[Flexradio] SDR-1000 Hanging in TX on CW
Folks: I wonder if anyone has encountered this problem: Running SDR-1000 Power SDR 1.8.0 N1MM Logger Version 7.12.7 1-20-2008 VAC 4.08 N8VB VCOM 2.26 Winkey set to Iambic B in N1MM In the POWER SDR set up I have both CAT control and Enable PTT checked. Everything works as it should in all modes , EXCEPT for an intermittent hang problem in the CW mode only, and only when Macros are sent from N1MM Logger. If I use short length buffers in N1MM, that is something like "Test K7RE Test". Everything works OK. If I make the Macro any longer, I get intermittent hangs, that is the radio stays in TX for something like 5 seconds, then returns to RX. Pushing ESC etc., has no effect on the time lag. Here is the interesting part: If I set the CW TX speed higher in N1MM Logger, I can put in a few more characters into the buffer before it hangs at the increased CW speed. In other words, amazingly, the problem seems to be time related, not related to the number of characters. Also, if I place some characters into one Macro, and some others into a second Macro, I can send the two short strings by pressing the two Function keys, one immediately after the other. In this way I am able to send the longer strings that I can not send when the same text in placed into one Macro. This is all very reproducible. In fact, at 22 WPM the text "Test K7RE Test" hangs about every 5th time. Increasing to 24 WPM, I get no hangs whatsoever. I tested this in the 160M CQ CW contest this past weekend, and made over 600 QSO's, so the threshold was well tested. I am out of ideas. Brian K7RE -- "age, crankiness & treachery will overcome youth energy & skill" ___ FlexRadio Systems Mailing List FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] PowerSDR Software Interfaces
Jim: Thanks for the tips. I am not very aware of other interfaces, so your tips help a lot. Yes, I am strictly a hobby programmer, HI! Brian K7RE -- "age, crankiness & treachery will overcome youth energy & skill" Jim Lux wrote: > Quoting Brian Kassel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on Wed 12 Dec 2007 07:47:56 AM PST: > >> Jim et AL: >> >> Thanks for your in depth comments. To me, any interface that works >> and is easy to implement would be acceptable. As you may know, many >> programmers for Ham Radio applications are what might be called "Hobby >> Level" types, and use languages like Visual Basic 6 or VB.NET. If the >> interface decided upon can be used with those languages, then I for one >> am all for the idea. > > > Almost all of the schemes can work with those languages. Either the > interface style is supported natively (e.g. DDE in VB) or a simple > wrapper can be created to expose the different style of interface > (for instance, you could create a C/VB library that provides API > style entry points that send and receive messages underneath). > > Sending and receiving packets with TCP/IP or UDP/IP is very, very > simple (especially with UDP). Check out the "sockets" libraries > (there's about 6 function calls you need.. open, close, send, > receive, etc.) > > There are other message passing architectures around.. e.g. you can > work at a higher level.. HTTP, for instance, which is what SOAP > uses. Or, you can use something like MPI (which is more oriented to > parallel computing) > > Jim, W6RMK > > > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] PowerSDR Software Interfaces
Jim et AL: Thanks for your in depth comments. To me, any interface that works and is easy to implement would be acceptable. As you may know, many programmers for Ham Radio applications are what might be called "Hobby Level" types, and use languages like Visual Basic 6 or VB.NET. If the interface decided upon can be used with those languages, then I for one am all for the idea. I do mostly digital and CW contesting. I know that there are others with similar interests on this reflector. My dream machine would allow a keystroke to move form one signal to another in the display, and have the signal tuned in as well as possible, if not on the nose. Perhaps the level at which the signal is selected could be set by something like the Squelch level control. Then the logging program would read the signal. A call sign is decoded from the data. The call sign that owns the frequency is selected by another keystroke in the logging program. That call sign is displayed above the signal's display in the SDR software, similar to a band map as implemented by N1MM Logger and others. Also, perhaps when using DX cluster software in combination with N1MM Logger, the band map info could also be displayed in a like manner, but in a different font or color, to differentiate it from data actually received over the air. Yes, I am fully aware of the problems of decoding CW, but software can be developed that will do a decent job, but not perfectly. The program CWGet comes amazingly close. It does do DDE as well. In a contest situation, almost all CW is machine sent, and given the filtering of the SDR, most signals are pretty well QRM free. Decoding the call sign is done in my software (K7RE RTTY), as well as several others fairly well, and can be done as well, or better in others. The Rocky software does indeed allow the control and arrow keys to move from signal to signal, perfectly tuned in. I use that software with the SoftRock V 6.2 40/30M little radio. If the program included DDE, or some other data sharing method, perhaps a scheme could be worked out where the call sign would displayed as I mentioned above. I feel that most of the pieces to this idea are there. There are probably some rough edges around this idea, but it should be doable. This would be a tremendous boon to S&P in contest operation. Maybe it would get some notorious contesters away from hitting that F-1 (CQ) key quite as often. ;) Brian K7RE Jim Lux wrote: > At 04:01 PM 12/11/2007, Brian Kassel wrote: > >> Cecil et Al: >> Actually there are several, various N3FJP programs, HRD I think, >> and several others. If DDE were implemented, I imagine other more >> popular logging programs might do the same like N1MM Logger etc. Not >> sure that other more sophisticated linking methods would be >> worthwhile, as the information to be exchanged is actually not that >> much data. >> >> It takes someone to do that first step. Hi! >> >> Brian K7RE > > > > Philosophically, I'd be more in favor of a message passing style > interface, rather than a shared memory style (The latter is what DDE > is.. process one modifies some bound data field in some other process, > etc.) > > Also, of course, DDE is Microsoft-centric. And oddly, uses the > Windows Messaging Layer as the transport.. so while it exposes a > shared memory model (application, topic, item as memory "location") > it's actually carried by a message passing interface. > > "Microsoft Windows provides several methods for transferring data > between applications. One method is to use the Dynamic Data Exchange > (DDE) protocol. The DDE protocol is a set of messages and guidelines. > It sends messages between applications that share data and uses shared > memory to exchange data between applications. Applications can use the > DDE protocol for one-time data transfers and for continuous exchanges > in which applications send updates to one another as new data becomes > available. " > > > Most modern systems use message passing (e.g. COM, WCF, SOAP, and the > various flavors of messaging middleware based pub/sub schemes) because: > 1) they lend themselves to distributed applications (network aware) and > 2) they lend themselves to various and sundry queueing and load > balancing systems. > > Jim > > > > -- "age, crankiness & treachery will overcome youth energy & skill" ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] PowerSDR Software Interfaces
Cecil et Al: Actually there are several, various N3FJP programs, HRD I think, and several others. If DDE were implemented, I imagine other more popular logging programs might do the same like N1MM Logger etc. Not sure that other more sophisticated linking methods would be worthwhile, as the information to be exchanged is actually not that much data. It takes someone to do that first step. Hi! Brian K7RE Eric Wachsmann wrote: >> There is no easy answer to this in the current revision of PowerSDR if you >> don't want to use CAT. Being able to easily modify/extend/interface to the >> radio is one of the goals of our next generation software architecture. >> >> >> Eric Wachsmann >> FlexRadio Systems >> >> > > The other program also has to support DDE, I'm not sure how many do if any. -- Cecil K5NWA www.softrockradio.org www.qrpradio.com "Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light." -- "age, crankiness & treachery will overcome youth energy & skill" ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
[Flexradio] Intermittant CW Sent from N1MM Logger - Fixed
Folks: Thanks to Rob for his very well done step by step instructions on how to set up the SDR-1000 with the N1MM Logger. I have successfully implemented the WinKey chip with the above. It works very well, and absolutely no strange or abnormal CW keying has been seen. All of my strange keying problems encountered during the ARRL CW SS are gone. Another advantage is that logging programs that can not send CW through the same serial port as used for the CAT, now will work fine, as a completely separate serial port is used for each function with WinKey. This setup is ideal for marginal PC systems too, takes away a lot of the load from the CPU when sending CW. I hesitate to post the actual setup, as it is all pretty straightforward. I will be glad though to provide my setup to anyone who may need it. Brian K7RE -- "age, crankiness & treachery will overcome youth energy & skill" ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger
So Eric: What you mean is the following set-up in Power SDR then: In Setup DSP Keyer Set: Primary SDR Secondary CAT PTT Line RTS Key Line DTR Brian K7RE Eric Wachsmann wrote: >Rob, > >I'm thinking that we may very well already have what you are looking for. >Please check out the Secondary settings on the Setup Form -> DSP Tab -> >Keyer Sub Tab. There is a setting for CAT. This would use the same COM >port as the CAT setup. > >I just tested this with MixW and it works great. Note that you have to tell >MixW to Key CW with CAT, but after that, it works just great. > > >Eric Wachsmann >FlexRadio Systems > > > >>-Original Message- >>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >>radio.biz] On Behalf Of Rob Dennison >>Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 6:03 PM >>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>Cc: flexradio@flex-radio.biz; [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>Subject: Re: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger >> >>Hi Bob, >> >>Well you know, I down loaded the PDF version of the CAT Command >>Dictionary on September 16, 2007 and it doesn't have the commands. I >>down loaded the Word version on September 27, 2007 and it does have them. >> Betcha the PDF should be updated. Of course I looked at the PDF version >>thinking they would be the same. >> >>Guess I'll have to install Tortoise to get current documentation. Only >>way to keep documentation up to date is to release alpha docs with alpha >>code and so on... terrible, terrible thing to have to do... >> >>It still seems implementing a vCOM ASCII interface to CWX would interface >>with more CAT programs with less hassle than using KS and KY.. >> >>Anyway I'm just super glad such an obvious solution has been implemented. >> Now flexRadio gets a break while I go converse with N1MM. >> >>Thanks for the info. >> >>73's >>Rob >>AB7CF >> >>BTW, I just looked at the Kenwood TS 2000 manual and it doesn't list a KW >>command. R... >> >> >> >> >>On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 12:28:01 -0600 "Bob Tracy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>writes: >> >> >>>Rob, >>> >>>Your CAT Dictionary is a few revisions behind, the latest is October >>>31, >>>2007. The KY and KS commands were added on August 25, 2007. In >>>the >>>downloads section of the Flex web site, the CAT Dictionary and >>>Cross-Reference are one revision behind the current ones, but is's >>>only been >>>about a week since the lastest revs were posted. >>> >>>The Kenwood KY/KS and Flex ZZKY/ZZKS are implemented in PowerSDR. >>>I'm not >>>sure about the KW command, it doesn't appear in my Kenwood docs. >>>The >>>solution does work with DXLabs Commander and WinWarbler as they were >>>the >>>programs (requested by a user) that spurred the addition of the >>>Kenwood >>>commands. >>> >>>If you want the latest docs, and you have TortoiseSVN loaded, you >>>can >>>download the documents directly from: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>svn://206.216.146.154/svn/repos_sdr_windows/PowerSDR/trunk/Documentation >> >> >>>73, >>> >>>Bob K5KDN >>> >>> >>> >>>-Original Message- >>>From: Rob Dennison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 11:29 AM >>>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; flexradio@flex-radio.biz >>>Subject: Re: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger >>> >>> >>>Hi all, >>> >>>For what it's worth, neither the KW or KY commands are listed in >>>the >>>latest flexRadio Cat Command Dictionary I've been able to find in >>>the >>>knowledge base (Revised January 3, 2006.) >>> >>>Of course my suggestion is that flexRadio implement a simple ascii >>>port >>>or the KW/KY commands or a ZZ equivalent and similarly N1MM >>>implement >>>them as well. >>> >>>No use pushing on N1MM until flexRadio is in motion. Of course >>>this >>>simple solution would work with DXLabs and other CAT programs... >>> >>>Sure would beat the competition (except Kenwood.) >>> >>>73's >>>Rob >>>AB7CF >>> >>> >>>On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 10:29:59 -0600 "Bob Tracy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>writes:
Re: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger
Bob and Rob: Is the Kenwood KY command the command that allows a single com port to send CW *AND* work as the CAT data? If so, N1MM Logger does indeed support that mode. I have used it on my K-2 for many moons. So, if I set up N1MM Logger to use a single serial port, what would have to be done in the setup in Power SDR for this to work as described? Brian K7RE Bob Tracy wrote: >See the Kenwood KY command in the CAT Dictionary. This is precisely what it >does, however, I don't believe N1MM implements KY. > >73, > >Bob K5KDN > >-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Rob Dennison >Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 9:34 AM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Cc: flexradio@flex-radio.biz >Subject: Re: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger > > >Hi Brian and all, > >Correct me if I'm wrong, but does not a program such as N1MM send a >character string through a COM or USB port to an external keyer which >then converts it to a string of opens and grounds which are then fed back >into PowerSDR via a real COM port and hence to PowerSDR? > >If so, why not make a minor mode to CWX so it can receive a string of >ACII from an external program say via vCOM as well as via a keyboard? > >Simplicity is the soul of elegance. > >Why should I be required to spend yet another $70 for a WinKey kit and >build it up in my shop to fix what is basically a specification bug in >PowerSDR? > >73's >Rob >AB7CF > > >On Tue, 06 Nov 2007 08:00:13 -0700 Brian Kassel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > >>Hi Army: >> >> QSL, Thanks for your input. I also am aware of how difficult it >>is >>for a PC to generate good CW when in a multi-tasking environment. >>I >>won't be using a MicroHam Microkeyer however. I can figure out out >>the >>serial port interface from N1MM Logger to the serial input of the >>WinKey, but I wonder where would I hook up the CW output of the >>WinKey >>into the SDR-1000? Do I simply use the CW in put jack on the box >>itself? I read where the preferred CW input to the SDR is on the >>serial port, but the serial port will be used for the CAT functions >>on >>the SDR. Perhaps it is possible for the CW output of the Winkey to >>key >>the radio through a transistor switch, whose output goes to the DTR >>or >>RTS pin the the CAT serial port? Maybe someone on the list can give >> >>some input to this idea? I am sure someone out there has done this, >>or >>something similar. I am using VCOM as well. >> >>Brian K7RE >> >>Army Curtis - AE5P wrote: >> >> >> >>>Brian, >>> >>>I used the Winkey keyer in a MicroHam Micokeyer this weekend, but >>> >>> >>from N3FJP >> >> >>>logger rather than N1MM. It worked perfectly with no timing issues >>> >>> >>at all. >> >> >>>It is very difficult for any program to generate perfect code when >>> >>> >>you are >> >> >>>sharing resources with something like PowerSDR. The Winkey keyer is >>> >>> >>a very >> >> >>>good solution to the problem, and it worked great for me. I have >>> >>> >>ordered the >> >> >>>Winkey kit for use with my new Flex 5000 so I don't have to kluge >>> >>> >>up >> >> >>>something like I did this past weekend to use the MicroHam unit. >>> >>>Hope this helps. >>> >>>73, >>>Army - AE5P >>> >>> >>>-Original Message- >>>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian >>> >>> >>Kassel >> >> >>>Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 2:05 PM >>>To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz >>>Subject: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger >>> >>>Folks: >>> >>> Has anyone out there successfully configured the above >>> >>> >>combination? I >> >> >>>had very serious timing issues this last weekend in the ARRL SS CW. >>> >>> >> I >> >> >>>was using the internal keyer that is included in N1MM Logger. I >>> >>> >>am >> >> >>>thinking that most of the timing issues could be circumvented by >>> >>
Re: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger
Greg: I can't say that I experienced any overload on my SDR-1000. I do live in a rural environment though, and didn't do too much operating on 80M. I will say though that I use just the bare minimum of preamp setting that I need on any band. I rarely go above the medium setting on 80 through about 30M. Also you may want to be sure that your RF gain is not set too high. It's very easy to forget these things in the heat of battle. There were a huge number of "dirty" signals on the air though, mostly key clicks, due to a well known issue in some radios from one of our freinds that orginate in the Pacific. ;) Brian K7RE [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >I've been on the Flex Radio Band wagon for over a year now, and really do like >my SDR-1000 for DX and general listening. But under contest conditions the >reciever really appeared to fall apart from overload. Maybe it was my >software set up, maybe not. Sound card here is an FA-66 with a duo core >processor in the computer. > >I used the same set up in CQWW CW last year with no problems on 80m but there >were far less strong signals. > >As to the N3FJP interface, I was using a separate lap top for the logging >program keying the radio through a Rigblaster pro. It sent pretty good cw >setting the program to HIGH priority. > >Greg K0PJ/9 > > > >-Original Message- > > >>From: Army Curtis - AE5P <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>Sent: Nov 5, 2007 5:20 PM >>To: 'Brian Kassel' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, flexradio@flex-radio.biz >>Subject: Re: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger >> >>Brian, >> >>I used the Winkey keyer in a MicroHam Micokeyer this weekend, but from N3FJP >>logger rather than N1MM. It worked perfectly with no timing issues at all. >> >>It is very difficult for any program to generate perfect code when you are >>sharing resources with something like PowerSDR. The Winkey keyer is a very >>good solution to the problem, and it worked great for me. I have ordered the >>Winkey kit for use with my new Flex 5000 so I don't have to kluge up >>something like I did this past weekend to use the MicroHam unit. >> >>Hope this helps. >> >>73, >>Army - AE5P >> >> >>-Original Message- >>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Kassel >>Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 2:05 PM >>To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz >>Subject: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger >> >>Folks: >> >> Has anyone out there successfully configured the above combination? I >>had very serious timing issues this last weekend in the ARRL SS CW. I >>was using the internal keyer that is included in N1MM Logger. I am >>thinking that most of the timing issues could be circumvented by using >>the Winkey keyer driven by N1MM Logger. >> >> I did look through the Knowledge Base and set up everything as >>recommended. The problem does not seem to occur with the keyer in Power >>SDR, only when CW is sent in a buffer from the N1MM Logger. No glitches >>were found in Power SDR, so I have to think that the Keyer timing in >>N1MM Logger while running with POwer SDR is the issue. >> >>Brian K7RE >> >>-- >>"age, crankiness & treachery will overcome youth energy & skill" >> >> >> >> >>___ >>FlexRadio mailing list >>FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >>http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >>Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >>FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ >>FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ >> >> >>No virus found in this incoming message. >>Checked by AVG Free Edition. >>Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.22/ - Release Date: 11/5/2007 >>4:36 AM >> >> >>No virus found in this outgoing message. >>Checked by AVG Free Edition. >>Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.22/ - Release Date: 11/5/2007 >>4:36 AM >> >> >> >>___ >>FlexRadio mailing list >>FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >>http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >>Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >>FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ >>FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ >> >> >> > > > > > -- "age, crankiness & treachery will overcome youth energy & skill" ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger
Hi Army: QSL, Thanks for your input. I also am aware of how difficult it is for a PC to generate good CW when in a multi-tasking environment. I won't be using a MicroHam Microkeyer however. I can figure out out the serial port interface from N1MM Logger to the serial input of the WinKey, but I wonder where would I hook up the CW output of the WinKey into the SDR-1000? Do I simply use the CW in put jack on the box itself? I read where the preferred CW input to the SDR is on the serial port, but the serial port will be used for the CAT functions on the SDR. Perhaps it is possible for the CW output of the Winkey to key the radio through a transistor switch, whose output goes to the DTR or RTS pin the the CAT serial port? Maybe someone on the list can give some input to this idea? I am sure someone out there has done this, or something similar. I am using VCOM as well. Brian K7RE Army Curtis - AE5P wrote: >Brian, > >I used the Winkey keyer in a MicroHam Micokeyer this weekend, but from N3FJP >logger rather than N1MM. It worked perfectly with no timing issues at all. > >It is very difficult for any program to generate perfect code when you are >sharing resources with something like PowerSDR. The Winkey keyer is a very >good solution to the problem, and it worked great for me. I have ordered the >Winkey kit for use with my new Flex 5000 so I don't have to kluge up >something like I did this past weekend to use the MicroHam unit. > >Hope this helps. > >73, >Army - AE5P > > >-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Kassel >Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 2:05 PM >To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz >Subject: [Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger > >Folks: > > Has anyone out there successfully configured the above combination? I >had very serious timing issues this last weekend in the ARRL SS CW. I >was using the internal keyer that is included in N1MM Logger. I am >thinking that most of the timing issues could be circumvented by using >the Winkey keyer driven by N1MM Logger. > > I did look through the Knowledge Base and set up everything as >recommended. The problem does not seem to occur with the keyer in Power >SDR, only when CW is sent in a buffer from the N1MM Logger. No glitches >were found in Power SDR, so I have to think that the Keyer timing in >N1MM Logger while running with POwer SDR is the issue. > >Brian K7RE > > > -- "age, crankiness & treachery will overcome youth energy & skill" ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
[Flexradio] SDR-1000 and Winkey with N1MM Logger
Folks: Has anyone out there successfully configured the above combination? I had very serious timing issues this last weekend in the ARRL SS CW. I was using the internal keyer that is included in N1MM Logger. I am thinking that most of the timing issues could be circumvented by using the Winkey keyer driven by N1MM Logger. I did look through the Knowledge Base and set up everything as recommended. The problem does not seem to occur with the keyer in Power SDR, only when CW is sent in a buffer from the N1MM Logger. No glitches were found in Power SDR, so I have to think that the Keyer timing in N1MM Logger while running with POwer SDR is the issue. Brian K7RE -- "age, crankiness & treachery will overcome youth energy & skill" ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] MixW Lockups
John: Wow, right again, you are batting 1000 today ! HI! For the record, to eliminate MixW resetting the VAC selection in the Power SDR 1.8.0 software, you need to do as John mentions below. In detail this would be: In MixW: Click on Configure from the menu bar Then click on TRCVR CAT/PTT Then In the box in this window labeled Default Digi Mode: Use the little scroll bar, select NONE. Click OK and exit out. Brian K7RE [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >Hi Brian, > >well, the issue of the PoweSDR swithing to USB and VAC to off is a matter of >settings in both Mix and PowerSDR programs. > >In MixW setup menu, set"Default mode for Digi" to NONE. You probalby >have it set as USB now. > >On PowerSDR, in the VAC setup -- uncheck the "VAC off on other than Digi" >(something like that, can't remember the exact words, I'm not home right now) > >I do suggest upgrading the latest VAC 4.04 version, much better than the 3.2 >versions. Or, wait for the new VAC from N8VB, Phil Covington. > >I think this will take care of that issue of jumping to USB and VAC to off. > >Glad it is going for you. > >Good DX! > >John, N3WT > > > -- Original message -- >From: Brian Kassel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >>Hi John: >> >> I did remember that message on the Flex Reflector, but I wasn't sure >>what version of MixW fixed the problems, and as I recall the message dod >>not address exactly what problems were fixed, that's one reason why I >>hesitated to upgrade. I even checked the History page on the MixW site, >>but it makes no mention of any fixes for the SDR radio. I notice now >>that there is another issue, but no big deal. If Power SDR is running, >>and MixW is not, loading MixW removes the check mark in the VAC setup >>screen of Power SDR! Also the SDR switches to USB Var 1 filter from >>DigU mode 5 KHz. filter settings. It does this every time. The fix is >>to simply open the Power SDR set up screen and check the "Enable VAC" >>option again, and reset the mode and filter settings.I have only >>ever seen this with the MixW 2.18 (February 19 2007) version. I posted >>this on the Flex reflector as well. >> I didn't check my coffee pot to see it had changed either! HI! See >>you on the bands I hope. >> >>Brian K7RE >> >>[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> >> >> >>>Glad you got it going now! See you on digi. I've been trying out the >>> >>> >>new Ham Radio Deluxe program called Digital Master 780, so I have been on PSK >>more lately. >> >> >>>As I now recall, the MixW ver . 2.18 (February 19, 2007) was even a >>> >>> >>modification because Tim Ellison sent Nick an e-mail telling Nick of problems >>with the PowerSDR program. The February version fixed whatever was causing >>the >>problems. >> >> >>>73 John, N3WT >>> >>> >>>-- Original message -- >>>From: Brian Kassel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>John: >>>> >>>> You were absolutely correct. By simply upgrading to the very latest >>>>Version 2.18 (there are several 2.18 versions), the problem went away >>>>completely. I di not attempt yet to upgrade the VCOM or the VAC. So, >>>>for the record and the Archives, if one is running Power SDR 1.8.0, one >>>>must upgrade MixW to the 2.18 (February 19 2007) version. What had me >>>>going was that the original version of MixW (2.16b7 Oct. 18 2005) >>>>worked just fine on all of my other radios, but not with Power SDR 1.8.0. >>>> >>>>Thanks for your help >>>> >>>>Brian K7RE >>>> >>>> >>>>[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>Brian, >>>>> >>>>>I suggest going ahead and upgrade to the newest version 2.18 of MixW. >>>>>This >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>version has been out a long time now and appears stable. Works fine here >>>> >>>> >>with >> >> >>>>PowerSDR ver . snv-x ver 1139.I think the problem is that you are >>>> >>>> >>
Re: [Flexradio] MixW SDR-1000 and Lockups
Bob: Yes, this was confirmed by me as well, just as you laid out in your message. Small problem, but very aggravating from an operational standpoint. Brian K7RE Bob McGwier wrote: > Brian: > > What is happening is MixW is changing the radio's mode from DigU to > USB and you have VAC enable in digital modes checked in your setup > box. This is VERY aggravating. We need Bob to make a change to CAT: > If we are in DigU and we are told to go to USB, we lie and say we did > and we report we are in USB. > > Bob > N4HY > > > Brian Kassel wrote: > >> Folks: >> >> Several folks suggested that I simply upgrade MixW. That totally >> fixed the problem. By simply upgrading to the very latest Version >> 2.18 (there are several 2.18 versions), the problem went away >> completely. I did not attempt yet to upgrade the VCOM or the VAC. >> So, for the record and the Archives, if one is running Power SDR >> 1.8.0, one must upgrade MixW to the 2.18 (February 19 2007) version. >> So far, like others mentioned, this MixW version seems completely >> stable. What had me going was that the original version of MixW >> (2.16b7 Oct. 18 2005) worked just fine on all of my other radios, but >> not with Power SDR 1.8.0. >> >> There seems to be one interesting new "feature". If Power SDR is >> running, and MixW is not, loading MixW removes the check mark in the >> VAC setup screen of Power SDR! It does this every time. The fix is >> to simply open the Power SDR set up screen and check the "Enable VAC" >> option again. No big deal, but something that the programmers might >> want to address at some point. I have only ever seen this with the >> MixW 2.18 (February 19 2007) version. >> >> Thanks for everyone's help >> >> Brian K7RE >> >> >> ___ >> FlexRadio mailing list >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >> Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >> FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ >> FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ >> >> > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] MixW SDR-1000 and Lockups
Folks: Several folks suggested that I simply upgrade MixW. That totally fixed the problem. By simply upgrading to the very latest Version 2.18 (there are several 2.18 versions), the problem went away completely. I did not attempt yet to upgrade the VCOM or the VAC. So, for the record and the Archives, if one is running Power SDR 1.8.0, one must upgrade MixW to the 2.18 (February 19 2007) version. So far, like others mentioned, this MixW version seems completely stable. What had me going was that the original version of MixW (2.16b7 Oct. 18 2005) worked just fine on all of my other radios, but not with Power SDR 1.8.0. There seems to be one interesting new "feature". If Power SDR is running, and MixW is not, loading MixW removes the check mark in the VAC setup screen of Power SDR! It does this every time. The fix is to simply open the Power SDR set up screen and check the "Enable VAC" option again. No big deal, but something that the programmers might want to address at some point. I have only ever seen this with the MixW 2.18 (February 19 2007) version. Thanks for everyone's help Brian K7RE ___ FlexRadio mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
[Flexradio] MixW SDR-1000 and Lockups
Folks: When using the MixW program, ONLY in the OLIVIA and MFSK modes, MixW crashes after I make a transmission, at the instant I attempt to return to receive. This happens every time without fail. I get the "MixW has experienced a problem, Send a Report to MS" window. It does not happen in any other mode when using MixW. I don't see any real change in CPU usage as measured on the SDR console. I have absolutely no problems whatsoever with any other software at any power level as far as I can tell. Particulars: SDR-1000 with 100W option PC - Intel Core Duo 6300 2 GB RAM XP SP 2 VAC Version 4.03 Power SDR Version 1.8.0 N8VB Virtual Com Port Version 7/09/2005, 1.0.0.4 MixW Version 2.16b7 Oct. 18 2005 Delta 66 Sound Card Decent grounding system on PC, SDR etc. It looks to me that the problem is with the MixW program itself. I have been to the MixW web page and see no reference to any similar problem. I hesitate to upgrade to the newest version as I see on the MixW reflector, new versions are often buggy, but I have no idea what the last stable version may be. I have searched the Flex KB also. Before I attempt that upgrade, I wanted to be sure that I am on the right track. I remember seeing a message sometime back on the Flex reflector that the author of MixW had released a version of that program that fixed several issues with he SDR. However, what the issues were, or what actual MixW version included these fixes are all unknown to me. Also I may be able to fix this issue by changing parameters in VAC, VCOM, or even Power SDR, and therefore may not need to upgrade. Any ideas? Brian K7RE ___ FlexRadio mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Drifting Newbie
Drifting Flexers: Jim, as usual, makes a good point. Simply disconnect the PTC from the 12 volt source. This will make the turn on drift take much longer, but after initial turn on, say 20 minutes, transmit again and see if the same short term drifting takes place. If not, it's the PTC and it needs to be voltage stabilized. The PTC is powered from the rear, fartherest left connection of the barrier strip, with the radiooriented so that it's front faces you. Brian K7RE Jim Lux wrote: > At 08:02 AM 3/14/2007, Brian Kassel wrote: > >> Hello Peter: >> > > > >>I added an 8 volt regulator circuit that powers only the PTC >> circuit. > > > > > the other solution that may work for you is to just disconnect the PTC > thermistor. The temperature (and frequency) will take longer to > stabilize, but might actually drift slower, especially if you have > decent ventilation (which you'd better have anyway, so the DDS doesn't > overheat). > > > Jim, W6RMK > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
[Flexradio] RE: Drifting Newbie
Hello Peter: This sounds very much like the issue that I also had experienced. The problem is that with newer units a "PTC" device was installed, mechanically coupled to the 200 MHz. reference oscillator can. This unit, as I understand it, is a combination thermistor and resistive heater, designed as a closed loop control device that attempts to keep the temperature of the "can" constant. It is NOT voltage regulated, as it certainly should be. It runs directly off of the raw 12 volt input to the radio. In transmit mode, there is always a little voltage drop across the wiring from the external 12 volt supply to the input terminals of the radio. This is enough to change the temperature of the PTC device, causing a slight frequency change. Slight is a relative term, as I found that the change was totally unacceptable for the digital modes. Unless your external 12 volt power supply is regulated to within less than a couple hundredths of a volt, AT THE RADIO TERMINALS, this problem will exist. Not many hams are going to use a laboratory quality supply that is capable of the current required by the 100W PA. I tested mine with 3 different commercial supplies, and still had all of the symptoms described. I added an 8 volt regulator circuit that powers only the PTC circuit. Fortunately, this isn't very hard to do physically. I have been meaning to work up up a proper mod for the Knowledge Base but that hasn't happened as yet. I will be glad to go into great detail on how to do this if you you are interested. I can even send you a little 8 Volt regulator mounted on the heat sink, a prewired module no money involved. I have a few of these that I bought at a flea market some time ago. The little module mounts on one of the existing mounting holes that hold the barrier strip to the bottom of the chassis, left hand side of the chassis when the front of the radio facing you. The left most wire on the barrier strip powers the PTC circuit from the 12 volts coming into the radio. I simply removed the wire from the terminal strip, and connected it to the output of the new circuit. The input (12V) of the new circuit I got directly from the 12 volt input to the power amp by running a wire to that point. As you may know, 12 volts is fed to the PA even with the SDR power switch in the off position. By connecting the new 8 volt regulator input to this point, the PTC circuit is powered on with 8 volts of regulated power even when the radio is turned off, but the external PS is turned on, meaning no warm-up time at all. I am not sure how much of a home brew type you may know or your level of hardware experience, so you may need more detail than I have provided here. No problem, just let me know. I can send some digital snapshots as well, as I need to make these anyway fro the KB article hat I need to work up. Just let me know, Peter. Brian K7RE - Original Message - From: "Peter G. Viscarola" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2007 7:17 PM Subject: [Flexradio] Drifting Newbie > My SDR-1000 is less than a week old, so I am very much a newbie. I'm > hoping for some guidance/help/reassurance/assistance from the list. > > As a bit of background, I work digital modes almost exclusively and the > SDR's implementation of nice, sharp, narrow filters is what really sold > me. So far, things are working pretty well in that regard. > > I hate to re-start an old topic (see, I *did* search the archives) but > I'm very concerned about the frequency drift I'm seeing in my unit. I > calibrated the unit using WWV according to the instructions. > > I understand the new design is supposed to stabilize in about 3 minutes, > is that right? > > After turn-on, just listening for five minutes, the frequency drifts > about 70Hz or so (as measured by WWV). > > After another ten minutes of just listening, the frequency continues to > drift about another 10Hz... WWV finally shows up at 14.999.998 -- Pretty > good, right? I can live with that. > > Here's the problem: 20 Minutes later, after a couple of short QSOs, WWV > is now at 15.000.006 and (while I listen) continues to "flip" back and > forth for a while between 15.000.006 and 14.999.998. > > If I let the receiver just sit there, again just listening, WWV returns > steadily to 14.999.998. > > To me, this is really, really, not good. > > The rig's powered by an Astron 35M, fed by a dedicated line with > dedicated ground... so I don't suspect the power supply. > > I'd hate to have to spend mucho bucks on a rubidium reference generator > just to lock my transceiver... > > This drift is pretty much freakin' me out. > Help? > > de Peter K1PGV > > > > ___ > FlexRadio mailing list > FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz > http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz > Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ > Flex
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem - Solved!
Folks: I have finally been able to completely eliminate the short term frequency drift of 20 -30 Hz. when returning to RX after transmitting for just a few seconds. In the last few weeks I have operated several digital contests, and am happy to report that there is no measurable drift as before. I have installed a very simple 3 terminal 8 volt regulator. The mod is cheap, involves to holes or other modification the radio in any way. The radio can be easily placed back into the original configuration. This drift condition is only apparent on SDR-1000 radios that *have the PTC modification installed*! I have no idea how many of these modified units are out there, perhaps our friends at Flex-Radio can supply a list of effected serial numbers. This condition is noticeable only on the Digital modes, or any mode that requires frequency stability less than 20 -30 HZ. short term when going from transmit back to receive. I am told that some folks can hear that amount of frequency shift in the CW and SSB modes. The real cause is the inevitable voltage drop that is seen by the DC input to the radio. Even a PS that regulates down to less than 1/10 th. volt will produce a noticeable drift on the waterfall display. There s also a small voltage drop in the cable that runs from the power supply to the radio. Yes, I am using the cable that was shipped with the radio. I picked 8 volts as the regulated voltage , as the 3 terminal regulators require a voltage "headroom" of about 3 volts in order to maintain regulation. This circuit should be good down to about 11 volts or so. If you contemplate battery operation, you may wish to opt for a low-headroom type of voltage regulator, or a lower regulated voltage output. I used a 1 amp type on a heat sink, which also furnishes a way to mount the circuit to n existing screw in the SDR-1000 enclosure. Many folks have helped in identifying this issue, and I certainly wish to thank them all for their time and effort. I have attempted to copy them all on this message. If I left out anyone, I really apologize. As a bonus, by wiring the input of the new voltage regulator to the unswitched DC input of the 100 watt PA, as long as the power supply is turned on, the oscillator is temperature stabilized. There is no warm up drift as before, short as it was. I would be glad to write up a step by step procedure for this modification/addition if anyone is interested. Thanks again for everyone's time. Brian K7RE ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] Error in KB Article for Griffin PowerMate ?
Hi Tim: Thanks. I still feel that it is misleading though. A newbie might very well get confused until he/she figures out that both the "Long Click" and the "Rotate Left" keys are set to the "Right Arrow" key. Why not just make the document correct, and avoid future hassles? Is it really all that difficult? People, especially the inexperienced, tend to take manuals at their word, they have nothing else to go on at that point. Brian K7RE Tim Ellison wrote: >Brian, > >The keyboard keystroke associations that you associate with the >PowerMate's functions are entirely configurable. The KB article is not >a definitive text on setting the PowerMate up, but rather shows how it >can be done using one person's personal preferences. So, essentially >there is no wrong way to configure it if it meets your requirements for >operating the radio. > >-Tim >- >FRS KB Administrator > >-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Kassel >Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:37 PM >To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz >Subject: [Flexradio] Error in KB Article for Griffen PowerMate ? > >Folks: > > Just wanted to report what I believe is an error in the otherwise >excellent KB article that Eric did concerning the Griffen PowerMate set >up. In Figure 18, the instructions indicate that the "Long Click" >should be set to the "Down Arrow" key. However, I think that the "Long >Click" should be set to the "Right Arrow" key. > > The "Rotate Left" key had already been set to the "Down Arrow" key in >a previous step. I love the document other wise, the screen shots and >Eric's very clear explanations make all of the difference to a newbie >like me. ;) > >Brian K7RE > > >___ >FlexRadio mailing list >FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ > >FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ > > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
[Flexradio] Error in KB Article for Griffen PowerMate ?
Folks: Just wanted to report what I believe is an error in the otherwise excellent KB article that Eric did concerning the Griffen PowerMate set up. In Figure 18, the instructions indicate that the "Long Click" should be set to the "Down Arrow" key. However, I think that the "Long Click" should be set to the "Right Arrow" key. The "Rotate Left" key had already been set to the "Down Arrow" key in a previous step. I love the document other wise, the screen shots and Eric's very clear explanations make all of the difference to a newbie like me. ;) Brian K7RE ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
[Flexradio] Possible Error in SDR 1.8.0 Setup?
Folks: In playing in the RTTY contest this weekend, I have discovered, what I think may be an error in the default setup for SDR V 1.8.0. Under the General Options tab, in the "Click Tune Offsets (Hz) group, the default settings are set to: DigU 1200 DigL 2210. I believe that this group's default should be set to: DigU 2210 DigL 1200, These settings work perfectly for me. Brian K7RE ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
[Flexradio] Error in KB Article for Griffen PowerMate ?
Folks: Just wanted to report what I believe is an error in the otherwise excellent KB article that Eric did concerning the Griffen PowerMate set up. In Figure 18, the instructions indicate that the "Long Click" should be set to the "Down Arrow" key. However, I think that the "Long Click" should be set to the "Right Arrow" key. The "Rotate Left" key had already been set to the "Down Arrow" key in a previous step. I love the document other wise, the screen shots and Eric's very clear explanations make all of the difference to a newbie like me. ;) Brian K7RE ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
[Flexradio] Has Anyone Else Senn the Strange Frequency Drift Problem?
Hi Jim: As always, thanks very much for taking the time to reply and your help in getting this problem fixed. Yes, feeding the PTC directly off of the main power supply must lead to some heat variance due to the inevitable voltage sag caused when going from TX to RX. However, I just have to ask a question here. How come no one else is seeing this 22 Hz., 10 second drift when switching from TX back to RX? It is very apparent on the waterfall in the digital modes, and anyone running any digital mode would immediately see this frequency change. I amusing a typical power supply, and see this change, let's remember, even at the 5W TX level. I have not received any message from anyone on this reflector that they have seen this phenomena at all. Let me ask again, has ANYONE at all seen anything like this at all? Seems to me that such a design flaw would manifest itself quite often in general usage. Unless I can correct this problem, the radio is quite useless to me in the digital modes, my main operating activity. With this drifting problem, I have not been able to use my radio since I received it, several weeks ago now, I hate to send the radio back for repair, as the fix has to be something quite straightforward I would think. Brian K7RE Jim Lux wrote: > At 02:48 AM 1/7/2007, Willi Reppel wrote: > >> Peter, >> >> You wrote: >> >> >I am not sure where the power for the heater on the 200MHz >> oscillator come >> >from >> > >> >> I bought a new 1 W SDR1000 last month before the announcement about >> the 100 >> W-only version came. >> I disassembled the unit to have a look at the termistor. It is a >> small disk >> of approx 8 mm diameter and 2 mm thickness which is soldered or glued >> with a >> conductive compound on to the case of oscillator QG1. A wire is >> soldered to >> the top of the disk which is connected directly to the terminal strip >> and + >> 13.8 V dc. The grounded case of the crystal oscillator serves as return >> pass and minus. It seems to be a combined heater / termistor with >> approx 50 >> ohm att room temp. and 150 ohm at operation temp. >> Hope this sheds some light upon how the preheater / termistor is fed. > > > > > Hmm, running the thermal control heater off an unregulated bus seems > like a dicey design. Better have a real stiff power supply and very > short leads or good sense lines going back to the PS regulator. > Certainly not going to be good for running off a battery. > > K7RE, you're running off a regulated power supply as I recall, but how > long and resistive are the wires from supply to radio? Can you measure > the voltage, at the thermistor, as you switch between Tx and Rx. Even > running at lower RF power, there may be enough of a shift in voltage > to account for your problem. > > Maybe Flex might want to figure out an ECO that runs the thermistor > off a regulated supply (5V has a fair amount of current because it has > to run the DDS which is right next to the oscillator, but I don't know > how close to the max current the 5V reg is running at). > > >> groeten van >> >> SM6OMH Willi >> >> - Original Message - >> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: "Brian Kassel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; >> Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2007 11:09 PM >> Subject: Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem >> >> >> >I am not sure where the power for the heater on the 200MHz oscilator >> come >> >from >> > >> > power to the 200MHz oscilator: >> > PIOboard [AVDD] IC9(TPS76833) pin5+6 to interconnect pin 10 >> > TRXboard power to 200MHz oscilator pin14 [AVDD] J7pin10 >> (interconnect) >> > interconnect J7 is a 12 pin connector >> > >> > I hope it helps you >> > 73 peter pa0pvn >> > >> > groeten Peter >> > petervn(a)hetnet.nl <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; pa0pvn(a)hetnet.nl >> > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; >> > pa0pvn(a)gmail.com ; pa0pvn(a)amsat.org . >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] namens Brian Kassel >> > Verzonden: za 6-1-2007 22:16 >> > Aan: flexradio@flex-radio.biz >> > Onderwerp: Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem >> > >> > >> > >> > Folks: >> > >> > Can someone tell me where the regulated voltage for the 200 MHz. >> > oscillator comes from? It isn't clear to me in the schematic. I am >> > investi
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hello Peter: I have never heard or worked with this device, so your explanation really helped me understand the circuit. Yes, I see now that it is quite unlikely that the PTC is the culprit. Since apparently there is no switching, change in loading, or other circuit change from TX to RX, I can only conclude that it is a voltage regulator problem. I can't seem to find any other explanation for the 10 second approximately 22 HZ drift at the test frequency of 14.070 I will disassemble the board stack in order to access the oscillator, run some temporary probes to the oscillator, then reassemble the stack for testing. Hopefully my measurements will lead to a solution. Brian K7RE [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Thanks Willi, > > That’s is new to me. I have not disassembled the print stack jet. > > I expected some NTC an opamp and so on. > > The heater must be a PTC, these devices possesses a sharp rice > > of the resistance at a defined temperature, this way making a stable > > temperature. In the past I have used PTC’s for that purpose. > > The lowest specific temperature available at that time was about 70 > degrees C. > > I wonder what that temp of this device is. > > PTC’s are widely used in the demagnetisation circuits in colour > televisions, in > > series with de demagnetisation coil on the picture tube. As the > resistance > > rises, the current can go down to almost nothing, provided that the > PTC is > > thermally isolated. > > In the SDR1000 some current will flow due to the heat loss trough the > oscillator. > > I do not think that the PTC is the culprit, the final temperature is > only slightly > > dependent on the voltage, and will not give a fast nor step like > change (in the > > frequency) as the heat transfer is also slowly. > > Still wondering what happens. > > 73 peter pa0pvn > > groeten Peter > petervn(a)hetnet.nl <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; pa0pvn(a)hetnet.nl > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; > pa0pvn(a)gmail.com ; pa0pvn(a)amsat.org . > > ---- > Van: Willi Reppel [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Verzonden: zo 7-1-2007 11:48 > Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Brian Kassel; flexradio@flex-radio.biz > Onderwerp: Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem > > Peter, > > You wrote: > > >I am not sure where the power for the heater on the 200MHz oscillator > come > >from > > > > I bought a new 1 W SDR1000 last month before the announcement about > the 100 > W-only version came. > I disassembled the unit to have a look at the termistor. It is a small > disk > of approx 8 mm diameter and 2 mm thickness which is soldered or glued > with a > conductive compound on to the case of oscillator QG1. A wire is > soldered to > the top of the disk which is connected directly to the terminal strip > and + > 13.8 V dc. The grounded case of the crystal oscillator serves as return > pass and minus. It seems to be a combined heater / termistor with > approx 50 > ohm att room temp. and 150 ohm at operation temp. > Hope this sheds some light upon how the preheater / termistor is fed. > > groeten van > > SM6OMH Willi > > snip > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hi Willi: Thanks for that very nice detailed description. I am not quite sure if the thermistor is the problem, but your description should help me to track down the culprit that causes the short term drifting between TX and RX Thanks Again Brian K7RE Willi Reppel wrote: > Peter, > > You wrote: > >> I am not sure where the power for the heater on the 200MHz oscillator >> come from >> > > I bought a new 1 W SDR1000 last month before the announcement about > the 100 W-only version came. > I disassembled the unit to have a look at the termistor. It is a small > disk of approx 8 mm diameter and 2 mm thickness which is soldered or > glued with a conductive compound on to the case of oscillator QG1. A > wire is soldered to the top of the disk which is connected directly to > the terminal strip and + 13.8 V dc. The grounded case of the crystal > oscillator serves as return pass and minus. It seems to be a combined > heater / termistor with approx 50 ohm att room temp. and 150 ohm at > operation temp. > Hope this sheds some light upon how the preheater / termistor is fed. > > groeten van > > SM6OMH Willi > > - Original Message - From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Brian Kassel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; > Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2007 11:09 PM > Subject: Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem > > >> I am not sure where the power for the heater on the 200MHz oscilator >> come from >> >> power to the 200MHz oscilator: >> PIOboard [AVDD] IC9(TPS76833) pin5+6 to interconnect pin 10 >> TRXboard power to 200MHz oscilator pin14 [AVDD] J7pin10 (interconnect) >> interconnect J7 is a 12 pin connector >> >> I hope it helps you >> 73 peter pa0pvn >> >> groeten Peter >> petervn(a)hetnet.nl <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; pa0pvn(a)hetnet.nl >> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; >> pa0pvn(a)gmail.com ; pa0pvn(a)amsat.org . >> >> >> >> >> Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] namens Brian Kassel >> Verzonden: za 6-1-2007 22:16 >> Aan: flexradio@flex-radio.biz >> Onderwerp: Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem >> >> >> >> Folks: >> >> Can someone tell me where the regulated voltage for the 200 MHz. >> oscillator comes from? It isn't clear to me in the schematic. I am >> investigating a 22 HZ oscillator frequency change from TX to RX that >> occurs in the first 10 seconds, then stabilizes to less than 1 Hz >> change. . Temperature doesn't seem to be the culprit, and as far as I >> can see, there is no switching or changing of loading on the >> oscillator between TX and RX. >> Still fighting the uphill battle to determine my frequency shift >> problem. >> >> Brian K7RE >> >> >> >> ___ >> FlexRadio mailing list >> FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >> http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >> Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >> FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ >> >> FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ >> >> >> -- next part -- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: >> http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20070106/87177bc4/attachment.html >> >> >> ___ >> FlexRadio mailing list >> FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >> http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >> Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >> FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ >> >> FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ >> > > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hello Ahti : I didn't realize that the thermister was powered directly from the raw DC input. I am using a commercial power supply, an SEC 1223 switcher. The drift is the same regardless of TX power levels, even down at the 5 Watt level. Wouldn't the drift be more severe at the higher power levels? Also, if this is the case, are there any others on this list that see the 22 (or so) HZ change from TX to RX? It is pretty apparent on the waterfall in the digital modes like PSK-31. The drift is the same on two different supplies, and both are regulated. I see very little change on the digital voltmeter as well from TX to RX. It would seem to me that others would see this shift as well, given average power supplies etc. Then again, I might not see the whole picture. ;) Brian K7RE Ahti Aintila wrote: > Brian, > > This is just my guess: > > The thermistor heating the oscillator takes its power directly from > the 13.8 V source. Switching from RX to TX will change the total > current and possibly causes a minor voltage change. That would disturb > shortly the temperature equilibrium of the thermistor/oscillator > system due to the thermal transfer delay. > > 73, Ahti OH2RZ > > > On 06/01/07, Brian Kassel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Folks: >> >> Can someone tell me where the regulated voltage for the 200 MHz. >> oscillator comes from? It isn't clear to me in the schematic. I am >> investigating a 22 HZ oscillator frequency change from TX to RX that >> occurs in the first 10 seconds, then stabilizes to less than 1 Hz >> change. . Temperature doesn't seem to be the culprit, and as far as I >> can see, there is no switching or changing of loading on the >> oscillator between TX and RX. >> Still fighting the uphill battle to determine my frequency shift >> problem. >> >> Brian K7RE >> >> >> >> ___ >> FlexRadio mailing list >> FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >> http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >> Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >> FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ >> >> FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/ >> > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Folks: Can someone tell me where the regulated voltage for the 200 MHz. oscillator comes from? It isn't clear to me in the schematic. I am investigating a 22 HZ oscillator frequency change from TX to RX that occurs in the first 10 seconds, then stabilizes to less than 1 Hz change. . Temperature doesn't seem to be the culprit, and as far as I can see, there is no switching or changing of loading on the oscillator between TX and RX. Still fighting the uphill battle to determine my frequency shift problem. Brian K7RE ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com/ FlexRadio Knowledge Base: http://kb.flex-radio.com/
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hi Maarten: Thanks for the information. More and more it is looking like a hardware problem, but hopefully it will be easy to solve. Tomorrow I will attempt to measure the 200 MHz. oscillator frequency. Got to be getting pretty close to the culprit that is causing the short term drift. Brian K7RE Maarten N1DZ wrote: > The same drift you described I encountered once in my 2m transverter. > I had stabilized the transverter with a thermistor soldered to the > crystal. > Everytime I transmitted the voltage would sag a little causing a > temparature change that caused the oscilator to drift a little. > It would only occur in high duty modes. Ultimately I gave the > thermistor its own power supply. After that the problem was solved. > Good luck and let us know if you are able to solve it. > 73 Maarten N1DZ > > On Sun, 31 Dec 2006 17:00:57 -0500, Brian Kassel > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Hi Jim: >> >> Thanks for the note. Let's see if I can describe to you what I >> see. After even a short transmission of, say, 5 seconds, running >> something like 5W, the frequency of the received PSK-31 signal slowly >> moves to the left on the waterfall display of my MixW program traveling >> about the width of a typical PSK-31 signal in about 2-3 seconds. There >> seems to be no greater frequency shift running 50W for periods up to 1 >> minute duration. I am not sure if my TX frequency is varying. I can't >> tell by ear at this point on another receiver. I have a frequency >> counter, and can measure the TX frequency on CW if that will provide any >> insight. The PS should have no voltage sag at this low power level. I >> use it for other projects. It is a commercial switching supply SEC >> 1223. Since I didn't really suspect the PS, I haven't as yet done any >> measurements. on it.I certainly appreciate any assistance you can >> provide. >> >> Brian K7RE >> Jim Lux wrote: >> >>> At 12:22 PM 12/31/2006, Brian Kassel wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Ross: >>>> >>>> As I had mentioned in 2 messages to Tim: >>>> >>>> "I also got a reply from Ken, N9VV. He basically agrees with you, >>>> and >>>> I gladly accept the turn on drift, no problem. I stand informed and >>>> educated by you both, thanks! >>>> >>>>What does bother me though is the drift that occurs for about 2 >>>> seconds after going from TX to RX. This same amount of drift >>>> happens no >>>> matter what power level is run, and no matter for what time period >>>> the >>>> transmission occurs. Makes for tough operating in a digital mode >>>> contest, which is my main operation here. I have never seen this >>>> mentioned on the Flex reflector. Owing to the fact that the drift >>>> amount and time to stabilize remains the same, it doesn't seem like >>>> any >>>> temperature related phenomena. If this is inherent to normal >>>> operation >>>> of the SDR-1000, then it would appear that either the K2WS mod, or the >>>> GPS mod may be in order. I really want to be sure though before I >>>> spend >>>> the big bucks, that there is no other alternative. " >>>> >>>> " I should have mentioned before that I did indeed test with the >>>> AFC on >>>> and off in both sound card programs (MixW and Digipan), no >>>> difference in >>>> the drift was seen in any case, still a few tens of Hz. " >>>> >>>> So even accepting the short initial turn on, I am still saddled with >>>> the TX-RX drift. Also, I am not totally sure that going with the K2WS >>>> or GPS mod, the TX-RX drift will be cured. Still open for any >>>> ideas! >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Something weird is going on. There shouldn't be that much change in >>> the frequency just changing from Tx to Rx and back. Is your power >>> supply voltage varying (although, I think the XO runs off a regulated >>> 5V)? Is the frequency change a "step" change or a slow drift to a new >>> steady state (where slow is a couple seconds).. >>> >>> My SDR1000s (old ones, no thermistors) drift on initial power up, but >>> are rock steady shifting between Tx and Rx. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> James Lux, P.E. >>> Spacecraft Radio Frequency Subsystems Group >>
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hi Jim: This is an excellent idea. I actually thought of it, but without a schematic, I was a little hesitant to open the case and probe around. I'll open up the cabinet and try it tomorrow. I'll let the reflector know what I find too, Someday, someone else just may experience these symptoms, whatever the ultimate fix might be. Brian K7RE Jim Lux wrote: > At 08:06 PM 12/31/2006, Brian Kassel wrote: > Have you tried using your frequency counter to count the 200 MHz > reference oscillator. A small loop of wire near the DDS should pick > it up. As I recall, there's some jumper pins that carry the 200 MHz, > so you could take a small piece of (insulated) wirewrap wire and wrap > it around the pin to capacitively couple it off. > > If the 200 MHz stays fixed, then you know that there's something else > going on. > > Jim, W6RMK > > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hi John: Thanks for the message. Yes, the stability from turn on is no problem at all for me. It is the 2-3 second drift from TX back to RX that is worrisome. With so much help on the reflector, I feel sure that we will find the answer. I wonder if any others that are using VAC 4.03 with the virtual sound card, the N8VB virtual com ports and the SDR with the digital mode programs MiXW and Digipan have see what I am describing? AS I have determined that the PS is not at fault, assume that the hardware in the SDR-1000 is OK, I am looking at possible differences between my set up and other folks. This might give me a clue with which to work. Brian K7RE John Basilotto wrote: >Brian, > >The newer SDRs have a 3 minute stabilization period. The older units took 15 >min to stabilize. The radio should be very stable after 3 minutes provided >your power supply voltage is stable. I leave my SDR on 7/24 and experience >about 5-10 Hz drift a day. I usually do an auto calibrate once a day and >don't have any drift problems. > >John P. Basilotto >W5GI >Marketing and Sales >512 535-5266 > >-Original Message- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Kassel >Sent: Sunday, December 31, 2006 10:35 AM >To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz; [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem > >Folks: > > I have been told that with the newer SDR's (mine is only a few weeks old), >no turn on drift should be experienced with the thermistor modification. >However I see drift of probably 100 HZ or so immediately after turn on, for >about 10 minutes or so. I have the feeling that the thermistor feature is >not working in hardware. Am I correct? Is there any way to fix this? I am >a retired electronic technician, and have a pretty good lab set up here, but >don't want to void the warranty. Any and all help will be appreciated. > >Brian K7RE > > > >___ >FlexRadio mailing list >FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com > > > > > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hi Larry: Thanks for your message and suggestions. I changed out the PS with another SEC 22 A version, and the symptoms persist. Please keep in mind that the symptoms also persist when running only 5W. I do appreciate the input as to the fact that a heavier PS is required than the typical 20 or 22A capacity version. Brian K7RE Larry Loen wrote: > Brian Kassel wrote: > >> Hi Jim: >> >>Thanks for the note. Let's see if I can describe to you what I >> see. After even a short transmission of, say, 5 seconds, running >> something like 5W, the frequency of the received PSK-31 signal slowly >> moves to the left on the waterfall display of my MixW program >> traveling about the width of a typical PSK-31 signal in about 2-3 >> seconds. There seems to be no greater frequency shift running 50W >> for periods up to 1 minute duration. I am not sure if my TX >> frequency is varying. I can't tell by ear at this point on another >> receiver. I have a frequency counter, and can measure the TX >> frequency on CW if that will provide any insight. The PS should have >> no voltage sag at this low power level. I use it for other >> projects. It is a commercial switching supply SEC 1223. Since I >> didn't really suspect the PS, I haven't as yet done any measurements. >> on it.I certainly appreciate any assistance you can provide. >> >> Brian K7RE >> Jim Lux wrote: >> >> > > As far as I can tell (and, sample of one notwithstanding, I think I > have a lot of hours with the rig) this is a new symptom. > > I have had various problems, but never a shift in frequency between > transmit and receive whether the rig was on for hours or just turned > on, at least not so far as I could ever tell. > > Do check the power supply, though. And, check the rating. A peak > rating is worthless. You need about a Astron 35 amp supply or better > to run this thing. I ran an Astron 20 (simple math said it worked, > but 20 was a peak rating) and it wasn't enough. But, it also wasn't > easy to detect. In my case, it fooled me by acting like QSK when it > was really just intermittently cutting out. > > > > Larry WO0Z > > > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hi Peter: Yes, it sure could be the sound card. I use the VAC 4-03 application so that the digital mode "sound card" is actually virtual. The SDR-1000 sound card is a Delta 66. The console is V 1.8.0. I can't seem to come up with a method to check the virtual sound card for frequency shift between TX and RX. There are never too many opinions and/or recommendations, so I appreciate your input and ideas. HNY to all EU Friends! Brian K7RE' [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > For what it is worth, can it be a soundcard related problem? > > > > " I should have mentioned before that I did indeed test with the AFC on > and off in both sound card programs (MixW and Digipan), no difference in > the drift was seen in any case, still a few tens of Hz. " (Brian K7RE) > > As I understand it, its only a small drift, Some odd things in a > soundcard > > could maybe change the actual clock frequency a bit just after switching > > between TX and RX, This could result in a small change in the soundcard > > output frequency and so in the transmitted signal > > > > Just a thought, I hope not to send anyone in the wrong direction > > > > Happy 2007 pa0pvn (70 minutes to go 2006) > > > groeten Peter > petervn(a)hetnet.nl <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; pa0pvn(a)hetnet.nl > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; > pa0pvn(a)gmail.com ; pa0pvn(a)amsat.org . > > > ---- > Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] namens Jim Lux > Verzonden: zo 31-12-2006 22:18 > Aan: Brian Kassel; Ross Stenberg > CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; flexradio@flex-radio.biz > Onderwerp: Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem > > At 12:22 PM 12/31/2006, Brian Kassel wrote: > >Hi Ross: > > > > As I had mentioned in 2 messages to Tim: > > > > "I also got a reply from Ken, N9VV. He basically agrees with you, and > >I gladly accept the turn on drift, no problem. I stand informed and > >educated by you both, thanks! > > > >What does bother me though is the drift that occurs for about 2 > >seconds after going from TX to RX. This same amount of drift happens no > >matter what power level is run, and no matter for what time period the > >transmission occurs. Makes for tough operating in a digital mode > >contest, which is my main operation here. I have never seen this > >mentioned on the Flex reflector. Owing to the fact that the drift > >amount and time to stabilize remains the same, it doesn't seem like any > >temperature related phenomena. If this is inherent to normal operation > >of the SDR-1000, then it would appear that either the K2WS mod, or the > >GPS mod may be in order. I really want to be sure though before I spend > >the big bucks, that there is no other alternative. " > > > >" I should have mentioned before that I did indeed test with the AFC on > >and off in both sound card programs (MixW and Digipan), no difference in > >the drift was seen in any case, still a few tens of Hz. " > > > > So even accepting the short initial turn on, I am still saddled with > >the TX-RX drift. Also, I am not totally sure that going with the K2WS > >or GPS mod, the TX-RX drift will be cured. Still open for any ideas! > > > Something weird is going on. There shouldn't be that much change in > the frequency just changing from Tx to Rx and back. Is your power > supply voltage varying (although, I think the XO runs off a regulated > 5V)? Is the frequency change a "step" change or a slow drift to a > new steady state (where slow is a couple seconds).. > > My SDR1000s (old ones, no thermistors) drift on initial power up, but > are rock steady shifting between Tx and Rx. > > > > > James Lux, P.E. > Spacecraft Radio Frequency Subsystems Group > Flight Communications Systems Section > Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Mail Stop 161-213 > 4800 Oak Grove Drive > Pasadena CA 91109 > tel: (818)354-2075 > fax: (818)393-6875 > > > > ___ > FlexRadio mailing list > FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz > http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz > Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ > FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com <http://www.flex-radio.com/> > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hi Jim: Thanks for the note. Let's see if I can describe to you what I see. After even a short transmission of, say, 5 seconds, running something like 5W, the frequency of the received PSK-31 signal slowly moves to the left on the waterfall display of my MixW program traveling about the width of a typical PSK-31 signal in about 2-3 seconds. There seems to be no greater frequency shift running 50W for periods up to 1 minute duration. I am not sure if my TX frequency is varying. I can't tell by ear at this point on another receiver. I have a frequency counter, and can measure the TX frequency on CW if that will provide any insight. The PS should have no voltage sag at this low power level. I use it for other projects. It is a commercial switching supply SEC 1223. Since I didn't really suspect the PS, I haven't as yet done any measurements. on it.I certainly appreciate any assistance you can provide. Brian K7RE Jim Lux wrote: > At 12:22 PM 12/31/2006, Brian Kassel wrote: > >> Hi Ross: >> >> As I had mentioned in 2 messages to Tim: >> >> "I also got a reply from Ken, N9VV. He basically agrees with you, and >> I gladly accept the turn on drift, no problem. I stand informed and >> educated by you both, thanks! >> >>What does bother me though is the drift that occurs for about 2 >> seconds after going from TX to RX. This same amount of drift happens no >> matter what power level is run, and no matter for what time period the >> transmission occurs. Makes for tough operating in a digital mode >> contest, which is my main operation here. I have never seen this >> mentioned on the Flex reflector. Owing to the fact that the drift >> amount and time to stabilize remains the same, it doesn't seem like any >> temperature related phenomena. If this is inherent to normal operation >> of the SDR-1000, then it would appear that either the K2WS mod, or the >> GPS mod may be in order. I really want to be sure though before I spend >> the big bucks, that there is no other alternative. " >> >> " I should have mentioned before that I did indeed test with the AFC on >> and off in both sound card programs (MixW and Digipan), no difference in >> the drift was seen in any case, still a few tens of Hz. " >> >> So even accepting the short initial turn on, I am still saddled with >> the TX-RX drift. Also, I am not totally sure that going with the K2WS >> or GPS mod, the TX-RX drift will be cured. Still open for any ideas! > > > > Something weird is going on. There shouldn't be that much change in > the frequency just changing from Tx to Rx and back. Is your power > supply voltage varying (although, I think the XO runs off a regulated > 5V)? Is the frequency change a "step" change or a slow drift to a new > steady state (where slow is a couple seconds).. > > My SDR1000s (old ones, no thermistors) drift on initial power up, but > are rock steady shifting between Tx and Rx. > > > > > James Lux, P.E. > Spacecraft Radio Frequency Subsystems Group > Flight Communications Systems Section > Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Mail Stop 161-213 > 4800 Oak Grove Drive > Pasadena CA 91109 > tel: (818)354-2075 > fax: (818)393-6875 > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hi Ross: As I had mentioned in 2 messages to Tim: "I also got a reply from Ken, N9VV. He basically agrees with you, and I gladly accept the turn on drift, no problem. I stand informed and educated by you both, thanks! What does bother me though is the drift that occurs for about 2 seconds after going from TX to RX. This same amount of drift happens no matter what power level is run, and no matter for what time period the transmission occurs. Makes for tough operating in a digital mode contest, which is my main operation here. I have never seen this mentioned on the Flex reflector. Owing to the fact that the drift amount and time to stabilize remains the same, it doesn't seem like any temperature related phenomena. If this is inherent to normal operation of the SDR-1000, then it would appear that either the K2WS mod, or the GPS mod may be in order. I really want to be sure though before I spend the big bucks, that there is no other alternative. " " I should have mentioned before that I did indeed test with the AFC on and off in both sound card programs (MixW and Digipan), no difference in the drift was seen in any case, still a few tens of Hz. " So even accepting the short initial turn on, I am still saddled with the TX-RX drift. Also, I am not totally sure that going with the K2WS or GPS mod, the TX-RX drift will be cured. Still open for any ideas! BTW, thanks to all who are trying to help, a Very Happy New Year to ALL! Brian K7RE Ross Stenberg wrote: >According to Flex-Radio "The early versions of the SDR-1000T took as long as >15 minutes to become frequency stable. The addition of the thermistor >results in a dramatic improvement; within 3 minutes the radio is as stable >as most radios with high stability oscillators." > >Seems as if there could be a problem. > >73 Ross K9COX > >- Original Message - >From: "Tim Ellison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Brian Kassel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; ; ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Sunday, December 31, 2006 1:19 PM >Subject: Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem > > > > >>It takes a while for the XO to stabilize once the SDR-1000 is turned on, >>so what you are seeing is normal behavior. Mine does not have the >>therminstor and it takes about 30 minutes to stabilize. Taking 10 >>minutes to stabilize is not that bad since it is three times faster than >>mine. Remember it isn't a VCXO or an OCXO. >> >> >>-Tim >> >>Integrated Technical Services >>www.itsco.com >> >>"Si fractum non sit, id reficere" >>-Unknown Roman consultant >> >>-Original Message- >>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Kassel >>Sent: Sunday, December 31, 2006 1:35 PM >>To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz; [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>Subject: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem >> >>Folks: >> >> I have been told that with the newer SDR's (mine is only a few weeks >>old), no turn on drift should be experienced with the thermistor >>modification. However I see drift of probably 100 HZ or so immediately >>after turn on, for about 10 minutes or so. I have the feeling that the >>thermistor feature is not working in hardware. Am I correct? Is there >>any way to fix this? I am a retired electronic technician, and have a >>pretty good lab set up here, but don't want to void the warranty. Any >>and all help will be appreciated. >> >>Brian K7RE >> >> > > > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Hi Tim: Thanks for your very rapid reply on a Sunday and a Holiday to boot! I also got a reply from Ken, N9VV. He basically agrees with you, and I gladly accept the turn on drift, no problem. I stand informed and educated by you both, thanks! What does bother me though is the drift that occurs for about 2 seconds after going from TX to RX. This same amount of drift happens no matter what power level is run, and no matter for what time period the transmission occurs. Makes for tough operating in a digital mode contest, which is my main operation here. I have never seen this mentioned on the Flex reflector. Owing to the fact that the drift amount and time to stabilize remains the same, it doesn't seem like any temperature related phenomena. If this is inherent to normal operation of the SDR-1000, then it would appear that either the K2WS mod, or the GPS mod may be in order. I really want to be sure though before I spend the big bucks, that there is no other alternative. Brian K7RE Tim Ellison wrote: >It takes a while for the XO to stabilize once the SDR-1000 is turned on, >so what you are seeing is normal behavior. Mine does not have the >therminstor and it takes about 30 minutes to stabilize. Taking 10 >minutes to stabilize is not that bad since it is three times faster than >mine. Remember it isn't a VCXO or an OCXO. > > >-Tim > >Integrated Technical Services >www.itsco.com > >"Si fractum non sit, id reficere" >-Unknown Roman consultant > >-Original Message----- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Kassel >Sent: Sunday, December 31, 2006 1:35 PM >To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz; [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem > >Folks: > > I have been told that with the newer SDR's (mine is only a few weeks >old), no turn on drift should be experienced with the thermistor >modification. However I see drift of probably 100 HZ or so immediately >after turn on, for about 10 minutes or so. I have the feeling that the >thermistor feature is not working in hardware. Am I correct? Is there >any way to fix this? I am a retired electronic technician, and have a >pretty good lab set up here, but don't want to void the warranty. Any >and all help will be appreciated. > >Brian K7RE > > > >___ >FlexRadio mailing list >FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ >FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com > > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] More Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Folks: I have been told that with the newer SDR's (mine is only a few weeks old), no turn on drift should be experienced with the thermistor modification. However I see drift of probably 100 HZ or so immediately after turn on, for about 10 minutes or so. I have the feeling that the thermistor feature is not working in hardware. Am I correct? Is there any way to fix this? I am a retired electronic technician, and have a pretty good lab set up here, but don't want to void the warranty. Any and all help will be appreciated. Brian K7RE ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] Strange Frequency Drift Problem
Folks: I notice a strange indication when I am in the Digital mode with any version of the console, and any digital mode program. When switching back to receive after a transmission, all signals on the waterfall move a few tens of Hz. left to right. This drift ceases after about 2-3 seconds, then the waterfall seems stable as a rock. I am referring to the Digital mode waterfall, not the SDR-1000 waterfall in the console. I have tried several Digital mode programs, and both version 1.6 and 1.8 of the console program. The amount TX power out has no effect, and the station PS is rock steady. I have run the frequency calibration routine against WWV. Since I am contester, I really need the RX waterfall to be steady immediately after a transmission, 3 seconds is too long to wait for the frequency to settle down. Any suggestions please/ Brian K7RE ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
