Re: recommendation instead of portmanager
--As of January 11, 2013 11:07:58 PM +0100, Artifex Maximus is alleged to have said: I am using portmanager for updating my ports. I love its -p switch. Is there any similar program with such option? I am asking because portmanager is gone from ports tree. --As for the rest, it is mine. As of when? I still see it. (And I'm dreading it ever going away: It's the only port update tool I've tried that's never broken my system, and the only one that can handle errors in any sensible way, in my opinion.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Gamin/IMAP issue
Since upgrading to 9.1 I've been getting errors retrieving my email via
IMAP. They don't appear to actually prevent anything, but they are
annoying at least. (And while I haven't noticed anything else that is
having the same errors that doesn't mean it's not happening...)
The errors I'm getting are:
Failed to connect to socket /tmp/fam-daniel/fam-
Failed to create cache file: maildirwatch (daniel)
Error: Input/output error
Check for proper operation and configuration
of the File Access Monitor daemon (famd).
('daniel' of course being the name of my user.) I'm using courier-IMAP and
gamin. The only thing I can find online on this is someone else on the
freebsd forums who had the same problem ~8 years ago, who eventually gave
up and switched to fam. (Well, other than the ones that say 'install
fam/gamin', which I have installed, but doesn't appear to be working.) I
have rebuilt and reinstalled both courier-IMAP and gamin. (I actually did
a 'rebuild all dependencies' for gamin.) Permissions on the /tmp and
/tmp/fam-daniel directories are as I'd expect. I've also increased
kern.maxfiles to 10, to make sure it can handle my large maildir
directories. (Though this wasn't a problem before I upgraded.)
Anyone have any other ideas on where I can start troubleshooting? (And
yes, I'm considering upgrading to Dovecot, but I want to know everything is
working first.)
Daniel T. Staal
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Re: Gamin/IMAP issue
--As of January 10, 2013 10:48:41 AM -0500, Michael Powell is alleged to have said: Not exactly sure where the problem stems from, but one thing you may wish to consider: do make config on the courier-imap port and deselect the 'with gamin' option and rebuild/make reinstall. I ran courier-imap forever without gamin so I suspect it's not really needed. If this works out remove gamin from the box if there is nothing else using it. Same for fam - if it isn't absolutely required by anything get rid of it. Only port I have that actually uses/depends on gamin for me is Samba36. Definatly an option, though I'd like to know what - exactly - went wrong, as I haven't touched those options on this box in a couple of years. (And it's apparently gamin *or* fam: They would conflict if you installed them both. I have gamin.) As it's just a personal box I can get away with trying to hunt down elusive snarks. ;) The only thing I can think of why courier-imap might have use for gamin/fam is for shared folders and shared folder indexing. This I do not use. YMMV? I don't either, but I get the error basically any time I open anything. I think Peter's idea that it's trying to check usage quotas (which I also don't use...) is more likely correct. Note: /tmp is usually a 'sticky bit' set - mode 1777. I've had a time or two in the past where I've muffed that up. Yep, that's what I was expecting. ;) Anyone have any other ideas on where I can start troubleshooting? (And yes, I'm considering upgrading to Dovecot, but I want to know everything is working first.) I just made the move to dovecot2 after 10 years, or so, of using courier- imap. Not that I ever had any trouble with courier-imap either, but the dovecot2 is a little cleaner install with fewer 'satellite' addons. Been using it a month now and am happy with results. It also slid right in and took over the existing Maildir contents from pre-existing courier-imap - I was very happy to see this! I'm mostly just hearing good things about it, especially that it's slightly faster. It doesn't make much difference to me, but on the other hand I have a couple of folders I do have to wait a moment to open... Mainly though, since I don't have any actual complaints about Courier (other than this new issue, which doesn't appear to primarily Courier's fault), it's not going to be moving up my priority list very fast. ;) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Reading the handbook from console
--As of January 10, 2013 12:37:06 PM -0600, Scott Eberl is alleged to have said: I went ahead and installed the FreeBSD handbook onto my system and I was able to find it on disk per the motd notes but I'm wondering if there is a preferred method for reading these since they are in html format. I tried w3m and lynx and it looks like they are both not installed. Is there something i'm missing for reading these or do I just need to install a cli browser? --As for the rest, it is mine. You'd need to install a cli browser, for the standard install. (Or a PDF viewer, IIRC.) You can go back and change your options for the handbook port if you want as well - one of the other options is to install it in plain text format, either as well or instead. (Other formats there are options for include PDF, Postscript, and a couple of HTML options.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: 9.0 vs 9.1
--As of January 10, 2013 8:02:01 PM -0600, Scott Eberl is alleged to have said: OK can someone please explain this to me in detail? I've been reading all the release notes I can find and I'm not understanding why after upgrading to 9.1 I have to compile from source to install stuff now. It takes forever and asks me questions I have no idea what the answer is to. Early today I installed irssi which I had to do with make clean install because just doing pkg_add -r irssi complains about not being able to find the url of it. Should I just reinstall 9.0 and not upgrade, will ports work correctly then? --As for the rest, it is mine. It's not really because of the release; the same problem actually affects 9.0, but you don't notice it because you can still get old packages. The basic problem is that there was a security breach in the Freebsd build and distribution network. Therefore, until parts of it have been rebuilt, it cannot be trusted. So, there are no trusted servers to build packages at the moment. This was mentioned in a security advisory a while back - well before the release. Since trusted packages of old versions of ports still exist in the required locations, 9.0 can see them. There is no particular reason to believe those packages wouldn't work under 9.1, but on the other hand there is no particular reason to believe that *all* of them still work, (other than there shouldn't have been any changes that affected them) and it is known that they are out of date, so they haven't been moved to the required locations for 9.1. The Freebsd team is working on rebuilding their build and distribution network, but it will take time, and I believe getting 9.1 out may have been considered higher priority. (Mostly because it was so close to done.) Until then, building from source is secure and trusted - and is the only way to get up-to-date ports for *either* 9.0 or 9.1. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: GELI+ZFS failed disk issue
On 2012-10-04 11:45, Andre Goree wrote: Hello all. Wondering I can pick your brains regarding a situation I've run into. I've followed this article on setting up my FreeBSD 9 install on ZFS w/GELI encyrption -- sans the part about having 'bootdir' on a mirror, which, sadly, likely would've saved me from my current problem: https://www.dan.me.uk/blog/2012/05/06/full-disk-encryption-with-zfs-root-for-freebsd-9-x/ The server ran great and I had no issues until this past weekend, when my hard drive that contains the OS pool (including /, /boot, etc.) FAILED. I'm now in the situation where my encryption key file cannot be accessed, since it is on a failed disk. I can live without the stuff on the OS pool, however I have another pool containing many GBs of data (music, video, documents, etc.) that I desperately need and cannot lose. Whats worse is that I never got around to setting up backups for this data (damn laziness!). Unless you've got your key saved somewhere I don't see a lot of options for you. There is one thing you might be able to try: There has to be a copy of the /boot directory someplace on that (failed) disk with the keys in an unencrypted form, otherwise it would have been unable to boot at all. Depending on how the disk failed, there's a chance that (relatively small) section of the disk survived, and could be recoverable by a disk-recovery service. But that's my only thought to a hope... Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Wifi for Lenovo Laptop
On 2012-08-29 11:42, Chris wrote: Hi, I've tried to search the lists but can't find anything, but please point me to an existing resource if available. I recently got a Lenovo ThinkPad Edge E530 (3259-9VG) laptop and would like to get the Wifi card running (fresh FreeBSD 9.0 install), but I'm failling as it has been at least 5 years since I used with wifi under FreeBSD. The card is not automatically detected (interface not listed in ifconfig) so I'm assuming I have to either load a kernel module or go the NDIS path. It seems like on Windows, the same driver is used for E430, E435, E530 and E535, so in case anyone is using one of these models, please let me know if have things running. So some questions that might point me in the right direction: - How can I find out which type of card this laptop actually has (can I read it out of dmesg, some PCI listing or whatever)? All I can find are product sheets saying that it has 11b/g/n, but doesn't help me to find a driver. I Is there some meta-module that loads all the native wifi drivers that I can use that I can test? There's a couple of different Wifi options for that machine, so which one you have may make a difference. There looks to be some information on identifying which card you have here: http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Wireless_Network_Adapters (Though they don't have your model listed yet, I think it's a new model...) I'm guessing you probably have a 'Thinkpad' card, which recently has been Realtek, but you'd have to check that. Note that replacing it with a generic mini-PCI wireless card may not work: Lenovo has been known to have their BIOS only recognize 'official' replacement parts. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: compare zfs xfs and jfs o
--As of August 5, 2012 10:29:16 AM -0600, Chad Perrin is alleged to have said: I think that XFS JFS are more mature filesystems than ZFS, but the feature set of ZFS i ahead in the future. For a NFS server first I'll go with ZFS because the consistence in disk and speed will gonna be the differentiator. The idea that ZFS is faster than XFS is certainly a new one for me. Do you have some benchmarks for that? --As for the rest, it is mine. Particularly in this use-case: From my reading ZFS has a performance hit when used as a base filesystem for NFS. (Largely because it insists on *actually following* the NFS spec, and not taking some shortcuts that are common elsewhere...) Not that I have tested that, even on my NFS server. (Which runs ZFS - there are other excellent reasons to use it, and speed isn't a major concern for that particular box.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: portupgrade -- is there a way to only build and update ports that actually NEED it?
On 2012-06-25 11:47, John Levine wrote: You would think there's an option to portupgrade that says don't upgrade every single package I've got, but if somewhere in the dependency chain I need a newer version of a thing, then do it. The problem is that the versioning in the ports system doesn't distinguish between upgrades that present interface changes and upgrades that are just nits, new features, or minor bug fixes. Port makefiles can contain version dependency info, e.g., this port needs at least version N.M of package X, but few of them do. This has bitten me in the past with PHP and pcre. In fact, PHP5 won't work with old versions of pcre, but the PHP port maintainer refuses to put in version dependency info, because he thinks that every port should be up to date all the time. There's also the issue of things like Perl modules - most of them will just work, even with a newer version of perl, but a few have sections that need to be compiled against perl itself. So if you update the Perl port, you need to at least recompile those. (I'm simplifying a bit.) But there is no good way to mark in general which ports will 'just work' with an updated dependency, and which care what version of the dependency was installed when they were compiled. This is separate from versioned dependencies: Again to use Perl modules as an example, DBI for instance is will work with any version of perl since 5.8 or so - but if you change which version of perl you are using you'll need to recompile and reinstall. Rebuilding everything is a bit overkill, but it beats missing one that needed to be rebuilt. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Is ZFS production ready?
On 2012-06-21 08:12, Евгений Лактанов wrote: 21.06.2012 15:52, Wojciech Puchar пишет: stick with UFS. It JUST WORKS(R), and is trusty. And it works fast. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org I see the trend here. That guy is determined to shove his opinion down the throat of everybody. Stop it, tis most annoying. Back to the topic. ZFS support has matured greatly since the last time you tried it, currently freebsd supports zfs pool v. 28 in the last updates. Try it, it won't disappoint you. Agreed. Wojciech Puchar is in my 'probable troll' file at this point, from his interactions on several topics. ZFS is stable and tested, and works well if you have the resources. That means RAM as well as hard disks - and if you don't have the resources, most of ZFS's advantages wouldn't be coming into play anyway. I have seen no reason to believe at this point (under FreeBSD 9) that it is any less stable than any other filesystem. It is still fairly new relatively, but I and others have used it with no problems, on boxes of various sizes. Getting the best performance may take some tweaking on occasion, but in general it should be very good. (And getting the best performance out of a multi-terabyte drive array will take tweaking no matter what file system you are trying.) My one note to the above would be to advise against using it for swap - unless you have enough RAM to make sure you never swap. It doesn't do well in that role, in my experience. (Though that was under a slightly earlier version.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Which FreeBSD for Intel i7-2600S and DQ67SWB3?
--As of June 7, 2012 3:30:52 PM -0700, David Christensen is alleged to have said: For a new computer, I wouldn't go with anything earlier than FreeBSD 9.0, and in my case, upgrading to 9.0-STABLE proved stabler than the 9.0 release. STFW: http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-questions/2012-March/239742.ht ml It looks like -STABLE are daily development/ test builds (?): It's a bit more nuanced: -STABLE is -RELEASE plus features that are believed to be complete and tested. -CURRENT is -STABLE plus features that are still under development. I'd call -STABLE test - but not quite development - builds, if that makes sense. ftp://ftp.allbsd.org/pub/FreeBSD-snapshots/amd64-amd64/ I'm looking for stability. I'll try the 9.0-RELEASE: ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/releases/amd64/amd64/ISO-IMAGES/9.0/ This generally my choice. You can be sure it's considered final-product ready. It also allows you to use freebsd-update to get patches. (Unless you compile your own.) I don't recognize or don't remember DQ67SWB3 motherboard model, is it from MSI? Intel: http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/motherboards/desktop-motherboards/ desktop-board-dq67sw.html I'm not sure what the B3 suffix means, but it's on the box. A few other questions for the list, please: 1. Does FreeBSD support encrypted disk partitions (slices)? Yes, see the Handbook: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/disks-encrypting.html (Actually, many of your questions can be answered from the handbook. ;) ) Using them in conjunction with ZFS is a bit complicated, but can be done. (Generally, you'd want to use an encrypted slice as a disk to put ZFS on.) ZFS itself does not currently support encryption. 2. Does the X server in FreeBSD (?) support Intel HD 2000 integrated graphics? That's Sandy Bridge, and is supported as of 9.0. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Is this something we (as consumers of FreeBSD) need to be aware of?]
On 2012-06-05 17:20, Jerry wrote: The question that I have not seen answered in this thread is what FreeBSD intents to do. From what I have seen, most FreeBSD users do not use the latest versions of most hardware, so it may be a while before its user base is even effected. I don't believe at this point FreeBSD has any intent one way or another, really. It's not an immediate problem for any platform supported by the FreeBSD project, at least for a technically-inclined user who's willing to check out their BIOS. (Even if they are using the latest hardware, the x86-derived platforms aren't going to require this code signing yet.) So it'll probably be a 'wait and see if it's something the FreeBSD community needs a solution for' at this point. But this is just my impression. In slight defense of RedHat: They do a lot of worrying about enterprise and government customers, many of whom don't really care what platform they are running on - as long as they can get 'support' and it passes their security/operational tests. In that environment, I can easily see some middle-manager decreeing that disabling the signed-boot process is verboten, without any understanding of the meaning or the consequences, and enforcing it on the whole company/division, to the point where any non-signed OS would be thrown out the door. FreeBSD has probably already been thrown out the door at those types of locations, as there is no 'official' support channel. (Yes, for my sins, I work at one of these...) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Is this something we (as consumers of FreeBSD) need to be aware of?]
On 2012-06-06 15:05, Jerry wrote: On Wed, 06 Jun 2012 12:49:53 -0400 Daniel Staal articulated: I don't believe at this point FreeBSD has any intent one way or another, really. It's not an immediate problem for any platform supported by the FreeBSD project, at least for a technically-inclined user who's willing to check out their BIOS. (Even if they are using the latest hardware, the x86-derived platforms aren't going to require this code signing yet.) So it'll probably be a 'wait and see if it's something the FreeBSD community needs a solution for' at this point. But this is just my impression. I totally agree with you. Unfortunately that speaks to the sad state of affairs that FreeBSD appears to be in. When it comes to supporting the latest technologies, it tends to be behind the curve when compared to other operating systems. Wireless networking and USB support are only a few examples. That was not my intended message with the above. :) FreeBSD supports several server-class hardware platforms. ARM is not currently a server-class hardware platform. (It's a very interesting platform for mobile and small devices, but it has not seen any significant use that I am aware of in the market that FreeBSD is primarily aimed at.) Secure Boot - if even a part of the platform - can easily be disabled on those platforms. So it is not a current problem, and there is a fair amount of bad feeling about the technology, so it may not ever be a problem. RedHat is facing severe backlash from the community because it supported this technology. A 'wait and see' approach to whether it needs to be supported at all - especially as it doesn't appear to need support at present - is a reasonable course. I don't know of any user personally who purchased a new PC and then threw FreeBSD on it. Most users that I have come into contact with use 2+ year old units that have been replaced by shiny new Windows units. I don't see that changing anytime soon. *Raises hand*. I did this with two boxes within the past year. One turned out to be to new for FreeBSD - but Linux didn't have support for it yet at that point either. Now either does. In slight defense of RedHat: They do a lot of worrying about enterprise and government customers, many of whom don't really care what platform they are running on - as long as they can get 'support' and it passes their security/operational tests. In that environment, I can easily see some middle-manager decreeing that disabling the signed-boot process is verboten, without any understanding of the meaning or the consequences, and enforcing it on the whole company/division, to the point where any non-signed OS would be thrown out the door. FreeBSD has probably already been thrown out the door at those types of locations, as there is no 'official' support channel. (Yes, for my sins, I work at one of these...) What sin? You use a product and want it properly supported. You have an absolute right to that. Posting a message on a forum and hoping that someone can answer it is not the type of support a business would want. I'm not sure what sin I committed to be consigned to this place, but it must have been heinous. (And in many cases 'official support' appears to be 'post a message about it on our forum, so we can ignore you more efficiently'.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Anyone using freebsd ZFS for large storage servers?
--As of June 2, 2012 6:32:39 PM -0400, Simon is alleged to have said: This thread confused me. Is the conclusion of this thread that ZFS is slow and breaks beyond recovery? I keep seeing two sides to this coin. I can't decide whether to use ZFS or hardware RAID. Why does EMC use hardware RAID? --As for the rest, it is mine. It appears to be the conclusion of Wojciech Puchar that ZFS is slow, and breaks beyond recovery. The rest of us don't appear to have issues. I will agree that ZFS could use a good worst-case scenario 'fsck' like tool. However, between at home and at work (where it's used on Solaris), the only time I've ever been in a situation where it would be needed was when I was playing with the disks in several low-level tools; the situation was entirely self-inflicted, and would have caused major trouble for any file system. (If I'd been storing data on it, I would have needed to go to backups. Again, this would have been the case for any file system.) ZFS can be a complicated beast: It's not the best choice for a single, small, disk. It may take tuning to work to it's full potential, and it's fairly resource-intensive. However, for large storage sets there is no other file system out there at the moment that's as flexible, or as useful, in my opinion. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Anyone using freebsd ZFS for large storage servers?
--As of May 31, 2012 11:24:41 AM -0700, Dennis Glatting is alleged to have said: 2) Under heavy I/O my systems freeze for a few seconds. I haven't looked into why but they are completely unresponsive. Note I am also using compressed volumes (gzip), which puts a substantual load on the kernel. --As for the rest, it is mine. I'm not using as huge a dataset, but I was seeing this behavior as well when I first set my box up. What was happening was that ZFS was caching *lots* of writes, and then would dump them all to disk at once, during which time the computer was completely occupied with the disk I/O. The solution (suggested from http://wiki.freebsd.org/ZFSTuningGuide) for me was: vfs.zfs.txg.timeout=5 in loader.conf. That only allows it to cache writes for 5 seconds, instead of the default 30. This appears to be the default in the latest versions of FreeBSD, so if you are running an upgraded 9, ignore me. ;) (But check the page linked above: There are other suggestions to try.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: FreeBSD X?
--As of May 17, 2012 8:36:38 PM -0400, Vance Siemens is alleged to have said: http://www.trollaxor.com/2012/05/freebsd-x-berkeley-unix-apple-quality.ht Um, wasn't April 1st *last* month? Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Best mail setup for home server?
--As of May 5, 2012 10:21:10 AM -0500, Joshua Isom is alleged to have said: I currently use my FreeBSD system as my generic unix server and some coding, along with occasional multimedia. I'd installed postfix years ago and kept using it. Right now, I use getmail with cron, dspam, and dovecot to handle my gmail account. I've never set up outgoing mail which makes changing email clients, or devices, annoying. Currently postfix is set to use dovecot's deliver command so that dovecot can sort and handle it. Before I deal with setting postfix to relay the mail, dealing with firewalls and other possible issues, is there a better alternative? I'd prefer that local mail just works even if I lose internet, and any email that gets as far as my server will at least eventually mail. --As for the rest, it is mine. I've been using Postfix for a decade to do basically this; no major problems, and it doesn't take much to set up. No reason to go to something else. (Even for speed: I've used it for work on a site handling millions of messages a day...) As has been said, a local resolver will help. The thing to watch for is what mail you'll let it accept: It's moderately easy to set it up as an open relay, which you *don't* want to do. Accept from the local network is fine; I've never needed to set up authenticated sending from outside that, though I keep meaning to when I have some free time... The dynamic IP problem can be a hassle, and lead to weird losses of mail. My solution has just been to call the ISP and get a 'business' line, with a static IP, though forwarding to their mail relay would work as well. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: freebsd-update not updating reported patchlevel
On 2012-05-04 10:45, Polytropon wrote: Allow me to extent the approach: For -STABLE versions (e. g. if updated per CVS), those files could contain the build number and the date of the currently installed -STABLE snapshot. A separation of a kernel version file and a world version file is useful in cases the kernel won't be touched, so no need to update its version file (as well as the kernel itself) by a binary update. The files should be easily parsable. They could even contain an assignment in sh syntax, as well as comments (for BSDL and $FreeBSD$ information). Their templates could be stored in the /usr/src subtree for the etc/ structure, so programs like make and mergemaster could access them from there. Maybe a binary command could be added to the base system to query this information (maybe getent could do that?). Here are some suggestions: /etc/kernversion VERSION=8.2 BRANCH=STABLE BUILD=12345 DATE=2011-08-01 12:34:56 or /etc/kernversion VERSION=8.4 BRANCH=RELEASE PATCH=2 DATE=2012-02-02 02:02:02 /etc/sysversion VERSION=8.4 BRANCH=RELEASE PATCH=4 DATE=2012-04-04 04:04:04 This shows: Kernel has last been updated to patchlevel 2 (to check with uname -r will show that version), but the system has been updated two more times to patchlevel 4. The notation could be X.Y-pZ or X.Y.Z for -RELEASE installations, and X.Y-B for -STABLE installations. However, it's not hard to write any custom parser and composer if urgently needed. Maybe things also present in uname -a output (such as architecture and OS name) could be included, but I think that's not required because it's mostly obvious. :-) I think you could still get a machine-parseable version on one line, that's also a bit nicer for human reading. Perhaps something like this? (Partly inspired by RedHat's /etc/redhat-release) /etc/sysversion FreeBSD RELEASE 8.4-p4: 2012-04-04 04:04:04 You should be able to parse that with a few lines of C or shell, and it looks like something set up to be read by humans. You just need to define - and stick to - which pieces of information will be in there in what order. (For instance, I'd prefer '9.0-p0' to '9.0' Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
bsdpan-* ports, portmanager, and @comment ORIGIN:
I'm working on developing some stuff in Perl on my box, which works fairly well unless I go to update my system. Anytime I do, I get the following error from portmanager: `rCreateInstalledDbVerifyContentsFile 0.4.1_9 error: @comment ORIGIN: not found in /var/db/pkg/bsdpan-$MODULE_NAME` Where $MODULE_NAME is one of the modules I've installed via CPAN, instead of using the FreeBSD ports system. It will advise me to delete the package and then try manually reinstalling it - which works, *if* I install the Ports version. Then running portmanager again will just pick the next module from the list, and go on, until I've uninstalled everything I installed via CPAN and installed it from Ports. Which would be fine, if annoying, if everything actually was available in Ports. But it's not: I'm using several modules that aren't available from Ports, and of course the modules I'm *developing* aren't available from Ports. So, is there any way to *avoid* getting that error? Some way where I can actually use the ports system to keep my stuff up to date? (Even if it doesn't include the manually-installed software?) Or do I just have to avoid anything Perl-related from the Ports system and install everything manually? (Or - likely at that point - find a different OS to work on. It'd be less hassle to switch OSes than to try to make sure *nothing* using Perl is installed from the Ports.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: bsdpan-* ports, portmanager, and @comment ORIGIN:
--As of April 29, 2012 12:46:52 PM -0400, Jerry is alleged to have said: Which would be fine, if annoying, if everything actually was available in Ports. But it's not: I'm using several modules that aren't available from Ports, and of course the modules I'm *developing* aren't available from Ports. Which specific modules are not available? In the past I had to port a few Perl modules into FreeBSD or else install them via CPAN as you have done. If it is a simple module, I can show you how to do it or make a port for it myself. Also, you should be aware that many modules are available in the ports system, but not under the correct CPAN name. Don't ask why; I did once and got so much BS that I just abandoned the question. --As for the rest, it is mine. I'm still in early development, so the list is likely to grow as the project moves along. The main one that's causing me trouble at the moment is CGI::Application::Plugin::CompressGzip, although I've noticed that several others of the CGI::Application set that look interesting and useful aren't in the ports system. And, of course, there is the modules I'm developing for this project. Making ports for each one feels like a band-aid though: It's a 'solution' that's just going to grow in complexity and scope the longer it goes on, and isn't really fixing anything other than the individual symptoms. A real solution to me would either be a way to get @comment ORIGIN: to automatically populate in the bsdpan-* (CPAN) module install process, or a way to get portmanager to ignore modules installed via that process. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: bsdpan-* ports, portmanager, and @comment ORIGIN:
--As of April 29, 2012 1:36:55 PM -0400, Jerry is alleged to have said: UNTESTED: In the /usr/local/etc/portmanager/pm-020.conf file, add the specific port(s) you are trying to bypass. EXAMPLE: IGNORE|www/tidy| Again, this is untested, but I have used it for other ports that I needed to skip. --As for the rest, it is mine. Yes, that works for *ports.* Unfortunatly, it doesn't appear to work for non-ports that are installed but show up in the ports system. (The bsdpan-* stuff.) (Note: The error I quoted earlier is the very first thing that shows up when I run portmanager - it then goes on to collect installed port data, and notes but skips a couple that I had already put in to be ignored. The error I'm having appears to occur before that step - and interferes with the proper collection of installed port data.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: bsdpan-* ports, portmanager, and @comment ORIGIN:
--As of April 29, 2012 1:36:55 PM -0400, Jerry is alleged to have said: I will have a look at the CPAN module: CGI::Application::Plugin::CompressGzip later today or tomorrow and see if I can make a port of it for you. --As for the rest, it is mine. Sorry, I should have put this in the other email... While I'd thank you for the consideration and effort, I'd consider this time poorly spent: CGI::Application::Plugin::CompressGzip is not the problem, it's just the current showstopper symptom. The problem is the bsdpan system, which tries to integrate CPAN with the ports system. It needs to either: A. Work. or B. Get out of the way. If you want to spend time on this, please rather than create a band-aid, see if you can find the root problem in wherever the bsdpan system is, and submit a patch upstream (to whomever is in charge of that) to fix it. (Or remove it.) It might take a bit longer, but instead of fixing it for *me* *this week,* you'd fix it for *everyone* for quite a bit longer. I'm hoping someone on this list knows some of where that might be, or might even be the person to talk to in order to get it fixed. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: bsdpan-* ports, portmanager, and @comment ORIGIN:
--As of April 29, 2012 8:11:19 PM +0100, RW is alleged to have said: So, is there any way to *avoid* getting that error? Some way where I can actually use the ports system to keep my stuff up to date? (Even if it doesn't include the manually-installed software?) It think you should be able to prevent the package entries by setting DISABLE_BSDPAN in the environment. --As for the rest, it is mine. Semi-successful: It appears to work for `cpanp` installed modules, but not `cpan` installed modules. And for some reason, p5-CPANPLUS won't install correctly (no errors, it just doesn't actually install the client), so `cpanp` is a `cpan` installed module... (And yes, this is after reinstalling them.) So it looks like it's getting me partway there, but not all the way. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: how often to update ports?
--As of March 30, 2012 4:31:49 PM -0400, Aleksandr Miroslav is alleged to have said: So I'm curious, how often do you keep your ports update, and what are the reasons for doing so? --As for the rest, it is mine. I do my home server on a monthly schedule, unless I see something come up in portaudit. I find it easier to keep roughly up to date, and that's a convient timeframe. It's also how often I go on call at work, so I have a reminder. ;) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: imap server performance benchmarks
--As of March 9, 2012 12:44:55 PM +1000, Da Rock is alleged to have said: I'm reconsidering my current setup (postfix/courier) for imap and I was doing some research on performance comparisons between imap server setups. I stumbled on this article just just about fell of my chair laughing when I read the last article on future benchmarking tests to perform: research.microsoft.com/pubs/138302/lisa.pdf Considering I have close to a hundred folders or more, and an average of 50,000 emails in each (yes, not good, and I am working on archiving but it won't help _that_ much) with nearly 200,000 in just one! I got a real kick out of the comment that no sane email user would have more than 21,000 emails in a folder - that would make me certifiable :D Oh, and that most email wouldn't be more than a GB or so... mine's edging 6GB already... So, all jokes aside, I contemplated that I would make an ideal test case to the extreme for benchmarking imap servers. Anyone have any suggestions on what to test/how? Anyone have some tools they have created for a similar challenge? I have my own ideas, but if anyone wants me to try something I'd be willing to give it a shot. --As for the rest, it is mine. No idea, but as someone who recently had to trim one of his mail folders (same setup) as it was having trouble with over 210,000 messages, I'd be interested in your results. ;) Daniel T. STaal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Email issues, relay failure, perhaps Jails is causing it.
--As of February 26, 2012 8:20:14 AM +0100, Bernt Hansson is alleged to have said: http://www.uk.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/jails.html Have you tried to telnet into the other jailed hostnames and ip-addresses, like telnet rt3.* 25 What does it say? Can you connect? There seems to be either a jail problem or a routing problem You can look at your routing table with netstat -r --As for the rest, it is mine. This is my strong suspicion as well. To separate out what the problem is: 'su' to root in the jailed system. Shut down postfix. (`postfix stop`, or `/etc/rc.d/postfix stop`) Then run `nc -l 25`. This will echo anything that comes in on port 25 direct to your terminal. Then try telneting to it. If it works, the problem is postfix. If it doesn't, restart postfix and ignore it: It's not the problem. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: SMTP error: 552 5.6.0 Headers too large (32768 max)
On Thu, February 23, 2012 2:01 pm, Julian H. Stacey wrote: Those 388 probably explain why I just saw on a FreeBSD-6.4 host: ] fetchmail: SMTP error: 552 5.6.0 Headers too large (32768 max) ] fetchmail: mail from MAILER-DAEMON@ bounced to owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org ] fetchmail: SMTP listener refused delivery My sympathies go to postmaster@ team who are probably already receiving lots of bounces noise on this. PS Yes I realise I should upgrade that 6.4 box to 8.2 (as headers made it through the more modern SMTP of list server), but my local tech. constraints etc delay me ). Sounds like it's working as a decent spam filter to me. What setting to I have to change to make it do that again? ;) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: One or Four?
--As of February 19, 2012 3:30:15 PM +0100, Julian H. Stacey is alleged to have said: Beside the point: the Wrong list was posted to. questions@ list was created to help beginners, not to debate invite votes to determine future design. FreeBSD lists have remits so people can read write lists most tuned to interests. Tossing non beginner support topics in questions@ deprives other lists. Not all on hackers@ current@ the many other list want to be on questions@ vice versa. Please read list remits subscribe post most appropriate list per topic. --As for the rest, it is mine. I don't get 'beginners' from 'User questions and technical support'. It's probably the best place for most beginner's questions, but that isn't the same as 'the list is for beginners'. Hackers@ might have been appropriate for this question, but it's not really a *technical* question: It's a *preference* question. As such asking the group of general users isn't a bad idea, as it's their preferences that the question was aimed at... It was a question for the users of FreeBSD. Adressing it to the list for user questions may be an interesting interpretation of the grammar, but it's not an invalid one. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: /usr/home vs /home (was: Re: One or Four?)
--As of February 18, 2012 2:46:32 PM -0800, Michael Sierchio is alleged to have said: man hier --As for the rest, it is mine. ...Doesn't mention /home (or /usr/home) once. ;) Pointing people to the docs which answers their question is good. But please make sure it actually answers their question. Thanks to everyone who has answered. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Maildir Format
On Fri, February 17, 2012 12:16 pm, APseudoUtopia wrote: Hello, I'm setting up the email system on my server. I got rid of sendmail and installed postfix, and I will be installing dovecot. I researched the difference between mbox and maildir formats, and I'm going to go with the Maildir. I'm running everything on ZFS, so many small files shouldn't be a problem. My problem is, before I made any of these changes and was using the default sendmail setup, I was using /usr/bin/mail to read my periodic and cron outputs. However, after I installed postfix with the Maildir delivery option, I quickly realized that /usr/bin/mail doesn't support Maildir. Can anyone suggest a MUA which has support for Maildir that I can use? I'm looking for something simple and command line, similar to /usr/bin/mail that I can use until I get around to installing Dovecot. The only one I know of off the top of my head is mutt. I've never had much use, and thus experience, with unix MUAs. Thank you. Honestly, for one or two pure-text emails a day, I find 'less' on the most recent files in the Maildir folder works fairly well, especially for just a couple of days... Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
/usr/home vs /home (was: Re: One or Four?)
--As of February 17, 2012 11:46:23 PM +0100, Polytropon is alleged to have said: Well, to be honest, I never liked the old style default with /home being part of /usr. As I mentioned before, _my_ default style for separated partitions include: / swap /tmp /var /usr /home In special cases, add /opt or /scratch as separate partitions with intendedly limited sizes. You can see that all user data is kept independently from the rest of the system. It can easily be switched over to a separate home disk if needed. --As for the rest, it is mine. I'm in agreement with you on that I like to have /home be a separate partition, and not under /usr. (Of course, my current zfs system has 40 partitions...) Partly though I recognize that I like it because that's what I'm used to, and how I learned to set it up originally. (My first unix experience was with OpenBSD, over 10 years ago now.) I've never seen anything listing the main reasons for having /home under /usr though. I figure there must be a decent reason why. Would anyone care to enlighten me? What are the perceived advantages? (Particularly if you then make a symlink to /home.) Just a question that's been bugging me, as I read through different FreeBSD docs. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: zroot won't mount after 9.0-RC2 - 9.0-RELEASE upgrade
--As of February 15, 2012 2:31:10 AM +0200, Daniel Shahaf is alleged to have said: One of our amd64 servers runs 9.0-RC2 (releng/9.0@r228325) with a zfs root. It fails to boot the 9.0-RELEASE (releng/9.0@r229305) GENERIC kernel (self compiled) with a mountfrom error: http://people.apache.org/~danielsh/infra/loki-20120215-mountfrom.png mountfrom zfs:zroot Trying to mount root from zfs:zroot []... Mounting from zfs:zroot failed with error 2. We've tried to upgrade the zpool format 15-28; the symptoms are unchanged. (The zroot fs is at version 4.) Why does 9.0-RC2 boot while 9.0-RELEASE (as /boot/testkernel) doesn't? What can do to boot 9.0-RELEASE from our zfs root filesystem? --As for the rest, it is mine. Did you update the bootloader? Depending on when you installed the system, it's possible your upgrading the zpool means the bootloader can't read it. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: vdevs in zpool spereated, unable to import
On Mon, February 13, 2012 11:31 am, Adam Coates wrote: More insight into my tomfoolery: I think the different hostnames issue may be because of my ignorance. If you can't tell I'm fairly new to zfs, and even newer to the revelation of zpools (I've been using one for over a year but had no idea, I wasn't the one who set it up). When I had finished the fresh os install I was originally trying to /mount/ the drives. I know I was running into an error of: /dev/da0 is part of active pool 'tank' with a suggestion that the mount could only proceed with the -f argument. I can't recall what exactly I did, but I may have tried to force a mount of da0 to /tank in pool tank. This would make sense why I now can't import the original pool tank, and why there is a destroyed pool tank. Since these were raidz, is there any chance of recovering from my error? You may have done some major damage, but things to try (in my thoughts on order): zpool import -f id from /dev/da0 That's trying to import by the numeric id, not the name. At the very least, you should get a different error message. (You may need the -D as well.) zpool import -D -f -d /dev/da0 -d /dev/da1 Now we're trying to import destroyed pools, and looking at both drives explicitly for data. The next is a bit of hail mary, and if anyone else has a good idea, I'd try that first...: You can try mounting /dev/da1 like you did /dev/da0, and *then* trying to import. Basically, at that point you are trying to get them both messed up the same way. Since these were raidz: Where's the third disk? If you have two of the raidz disks, you should be able to rebuild the third. (It's *possible*, it appears, to run a raidz with two disks, but you don't get any benefits over mirroring, and you complicate recovery - a mirror in this situation would be directly usable. In theory a two-disk raidz should be recoverable from one disk, I think, but it may not have been well-tested.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: vdevs in zpool spereated, unable to import
On Mon, February 13, 2012 2:25 pm, Daniel Staal wrote: On Mon, February 13, 2012 11:31 am, Adam Coates wrote: More insight into my tomfoolery: I think the different hostnames issue may be because of my ignorance. If you can't tell I'm fairly new to zfs, and even newer to the revelation of zpools (I've been using one for over a year but had no idea, I wasn't the one who set it up). When I had finished the fresh os install I was originally trying to /mount/ the drives. I know I was running into an error of: /dev/da0 is part of active pool 'tank' with a suggestion that the mount could only proceed with the -f argument. I can't recall what exactly I did, but I may have tried to force a mount of da0 to /tank in pool tank. This would make sense why I now can't import the original pool tank, and why there is a destroyed pool tank. Since these were raidz, is there any chance of recovering from my error? You may have done some major damage, but things to try (in my thoughts on order): zpool import -f id from /dev/da0 That's trying to import by the numeric id, not the name. At the very least, you should get a different error message. (You may need the -D as well.) zpool import -D -f -d /dev/da0 -d /dev/da1 Now we're trying to import destroyed pools, and looking at both drives explicitly for data. The next is a bit of hail mary, and if anyone else has a good idea, I'd try that first...: You can try mounting /dev/da1 like you did /dev/da0, and *then* trying to import. Basically, at that point you are trying to get them both messed up the same way. Since these were raidz: Where's the third disk? If you have two of the raidz disks, you should be able to rebuild the third. (It's *possible*, it appears, to run a raidz with two disks, but you don't get any benefits over mirroring, and you complicate recovery - a mirror in this situation would be directly usable. In theory a two-disk raidz should be recoverable from one disk, I think, but it may not have been well-tested.) Sorry, I went back to check something: Swap /dev/da0 with /dev/da1, and vice-versa. I'd gotten which disk you tried mounting backwards. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: 'rm' Can not delete files
--As of February 10, 2012 4:24:58 PM +, Matthew Seaman is alleged to have said: On 10/02/2012 16:04, Matthew Story wrote: find . -type f -depth 1 -print0 | xargs -n99 -0 -s8192 -c5 rm -- or some such, depending on your needs, I believe in most situations this particular invocation will also out-perform find ... -delete. Why would you believe that? find ... -delete calls unlink(2) directly on each file it finds as it searches the directory tree given that it matches the other find predicates. Whereas find ... -print0 | xargs ... rm ... involves a whole complicated sequence of find doing the same searching and matching job, then marshalling lists of filenames, piping them between processes, then xargs exec(2)ing rm with chunks of that arglist; each rm invocation then finally ... calling unlink(2) on each of the named files. On the other hand, passing it through xargs makes the deletion multi-threaded (well, multi-process), while using -delete keeps it all in one process. Depending on your execution environment, that may be a win. Actually, I doubt you'ld see much difference above the noise in the speed of either of those two commands: they're both going to spend the vast majority of the time waiting for disk IO, and that's common to any way of doing this job. This is likely the root of the issue however. ;) (There are probably some pathological cases of multi-processor, multi-controller, multi-disk systems where having multiple IO streams would make a difference, but they are likely to be few for something like this.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Removal Attempt of Directory under ZFS causes Kernel Panic
On Fri, February 10, 2012 11:43 am, Martin McCormick wrote: Does this sound familiar to anybody? This is the first zfs installation I have used and I am not real wild about trying it again if we can't solve this mystery. We can't seem to duplicate the problem. Any ideas are appreciated. Nothing sounds familiar, but as a first step in debugging most ZFS issues, what does a `zpool scrub`, `zpool status -v` output? (Expect the scrub to take a while; depending on speed/size of your disks and system, it could be several hours, and it will run in the background.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: fbsd safety of the ports
--As of February 9, 2012 6:36:00 AM -0800, per...@pluto.rain.com is alleged to have said: TWiki is a nightmare to update ... TWiki was replaced with Foswiki (which is also in ports) at $WORK a while back. Dunno why, or how much of a job the changeover was for the admins, but there must have been some expected benefit to justify the effort. The change was largely transparent to users. --As for the rest, it is mine. That's because TWiki's former lead developer - and trademark holder - was being a dick. He managed to completely alienate all the current developers, and was holding up development of TWiki. So they left en-mass and forked the project; the new project is Foswiki. (This is obviously a condensed summary. There is much more information online, as most of this happened in public.) The expected benefits are therefore the backlog of changes that had been held up, and an active developer community. However, the 'update' procedure hasn't changed. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: fbsd safety of the ports
--As of February 7, 2012 5:59:27 PM -0500, mikel king is alleged to have said: On Feb 7, 2012, at 5:15 PM, David Brodbeck wrote: On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 9:37 AM, dick d...@nagual.nl wrote: I'm a bit confused. I always believed FreeBSD is a very safe system. That may be true for the core files, but what about ports. On the net I read _never_ to let the webserver be the owner of its files and yet, ports like Drupal or WordPress make the files rwx for the owner (www) as well as the group (www). How does this fit into fbsd's safety policy? Content management systems are a bit of a sticky wicket for security. The reason for not allowing the web server user to own files is so that someone who hacks a web app can't modify the site contents. But the whole reason for running a CMS system is to allow modifying the site contents via a web app. One compromise, used by TWiki and some other systems, is to make the content writable by web processes but the actual code read-only. That's more secure but it requires a lot of manual intervention for updates and configuration changes. You *can* run WordPress this way, and it will be more secure, but you'll lose the automated update functionality as well as most of the web GUI configuration capability. Not necessarily a problem if you have good command line fu, but it can get tedious. Sounds like a good area for a maintenance tool script. Run the script prior to updates/config changes to temporarily open the permissions. After the update has been completed rerun the script to re-secure the permissions. Probably included a little db back in the preparation. Thoughts? --As for the rest, it is mine. So, who's running the script? If it's running from the web, you haven't actually increased your security. And if it's running from the command line, you haven't typically saved yourself much work. (Changing the permissions for the folders needed for an update would typically be a one-liner, and updating manually isn't going to be much longer; a well-designed CMS can let you do that with a single untar command.) Of course, you could put it in cron someplace... Of course a better solution would be to have some sort of back-end process that the web frontend talks to, but that's a whole new layer of complexity. (And may or may not increase security, depending on how well it's written.) Some CMS's basically do this: They'll store all the actual pages in a database (typically MySQL), and would only need write permissions if they are supposed to be able to update themselves. Balance the security, the ease of setup, the resource load, and the ease of adminning. Sometimes the latter are worth the loss of some of the former, if it's done well. You can always jail the webserver as well. User's choice at that point. ;) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Portmanager Status Report Gone - Fixed.
--As of January 15, 2012 10:09:06 AM -0500, freebsd-questions@freebsd.org is alleged to have said: I was trying out portmaster to see if it worked better than my current tool of choice for keeping my ports up to date (portmanager) and when I went back to portmanager I can no longer get it to give me a 'Port Status Report', or to update anything. It just collects the installed port data, and stops. Any ideas on what I may have messed up? I'd like to upgrade my ports to the latest versions before upgrading to 9.0 (and I'd want portmanager working afterwards to help me fix any port-related problems that come up.) I'm on 8.2. --As for the rest, it is mine. Not really 'solved' in that I still don't know what the problem was, but running portupgrade once fixed it. (I let it upgrade a couple of ports, but not all of them.) Leaving this here for whomever has this problem next. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: How to destroy a zombie zpool
--As of January 17, 2012 5:19:15 AM +0100, Fritz Wuehler is alleged to have said: zfs is famous for fucking itself like this. the only totally safe way is to dd the drive since nailing the label doesn't clear out stuff at the far end of the filesystem that can really ruin your day. don't ask me how i know.. it will take a few hours dd'ing from /dev/zero to your devices but it is well worth it when you do any major surgery on drives that had zfs at one point and you want to use them over again with zfs --As for the rest, it is mine. Thanks; I finally had some more time to play with this box again, and that did the trick. Took less than 2 hours, to do two drives. ;) (Simultainously, and one's a SSD.) (Well, I still can't figure out why I can't *boot* into ZFS, but at least I've eliminated one variable.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
How to destroy a zombie zpool
I've got a weird problem... I was working on installing 9.0 w/zfs on my
laptop, messed up, rebooted, *formatted the drives* and restarted. Got
much further the next time, however...
There is a zombie copy of the old zpool sitting around interfering with
things. 'zpool import' lists it, but it can't import it because the disks
don't actually exist. 'zpool destroy' can't delete it, because it's not
imported. ('No such pool') Any ideas on how to get rid of it?
Daniel T. Staal
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Portmanager Status Report Gone
I was trying out portmaster to see if it worked better than my current tool of choice for keeping my ports up to date (portmanager) and when I went back to portmanager I can no longer get it to give me a 'Port Status Report', or to update anything. It just collects the installed port data, and stops. Any ideas on what I may have messed up? I'd like to upgrade my ports to the latest versions before upgrading to 9.0 (and I'd want portmanager working afterwards to help me fix any port-related problems that come up.) I'm on 8.2. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: SSD for ZIL suggestions?
--As of January 13, 2012 9:40:58 PM -0600, Rob is alleged to have said: I'm looking at getting a couple of SSDs to act as ZIL drives on FreeBSD 8/9 systems. Are there any recommended drives? Rob --As for the rest, it is mine. I remember that Intel released a line of SSDs that looked ideal for this, but I can't recall which one it was... For a ZIL, write/IOP speed and endurance are primary considerations. Size is not: The ZIL will never need more space than 1/2 the RAM of the box, IIRC. Anything more than that is just wasted space. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Portmanager Status Report Gone
--As of January 15, 2012 10:33:32 AM -0500, Jerry is alleged to have said: Exactly how are you invoking portmanager? Usually, just give it it the -s flag will get you a list of port and there status as you probably know. Yep. I have that in a weekly cron command, so I know what's out of date. ;) Basically, any way I invoke portmanager is showing the problem: If I invoke with -s, the status doesn't show. If I invoke with -u, it doesn't upgrade anything. Either way the result is the same: It gathers all the data on the ports (at least to 1), and then prints the header for the next section and quits, without actually doing anything. If you just want to update everything before updating FreeBSD itself, I would suggest running it as: portmanager -u -l -p -y Obviously, update your ports tree prior to running that command. At the very least, you will end up with a log file telling you what failed to update properly. The problem is that it's not *getting* to the updating, somehow. It gathers all the info on what it needs to know for the updating, and then stops. No error message, no output, no log, just stop. Running that command (or any other) doesn't result in portmanager actually *doing* anything. Here is the last four lines of output of a `portmanager -u -l`: 1 sane-backends-1.0.22 /graphics/sane-backends Port Status Report The log noted two broken ports (geany-plugins, both times). No other output. I use portmanager myself because it just works when other port management tools fail. This has been my experience as well. ;) The one thing I don't like about it is that it tends to need someone to watch it: If a port has changed it's config options, or added a new dependency that I haven't configured before, it will pull up the config screen and wait for input. I'd heard some of the other port management tools went and did that all at the beginning, which would mean I wouldn't have to sit and watch the screen as much. Unfortunatly, they appear to have more annoying behaviors. (portmaster tended to die on the smallest problem, where portmanager would have just logged a failure and gone on.) I'm mostly happy with portmanager. I just want it *back.* Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Portmanager Status Report Gone
--As of January 15, 2012 12:25:47 PM -0500, Jerry is alleged to have said: Well, you might try and deinstall and then reinstall portmanager. Perhaps something got corrupted, although I don't know why that might have happened. No joy. Worth a try though. ;) My suspicion is that it's a permissions issue someplace, somehow: I was trying portmaster in it's 'run as wheel, sudo to root when needed' mode, and it kept throwing permissions errors at me which I fixed for a while. (Before reverting to just running it as root.) Of course, I'm running *portmanager* as root, so... (Both under sudo, and from root's cron.) I have BATCH=yes set in the /etc/make.conf file to avoid receiving those annoying config screens. Of course that does require you to insure that your ports are configured the way you want them prior to updating them. I don't find it a problem; however, others might. Interesting. I'll keep that in mind. Something to take a look at once I've gotten this solved. ;) By the way, how do you update your ports tree? Perhaps something got corrupted there. I use portsnap myself, so you could use it to just create a new tree thereby over writing the old one. Just a thought. I have csup set to run once a week in cron. I don't think that corrupted anything: `portmanager -s -y` ran fine before I ran portmaster, and I didn't update the tree in between. But blowing away the tree and re-creating it is starting to sound like something worth a try. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Portmanager Status Report Gone
--As of January 15, 2012 3:35:20 PM -0500, Jerry is alleged to have said: You don't have to manually erase the tree. I believe that: portsnap fetch extract is all you need to do to replace the ports tree with a fresh copy. It won't hurt anything since it doesn't touch the configuration files. --As for the rest, it is mine. Done, and it didn't fix my problem. Something's obviously gone seriously weird with my system. What would happen if I did blow away the config files? What's the minimum necessary for my system to be able to manage it's ports collection? I really don't want to reinstall from scratch over this (If nothing else, it's my main fileserver. I've got backups, but that would take ages.), but I'm thinking rebuilding my ports database from bare bones sounds like it might be a good idea. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: ZFS Root Won't Mount - Unknown Filesystem
--As of January 7, 2012 10:14:00 AM -0600, Mark Felder is alleged to have said: Hi Drew, I'm pretty sure you can't run a RAIDZ as your root pool. That's likely the problem. Kind of sucks, I know :-( --As for the rest, it is mine. I've been running RAIDZ as a root pool for months. (Under 8.x, not 9.) That's not the problem. ;) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Help Recovering FBSD 8 ZFS System
--As of December 31, 2011 1:40:59 PM -0800, Drew Tomlinson is alleged to have said: Thus it appears I am missing ad16 that I used to have. My data zpool was the bulk of my system with over 600 gig of files and things I'd like to have back. I thought that by creating a raidz1 I could avoid having to back up the huge drive and avoid this grief. However it appears I have lost 2 disks at the same time. :( Any thoughts before I just give up on recovering my data pool? Ouch. All I can really say is 'Redundancy is not backup', but that's a bit trite... The one thing you haven't mentioned trying that might be worth the attempt is trying the recovery from a 9.0 disk. There has been work done on the ZFS system, and it's possible that something might work. But that's mostly just to be thorough... As for what it was telling you: It was just saying it couldn't open the drives. ;) Which does bring up one other option: If you've got a different drive controller, you might try plugging the drives into it. (In the hopes that it's the *controller* and not the drive that's gone bad. Unlikely, bit it *does* happen.) (Depending on the value of the data pool, a good data recovery service might be able to do something as well. But they'd have to be a very good service, and know what they were working with.) And regarding my root pool, my system can't mount root and start. What do I need to do to boot from my degraded root pool. Here's the current status: # zpool status pool: root state: DEGRADED status: One or more devices could not be opened. Sufficient replicas exist for the pool to continue functioning in a degraded state. action: Attach the missing device and online it using 'zpool online'. see: http://www.sun.com/msg/ZFS-8000-2Q scrub: none requested config: NAMESTATE READ WRITE CKSUM rootDEGRADED 0 0 0 mirrorDEGRADED 0 0 0 gptid/5b623854-6c46-11de-ae82-001b21361de7 ONLINE 0 0 0 12032653780322685599UNAVAIL 0 0 0 was /dev/ad6p3 Do I just need to do a 'zpool detach root /dev/ad6p3' to remove it from the pool and get it to boot? And then once I replace the disk a 'zpool attach root new partition' to fix? Thanks for your time. Personally, I'd do a 'zpool replace /dev/ad6p3 /dev/$NEWDRIVE', but the above should work as well. What's odd though is that you can't boot from it as is: Degraded should be considered functional, and it should let you boot. You mentioned updating the zpool to v15. Did you update the boot block at the same time? (Just checking the basics.) It'd need to be able to read the updated zpool. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Help Recovering FBSD 8 ZFS System
--As of January 2, 2012 2:14:55 PM -0800, Drew Tomlinson is alleged to have said: Thanks. I'll keep that in mind. However in this case, the controller is a SATA that's integrated into the motherboard. Since two of 4 are working, that would mean the controller is OK, right? I guess I could swap SATA cables for a test. --As for the rest, it is mine. Actually, typically one controller only runs two drives, IIRC. So you could have one bad controller out of two. If swapping cables helps, you may want to try getting a SATA card or something similar. (If swapping cables means you can see the other two drives, a SATA card should mean you'll get all your data back.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: [Spam] Fw: Merry Christmas from the FreeBSD Security Team
--As of December 23, 2011 5:45:42 PM +0100, Bas Smeelen is alleged to have said: While I'm writing, a note to freebsd-update users: FreeBSD-SA-11:07.chroot has a rather messy fix involving adding a new interface to libc; this has the awkward side effect of causing the sizes of some symbols (aka. functions) in libc to change, resulting in cascading changes into many binaries. The long list of updated files is irritating, but isn't a sign that anything in freebsd-update went wrong. --As for the rest, it is mine. I appreciate the hard work, though I could wish it were better timed. ;) However, the above does worry me a bit: Is that same library change likely to affect ports? Any way to tell which, if so? (Or should I just start reinstalling everything...) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: high load system do not take all CPU time
--As of December 17, 2011 10:29:42 AM +0200, Коньков Евгений is alleged to have said: How to debug why system do not use free CPU resouces? On this pictures you can see that CPU can not exceed 400tics http://piccy.info/view3/2368839/c9022754d5fcd64aff04482dd360b5b2/ http://piccy.info/view3/2368837/a12aeed98681ed10f1a22f5b5edc5abc/ http://piccy.info/view3/2368836/da6a67703af80eb0ab8088ab8421385c/ On these pictures you can see that problems begin with trafic on re0 when CPU load rise to maximum http://piccy.info/view3/2368834/512139edc56eea736881affcda490eca/ http://piccy.info/view3/2368827/d27aead22eff69fd1ec2b6aa15e2cea3/ But there is 25% CPU idle yet at that moment. snip # top -SIHP last pid: 93050; load averages: 1.45, 1.41, 1.29 up 9+16:32:06 10:28:43 237 processes: 5 running, 210 sleeping, 2 stopped, 20 waiting CPU 0: 0.8% user, 0.0% nice, 8.7% system, 17.7% interrupt, 72.8% idle CPU 1: 0.0% user, 0.0% nice, 9.1% system, 20.1% interrupt, 70.9% idle CPU 2: 0.4% user, 0.0% nice, 9.4% system, 19.7% interrupt, 70.5% idle CPU 3: 1.2% user, 0.0% nice, 6.3% system, 22.4% interrupt, 70.1% idle Mem: 843M Active, 2476M Inact, 347M Wired, 150M Cache, 112M Buf, 80M Free Swap: 4096M Total, 15M Used, 4080M Free --As for the rest, it is mine. You are I/O bound; most of your time is spent in interrupts. The CPU is dealing with things as fast as it can get them, but it has to wait for the disk and/or network card to get them to it. The CPU is not your problem; if you need more performance, you need to tune the I/O. (And possibly get better I/O cards, if available.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Setting up ZFS - Filesystem Properties and Installing on Root
On Sun, November 20, 2011 10:34 pm, APseudoUtopia wrote: Hello, I'll be setting up a server with ZFS on 9.0-RELEASE (when it's released...). I've never used ZFS before, and although I've been reading quite a bit about it, I have some questions. My plan is to use RAID-Z1 across 4 disks. I'll be using GPT, and I would like the root to be ZFS as well. I found a guide: http://wiki.freebsd.org/RootOnZFS/GPTZFSBoot/RAIDZ1 In step #4, it has you create boot, swap, and zfs partitions on all 3 (which would be 4 in my case) disks. Then, in step #5, you install the bootloader into all 3 (4) drives. Why do you need boot and swap partitions on EACH disk? It seems to me that you would only need disk 1 to have boot, swap, and zfs, and the other 3 disks only have one partition (using the entire drive) for zfs's pool. Does it have to do with the RAIDZ1 setup? Even then, I don't understand it because it's not disk mirroring, it's RAID. The BIOS is set to look on one specific disk for the loader, not all of them. It seems I'm not understanding something entirely here. As someone else said, the BIOS will search attached drives. And remember that one of the points to using a ZFS raid is that you can get hotswap drives. If your one drive with a bootloader fails, you can hotswap it and not notice that it was that drive, which then means your next boot will fail. Personally, I dedicated one small drive to the boot code, and put everything else in ZFS. There are varying opinions on whether that is a good idea. ;) Swap in theory can be put on the ZFS volume - and I have done so - but I would not recommend it. It's caused lockups in some situations, which would have been avoided by putting swap on it's own volume. Also, with ZFS, you can have an unlimited number of filesystems, correct? I've been trying to figure out the best way to create these filesystems with the appropriate flags (specifically: atime, compression, devices, exec, quota, readonly, and setuid). If, for example, I set devices=off and suid=off on the tank/var filesystem, it is applied to the children filesystem, such as, /var/log, /var/db, and so on? The flags/properties can be changed on-the-fly, correct? If, for example, I set a filesystem noexec, but later realize I need exec, I can change it without issue? Yep. As long as you didn't set the volume that has the zfs tools to noexec. ;) Does anyone with zfs experience have any tips on creating a filesystem layout, in terms of which filesystems to create and what flags/properties? Would it be bad to set noatime, nosuid, nodev, and noexec all on the tank, then allow each property appropriately for each directory as necessary? As in, set the whole tank noexec, but allow exec for /bin, /usr/home, /usr/local/bin, etc.? Well, you already linked to a decent guide to the filesystem layout. Following it won't get you too far wrong. A couple of thoughts though: One thing that might have been useful in my experience is not having / be /zroot. If I'd set /zroot/root to / (and built everything else below that) I'd be able to play around a bit more, by setting up other filesystems under /zroot. (Including things like making a new root volume, or excluding volumes from snapshots.) Note that would cause changes in the bootloader code from the wiki example. And don't be to worried about getting it 'right the first time': Because ZFS allows you to create filesystems so easily, you can play around with it. It's not too hard to move a directory tree to a new filesystem, even on a live box. ;) You can create copies, try things out, and then use whatever's the best system for you. As for noexec on /... I'd be hesitant. Without being an absolute master on what is run from where under all circumstances in FreeBSD, it would worry me. (Does /etc need exec? How about /root? /boot? etc.) I'd rather err on the side of turning it off where I know I don't need it, instead of turning it on where I do. If I forget one, it's less likely to break my system. ;) The one other place where I'd disagree with the wiki page you linked would be on compression: If you have a fairly recent processor in the box, I'd recommend gzip for just about everywhere. In most cases it'll actually speed up I/O. Oh, and if you are thinking of using dedup, you'll need sha256 for the checksum. But I think it'll do that automatically if you turn on dedup. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing
Re: Setting up ZFS - Filesystem Properties and Installing on Root
--As of November 21, 2011 9:09:45 PM -0500, APseudoUtopia is alleged to have said: Ok, thank you for the advice. It's on a quad-core xeon, so, in reference to your suggestion, I'll turn on compression for the entire pool. I did read that having swap in zfs may cause problems, so I'll be sticking to the traditional freebsd-swap partition. Another quick question about swap: If I have 4 drives, with 512MB swap, the system uses all 4 swap partitions, correct? So it's not like it'd be going to waste? I'd have a total of 2 GB swap? --As for the rest, it is mine. I'll admit I don't know. As as I said: I put it on ZFS. ;) It works well enough, as long as I make sure it never runs low on RAM. (Basically, I threw money at the problem.) There are a few cases where compression isn't a win - if you have a section that you know will have mostly non-compressible data it's worth turning off. (I also haven't actually tried it on *root*, just in case... Not that I'd expect problems, but I didn't see the need to take the chance.) But most of my stuff is compressed. Note that changing compression settings doesn't affect anything *currently* on the disk; just new writes. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: where to ask about problems with bsdinstall in 9.0RC2?
--As of November 19, 2011 8:14:56 AM +, Matthew Seaman is alleged to have said: On 19/11/2011 00:53, Edward Martinez wrote: As the progress bar moved to the right toward 100% completion, a window popped up telling me that it (bsdinstall) could not handle the base.txz (BTW, what does the suffix .txz mean?) - it could not uncompress it and said something about unable to write and the string was something like: var/base.txz (note the lack of a leading slash in front of var). xz(1) is the latest compression program around. It usually gets better results than bzip2 so lots of usages are being switched to it. .txz is a tar archive compressed with xz. --As for the rest, it is mine. Just as a quick digression... xz has only marginal improvements in compressed size over bzip2, and takes a lot more cpu/memory resources to compress. In most cases, I'd say it's the wrong choice for a compression format. However, the one place where it is unequivocally the *best* choice is one that will make it well known: Distributing archives. It does beat bzip2 by a small amount, and it's *decompression* time is *much* faster than bzip2 - on par with gzip. Plus decompression can be done in a fixed amount of RAM, regardless of the size of the files being uncompressed. For files that are compressed once and then decompressed many times on many different boxes - like a FreeBSD release - it's a definite win. But for files that will be compressed and uncompressed regularly, or compressed and usually never touched again, it's worth thinking about what's the best balance of resources. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Shouldn't GNU tar be ignoring /proc with --one-file-system?
On Fri, November 18, 2011 10:34 am, Kirk Strauser wrote: I use Amanda to make nightly backups of a bunch of servers using GNU tar. However, gtar doesn't seem to respect its --one-file-system flag with /proc. Amanda runs a variation of this command: # /usr/local/bin/gtar --create --file - --directory / --one-file-system --sparse --ignore-failed-read --totals . /dev/null /usr/local/bin/gtar: ./proc: file changed as we read it Before I file a bug report, can anyone think of a legitimate reason why gtar would be touching /proc at all? Just a guess, really but: /proc is a file on /. /proc/* are files on /proc. The former is still on the root filesystem (if only as a directory stub to be used as a mountpoint), so reading it isn't leaving that filesystem. Reading anything *in* it would be. Just a thought. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Webmail for local system mail
On Fri, November 18, 2011 2:30 pm, Errol Sayre wrote: Are you sure SquirrelMail will do this? I was under the impression (from their requirements page) that it needs an IMAP backend. In which case you'll want an IMAP server that can serve the local system accounts. Not hard to set up. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Unprintable 8-bit characters
--As of November 8, 2011 7:58:04 PM -0600, Conrad J. Sabatier is alleged to have said: So, what would be the safest bet as far as the most universal representation for these characters? Something I've long wondered about when I've e-mailed people and copied/pasted these characters (are they really seeing what I'm seeing?). :-) --As for the rest, it is mine. These days, the safest bet is UTF-8, or some other Unicode character set, in something that can convey what character set it is in. (Email can, depending on the mail client.) Not that Unicode is universal yet, but it designed to be (and is, generally) a solution to the 'multiple character encodings' problem. (By, of course, defining a new encoding.) It has a decent amount of traction, and in a decade or so - once other options have been firmly depreciated - I'd expect we could start discussing whether to switch ls to using it by default. ;) All this is of course if you *must* go beyond 7-bit ASCII. (Which all forms of Unicode is designed to be a strict superset of.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: ZFS Write Lockup
--As of October 4, 2011 2:43:45 AM -0400, Dave Cundiff is alleged to have said: I don't know what triggers the problem but I know how to fix it. If I perform a couple snapshot deletes the IO will come back in line every single time. Fortunately I have LOTS of snapshots to delete. [root@san2 ~]# zfs list -r -t snapshot | wc -l 5236 [root@san2 ~]# zfs list -r -t volume | wc -l 17 --As for the rest, it is mine. I have no good advice, but I have a thought. ;) The thought is: Why so many snapshots? And: How many other people have that many snapshots? I know that ZFS is supposed to be able to handle huge numbers of snapshots (far more than a few thousand, from my understanding), but if it hasn't been used much in that config, there may be bugs lurking. You might try weeding through and figuring out if you can drop a good amount of those snapshots. Also, try the filesystems list. They may have better thoughts. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: ZFS Write Lockup
--As of October 5, 2011 6:37:17 PM -0400, Dave Cundiff is alleged to have said: Its for a backup service I've been working on. It takes a snapshot hourly of all 17 zvols. I was planning on keeping them for a month. I had the same thought about the snapshots and deleted them all yesterday. It appears there is some issue with keeping that many. I removed them all and the zvols are now functioning correctly. Its strange that the large number didn't cause incremental slowdown. While the snapshots were still there the IO was normal when it wasn't acting up. Just it would have spurts of almost total lockup until I performed a snapshot removal operation or 2. --As for the rest, it is mine. Look at sysutils/zfs-periodic. It does that type of backup, although it doesn't keep quite as many. (Several hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly. Configurable. I have 38 filesystems, and 780 snapshots. (Only one volume, though.)) And that definitely sounds like a bug. Gradual slowdowns would be expected if you were just reaching performance limits, but sudden stops sound like there's a condition that doesn't work someplace, or some loop the system can get into. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: 9.0 bsdinstall usage
On Fri, September 23, 2011 9:23 am, Fbsd8 wrote: These 2 statements should be added at the end of bsdinstall/auto to complete the clean up of the install process. rm /usr/sbin/bsdinstall rm -rf /usr/libexec/bsdinstall Another benefit of doing this is it will no longer be necessary to create man pages for bsdinstall. On the other hand, that makes it harder for someone to look at the program to see what it does, in order to build or rebuild their own installer, or to customize the actions of this one. I don't see a cost to keeping the program around. There are probably some slight use cases for it, and there are some slight costs to removing it. It doesn't have to be everything to everybody: It can be itself, nothing more and nothing less. I guess I just don't see the problem with keeping it. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: much to my surprise....
--As of September 22, 2011 6:31:19 PM -0700, Gary Kline is alleged to have said: i'm to the point where letting somebody else handle the dns-and-outward side sounds better by the day. i'v got more question if you care to answer them. i've been using gkg.net for a few years--8 or 9 anyway. but if switching to dyndns saves a lot of my flubs, hey. --As for the rest, it is mine. Just as an alternative vote: I've been using ZoneEdit for years. It's free if you are just running a couple of small sites. (Although I haven't tried their dynamic DNS features. I just pay the ISP for a static.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
RE: Please secure your FTP access
On Fri, September 16, 2011 2:03 pm, Devin Teske wrote: -Original Message- From: owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org [mailto:owner-freebsd- questi...@freebsd.org] On Behalf Of David Demelier Sent: Friday, September 16, 2011 10:38 AM To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Please secure your FTP access On 15/09/2011 23:46, Allen wrote: Sorry for top posting I have never understood why people apologise when they top post. Is your client mail so bad that you can't move your cursor selector under the last message? Preamble: Not making excuses for others' actions, but airing grievances because I'd really like Microsoft to fix this one. Observation: Microsoft Outlook 2010 has a nasty nasty bug (or at least, I consider it to be a bug). If the e-mail that you are responding to is in HTML format and your reply is also in HTML format, then you cannot insert text in the middle of the reply-text. The expectation that you can insert text in the middle of the reply-text at a different indentation-level fails miserably. As a work-around you can change the reply-mail to be in either Rich Text or Plain Text format, but that removes the indentation-level of the reply-text (yuck). It's rather frustrating and whenever I am faced with top-posting because of Outlook's iniquities or using another mail client ... I simply use another mail client (period). Just sharing... Devin Also many smartphone and tablet mailers automatically top-post, and make it significantly harder to move the cursor around inside the text with any accuracy. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Thinkpad audio question
On Wed, September 14, 2011 9:44 am, William Bulley wrote: A friend of mine has an IBM T500 Thinkpad which is nearly identical to the one I have. We both have interesting audio issues. Any ideas as to why the problems explained below exist would be greatly appreciated. My T500 shows two devices /dev/mixer0 and /dev/mixer1 corresponding to pcm0 and pcm1 as displayed by % cat /dev/sndstat in 8.2-PRERELEASE from January 2011. I am able to hear audio on the built-in speakers using /dev/mixer1 but not able to hear audio when plugging stereo headphones into the green audio out jack. However, the speaker audio is muted when the headphones are plugged in. I have tried two different head sets to rule out flawed hardware. My friend's T500 is more up-to-date than mine (likely 8.2-STABLE) but in his case headphone audio works perfectly and he has had no luck in getting audio out of his built-in laptop speakers. Very weird... This situation sucks, but we have not been able to suss out what the problem is. He and I have been running FreeBSD for over a decade, so we are not clueless, but this laptop audio weirdness has us stumped. Quick thought: What versions of the BIOS are each of you running? Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: KVM switch with FreeBSD-8.2
--As of September 11, 2011 9:03:17 AM -0400, Carmel is alleged to have said: I am thinking of using a TRENDnet 2-Port DVI USB KVM Switch Kit with Audio TK-214i with a FreeBSD-8.2 amd64 PC and a Windows 7 machine. I presently have a Samsung 24 digital monitor and a Logitech S510 cordless keyboard mouse combination. The keyboard, mouse and monitor presently work fine on FreeBSD. I am wondering if anyone has any personal experience with using KVM switches with FreeBSD and what that experience might be. I would really like to integrate these two PC into using just one common monitor, etcetera mostly due to space considerations. --As for the rest, it is mine. In my experience, the OS isn't all that relevant. The main question is if the hardware works well together. Many KVMs don't do a great job of emulating a connection if the computer isn't the currently active one, and this can cause problems when something wants to see if a monitor is present (and wants to check what it's specs are), but that's not a FreeBSD problem per se: It's just a problem with the hardware. I'm sorry I don't have any good, cheap, KVM recommendations at this time. Enterprize-grade hardware usually doesn't have this problem (although it might), and I haven't needed to use a small KVM for a while. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Help Finding ZFS snapshots
--As of September 5, 2011 10:23:32 AM -0500, Gene is alleged to have said: On Mon, 05 Sep 2011 10:48:22 -0400, Daniel Staal wrote --As of September 5, 2011 8:13:52 AM -0500, Gene is alleged to have said: Using FreeBSD 8.1, amd64 - I wanted to recover files from a snapshot of usr/home. Everything I've found via googling refers to a link such as path/zfs/.snapshot --As for the rest, it is mine. Try path/.zfs. ;) (Which, on my system, then has a 'snapshot' directory, which holds all the snapshots.) Daniel T. Staal No such luck. The following: cd / ls -R | grep -i zfs finds only 'zfs' directories in the source tree and ports. Other ideas? I know the snapshots exist, I can see 'em with zfs list -t snapshot. --As for the rest, it is mine. Don't check if the directory is there first. It isn't. Just 'cd' to it, and it will exist. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Hi
--As of August 28, 2011 2:09:30 PM -0700, Spencer Thompson is alleged to have said: Dear FreeBSD.org, I would like to order a CD with FreeBSD for an IBM Thinkpad. What is the best package to get? Will it work perfectly? I want a package with the manual, man-pages and how to use FreeBSD perfectly in books. First off: Is this a new machine, or an older one? IBM hasn't made Thinkpads in at least five years: They sold the business to Lenovo. (Who has kept up the quality and design.) If it's a new machine, which machine is it? Most of the current-generation Thinkpads use the integrated Sandy Bridge graphics. This is supported in -CURRENT, but not in 8.2. There is also a keyboard interaction at boot under 8.2, that has been fixed. What does Free in FreeBSD mean? Does it mean Free as in Free of charge? Or is there an alternate meaning? Free of charge, free to use, free to read the source, free to modify, free to redistribute. Most definitions of free are covered. ;) I'm wanting the best operating system for my laptop. Is this the one? Why is it free of charge when I want to pay for it? I don't want something stupid. As others have said 'best' is an opinion, and dependent on which use you are putting the laptop to. It is a very good one, for many uses. However, given that you sound like a newcomer to the UNIX/OSS software world, and that *currently* your likely hardware (if you are buying a new Thinkpad) isn't fully supported by the standard distribution, FreeBSD may not be for you at this time. If you are in that case, you'll find yourself working with untested and non-finalized software. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: A quality operating system
--As of August 28, 2011 9:10:34 AM -0600, Chad Perrin is alleged to have said: On Sat, Aug 27, 2011 at 09:04:28PM -0700, Chip Camden wrote: Quoth Chad Perrin on Saturday, 27 August 2011: I've decided to provide the professional response Evan claims to crave: Dear Evan, We appreciate your feedback on the quality, scope, and focus of our software and documentation. We always strive to provide the highest quality products and service to all of our customers, and constantly seek new ways to improve on perfection. The input of our customers is a key element of our strategy to consistently provide what they need in a timely and responsible fashion. Your ticket number is d3b07384d113edec49eaa6238ad5ff00. Your case worker is Robert Jones. Your ticket is: [ ] Pending Action [ ] Open [X] Closed: Complete Your account has been charged $14.99 for successful completion. Note that this special 25% reduced support pricing will only apply for actions until September 15th. Take advantage of the discounts now! If you have any further questions, do not hesitate to use the support form on the Website. Thank you for your business. Perfect, except you didn't charge enough -- and you didn't ask him to complete a survey. In retrospect, I see that you are of course correct about the charge. I considered doing something with a survey, but it was a lot of work constructing something using soul-sucking corporate customer service lingo, and I just didn't have the energy left to write anything about a survey. --As for the rest, it is mine. What do you mean? All you need is some random link to a random survey URL. The fact that the survey doesn't mention anything about the product in question, the type of issue addressed, what type of response he was given, or anything else actually pertaining to his situation is totally irrelevant. As is the fact that the survey won't be read by anyone. ;) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: First World (Was: What dialup modem WILL work with 8.x and uart?)
On Mon, August 22, 2011 7:19 am, Odhiambo Washington wrote: I live in some 3rd world country (BTW, how does one become 1st world?) Back in the day, you'd have needed to join NATO... (2nd world, of course, required joining the Warsaw Pact.) These days, I subscribe to the 'soda theory'. At the lowest level of an economy, you can only buy one of Pepsi or Coke. A step up, and you will have a choice. The next step beyond that, you have a choice between Sprite and 7-Up. A first world economy will have multiple choices for any flavor of soda, including things like Root Beer, Grape, or Sport Drinks. In fact, you will have specialty sodas in most flavors, that are in limited distribution by area, but still in major market retailers. They will often be sold at prices near or above half an hour's wage (at minimum wage) for a single soda. (Vs. Coke or Pepsi, which are usually sold at half that or less.) ;) Daniel T. Staal (How is Kenya these days? I haven't been there in 10 years or so...) --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
RE: First World
--As of August 22, 2011 2:15:24 PM -0500, Gary Gatten is alleged to have said: Interesting analogy. Osama - er, I mean Obama could really use people like you to explain things better to him, 'cause obviously he has NO idea what his various and numerous Czars and advisors are saying. Or maybe they're all barely functional and don't know any better --As for the rest, it is mine. What analogy? I was answering a question posed as an aside, in a typically geeky 'ha ha, only serious' way. The distinction between what is considered a 'First World Country' and a 'Third World County' is hard to define, but easy to feel if you've traveled through a bunch of both. It's some combination of average wealth, stability of the economy, the wealth distribution, and possibly a few other factors. Sodas are actually a decent proxy for them: They are a cheap, low-end, consumable, _luxury_ item. An economy that can support a large number of different manufacturers with a large variety is going to have a certain average wealth, fairly evenly distributed, and have been stable in that situation for a while. So it's an indicator. A bit of an odd one, but it's easy to check, and does a surprisingly good job. ;) It's no major insight, and wouldn't really help make any policy decisions, but it's something I'll check given the chance in a new country: What the selection is, and what the price is. It will tell you a surprising amount about the country. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: ZFS and NFS or CIFS
--As of August 19, 2011 1:43:23 AM -0400, Chris Brennan is alleged to have said: I have several ZFS volumes set up on my FreeBSD 8.2 (32-bit) server at home and I am trying to figure out how to set up a NFS and/or CIFS share of the various volumes I have created and for the life of me, I can't figure it out. I don't really care which one or both right now (I should learn both). I just have tons and tons of data to move from my Windows desktop to this server and I'd like to use something other then SFTP, even over my LAN, it's very slow. Many thanks to anyone who can point me in the right direction... --As for the rest, it is mine. I've only tried NFS, but it's fairly easy. Either of these are controlled by ZFS properties, set by the command `zfs set` with the property names being 'sharesmb' or 'sharenfs'. The value of the property is the options you want to use for the share. See `man zfs` for more detail, plus the docs for the type of share you decide to set up for the options. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: A quality operating system
--As of August 20, 2011 12:12:00 PM -0500, Dave Pooser is alleged to have said: 3) Updates are a mess. It's cool that I *can* compile a new kernel, but that I *have* to is ridiculous. Updating a server should not be more difficult than yum update -- full stop. --As for the rest, it is mine. Oh, how I *wish* it was that easy on a Linux box... Have you ever actually tried to update RedHat from one version to another? It can't be done. No support. Oh, I suppose you could install everything manually, but if you miss something and break it, that's your problem. The only recommended way is 'wipe, reinstall, copy everything in from backup.' Having to do that at work made me miss freebsd-update... (And if you are complaining about user-land programs: Try portmanager. Or one of the other fine tools in the ports system.) (Oh, and as for comparing the Handbook with RedHat's knowledge base... I'll admit there are flaws in the Handbook. But the knowledge base shows the distinct impressions of being run through marketing. There's quite a lot of 'And then you can use this shiny feature!' without any 'To configure, read the following:'.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: A quality operating system
--As of August 20, 2011 4:22:45 PM -0400, Jerry is alleged to have said: I have never wasted my time with it personally; however, I thought I read somewhere that it did not work if the user had built a custom kernel. From what I have seen written regarding it, you have to move the custom kernel out of the way and replace it with the generic kernel, run the freebsd-update program and then re-install the custom kernel and then rebuild that. Assuming that is correct, I can safely say that only a masochist would find that solution given the numerous possibilities for catastrophic failure any serious consideration. Obviously the KISS principal was considered important in this scenario. --As for the rest, it is mine. Exactly how would you want to do a binary upgrade on a custom-configured kernel? (I.E.: A custom binary.) And can you name any OS that can do that? Although you don't have to replace the kernel with the generic, if you are doing a source upgrade. You should be able to do a standard source upgrade. (Making sure, of course, that your custom kernel's configuration is still valid for the newer source.) I might *recommend* replacing with a generic during the upgrade, just because it's safer to be upgrading to the tested kernel, but it shouldn't be required. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
RE: A quality operating system
--As of August 20, 2011 7:01:07 PM -0700, Carl G Smith is alleged to have said: I have heard that the OS X OS is based on FreeBSD. Is this true? --As for the rest, it is mine. Partially. It combines a mostly Mach kernel with some FreeBSD-derived userland and interfaces, then adds a proprietary window manager and UI on top of the rest. So the largest single source of code is probably FreeBSD, but neither the kernel or the part most people interact with isn't. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: FreeBSD supported versions (UNCLASSIFIED)
--As of August 10, 2011 6:42:58 PM -0700, Michael Sierchio is alleged to have said: man freebsd-update --As for the rest, it is mine. That doesn't help with the question being asked. The question is 'Will there be updates (as necessary) for this version of the OS in the future?'. Freebsd-update only answers 'Are there updates for this version of the OS in the present?'. Having present updates says nothing about there being future updates. (Nor does the fact that there aren't any at the present mean that there _won't_ be one tomorrow.) (Well, ok, given the current release structure having an update today means you are in a supported branch, and that supported branch will continue to get updates for the foreseeable future. But that still does not tell me when the branch is likely to get unsupported, and in theory a patch release could be made on the last day of support for a branch.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: FreeBSD supported versions (UNCLASSIFIED)
--As of August 10, 2011 1:26:10 PM -1000, Wright, Jonathon Mr CTR US USA USARPAC is alleged to have said: How do I know as an admin of my FreeBSD server that the version I am running is supported via automated fashion? I'm trying to find a way to do this through a script of sorts so that when the date comes, I'm alerted that I need to upgrade. For example on this link: http://www.freebsd.org/security/#sup It has a table with dates / versions. How can I query this through the ports tree / or other means? --As for the rest, it is mine. I don't think there is an automated way to do this. Like most OSes, end of life for a particular version is announced ahead of time, and when it occurs, through mailing lists and the media, but there aren't any automatic checks. You can check if there are current patches for your current version, but the lack of patches doesn't mean that there necessarily won't be some at some future time. (I actually can't think of _any_ OS that has support for an 'automated' check of this sort, besides possibly scraping a web page, which you could do with FreeBSD if you wanted.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: MC and snapshots
On Fri, July 29, 2011 2:26 pm, Dick Hoogendijk wrote: Can one of you tell me why it is not possible to browse .zfs directories (from snapshots) with midnight commander? I'm running FreeBSD-8.2 w/ mc from ports. Manually switching to .zfs and it's subdirectories does show the snapshotted files, but I would like to be able to browse them (its so much easier). I know that the snapshots aren't mounted by default. (And are mounted/unmounted on the fly if needed.) That's probably part of it, at least. Have you tried setting the 'snapdir' property to 'visible'? I don't know that would help, but it'd be worth trying. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Hi installing on windows dual boot
On Wed, July 27, 2011 7:58 am, Polytropon wrote: On Tue, 26 Jul 2011 11:06:57 +, Ganesh Khedkar wrote: Hi all, I am new to FreeBSD , just wanted to give one suggestion that , Ubuntu linux have given one Nice facility to user that they can easily install Ubuntu in windows and any drive we want . Even we can assign size to that drive . So cant we provide this facility to our user . So that people can experience freeBSD. Currently you cannot install FreeBSD from withing Windows, if this is what you mean. FreeBSD is an operating system that needs to be booted _on_ the machine it should be installed to, as the installer requires that OS - just the same way you cannot simply try a Windows by installing it into, let's say... Solaris. :-) I think the original poster was referring to the fact that Ubuntu actually has an installer that can run as a Windows application, and will resize your hard drive for you and install a dual-boot setup. It does this while you are running Windows, although it has to reboot the machine. (Which it will do automatically for you.) It's very slick, and would be an interesting addition to FreeBSD, but I don't think it's likely to be something that will get worked on soon. Ubuntu is targeted at non-technical users, especially ones not likely to have run Linux (or any other open-source OS) before. FreeBSD is largely targeted at more technical users, and at the server space instead of the desktop. So such a tool would be a high priority for Ubuntu (as it makes installing the OS much easier for a newbie), it's not the top of the list for FreeBSD. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: zpool remove locks up ZFS under amd64 RELENG_8
On Wed, July 27, 2011 1:03 am, Dennis Glatting wrote: I attached a SSD as a ZIL to a RAIDz pool, which is a fairly useless thing to do but I am testing. If I try to remove the SSD ZIL the zpool command does not return and in another window a zpool status also doesn't return or print anything, typifying a lockup. I also have a SSD attached to the pool as a cache. Not that useless, if the SSD has a faster write time and you are doing lots of writes to the ZFS pool. ;) iirc# zpool upgrade This system is currently running ZFS pool version 28. All pools are formatted using this version. Ok, so the most obvious reason is out (that ZILs can't be removed under the version of ZFS that ships with 8.2), but it means you must have a patched kernel, or be running -CURRENT. It's possible this is a bug in the ZFS code. It might be worth taking this to the CURRENT list. How are you trying to remove the ZIL? Are you just pulling the drive or are you running a 'remove' first? (Just checking...) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Question about regular expressions
On Wed, July 20, 2011 10:33 pm, dave jones wrote: Hi, I have a config file below: $user= 'root'; // This is the username if $user is found, I want to display root. Anyone knows how to programming in C or some other language? thank you. I'm not quite sure what you are asking here. Found where? Display where? Are we just reading through the config file? Are we processing some other file with it's config? It should be simple in Perl or some similar scripting language, if I knew what you meant. (Except for the comment, that could be a Perl file. If so, one way to 'process' the config file would be to execute it in your main program, and then just use the variables assigned in it as regular variables.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: build ports from not a root user?
On Thu, July 21, 2011 6:02 am, Peter Vereshagin wrote: I'd like to build my ports from not a root user. How can I tell the ports system that it should su ( switch user ) before to build the dependencies? Can portupgrade handle this? Dependencies should be installed from a root user. Install sudo, and (as long as your permissions are set correctly) the ports system can do everything except the install and configure from a user in the 'wheel' group. Daniel Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: 2020: Will BSD and Linux be relevant anymore?
On Thu, July 21, 2011 12:13 pm, Jamie Paul Griffin wrote: Adding a variety of devices to a tablet still wouldn't make it an attractive option for me. I can't imagine doing my CS degree course-work on one of them, it would be a nightmare. I even found working on a laptop frustrating given the length of study sessions sometimes. As I said elsewhere in that email, I don't expect everyone to do so. I just know several who have. As tablets and such get more powerful and the connection systems get better it will become a more appealing option for more and more users. But for a large number of non-technical users, I can see it being the most appealing option already. Also, due to the nature of the course-work I absolutely could not work with anything other than UNIX and so I have to select my hardware around my choice of OS which of course is FreeBSD. Which nicely brings us back to where this thread started: What needs to happen to make sure FreeBSD stays relevant as computing moves to these devices? ;) (Or should FreeBSD try to be relevant to the end-user at all? Part of what makes this an appealing option is increased 'cloud computing', and FreeBSD has an obviously relevant place in that, as a high-performance and high-reliability server platform.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: build ports from not a root user?
On Thu, July 21, 2011 11:30 am, Peter Vereshagin wrote: You'll never silence the voice of the voiceless, freebsd-questions! 2011/07/21 11:04:57 -0400 Daniel Staal dst...@usa.net = To freebsd-questions@freebsd.org : DS I'd like to build my ports from not a root user. DS How can I tell the ports system that it should su ( switch user ) before DS to DS build the dependencies? DS Can portupgrade handle this? DS Dependencies should be installed from a root user. DS DS Install sudo, and (as long as your permissions are set correctly) the DS ports system can do everything except the install and configure from a DS user in the 'wheel' group. Heck I know I can use su or sudo and after chown -Rf user00:group00 /usr/ports/ /usr/src/ /usr/obj I can build world or a single port with 'make'. It's easy. But with ports I know the dependencies will not follow my policy to install the every single port as: $ cd /usr/ports/category/port00 $ make $ su - # cd /usr/ports/category/port00 # make install # exit $ cd /usr/ports/category/port01 ... and so on ... No, it'll _build_ each port as your user, and then try to go to root to install them. Which is why I suggested sudo: You can tune it's timeouts, and only have to enter your password occasionally. (Why do you trust a port's dependencies to be built as root if you don't trust the port itself, after all?) The other option would be to do something like this: $ su - # make depends # exit $ make $ su - # make install Which should be fairly close to what you are saying. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: build ports from not a root user?
On Thu, July 21, 2011 1:54 pm, Peter Vereshagin wrote: Oh Daniel want you buy me a mersedes benz? 2011/07/21 13:19:40 -0400 Daniel Staal dst...@usa.net = To freebsd-questions@freebsd.org : DS DS On Thu, July 21, 2011 11:30 am, Peter Vereshagin wrote: DS You'll never silence the voice of the voiceless, freebsd-questions! DS 2011/07/21 11:04:57 -0400 Daniel Staal dst...@usa.net = To DS freebsd-questions@freebsd.org : DS DS I'd like to build my ports from not a root user. DS DS How can I tell the ports system that it should su ( switch user ) DS before DS DS to DS DS build the dependencies? DS DS Can portupgrade handle this? DS DS Dependencies should be installed from a root user. DS DS DS DS Install sudo, and (as long as your permissions are set correctly) the DS DS ports system can do everything except the install and configure from a DS DS user in the 'wheel' group. DS DS Heck I know I can use su or sudo and after DS DS chown -Rf user00:group00 /usr/ports/ /usr/src/ /usr/obj DS DS I can build world or a single port with 'make'. It's easy. DS DS But with ports I know the dependencies will not follow my policy to DS install the DS every single port as: DS DS $ cd /usr/ports/category/port00 DS $ make DS $ su - DS # cd /usr/ports/category/port00 DS # make install DS # exit DS $ cd /usr/ports/category/port01 DS ... and so on ... DS DS No, it'll _build_ each port as your user, and then try to go to root to DS install them. Which is why I suggested sudo: You can tune it's timeouts, DS and only have to enter your password occasionally. (Why do you trust a DS port's dependencies to be built as root if you don't trust the port DS itself, after all?) That's the question: I don't. In that my code example, port00 and port01 can all be (or not be) the dependencies for the port I try to install. I mean about every single port, including its dependencies, to be installed that way: build as a user and then install as a root. Ok, then I've already answered your question several emails ago. The ports system will do this automatically with a simple 'make', 'make install', or 'make depends; make install'. And you said you knew about that way of it working. So, what are we discussing again? Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: 2020: Will BSD and Linux be relevant anymore?
On Thu, July 21, 2011 1:11 pm, Chad Perrin wrote: If all they want is a toy with a Web browser and an email client, I guess that works for them. I don't know if they really count for purposes of discussing the possible replacement of desktops and laptops, though, because what they really need is not a general-purpose personal computer at all. Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] One of the people I know uses this as his work laptop, running Excel, Powerpoint, Outlook, Word, etc. (Of course, he's not running Android at that point...) The 'laptop' is a tablet in a case with a bluetooth keyboard. He uses this _at his desk in the office, next to a desktop computer._ (Because he can then take the work home with him, or bring it to a meeting.) Whether of not it's sane, it's being done. ;) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: build ports from not a root user?
On Thu, July 21, 2011 2:26 pm, Peter Vereshagin wrote: Oh Daniel want you buy me a mersedes benz? 2011/07/21 14:01:04 -0400 Daniel Staal dst...@usa.net = To freebsd-questions@freebsd.org : DS Ok, then I've already answered your question several emails ago. The DS ports system will do this automatically with a simple 'make', 'make DS install', or 'make depends; make install'. And you said you knew about No it doesn't. 'all' target includes 'depends' target. 'depends' target includes performing 'make install' on the dependencies which I'd like to avoid. This can be avoided if a some tool like the portupgrade has did them already. It can do it that same way, too: build as a non-root user and then install as a root user. That way the 'make depends' can be done as a non-root user as it's a no-op additional check. So you want to install software without installing it's dependencies first? Or build software without installing it's build dependencies first? Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: 2020: Will BSD and Linux be relevant anymore?
On Wed, July 20, 2011 1:52 pm, David Jackson wrote: I do not believe that these phones or tablets will replace desktop but there is a lot of room for these two types of devices basically to communicate, giving people access to their data and environment from both. The reason I dont see the desktop going anywhere is that, basically people dont want to work on a spreadsheet, play a game, write a letter or do many other things on a 3 screen. Students wont want to use them to do their reports, etc. Phones and tablets are handy when on the go due to the portability, but their portability makes them impractical for use at home when a larger screen is more desirable. The growth of tablets is due to there simply not being the market there before and more people buying them for mobile use. But desktops will remain popular for home and work use. Also users want upgradeability, they dont want to be stuck with the same amount of hard disk space and may want to add a new camera to the system, a capture device, scanner, etc. Desktop systems provide much more upgrade flexibility. Linking the desktop to the tablet will be an important thing so people can access data and so on from their tablet. I'll disagree, somewhat: I know several people who are using a tablet as a desktop-replacement laptop. They have a Bluetooth keyboard, and can use the tablet as a full computer or not. Most *consumers,* in my experience, also don't typically care about upgradablity. Either the machine works when they get it, or it doesn't (which is a warranty issue), and after that if it breaks in few years, well, time to get a new one. A few will add RAM or a HD when they get it, but that's about it. Other additions, if any, are done as USB/Bluetooth, etc, and can be done on a tablet just as easily as a desktop. As for binary drivers... They work ok *if* and *while* the company wants to support the hardware/OS. Once they decide they don't want to, that's it. This tends to cause problems down the road. Also, they may do no more than the minimum necessary to support a certain version of the OS, unless that OS is a major source for their customers. So while they *can* make better drivers than the core team, they often *don't.* Best is an open driver by the manufacturer. Second is open docs, third is binary blob. My opinion. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: 2020: Will BSD and Linux be relevant anymore?
--As of July 20, 2011 5:45:49 PM -0400, David Jackson is alleged to have said: but you also have scanners, cameras, joysticks, capture devices for video, and so on that many common users love to use. A lot of people use computers for writing, home and office business work, and gaming, and given the choice between a 3 screen and a 20 screen, you want a 20 screen. Even facebook is better on a 20 screen. I stand by what i said, mobile is great for use on a subway, but when you get home, you really want a nice 20 screen to work on, and the bigger hard drive and faster CPU. --As for the rest, it is mine. *All* of which can be connected to a tablet just as easily as a desktop. (Well, except for a faster CPU.) I know people who do so. Current tablets have USB, Bluetooth, and HDMI/Displayport. Can you do everything on a tablet that you can on a dedicated desktop? No. But you can do most of it, especially if the people writing the software and designing the add-ons know that's the market they have to work with. I don't think everyone will go to tablets. But I think it's going to be a larger market than you think, and I think they *will* displace some desktops and laptops. The perfect computing device would fit in a pocket, have a screen the size of your wall, have a full (and full-sized) keyboard, and your choice of pointing devices. It would be able to play any game you wanted to play, hold every movie and song ever recorded along with your entire lifetime's collection of documents, and be able to access the Internet from anywhere. It would only need to be recharged as often as you sleep. (And would be able to recharge anywhere.) Today, a tablet is closer to that then a desktop is. It's short on CPU and storage, and it doesn't have the battery life. It's also a little too big and not quite mobile enough. Several of those constraints can be worked around with a docking station/case. Smartphones have the mobility and Internet access, and nearly the charging/battery life, but are even more constrained on other issues. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Lennart Poettering: BSD Isn't Relevant Anymore
--As of July 17, 2011 8:13:13 PM +0700, C. Bergström is alleged to have said: 1) Why care about *BSD as a desktop? 2) Why care about *BSD as a workstation? (Which I see as a next level in stability/usability beyond a toy desktop) --As for the rest, it is mine. Because it is easier to get your admins to support a server if they can have a working development desktop that matches the server's OS and config. (Apart from their interface and development software, which would only be on the dev box.) Just a thought. ;) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Mouse problem on ThinkPad X61
--As of July 2, 2011 9:56:33 PM -0600, Warren Block is alleged to have said: The T61 has both a touchpad and a trackpoint. Seems like on my T42, only one works. Possibly there are settings for psm(4) or the synaptics touchpad driver is needed. --As for the rest, it is mine. Check your BIOS settings as well: You can turn them off independently there, and the OS would never see it. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Looking to build a router box, seeking some general advice
--As of June 30, 2011 6:34:52 PM -0400, Chris Brennan is alleged to have said: While trying to learn IPv6 as best as I can and messing with my Linksys WRT54Gv3 router running DD-WRT, I realized that it cannot properly do IPv6 yet. This leaves me rather limited. More then once some people on IRC who were helping me with this suggested I build my own router, this has been something I've been looking to do for quite some time and this might be the fire I need lit to get motivated. The overall suggested board was an ALIX board[1] from PC Engines[1]. This is all rather new to me so I am unsure where to go from here, what all is needed (a breakdown of necessary/optional hardware/items). The memory and cpu I know I could google for w/o much issue. What I foresaw as problematic was a case for the device and a power supply. Are these just as easily googled for? Inversely, instead of me building my own (which would be great experience!) is there a place that sells devices such as these pre-assembled? --As for the rest, it is mine. There are a variety of stores that will sell ALIX kits, either pre-assembled or not. I've used Netgate recently (http://store.netgate.com/Default.aspx), but depending on where you are others may be better. Many will also sell them pre-loaded with m0n0wall or pfsense, both of which are FreeBSD-based router/firewall distros with web interfaces to do most things you would want. (Although I know pfsense at least doesn't support IPv6 configuration through the web interface yet. Of course, you can still ssh in.) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: NFS zfs serveur (hardware question)
On Wed, June 22, 2011 9:26 pm, Damien Fleuriot wrote: You will lose your main ZFS pool if you lose: - more than 1 of your full ZFS pools or - your ZIL (need confirmation on that) From my reading, on the ZIL: Under 8.2, true. If you have patched your ZFS install, or are running -CURRENT, you can lose your ZIL, I think. (The ability is in zpool version 19.) The 'I think' is because that version allows *removal* of the ZIL device. Which should be the same as a loss of the device, but... Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: FreeBSD paid support
On Mon, June 20, 2011 3:35 am, Dennis Perisa wrote: Hi guys, Are there paid support services available for FreeBSD? If provided by a 3rd party, can you name or even recommend a few? I haven't tried any, so I can't make recommendations, but the FreeBSD website has a listing: http://www.freebsd.org/commercial/commercial.html Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: ZFS and cp -x
--As of June 19, 2011 10:49:58 AM +0400, Eir Nym is alleged to have said: zfs mount contains: zpoo/usr/ports /usr/ports zpool/usr/ports/distfiles /usr/ports/distfiles when I try to cp -Rx, distfiles will be copied too. --As for the rest, it is mine. The distfiles directory, or the distfiles themselves? If it's following the Gnu semantics (and from my test it was) it should create an empty distfiles directory. All I can say is that on my 8.2-RELEASE system, it worked correctly when I tested it. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: unable to reach bsd-lists via mail
On Saturday, June 18, 2011 11:53:57 AM Christopher J. Ruwe wrote: I have a problem with my mail-server configuration so that mail sent will not reach any freebsd adresses. The solutions offered in similar mails already accessible via various archives did not help :-( I usually send mail from the domain cruwe.de with the mail-server mail.cruwe.de. My configration is as such, that $ host cruwe.de cruwe.de has address 188.40.164.98 cruwe.de mail is handled by 10 mail.cruwe.de. and $ host mail.cruwe.de mail.cruwe.de has address 188.40.164.98 mail.cruwe.de mail is handled by 10 mail.cruwe.de. [snip] seems to be OK. Does anyone have an idea what could be the issue? Thank you, cheers What does you mailer return as the hostname? (Not the box on which your mailer is runing, but the mail server itself. Often it can be set seperately.) The FreeBSD lists are picky about having that match the DNS entries for your domain. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: ZFS and cp -x
--As of June 16, 2011 5:31:26 PM +0400, Eir Nym is alleged to have said: Does `cp -x` works correctly on ZFS? --As for the rest, it is mine. Yes, it does. Sorry, I meant to test this for you earlier, but forgot... Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: ZFS and cp -x
--As of June 18, 2011 5:46:54 PM -0700, Randal L. Schwartz is alleged to have said: Is cp -x new? Not in my 8.1 manpages. --As for the rest, it is mine. The online man page viewer shows it in 8.1, but not 8.0. So, it looks like a gnu-ism that got brought over for 8.1, according to the manpage histories. It's also slightly confusing in the docs: the man page only says 'File System mounts are not traversed'. It probably would be worth noting that it only has any effect with -R, as that's the only time when you are trying to copy files from multiple mountpoints. It would have cleared up for me that it doesn't mean you can't copy *to* a different mountpoint. ;) Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: unable to reach bsd-lists via mail
--As of June 19, 2011 12:29:02 AM +0200, Christopher J. Ruwe is alleged to have said: (The server is a rented virtual machine.) Am I right that I need to set the rDNS of 188.40.164.98 to mail.cruwe.de to make the freebsd.org servers accept my mail or that, should I set the rDNS to cruwe.de, I should make the mailer on mail.cruwe.de identify itself as cruwe.de instead of mail.cruwe.de? Anyway, thank you very much for your help, --As for the rest, it is mine. In postfix, the relevant setting is 'myhostname' in main.cf for the hostname. From my experience, it doesn't have to match the rDNS. It needs to match the MX record. But, you should be able to see what they are saying as a rejection notice from your logs. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: free sco unix
--As of June 17, 2011 5:02:09 PM -0500, Robert Bonomi is alleged to have said: 4) In the U.S., one can officially register copyright on something up to SIX MONTHS _after_ first 'publication'. --As for the rest, it is mine. Actually, you can register it at any time after it has been created, until the copyright period ends. (Even before it's been published.) Though you get certain benefits if you register within five years of it's creation. Also note that to file a _copyright suit_ your work has to be registered. But this registration can occur _after_ the infringement. (Although if it's done beforehand you'll have an easier time with your case, and some extra legal options.) Bare details available here: http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.pdf Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: free sco unix
On Thu, June 16, 2011 12:20 pm, Peter Vereshagin wrote: You can't take no for an answer, freebsd-questions! 2011/06/16 11:54:05 -0400 Robert Simmons rsimmo...@gmail.com = To freebsd-questions@freebsd.org : RS http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright RS http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trademark I'll surely will when I'll have some to trade ;-) RS Copyright pertains to the source code. Trademark pertains to the use of RS signs, symbols, names, logos, etc. Source code itself can have 'signs, symbols, names, logos, etc.' and consist in terms of its usability of them, doesn't it just use to? 'signs, symbols, names, logos, etc.' same way can have their source code and consist in terms of their usability of it, doesn't they just use to? Trademark is for 'this is made by me. I put my name on it.' Copyright is for the content of a book/speech/whatever. 'Trademark' is a _maker's mark._ The point is not encouraging the creation of works (like copyright): The point is so that a maker/seller can build a reputation with their customers. They are very different in terms, uses, and requirements. In theory it is possible to hold both a trademark and a copyright on the same thing, but it is hard. (You will likely fail applicability tests for one or the other.) It is of course possible to put a trademark on something you've copyrighted, so people know who created it. Daniel T. Staal --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: free sco unix
--As of June 16, 2011 11:21:34 PM +0400, Peter Vereshagin is alleged to have said: CP UNIX, the name, is a trademark. We can use it all we like here, speaking Do we need a license to use it? ;-) According to what I recall of my 'business law for managers' classes: As long as we don't claim we own it, and only *referring* to the company who does or it's products, no. It's an identifying mark: You can use it to identify. I don't need a license to talk about Peter Vershagain, as long as I don't claim that *I* am Peter Vershagain. ;) If I wanted to say that something I was selling was something you had made or endorsed, I'd want to pay you for a licence to use your name in that context. Your name isn't copyrighted: Anyone can copy it. But we can't *claim* it. CP about the UNIX trademark, its applicability, who owns the trademark, and CP so on. We just can't claim *we* own it, misapply it to things to which So it's just enough to reserve a copyright on this word usage and we will have just another reason why we can't claim we own it ;-) Sorry my confusion, it's just a new thing to me and it seems as absurd as those ideas. It's extremely hard to claim a copyright on a single word: You have to meet an orgininality requirement that a single word is going to have trouble meeting. A longer work, a story or a section of code, is much more original, so you can take out a copyright on it. This means you have the right to say who can and cannot make copies. (Mostly cannot...) But if you give someone the right to make a copy, they still can't say that *you* made that copy. (But they must say that the words are yours, unless you've given them the right to do otherwise.) (And note that a pure list of facts can't be copyrighted: The phone book is often an example. It's just a list of names and numbers.) A trademark is a mark: It marks a product as having come from a person or company. A copyright is a license/right: It allows you to control what other people do with your work. (Or some of it.) They are two very different, if somewhat confusing, things. Another example: If you wrote a program, you'd probably want to say who can sell it (or give it away) and under what conditions. That's copyright. (Even if your conditions are just 'don't take off my trademark'.) You'd probably also want people to know who wrote it, so you'd put your name on it. That's a trademark. Daniel T. Staal CP Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] --- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. --- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
