reusing my thesis

[Bruce Ryan]

Hi g-listers

My PhD thesis dates from 1996 and was created in MS Word 4 or 5. I've just had 
reason to look at this ancient history but can't do so satisfactorily. It 
doesn't open in my current version of Word (mac:2011). It will open in 
TextEdit: the text appears to be complete, as far as I can see, but the 
illustrations and indices to the footnotes (the references*) are gone, and 
there's a load of unreadable stuff following the text. 
*Chemistry at the time didn't use author-date/inline references. 

I can rescue the illustrations: they were created in ChemDraw 3 on one of my 
old macs, saved the files as EPS, copied them to my main mac and got the bits I 
need in Illustrator CS5. But I want to be sure where each one goes if I have to 
rebuild the thesis from the text rescued with TextEdit

So, is there any way of opening the Word file. I have floppy-disk installers 
for MS Word 4 but my USB floppy drive won't read them. The hardware I have is
2008 Mac Pro running 10·8·5, with Adobe Creative Suite 5 and 5·5, and Office 
Mac 2011.
2010 MacBook Air running 10·8·5 - software as above
Dell mini 10V running 10·6
Powerbook G4 1GHz running 10·5, 10·4, 10·2 and 9·2. The 9·2 installation has 
PageMaker 6·5, InDesign 2 and ChemDraw 3
Powerbook G3 Pismo running 10·4·11

I guess the most likely route is to find an old mac with a built-in floppy 
drive, then install Word 4 on it. Then I could open the file for the thesis and 
use this to rebuild a version in a modern version of Word or InDesign. But I'm 
not so keep to buy yet another old mac just for this purpose. Can anyone 
suggest anything better, pretty please?

thanks indeed

Bruce

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Re: reusing my thesis

[Mac User #330250]

--  Original message  --
Subject: reusing my thesis
Date:Monday, 21. October 2013
From:Bruce Ryan 
To:  "g3-5-list@googlegroups.com" 

> So, is there any way of opening the Word file.

Word 4… sounds like this is a Mac OS 7/8/9 Application.

The best way is propably to try opening it with Office:mac 2001 or so because 
this should be able to read your files correctly.

And if you then save it in the new format, you may be able to open it using 
Office:mac 2011…

What I would do is to install Word 4/5 inside Classic on, say, the G3 Prismo 
or on 9.2 on the PowerBook G3.

Printing/Saving files as PDF is always a good idea, as is saving it in a 
standard format like RTF and RTFD.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDF/A
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Text_Format
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Text_Format_Directory

Cheers,
Andreas  aka  Mac User #330250

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Re: reusing my thesis

[Bruce Ryan]

Hi Andreas

IIRC, the file dates from 1996 - around the time of mac classic and Mac II. 

Someone has offered to translate the file into a modern version of Word. If 
that fails, I will try to find Office 2001, which is more likely to be on a CD 
and thus avoid the floppy-drive blues. The PITA is that my floppy drive won't 
read by 800K Word 4 installer floppies.

Absolutely agree about output to PDF - if only I'd known in 1996.

thanks indeed

Bruce

On 21 Oct 2013, at 17:51, Mac User #330250  wrote:

> --  Original message  --
> Subject: reusing my thesis
> Date:Monday, 21. October 2013
> From:Bruce Ryan 
> To:  "g3-5-list@googlegroups.com" 
> 
>> So, is there any way of opening the Word file.
> 
> Word 4… sounds like this is a Mac OS 7/8/9 Application.
> 
> The best way is propably to try opening it with Office:mac 2001 or so because 
> this should be able to read your files correctly.
> 
> And if you then save it in the new format, you may be able to open it using 
> Office:mac 2011…
> 
> What I would do is to install Word 4/5 inside Classic on, say, the G3 Prismo 
> or on 9.2 on the PowerBook G3.
> 
> Printing/Saving files as PDF is always a good idea, as is saving it in a 
> standard format like RTF and RTFD.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDF/A
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Text_Format
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Text_Format_Directory
> 
> Cheers,
> Andreas  aka  Mac User #330250
> 
> -- 
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Re: reusing my thesis

[Mac User #330250]

--  Original message  --
Subject: Re: reusing my thesis
Date:Monday, 21. October 2013
From:Bruce Ryan 
To:  g3-5-list@googlegroups.com
> Hi Andreas
> 
> IIRC, the file dates from 1996 - around the time of mac classic and Mac II.

Ah, that old…

> Someone has offered to translate the file into a modern version of Word. If
> that fails, I will try to find Office 2001, which is more likely to be on
> a CD and thus avoid the floppy-drive blues. The PITA is that my floppy
> drive won't read by 800K Word 4 installer floppies.

Maybe Word 98 is a better choice.

> Absolutely agree about output to PDF - if only I'd known in 1996.

I had the same problems with an old Word file, but it wasn’t that important so 
I just didn’t restore it after all.


Cheers,
Andreas  aka  Mac User #330250

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Re: reusing my thesis

[Valter Prahlad]

Il giorno 21/10/13 18.21, "Bruce Ryan" ha scritto:

> My PhD thesis dates from 1996 and was created in MS Word 4 or 5. I've just had
> reason to look at this ancient history but can't do so satisfactorily. It
> doesn't open in my current version of Word (mac:2011).

Bruce, I have Office Mac 2008 and its Word was able to correctly open
several files I made ten years ago with Word 5.
Thus maybe Word 2008 could be able to open your files as well.
I'm willing to try to translate your files for you, if you want.

Another suggestion is try to use Open Office (it's free): it should be able
to open most Word formats.
http://www.openoffice.org/



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Re: reusing my thesis

[James E. Therrault]

The Mac II dates to 1987-88 and by 1996, Apple was dealing strictly with PPC 
code (unless you had a Mac II from earlier days)

More important is the system software used, (System 7.xxx???).

And yes, if you can find a way of getting that far back, definitely go for a 
PDF conversion.

BTW, you might be able to find someone with an earlier Mac that used System 9.1 
or so and is pretty well backward compatible.

JT



On Oct 21, 2013, at 11:59 AM, Bruce Ryan wrote:

> Hi Andreas
> 
> IIRC, the file dates from 1996 - around the time of mac classic and Mac II. 
> 
> Someone has offered to translate the file into a modern version of Word. If 
> that fails, I will try to find Office 2001, which is more likely to be on a 
> CD and thus avoid the floppy-drive blues. The PITA is that my floppy drive 
> won't read by 800K Word 4 installer floppies.
> 
> Absolutely agree about output to PDF - if only I'd known in 1996.
> 
> thanks indeed
> 
> Bruce
> 
> On 21 Oct 2013, at 17:51, Mac User #330250  wrote:
> 
>> ------  Original message  --
>> Subject: reusing my thesis
>> Date:Monday, 21. October 2013
>> From:Bruce Ryan 
>> To:  "g3-5-list@googlegroups.com" 
>> 
>>> So, is there any way of opening the Word file.
>> 
>> Word 4… sounds like this is a Mac OS 7/8/9 Application.
>> 
>> The best way is propably to try opening it with Office:mac 2001 or so 
>> because 
>> this should be able to read your files correctly.
>> 
>> And if you then save it in the new format, you may be able to open it using 
>> Office:mac 2011…
>> 
>> What I would do is to install Word 4/5 inside Classic on, say, the G3 Prismo 
>> or on 9.2 on the PowerBook G3.
>> 
>> Printing/Saving files as PDF is always a good idea, as is saving it in a 
>> standard format like RTF and RTFD.
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDF/A
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Text_Format
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Text_Format_Directory
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Andreas  aka  Mac User #330250

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Re: reusing my thesis

[Bruce Johnson]

On Oct 21, 2013, at 9:21 AM, Bruce Ryan  wrote:

> Hi g-listers
> 
> My PhD thesis dates from 1996 and was created in MS Word 4 or 5. I've just 
> had reason to look at this ancient history but can't do so satisfactorily. It 
> doesn't open in my current version of Word (mac:2011). It will open in 
> TextEdit: the text appears to be complete, as far as I can see, but the 
> illustrations and indices to the footnotes (the references*) are gone, and 
> there's a load of unreadable stuff following the text. 


Try LibreOffice on either of the two 10.8 macs. 



-- 
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs


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Re: reusing my thesis

[Bruce Ryan]

Hi G-list

Thank you for all replies and thoughts. A G-lister offered to sort it for me by 
on his old macs and their corresponding versions of Word. 

But the answer was even simpler: 2 minutes later, he emailed 'I just tried it 
on my work computer running Windows 7 and Word 2010, it opened fine, and I 
saved it as the 97-2003 version.  Here you go.'

So huge thanks to him and raspberry to me - I have a Windows 7 VM, with Office 
2010 on my Mac Pro. It just worked! (Once I'd sorted the trust centre settings.)

Bruce

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Re: reusing my thesis

[Nick Dynice]

FIY,

I offered to convert it for Bruce tonight with my G3 running OS9 and Word
which is in my local network and I transfer files back and fourth on a
regular basis between it and my MBP running OSX 10.8.

Just for the heck of it I tried to open it on my Windows 7 PC at work with
Word 2010 and it opened fine (needed to disable some security settings in
Word).  I saved it as Word 97-2003 format and sent it back to him, he says
it looks great.

-Nick


On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 9:21 AM, Bruce Ryan  wrote:

> Hi g-listers
>
> My PhD thesis dates from 1996 and was created in MS Word 4 or 5. I've just
> had reason to look at this ancient history but can't do so satisfactorily.
> It doesn't open in my current version of Word (mac:2011). It will open in
> TextEdit: the text appears to be complete, as far as I can see, but the
> illustrations and indices to the footnotes (the references*) are gone, and
> there's a load of unreadable stuff following the text.
> *Chemistry at the time didn't use author-date/inline references.
>
> I can rescue the illustrations: they were created in ChemDraw 3 on one of
> my old macs, saved the files as EPS, copied them to my main mac and got the
> bits I need in Illustrator CS5. But I want to be sure where each one goes
> if I have to rebuild the thesis from the text rescued with TextEdit
>
> So, is there any way of opening the Word file. I have floppy-disk
> installers for MS Word 4 but my USB floppy drive won't read them. The
> hardware I have is
> 2008 Mac Pro running 10·8·5, with Adobe Creative Suite 5 and 5·5, and
> Office Mac 2011.
> 2010 MacBook Air running 10·8·5 - software as above
> Dell mini 10V running 10·6
> Powerbook G4 1GHz running 10·5, 10·4, 10·2 and 9·2. The 9·2 installation
> has PageMaker 6·5, InDesign 2 and ChemDraw 3
> Powerbook G3 Pismo running 10·4·11
>
> I guess the most likely route is to find an old mac with a built-in floppy
> drive, then install Word 4 on it. Then I could open the file for the thesis
> and use this to rebuild a version in a modern version of Word or InDesign.
> But I'm not so keep to buy yet another old mac just for this purpose. Can
> anyone suggest anything better, pretty please?
>
> thanks indeed
>
> Bruce
>
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Re: reusing my thesis

[peter]

Glad you got it sorted, but couldn't your university's library just scanned it 
and e-mailed it to you???

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Re: reusing my thesis

[Bruce Ryan]

Hi Peter

My thesis dates from 1996 and I'm no longer at that university. Scanning 250 
would be a major task. 

Also, while I want to see the difference between chemistry research language at 
that time and  current social informatics research language, I have a notion to 
lay out my thesis attractively, using InDesign. For that, I'd need the content 
in electronic format. Correcting OCRed files would be a major pain - there is 
page after page of stuff like the below

cheers

Bruce

d Preparation of ylides

i  Preparation of [(ethanesulphinyl)ethoxycarbonylmethylene]triphenyl 
phosphorane 248

(Ethoxycarbonylmethylene)triphenylphosphorane 245 (12.4 g, 35 mmol) was stirred 
in dry toluene (100 ml) at 0°C under nitrogen.  Ethanesulphinyl chloride (1.9 
g, 17 mmol) in dry toluene (10 ml) was added and the mixture was stirred for 12 
h. The mixture was filtered and evaporation and trituration with ethyl acetate 
(5 ml) gave yellow cubes of slightly impure 
[(ethanesulphinyl)ethoxycarbonylmethylene]triphenylphosphorane 248 (1.2 g, 
16%).  m.p. 141–2°C (Found: C, 69.4; H, 5.9; m/z = 408.1307.  C24H25O3PS 
requires C, 67.9; H, 5.9%; M+ – O, 408.1313); dP +27.5 (120) [impurities +22.1 
(7) and 18.7 (3)]; dH (80 MHz) 7.4–8.0 (15H, m), 4.05 (2H, q, J = 7 Hz, OCH2), 
2.25 (2H, q of d, J = 7 Hz, JP = 2 Hz, SCH2), 0.95 (3H, t, J = 7 Hz, OCH2CH3) 
and 0.9–1.0 (3H, br s, SCH2CH3) [minor impurities 4.0–4.4 (m) and 1.2–1.4 (m)]; 
dC (75 MHz) 172.2 (C=O), 133.8 (6C, d, 2JP = 10 Hz), 131.7 (3C, d, 4JP = 2 Hz), 
130.8 (3C, 4ry, 1JP = 58 Hz), 128.3 (6C, d, 3JP = 12 Hz), 58.6 (OCH2), 37.0 (d, 
J = 120 Hz), 33.1 (SCH2), 13.9 (OCH2CH3) and 13.4; nmax 3040, 2970, 2920, 1640, 
1595, 1482, 1436, 1365, 1230, 1190, 1170, 1100, 1070 and 865 cm–1; m/z 408 (M+ 
– O, 45%), 379 (100), 301 (7), 277 (8), 262 (37), 183 (38), 152 (5), 108 (14) 
and 77(4).



On 27 Oct 2013, at 15:58, peter  wrote:

> Glad you got it sorted, but couldn't your university's library just scanned 
> it and e-mailed it to you???
> 
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Re: reusing my thesis

[Bruce Ryan]

Sorry, that should have been 'Scanning 250 pages would be a major pain.'

Bruce
 
On 27 Oct 2013, at 16:13, Bruce Ryan  wrote:

> Hi Peter
> 
> My thesis dates from 1996 and I'm no longer at that university. Scanning 250 
> would be a major task. 
> 
> Also, while I want to see the difference between chemistry research language 
> at that time and  current social informatics research language, I have a 
> notion to lay out my thesis attractively, using InDesign. For that, I'd need 
> the content in electronic format. Correcting OCRed files would be a major 
> pain - there is page after page of stuff like the below
> 
> cheers
> 
> Bruce
> 
> d Preparation of ylides
> 
> i  Preparation of [(ethanesulphinyl)ethoxycarbonylmethylene]triphenyl 
> phosphorane 248
> 
> (Ethoxycarbonylmethylene)triphenylphosphorane 245 (12.4 g, 35 mmol) was 
> stirred in dry toluene (100 ml) at 0°C under nitrogen.  Ethanesulphinyl 
> chloride (1.9 g, 17 mmol) in dry toluene (10 ml) was added and the mixture 
> was stirred for 12 h. The mixture was filtered and evaporation and 
> trituration with ethyl acetate (5 ml) gave yellow cubes of slightly impure 
> [(ethanesulphinyl)ethoxycarbonylmethylene]triphenylphosphorane 248 (1.2 g, 
> 16%).  m.p. 141–2°C (Found: C, 69.4; H, 5.9; m/z = 408.1307.  C24H25O3PS 
> requires C, 67.9; H, 5.9%; M+ – O, 408.1313); dP +27.5 (120) [impurities 
> +22.1 (7) and 18.7 (3)]; dH (80 MHz) 7.4–8.0 (15H, m), 4.05 (2H, q, J = 7 Hz, 
> OCH2), 2.25 (2H, q of d, J = 7 Hz, JP = 2 Hz, SCH2), 0.95 (3H, t, J = 7 Hz, 
> OCH2CH3) and 0.9–1.0 (3H, br s, SCH2CH3) [minor impurities 4.0–4.4 (m) and 
> 1.2–1.4 (m)]; dC (75 MHz) 172.2 (C=O), 133.8 (6C, d, 2JP = 10 Hz), 131.7 (3C, 
> d, 4JP = 2 Hz), 130.8 (3C, 4ry, 1JP = 58 Hz), 128.3 (6C, d, 3JP = 12 Hz), 
> 58.6 (OCH2), 37.0 (d, J = 120 Hz), 33.1 (SCH2), 13.9 (OCH2CH3) and 13.4; nmax 
> 3040, 2970, 2920, 1640, 1595, 1482, 1436, 1365, 1230, 1190, 1170, 1100, 1070 
> and 865 cm–1; m/z 408 (M+ – O, 45%), 379 (100), 301 (7), 277 (8), 262 (37), 
> 183 (38), 152 (5), 108 (14) and 77(4).
> 
> 
> 
> On 27 Oct 2013, at 15:58, peter  wrote:
> 
>> Glad you got it sorted, but couldn't your university's library just scanned 
>> it and e-mailed it to you???
>> 
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Re: reusing my thesis

[Guy Plunkett III]

So the Windows version will open old Mac documents, but the Mac version won't!?

On 10/21/13, Bruce Ryan wrote:
>Hi G-list
>
>Thank you for all replies and thoughts. A G-lister offered to sort it for me 
>by on his old macs and their corresponding versions of Word.
>
>But the answer was even simpler: 2 minutes later, he emailed 'I just tried it 
>on my work computer running Windows 7 and Word 2010, it opened fine, and I 
>saved it as the 97-2003 version.  Here you go.'
>
>So huge thanks to him and raspberry to me - I have a Windows 7 VM, with Office 
>2010 on my Mac Pro. It just worked! (Once I'd sorted the trust centre 
>settings.)
>
>Bruce

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Re: reusing my thesis

[Bruce Johnson]

On Oct 22, 2013, at 6:47 AM, Guy Plunkett III  wrote:

> So the Windows version will open old Mac documents, but the Mac version 
> won't!?


Welcome to the World According to Microsoft.


-- 
Bruce Johnson

"Wherever you go, there you are." B. Banzai, PhD

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Re: reusing my thesis

[Beniamino Cenci Goga]

This is not correct: as I wrote in my previous comment, Word 2011 fir Mac dies 
open old Word 4 files, but not via the double click. You need to open the file 
from the File: Open menu.

Ben

Sent from my iPad

On 22/ott/2013, at 15:47, Guy Plunkett III  wrote:

> So the Windows version will open old Mac documents, but the Mac version 
> won't!?
> 
> On 10/21/13, Bruce Ryan wrote:
>> Hi G-list
>> 
>> Thank you for all replies and thoughts. A G-lister offered to sort it for me 
>> by on his old macs and their corresponding versions of Word.
>> 
>> But the answer was even simpler: 2 minutes later, he emailed 'I just tried 
>> it on my work computer running Windows 7 and Word 2010, it opened fine, and 
>> I saved it as the 97-2003 version.  Here you go.'
>> 
>> So huge thanks to him and raspberry to me - I have a Windows 7 VM, with 
>> Office 2010 on my Mac Pro. It just worked! (Once I'd sorted the trust centre 
>> settings.)
>> 
>> Bruce
> 
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Re: reusing my thesis

[Bruce Ryan]

Thanks but this doesn't work for me and this file: the error message is 

Word cannot open this document. The document might be in use, the document 
might not be a valid Word document, or the file name might contain invalid 
characters (for example, \ /).
(V4 MSW.doc)

Bruce

On 28 Oct 2013, at 06:02, Beniamino Cenci Goga  wrote:

> This is not correct: as I wrote in my previous comment, Word 2011 fir Mac 
> dies open old Word 4 files, but not via the double click. You need to open 
> the file from the File: Open menu.
> 
> Ben
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 22/ott/2013, at 15:47, Guy Plunkett III  wrote:
> 
>> So the Windows version will open old Mac documents, but the Mac version 
>> won't!?
>> 
>> On 10/21/13, Bruce Ryan wrote:
>>> Hi G-list
>>> 
>>> Thank you for all replies and thoughts. A G-lister offered to sort it for 
>>> me by on his old macs and their corresponding versions of Word.
>>> 
>>> But the answer was even simpler: 2 minutes later, he emailed 'I just tried 
>>> it on my work computer running Windows 7 and Word 2010, it opened fine, and 
>>> I saved it as the 97-2003 version.  Here you go.'
>>> 
>>> So huge thanks to him and raspberry to me - I have a Windows 7 VM, with 
>>> Office 2010 on my Mac Pro. It just worked! (Once I'd sorted the trust 
>>> centre settings.)
>>> 
>>> Bruce
>> 
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