[Audyssey] Board Games: Now Blind Accessible

[Richard Gibbs]

I thought that my Kickstarter might be of particular interest to this
group, especially considering the overlap between iOS games and board games
nowadays.

It is my hope that as a side benefit I'll be able to raise awareness of the
importance of including voice over in games. It's absurd that turn based
video games based on board games don't have VoiceOver.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/64ouncegames/board-games-now-blind-accessible/

-- 
Richard Gibbs
Lead Designer/Owner
64 Oz. Games
http://www.64OunceGames.com 
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Re: [Audyssey] Board games

[dark]

Hi Richard.

First as to game suggestions, one awsome game my family play on occasion is 
called Compatibility. You play in couples (though rules exist for playin 
with three or five players), Basically you are given a word (from having a 
word card and a dice), and a pack of cards with simple, illustrative 
pictures on, egg a wedding, one plane black, a cross, a tranquil country 
scene etc. You and your partner then choose cards from the pack which 
illustrate that word to you and arrange them in order of importance. If you 
have the same card in the same place you get 3 points and can move your 
peaces 3 spaces along the board. If you have same card in a different place 
you get one point.


Accessifying the game was fairly easy. We just use a braille dice (a single 
d6 is all), brailled the word choice cards and pack of picture cards (all 
the pictures are rather concepts than pictures so no need to be artistic), 
and we stuck braille labels on the board squares, (each square has the 
number of picture cards you get for the turn). You could equally use a pen 
friend for these, but we got the game a long time ago.


You would also need to either stick markers on the peaces or use alternative 
peaces, since the ones that come with the game are distinguishable only by 
colour. I didn't personally need to do this myself, but it wouldn't be so 
hard.




regarding atmosphere, unfortunately I gave away my copies of both atmosphere 
and atmosphere Ii many years ago due to a specific access problem.


labelling the board itself with tactile markers or braille letters would be 
easy enough,  though you'd need to have some sort of code as Atmosphere 
has several specialist squares. In the version of the game I had the peaces 
were also distinguishable only by colour, though more modern versions have 
far more tactile peaces, though if you've got a version of the game which 
just had the numbered scull peaces you might need to number those in 
braille. The real problem were the cards and timings.


Each card has a complex event on it, which was way more information than 
could be fit on the card in braille. This would not be a problem with the 
penfriend of course.


The other issue is that atmosphere was played along side the video of the 
Gate Keeper (or other characters in  other versions), who would appear and 
do various things like make people miss turns, play little minigames etc. Of 
course these people actually speak, however there is a clock on screen which 
counts down an hour and some of the time cards involve having to do things 
at specific times. For example you might have a card saying "at 21 minutes 
start laughing, if another player asks you why your laughing take a key from 
them" and I'm not sure how you'd be able to see the time on the screen, 
though it'd be relatively easy to run an hours precise timer on some other 
accessible device such as a computer and use that instead.


My only concern with some of the modern atmosphere is apparently the video 
bit has gone a little random and interactive now that it's on dvd, and 
includes things like playing poker with the host, which needless to say 
would be a problem.


As I said, the main issue with me and atmosphere as a teenager was the 
length of message required which we just couldn't get onto the space in 
Braille, but which would not be an issue with the pen friend, heck since 
each player has some of the same cards and such like the keys you acquire 
which let you do various things you could even use those big labels where 
you can chop them up to give one label with the same message on different 
objects.


Whatever method you use, Atmosphere would be a lot of work to label,  as 
I said we never got my set fully sorted as a teenager and usually I had to 
just rely on my friends which wasn't good. I'd suggest perhaps you need to 
look at a modern set including what is required of the video part of the 
game and see how things work.


Hth.

Beware the Grue!

Dark. 



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[Audyssey] Board games

[Richard Claridge]

Hi all.
I cannot remember if the discussion of board games is relevant to this
list, so apologies if I have overstepped the mark.
I live in a household with all blind adults but sighted children so I
have a question in a couple of parts. Firstly does anyone know any
good board games, mainstream as braille games are extremely limited
and I| think we have them all, that can easily be adapted to make them
playable by a blind person. I have bought a number of games and made
them accessible by using my penfriend on cards, or using a braille
letter system and then a key of the cards on a seperate reference
sheet.
SImilarly I have labeled squares on boards in the same way, as well as
using sticky velcrow dots on the squares and underside of playing
pieces to great effect.
I wanted to know if anyone had any good family or older games that
could be easily adapted in this way.
Secondly to Dark, you mentioned adapting the game Atmosfear which is a
game I really want to buy but haven't taken the plunge and I haven't
been sure if it would be possible to adapt it easily.
How did you find doing this and was the game any good and playable for
blind people?
Thanks all for any advice.
Richard

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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Charles Rivard]

That is absolutely criminal!

---
Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second.
- Original Message - 
From: "dark" 

To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2012 2:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers



Hi tom.

I have actually said before the Us services and a certain amount of their 
attitudes are better.


While there are individual brailling or reading services for the rnib, the 
price for them is prohibitively expensive, and the time taken is 
ridiculous. For instance, when i was doing my disertation, before I'd 
sorted the hole digital recorder routine, we got a book read onto cd by 
the rnib that it would need. It however cost about 200 pounds to have this 
done which was paid out of my readers' grant (that's about 300 usd), and 
furthermore, they refused to put it into the main library, meaning that if 
someone else asked them tomorrow for the same book they'd get charged the 
same fee. That to me is not! the behaviour of a charity.


And getting items brailled is even worse, though luckily I can fix that 
myself. To be honest, the Rnib are so damnably useless given their view of 
blind people, these days my approach personally is to have as little to do 
with them as possible, and either do things myself (these days I manage my 
own readers' grant paying for assistance which works far better and in 
fact cheaper, plus can read dynamically according to what I need done at 
the time), concentrate on smaller, but better agencies like guide dog 
services, who naturally deal with a more flexible view of the capabilities 
of blind people, for example I've already mentioned the rather extreme 
guide dog holidays group.
the only sad thing is they don't get the government or public funding the 
Rnib does.


Beware the grue!

Dark.



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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[dark]

Hi Tom.

Your unfortunately right on the british government and on them washing their 
hands on access, indeed up until 2005 if an agency wanted! to produce 
acessible books in the Uk they'd need to buy the copywrite to do so, and 
while this law has been changed, nobody as far as I know has gone against 
the wishes of the publishing industry for access purposes.


One correction however. The rnib aren't the only! agency in Britain, the 
problem is they have the most funding. For instance, Calibre are a volunteer 
run cassette library I've had huge amount fo respect for, who produce a wide 
variety of books. The problem? they get no government funding, or big 
charitable contributions that the rnib do.


Ditto with smaller groups like action for blind people. So, while it is! 
possible to find other agencies than the rnib, they don't really have half 
the same clout or resources unfortunately.


Beware the grue!

dark. 



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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Thomas Ward]

HI Dark,

Yikes! For those kinds of prices the RNIB aren't a charity but are a
bloody band of pirates!

Sadly, I don't know what you can do in that situation. Chances are if
someone took them to court over discrimination the courts would side
with them, because the very attitudes of your government is to wipe
their hands clean of accessibility related issues and put it in the
hands of the RNIB who obviously are incompetent. Since you don't have
any laws like the ADA you don't have any legal grounds to challenge
the RNIB and getting such laws passed in your country would take quite
a bit of work from what it sounds.

The other problem is that you seem stuck for one and only one agency
for all blind related things. Here in the US there are all kinds of
agencies and if a person is dissatisfied with one they can try
another. I often buy things from different rehab centers simply
because one carries something I need that another center doesn't have
in stock, or I find it slightly cheaper somewhere else. I have some
choice where I go and buy things from where the RNIB is able to do
whatever however they like unchallenged. That's quite sad.

Cheers!



On 6/10/12, dark  wrote:
> Hi tom.
>
> I have actually said before the Us services and a certain amount of their
> attitudes are better.
>
> While there are individual brailling or reading services for the rnib, the
> price for them is prohibitively expensive, and the time taken is ridiculous.
>
> For instance, when i was doing my disertation, before I'd sorted the hole
> digital recorder routine, we got a book read onto cd by the rnib that it
> would need. It however cost about 200 pounds to have this done which was
> paid out of my readers' grant (that's about 300 usd), and furthermore, they
>
> refused to put it into the main library, meaning that if someone else asked
>
> them tomorrow for the same book they'd get charged the same fee. That to me
>
> is not! the behaviour of a charity.
>
> And getting items brailled is even worse, though luckily I can fix that
> myself. To be honest, the Rnib are so damnably useless given their view of
> blind people, these days my approach personally is to have as little to do
> with them as possible, and either do things myself (these days I manage my
> own readers' grant paying for assistance which works far better and in fact
>
> cheaper, plus can read dynamically according to what I need done at the
> time), concentrate on smaller, but better agencies like guide dog services,
>
> who naturally deal with a more flexible view of the capabilities of blind
> people, for example I've already mentioned the rather extreme guide dog
> holidays group.
> the only sad thing is they don't get the government or public funding the
> Rnib does.
>
> Beware the grue!
>
> Dark.

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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,

Ah, that makes sense, and sadly you are right. The shows my son has on
DVD and those on PBS don't seem very historically accurate. Although,
I'll admit they are still pretty entertaining even for adults. Thanks
for the precise history of the books and shows. Now, back to gaming.
:D

Cheers!




On 6/10/12, dark  wrote:
> Hi Tom.
>
> Actually the original thomas books were written by Reverend Raymand audry a
>
> vicar who was also a railway inthusiast in the late 60's, using trains from
>
> his model rail way and the rules of the actual 1932 south eastern British
> rail company that existed at the time.
>
> it was first created in  book form in the very early 80's, with the original
>
> series, (still based on Reverend Audry's books), narated by Ringo star from
>
> the beatles.
>
> Then of course, like everything else, The series got taken up by the big
> cooperations who demanded more books than were written, and started writing
>
> their own episodes in a third series originally started in the late 1990's,
>
> first with Michael angeleis as narator, then with other naraters going on to
>
> peers brosnan.
>
> One of the sad things, is that Audry himself fell out severely with the
> company who licensed thomas, when their stories started losing all the
> historical background. For instance, one story "henry's forest" involved
> Henry sitting around and looking at the forest mid trip, but Audry stated
> (quite rightly), that this would not be possible under  the behaviour of a
> steam train at that time. This was why the name was changed to "thomas and
> friends" rather than the original "thomas the tank engine" as it had been in
>
> the early 80's, when still based on audry's work.
>
> That was really the thing about the original Thomas, it was hugely
> historically based. Each of the engines is modeled on a real make of
> locomotive,  Percy for instance is a welsh saddle tanker, and it is
> distinctly set in a period of pre second world war british history, just at
>
> the end of the use of steam trains, when the country still had it's very
> large railway companies (actually one of the best examples of companies I've
>
> ever seen).
>
> My mum often says it was Thomas that stopped me being autistic. i'd been
> extremely ill when I was 1-3 due to birth complications, and was apparently
>
> losing a lot of interest in things, until! I was introduced to Thomas. Our
> local rail preservation society even had thomas days when they'd dress up an
>
> actual steam engine as one of the Thomas trains,  which as you can
> imagine is quite an experience for a child.
>
> indeed, I still am a share holder of some of the stock of the butterly steam
>
> museum, because when it was threatened with closing it was privatized, and
> my parents bought me some shares because I'd got such a lot out of it (I
> still remember my mum trying to explain to me at the age of four what owning
>
> shares in a company meant).
>
> So yes, thomas has been around for a good long while, it's just such a shame
>
> that it's completely lost it's realism, - not to mention Ringo star of
> coourse, who for me is as much a part of Thomas as any of the engines :D.
>
> all the best,
>
> Dark.

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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Matthew Shifrin]

A family friend of who is fluen in braille, brailed some of the less
popular games such as Wise and Otherwise, Origin of Expressions, and
Bonkers. I don't know of any places to get the more unconventional
games, but as others have said, you could braille up the cards, or if
the braille doesn't fit, you could braille sheets with questions and
answers that corresponde to the cards in print, like I did in Wit's
End.
I don't get to play them much with school and all, but it would be
nice to take a day and play through all the game i have, just wishful
thinking though.
Matthew

On 6/9/12, dark  wrote:
> Funny you should mention thomas the tank engine board games Tom, sinse one
> of my earlier childhood memories when I was learning braille was my mum
> labeling a Thomas board game for me,  basically a roll the dice to reach
>
> the end type of game with a few special squares.
>
> I must have been about 3 or 4 at the time, and played the game with my mum
> and sometimes friends until it fell to bits :D.
>
> Not that there shold! have been an accessible version, much as I had a bit
> of a craze on Thomas and trains when I was little (I own the hole set of
> original, metal 1980's trains, which are probably now worth quite a lot of
> money), though perhaps a service helping parents braille those sorts of
> games for blind children would be a good thing. luckily my mum could do it
> herself, but obviously not everyone has a mother who also reads braille
> (Indeed my mum pretty much taught me braille for the first year of school
> because the councel couldn't find a teacher).
>
> Beware the grue!
>
> dark.
> - Original Message -
> From: "Thomas Ward" 
> To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
> Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2012 6:13 PM
> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers
>
>
>> Hi Jim,
>>
>> That would be a good question for the rehab centers that sell the
>> games. Perhaps contacting someone like the Cleveland Sight Center
>> since they have a lot of those games in their Ideas Shop. I never
>> really thought about that question much until this subject came up,
>> and now I'd really like to know if it is the manufacturer or the rehab
>> centers themselves that decides which games are to be made accessible.
>>
>> Certainly some games like Monopoly are a given. It seems to be a game
>> that everyone plays, just about every family owns, and is very
>> popular. Something like the Thomas and Friends board game is designed
>> for small kids, and wouldn't be too popular with adults.Therefore it
>> might make sense why that game wouldn't be made accessible because
>> the majority of people with vision related issues are over 60 where
>> Thomas and Friends is for kids ages 3 to 6.
>>
>> Cheers!
>>
>>
>> On 6/8/12, Jim Kitchen  wrote:
>>> Hi Charles and all,
>>>
>>> I am curious, who decides what games to make accessible.  I mean is it
>>> the
>>> original manufactures of the games, or do some of the blind
>>> organizations
>>> get together and commission for the games to be made accessible or what?
>>> And then who does set the price of them?
>>>
>>> BFN
>>>
>>>  Jim
>>>
>>> If Walmart is lowering prices every day, how come nothing is free yet?
>>>
>>> j...@kitchensinc.net
>>> http://www.kitchensinc.net
>>> (440) 286-6920
>>> Chardon Ohio USA
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>>> list,
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>>>
>>
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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Ben]

Completely agree with you about ringo dark.  I still remember watching that
show too :d

not just that, i actually had some of those on mini disc... :d

-Original Message-
From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On
Behalf Of dark
Sent: 10 June 2012 08:32
To: Gamers Discussion list
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

Hi Tom.

Actually the original thomas books were written by Reverend Raymand audry a 
vicar who was also a railway inthusiast in the late 60's, using trains from 
his model rail way and the rules of the actual 1932 south eastern British 
rail company that existed at the time.

it was first created in  book form in the very early 80's, with the original

series, (still based on Reverend Audry's books), narated by Ringo star from 
the beatles.

Then of course, like everything else, The series got taken up by the big 
cooperations who demanded more books than were written, and started writing 
their own episodes in a third series originally started in the late 1990's, 
first with Michael angeleis as narator, then with other naraters going on to

peers brosnan.

One of the sad things, is that Audry himself fell out severely with the 
company who licensed thomas, when their stories started losing all the 
historical background. For instance, one story "henry's forest" involved 
Henry sitting around and looking at the forest mid trip, but Audry stated 
(quite rightly), that this would not be possible under  the behaviour of a 
steam train at that time. This was why the name was changed to "thomas and 
friends" rather than the original "thomas the tank engine" as it had been in

the early 80's, when still based on audry's work.

That was really the thing about the original Thomas, it was hugely 
historically based. Each of the engines is modeled on a real make of 
locomotive,  Percy for instance is a welsh saddle tanker, and it is 
distinctly set in a period of pre second world war british history, just at 
the end of the use of steam trains, when the country still had it's very 
large railway companies (actually one of the best examples of companies I've

ever seen).

My mum often says it was Thomas that stopped me being autistic. i'd been 
extremely ill when I was 1-3 due to birth complications, and was apparently 
losing a lot of interest in things, until! I was introduced to Thomas. Our 
local rail preservation society even had thomas days when they'd dress up an

actual steam engine as one of the Thomas trains,  which as you can 
imagine is quite an experience for a child.

indeed, I still am a share holder of some of the stock of the butterly steam

museum, because when it was threatened with closing it was privatized, and 
my parents bought me some shares because I'd got such a lot out of it (I 
still remember my mum trying to explain to me at the age of four what owning

shares in a company meant).

So yes, thomas has been around for a good long while, it's just such a shame

that it's completely lost it's realism, - not to mention Ringo star of 
coourse, who for me is as much a part of Thomas as any of the engines :D.

all the best,

Dark. 


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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[dark]

Hi Tom.

Actually the original thomas books were written by Reverend Raymand audry a 
vicar who was also a railway inthusiast in the late 60's, using trains from 
his model rail way and the rules of the actual 1932 south eastern British 
rail company that existed at the time.


it was first created in  book form in the very early 80's, with the original 
series, (still based on Reverend Audry's books), narated by Ringo star from 
the beatles.


Then of course, like everything else, The series got taken up by the big 
cooperations who demanded more books than were written, and started writing 
their own episodes in a third series originally started in the late 1990's, 
first with Michael angeleis as narator, then with other naraters going on to 
peers brosnan.


One of the sad things, is that Audry himself fell out severely with the 
company who licensed thomas, when their stories started losing all the 
historical background. For instance, one story "henry's forest" involved 
Henry sitting around and looking at the forest mid trip, but Audry stated 
(quite rightly), that this would not be possible under  the behaviour of a 
steam train at that time. This was why the name was changed to "thomas and 
friends" rather than the original "thomas the tank engine" as it had been in 
the early 80's, when still based on audry's work.


That was really the thing about the original Thomas, it was hugely 
historically based. Each of the engines is modeled on a real make of 
locomotive,  Percy for instance is a welsh saddle tanker, and it is 
distinctly set in a period of pre second world war british history, just at 
the end of the use of steam trains, when the country still had it's very 
large railway companies (actually one of the best examples of companies I've 
ever seen).


My mum often says it was Thomas that stopped me being autistic. i'd been 
extremely ill when I was 1-3 due to birth complications, and was apparently 
losing a lot of interest in things, until! I was introduced to Thomas. Our 
local rail preservation society even had thomas days when they'd dress up an 
actual steam engine as one of the Thomas trains,  which as you can 
imagine is quite an experience for a child.


indeed, I still am a share holder of some of the stock of the butterly steam 
museum, because when it was threatened with closing it was privatized, and 
my parents bought me some shares because I'd got such a lot out of it (I 
still remember my mum trying to explain to me at the age of four what owning 
shares in a company meant).


So yes, thomas has been around for a good long while, it's just such a shame 
that it's completely lost it's realism, - not to mention Ringo star of 
coourse, who for me is as much a part of Thomas as any of the engines :D.


all the best,

Dark. 



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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[dark]

Hi tom.

I have actually said before the Us services and a certain amount of their 
attitudes are better.


While there are individual brailling or reading services for the rnib, the 
price for them is prohibitively expensive, and the time taken is ridiculous. 
For instance, when i was doing my disertation, before I'd sorted the hole 
digital recorder routine, we got a book read onto cd by the rnib that it 
would need. It however cost about 200 pounds to have this done which was 
paid out of my readers' grant (that's about 300 usd), and furthermore, they 
refused to put it into the main library, meaning that if someone else asked 
them tomorrow for the same book they'd get charged the same fee. That to me 
is not! the behaviour of a charity.


And getting items brailled is even worse, though luckily I can fix that 
myself. To be honest, the Rnib are so damnably useless given their view of 
blind people, these days my approach personally is to have as little to do 
with them as possible, and either do things myself (these days I manage my 
own readers' grant paying for assistance which works far better and in fact 
cheaper, plus can read dynamically according to what I need done at the 
time), concentrate on smaller, but better agencies like guide dog services, 
who naturally deal with a more flexible view of the capabilities of blind 
people, for example I've already mentioned the rather extreme guide dog 
holidays group.
the only sad thing is they don't get the government or public funding the 
Rnib does.


Beware the grue!

Dark.



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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[bpeterson2000]

Oh they've been in the states since at least the nineties. I remember my 
sister babysat a kid who was obsessed with those cartoons.




Life, don't talk to me about life.
-Original Message- 
From: Thomas Ward

Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2012 7:24 PM
To: Gamers Discussion list
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

Hi Dark,

Interesting. I didn't even know Thomas was that old. Perhaps it hadn't
been imported to the States until later, but the first I heard of the
Thomas cartoons and toys was in 2004 when my son Sean was born. Before
that I had never heard of it.

In any case the game my son Sean has is like Shoots and Ladders. There
are four cardboard trains, and the board is 100 squares of tracks.
There is a spinner you spin to move and some tracks go up, to the next
level of tracks and others lead back to start.It is a pretty cute
game, but  as I said in my prior post it is designed for a 3 to 6 year
old child so is pretty simplistic as games goes. Although, It would be
kind of cool as an audio game.

Cheers!


On 6/9/12, dark  wrote:

Funny you should mention thomas the tank engine board games Tom, sinse one
of my earlier childhood memories when I was learning braille was my mum
labeling a Thomas board game for me,  basically a roll the dice to 
reach


the end type of game with a few special squares.

I must have been about 3 or 4 at the time, and played the game with my mum
and sometimes friends until it fell to bits :D.

Not that there shold! have been an accessible version, much as I had a bit
of a craze on Thomas and trains when I was little (I own the hole set of
original, metal 1980's trains, which are probably now worth quite a lot of
money), though perhaps a service helping parents braille those sorts of
games for blind children would be a good thing. luckily my mum could do it
herself, but obviously not everyone has a mother who also reads braille
(Indeed my mum pretty much taught me braille for the first year of school
because the councel couldn't find a teacher).

Beware the grue!

dark.


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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,

Interesting. I didn't even know Thomas was that old. Perhaps it hadn't
been imported to the States until later, but the first I heard of the
Thomas cartoons and toys was in 2004 when my son Sean was born. Before
that I had never heard of it.

In any case the game my son Sean has is like Shoots and Ladders. There
are four cardboard trains, and the board is 100 squares of tracks.
There is a spinner you spin to move and some tracks go up, to the next
level of tracks and others lead back to start.It is a pretty cute
game, but  as I said in my prior post it is designed for a 3 to 6 year
old child so is pretty simplistic as games goes. Although, It would be
kind of cool as an audio game.

Cheers!


On 6/9/12, dark  wrote:
> Funny you should mention thomas the tank engine board games Tom, sinse one
> of my earlier childhood memories when I was learning braille was my mum
> labeling a Thomas board game for me,  basically a roll the dice to reach
>
> the end type of game with a few special squares.
>
> I must have been about 3 or 4 at the time, and played the game with my mum
> and sometimes friends until it fell to bits :D.
>
> Not that there shold! have been an accessible version, much as I had a bit
> of a craze on Thomas and trains when I was little (I own the hole set of
> original, metal 1980's trains, which are probably now worth quite a lot of
> money), though perhaps a service helping parents braille those sorts of
> games for blind children would be a good thing. luckily my mum could do it
> herself, but obviously not everyone has a mother who also reads braille
> (Indeed my mum pretty much taught me braille for the first year of school
> because the councel couldn't find a teacher).
>
> Beware the grue!
>
> dark.

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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,

Well, I think we all know by now that RNIB are run by bureaucrats who
do nothing else but push their own limited view of blindness on
everyone else, and because the younger generation such as yourself are
out numbered by elderly members you'll have to wait until your
generation is old enough to have elderly status and perhaps by then
the RNIB will listen.

Fortunately, here in the United States are a bit better simply because
of laws like the ADA. Just because the Learning Alley, National
Library Service, APH, or some other agency might think a certain book
or genre would be of no interest to their clients doesn't give them
the excuse to not make it accessible. The ADA is clear that all
printed material must be made accessible on demand which is a powerful
law in our favor. As a result it is usually possible to get best
sellers, regardless of genre, with in a year of publication on audio
tape, in text format, or some other accessible format.

/Getting back to games though we have another asset which you don't
have. Because there is no single agency or rehab center that deals
with the blind chances are good that a blind person can call up their
local rehab center and get what they need. If it is a board game for a
small fee the local rehab center might be willing to braille label the
board for you, and since its on your dime they can hardly refuse.
After all, that's basically what they are there fore to assist you in
any way they can.

So perhaps its your approach to the RNIB that might have to change.
What if you told them you would pay them a certain amount to have this
or that brailled etc?

Cheers!


On 6/9/12, dark  wrote:
> Hi Tom.
>
> what frustrates me is when I discussed with the rnib some other leasure
> activities, i was stone walled. I suggested that they create tactile rp dice
>
> for instance, as well as accessible versions of tabletop rp manuals because
>
> rp is such an accessible activity that blind people could participate in
> equally with sighted people, and was freely told "Our members aren't
> interested in that"
>
> ditto when i attempted to get the rnib to make accessible gamebooks, and
> ditto with any other board game.
>
> then again i shouldn't be surprised, sinse even when it comes to making
> books accessible that aren't aimed at older generations, ie, aren't crime,
> thriller or romance the rnib gave me the constant run around, even when i
> offered to travel down to London and sit on their book selection committee,
>
> to help them finish the series that they'd started and never finished in sf
>
> and fantasy. Needless to say they told me to get lost, in fact they just
> told me to submit reader requests, and when I pointed out to them that I'd
> been submitting reader requests sinse the age of 7, and only ever seen one
> get filledd, (which wasn't actually an sf or fantasy novel but steven King's
>
> horror novel it), they put the phone down on me.
>
> So, getting them to produce any accessible game is a none starter I think
> unless you could show how people over 60 would like it,  heck they even
>
> stopped producing large, coloured tactile maps of the world for schools.
>
> Beware the grue!
>
> Dark.

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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[dark]

Funny you should mention thomas the tank engine board games Tom, sinse one 
of my earlier childhood memories when I was learning braille was my mum 
labeling a Thomas board game for me,  basically a roll the dice to reach 
the end type of game with a few special squares.


I must have been about 3 or 4 at the time, and played the game with my mum 
and sometimes friends until it fell to bits :D.


Not that there shold! have been an accessible version, much as I had a bit 
of a craze on Thomas and trains when I was little (I own the hole set of 
original, metal 1980's trains, which are probably now worth quite a lot of 
money), though perhaps a service helping parents braille those sorts of 
games for blind children would be a good thing. luckily my mum could do it 
herself, but obviously not everyone has a mother who also reads braille 
(Indeed my mum pretty much taught me braille for the first year of school 
because the councel couldn't find a teacher).


Beware the grue!

dark.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" 

To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Saturday, June 09, 2012 6:13 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers



Hi Jim,

That would be a good question for the rehab centers that sell the
games. Perhaps contacting someone like the Cleveland Sight Center
since they have a lot of those games in their Ideas Shop. I never
really thought about that question much until this subject came up,
and now I'd really like to know if it is the manufacturer or the rehab
centers themselves that decides which games are to be made accessible.

Certainly some games like Monopoly are a given. It seems to be a game
that everyone plays, just about every family owns, and is very
popular. Something like the Thomas and Friends board game is designed
for small kids, and wouldn't be too popular with adults.Therefore it
might make sense why that game wouldn't be made accessible because
the majority of people with vision related issues are over 60 where
Thomas and Friends is for kids ages 3 to 6.

Cheers!


On 6/8/12, Jim Kitchen  wrote:

Hi Charles and all,

I am curious, who decides what games to make accessible.  I mean is it 
the

original manufactures of the games, or do some of the blind organizations
get together and commission for the games to be made accessible or what?
And then who does set the price of them?

BFN

 Jim

If Walmart is lowering prices every day, how come nothing is free yet?

j...@kitchensinc.net
http://www.kitchensinc.net
(440) 286-6920
Chardon Ohio USA
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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[dark]

Hi Tom.

what frustrates me is when I discussed with the rnib some other leasure 
activities, i was stone walled. I suggested that they create tactile rp dice 
for instance, as well as accessible versions of tabletop rp manuals because 
rp is such an accessible activity that blind people could participate in 
equally with sighted people, and was freely told "Our members aren't 
interested in that"


ditto when i attempted to get the rnib to make accessible gamebooks, and 
ditto with any other board game.


then again i shouldn't be surprised, sinse even when it comes to making 
books accessible that aren't aimed at older generations, ie, aren't crime, 
thriller or romance the rnib gave me the constant run around, even when i 
offered to travel down to London and sit on their book selection committee, 
to help them finish the series that they'd started and never finished in sf 
and fantasy. Needless to say they told me to get lost, in fact they just 
told me to submit reader requests, and when I pointed out to them that I'd 
been submitting reader requests sinse the age of 7, and only ever seen one 
get filledd, (which wasn't actually an sf or fantasy novel but steven King's 
horror novel it), they put the phone down on me.


So, getting them to produce any accessible game is a none starter I think 
unless you could show how people over 60 would like it,  heck they even 
stopped producing large, coloured tactile maps of the world for schools.


Beware the grue!

Dark. 



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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Jim,

That would be a good question for the rehab centers that sell the
games. Perhaps contacting someone like the Cleveland Sight Center
since they have a lot of those games in their Ideas Shop. I never
really thought about that question much until this subject came up,
and now I'd really like to know if it is the manufacturer or the rehab
centers themselves that decides which games are to be made accessible.

Certainly some games like Monopoly are a given. It seems to be a game
that everyone plays, just about every family owns, and is very
popular. Something like the Thomas and Friends board game is designed
for small kids, and wouldn't be too popular with adults.Therefore it
might make sense why that game wouldn't be made accessible because
the majority of people with vision related issues are over 60 where
Thomas and Friends is for kids ages 3 to 6.

Cheers!


On 6/8/12, Jim Kitchen  wrote:
> Hi Charles and all,
>
> I am curious, who decides what games to make accessible.  I mean is it the
> original manufactures of the games, or do some of the blind organizations
> get together and commission for the games to be made accessible or what?
> And then who does set the price of them?
>
> BFN
>
>  Jim
>
> If Walmart is lowering prices every day, how come nothing is free yet?
>
> j...@kitchensinc.net
> http://www.kitchensinc.net
> (440) 286-6920
> Chardon Ohio USA
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> http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org.
> If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list,
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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,

Well, unfortunately the situation with accessible card and board games
isn't that much different here in the United States. I haven't checked
a catalog in a while but it is generally the basics like Monopoly
Chess, Uno, Scrabble, Bingo, and your all purpose standarddeck of
playing cards. You won't find anything like Jeopardy, Mad Gab, Clue,
Trouble, or Risk even though there really isn't much to making most of
those games accessible.

For example, lets take Trouble here. There are plastic pegs on the
board you set the little pieces on so a blind person can count them to
find out how many squares to move. The plastic popper in the center of
the board isn't accessible but that can easily be fixed by a single
braille set of dice. As for the playing pieces a little braille label
tape with the letter r for red, letter y for yellow, g for green, and
b for blue stuck to the back of the pieces is more than enough to tell
them apart. Yet of course there is no such accessible set for sale,
and it is up to us to modify a standard set if we want to play that
particular game.

I don't really know how much say the rehab agencies have in
determining what games are made accessible, but the variety of games
have been consistent for as long as I can remember. I remember when I
first began losing my sight looking in the catalogs and feeling like
we were being excluded from games because nobody produced many of the
games I played as a kid or young teen.

Cheers!


On 6/8/12, dark  wrote:
> As I understand it, in this country it's the rnib who pretty much rule
> everything with an iron fist.
>
> They commission someone to make the accessible versions of the games, get
> the copywrites, and then distribute them themselves, and sinse the
> government agencies will always put newly blind people or families with
> blind children in touch with the rnib, that really is how they will sell
> stuff.
>
> In fairness I can't complain about the prices. My tactile backgammon board
> was 18 pounds, that's around 25 dollars, however this does mean that the
> only games that get made accessible are the games which the Rnib themselves
>
> aproves of for blind people, which means only games really aimed at eldily
> people, or very occasionally, young  children.
>
> heck, even well known games like life or cludo (what is called clue in the
> states), dont' have an accessible form.
>
> As I said, all the rnib does are packs of braille uno and standard cards,
> tactile dominoes, backgammon, chess, snakes and ladders, monopoly, the peg
> five in a row game,  and ludo.
>
> Beware the Grue!
>
> dark.

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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[dark]

As I understand it, in this country it's the rnib who pretty much rule 
everything with an iron fist.


They commission someone to make the accessible versions of the games, get 
the copywrites, and then distribute them themselves, and sinse the 
government agencies will always put newly blind people or families with 
blind children in touch with the rnib, that really is how they will sell 
stuff.


In fairness I can't complain about the prices. My tactile backgammon board 
was 18 pounds, that's around 25 dollars, however this does mean that the 
only games that get made accessible are the games which the Rnib themselves 
aproves of for blind people, which means only games really aimed at eldily 
people, or very occasionally, young  children.


heck, even well known games like life or cludo (what is called clue in the 
states), dont' have an accessible form.


As I said, all the rnib does are packs of braille uno and standard cards, 
tactile dominoes, backgammon, chess, snakes and ladders, monopoly, the peg 
five in a row game,  and ludo.


Beware the Grue!

dark.
- Original Message - 
From: "Jim Kitchen" 

To: "Charles Rivard" 
Sent: Friday, June 08, 2012 10:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers



Hi Charles and all,

I am curious, who decides what games to make accessible.  I mean is it the 
original manufactures of the games, or do some of the blind organizations 
get together and commission for the games to be made accessible or what? 
And then who does set the price of them?


BFN

Jim

If Walmart is lowering prices every day, how come nothing is free yet?

j...@kitchensinc.net
http://www.kitchensinc.net
(440) 286-6920
Chardon Ohio USA
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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Jim Kitchen]

Hi Charles and all,

I am curious, who decides what games to make accessible.  I mean is it the 
original manufactures of the games, or do some of the blind organizations get 
together and commission for the games to be made accessible or what?  And then 
who does set the price of them?

BFN

Jim

If Walmart is lowering prices every day, how come nothing is free yet?

j...@kitchensinc.net
http://www.kitchensinc.net
(440) 286-6920
Chardon Ohio USA
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Re: [Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Charles,

Definitely much less. I think a standard version of Monopoly goes for
$20 and sometimes cost a little more if it is a promotional version. I
once saw a Monopoly set for $40, but what made it so expensive is that
it was electronic. What I mean by that is you could put batteries in
the board and when you set the houses on the board they would light up
like a little town or city which was pretty cool. However, no
mainstream copy of Monopoly ever costs $75 unless it is a rare
collectors edition. Otherwise figure $20 to $30 range on average.

Scrabble costs even less. i think the last time I was looking at games
at Wal-Mart Scrabble was only like $12. Its not very expensive at all.
For the price the accessible versions cost its cheaper to buy the
basic Scrabble game and just slap braille labels on the
pieces. Which is what i do most of the time anyway.

For example, I have several different versions of Monopoly. Most of
them have special movie or show themes so are slightly different from
the basic versions. I have the Star Wars Monopoly game where you have
little tokens of Luke, Han, Chewie, etc and instead of houses you have
x-wings and tie fighters. I have the Lord of the Rings set with
minature tokens of the main characters, and instead of houses you
build towers and fortresses. The Star Trek: Next Generation set is
really unique because its basically a huge map of the Enterprise and
you go around buying up pieces of the Enterprise. How's that for
strange?

Anyway, since I know i can't buy accessible versions of those games I
just buy them and braille them myself. Its no big deal to take a sheet
of braille label, write up a list of the properties, and have my wife
stick them on the board. Brailling the cards, money, etc is also
pretty easy. it is time consuming, but otherwise fairly straight
forward.

Cheers!


On 6/8/12, Charles Rivard  wrote:
> Now if the board games that are produced were less expensive!  $75 for a
> Monopoly set?  $60 or so for Scrabble?  How much does a game of similar
> quality cost for sighted gamers?
>
> ---
> Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second.

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[Audyssey] board games for the blind - Re: Accessible Checkers

[Charles Rivard]

Now if the board games that are produced were less expensive!  $75 for a 
Monopoly set?  $60 or so for Scrabble?  How much does a game of similar 
quality cost for sighted gamers?


---
Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" 

To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Friday, June 08, 2012 7:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Accessible Checkers



Hi Jim,

Well, I'm not a kid myself, but I do play a lot of board games. I've
several board games that simply are not available from the blind rehab
centers and I think would be enjoyable if they were made accessible.

For example, I've got this one game made in the 80's or 90's called
Hotels. Its similar to Monopoly where you go around the board buying
up properties and then building luxury hotels.  You'd have the Grand
Hotel from Vegas, the Fuji Hotel from Japan, and several others like
that. You'd begin with buying the property, building the main
buildings, adding a swimming pool, and the more complete your hotel is
the more expensive it is to rent. Your goal is to drive all the other
hotel owners out of business. :D

Another game I like is Risk. The board is divided up into six
continents and 42 territories. You can play up to six players and each
player commands an army. If playing mission risk each player gets a
mission card and if they complete their mission before anyone else
they win. If playing domination risk the goal is simply to beat the
opposing armies or make alliances so that the player is in control of
all 42 territories. In either case it is a strategy game were you plan
battles and figure out how to outsmart your opponents.

I have another game called Dark World. It is basically an adventure
game with a big plastic castle, cardboard walls and doors, several
monsters, and four hero tokens. Basically, the player picks a hero
token and attempts to get through the castle killing mummies, orcs,
ogres, skeletons, and goblins.Along the way he or she will find magic
items like enchanted swords, healing potions, magic shoes that will
give them an extra turn, etc. Eventually, they will make it to the
thrown room where they must challenge the snake king. That is probably
one of my favorite games, but I've had to do a lot to make that game
accessible.

Fact of the matter is I probably could go on and on about the games I
own or have played. There is a lot of them that I've enjoyed over the
years and of course aren't made accessible. Either the game didn't
last long such as the Hotels game which I don't believe is sold any
more, or its a promotional game like Star Wars Monopoly, Star Wars
Risk,   Pirates of the Caribbean Life, and so on that is available for
a year or so and is discontinued. Other games such as Mad Gab is a fun
party game, I see no reason why it couldn't be made accessible if the
cards were brailled,  but nobody seems to have taken an interest in
producing a braille and large print version.

In any case my over all point was there is a lot more card and board
games out there on the market that rehab centers simply do not carry
in accessible form. You can go to any Toys R Us, Wal-Mart, or K-Mart,
and there is at least 30 different board and card games on the shelf
at any given time. You open a catalog for the blind and there is five
or six selections. Maybe 10 if you are lucky.

Cheers!


On 6/8/12, Jim Kitchen  wrote:

 Mahjong
Hi Thomas,

It's been so long since I was a kid that I don't even know what games you
would like to see made accessible.  The only game that I have that I put
Braille on is Up Words.  I like it better than Scrabble even though it is
similar.  I of course have decks of cards and have seen dominos, 
checkers,
chess and monopoly.  And there was this block of wood with I think 16 
pins.

It was like 3d connect 4.  Can't think of any others right now.

BFN

 Jim

As Leuis Braille said: stay in touch.

j...@kitchensinc.net
http://www.kitchensinc.net
(440) 286-6920
Chardon Ohio USA
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Re: [Audyssey] Board games in braille

[Dakotah Rickard]

Be aware: the board does not fold up, at last check, and it's huge!

On 11/9/07, Greg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hello,
> Go to www.independentliving.com/ and I know for sure they have monopoly.
> Hope this helps Greg
> - Original Message -
> From: "Darren Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "'Gamers Discussion list'" 
> Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 3:57 PM
> Subject: [Audyssey] Board games in braille
>
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Does anybody know where I could obtain either pictionary in Braille or
> > Braille trivial pursuit? Or a braille monopoly where by the board folds
> > up? Who would sell such things. Am thinking of xmas presents you see.
> > Any ideas welcome.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> >
> > ---
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Re: [Audyssey] Board games in braille

[Greg]

Hello,
Go to www.independentliving.com/ and I know for sure they have monopoly.
Hope this helps Greg
- Original Message - 
From: "Darren Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'Gamers Discussion list'" 
Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 3:57 PM
Subject: [Audyssey] Board games in braille


> Hi all,
>
> Does anybody know where I could obtain either pictionary in Braille or
> Braille trivial pursuit? Or a braille monopoly where by the board folds
> up? Who would sell such things. Am thinking of xmas presents you see.
> Any ideas welcome.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> ---
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[Audyssey] Board games in braille

[Darren Harris]

Hi all, 

Does anybody know where I could obtain either pictionary in Braille or
Braille trivial pursuit? Or a braille monopoly where by the board folds
up? Who would sell such things. Am thinking of xmas presents you see.
Any ideas welcome.

Thanks.


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Dark]

Well thom.

I've never seen foot wide draughts pieces. but in skegness, there is an 
outdoor chess board which is about 10 foot wide, and you can wrent chess 
pieces to play on it which are about three feet high.

fortunately, they're not filled with lead, lol!

As my brother used to say, chess requires amazing amounts of strength, to 
pick up and move those castles! ;D.

Beware the Grue!

Dark.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games


> Hi,
> Oh,good grief. One foot checkers in diameter filled with led I would
> imagine those mothers would be fricken heavy as heck. Anyone know
> Hercules so he can lift the checkers for me?
>


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Charles Rivard]

It's known as working at having fun!
--
If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 4:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games


> Hi,
> Oh,good grief. One foot checkers in diameter filled with led I would
> imagine those mothers would be fricken heavy as heck. Anyone know
> Hercules so he can lift the checkers for me?
>
> Charles Rivard wrote:
>> To make it more awesome, fill the checkers with led to make them really
>> heavy.  This would add to the feeling of playing on a huge board.
>>
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

Hi,
Oh,good grief. One foot checkers in diameter filled with led I would 
imagine those mothers would be fricken heavy as heck. Anyone know 
Hercules so he can lift the checkers for me?

Charles Rivard wrote:
> To make it more awesome, fill the checkers with led to make them really 
> heavy.  This would add to the feeling of playing on a huge board.
>   


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Charles,
Lol! Ah, no I will pass on your dental work. 

Charles Rivard wrote:
> I know.  Modification would be very easy with my electric screwdriver/drill. 
> And all it would cost is the time to charge the battery.  While I'm thinking 
> of it, need any dental work done??  (evol grin)
>   


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Charles Rivard]

To make it more awesome, fill the checkers with led to make them really 
heavy.  This would add to the feeling of playing on a huge board.
--
If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 8:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games


> Hi Dark,
> Cool man! Just imagine what a living room piece that would make having a
> 5 foot tall Connect 4 game in your house. 
>
>
> Dark wrote:
>> Hi charles.
>>
>> the versions of connect four I've seen had red and yellow plastic 
>> counters,
>> with no tactile marking to distinguish them whatsoever, hence the 
>> drilling
>> practice to make the game completely accessible to totally blind players.
>>
>> A case of accidental accessibility I think, and where something as small 
>> as
>> a decoration can obviously make a large difference.
>>
>> On a mildly Ot note, once going to the tetly's beer historical 
>> museum, 
>> though I'm not a big beer drinker at all, the history was incredibly
>> interesting, there was a collection of popular pub games from various
>> periods which you could try. this included a five foot tall connect four
>> set, with foot wide playing pieces!
>>
>> My brother and I certainly had some fun with that one!
>>
>> Beware the Grue!
>>
>> Dark.
>>
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Charles Rivard]

I know.  Modification would be very easy with my electric screwdriver/drill. 
And all it would cost is the time to charge the battery.  While I'm thinking 
of it, need any dental work done??  (evol grin)
--
If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 8:23 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games


> Hi Charles,
> From what I can tell the Connect 4 sets you buy no longer have the
> stylised eagles and stars on them. However, if you want a set to be
> accessible it is easy enough to take a drill and drill the blasted holes
> in the tials to tell them apart.
>
>
> Charles Rivard wrote:
>> The game is made for the blind by drilling holes in one colored piece or 
>> the
>> other, I don't recall which, but I found it unnecessary, as the set I 
>> once
>> had contained all identical checkers.  One side was red and had a raised
>> star on it that could be easily felt when placed on the board.  The black
>> side had an eagle on it which could also be easily recognized.  No
>> modification to the game was needed.  The design may have been changed 
>> since
>> then, but it was cool to find a game that needed no modification, and 
>> this
>> was back in the late sixties or early seventies.  The game designed for, 
>> and
>> sold to, the blind was, of course, like all such products, far more 
>> costly.
>> I think it was at least double the price.
>>
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,
Interesting. We have regional language changes here as well in 
terminology. For example in Ohio we will ask for a glass of pop. In 
other places in the US the same thing is called a soda, a coke, a soft 
drink, and it all depends on where you are from in the US. In fact, in 
some places people say soda as sodi.
Anyway, given the evidents of a drafts board from the 1600's it is 
possible drafts is an older name for checkers. I'll look up the history 
and see if I can track down the diference in name change.


Dark wrote:
> Hi tom.
>
> There are actually many differences betwene us and Uk english in 
> general,  and not just in words used, but also in some forms of grammar 
> as well.
>
> I once tried to write a story completely in us English, and was amazed at 
> the amount of stuff I needed to change in my usual vocabulary,  Eg, 
> using "in back" where I would normally use "behind"
>
> And that's even before we get into specifically regional phrasiology. where 
> I originally come from in the Midlands for example, nearly any sort of sweet 
> is referred to as a tuffy.
>
> to get on to Checkers vs Draughts though, well a quick checkers of Wikipedia 
> (hahaha,), didn't turn up any useful info annoyingly about the name change, 
> though apparently draughts boards from the 16th century have been found, so 
> I wonder if it's got a slightly older origen?
>
> the only other relevant fact that occurs to me (though it might be a 
> coincidence), is that Checkers court, usually just known as Checkers, is a 
> house in Aylesbury which is the Prime Minister's official country residence. 
> Or this could just be completely random!
>
> Beware the Grue!
>
> dark.
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,
Cool man! Just imagine what a living room piece that would make having a 
5 foot tall Connect 4 game in your house. 


Dark wrote:
> Hi charles.
>
> the versions of connect four I've seen had red and yellow plastic counters, 
> with no tactile marking to distinguish them whatsoever, hence the drilling 
> practice to make the game completely accessible to totally blind players.
>
> A case of accidental accessibility I think, and where something as small as 
> a decoration can obviously make a large difference.
>
> On a mildly Ot note, once going to the tetly's beer historical museum,   
> though I'm not a big beer drinker at all, the history was incredibly 
> interesting, there was a collection of popular pub games from various 
> periods which you could try. this included a five foot tall connect four 
> set, with foot wide playing pieces!
>
> My brother and I certainly had some fun with that one!
>
> Beware the Grue!
>
> Dark.
>   


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Charles,
 From what I can tell the Connect 4 sets you buy no longer have the 
stylised eagles and stars on them. However, if you want a set to be 
accessible it is easy enough to take a drill and drill the blasted holes 
in the tials to tell them apart.


Charles Rivard wrote:
> The game is made for the blind by drilling holes in one colored piece or the 
> other, I don't recall which, but I found it unnecessary, as the set I once 
> had contained all identical checkers.  One side was red and had a raised 
> star on it that could be easily felt when placed on the board.  The black 
> side had an eagle on it which could also be easily recognized.  No 
> modification to the game was needed.  The design may have been changed since 
> then, but it was cool to find a game that needed no modification, and this 
> was back in the late sixties or early seventies.  The game designed for, and 
> sold to, the blind was, of course, like all such products, far more costly. 
> I think it was at least double the price.
>   


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Dark]

Hi tom.

There are actually many differences betwene us and Uk english in 
general,  and not just in words used, but also in some forms of grammar 
as well.

I once tried to write a story completely in us English, and was amazed at 
the amount of stuff I needed to change in my usual vocabulary,  Eg, 
using "in back" where I would normally use "behind"

And that's even before we get into specifically regional phrasiology. where 
I originally come from in the Midlands for example, nearly any sort of sweet 
is referred to as a tuffy.

to get on to Checkers vs Draughts though, well a quick checkers of Wikipedia 
(hahaha,), didn't turn up any useful info annoyingly about the name change, 
though apparently draughts boards from the 16th century have been found, so 
I wonder if it's got a slightly older origen?

the only other relevant fact that occurs to me (though it might be a 
coincidence), is that Checkers court, usually just known as Checkers, is a 
house in Aylesbury which is the Prime Minister's official country residence. 
Or this could just be completely random!

Beware the Grue!

dark.


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Dark]

Hi charles.

the versions of connect four I've seen had red and yellow plastic counters, 
with no tactile marking to distinguish them whatsoever, hence the drilling 
practice to make the game completely accessible to totally blind players.

A case of accidental accessibility I think, and where something as small as 
a decoration can obviously make a large difference.

On a mildly Ot note, once going to the tetly's beer historical museum,   
though I'm not a big beer drinker at all, the history was incredibly 
interesting, there was a collection of popular pub games from various 
periods which you could try. this included a five foot tall connect four 
set, with foot wide playing pieces!

My brother and I certainly had some fun with that one!

Beware the Grue!

Dark.
- Original Message - 
From: "Charles Rivard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:23 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games


> The game is made for the blind by drilling holes in one colored piece or 
> the
> other, I don't recall which, but I found it unnecessary, as the set I once
> had contained all identical checkers.  One side was red and had a raised
> star on it that could be easily felt when placed on the board.  The black
> side had an eagle on it which could also be easily recognized.  No
> modification to the game was needed.  The design may have been changed 
> since
> then, but it was cool to find a game that needed no modification, and this
> was back in the late sixties or early seventies.  The game designed for, 
> and
> sold to, the blind was, of course, like all such products, far more 
> costly.
> I think it was at least double the price.
>
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 9:54 AM
> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games
>
>
>> Hi Charles,
>> Ah,I see. I really should pick up a Connect four game sometime and play
>> it with the family. I haven't owned the Connect 4 game since I was a kid.
>>
>>
>> Charles Rivard wrote:
>>> The board I had at one time was 6 high and 7 wide.
>>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Charles Rivard]

The game is made for the blind by drilling holes in one colored piece or the 
other, I don't recall which, but I found it unnecessary, as the set I once 
had contained all identical checkers.  One side was red and had a raised 
star on it that could be easily felt when placed on the board.  The black 
side had an eagle on it which could also be easily recognized.  No 
modification to the game was needed.  The design may have been changed since 
then, but it was cool to find a game that needed no modification, and this 
was back in the late sixties or early seventies.  The game designed for, and 
sold to, the blind was, of course, like all such products, far more costly. 
I think it was at least double the price.

- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 9:54 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games


> Hi Charles,
> Ah,I see. I really should pick up a Connect four game sometime and play
> it with the family. I haven't owned the Connect 4 game since I was a kid.
>
>
> Charles Rivard wrote:
>> The board I had at one time was 6 high and 7 wide.
>>
>
>
> ---
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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Charles,
Ah,I see. I really should pick up a Connect four game sometime and play 
it with the family. I haven't owned the Connect 4 game since I was a kid.


Charles Rivard wrote:
> The board I had at one time was 6 high and 7 wide.
>   


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

HiDark,
As you might have guessed already one of my passions is history, and 
that is why I know or find interest in such things as how this or that 
game got started. As you pointed out Candy Land is an all American 
creation, and terminology so that might explain why it hasn't caught on 
over seas.
Though, i noticed in your own posts even differences in the same games. 
For example you mentioned Snakes and Ladders. We have a game over here 
which is basically the same game but called Shoots and Ladders. They are 
very similar, but a bit different as well.
Then, there is Checkers. You guys call it Drafts, but is esentually the 
same game. I would be interested to note how the game got to be named 
something else in your part of the world, and Checkers here.
Cheers.




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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Charles Rivard]

The board I had at one time was 6 high and 7 wide.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 10:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] board games


> Hi Charles,
> Are you sure Connect 4 is  a 6 by 6 board? I thought it was 8 by 8.
> Though, I could be wrong on that point since I don't actually have the
> game on hand any more.
> Funny Bryan braught this subject up, because the other day I was
> mentioning to my wife we should get our son Sean some simple board games
> like Candy Land to get him introduced to playing with colors and doing
> color matching.
> I could easily braille up the board and ccards for myself since all the
> labels need to say is stuff like blue, red, green, yellow, castle, ice
> cream float, etc...
> For some reason that game always made me feel hungry. I had some strange
> psychosamatic smell of peppermint or the smell of gingerbread everytime
> while playing. Lol!
> Me thinks I am going to have to dig into the halloween candy after
> thinking of Candy Land. Dang that game, it always makes me think of food.
>
>
> Charles Rivard wrote:
>> Are you going to make these board games for manual use?, or for a PC.
>>
>> Connect Four is an easy game.  You have a vertical board with 7 slots at 
>> the
>> top.  These are columns of 6 holes each.  Two players take turns dropping 
>> a
>> checker down a slot.  One uses red ones, the other uses black.  The 
>> dropped
>> checker goes down as far as it can.  Checkers become stacked along the
>> columns.  The winner is the first one to line up 4 checkers in either a
>> vertical, horizontal or diagonal row.  In short, it's vertical tic tac 
>> toe,
>> needing 4 instead of 3 in a row.  HTH
>>
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Bryan Mckinnish]

Hi.
I was going to make them for pc.
Thanks for the instructions on connect 4.
Bryan Mckinnish

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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Dark]

Hmmm, interesting tale about the creation of candyland there tom.

Having both several friends who are insipient parents (though only one is 
actually beyond the planning stage), and having some fairly clear memories 
of myself being that age, not to mention my mum working as a children's 
physio therapist, I can most deffinately say yes, people in the Uk do play 
with their todlers!

I think though it's quite understandable that Candyland never got a release 
over here. Firstly, aand I assume most obviously, "Candy" is a very 
specifically american term. Here in England we'd generally refer to it as 
sweets,  or more specifically by type such as jellies or chocolate.

I also believe several Us sweets (and terms for them), are not used over 
here,  gummy for instance, in fact up until watching the simpsons I 
wasn't actually sure what gummies were.

For games i remember playing around that point,  well Certainly snakes 
and ladders, also beatle and a couple of games with similar rules. I also 
played a number of "get to the end" style board games, such as Ludo (which 
is apparently a slightly easier variation on Parcheesy), and games based on 
Tv series I was interested in, such as card games for The Mister men or 
thomas the tank engine, and a thomas the Tank board game.

another game I remember getting hours of fun out of was Dizzy dizzy 
dinosaur, which I'm guessing was available in the states.

then, my grandmar taught me to play quite a few card games when i was six or 
seven, such as 31's, rummy, two's (a game with similar rules to Uno or crazy 
eights), and even Cribbage.

My brother was (and stil is), a fairly amazing chess player, and started 
with draughts (checkers as it's called in the states I believe), at about 
age 5 or so.

Later on of course, when I was 9 or 10, we started playing games like 
monopoly, rat race, Yahtsi or an excelent game called compatibility.

so, I hope all this proves that people in the Uk vaguely do play with their 
todlers, even if companies like Hasbro don't release slightly more Us themed 
games over here.

there are probably some games we have overhere that aren't around in the Us 
as well.

Beware the Grue!

Dark. 


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,
Candy Land is one of our popular childrens games here in the USA. It was 
created in the 1940's by a woman named Eleanor Abbot. As I understand 
the legendary story the woman had suffered most of her life from the 
results of having had Polio so she had gone to work for a childrens 
hospital attending to sick children with Polio. Like all nice and caring 
people she created a simple board game she drew up on cardboard with a 
rainbow and candies on it and some wooden pieces from another game and 
invented Candy Land. In the late 40's she sold the game to Milton 
Bradly, now owned by Hazbro, and it sold like hot cakes with American 
moms and pops buying it for their children. It is the top selling 
childrens game of all time here in the U.S.
Which brings up an interesting point. I find it interesting that Candy 
Land is like the mega childs board game for kids ages 3 to 6 here in the 
USA, but you are from the U.K. and have never heard of the game. What 
games do you guys over in the U.K. play with your tottlers?


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Dark]

Hmmm, I've not even heard of the last two.

I could probably right up some instructions for connect 4, if you 
like, - though sinse the game requires both gravity and spacial memory, 
it might be rather strange running on a computer with speech commands.

but for info about any board game, I suggest the fount of all ineffable 
Wisdom that is Wikipedia. just go to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page 
type the name of whatever game you want info on into the search field, check 
the list of articals (there will probably be a fair few listed under trouble 
or candyland), and find the one that refers to the game.

I've had very good results looking up games on there in the past myself.

Hth.

Beware the Grue!

Dark.
- Original Message - 
From: "Bryan Mckinnish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 3:11 AM
Subject: [Audyssey] board games


> Hi everyone.
> I was thinking about making some board games like connect 4, candy land, 
> and maybe trouble.
> Does anyone know where I can get instructions for these games or is there 
> anyone that knows how to play any of these?
> Thanks
> Bryan Mckinnish
> ---
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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Charles,
Are you sure Connect 4 is  a 6 by 6 board? I thought it was 8 by 8. 
Though, I could be wrong on that point since I don't actually have the 
game on hand any more.
Funny Bryan braught this subject up, because the other day I was 
mentioning to my wife we should get our son Sean some simple board games 
like Candy Land to get him introduced to playing with colors and doing 
color matching.
I could easily braille up the board and ccards for myself since all the 
labels need to say is stuff like blue, red, green, yellow, castle, ice 
cream float, etc...
For some reason that game always made me feel hungry. I had some strange 
psychosamatic smell of peppermint or the smell of gingerbread everytime 
while playing. Lol!
Me thinks I am going to have to dig into the halloween candy after 
thinking of Candy Land. Dang that game, it always makes me think of food.


Charles Rivard wrote:
> Are you going to make these board games for manual use?, or for a PC.
>
> Connect Four is an easy game.  You have a vertical board with 7 slots at the 
> top.  These are columns of 6 holes each.  Two players take turns dropping a 
> checker down a slot.  One uses red ones, the other uses black.  The dropped 
> checker goes down as far as it can.  Checkers become stacked along the 
> columns.  The winner is the first one to line up 4 checkers in either a 
> vertical, horizontal or diagonal row.  In short, it's vertical tic tac toe, 
> needing 4 instead of 3 in a row.  HTH
>   


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Bryan,
The games you mentioned are actually quite easy to play. I don't have a 
copy of the rules in front of me, but I certainly could fill you in on 
basic game play since the games themselves aren't overly complicated.
Connect 4 is a very easy game to play with very simple rules. Basically 
you have a plastic game board that stands up vertically. On it there is 
8 columns of slots with 8 rows where you can place your game pieces. 
There are two colors of round game pieces. One player gets the red and 
the other plays black. The object of the game is to get 4 in a row 
either horizontally, vertically, or diagonally.
candy land is also a game with very simple rules. Basically, each player 
takes a little gingerbread man, and they must follow the rainbow path to 
the candy castle. Each player draws color coded cards which tells the 
player which color on the rainbow path to move to next red, blue, green, 
yellow, etc... Sometimes you will get a card that takes you to traps 
like the Molasses Swamp or the Ice Cream Floats. You will pass 
interesting places such as the peppermint stick forest or the gumdrop 
mountain.
If you really want to get a feel for the game you might want to pick up 
a real one at Wal-Mart and have a sighted person read the rules, and 
give you a square by square description of the board. The game is 
usually $12 to $14 at most U.S. Toy and game stores.
As for Trouble i haven't personally played it much but the basic idea is 
you have to get your pegs to the finish line before everyone else does. 
You roll the dice by pushing down the bubble in the center of the board 
and it rolls the dice. If you land on an aponents peg it goes back to 
start, and if they land on your peg you are bak to start and are in 
trouble. Some trouble games also have cards, and I am not certain how 
they work with the game.
Hth.


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Re: [Audyssey] board games

[Charles Rivard]

Are you going to make these board games for manual use?, or for a PC.

Connect Four is an easy game.  You have a vertical board with 7 slots at the 
top.  These are columns of 6 holes each.  Two players take turns dropping a 
checker down a slot.  One uses red ones, the other uses black.  The dropped 
checker goes down as far as it can.  Checkers become stacked along the 
columns.  The winner is the first one to line up 4 checkers in either a 
vertical, horizontal or diagonal row.  In short, it's vertical tic tac toe, 
needing 4 instead of 3 in a row.  HTH
- Original Message - 
From: "Bryan Mckinnish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 9:11 PM
Subject: [Audyssey] board games


> Hi everyone.
> I was thinking about making some board games like connect 4, candy land, 
> and maybe trouble.
> Does anyone know where I can get instructions for these games or is there 
> anyone that knows how to play any of these?
> Thanks
> Bryan Mckinnish
> ---
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[Audyssey] board games

[Bryan Mckinnish]

Hi everyone.
I was thinking about making some board games like connect 4, candy land, and 
maybe trouble.
Does anyone know where I can get instructions for these games or is there 
anyone that knows how to play any of these?
Thanks
Bryan Mckinnish
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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Lora,
I'd be very interrested in the list of territories and connecting 
territories for risk. It would come in handy if I ever decided to do a 
accessible version of risk.
You can send it to
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
if you want to.
Cheers.


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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Lora]

You don't really need a Braille version.  I've devised a way to play Risk
without a board at all, if only blind folks are playing.

If not, I've created a map.  I list each province, and every other province
it connects to.  When we're playing, you can either update the map with how
many of whose units are there, or just ask.  I have a good memory, so it's
not a problem.

The best games out there aren't Brailled, and probably never will be.

OK, backgammon is adapted, but I don't use the adapted boards, anyway.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Dark
Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 1:53 AM
To: Gamers Discussion list
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

Sinse there's never been a braille version, the only contact I've really had
with Risk has been the Red dwarf episode where Rimmer is telling a very
dramatic war story which turns out to be a game of risk.

Stil, looking at the Wikipedia artical it's deffinately a game I'd like to
try, -- though of course if someone could do the Lotr board game I
mentioned that'd be even better! smile!

Beware the Grue!

Dark.
- Original Message -
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 3:08 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello


> Hi,
> Yes, Trivial Pursuit is very easy to recreate using audio. Many board
> games are. Some can be difficult, but that one is pretty easy.
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,
yeah, the LOTR version of risk is really cool. You get to battle it out 
in Middle Earth, and command armies of Goblins, Orcs,  Elves, wizards, 
etc...
There is allot of different types of risk we could go with including 
World War II, classic, LOTR, Star Wars, and so on. Each is unique in 
it's own way.


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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Thomas Ward]

Hi,
I might, but as you said I am busy right now. It would be a couple of 
years before I could take on a Trivial Pursuit type game even though the 
game is rather simple.


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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Dark]

Sinse there's never been a braille version, the only contact I've really had 
with Risk has been the Red dwarf episode where Rimmer is telling a very 
dramatic war story which turns out to be a game of risk.

Stil, looking at the Wikipedia artical it's deffinately a game I'd like to 
try, -- though of course if someone could do the Lotr board game I 
mentioned that'd be even better! smile!

Beware the Grue!

Dark.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 3:08 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello


> Hi,
> Yes, Trivial Pursuit is very easy to recreate using audio. Many board
> games are. Some can be difficult, but that one is pretty easy.
>
>
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> any subscription changes via the web. 


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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Dark]

Hi thom.

while I do understand the reasons why the game was canceled, I can't pretend 
I'm not highly disappointed that Cq has been dropped entirely. the 
description of Cq was one of the things that first interested me in audio 
games, -- and encouraged me to try out Bsc's other games.

It's a shame that the developement couldn't have either been shared or 
passed on betwene different devs, -- as seems to have happened with the 
various Esp titles (not to mention Monti). Okay this might have meant a 
delay - maybe even a long one, but at least a game of some sort would've 
been there eventually.

Beware the Cq!

Dark.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2007 5:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello


> Hi Dark,
> Risk is pretty cool. For a description of it read my article on board
> games from the  Audysey mag an issue or two back.
>
>
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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Charles Rivard]

Now, that's interesting!  I thought it would be a lot of work inputting the 
questions.  Would you, or another developer consider trying it when, and I 
know it would be in the future cause you're, shall we say, just a bit?? busy 
right now?  Thanks.
--
If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2007 9:08 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello


> Hi,
> Yes, Trivial Pursuit is very easy to recreate using audio. Many board
> games are. Some can be difficult, but that one is pretty easy.
>
>
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> any subscription changes via the web.
> 



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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Thomas Ward]

Hi,
Yes, Trivial Pursuit is very easy to recreate using audio. Many board 
games are. Some can be difficult, but that one is pretty easy.


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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Mark,
It isn't so hard as the Risk board could be drawn with a 2D array. Most 
of it is very logically laid out.
However, there are several versions of Risk. is the classic Risk, 
Transformers Risk, Star Wars Clone Wars Risk, Star Wars Rebel VS Empire 
Risk, and a few other versions. Point is there is allot of ways of doing 
the game.


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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Mark Pemberton]

Hi Risk was my favourite board game when I could see to play them.  I 
imagine it would be quite a challenge to programme as the playing area is a 
world map.  A bit difficult to get an overview until you learnt the board 
and the breakdown of countries in there continents.  Still it would be on 
the top of my wish list.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2007 5:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello


> Hi Dark,
> Risk is pretty cool. For a description of it read my article on board
> games from the  Audysey mag an issue or two back.
>
>
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> any subscription changes via the web.
> 

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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[mark bishop]

could one of the deveolopers out there develop a trivial pursuit game.  I am 
guessing that this would be quite easy to create with audio?
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Friday, June 01, 2007 11:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello


> Hi Ian,
> Yeah, there have been many good board games that could be made
> accessible. Many of my favorites no longer appear on the store shelves.
> One of the cooler games that was out about 15 years ago was a Batman
> board game. You spun a wheel shaped like a bat and traveled around the
> board. you picked up mission cards, and got to move to certain places on
> the board like the bat cave, bank, Wane Manner, etc. I don't remember it
> all completely, but I do remember being able to battle the Joker,
> Riddler, Mr. Freeze, etc based on the mission card, and aposing players.
>
>
>
>
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>
> 



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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,
Risk is pretty cool. For a description of it read my article on board 
games from the  Audysey mag an issue or two back.


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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Dark]

Hi Lora.

I've never actually played Risk, but a stratogy style boardgame would be 
great sinse it would satisfy two of our gaming desires, - stratogy games 
and board games, however I'm not sure about how the programming for such a 
game would work.

the fantasy game certainly sounds great. tthere seems to have been a fair 
few releases like that in the 1980's, particularly tied to specific books or 
worlds, - there's apparently a boardgame based on Warlock of Firetop 
mountain, the very first Fighting fantasy adventure game book.

Of course, being a tolkeen fan, the game I'd love to play most is the Lotr 
stratogy game, which has both characters wandering around the board 
encountering various things, and large armies and military stratogy ala 
risk. It sounds great! and an accessible version, with or without computer 
opponents would be great!

I believe a fair few 1980's board games can be downloaded as Pdf's so that 
you can print out the board and cards and such,  unfortunately though, 
these aren't precisely accessible,  like the sited versions, unless 
you've got somebody to do the necessary reading of cards, board squares etc.

but for people specifically wanting a fantasy adventure style board game 
(including me), there's a quite interesting project underway over at 
Chronicals of Arborell  http://www.arborell.com/

this is a sort of cross betwene a card game and a gamebook. There are a 
number of cards that make up the dungeon, and a very large book of gamebook 
sections. The idea is that you put down a card and then look up certain 
things in the book - occasionally rowling on random encounter tables D&D 
style), you then put down another card (the cards have arrows), to represent 
another dungeon room, and so on. There is a quest to complete which requires 
you to collect certain items, but there are also some extre encounter tables 
and things so that you can just play the game as a randomly generating 
dungeon.

Obviously the only accessibility issue is the actual cards themselves, but 
I've had a discussion with the game creator, - who's been fairly 
fantastic as regards accessibility matters, and he's looking into producing 
an Html version of the cards, and using the Gma dice program to generate a 
number at random to tell you what card to pick (keeping a record of past 
cards in case you need to back track through the dungeon).

I'm not sure how much work has been done on the accessible html 
version,  the Gm's rewriting one of the Arborell gamebooks at the 
moment, but I certainly think it'll be fantastic when it's done.

In the mean time, I'd deffinately recommend checking out the gamebooks and 
novellas on the site, the Arborell world is really interesting and the Gm 
can certainly write.

I'll now run away before this turns into an advert.

Beware the Grue!

Dark. 


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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Lora]

I would love to see more board games developed.  Top of my list include:

Risk:  Yes, many of us are familiar with this game of world conquest.  I'd
love to play against the computer, or find ways to make it an Internet game,
and play with human opponents.

Ticket to Ride:  The goal of this game is to build trains all across the map
(there are currently three:  U.S., Europe, and Germany specifically).  It's
a lot of fun.

San Juan:  A resource building game, where you're trying to build the city
of San Juan.  You build buildings, factories and other resources that each
help you earn victory points.  Playing against the computer would be good,
but against other people is better.  San Juan is actually a card game, but
it's based on a board game called Puerto Rico.

Talisman:  A fantasy game where each player takes on the role of a character
with special abilities:  thief, warrior, prophetess, monk, etc.  You
navigate around the board, encountering adventures in the various spaces,
and drawing cards to encounter your foes, treasures and the like.
Originally released in the 1980's, with many expansions, the actual game
will be re-released this summer.

I'd love card games that I could play against others, such as hearts,
pinochle and the like.  There's a cool card game called Five Crowns, which
is an enhanced version of rummy.

There are also word games like Palabra and Quiddler which test your word
knowledge against that of your opponents.

OK, I've rambled enough for now.



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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Charles,
Seams to me the board game I had was more in line with the newer series 
of Batman movies that have been put out over the last 15 years or so. 
The Batman playing piece I always played with was black, but the game 
did offer the classic 1966 blue and gray Batman figure as well.



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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Charles Rivard]

A board game like this one that operates like Jim Kitchen's game of Life, or 
his Monopoly game  would be cool!  I was a big fan of the TV series of 
BatMan.

--
If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Friday, June 01, 2007 5:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello


> Hi Ian,
> Yeah, there have been many good board games that could be made
> accessible. Many of my favorites no longer appear on the store shelves.
> One of the cooler games that was out about 15 years ago was a Batman
> board game. You spun a wheel shaped like a bat and traveled around the
> board. you picked up mission cards, and got to move to certain places on
> the board like the bat cave, bank, Wane Manner, etc. I don't remember it
> all completely, but I do remember being able to battle the Joker,
> Riddler, Mr. Freeze, etc based on the mission card, and aposing players.
>
>
>
>
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> any subscription changes via the web.
> 



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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Ian,
Yeah, there have been many good board games that could be made 
accessible. Many of my favorites no longer appear on the store shelves.
One of the cooler games that was out about 15 years ago was a Batman 
board game. You spun a wheel shaped like a bat and traveled around the 
board. you picked up mission cards, and got to move to certain places on 
the board like the bat cave, bank, Wane Manner, etc. I don't remember it 
all completely, but I do remember being able to battle the Joker, 
Riddler, Mr. Freeze, etc based on the mission card, and aposing players.




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Re: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[ian and riggs]

yes i would like another bord game that would be grate. i am a fan of board 
games and love to play them. i had a board game called pay day wheir you had 
to do diffrent things and you disided how many months to play and their 
wheir diffrent things in it like lottary and stuff like that.

also their was another game called let's by holleywood wheir your aim was to 
get controle of four coumpanies. they wheir good games.

in my time i played loads of board games.

another game i liked was a talking board game. it was called castle of doom. 
you would press the dice button and it would tell you what space to move to 
and it would make sounds so you knew what was happening. you needed 
sightedpeople to help you move counters but other than that it was really 
accessable.
- Original Message - 
From: "Thomas Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" 
Sent: Friday, June 01, 2007 3:24 AM
Subject: [Audyssey] Board games was Hello


> Hi Dark,
> Yeah, there are allot of board games out there that work similar to the
> one we know and love. For example, there is a game called Hotels. It is
> like Monopoly but cooler in ways.
> In short, the Hotels game is where you go around the world building the
> biggest and best Hotels. As you improve them, expand them, etc you
> charge more and more. Your job is of course is to outbuild and drive
> your competition into bankrupcy.
> Of course I can imagine an even cooler idea where you buy and own famous
> Hotels rather than made up ones.
>
>> Fair enough Jim, I did wonder if something like that might be a pest to
>> program.
>>
>> Personally, I'd deffinately like to see another board game next, - I 
>> do
>> rather like game of life and monopoly, have played them on several 
>> occasions
>> against friends as well. It's particularly nice to have something like 
>> that
>> on computer and not need to keep a hulking great braille monopoly board
>> knocking around, and I don't ever think there's been a braille version of
>> the game of life at all!
>>
>> I believe there are several games around that use similar rules,   
>> some
>> of them i've played (with sombody reading cards etc.
>>
>> Two I particularly remember were the pyramid game, where you had to be 
>> first
>> to get a dead phairo's sarcophagus to the valley of the kings and build a
>> pyramid, and Ratrace, which was similar to monopoly, accept you had to 
>> buy
>> various status symbols from the other players in order to become a rich
>> upperclass snob (a rather sarcastic game).
>>
>> Well, that'd be my thoughts games wise, though I'm sure other people have
>> different ideas.
>>
>> Beware the Grue!
>>
>> Dark.
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "Jim Kitchen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "Dark" 
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:51 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Hello
>>
>>
>>
>>> Hi Dark,
>>>
>>> One problem with expanding the Monopoly board is that it would make all
>>> current board files no good.  And as you said the chance and community
>>> chest cards must have a certain format because of what they do money or
>>> piece movement wise.  Making it so that one could edit the tokens would 
>>> be
>>> possible, but truthfully I do not plan to do any more versions of
>>> Monopoly.
>>>
>>> I'm glad to hear that you like the idea for editable player files for
>>> baseball.  Thanks for saying so.
>>>
>>> I really do hope to work on something brand new after the new version of
>>> baseball.  Don't know what yet, but would like to work on something 
>>> brand
>>> new.
>>>
>>> BFN
>>>
>>> Jim
>>>
>>> All people smile in the same language.
>>>
>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>> http://www.kitchensinc.net
>>> (440) 286-6920
>>> Chardon Ohio USA
>>> ___
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>>> visit
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>>> any subscription changes via the web.
>>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>
>
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[Audyssey] Board games was Hello

[Thomas Ward]

Hi Dark,
Yeah, there are allot of board games out there that work similar to the 
one we know and love. For example, there is a game called Hotels. It is 
like Monopoly but cooler in ways.
In short, the Hotels game is where you go around the world building the 
biggest and best Hotels. As you improve them, expand them, etc you 
charge more and more. Your job is of course is to outbuild and drive 
your competition into bankrupcy.
Of course I can imagine an even cooler idea where you buy and own famous 
Hotels rather than made up ones.

> Fair enough Jim, I did wonder if something like that might be a pest to 
> program.
>
> Personally, I'd deffinately like to see another board game next, - I do 
> rather like game of life and monopoly, have played them on several occasions 
> against friends as well. It's particularly nice to have something like that 
> on computer and not need to keep a hulking great braille monopoly board 
> knocking around, and I don't ever think there's been a braille version of 
> the game of life at all!
>
> I believe there are several games around that use similar rules,  some 
> of them i've played (with sombody reading cards etc.
>
> Two I particularly remember were the pyramid game, where you had to be first 
> to get a dead phairo's sarcophagus to the valley of the kings and build a 
> pyramid, and Ratrace, which was similar to monopoly, accept you had to buy 
> various status symbols from the other players in order to become a rich 
> upperclass snob (a rather sarcastic game).
>
> Well, that'd be my thoughts games wise, though I'm sure other people have 
> different ideas.
>
> Beware the Grue!
>
> Dark.
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Jim Kitchen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Dark" 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:51 AM
> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Hello
>
>
>   
>> Hi Dark,
>>
>> One problem with expanding the Monopoly board is that it would make all 
>> current board files no good.  And as you said the chance and community 
>> chest cards must have a certain format because of what they do money or 
>> piece movement wise.  Making it so that one could edit the tokens would be 
>> possible, but truthfully I do not plan to do any more versions of 
>> Monopoly.
>>
>> I'm glad to hear that you like the idea for editable player files for 
>> baseball.  Thanks for saying so.
>>
>> I really do hope to work on something brand new after the new version of 
>> baseball.  Don't know what yet, but would like to work on something brand 
>> new.
>>
>> BFN
>>
>> Jim
>>
>> All people smile in the same language.
>>
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> http://www.kitchensinc.net
>> (440) 286-6920
>> Chardon Ohio USA
>> ___
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