Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hey Thomas, Yes, sorry. I've dragged this way off topic. Thanks for the offer of an off list chat. If you don't mind I'd love to ask you about a bunch of other things, too. It won't be until late tonight (Australia time) that I get a chance to write. Chat then. Thanks again. Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Hayden, I'll have to check Gournet out. It should be simple to code into any game, and it sounds like it would be vey helpful. As for the Braille Note talk, perhaps I'm confusing it with the braille output device she had. I remember her talking about a number of braille devices. I'll have to check sometime. Cheers, Neophyte. Hi Noeophyet, There are, as a natter of fact, games written in zcode that use the command "exits" for that information (see Gournet). As for Wake...did they really? I missed the Braille Note talk. Although, owning one I cansay theyare invaluable. Best Regards, Hayden --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Noeophyet, There are, as a natter of fact, games written in zcode that use the command "exits" for that information (see Gournet). As for Wake...did they really? I missed the Braille Note talk. Although, owning one I cansay theyare invaluable. Best Regards, Hayden -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of neoph...@inthecompanyofgrues.com Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 9:25 PM To: gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS Hi, Another all-in-one email. To Zachary. Thanks. I'll add that little bit of information to my expanding text document. Hopefully, soon, I'll work through everyone's advice and distill it down into some good set ups that work well on particular platforms. To Muhammed. I'll do some research on the Braille note before I chat to you, so I can get a better understanding. I believe it was talked about in the book I recently finished, called Wake. It's by science fiction author Robert Sawyer and features a blind girl as the protagonist. To Shaun. Sounds like you've got a great collection of old-school games there. There's something about the really old floppy disks that were around in the eighties and nineties that I still love. I wonder if, in thirty years time, people will get all nostalgic over CDs. Grins. To Dark. Awesome. Thanks so much. That's given me a good understanding of some of the features that are missing from Winfrotz TTS. Your reply to Michael was great, too. Laughs. Don't worry. Pretty much all of the frustrations you talk about with interactive fiction is there for sighted players, as well. So many games have tripped me up just because I couldn't get the right syntax or didn't understand the author's logic. In my opinion, that's often largely the fault of the author. In both replies you mentioned text based game books. What exactly are you referring to there? I've downloaded a copy of fallthru. Hopefully, on the weekend, I'll get to play some of it. I played a bit more of the IF comp game Mite last night using Winfrotz TTS. It was a little easier than the night before. I imagine you get used to things and anticipate them, or cancel them with the right keystroke. As for a recommendation on what to play, it depends on the type of game you like. I'm a big sucker for short interactive fiction games such as Lost Pig, Escapade, Snack Time and so on. To Michael. Thanks for the welcome. No doubt me landing on Audyssey and then proceeding to ask a million questions has caused a little intrigue. There's a couple of reasons why I'm trying to learn so much. One of them is so that I can help the community of sighted interactive fiction authors understand how to write better games. Anything (and perhaps everything) I learn here I hope to share with them at some point. Thanks for the fantastic overview on Winfrotz. Some questions that popped into my head include things like: What if there were commands written into games that could let you review your last turn, or list the known objects in a room? What if there was a command that let you know the obvious exits? For example, typing the word "directions" gave you an abbreviated list of the exits. Are there features like that which could be written into an Inform extension that would help? To Jim. Thanks for the brief history lesson. I understand the revolutionary aspect of audio games, but do you have more problems with system conflicts and platform bugs as a result? To Tom. Once again, some awesome information there. Thanks! I really appreciate it. I obviously need to do some research on Sapi and start listening to the differences between screen readers to get a better understanding. Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Neophite, I have NVDA 2010, and use it on Windows. However, as we are getting way off topic here if you want to talk about NVDA you can write me off list at thomasward1...@gmail.com and I'll answer any questions you might have regarding that screen reader. Cheers! On 11/5/10, neoph...@inthecompanyofgrues.com wrote: > > Hey Phil, > > I can understand why you would suggest buying a voice! The links you gave > me had quite the variety of them. I was pretty stoked to find that Real > Speak has an Australian one called Karen, which isn't too bad! > > The Ivona Amy voice is my favourite from the pages you've linked to. It's > amazing to hear the difference between the voice I've got in Winfrotz TTS > to a properly paced voice using a screen reader program. Do you know much > about the Ivona Bright Voice technology, or the NVDA screen reader they > offer? > > Cheers, > > Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
You might also look at http://www.cereproc.com/home for voices, sinse they have some very good ones indeed. I myself use the Scansoft Uk English voice daniel (being English myself I prefer Uk English synths), but the seerproc ones are even better imho and I'm actually considdering forking over for one of their voices. A good sapi voice is for playing accessible games is a litle like buying a joypad, highly necessary sinse so many games use it and the default microsoft ones are so dire (I've heard worse, but not by much). Beware the Grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: To: Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 10:23 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS Hey Phil, I can understand why you would suggest buying a voice! The links you gave me had quite the variety of them. I was pretty stoked to find that Real Speak has an Australian one called Karen, which isn't too bad! The Ivona Amy voice is my favourite from the pages you've linked to. It's amazing to hear the difference between the voice I've got in Winfrotz TTS to a properly paced voice using a screen reader program. Do you know much about the Ivona Bright Voice technology, or the NVDA screen reader they offer? Cheers, Neophyte. Message: 6 Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2010 22:59:19 -0400 From: "Phil Vlasak" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Hi Neophyte, If you are trying to play I F games using SAPI, you should try to get a decent sounding voice. The better ones need to be purchased and cost from $35 to $45 US per voice. You can check out the demos at, http://www.nextup.com They carry the A T and T voices. I prefer the Crystal and Mike US English voices. I read a review that said that most sighted players who use voices like Acapela Heather the best which Next up also sells. A new company, IVONA Text To Speech, has some interesting voices, http://www.ivona.com/# sincerely, Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hey Phil, I can understand why you would suggest buying a voice! The links you gave me had quite the variety of them. I was pretty stoked to find that Real Speak has an Australian one called Karen, which isn't too bad! The Ivona Amy voice is my favourite from the pages you've linked to. It's amazing to hear the difference between the voice I've got in Winfrotz TTS to a properly paced voice using a screen reader program. Do you know much about the Ivona Bright Voice technology, or the NVDA screen reader they offer? Cheers, Neophyte. Message: 6 Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2010 22:59:19 -0400 From: "Phil Vlasak" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Hi Neophyte, If you are trying to play I F games using SAPI, you should try to get a decent sounding voice. The better ones need to be purchased and cost from $35 to $45 US per voice. You can check out the demos at, http://www.nextup.com They carry the A T and T voices. I prefer the Crystal and Mike US English voices. I read a review that said that most sighted players who use voices like Acapela Heather the best which Next up also sells. A new company, IVONA Text To Speech, has some interesting voices, http://www.ivona.com/# sincerely, Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Neophyte, My games do need the VB6 run time libraries and DirectX 8.1 or better. My Winkit.zip file will install the VB6 libraries which no longer ship with Windows but other than that, no, I do not seem to have problems with system conflicts and platform bugs. People have been playing my windows games for like 10 years for the most part free of any problems like you mentioned. TGIF and BFN Jim I'm sticking with POP rather than switching to OOP. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Neophyte. i wasn't meaning that this was a specifically vi issue at all, just that it is principely the reason I've stopped playing a lot of if these days, sinse for every game I tried that I really liked, there seemed to be five or six others where I ran into those sorts of problems. This got particularly irritating with games like heroes which had a greeat concept and very much grabbed my interest. As to text gamebooks, I mean games based upon the style of the old gamebook series of the 1980's and early 90's, things like fighting fantasy, lone wolf and fabled lands. These are similar to interactive fiction in that they provide a second person narative, but rather than having a complex program and parza to handle progression, they use a system of turning to various pages of text (or with some of the online ones, clicking links), to make choices. Often, they also feature an abilities and stats system similar to a tabletop rp game and have turn based combat. By limiting the choice of player actions, I find it far easier to concentrate upon the story and world, rather than get stuck behind some over complex puzle. Traditionally, series like Fighting fantasy have been slightly pulp fantasy in genre, big swords and big explosions, however with people now writing gamebooks online, there are some more subtle works available and works in different genres. Noteable sites include www.ffproject.orgg, a site which has many gamebooks online, pluss an in built dice and character sheet system (so you don't need to write your own). www.arborell.com, The chronicles of arborell (actually very much a favourite of mine), a site where an author is trying to do essentially what Tolkien did, create a world with it's own history, culture and language. There are several game books (including one very unusual one), pluss many background novels, historical documents and the like. www.project.aon.org, a site wwhich allows you to either download or play online the lone wolf series of gamebooks from the 80's. These are unique in that the 20 books in the series form episodes in an ongoing story, and you keep your character and abilities from book to book adding more skills as you progress and thus getting more choices about where the story goes. There are several others kicking around, but these I think are probably the main three, and the three I frequent most. You can always search the database at www.audiogames.net for the gamebooks catagory. Hth. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Neophyte, If you are trying to play I F games using SAPI, you should try to get a decent sounding voice. The better ones need to be purchased and cost from $35 to $45 US per voice. You can check out the demos at, http://www.nextup.com They carry the A T and T voices. I prefer the Crystal and Mike US English voices. I read a review that said that most sighted players who use voices like Acapela Heather the best which Next up also sells. A new company, IVONA Text To Speech, has some interesting voices, http://www.ivona.com/# sincerely, Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi, Another all-in-one email. To Zachary. Thanks. I'll add that little bit of information to my expanding text document. Hopefully, soon, I'll work through everyone's advice and distill it down into some good set ups that work well on particular platforms. To Muhammed. I'll do some research on the Braille note before I chat to you, so I can get a better understanding. I believe it was talked about in the book I recently finished, called Wake. It's by science fiction author Robert Sawyer and features a blind girl as the protagonist. To Shaun. Sounds like you've got a great collection of old-school games there. There's something about the really old floppy disks that were around in the eighties and nineties that I still love. I wonder if, in thirty years time, people will get all nostalgic over CDs. Grins. To Dark. Awesome. Thanks so much. That's given me a good understanding of some of the features that are missing from Winfrotz TTS. Your reply to Michael was great, too. Laughs. Don't worry. Pretty much all of the frustrations you talk about with interactive fiction is there for sighted players, as well. So many games have tripped me up just because I couldn't get the right syntax or didn't understand the author's logic. In my opinion, that's often largely the fault of the author. In both replies you mentioned text based game books. What exactly are you referring to there? I've downloaded a copy of fallthru. Hopefully, on the weekend, I'll get to play some of it. I played a bit more of the IF comp game Mite last night using Winfrotz TTS. It was a little easier than the night before. I imagine you get used to things and anticipate them, or cancel them with the right keystroke. As for a recommendation on what to play, it depends on the type of game you like. I'm a big sucker for short interactive fiction games such as Lost Pig, Escapade, Snack Time and so on. To Michael. Thanks for the welcome. No doubt me landing on Audyssey and then proceeding to ask a million questions has caused a little intrigue. There's a couple of reasons why I'm trying to learn so much. One of them is so that I can help the community of sighted interactive fiction authors understand how to write better games. Anything (and perhaps everything) I learn here I hope to share with them at some point. Thanks for the fantastic overview on Winfrotz. Some questions that popped into my head include things like: What if there were commands written into games that could let you review your last turn, or list the known objects in a room? What if there was a command that let you know the obvious exits? For example, typing the word "directions" gave you an abbreviated list of the exits. Are there features like that which could be written into an Inform extension that would help? To Jim. Thanks for the brief history lesson. I understand the revolutionary aspect of audio games, but do you have more problems with system conflicts and platform bugs as a result? To Tom. Once again, some awesome information there. Thanks! I really appreciate it. I obviously need to do some research on Sapi and start listening to the differences between screen readers to get a better understanding. Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi, David Kinder? That's one of the bigger names in Inform. Like Graham Nelson, Emily Short, Andrew Plotken, and others. Best Regards, Hayden -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of neoph...@inthecompanyofgrues.com Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 5:21 AM To: gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS Hey Dark and Hayden, Thanks for the replies. I've tried to do a bit of research on Winfrotz TTS and found that David Kinder wrote the program. From what I understand, he's been helping out with Inform 7 of late, but I'm not certain. I'm intrigued by your comment, Dark. You said that Winfrotz TTS was based on only a partially completed version of the program and that it was missing features that had been intended. What were some of those intended features? If it was an ideal world and you could add some features, what would they include? What features would you do away with? Also, you said you'd find it weird if the greater than symbol wasn't your prompt. What if it was a colon? What about a word? Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hey all, Yikes! Waking up on the other side of the planet means opening up an in-box with 18 or so updates. I've noted replies from Jim, Tom, Michael, Dark, Shaun, Muhammed and Zachary. I'll do my best to respond in a few hours time. Thanks for your help and comments. Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hello Neophyte, Well, you can play some interactive fiction games on the brail note. Basically, you just play the games like Dragon, gormeay, adventure and stuff. Their is a sight with other brail note games, but I am sorry to say that they only work if you no brail. If you don't no brail, you could use the speech, but if your interested in brail, you might have to learn brail. Or you might have to learn without brail on the brail note, just the speech, but I am telling you this, and I am warning you, this isn't a rude comment, but the brail note isn't like a computer layout. I mean, their is an empower brail note, its old, but humonware don't add features that offen. If I'm correct, their is a brail note with keys like computers on it, but I might be wrong all the same. I can't tell you all about the brail note on the list, but you might have to contact me offlist. On the subject of interactive fiction games, some of them might have sounds on the brail note, but that actually depends on which enterpriter you use. Um, also, some interactive fiction games are fun, some not. Anyways, that is all I could tell you. If you want to contact me offlist about the brail note, send an email to. muhamme...@gmail.com - Original Message - From: "shaun everiss" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 5:10 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS well once I get a linux box I may start old gaming again. I have loads and loads of games from old floppies. when my floppies started going bad and before they got to bad I backed these on cd and then to my hard drives later on. I have about 130mb of old stuff. sadly most of it is old programs and dos games but there are games and such for inform tads and agt though unless there is an general agt runner for linux I have no idea how to play those. Actually I need to see where the heck to fit a linux system. At 03:35 a.m. 5/11/2010, you wrote: Hi Michael, That's actually one of the reasons I have taken to playing interactive fiction type games on linux using Speakup. Since many VI users, such as those who run Vinux, still very much use the console and console applications with speakup you can load up your favorite IF title in frotz and it is not all that different than the Dos days. On Windows with the development of screen readers like Jaws, Window-eyes, and on linux the Orca screen reader just don't handle console applications as well as the console screen readers do. Dos screen readers are a tthing of the past on Windows systems, but on Linux there is Yasr and Speakup to access the console. That's why Linux users are still able to access scare and frotz more or less like the old Dos days. Cheers! On 11/4/10, Michael Feir wrote: > Hi Neofite. Welcome aboard. I've been following your entrance onto the > list > with some interest. Interactive fiction has somewhat faded from centre stage > over the years since I started Audyssey Magazine. Audio arcade games > have > given us less cerebral alternatives as graphics did for the sighted. Another > problem has been that interactive fiction has become harder to properly > access. In the days of Dos, I could use my screen-reader to review text > and > the current move would automatically be read out loud. Winfrotztts only > offers us a partial solution. The current move is read aloud but one > cannot > review it as you could with a screen-reader. Also, the hints and help > menus > don't work very well at all since the current option isn't tracked or > announced. This makes getting into the games harder for newcommers. We > either need an interpreter which lets modern screen-readers work with > the > same facility that they let us access web pages, or a self-voicing > interpreter which esentially lets us review text and everything like a > screen-reader would. At the moment, we have neither. David Kinder says > it's > because of how text is sent to the screen so that it looks better. He > indicated to me that he was too busy to work on a better solution for > us. > The current version of his windowsfrotz does have the ability to read > text > as it is output but is like Winfrotztts in that it doesn't let one > review > the text properly or deal with the help menus well. > Michael Feir > Author of Personal Power: > How Accessible Computers Can Enhance Personal Life For Blind People > 2006-2008 > www.blind-planet.com/content/personal-power > > A Life of Word and Sound > 2003-2007 > http://www.blind-planet.com/content/life-word-and-sound > > Creator and former editor of Audyssey Magazine > 1996-2004 > Check out my blog at: > www.michaelfeir.blogspot.com > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
well once I get a linux box I may start old gaming again. I have loads and loads of games from old floppies. when my floppies started going bad and before they got to bad I backed these on cd and then to my hard drives later on. I have about 130mb of old stuff. sadly most of it is old programs and dos games but there are games and such for inform tads and agt though unless there is an general agt runner for linux I have no idea how to play those. Actually I need to see where the heck to fit a linux system. At 03:35 a.m. 5/11/2010, you wrote: Hi Michael, That's actually one of the reasons I have taken to playing interactive fiction type games on linux using Speakup. Since many VI users, such as those who run Vinux, still very much use the console and console applications with speakup you can load up your favorite IF title in frotz and it is not all that different than the Dos days. On Windows with the development of screen readers like Jaws, Window-eyes, and on linux the Orca screen reader just don't handle console applications as well as the console screen readers do. Dos screen readers are a tthing of the past on Windows systems, but on Linux there is Yasr and Speakup to access the console. That's why Linux users are still able to access scare and frotz more or less like the old Dos days. Cheers! On 11/4/10, Michael Feir wrote: > Hi Neofite. Welcome aboard. I've been following your entrance onto the list > with some interest. Interactive fiction has somewhat faded from centre stage > over the years since I started Audyssey Magazine. Audio arcade games have > given us less cerebral alternatives as graphics did for the sighted. Another > problem has been that interactive fiction has become harder to properly > access. In the days of Dos, I could use my screen-reader to review text and > the current move would automatically be read out loud. Winfrotztts only > offers us a partial solution. The current move is read aloud but one cannot > review it as you could with a screen-reader. Also, the hints and help menus > don't work very well at all since the current option isn't tracked or > announced. This makes getting into the games harder for newcommers. We > either need an interpreter which lets modern screen-readers work with the > same facility that they let us access web pages, or a self-voicing > interpreter which esentially lets us review text and everything like a > screen-reader would. At the moment, we have neither. David Kinder says it's > because of how text is sent to the screen so that it looks better. He > indicated to me that he was too busy to work on a better solution for us. > The current version of his windowsfrotz does have the ability to read text > as it is output but is like Winfrotztts in that it doesn't let one review > the text properly or deal with the help menus well. > Michael Feir > Author of Personal Power: > How Accessible Computers Can Enhance Personal Life For Blind People > 2006-2008 > www.blind-planet.com/content/personal-power > > A Life of Word and Sound > 2003-2007 > http://www.blind-planet.com/content/life-word-and-sound > > Creator and former editor of Audyssey Magazine > 1996-2004 > Check out my blog at: > www.michaelfeir.blogspot.com > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Michael, That's actually one of the reasons I have taken to playing interactive fiction type games on linux using Speakup. Since many VI users, such as those who run Vinux, still very much use the console and console applications with speakup you can load up your favorite IF title in frotz and it is not all that different than the Dos days. On Windows with the development of screen readers like Jaws, Window-eyes, and on linux the Orca screen reader just don't handle console applications as well as the console screen readers do. Dos screen readers are a tthing of the past on Windows systems, but on Linux there is Yasr and Speakup to access the console. That's why Linux users are still able to access scare and frotz more or less like the old Dos days. Cheers! On 11/4/10, Michael Feir wrote: > Hi Neofite. Welcome aboard. I've been following your entrance onto the list > with some interest. Interactive fiction has somewhat faded from centre stage > over the years since I started Audyssey Magazine. Audio arcade games have > given us less cerebral alternatives as graphics did for the sighted. Another > problem has been that interactive fiction has become harder to properly > access. In the days of Dos, I could use my screen-reader to review text and > the current move would automatically be read out loud. Winfrotztts only > offers us a partial solution. The current move is read aloud but one cannot > review it as you could with a screen-reader. Also, the hints and help menus > don't work very well at all since the current option isn't tracked or > announced. This makes getting into the games harder for newcommers. We > either need an interpreter which lets modern screen-readers work with the > same facility that they let us access web pages, or a self-voicing > interpreter which esentially lets us review text and everything like a > screen-reader would. At the moment, we have neither. David Kinder says it's > because of how text is sent to the screen so that it looks better. He > indicated to me that he was too busy to work on a better solution for us. > The current version of his windowsfrotz does have the ability to read text > as it is output but is like Winfrotztts in that it doesn't let one review > the text properly or deal with the help menus well. > Michael Feir > Author of Personal Power: > How Accessible Computers Can Enhance Personal Life For Blind People > 2006-2008 > www.blind-planet.com/content/personal-power > > A Life of Word and Sound > 2003-2007 > http://www.blind-planet.com/content/life-word-and-sound > > Creator and former editor of Audyssey Magazine > 1996-2004 > Check out my blog at: > www.michaelfeir.blogspot.com > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Michael. The example of doss games is a good one actually, sinse while I never actually ran any games under dos, I have become a fan of games like Eamon, fallthru and braminer played in console windows (which stil run under xp). In those cases, turns aren't actually read aloud at all and it's necessary to read the screen manually, but equally, in a game like eamon there are far fewer possible actions so the actual playing of the game is faster. I personally also do enjoy the exploration aspects of rpgs and gamebooks slightly more than If, sinse progress in such games is easier and it's more possible to follow the flow and thread of a story and exploration of an area. in most If I've tried, I tend to end up getting stuck by a random puzle who's solution is something deeply unguessable and obscure, or which gets stuck in the parza somewhere. For instance, I wanted to review Malinche's commercial If games for audiogames.net, so I tried their free prequal. I get to the end of a ruined castle Hall and see a fire place. Examining it, I find it to be large enough to crawl into. so north "you can't go that way" Look in fireplace "you see something glinting" Enter fireplace "that's not something you can enter" Down "you cannot go that way" get all fireplace "that doesn't hold anything" As it turned out (after asking the developer), the right command was in, for goodness sake In! with no reference to the blasted fireplace at all! It seems that in the majority of games I've played I get to this kind of point. Certainly not all, but more than less, even so called Easy games such as Glowgrass (which I was once advised as an introductory game), I found I ran into a blockade and stopped. it might be that I came to If comparatively late as I started in the year 2000 and missed the tradition of riddling and puzle solving that went with it. I have played some fantastic games, for instance Pythos mask by emily short, Paul obrian's stuff or Worlds appart, but I've largely now stopped playing most If sinse I find I inevitably come up stuck. So, these days I prefer to look for exploration style games with a more symple system of advancement such as fallthru. oh heck, this rather turned into more of a wrant than I intended. Actually Neophyte, if you can offer some advice I would indeed appreciate it. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi neophyte. Well, when I said partially complete and based on earlier versions, I simply mean that winfrotz tts is based on winfrotz version 1.4, where as I believe the current version is 1.53 (it might even be further), so obviously the older tts is less compatible with certain games which use more uptodate inform. in terms of feature adding, well as tom said, punctuation muting would be a must. I would also like to see more refigned reading commands. Currently, only the latest text to the screen is spoken, it would be nice to be able to review specific turns of the game, eg by pressing a shortcut, say ctrl minus to speak previous turn and ctrl pluss for the next (obviously ctrl p is taken). It would also be nice to have a find and spell specific word or name feature, sinse that's one of the things I often have to use Hal for. The mud client, vip mud which outputs to certain screen reading programs and also uses sapi has some exceptional built in methods for text review, and it's these sorts of things which it would be nice to see in a self voicing if interpreter. As to greater than, I think I've just become used to reading "greater than" as "what next?" ;D, so I really wouldn't see a word like "it's your turn" as meaning that much. Then again as I said, If was one of the first types of games I played on my old win 95 machine, and I got used to doing it without sapi or instant speaking capabilities. That's probably one reason now I play so many text based game books. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Tom. i like the idea of a texon screen reader. As regards winfrotz, I actually use the tts for the same reason as you, it aides in game flow to have the text automatically spoken as it appears on screen. I do however keep Hal running at the same time for review purposes. As regards sapi formulation of speech though, i do have to disagree. While it narks me that I cannot alter the voice dictionary and my sapi voice, scansoft daniel notoriously miss pronounces certain things (particularly abbreviations such as pronouncing ms as manuscript), I am actually quite happy with the pausing and sentence structure of the voice which was in fact why I got the voice in the first place. of course, much of the intonation does come from the voice not from Sapi, sinse as you said, unlike Hal, Jaws or other screen readers sapi has few or no speech rules, but I haven't found this particularly as irritating as I might in the matter of tone and pausing. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Neofite. Welcome aboard. I've been following your entrance onto the list with some interest. Interactive fiction has somewhat faded from centre stage over the years since I started Audyssey Magazine. Audio arcade games have given us less cerebral alternatives as graphics did for the sighted. Another problem has been that interactive fiction has become harder to properly access. In the days of Dos, I could use my screen-reader to review text and the current move would automatically be read out loud. Winfrotztts only offers us a partial solution. The current move is read aloud but one cannot review it as you could with a screen-reader. Also, the hints and help menus don't work very well at all since the current option isn't tracked or announced. This makes getting into the games harder for newcommers. We either need an interpreter which lets modern screen-readers work with the same facility that they let us access web pages, or a self-voicing interpreter which esentially lets us review text and everything like a screen-reader would. At the moment, we have neither. David Kinder says it's because of how text is sent to the screen so that it looks better. He indicated to me that he was too busy to work on a better solution for us. The current version of his windowsfrotz does have the ability to read text as it is output but is like Winfrotztts in that it doesn't let one review the text properly or deal with the help menus well. Michael Feir Author of Personal Power: How Accessible Computers Can Enhance Personal Life For Blind People 2006-2008 www.blind-planet.com/content/personal-power A Life of Word and Sound 2003-2007 http://www.blind-planet.com/content/life-word-and-sound Creator and former editor of Audyssey Magazine 1996-2004 Check out my blog at: www.michaelfeir.blogspot.com - Original Message - From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 6:21 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS Hey Dark and Hayden, Thanks for the replies. I've tried to do a bit of research on Winfrotz TTS and found that David Kinder wrote the program. From what I understand, he's been helping out with Inform 7 of late, but I'm not certain. I'm intrigued by your comment, Dark. You said that Winfrotz TTS was based on only a partially completed version of the program and that it was missing features that had been intended. What were some of those intended features? If it was an ideal world and you could add some features, what would they include? What features would you do away with? Also, you said you'd find it weird if the greater than symbol wasn't your prompt. What if it was a colon? What about a word? Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi, Neophite wrote: Thanks for the tip about there being a version of Frotz with a screen reader built in. My reply: Actually, that's not technically correct. Microsoft Windows comes with a technology called the Microsoft Speech API or Sapi for short. Sapi is an API that is used to create and control a number of Sapi compatibl voices. Unlike a screen reader, per say, Sapi is only there for speaking text sent to it by a program. It has no screen reader abilities etc in of itself. So just think of Sapi as the computers voice if you will. So what Winfrotz TTS does is it copies the text on the screen and sends it to Sapi to be spoken. Since neither of the programs allows you to review the screen, speak applications outside the Winfrotz TTS environment, etc therefore it is not in fact a screen reader. We call this kind of program self-voicing because it speaks the stuff related to Winfrotz via Sapi 5, but doesn't provide the same abilities as a screen reader. Neophite wrote: Does anyone use winfrotz TTS, or is it better to use a more recent version of frotz with your own screen reader software? My reply: Personally, I find Winfrotz TTS invaluable for playing inform style adventures because it automatically speaks the text on the screen as well as a few other things. Running Winfrotz by itself with a screen reader also means I have to do a fair amount of reviewing the screen and looking around for the last prompt etc. That gets old real quick. Winfrotz TTS is better because it takes a lot of effort out of playing text adventures. Neophite wrote: Some sections of text being read just jumble together. Is that a normal experience using a screen reader? Or, is it something in the winfrotz reader? My reply: That unfortunately is one of the problems with Winfrotz TTS. True screen readers like Jaws, Orca, Window-Eyes, NVDA, etc don't have this problem. Screen readers are more customizable allowing you to turn off things you don't want to be spoken such as punctuation marks as well as using acception dictionaries to change how certain things are spoken. Winfrotz TTS is very static were screen readers are very customizable. For example, a number of years ago I met a young laidy who was from the south. Naturally being from the south she had a very heavy southeren accent and used a lot of slang like y'all, you'ins, you get the picture. However, typically screen readers like Jaws, Window-eyes, etc are textbook perfect English. She didn't like it and used the Jaws acception dictionary to change you all to y'all and various other frazes to sound, well, more southeren. When I heard Jaws talking like that i couldn't help but laugh my butt off. It was great. However, the point is you can do that with Jaws, but with Winfrotz TTS because it just copies text and sends it to Sapi you have very little control over how it comes out punctuation marks, symbols, and all. Without using special speech rules etc Sapi will tend to run on and string things together robotically without pausing to sound more human/natural. Screen readers have special speech rules in place to pause between sentences etc to sound more natural and realistic. Make sense? Neophite wrote: I realise now how annoying extra symbols are. In the game, it came across a line made up of about forty underlines and it just went "under line under line under line under line". Is there something you can do to avoid those kind of situations, or is it something you just put up with, and hope that authors do it as little as possible? My reply: Well, this too is a problem with Winfrotz TTS. As long as you use Winfrotz TTS there isn't much you can do but to put up with it. if Winfrotz TTS had the features of a real screen reader you could set the punctuation level to full, most, some, or none, and disable the pspeaking of some symbols like the underline symbol. In this case you can't. the only alternative is to use Winfrotz with a real screen reader like NVDA or something. Now, you want to know something really annoying? Try a game that has a lot of text art. Now, that will drive you up the wall. Since we can't see it and we are hearing a mindless string of letters, numbers, and symbols it is beyond insane. Cheers! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
I still can't get winfrotz TTS to work on my system after one of my reinstalls, so I stick to winfrotz 1.16, or thereabouts, with TTS support built in, but will also just say we maybe get more used to a bit more spoken noise on a computer as such... Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message - From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 2:12 AM Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS Hey Dark, Thanks for the tip about there being a version of Frotz with a screen reader built in. I was pretty tired last night, so I didn't tackle the big Linux install. Instead I downloaded Winfrotz TTS and started playing Mite, one of the interactive fiction works from the two thousand and ten competition. Wow. It certainly opened my ears. I have a few questions about it all. One. Does anyone use winfrotz TTS, or is it better to use a more recent version of frotz with your own screen reader software? Do the added built-in features help? For example, pressing space to cancel a reading. Two. Some sections of text being read just jumble together. Is that a normal experience using a screen reader? Or, is it something in the winfrotz reader? Three. I realise now how annoying extra symbols are. In the game, it came across a line made up of about forty underlines and it just went "under line under line under line under line". Is there something you can do to avoid those kind of situations, or is it something you just put up with, and hope that authors do it as little as possible? Four. Every time the command line prompt came up, the screen reader said "greater than fork in the path moves two". Effectively, it was reading the prompt as greater than, and the status line which said the location, "fork in the path", followed by the number of moves I had made, "moves two". Similar to the last question, is there a way around this? Also, when the command prompt comes up, would you rather it be coded to say something like "Your turn", or "ready"? Or can you make a rule for it in your screen reader? I hope that's not too many questions to fire off. Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5589 (20101103) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5589 (20101103) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hey Dark and Hayden, Thanks for the replies. I've tried to do a bit of research on Winfrotz TTS and found that David Kinder wrote the program. From what I understand, he's been helping out with Inform 7 of late, but I'm not certain. I'm intrigued by your comment, Dark. You said that Winfrotz TTS was based on only a partially completed version of the program and that it was missing features that had been intended. What were some of those intended features? If it was an ideal world and you could add some features, what would they include? What features would you do away with? Also, you said you'd find it weird if the greater than symbol wasn't your prompt. What if it was a colon? What about a word? Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Neophyte, I do not recall if Dark answered one of your last question, but I'll answer that here. Sense the > symbol is a result of the Inform Compiler, I do not believe you can change it to say something like you are asking. If you could, that would be something interesting to consider. Best Regards, Hayden -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of neoph...@inthecompanyofgrues.com Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2010 7:12 PM To: gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS Hey Dark, Thanks for the tip about there being a version of Frotz with a screen reader built in. I was pretty tired last night, so I didn't tackle the big Linux install. Instead I downloaded Winfrotz TTS and started playing Mite, one of the interactive fiction works from the two thousand and ten competition. Wow. It certainly opened my ears. I have a few questions about it all. One. Does anyone use winfrotz TTS, or is it better to use a more recent version of frotz with your own screen reader software? Do the added built-in features help? For example, pressing space to cancel a reading. Two. Some sections of text being read just jumble together. Is that a normal experience using a screen reader? Or, is it something in the winfrotz reader? Three. I realise now how annoying extra symbols are. In the game, it came across a line made up of about forty underlines and it just went "under line under line under line under line". Is there something you can do to avoid those kind of situations, or is it something you just put up with, and hope that authors do it as little as possible? Four. Every time the command line prompt came up, the screen reader said "greater than fork in the path moves two". Effectively, it was reading the prompt as greater than, and the status line which said the location, "fork in the path", followed by the number of moves I had made, "moves two". Similar to the last question, is there a way around this? Also, when the command prompt comes up, would you rather it be coded to say something like "Your turn", or "ready"? Or can you make a rule for it in your screen reader? I hope that's not too many questions to fire off. Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hi Niophyte. The first thing to note is that winfrotz tts is only a partially completed version of the software, it's also only based on an earlier version of win frotz 4.5 I believe, so some features which were planned never seemed to make it into the final release annoyingly. as to your questions: 1: Yes, some of the features such as cutting of speech can be helpful, however others are less so. I myself find winfrotz tts useful for instantanious reading of text which is printed to the screen rather than me having to physically move Hal's focus around to read the latest entry, though quite often i keep Hal running at the same time as win frotz tts so that I can perform more minute reading tasks, eg finding the name of a given object. 2: not as much with a screen reader, though you do have to read manually. In tts however, can significantly improve the situation by removing extranious clutter from the screen,for instance turning the header flag off and also turning off fast scrolling sinse this seems to interfere with the speech. It's also a good idea to try and get as much on a single screen as possible to avoid shenanigans with scrolling the screen downwards. 3: oncemore, this is not possible in win frotz tts. Screen readers however do have settings to not read punctuation marks (though these are more difficult to set in some programs than in others). For instance, I have Hal currently set to read me punctuation when I am typing or using read line or other area commands, but to ignore punctuation when I am on continuous document read or navigating other areas of the screen. This cuts down on clutter a fair amount. Oh, even if hal does read punctuation, it also has the ability to say "underline 27 times" which is significantly helpful as well. 4: Well, if reading the screan manually with a screen reader it really doesn't matter about the greater than prompt particularly, in fact I've personally got used to typing whenever I get to greater than and would find some sort of hard coded message rather odd. In win frotz tts, usually the best you can do is turn off the status line display. I have heard of other interpreters with built in self voicing actually, but the only one I've significantly tried is win frotz tts really. Then again, I was playing if games quite a while before i discovered accessible audio games and the like, and that was on a laptop running windows 95 which had no speech capacity and thus I had to use my screen reader. On that I played a lot of the classics, pluss a lot of stuff by people like Andrew plotkin and emily short. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Hey Dark, Thanks for the tip about there being a version of Frotz with a screen reader built in. I was pretty tired last night, so I didn't tackle the big Linux install. Instead I downloaded Winfrotz TTS and started playing Mite, one of the interactive fiction works from the two thousand and ten competition. Wow. It certainly opened my ears. I have a few questions about it all. One. Does anyone use winfrotz TTS, or is it better to use a more recent version of frotz with your own screen reader software? Do the added built-in features help? For example, pressing space to cancel a reading. Two. Some sections of text being read just jumble together. Is that a normal experience using a screen reader? Or, is it something in the winfrotz reader? Three. I realise now how annoying extra symbols are. In the game, it came across a line made up of about forty underlines and it just went "under line under line under line under line". Is there something you can do to avoid those kind of situations, or is it something you just put up with, and hope that authors do it as little as possible? Four. Every time the command line prompt came up, the screen reader said "greater than fork in the path moves two". Effectively, it was reading the prompt as greater than, and the status line which said the location, "fork in the path", followed by the number of moves I had made, "moves two". Similar to the last question, is there a way around this? Also, when the command prompt comes up, would you rather it be coded to say something like "Your turn", or "ready"? Or can you make a rule for it in your screen reader? I hope that's not too many questions to fire off. Cheers, Neophyte. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Here's the error message am getting twice each time I try run it: ---start of virtualised dialogue--- FrotzTTS.exe - Application Error The application failed to initialize properly (0xc005). Click on OK to terminate the application. OK ---end of virtualised dialogue--- Doesn't mean much, and there's nothing in the windows event viewer. Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message - From: "Jacob Kruger" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 8:35 PM Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS Ok, still can't get it to work after trying to reinstall various screen readers etc. like think did before, and also found the following page, offering an actual sapi4 engine installation, including 8 voices to go with it, and those now work in NVDA for example, so the problem isn't specifically related to sapi4 as such, it would seem: http://www.st-tools.com/download.asp Any thoughts/ideas on what to try to get winfrotz TTS to work? Will also be testing a few of the other games now to make sure they want to work on this clean machine now, so let's hope so... Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] Winfrotz TTS
Ok, still can't get it to work after trying to reinstall various screen readers etc. like think did before, and also found the following page, offering an actual sapi4 engine installation, including 8 voices to go with it, and those now work in NVDA for example, so the problem isn't specifically related to sapi4 as such, it would seem: http://www.st-tools.com/download.asp Any thoughts/ideas on what to try to get winfrotz TTS to work? Will also be testing a few of the other games now to make sure they want to work on this clean machine now, so let's hope so... Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gam...@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
Hi. For the record, dos is spelled d o s. Couldn't resist, lol. Aaron T. Spears- Original Message - From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 12:05 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions hmmm trenton, sinse there are some nice windows alternative (as I said, winfrotz has always worked fine for me), why would I want to use Ms doss, which may or may not work with xp? Afterall, unlike Eamon, the inform stuff is machine independent, it's just a case of having an interpreter to run it with. Beware the Gru! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 2:40 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Here's a link to the "dos" versions of Winfrotz, with "dosfrotz" at the top, v2.4 http://www.inform-fiction.org/zmachine/dos.html To confirm, winfrotz tts is still at v1.5.1 Looked on the web site at 7:30 AM this morning. -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:36 AM To: Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- avast! Antivirus: Inbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 081116-1, 11/16/2008 Tested on: 11/17/2008 7:07:59 PM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2008 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
Well, there is one way to shut winfrotz tts up, even if it's not particularly eligant. Sinse any new speech will interupt the old flow of speech, just type ggg or anything else random at the text prompt and the game's "command not recognized" message will interupt whatever the sapi voice is saying. As i said, it's not really the best method, but it does work! Bware the Grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 8:11 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions That's definitely agreeable! -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 12:03 PM To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions It's a shame, though the only feature it would be really nice for winfrotz tts to have is a way of shutting the speech up, sinse it can't half go on a bit. Beware the Grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 6:45 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Ah, get the picture! Yes, wish the TTS version of Winfrotz was updated more, however it isn't bad to say the least. -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 10:05 AM To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions hmmm trenton, sinse there are some nice windows alternative (as I said, winfrotz has always worked fine for me), why would I want to use Ms doss, which may or may not work with xp? Afterall, unlike Eamon, the inform stuff is machine independent, it's just a case of having an interpreter to run it with. Beware the Gru! Dark. - Original Message ----- From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 2:40 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Here's a link to the "dos" versions of Winfrotz, with "dosfrotz" at the top, v2.4 http://www.inform-fiction.org/zmachine/dos.html To confirm, winfrotz tts is still at v1.5.1 Looked on the web site at 7:30 AM this morning. -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:36 AM To: Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
That's definitely agreeable! -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 12:03 PM To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions It's a shame, though the only feature it would be really nice for winfrotz tts to have is a way of shutting the speech up, sinse it can't half go on a bit. Beware the Grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 6:45 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Ah, get the picture! Yes, wish the TTS version of Winfrotz was updated more, however it isn't bad to say the least. -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 10:05 AM To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions hmmm trenton, sinse there are some nice windows alternative (as I said, winfrotz has always worked fine for me), why would I want to use Ms doss, which may or may not work with xp? Afterall, unlike Eamon, the inform stuff is machine independent, it's just a case of having an interpreter to run it with. Beware the Gru! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 2:40 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Here's a link to the "dos" versions of Winfrotz, with "dosfrotz" at the top, v2.4 http://www.inform-fiction.org/zmachine/dos.html To confirm, winfrotz tts is still at v1.5.1 Looked on the web site at 7:30 AM this morning. ---------- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:36 AM To: Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
It's a shame, though the only feature it would be really nice for winfrotz tts to have is a way of shutting the speech up, sinse it can't half go on a bit. Beware the Grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 6:45 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Ah, get the picture! Yes, wish the TTS version of Winfrotz was updated more, however it isn't bad to say the least. -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 10:05 AM To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions hmmm trenton, sinse there are some nice windows alternative (as I said, winfrotz has always worked fine for me), why would I want to use Ms doss, which may or may not work with xp? Afterall, unlike Eamon, the inform stuff is machine independent, it's just a case of having an interpreter to run it with. Beware the Gru! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 2:40 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Here's a link to the "dos" versions of Winfrotz, with "dosfrotz" at the top, v2.4 http://www.inform-fiction.org/zmachine/dos.html To confirm, winfrotz tts is still at v1.5.1 Looked on the web site at 7:30 AM this morning. ------ From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:36 AM To: Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
Ah, get the picture! Yes, wish the TTS version of Winfrotz was updated more, however it isn't bad to say the least. -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 10:05 AM To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions hmmm trenton, sinse there are some nice windows alternative (as I said, winfrotz has always worked fine for me), why would I want to use Ms doss, which may or may not work with xp? Afterall, unlike Eamon, the inform stuff is machine independent, it's just a case of having an interpreter to run it with. Beware the Gru! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 2:40 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Here's a link to the "dos" versions of Winfrotz, with "dosfrotz" at the top, v2.4 http://www.inform-fiction.org/zmachine/dos.html To confirm, winfrotz tts is still at v1.5.1 Looked on the web site at 7:30 AM this morning. -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:36 AM To: Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
hmmm trenton, sinse there are some nice windows alternative (as I said, winfrotz has always worked fine for me), why would I want to use Ms doss, which may or may not work with xp? Afterall, unlike Eamon, the inform stuff is machine independent, it's just a case of having an interpreter to run it with. Beware the Gru! Dark. - Original Message - From: "Trenton Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 2:40 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Here's a link to the "dos" versions of Winfrotz, with "dosfrotz" at the top, v2.4 http://www.inform-fiction.org/zmachine/dos.html To confirm, winfrotz tts is still at v1.5.1 Looked on the web site at 7:30 AM this morning. -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:36 AM To: Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
Hmmm that's odd. Both myself and a friend using jaws found standard Windfrotz to work perfectly well. windows frotz was a different story though. thanks for the info about winfrotz tts, I'll see what I can do about writing up a game page for it. Beware the Grue! dark. - Original Message - From: "Michael Feir" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 1:35 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions That's still the latest version as far as I know. Unfortunately, standard Winfrotz doesn't work all that well with screen readers anymore in my experience. I haven't had any success in pursuading anyone in the IF development community to create a solution more favorable to screen-readers. Michael Feir Author of Personal Power: How Accessible Computers Can Enhance Personal Life For Blind People 2006-2008 www.blind-planet.com/content/personal-power A Life of Word and Sound 2003-2007 http://www.blind-planet.com/content/life-word-and-sound Creator and former editor of Audyssey Magazine 1996-2004 Check out my blog at: www.michaelfeir.blogspot.com - Original Message - From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 5:36 AM Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
Here's a link to the "dos" versions of Winfrotz, with "dosfrotz" at the top, v2.4 http://www.inform-fiction.org/zmachine/dos.html To confirm, winfrotz tts is still at v1.5.1 Looked on the web site at 7:30 AM this morning. -- From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 3:36 AM To: Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
That's still the latest version as far as I know. Unfortunately, standard Winfrotz doesn't work all that well with screen readers anymore in my experience. I haven't had any success in pursuading anyone in the IF development community to create a solution more favorable to screen-readers. Michael Feir Author of Personal Power: How Accessible Computers Can Enhance Personal Life For Blind People 2006-2008 www.blind-planet.com/content/personal-power A Life of Word and Sound 2003-2007 http://www.blind-planet.com/content/life-word-and-sound Creator and former editor of Audyssey Magazine 1996-2004 Check out my blog at: www.michaelfeir.blogspot.com - Original Message - From: "dark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 5:36 AM Subject: [Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Audyssey] Winfrotz tts versions
Hi. I'm trying to sort out If interpreter pages for audiogames.net. Does anyone know if Winfrotz tts 151 is stil the most recent version? i checked the binery revelations site, and that seemed to be the most recent listed, - but I'm not certain. Advice would be apprciated. Oh, and yes I know, standard win frotz also works fine with screen readers as well. Beware the Grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
