a CDE clinic this weekend was working with me and my fjord and four other horses and drivers. We were working on collection and getting the horses to work on the bit.He was pleasantly surprised by my Fjord and complimented her on her way of going, walk, trot, willingness to go and was absolutely sure she was unusual for a fjord. He thought she was 15 hands tall. ( she is barely 14hh) and confided that he had trained two and was training a third fjord. He said his experience was that they were ponyish with ponyish gaits and the third one was either stubborn or too smart. Obviously some people do have this opinion and it is based on experience. However, as I watched him work with the five horses, he was somewhat frustrated that he could alter the behavior of the other four horses so fast, but it took him a longer time to figure out the fjord. He was asking her to break at the poll and work on the bit, a position that for this horse was very unatural - even in the pasture, she runs like her head is a snorkle- neck straight up and head parallel to the ground. Once he figured out her cue, she immediately looked beautiful and he said she could easily do an 8 or 9 on the dressage test, but it really hurt his pride I think because he could not use the same tactics on the Fjord as the hotter horses. He apologized for not being able to do a quick fix, as if that were expected. I certainly did not, I was looking for some help in figuring out what we should be doing and was happy with the session. I know that this is something that we will work on slow and steady for the next couple of months. Long story short, maybe some of the reputation is from experience and maybe as owners and trainers we are partially responsible for that reputation by not respecting the differences between these horses and the more common ones and giving people the impression that all you have to do is treat them nice and they will be instantly trained. Just a thought
Re: weight of rider for Fjords
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Frederick J. Pack wrote: This message is from: Frederick J. Pack [EMAIL PROTECTED] Shelly, I think a general rule is 20% of the horses weight. Fred All Mail is scanned in AND out by Norton Anti-virus 2003. Fred and Lois Pack Pack's Peak Stables Wilkeson, Washington 98396 http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/3158 I think there was a discussion a while ago on this list and a formula given. Does anyone have it?. At 20% of a horses weight most of these quarter horses with heavy western saddles would be over mounted. I think it had less to do with weight than structure of the legs? Kathy
Re: Cougar
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] jgayle wrote: This message is from: jgayle [EMAIL PROTECTED] We finally heard the sound of real rain yesterday and last night. My gardener saw a big cougar about 100 feet from my barn on Friday. Jean Walters Gayle Montesano, WA 98563 Your rain hit us last night with maybe more on the way - this is our driest stretch since they began keeping records. We often have cougars come in, usually they are youngsters, either just separated or moving through - this time of year it is because of the water around the place - the older ones are usually more wary and do not let you see them. . I do not know of a reliable way to keep them away - activity -noise - lights are all said to help. Keep the little critters in at night. When ours are around, the smaller predators ( foxes, coyotes, dogs and feral cats) disappear. They have not attacked the horses but will spook them so they run through fences. On another note. First place in both the pleasure driving class and the cones course at the Eastern Idaho State Fair on saturday were won by a Fjord ( and owner) from Jackson Hole. I did not remember their names well enough to attempt here. My fjord picked the pleasure class to have a blonde moment and decided to race the arab across the arena. First time she has ever broken out of the trot in harness. Not a true runaway since I got her shut down fairly fast but a short thrilling ride in an old black buggy. I have videos of the event and she does look sharp, and the judges were watching, lost hat and whip in the dash- but not quite the appropriate gait for the class. Even so-we didn't come in last and placed in the cones right after with a clean run. I deliberately took her slow so she wouldn't get the idea that the fair was for racing. The competition was held immediately adjacent to the carnival rides and the race track where they were running Indian relay races while we were showing. The Fjords were not at all upset about the rides or the racing but mine startled at the loudspeaker several times and in watching the videos, the announcer and the loudspeaker are what she decided to spook at. ( or just took advantage of the situation) The people from Jackson who won both cones and driving class had a beautifully behaved gelding on a wooden road cart. Nothing fancy but nice and fit the horse. Although getting a little hair and sporting the Fjord well filled look he was well trimmed and had obviously been driven a lot. The lady driving looked neat and quite nice in hat, gloves, white shirt and slacks. I think she said she had never competed in pleasure driving before so a thumbs up. Having two fjords there was a first and generated a lot of questions and interest, especially when one of them won both classes. Next year, we are trying to get a whole afternoon or morning and in a better place ( better surface and away from the carnival) with additional classes -single,double, two and four wheeled and various cones-possibly an obstacle course. I will keep the list posted if it happens, would be relatively easy for Wyoming, Idaho and northern Utah drivers.There will be a cones clinic and playday on October 25th in Pocatello, Idaho. Let me know if anyone is interested. Boarding facilities for overnight could probably be arranged. Kathy in Southern Idaho
Re: Carol raising standards
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] ruth bushnell wrote: This message is from: ruth bushnell [EMAIL PROTECTED] Carol, Now you've gone and done it! =)) Just when I complimented your Fjord tutoring tendencies too. Your current letter regards raising the standards rather nettled me... I I too, like the more relaxed (do not read lower) western standards. We enter a show tomorrow ( pleasure driving and a cones class at the Eastern Idaho State FAir) to have fun and to show off what we think are fine horses and vehicles. We also do it to get people interested in pleasure driving with their horses, show that there is an interest and try to expand the offerings and classes. Some of us also do it to engender interest in our own particular horses-(read potential customers for our colts). Most of all it is a wonderful opportunity to meet people with similar interests. I wholeheartedly agree that presentation and preparation are important - clean and well conditioned vehicles and horses and tack. Dress as if you are proud of your entry but I feel it should be appropriate to your rig and horse. I do drive the original vehicles as were driven in the West ( original 100 year old buggy and springwagon), some of us drive newer roadcarts and marathon rigs too. We all find a lot of the English accoutrements too expensive and certainly not in keeping with the rigs but we welcome the entries from Jackson Hole who are dressed to the hilt and look mighty sharp. A driving apron and tophat look really out of place on my buggy though and the modern steel vehicles are not nearly as graceful as the old BUT in an english driving class they are appropriate. So, why not compromise and encourage and allow both types of shows or classes and enter the kind of show in which you feel the most comfortable. Just a thought as I leave work to go touch up the paint nicks on the spokes of the buggy, grease the leathers in the hubs - not built with bearings, clean the seats with armourall, polish the harness and clean the green spots off the blonde horse for the State Fair tomorrow. ( and find my brown driving gloves ( isotoners that double for winter car driving gloves), straw sun hat that I do use elsewhere, and casual jacket, slacks and a turtle neck. Kathy in Southern Idaho
Re: embryo transplant reply
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jean Ernest wrote: This message is from: Jean Ernest [EMAIL PROTECTED] Well, the idea fascinates me, also, as I also have a biology background. . etc.) the synchronization of the recipient mare's estrous cycle with the donor mare's, plus all the procedures necessary to retrieve the embryo (In the blastula stage I beleive), plus placing it in the recipient mare's uterus would seem much too involved to warrant it. Or importing an embryo, rather than a grown horse from another country might also be a good reason to do embryo transplants! Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska, thankful for the lack of forest fires, but darned sick of all this rain. Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] After I replied the first time it struck me that the two mules I have are from the same mother as the TB/QH I talked about and their temperament is totally different from either their half sister or their mother, so it would be interesting to see if Fjords are the same way. Yes, this experiment would be mainly to help someone work the bugs out, but if it worked, then I have the added bonus of a second foal the first year from the mare I have, but obviously at no savings in expense since I would assume two breed fees and similar mare care. You are right about commercial expense. Folks who do this usually have a whole herd of young recip mares, several of them synchronized to the donor mare. I do have two mares though that I would not breed again for myself. Send me the rain -we are entering history making drought in our little corner of Idaho with the fires to go with it. In my drive to work I pass at least five burned out areas that have not only blackened the hillsides but burned homes. Kathy in southern Idaho
Re: embryo transplant reply
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jean Ernest wrote: This message is from: Jean Ernest [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi KAthy, Wouldn't it be Much MUCH less expensive to simply buy a good Fjord weanling or yearling rather than go through all the expense and trouble of doing an embryo transplant? who would be raised by this mare. Very interesting! * Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jean - You are absolutely right and I will be buying more Fjords I just happen to have a best friend who is a vet and has a stallion station and gone to embryo transplant school and since I am going to breed my Fjord in the spring anyway we were wondering if anyone had done it. I would be an understanding first client to work the bugs out with and have a biology background so find it fascinating. But- you bring up an excellent point about personality of the surrogate mom possibly rubbing off on the kid. Kathy
various and embryo transplant
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] I totally agree that you should find the horse with which you are most comfortable and let the rest be hanged. If I had had my Fjord earlier, I would have had far fewer horses. I Am seriously thinking of using my thoroughbred/Qh and thoroughbred mares as recip mares for embryo transplant - from a fjord of course. TheTB/QH is absolutely gorgeous, but too exciteable in the mountains for me and I would not trust her as a driving horse. I bred her specifically because the friends I have really loved that cross for trail riding because they can really move out--- and they were convinced that in order to keep up I would need the same kind of horse or a good riding mule. I have a young mule out of the same mare as my TB/QH cross and I agree she will be an awsome mount as long as you are not afraid of heights, but we all have a new respect for the Fjord. . My four year old Fjord just took her first real trail ride in the mountains last week, accompanied by an equally green 4 year old riding mule and an 20 year old steady eddy TB/QH. On this one ride she learned about trail bikes, deer, moose, ponying another horse and crossing rapidly moving water, slipping down a short steep slope and recovering with a rider. And you know what? Those short little legs kept up just fine with the others in spite of at least a 10 inch difference in height. People underestimate the power and athleticism because of the build. I felt confident because it was like riding a six wheel drive gator up those hills. The mule was also steady but insisted on putting the Fjord between himselff and anything really suspicious - probably figured the bears would eat the fat pony first and give him a chance to get away. Actually Jill is not at all fat but has the same girth as the big horses. The day after the trail ride she entertained a group of kids in the arena for half the afternoon and a nine year old girl started riding her english over ground poles. Tomorrow we take her to the county fair for a pleasure driving competition and cones course. If I could have managed to leave her there we would have competed in ladies draft cart class and I think done well. The only thing that comes near this kind of versatility and steadiness in my small group is the mule. The mule and her full brother ( thoroughbred/catalonian) will be a very classy (tall)driving team in another year so I was interested to hear about the draft mules in the CDE competition. The gentleman who helps me train the fjord ( and me) will be working this winter with us on low level dressage to put some collection and polish on her and me. All in all, even though the initial investment may be higher, this is the most used horse that I own and worth her weight in gold to me because I am so much more comfortable with her. Anything any of the other horses can do, she can do ( except win a speed race- unless it is over sagebrush). Now back to my original question - has anyone out there had experience or know of anyone with experience using embryo transplant and recipient mares with Fjords? Kathy in Southern Idaho
Re: mosquitoes and bats
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bats are nice and as long as you are aware of the danger of rabies they should be encouraged . The infection rate in some areas of the country is considerably higher than one half of one percent - closer to ten but still no reason not to encourage them. However, to make this horse appropriate - horses, cats and people can contract rabies from bats. There are also other reservoirs such as skunks and foxes. A good safety rule, vaccinate the animals you have when there is a safe and effective vaccine for them and if you do have bats on the premises, if they are acting unusually - stay clear of them. In the last few years in Eastern Idaho we have had one horse and several domestic cats infected. The horse was a nightmare ( no pun intended), and the cats necessitated several people having prophylactic treatment. If my info is correct, the rabies strain in all three was traceable to bats. If the bat has been caught by your barn cat, something is wrong. If the bat is on the ground or flopping, do not pick it up or allow your animals to play with it. If it is active during daylight and not because you have distrubed the roost-something is wrong. Rabies weakens and causes them to act abnormally, but may not kill them immediately. If you do have one that you suspect, send the body intact and unsquashed to your public health department (call first for specific instructions) and immediately corral the animals it has contacted. The health department can arrange the appropriate lab tests, but timing and transport is important. The same advice goes for skunks and foxes and raccoons in certain parts of the country. Kathy Fjord owner but also Program Director Clinical Lab Sciences program-Idaho State University and long time ago assistant in bat research projects.
Re: non-synthetic wormers
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] SAFreivald wrote: This message is from: SAFreivald [EMAIL PROTECTED] An old time harness racer that I knew fed his horses and ponies cigarette tobacco routinely. The horses loved it and he swore that it took care of any/all worms/intestinal parasites. Anybody have any specifics? Sue Freivald. The active ingredient is nicotine-it is also used an insecticide in gardens. Pretty hard to dose and by no means as safe as the commercial wormers-there you can have a 10x overdose and probably not do anything-here(using nicotine) an overdose can be fatal. Acute nicotine poisoning is a problem with children who get into ashtrays or cigarets. Kathy Spiegel Idaho State University
Re: restrictions on fjordhorse-digest
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Actually the list is like a kitchen table disucssion and I for one have enjoyed it - there is a lot of substance to it and it makes for lively reading - However, when you do get controversial subjects, as with an argument around the table, tempers flare and people think that by shouting louder they can change other peoples minds- it doesn't happen. . At the kitchen table though we can smile at each other and agree to disagree and move on - with the list it is a little harder to do that. I was once in the uncomfortable situation of having to formally mediate between two very vocal and outrageously indignant professors, just as on the list the tone got more and more personal. Neither was going to change the others mind and the things we had convened to discuss were being left by the wayside and sooner or later something irretractable would have been said. I ended the disussion by simply stating Will you both agree that you disagree- neither of you will change the other's mind and thats OK and now lets get on with other things. It worked and that is exactly what Steve has done. That takes guts to do and it has to be done by an outside person ( one not involved in the discussion). Since people are freer with what they say on line than face to face you run the chance when you do that of having the prior combatants team up and turn on you. So - hats off to Steve. There has to be a benign mediator and a rule maker to occasionally smile and say lets move on. Kathy in SE Idaho where I am going to leave work and go ride my fjord.
Re: crossbreeding
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] As conservators of the fjord in North America it is admirable to be concerned about keeping the breed pure - however, it might cool things down to reflect on exactly what a breed is. Humans are inveterate tinkerers, particularly when it comes to their horses/dogs/ cats/ other livestock and plants. Always have been and always will be. All the breeds of horses are one species. When you look at the genetic makeup there is an incredibly small genetic difference between the breeds - in fact there is surprisingly little difference between mice and men and even less between men and chimps. Over time as tinkerers we have limited the gene pool on selected populations of horses by selecting for and against currently desirable or undesirable traits. We have selected in essence a group of horses of another color (breed). If all the horse breeds were allowed to run free in a mixed herd, before too many generations a new breed would arise which combines those traits that are either advantageous or at least not harmful to the survival of the horses in that environment. The horses would probably resemble each other fairly closely. This type of experiment has been done with dogs, and within a short period of time, even well mixed populations evolve into nondescript, sandy haired, medium coated dogs that weigh about 35-45 pounds and at first glance are indistinguishable from each other. The breeds that we become so attached to are simply selected populations whose evolution has beens artificially directed to please our tastes, eyes, or sporting fancy. When the selective pressure changes ( ie. we want faster taller horses, fatter turkeys or dogs suited to a particular job ) the breed changes but our horses remain horses, but horses with even fewer options for adapatation. One problem that occurs as we narrow these gene pools too much is that there is less genetic diversity. In well controlled husbandry, humans regulate environmental pressures and disease. With low levels of diversity ( narrow gene pools), new viruses, diseases, environmental changes, and climatic changes may do in these purebred strains while sparing populations with greater diversity. Also in artificial environments, gene alleles resulting in deletorius changes may silently increase in frequency, along with the ones that are being selected for, simply as a result of the selection of the breeding stock and the protective effects of human husbandry. As conservators of breeds, we need to be aware of this and should be very careful about severely limiting genetic pools and making ironclad rules. Most of the differences in breeds of horses are in alleles that code for very visible but maybe not physiologically significant traits like stature, coat color, head shape etc. Other hidden ones may code for things like hppy in quarterhorses ( impressive bred), metabolic diseases in drafties, eye problems in Rocky mountain horses, fatal white in paints. Just a thought. Kathy in SE Idaho
Re: Gelding wanted/boomproof?
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Can I make a suggestion for the timid person looking for the well trained gelding. You may not find exactly what you want, and even if you do, the communication between horse and rider will not be instantaneous. Find a good trainer who will work with you and the horse even if you do find one well trained. Riding lessons alone, without the connection to the horses mind that you are using may help but you will get a lot more if you focus also on the horses behaviour. Start at the beginning ( even if it is review for the horse and you) so you know why horses respond the way they do and how they are motivated. It may not be the only way but I can attest that if you know why your horse does what it does and how to modify that behaviour, your enjoyment and ease and trust in the animal while riding will increase enormously. Don't be afraid to tell the trainer how you feel about riding. I went to several workshops, found a trainer whose methods and results I admired and asked for his help. He took my fjord for a month to get her started and worked with both her and me, explaining why and how he was doing things and then letting me do them. We meet back every 4 to 8 weeks and check up on progress and advance to new things. This trainer also genuinely enjoys the people too - necessary in a riding instructor for timid riders. I can make a mistake and laugh about it and I can tell him I do not understand what he is trying to tell me. -- Attilla the hun riding instructors will not do for some of us. The horse and I are learning together - it is the best money I have ever spent, and it has done wonders for my confidence. I feel I am investing in a partnership that should last a lifetime - mine and hers. Kathy in SE IDaho
new lister in Southeast Idaho?
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have been gone and my e-mail filled up and bounced back messages. As I was cleaning things up I noticed a comment from a returning lister with a fjord in Southeast Idaho? Or did I misread before I hit delete?. If there are any other fjord owners on the list in this part of the state I would love to know. I am involved with an informal group of people who like to drive, ride and have events and training clinics you might be interested in. It is not a fjord group , nor is it formal at all and includes everyone from vets to engineers - college professors and archeologists-- but they are all friendly toward fjords - Jillian ( my fjord) has made quite an impression -they call her the humvee ( respectfully of course) I have a small farm about 30 miles south of Pocatello outside of McCammon but keep my Fjord for the winter at the Rock-n-horse arena ( you can see it and Jillian from the flying Y junction between I-86 and I-15) in Pocatello - close to work. So if I didn't misread-or there are any other lurkers in the area contact me if you want to be notified when we do fun things. Kathy Outside McCammon, Idaho ( where we finally just got about 6 inches of much wanted snow-we need 6 feet more)
Re: Items on eBay
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jean Ernest wrote: This message is from: Jean Ernest [EMAIL PROTECTED] I can't think of her name at the moment, but she has been on this list and may still be. She has had Fjord greeting cards in the past. Does anyone know who the person from Columbia Station, OH is that has all of the Fjord items on eBay? Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Try Ingrid Ivic (sp) - She is a neat lady and I think the one you are talking about - I also think she is on the list. I bought my mare from her two years ago. Also Re old knowlege : I took my mare to a workshop this spring being given by an old time draft horse driver. I kept gettting gee and haw mixed up when ever I got flustered - he confided in me that it was perfectly acceptable to tell them right and left which I now do quietly. The horse is smart enough to pick up the difference between the commands and I do not confuse her. Kathy
Re: twenty-one questions-
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] I am not a serious breeder but am building a small herd of mares to be able to in the near future but I would probably never buy a stallion for the following reasons. The press on Titan is wonderful and anyone would probably give their eyeteeth to be able to own him. But within in the advertizement itself lie some of the reasons that very few will reply. One is the subtly or not so subtly stated expectation that the horse will be campaigned, shown etc. and that if anyone is interested, they must meet a very rigid inspection. This is common with any breed. You have to prove they are worth breeding, not just have wonderful papers. This takes time , money and expertise. The people who gravitate toward fjords are probably more laid back than a lot of the other horse people, and this is not what they want to do - I am not knocking the ones that do-they do the entire breed a service. If you want to recoup your investment in a stud you have to be able to breed to outside mares or have a pretty large string of unrelated mares, from which you cannot recruit replacements and whose offspring must go off the place. ( unless you build a stable of different studs). And to get that interest in using your stud, you have to prove him . Two is the eyeteeth- it is expensive to do this kind of campaigning , training and managing and realistically, there is not the kind of spread in prices of Fjords that you see in other breeds to drive the enterprise The rewards are not in it monetarily to make that investment at this time. Not knocking fjords - they are my choice of any breed, but the market clamoring to pay what they are worth is just not there yet - at least here in the west, where well bred using TBs and QH may go for less than the breed fee as weanlings but those currenty in fashion with specific bloodlines proven in cutting and reining may go for Astonomical prices regardless of conformation, and depending on whose progeny wins the big shows, that demand will shift in a year or two.. Three- only people who are willing to take on the liabilities and expenses of a stallion will do it and they are probably not too plentiful- a stalliion is a stallion and regardless of the temperament of the breed it should be a major responsibility to own one. Four-Just as someone else has said, with the other three brothers, breeding, as good as they are, some of us have a problem finding a stallion that is not related to our mare. I have a Gest grandaughter that I dearly love and want to breed and I will try to select the very best stallion that I can afford and get her to that I will, but she is related too closely to at least five of them. WE do need some additional bloodlines, better distribution etc. What about syndication or consortia of interested breeders as an alternative to one owner?
Re: soliciting suggestions
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] I am looking for suggestions for a vehicle suitable for both pleasure driving on paved and dirt roads and usable for cones and driving competition. I have antique vehicles but they are restored and parts of them particularly the undercarrieages are over a hundred years old. With metal fatique and dried out wood, they are classy and fun to drive but have their liabilities. I know that this list will have some good suggestions. Kathy In southern Idaho where we just got 2 of incredibly welcome rain - we have had 4 inches since last October 1. Wouldn't you know it rained on the last day of the state fair and our driving and cones competition. It had been so long since we have had a good rain that my Fjord did not recognize a mud puddle. Thought it was the ocean.
Re: Health Question
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] I forgot to add - someone on this list may have access to the reference ranges for hematology and chemistry values specific to the Fjord horse. Our reference ranges were established using mainly quarter horse and TB. I do know that they are different for Arabians and I would guess that the draft breeds will be even more different. Just from observations of other mammals I would guess that the hemoglobin/hematocrit may differ significantly from the hotter breeds. ( should be lower) while the MCV and MCHC should be similar. If this horse evolved at high altitudes the MCV in theory will be lower. If these values are not available, I would be willing to coordinate a project to help get them determined and published. Ditto chemistry values. I have one Fjord and it takes at least one hundred samples to establish a reliable start to a data base. The samples would also have to represent various age groups and stallions/geldings and mares as well as different geographic regions ( particularly altitude when looking at hematology values). I can provide sample containers and mailing containers and probably shipping to get samples here. It would be best to involve and include your own veterniarians and and their instruments in such a study and do an even more extensive comparison-that way we could see also how much variation there was in the methods being used. Also ultimately it is the veterinarian who uses the clinical data to make a diagnosis and it is done in conjunction with signs and symptoms and history. Laboratory data should NEVER be used as the sole diagnositc criterion. ( I will get off my soap box - I teach my own students, Pharmacists and Physician assistants and the concept that is the hardest to convey is that a lab test is only used to assist in a diagnosis - it does not make it ). Any intererst? Kathleen Spiegel Ph.D. Program Director Clinical Laboratory Science Program Idaho State University Pocatello, Idaho [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Health Question
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Before you get too exited about the blood tests, make sure that they are performed with an instrument and laboratory using methods, instruments and reference ranges that are specifically designed or adjusted for animals and not humans. AND htat there is an adequate reference range established for horses and in particular Fjords. My specialty is Laboratory medicine including hematology and I have owned and managed veterinary testing labs. The albumin test most frequently used clinically uses a dye called bromcresyl purple for albumin. It works for humans but underestimates animal albumins except for cows. The lab should be using bromcresyl green which works better. Same for determining anemia. There is a tremendous variation among the different mammals on size , shape and hemoglobin concentration of their red cells. While most human hematology analyzers work well with humans and dogs, without major modifications results for cats and horses are questionable and camelids are undoable. Goats and sheep do not register either. Most of these groups, with the exception of dogs appear anemic if human criteria are used. Thats why you need to use a lab that has established refgerence ranges for different animals and even different breeds. Kathy
fjord mule
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have a thoroughbred, a quarter horse/TB , a mule ( sister to the cross and daughter of the TB) and a Fjord. Although I have no desire to make a fjord mule, it really might be a wonderful cross. Both the mule and Fjord are very very similar in temperament and trainability. They are not governed as much by the flight response as the horses and I would trust both of them further than either of the horses. Their response to new situations is incredible.Their devotion to people and their intelligence ( and playful personality) is several notches higher than the horses. They do share a trait that has been mentioned in the posts on childrens horses and that is incredible strength, particulalrly in their necks and a different attittude toward authority. You cannot be just a passenger on either the fjord or the mule - they constantly look for direction and if you don't give it they are quite confident of their own direction. They too must realize the similarities. At home, my Fjords all time best buddy is the mule - they look like mutt and jeff one short blonde one tall elegant brunette ( yes some mules are simply elegant) At the place I have her for training, she fell instantly in love with the mule next to her ( and he her). Given the proper training, this little fjord mule in the post might be awsome. Kathy in Idaho
Re: questions about anemia
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I had my fjord's blood tested recently and it came back that she is anemic. I was curios what you all might suggest, or recommend as far as vitamins go. I have had Morgan's that were anemic before, but if I put them on something like red cell, they became extremely hyper, even if the were usually calm/ fjord like :). If you have any suggestions I would truly appreciate it. Thanks Amy Ebbert Anemia is not a disease itself but may arise as part of many diseases. This is where you really need your vet to find out why if possible and help you select the treatment of choice. Anemia can be nutritional, it can occur because of a chronic disease or parasitism.It can be a symptom of some not very nice diseases. Why did you have a blood test done in the first place? Were there symptoms? Kathy Spiegel
Re: Manure management
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] That stuff is brown gold! Over the years I have landscaped two acres of rockpiles using it. I just move the rocks out to the perimeter of where I want a garden ( that leaves a hole because there is no dirt here) add manure-make sure it stays damp for the first season ( not sopping) turn it a couple of times then use it as a garden the next year. An add in the local paper might get you people who will haul it away for you. There is an increase in gardeners who are interested in organic or natural methods. The stuff in the pastures we break up with a harrow a couple of times a year. However, we are talking three or four horses on 15 acres so it only builds up around the mangers and waterers ( and the paths they use in the winter because they do not want to get their little feet wet.) Looks funny in the spring because you have these lush green lines crisscrossing the pastures. In this area - you could add tons to the acre and only marginally increase the fertility of the ground up rock that passes for soil. I take all of it they will give me. Used straw and moldy hay or bedding mixed with manure goes between the trees as mulch a foot or more deep. After a couple of years of doing this, a marginal layer of soil builds up that you can use for garden. I also scrounge leaves in the fall from town and haul them out by the truckload to go on top of everything ( looks nicer than straw).This management style may not do in areas with high rainfal or humidity and the cows across the street don't mind but your neighbors might object. Kathy in Southern Idaho
Re: positive reinforcement..
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] As an educator (people) and long time supervisor - I will add amen to the positive reinforcement. --people or animals regardless of position. It doesn't mean relaxing rigor or expectations, just a far more powerful and expedient way to guide individuals to achieve to the best of their ability. Unfortunately, it is not always an innate response to keep your cool and accentruate the positive when what you would really like to do is twist off their heads and spit down their windpipes ( a method of training favored by some of my colleagues) and most of us need reminding. On another subject - anyone in the vicinity of Southeastern Idaho- there will be a driving clinic on Saturday March 2-starting at 9 AM at the Rock-N-Horse Arena in Pocatello Idaho. Participants $30.00-Observers $15.00. There will be a program in the morning which will include fitting harnesses - starting horses to drive and other topics. There will then be times to work with individual participants throughout the day. There is an indoor and outdoor arena and there will be two clinicians. In the late afternoon, they will do some demonstrations on starting green horses - one mule and one fjord. Del Barney and his son will conduct the clinic. They are part of the multigenerational Barney family from the upper valley who for many years been the premier drivers, showers and breeders of draft horses and mules. ( They also seem to win most of the competitions, from Big hitches to ladies cart classes).This clinic is not part of a formal club or anything, just a group of people who like to drive or would like to learn to drive who got together and asked for help. It should be a fun and relaxed event and a chance to meet people with similar interests. Contact me if you are interested and I will put you in touch with the organizers. If you are bringing your horse from a distance, there may be stabling arrangements available. There will also be refreshments. Kathy in SE Idaho - where I see the posts from Fairbanks and wonder if I should move north - this weekend was the first day we had a low that was near zero ( it has been 15 - 33 below forever) and the high got close to 30 ( 0-10 has been all we could manage) Don't let it scare you off from the clinic though- Pocatello runs 20 or more degrees warmer than my house.
harness questions
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have a few questions about harness. I have a Fjord that I will be driving this year and have decided to probably go with Camptown Harness Biothane for her but the question I have relate to the half of a mule team I also have. The other half is owned by someone else and we just went to talk to a local harness maker about a set of harness. He is an old timer, does beutiful work but as an artist, he makes his kind of harness. He uses what he calls a Yankee britchin which he claims pulls down on the butt of the horse rather than forward when the horse brakes a vehicle going downhill or to slow it down. He says he has made harness for fjord teams and I know he does some very large workhorses around here. The advantage to using a local one is he can fit these mules as he goes. The disadvantage is that his style appears to be different than the little bit I am familiar with. These are tall, more refined mules than the Belgian cross mules they use around here for the heavy wagons. They will mature out at 16+ hands - thoroughbred and Catalonian background - and will be more like carriage horses than heavy draft. They will be hitched to several antique buggies and probably a buckboard - nothing heavier. He can make the harnesses so they can also be used as a single with shafts. He also puts lots of spots on -( cleaning ugh) and claims the stainless steel is easier than the nickel or chrome to keep clean. He also recommends biothane for all tugs and lines but generally makes the rest of the harness from leather, with biothan interlayers at major stress points and where the bridle attaches to the bit - or he can go all synthetic . My questions- Is anyone familiar with this yankee britchin and has anyone on the list had harness made by this guy. Monte Piqued of Ucon Idaho ( North of Idaho Falls ). He is in his mid seventies and only accepts orders for a limited number of harness each year. I visited his shop and was impressed, but at this stage I am probably easily impressed since I do not know a whole lot. The owner of the other half of the team has experience with older workhorse and mule harness from her own fathers farming days, but we will want to show this pair too. Since this list has so many people with diverse experience, I couldn.t think of a better group to ask. I am open to any suggestions and opinions, and if you have any personal comments about this guy you can e-mail me privately if you do not want it to go to the whole list. Thanks in advance Kathy in Southern Idaho - We are anticipating a major snow dump tonight and tomorrow. The last real stuff we had was just after thanksgiving and it is still around at my house.
Re: Thanks list, an answer to prayer
This message is from: Kathleen Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi there list, First, thank you to those who responded to my plea for help. You just proved once more that there are some sincere people out there that truly care about others. I got answers from southern Ca. to Alaska, and their hearts were open for my needs. Thank you a thousand times. As you know from my first post, the problem was the inability for me to financially afford to transport my beloved Fjord here and have a place for him to stay. This of course is a temporary situation I can assure you. My new business in Salem will flourish, and I will soon be back on my feet. In the mean time, I now need to have him transported here from Half-moon Bay California to Catherine Lassesen's ranch, HESTEHAVEN in Days Creek, which she says is located south of Roseburg and north of Grant's Pass. I may be asking a lot, but, I will try to get enough to cover what is needed, depends on the situation at the time of an answer. I am looking for someone who will be transporting a horse or horses that Raphael could hitch a ride with. Perhaps I could pitch in what I could to help with the transportation fee they are already paying. Or, if someone has a truck and a horse trailer and wanted to take me to pick him up, I could and would be willing to do what ever is necessary to accomplish the trip. Again, if someone lives here and does the latter, I would be willing to work on their property (ranch) and give what ever money I can come up with. I am not a carpenter per say, but have many years carpentry skills. Just let me know what your needs are. Please let me know as soon as you can. Thank you so much for even considering this, Jack Long and Raphael There is a service-go onto the web and look under horse transportation-which links up people traveling with horses needing to get to a particular place. I was at wits end last year trying to get a fjord from ohio to idaho - I am off the regular routes. within 24 hours of listing there was a person going from 30 miles of where my horse was in ohio who was passing within 3 miles of my home. she was transporting two of her own and one other horse. Be careful, though, these are usually private individuals and there are no guarantees. My horse got here in excellent shape but there were some tense moments because of communications snafus. I apologize I cannot remember the name of the listing service Kathy in Southern Idaho.
