[Goanet] Births and Deaths records now shifted back to respective taluka levels but..
Births and Deaths records now shifted back to respective taluka levels but.. Situation is worst than what it was at Directorates of Archives at Altinho. It may be reminded that all the Births and Deaths records were shifted to Altinho, Panjim but after the complaints and protests by the public, the same is now restored back to where it was. Other day we went to Vasco to get a Birth Certificate, we were told to come back next day morning as the receipts are issued only during morning before 12 noon. We arrived there at 3pm. Today, we arrived there at 10pm, we got the receipt after a long wait but for the birth certificate, we will have to come back after 10 days only to enquire if it is ready. The simple reason or excuse they give for this type of slow services is 'shortage of Staff'. Before transferring to Altinho, one could get his/her birth certificate same day. Some people there even said, at Altinho, the services were comparatively far better than this one. I also read about similar problems faced by Margao/salcette people. Our CM Digu is from Margao.. Digu kaka, zara deko tere 'aam aadmi' ki hallat.. However, one may get his/her Birth certificate almost instantly for a price. (price=bribe). [EMAIL PROTECTED] for Goa NRI related info... http://in.groups.yahoo.com/group/GOAN-NRI/ For Goan Video Clips http://youtube.com/joeukgoa or http://is.rediff.com/profilevisitor.php?mem_id=48419 __ Sent from Yahoo! Mail - a smarter inbox http://uk.mail.yahoo.com
[Goanet] Yahoo addresses...
While the Goa governments (of whichever party) offers tall promises about how IT savvy they are, what great plans they has to offer broadband connectivity across the state, or give almost-free computers to 25,000+ students, the fact is that this technology is hardly used effectively here. While we are all good at incurring expenses, are computers used to actually communicate more effectively? Some time ago, I had written to over 107 government officials as a teast case, and got back just two replies! Earlier this week, I was a bit surprised to find that that the Directorate of Art Culture (on the 5th Floor, Shram Shakti Bhavan, Patto, Panjim ph 243 8103) actually uses a yahoo.co.in address for its official work -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] One would have thought that official addresses would be used for official work. Just a thought. FN -- Frederick Noronha http://fn.goa-india.org Ph +91-832-2409490
[Goanet] Pamphlet Circulated for Hindu Dharmajagruti
Sachin Phadte wrote: I stand corrected that there are no temples in Goa with nude carvings. There are, however, two issues. One is the rule and the exception. The second, and more important, is whether the nude/erotic paintings/carvings in Hindu temples are those of the Hindu gods and goddesses. M F Husain has painted the Hindu deities in this manner, and that is what is objectionable. Comment: 1. These paintings were done over 40-50 years ago and displayed in numerous art galleries. Why the protest now if not with some ulterior motive. 2. The exhibition of Hussain's paintings are being held by those who purchased his paintings a long time ago. Why no protests against these organisers? Is it because they are Hindus and Hussain a muslim? 3.Only an artist can understand and appreciate true art as with music. To a layman, even a nude statue or picture can be offensive. The context is important. 4. If you know even a little bit of Hussain or his themes, you find find all his paintings and themes are based on Indian conditions and environment and culture. Unlike other artists like F N Souza who made a name overseas, Hussain has been India centric. 5. A famous Goan painter Angelo Da Fonseca (who was my neighbour) used to paint Christ, Mother Mary and other Christian themes in an Indian context. I remember at that time, there were many christians who found it objectionable. Art like beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder. 6. Even for arguments sake, if one finds Hussain's paintings of Hindu deities offensive, there are civil ways of protesting. Hounding him with threats of violence, filing sundry criminal cases all over the country, inciting hatred are no way of protesting in a civil society. 7.Doesn't the sangh parivar find Valentine's Day offensive? Why blame Hussain for the fundamentalist mindset? Marshall Mendonza
Re: [Goanet] Pamphlet Circulated for Hindu Dharmajagruti Sabha - protest against MF Husain !!
Thanbk you Sachin, that is my point exactly. How, when why the original statues, such as the vast temples in Madurai surrounding areas where such temples were, nor the temples around the rest of India is not in question. But if anyone can name any of the Gods Goddesses which are depicted in the nude carvings in stone, wood or marble etc I would welcome this. I have no problem with nuditiy in any of its forms but to portray the deities in the nude is one thing, which is objectional enough, but to show them in sexaul poses with animals etc, this is beyond contempt. My post in response ealier was rejected because it was deemed inappropriate by the moderators. This was because I had compared like for like with another religion it was rejected for this reason. Blasphemy is ok when you demean the Hindu Gods Goddesses then. Erotism is one thing but showing a Goddess practicing beastialty is another, but none of the Gods Goddesses are posed in the nude or in any other pose other than standing or sitting, fully clothed. Never naked. If anything like this exists then it must have been made thousands of years ago, or as recently as the last hundred years, or in MF Hussain case, I am told 50 / 60 years ago. It does not make it right to deride another persons religion, no matter who you are. John Monteiro Sachin Phadte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote To my comment: As far as many temples with nude carvings, the statement would give an impression that there is a very significant numbers of such temples. I do not think there is a single temple in Goa with nude carvings. Santosh Helekar responded as follows: This is not true. There are at least a few temples in Goa, and many in India with temple friezes with nude figurines. Please see an earlier Goanet post on this with a link to actual pictures from the Kamat Potpourri site: http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/msg35594.html I stand corrected that there are no temples in Goa with nude carvings. There are, however, two issues. One is the rule and the exception. The second, and more important, is whether the nude/erotic paintings/carvings in Hindu temples are those of the Hindu gods and goddesses. M F Husain has painted the Hindu deities in this manner, and that is what is objectionable. Sachin Phadte
[Goanet] Fwd: V.M.Salgaocar College of Law presents- TATVA
-- Forwarded message --
From: Gustavo Monteiro [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Feb 8, 2008 11:47 PM
Subject: V.M.Salgaocar College of Law presents- TATVA
To: !! SAGaR.. ! ITz ALL ABoUT !!ATTITUDE!! [EMAIL PROTECTED],
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V.M.Salgaocar College of Law presents TATVA- The Elements of Life
http://www.vmslaw.edu/tatva/index.html
BE THERE...!!!
--
Truth Liberates,
Nigel Britto
http://amicusnaturae.blogspot.com
[Goanet] Guardian of the Dawn- by Richard Zimler
Hi! Has any one read this book Guardian of the Dawn- by Richard Zimler in which he mentions 'Goa Inquisition was most merciless and cruel' Regards YOgesh
[Goanet] Villagers of Colomba paralised Traffic over 3 hours over alleged assault by the Quepem police
From John Fernandes, Quepem That a group of villagers from Colomba, Rivona, Dhadolem, Muscavrem, and Kevona blocked the entire Rivona Colomba road for over 3 hours today over the issue of alleged assault done by the ASI P.V. Dessai attached to Quepem police station on one of the villagers at Colomba today. That the villagers of Colomba and other adjoining areas are agitating over the functioning of Hirala and Khodidas mine at Colomba , who claims that due to the functioning of the mine their very life is in danger. The villagers in the last week of January even forcefully closed down which prompted the mine owner to keep the mine close for two days but the mine was again started. Claims the villagers Though the said mine was in operation internally no transportation of ore outside the mine was done. The tuck which were going to operate inside the mine were going through a road made illegally made by the mining company through reserve Forest . The illegal making of road by the mining company through the reserve forest triggered the villagers as no action taken by the forest department inspite of Complaint . Stated the villagers further. That from 6th of February through its contractor the mining company started transporting the ore from the mine through reserve forest via Curpe as there is no other way out.That yesterday some of the villagers got together and warned all the truck transporting ore from that mine. That through the reserve forest the road passes through private property of one one Prabhudessai passes before reaching the mine , which property has a gate on both side of boundary. As the villagers were planning to stopped the transport from the said mine yesterday evening with the help of Prabhudessai Supervisor locked the gate one both side. They also warned the truck from operating from the mine. As the villagers warned the truck operator no truck entered in the mine and nor transportation work was started in todays morning session. Stated the villagers further . However today at around 1.30 PM the transport contractor with police protection with some truck went to the site, the police took the key of the gate from the supervisor of PrabhuDessai and opened the same , loaded the truck . The loaded trucks were followed by the the Quepem police jeep. As the villagers were keeping a close watch on the movement of the truck from that mine , When the loaded truck from the said mine reached at Colomba one of the village youth showed his hand to the truck and stopped it . The police jeep which was following the truck one of the police by name ASI P.V.Dessai got down from the jeep caught hold the colour of the youth shirt pulled him and then assaulted him with shoes one his private part and then pulled him into the police jeep. The incident was noticed by other villager who were planning their strategies , they then rushed to the site and stooped the police Jeep. That within no time around 400 villagers gathered at the site. The villagers blocked the entire rout rivona Colomba road and paralised the entire traffic for almost 3 hours. The incident forced Quepem P.I. Naresh Mamel to rush to the incident site who after a long discussion managed to convinced the agitating villager and assured them such incident of alleged assault will not repeat in future. At around 6.30 the villagers disbursed and allowed the traffic to go. Now the villagers are determine not to allow the operation of Hiralal and Khodidas mine operating in Colomba village. - Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
[Goanet] Panjim will soon become like Vasco
Hi Joegoa. What guarantee is there that BJP will sort this mess? Baina was an organised business or demand based activities. What is happening in Panjim is akin to snipers taking a random potshot. What is the pont in publishing your photos on Goanet, when you can push them under the noses of Goa ministers in Goa itself? Present CM was a BJP, - same difference. ED. Joegoa said: I think only BJP govt can sort out this mess as it has done in case of Vasco Baina Beach. BJP Zindabad - Sent from Yahoo! #45; a smarter inbox.
Re: [Goanet] Pamphlet Circulated for Hindu Dharmajagruti Sabha - protest against MF Husain !!
--- Sachin Phadte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The second, and more important, is whether the nude/erotic paintings/carvings in Hindu temples are those of the Hindu gods and goddesses. This issue has also been addressed earlier on Goanet. Please see another post in the archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/msg35628.html The nude gods and goddesses depicted are Uma and Shiva, Radha and Krishna, Rati and Manmath, etc. Cheers, Santosh
[Goanet] Hindu janajagruti pamphlet- protesting against M F Hussain
Selma says : I am so embarrassed as an Indian citizen, that this man is forced to live out the last days of his life in hiding. This statement is bogus because M F hussain has voluntary left india by cocking a snook at the judicial system of our country. In this particular case, certain hindus felt offended (as is their right to be offended) The followed the due process of the law and filed police complaints against the offender. Now Hussain, had he been a loyal and llaw abiding citizen of this country would have responded to the summons. Instead he chose to abscond to foreign countries. can santosh or rajan or anyone else provide us with one example of a temple in india which has a nude sita in a sexually explicit pose with hanuman? regards Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[Goanet] LIMERICK FOR THE DAY III
Will Konkani be dead in fifty years? That's top of the list of Goans' fears. Isn't it a crime That but for a stitch in time Konkani-lovers will be reduced to tears.
Re: [Goanet] karanjia
Eugene Correia [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:To clarify the one Goan connection reference, what I meant was the closeness Russi and Olga enjoyed and not one of employer-employee. One Goan friend of mine worked for Blitz in the 70s. Perhaps there were more. One East Indian who worked there and I knew was Eddie Fernandes, who later switched on to the sports department of Indian Express. Dear Eugene, To clarify the matter further, Oscar and Russi were friends much before Oscar began writing for Blitz. My connection with Russi may have begun as employer-employee, but I was the featured employee, and a friendship soon developed. But he was far older than me, so he and I naturally moved in different circles. Regards, Victor
Re: [Goanet] Ghanttis... over the hills
Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2008 02:40:56 +0530 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: goanet@lists.goanet.org Subject: [Goanet] Ghanttis... over the hills I've even peed on their roads once... the shortage of toilets is not just limited to Goa... thankfully nobody photographed me... or if they didn,. I didn't get to know.) FN -- Frederick Noronha http://fn.goa-india.org Ph +91-832-2409490 Dear Rico's candid confession of his transgression endearigly brings to mind Jimmy Carter's famously revealed everyone has comitted adultery in heart. Uncertain of exact quote. Well he/she who has never done it in a public place be the first one to wet the pants... Alfred _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
Re: [Goanet] Pamphlet Circulated for Hindu Dharmajagruti Sabha - protest against MF Husain !!
--- Sachin Phadte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As she herself wrote recently that she does not read all the messages on Goanet, I presume she will give me the same privilege. I do not remember her asking me this question. And for me to answer the question, will she tell me if in Da Vinci was Mary painted in the nude? Or was Jesus painted in the nude? Sachin Phadte --- Sachin, Your entire response was a good duck and weave, but for the sake of argument let me concentrate on the last paragraph. Mary, Jesus, saints, angels, and the entire pantheon of Western Gods and Goddesses have been depicted as or painted in far more objectionable fashion than merely nude. If people threatened the life of another individual everytime we disagreed with them, life as we know it would come to an end. By all means you are free to disagree, but apparently the crux of this argument collectively has now turned into a real threat on the life of MF Hussain, which has kept him flitting between Dubai, London and New York. To reiterate my point, you wrote scathingly about the Da Vinci code debacle in Goa, and you were very vocal about Talisma Nasreen's freedom of speech. So is it a double standard that prohibits you from respecting that of MF Hussain, or is that only your sensibilities need redress, while those of other religions can be rationalised away? selma Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
Re: [Goanet] Pamphlet Circulated for Hindu Dharmajagruti Sabha - protest against MF Husain !!
I once saw a painting of a Hindu Goddess painted by Hussain ( I do not know which goddess it was ) riding on Hanuman's tail. I am a Catholic but was utterly revolted by this painting !! It was tasteless and was obvious that it would hurt the sentiments of a great number of people. Freedom when it comes should go together with responsible behaviour. Just a thought, if Hussain likes to depict all Gods and Goddesses in the nude in the name of artistic freedom he should also paint his own god in the same way. Warm wishes Sonia --- Sachin Phadte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fredrick Noronha writes: Firstly, artists should have artistic freedom (without it being decided upon by the mullahs -- whether they are Christian, Hindu, Muslim, secular, atheist, agnostic or whatever). In which case it is necessary to do away with censor boards all over the world. In which case why is the programme of the the Hindu Dharmajagruti Sabha sought to be banned? And why did the Government of India seek to remove a video from YouTube of a character depcited as Mahatma Gandhi doing a pole dance? More importantly, does freedom come without any sense of responsibility? I would like members on this list to remember, a fact that will not be part of the mainstream discussion, that Husain's son objected to his father being depicted in the nude by an art gallery in Chennai. This depiction was done in retaliation to his depiction of Saraswati in nude. I think it is said that your freedom to swing your arm stops where my nose begns. The issue is whether anyone can trample on the sentiments of others. Of course, this trampling business is a subjective issue. But instead of using the 'artisitic freedom' argument, Fredrick should clearly say whether he thinks the sentiments were hurt or not in this particular case. Others who use 'eminent artist' argument should also answer this question. Sachin Phadte _ Tried the new MSN Messenger? Its cool! Download now. http://messenger.msn.com/Download/Default.aspx?mkt=en-in Get the freedom to save as many mails as you wish. To know how, go to http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html
[Goanet] Monteiro blasts communalism, calls for independence in scientists
Monteiro blasts communalism, calls for independence in scientists PANJIM, Feb 7: Trade unionist, maths educator and mathematical physicist Dr Vivek Monteiro lambasted communalism, called for scientists to think independently, and stressed the need to meet the basic living needs of the poor here this evening. Dr Monteiro, a son of Goa but settled in Mumbai, was delivering the fourth day's talks in the D.D. Kosambi festival of ideas series at the Kala Academy. US-educated Monteiro, secretary of the CPI(M)-affiliated CITU Maharashtra State Committee, said: Kosambi has been a very prominent influence on every young student in India who proceeds towards the Left. He acknowledged the influence of the Miramar-based Dhempe College in shaping him in the sixties -- including professors Joe Menezes, Nadkarni, Kantak, Parbhudesai, and others at St Xavier's Mumbai. He also had a good word for his colleagues Frank Braganza and Nitan Kenkre, and his parents maths teacher Sophia and engineer-armyman (Brig) Innocencio Monteiro. He said India's biggest problem was 836 million people being denied their basic needs and said science could not ignore this. Some 92% of the workforce belonged to the unorganised sector in INdia, he noted. Science is the long history of learning how not to fool yourself, said Monteiro. It is not always convenient to be scientific, said Monteiro, stressing how some scientists shirked their social responsibilities and acted as if politics was completely another world. DD Kosambi was a scientist who never compromised with his scientific values. He worked in the TIFR and was critical of nuclear energy, so he was out on early retirement. During his life, he never attained the status of a scientific star, said Monteiro. He pointed to Kosambi's view that modern science was the creation of the bourgeosie and was no longer independent. Monteiro spoke about the scam of the Enron plant at Dhabol not far from Goa, and said India's intelligentsia, including the IITs, had failed to challenge this. Monteiro lambasted the communal propaganda built up prior to elections, and said science is an ideology that is fundamentally opposed to communal ideology and obsfucation. Religious terrorism should be used as a category whenever people were killed because of their religious identities, he said, and not just depending on the religion of the killers. He stressed the need to take quality math education to the common schools of India, and cited to experiences in Sanguem which showed this was possible. Monteiro's NavNirmit trust is devoted to universalizing elementary science and mathematics education. He pointed to the work of the All India People's Science Congress, and how 10,000 decent homes had been built at Solapur the cost of just two plush apartments in the costliest part of Mumbai. Later, in a QA session, he fielded questions on whether Marxism had created freedom of thought (it's an issue socialism has still to resolve), scientific terrorism, the misuse of science, his views on Gandhi, and from some who appeared keen to contrast whether communal riots caused more deaths than human exploitation. Speaking earlier, environmentalist Dr Claude Alvares, whose Dutch doctorate is in the history of science, said Monteiro had disappeared from my life for at least 30 years. Like him, Alvares noted, Monteiro was also a creature of the 1960s when college youth battled the reality of poverty in India and took part in rural development camps. Alvares praised Monteiro for sticking to his vision and opting for trade unionism which was not a sexy job. People with US doctorates went in for the universities, corporations and the heart bypasse at the apt age.
[Goanet] Fw: Curruption Kills!
- Original Message - From: Goasuraj [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Goa's premiere mailing list, estb. 1994! goanet@lists.goanet.org Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 9:27 AM Subject: Re: [Goanet] Curruption Kills! Dr. Anesimo Fernandes says:- I am trained to save lives, and I cannot wait and watch my patients dying. so, I have decided to do something about it. Goasuraj responds:- Thank you for volunteering, Dr. Fernandes. Goa needs more of your kind in every imaginable department. The task is huge. 1. You will have to help increase the bed capacity of the mental asylums in Goa. Thanks to the entertainment and hospitality lobby wnating to go ga-ga on blasting music 24 x 365 days and make pots of money for themselves. 2. Super speciality where artificial limbs and brain transplants are the order of the day. Thanks to the RTO and the transport lobby with a capacity morgue thrown-in as well. 3. Reformation centres for drug addicts which supplies drugs of all kinds free of cost. 4. Educational institutions to teach goan youngsters as well as their parents the intrinsic values of dignity of labour/work. 5. A peaceful retiring homes for people who have been working their ulcers to clean up the long standing governance mess and failed, so that they can pass away peacefully with a hell of a lot of regrets. 6. Plus lots more... Thank you for your concerns. goasuraj - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 9:22 PM Subject: [Goanet] Curruption Kills! Dear Goanet Readers. I was motivated to write this post after reading one from Valmiki Faleiro on Directorate of Transport. During my school days, I don’t remember anybody uttering the word Bribe or Corruption. But, as time passed by, and Goa became a State from Union Territory, the virus of Corruption was starting to spread. I remember the first bus agitation where the stakes were only a few rupees!...
[Goanet] BSNL offers free Rs.50,000 to it's customers if...
BSNL offers free Rs.50,000 to it's customers if... He/she dies an accidental death anytime during the year 2008. i.e. Rs.50,000 per connection. If same person having 3 connections say 2 land lines and one mobile then the money will be 50,000 x 3 = Rs. 1,50,000 The personal accident insurance scheme (thru bajaj allianz) is initially for a periond of one year w.e.f. Jan.14, 2008. All the existing and new landlines and Mobile postpaid customers covered. Call Free on 1800 225858 from bsnl/mtnl line. Similar, insurance scheme, was offered by barclayscard in UK where in 1000 pounds money assured should the cardholder dies an accidental death. But the offer was for lifetime. I even have a certificate issued by Barclays. [EMAIL PROTECTED] for Goa NRI related info... http://in.groups.yahoo.com/group/GOAN-NRI/ For Goan Video Clips http://youtube.com/joeukgoa or http://is.rediff.com/profilevisitor.php?mem_id=48419 __ Sent from Yahoo! Mail - a smarter inbox http://uk.mail.yahoo.com
[Goanet] Dadar train to ply till CSTM (VT Station)
The Ministry of Railways has decided to extend the 2051/2052 Dadar-Madgaon-Dadar Janshatabdi Express to Mumbai CSTM (formerly VT Station, or Victoria Terminus) from February 8, 2008. Train No.2051 Dn will leave CSTM at 05:10 hrs daily (except Wednesday) and arrive Margao at 13:55 Hrs. Train No.2052 Up will leave Margao at 14:20 hrs. (except Wednesday) and arrive CSTM at 23:10 hrs, according to a press note from the Konkan Railway Corp public relations manager Baban Ghatge [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Goanet] NEWS: Romila Thapar praises Kosambi for changing course of studying Indian history
To Goanet - Speaking to introduce Thapar, who has worked on the decline of the Mauryas and early India among other topics, businessman-social campaigner Datta Naik said she was an impressive thinker to interprete South Asia's past along with the Goan-origin Kosambi and Debiprasad Chattopadhyaya. Naik stressed that Thapar played a key role in shifting the study of Indian hstory away from the communal interpretation. It was she who had point out that there was a 'selective memory' and 'selective forgetting' of history. This is priceless. One fraud certifying another. Datta Damodar Naik should first come clean about the history of his own construction activities. Details about his meetings (if any) with the then-TCP Minister Mr Monseratte during Manohar P's govt could throw historical light on just how and why D D Naik discovered the ill effects of communalism and the virtues of secularism. Now on to Romila Thapar, the high priestess of the Marxist historian brigade at JNU, also known as the Kremlin by the Jamuna. Romila is an adept in the art of whitewashing Islamic atrocities against ancient Hindus and Hindu civilization. Indian historiography has long been held hostage, first by its hijacking and capture by Marxist historians, and then recently by the pathetic attempts of the Hindutvavadis to provide a corrective under the aegis of Murli Manohar Joshi during the BJP reign at the Centre. Romila and her ilk thrive by wrapping themselves in the 'secular' saree and the idiotic Hindutvavadis provide the Marxists the excuse and the cover needed for their academic skulduggery. For more on Romila Thapar, see - http://www.indiastar.com/venkat1.html The Marxist modus operandi is best summarised by Kalavai Venkat: This eminent historian adduces no references for such claims. This is the usual trick in the Marxist trade. They start their hypotheses with uncertainty, using the word perhaps, but conclude the statement quite assertively, as if their uncertain speculation in itself has metamorphosed into evidence as well. Sidelight: At her lecture in Berkeley some years ago, Kalavai Venkat asked Thapar directly if she knew the classical languages Sanskrit or Tamil (knowledge of which is critical to anyone writing on ancient Indian history, since the primary sources are in those languages). IIRC, she refused to answer him, and made the absurd retort that she took questions only from professional historians. Regards, r Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [Goanet] Science and Churchy reasoning
Dear Santosh, Both Goanet and America have been a great source of learning for me .. that traditional philosophy itself has become obsolete in light of advances made by science. Dear Selma, You are quite right. Gilbert is also right in this respect. My previous posts showed how the principle of causality has become obsolete because of scientific findings, apart from other reasons related to the alternative non-causal philosophical models of the universe. In additional support of your above statement, Fr. Ivo's post below inadvertently shows how the philosophical notion that something cannot spontaneously emerge from nothing is also obsolete. Recent discoveries and theoretical insights have shown that nothing in the natural universe is actually quantum vacuum, which can spontaneously (i.e. without any cause) generate positive and negative energy particles. They have also shown that the total amount of matter and energy in the universe is zero. Because of generation of equal number of positive and negative energy particles in each such spontaneous creation event, the matter/energy total always remains zero, and therefore, the first law of thermodynamics is never violated. Of course, Fr. Ivo mistakenly confuses the principle of causality with creation ex-nihilo. He fails to recognize that the reason quantum fluctuations make the principle of causality obsolete is because they are spontaneous i.e. by pure chance or without any preceding cause. He also seems to assume that there is such a thing as absolute nothingness in the natural world. The discovery of quantum vacuum also makes the latter philosophical concept obsolete, as far as the natural world is concerned. Cheers, Santosh Fr. Ivo wrote: The microstructure of the quantum vacuum is a sea of continually forming and dissolving particles which borrow energy from the vacuum for their brief existence. A quantum vacuum is thus far from nothing, and vacuum fluctuations do not constitute an exception to the principle that whatever begins to exist has a cause. Further, creation ex nihilo contradicts the first law of thermodynamics.
Re: [Goanet] Pamphlet Circulated for Hindu Dharmajagruti Sabha - protest against MF Husain !!
Fredrick Noronha writes: Firstly, artists should have artistic freedom (without it being decided upon by the mullahs -- whether they are Christian, Hindu, Muslim, secular, atheist, agnostic or whatever). In which case it is necessary to do away with censor boards all over the world. In which case why is the programme of the the Hindu Dharmajagruti Sabha sought to be banned? And why did the Government of India seek to remove a video from YouTube of a character depcited as Mahatma Gandhi doing a pole dance? More importantly, does freedom come without any sense of responsibility? I would like members on this list to remember, a fact that will not be part of the mainstream discussion, that Husain's son objected to his father being depicted in the nude by an art gallery in Chennai. This depiction was done in retaliation to his depiction of Saraswati in nude. I think it is said that your freedom to swing your arm stops where my nose begns. The issue is whether anyone can trample on the sentiments of others. Of course, this trampling business is a subjective issue. But instead of using the 'artisitic freedom' argument, Fredrick should clearly say whether he thinks the sentiments were hurt or not in this particular case. Others who use 'eminent artist' argument should also answer this question. Sachin Phadte _ Tried the new MSN Messenger? It’s cool! Download now. http://messenger.msn.com/Download/Default.aspx?mkt=en-in
[Goanet] Ghanttis... over the hills
As I looked out of the bus, I suddenly remembered Rajan Parrikar. Yes, it was filled with 'ghantis'. I guess that's what you could call them all -- people crossing over the ghats (the hills along western India), probably unwanted in their destination, and all just travelling because of economic need. But the shoe was on the wrong foot here. The 'ghantis' were speaking Konkani, they were getting set to travel by the Volvo 6 pm bus to Bangalore, and they were all people like you and me! (In fact, I was already on the bus!) They appeared to be largely Goan, going probably for IT-related jobs in India's wannabee Silicon Valley. Couldn't help wondering how Bangaloreans (or Bengalooruuwallahs) see people like us invading their city (well, I've even peed on their roads once... the shortage of toilets is not just limited to Goa... thankfully nobody photographed me... or if they didn,. I didn't get to know.) FN -- Frederick Noronha http://fn.goa-india.org Ph +91-832-2409490
[Goanet] Goa news for February 9, 2008
Goa News from Google News and Goanet.org Visit http://www.goanet.org/newslinks.php for the full stories. *** Babus botch up Olympic hopes of Indian badminton - Merinews [15 hours ago] The organisers had shifted the camps to Goa and Chandigarh from Hyderabad, selected earlier. The Indian Grand Prix, scheduled in April at the same venue, ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/7-0fd=Rurl=http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=130027cid=1129204395ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ *** Goa alert after militant reveals attack plans - Hindu [Feb 7, 2008] Panaji: Goa may have escaped a major terror attack with a suspected militant revealing plans to strike at the tourist State, targeting the crowded ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/0-0fd=Rurl=http://www.hindu.com/2008/02/08/stories/2008020857061200.htmcid=1129486109ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ *** Goa XI in last four - Hindu [Feb 6, 2008] MUMBAI: Goa XI went down 4-3 to Central Railway in the tie-breaker of the quarterfinals of the sixth Sim Clinpharm KSA all-India veterans football ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/5-0fd=Rurl=http://www.hindu.com/2008/02/07/stories/2008020755422200.htmcid=1129659114ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ *** Goa escapes terror attack - NDTV.com [Feb 7, 2008] The Goa government on Thursday revealed that terrorists had planned to attack the state during the Christmas-New Year celebrations, over a month ago. ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/4-0fd=Rurl=http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/story.aspx?id=NEWEN20080040643ch=2/7/2008%202:17:00%20PMcid=1129476509ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ *** Goa on alert after terror threat - Times of India [Feb 7, 2008] He had also convinced his arrested associates Asaduallah Abubaker and Mohammed Asif about the need to create terror in Goa. Ghouse had visited Goa and ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/2-0fd=Rurl=http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/India/Goa_on_alert_after_terror_threat_/articleshow/2765598.cmscid=1129644153ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ *** Mining Resumes in Goa Despite Opposition From Environmentalists - Voice of America [Feb 7, 2008] By Steve Herman Mining, along with tourism, forms the economic backbone of India's seaside state of Goa. Environmental concerns recently halted much of the ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/3-0fd=Rurl=http://www.voanews.com/english/2008-02-07-voa16.cfmcid=1129589971ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ *** Goa BJP demands apology over insult to tricolour at Carnival - Times of India [Feb 6, 2008] PANAJI: Insult to the Indian national flag on Brazilian Float during Carnival parade here has snowballed into a major controversy in Goa with Bharatiya ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/9-0fd=Rurl=http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/India/Goa_BJP_demands_apology_over_insult_to_tricolour_at_Carnival/articleshow/2761500.cmscid=0ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ *** Goa boys excel in sepak takraw - Navhind Times [Feb 7, 2008] Margao, Feb 7 Goa boys got off to a winning start beating Maharashtra 2-0 andUP 2-1 in their opening round matches at 10th sub-junior sepak takraw ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/8-0fd=Rurl=http://www.navhindtimes.com/articles.php?Story_ID=020823cid=0ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ *** SC upholds disqualification of two Goa MLAs - Hindu [Feb 6, 2008] The legislators Dayanand Rayu Mandrekar and another representing Siolim and Vasco-da-gama constituencies were disqualified for being Chairman of the Goa ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/6-0fd=Rurl=http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/002200802062073.htmcid=1129262261ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ *** India Thwarts Terrorist Plan to Attack Tourists Visiting Goa - Bloomberg [23 hours ago] 8 (Bloomberg) -- Indian security forces thwarted a plan by terrorists to attack tourists visiting the western state of Goa, one of India's most popular ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/1-0fd=Rurl=http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601091sid=anpkFTZLR.Z0refer=indiacid=0ei=C_SsR4byDJTcqgPRtoyaDQ Compiled by Goanet News Service http://www.goanet.org/newslinks.php
Re: [Goanet] How would this play in Goa?
To Goanet - Modisation of Mumbai -by Sanjeev Chouhan Wednesday, February 06, 2008 What is happening in Mumbai today is just an echo of what happened in Gujarat in the not too distant past. Don't forget the distant past. 65 million years ago, the dinosaurs were also exterminated by Modi. Mumbai would not have been the affluent and vibrant metropolis it is today, without the contribution of the migrants from the other parts of the country. Had it not been for the Punjabis, the Marwaris, the Biharis and the purbiyas, Mumbai would have remained the fishing community that it was. The migrant nature of the city is what gives it the luster and sheen. Take that, fellow Goans. You have been blind all along to the lustre and sheen wrought by the ghati slums of Indiranagar, Zuarinagar, Monte Dongor, Betim, Vasco etc etc. Only an uncultivated mind would fail to take note of the sublime incandescence bequeathed to the Panjim river promenade and the Panjim jardims by the loitering, urinating and defecating migrants. The fragrance of migrant droppings you complain about - what would Yves Saint Laurent and Calvin Klein not give for a patent on that one, eh? It is the migrants and the Dilliwallahs, dear Goans, who give your otherwise dull and boring land its vibrance and affluence. It is these ghatis who have lifted you casti-clad kharvi bums out of your lazy stupor. And forget not the pearls of wisdom dropped by our Comrades: the migrants bring nuance and interconnectedness to your simple, staid lives. Seriously: only the obscurantist would eulogize the unlivable, noxious hellhole that is Mumbai (or any other Indian city for that matter). This romanticizing of Mumbai as some kind of a didactic beehive of human experience is pure hogwash, peddled by either the Marxists or by some middle-class residents of Mumbai who want to earnestly believe in the delusion as a palliative from the day-to-day pain that is the city. On virtually every index of the quality of life that you can conceive, these Indian cities flop, and flop miserably. Goa is (still, but not for long) the last refuge of the good life in India. I submit that we Goans must do whatever it takes to keep it that way. The aversion to Bihari and UP fellows is not the exclusive preserve of the Raj Thackerayites. Thackeray is only exploiting the already stretched patience of the Mumbaikars. Even the south Indians - the initial target of the Sena's ire, mind you - and other relatively civilized communities in Mumbai hold these waves from up North washing up on the Mumbai shores in contempt. Why, even in the North they are loathed. Check out what the Lt Governor of Delhi said the other day. Ask Sheila Dixit, the Kangress Chief Minister of Delhi, about what the huge influx from UP and Bihar is doing to the capital city. We Goans ignore the warning signals in our midst at our own peril. I can see it all now: in 10 years Goa will be turned into an appalling, squalid swamp by the unchecked influx of ghatis at one end and the rich Indians at the other. Goans - by then, 10% of the 60 lakhs total population of Goa - finally wake up and launch sporadic (impotent) protests. Enter the Marxists, who spin another turgid tract titled Reinventing Goa, where they tell us that Goa was always full of migrants, that it is the migrants who have made Goa what it is, and that these motley crew of Goan hangovers are fantasizing about a past beautiful, serene and civilized Goa that never existed in the first place. Warm regards, r Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
Re: [Goanet] Religion vs science
From: Santosh Helekar [EMAIL PROTECTED] ...Since Fr.Ivo is not a scientist, he is not able to recognize what is nonsense in science. He is not able to understand that there is no such thing as absolutizing science, because science does not claim to know the absolute truth. *Being a scientist, Dr.Santosh is treating vacuum fluctuation as creation from nothing, which is an absurd. It is a change, not a creation... Scientific agnosticism means lack of knowledge. Therefore, a scientific agnostic can never be an absolutist. *Being a scientist, Dr.Santosh proclaims that nothing exists outside empirical verification. In other words, one cannot know about the existence of God, because his existence cannot be proved empirically. Therefore, he absolutizes Science as the only source of knowledge. ...since he is also not able to comprehend the meaning of scientific skepticism... *Being a scientist, Dr.Santosh doubts about anything that cannot be empirically verified. Therefore, he doubts about the reality of God, miracles, Resurrection of Christ, resurrection of body. With this myopic vision, he attacks all the postings dealing with 'supernatural realities'. Finally, not being a scientist Fr. Ivo fails to recognize when religious views amount to nonsense in science, e. g. the anti-evolutionary views of Nigel Britto. That is also why he mistakenly believes that I have attacked the Christian religion. *Nobody is bound to accept evolution, although all of us study it. This is not a 'religious view' or a 'nonsense in science', because Bible does not teach us creation as a scientific hypothesis. Creation is a theological concept, therefore not empirical, but transcendental. Being a scientist, Dr.Santosh is forced to accept evolution, not creation. This is not 'double '. In a previous posting, Dr.Santosh accused me of attributing to him the idea that Religion is a superstition. Answer: When I said in one of my postings: Many have a positivistic tendency to emphasize science and reduce religion to a superstition, Dr.Santosh retorted: This is by and large a good strategy, as long as you exhibit tolerance and congeniality towards people who disagree with you, and respect their right to believe. Did I create from nothing his idea of treating Religion as 'superstition'? Also Dr.Santosh accused me of reading more than Prof.Francisco Ayala said in his interview. I reproduce here the e-mail of Professor Francisco Ayala in answer to my question: Dear Professor Francisco Ayala, I would like to know whether we can say that 'belief/faith' has a role to play in scientific experiments. Thanks! Regards. Fr.Ivo Dear Fr. Ivo: Religious faith and beliefs may motivate and inspire scientific research (as well as any other activities). Scientific research and knowledge concern natural phenomena explained by natural processes. Science cannot prove the existence or non-existence of God. And: surely we use Popper's falsification criteria to test evolutionary hypotheses. Best wishes, Francisco Ayala Regards. Fr.Ivo
[Goanet] Gandhi
Dear Santosh: I have provided you with clear evidence why at least 2 of those facts are blatant lies or half truths at best.Can you comment on them? I have provided references to the writings of Rajendra prasad, the first president of India as well as the official communique issued by the indian government which clearly mentions that it reversed its decision to withheld the money due to pakistan because of gandhijis fast. I agree with you that the hindu jagruti site is crude and has more rhetoric than facts. I have already contacted them and should time permit i will take it upon myself to provide better researched content to their websites. As regards your suspicion, i am afraid you are wrong. I have researched this issue a lot in the past long before i came on goanet. i am willing to argue point by point with you or anyone else on this, except of course a few of the usual suspects that i ignore. regards Chinmay Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
[Goanet] Gandhi
I need to explain the second last Para picked up from my posting under subject Gandhi by Elisabeth Carvalho in her message No 2 in Goanet Digest, Vol 3, Issue 150 Sent on Wednesday, February 06, 2008 Elisabeth rushed with her reply trying to silence me by brain and emotions for a second and in that attempt she tried to shift the goal post to some other point other than the point which was picked up by her from my posting! Pamela Mountbatten showed her guts and gumption to talk about ones' family, especially a mother's relationships in the public. On this count, perhaps one of the rarest accounts of describing relationship is that of Pamela Mountbatten's depiction of her mother Edwina, wife of Lord Mountbatten the last Viceroy of India and Pandit Jawaharlal Nehru's 'love affair' in her book - India Remembered: A Personal Account of the Mountbatten's During the Transfer of Power. Pamela's approach in her book also gives an indication that emotions, sentiments have no value when one talk, writes, discusses about the facts and incidences that occurred in the past. What Pamela mentioned in her book is what I had quoted in my posting. Once you read that book you will get much more information than what I have shared to the net. Nehru - Edwina relations are known all over India much prior to even Pamela wrote the book! And if you still differ with what Pamela wrote about Nehru - Edwina relation you could write to her expressing your feelings, sentiments, etc... Best regards, Dr. U. G. Barad
Re: [Goanet] Science and Churchy reasoning
--- Gilbert Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So your conclusion below - most likely wrong is a mistake. Such basic mistakes are not good for a scientist.:=)) Hi Gilbert, You are most likely wrong about Spinoza because of the wrong assumptions you make in the following quote of yours: He did not undertake one scientific experiment to back up his theoretical models and ethical philosophy about the working of the mind that some Goans are now so engrossed about. Are we Goans going ga-ga because Spinoza was an European (white skin)? The assumption that because he did not do experiments, his theoretical ideas are not relevant, is wrong. Einstein did not do any experiment, as well. Spinoza's ideas are very useful from a historical and practical standpoint today to Goans like me who study the workings of the mind. In fact, the eminent neuroscientist Antonio Damasio has written an entire book entitled Looking for Spinoza to explain how Spinoza's ideas are relevant to modern brain sciences. The assumption behind your pointless reference to his white skin is also wrong. As far as your web link and abstract from the link, I still call not find the link of what is written by or about Spinoza to Goa or Goans which you purport are connected. Can you please enlighten us Goanetters with some more specific facts? The connection to Goans was specifically in reference to your above question regarding Goans who study the workings of the mind, and other Goans like Selma who are interested in such ideas because of a genuine thirst for knowledge. Cheers, Santosh
Re: [Goanet] Science and Churchy reasoning
--- Fr. Ivo da C. Souza [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: *You are wrong on this point. Let me repeat here that the principle of causality has not become obsolete in light of advances made by science. -- Dear Fr. Ivo, Thanks for responding. However, I was not referring to the principle of causality. I am quite unread in matters of science, and find philosophy a difficult read too. I am more a lover of history, economics and politics :-) I was actually referring to a much earlier discussion on this forum about consciousness, monism and dualism. I am ofcourse only cursorily acquainted with these concepts. When I began reading Spinoza, as I said quite a difficult read, I did feel that what at one time must have been esoteric and seminal seemed a bit redundant given what we know about the human mind and human behaviour. The same thing happens to me when I watch a Chekhov play. What must have been progressive thinking at the time, has become commonplace in our own time. warm regards, selma Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
Re: [Goanet] Guardian of the Dawn- by Richard Zimler
True. This has been said many times in the past too. What's interesting is the use of history to settle current-day scores. FN On 08/02/2008, Yogesh Desai [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi! Has any one read this book Guardian of the Dawn- by Richard Zimler in which he mentions 'Goa Inquisition was most merciless and cruel' Regards YOgesh -- Frederick Noronha http://fn.goa-india.org Ph +91-832-2409490 The Goa books blog: http://goabooks.wordpress.com Goa1556 (alt.publishing.goa): http://goa1556.goa-india.org
[Goanet] Govt Teror at Colomb
refer http://mandgoa.blogspot.com/2008/02/believe-it-or-not-goa-police-has-gone.html The villagers are agitating for a basic right to live. The functioning of Hirala and Khodidas mine at Colomb seeks to kill this very right. The villagers in the last week of January closed down the mine. This prompted the mine owner (Fomentos) to keep the mine close for two days but the mine was then started under police protection. However no transportation of ore outside the mine was done. The trucks which were going to operate inside the mine were going through a road made ILLEGALLY by the mining company through reserve Forest. No action was taken by the forest department despite Complaints. On 6th of February Fomentos started transporting the ore through reserve forest via Curpe. The villagers got together and opposed this blatant illegality. However, on 8th Feb at 3 pm, the Goa Police decided to give protection to this illegality by escorting the truck with two jeeps! Agnelo Dias noticed the truck and waved to it to stop. The brave Goa Police led by ASI PV Dessai showed their allegiance to the Fomentos. Agnelo was assaulted and kicked in his private parts. Hearing of this act of bravery of the Goa Police, more than 400 villagers from Colomba, Rivona, Dhadolem, Muscavrem, and Kevona blocked the entire Rivona Colomba road for over 3 hours untill Quepem P.I. Naresh Mamel rushed to the incident site and assured the agitated villagers that such incident of alleged assault will not be repeated in future. Has the Govt of Goa decided to turn terrorist with the people of Goa? Blatant illegalities are being ignored, peaceful protests are treated with contempt the Forest and other Depts are protecting the offenders and the solidarity of the villagers is sought to be undone by the terror of the State. Shame on the henchmen of the rapist mining lobby! All who speak about love for Goa should do their bit for the brave villagers of Colomb. Be ready to show your solidarity and tell the Govt that the rightful protest cannot be stamped out by terror! As the great Harvanshrai Bachan wrote: Itne baazu, Itne sar, ginle dushman dhyan se haarega woh har baazi jo khele hum jee jaan se (The enemy needs to note the raised hands and the upright heads He is set to lose every battle fought with our determined solidarity) in solidarity Pravin Sabnis
Re: [Goanet] How would this play in Goa?
To Goanet - I received this email in late December 2007. The author had requested that his identity not be disclosed. I am reproducing excerpts: Dear Mr. Parrikar I occassionally browse thru issues on [Goanet]... . . Mr Parrikar, I am a member of a group that is fighting a losing battle against SEZ on the Island of Mumbai - Gorai-Utan Belt along the coastline. (the last remaining bastion of the local East Indian Population of Mumbai - the one time sons of the soil) Most Goanetters are blissfully unaware of what SEZ is and what it would mean to their lives in the long term. I know you must be familiar with the SEZ Rules and the Act, but for academic value and sharing, I am listing below informative links about SEZ. My humble suggestion is that you suggest your readers take time to browse these links, only then they will see clearly.. They do not know what is befalling them. (do not mention my name on your forum), I am a native of the island of Bombay (Mumbai) Once Landlords, today landless and so bad economically, socially and culturally that we have been declared an OBC (Other Backward Class). We are a miniscule minority in our own land. We have been overrun by the countless cultures that have descended upon us. The Government took our lands our fields, our homes, all in the name of public utilities..Today there are sprawling slums that have proliferated on these lands as the Govt is unable to maintain what they grabbed for us. These slums have become vote banks for politicians. On the cultural front we have had to abandon and discard our lifestyle, culture, customs, mores and tradditions to accommodate the migrants in Bombay.. God forbid this should happen to Beautiful Goa ! * Regards, r Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
[Goanet] ALEXYZ Daily Cartoon (9Feb08)
DOCTOR: You can't hearYou must be staying next to a Hotel Shack...or by Francisco Sardin'-has home... PATIENT: Yes! To enjoy the visual cartoon please visit: www.alexyztoons.com Site sponsored by www.goasudharop.org
[Goanet] A pause, further pause
People, On this forum one regularly comes across posts -- bewildering analysis on a range of topics, including complex social ills. These are written in the manner of the aesthete, to mean one having a sense of well digested modernity -- memory, convictions and materialism. And of course the succulent olive of egalitarianism to prevent an otherwise lugubrious martini; to go with the sorpotel of modernity. A singular thread runs through them, namely the aversion to past mores and treatments conducted though beliefs as manifested via exegesis of religious texts, bittersweet memories of dalliances and interactions, including caste persuasions and pretensions, and religion as practiced over time. I say aesthete, since very often it is such an individual who presumes that one is above others in ones station in life. The belief is that one has encountered ones share of life, having had deep encounters, blushes and brushes against the effervescently pulchritudinous, while being regarded as remarkable for ones rectitude. Furthermore these presenters have the fortitude to take on hard issues, in a verite format, but consistently shy away from underpinning their attempts at veracity with reasonable references, that support views and flesh out hurts. This is not quite a scholarly forum, and I am not a scholar; but to delve into analytical renderings of ills, which range from Hinduism, to all manners of articulation, and have it be regarded as opinion -- as such exempt from deeper or rather elaborate though -- often needed, is indeed diluting the collective intelligence of the forum. When issues such as development, marriages, the issues that widows have been subjected to (other than to immediately imply sati, which there is no reason for me to just talk about) in all communities, foster children, domestic abuse -- almost non existent on this forum (trigger happy people, note the word -- almost). Everyone on this forum, has at some point posted a solid fact now and then, some consistently and others not so, some of us have erred and mended our ways, some persist on. The path we are on requires us to be be more than modestly understanding of such facts. It is not enough to superficially approach beliefs and religions other than ones own. Comparisons, that are merely tit for tat are best left behind to our college days, and the gallis, mohallas, vaddos, and bastis of our minds. If one has watched Lejim/lezim one will see in the deadly mimicry of the thrust, parry, the lunges; feints and weaves of earlier swordsmanship. Likewise, our thoughts. The deeper the hurts, no matter how sophisticated ones education and erudition; the higher the propensity to repeatedly crash on the rocks of barren intellectual shores. venantius j pinto
[Goanet] Caje's Bhaji - Top 5 on Best Buys, Worst Buys and Bye-Byes!
Hi All, For those of you in Goa who listen to FM Rainbow 105.4Mhz, some of this may be deja vu.Last year I started highlighting my Top 5 lists on my Friday show 'Caje's Bhaji'.Now that FM Rainbow is out of bounds for me, I thought it would be fun to share some of my Top 5 lists here. Last week I'll wrote about my choices on eating out.None of my listings have any vested interest.I paid for my own food and hence was not obliged to be charitable in my reviews. I am overwhelmed by the response received directly in my inbox. Thank you all for sharing your personal preferences and delightful experiences. For those who would like me to cover more of South Goa, in good time I shall. Till then enjoy my personal listing. This week let's go shopping. So here goes... My Top 5 things to buy in Goa: 1. Choricios at Agassiam (Boil them well or else!) 2. Pork Chops from Farmer's Choice, Porvorim (The meat counter man once smiled by mistake) 3. Cashew Feni in bulk from Datta in Revora (PVV sources here, the owner's a teetotaler) 4. Shoes from Janota, either at Ingo's or Porvorim (Expensive but worth every rupee) 5. Sweets from Simonia's, Mapusa market (Doss Bhaji, Dodol, Channa Doss like mama made them!) Top 5 buys to avoid: 1. Spiced cashew nuts (Quality taken a nosedive against soaring prices) 2. Readymade baby clothes (Prices make an adult cry like a baby) 3. Goa port wines (Flavoured denatured spirit with free headaches guaranteed) 4. Imported apples, grapes, pears (pesticide filled, genetically modified) 5. Household items at exhibitions (marked up and short life) Top 5 'bye-byes' for Goans: 1. Taxi/rickshaw journeys (Ransom rates!) 2. Sitting at the sea shore (Take a shack beach bed and order stuff or scram!) 3. Konkani (Goan youth take offence when spoken to in Konkani, think you are undermining their status and/or English speaking ability) 4. Poie (They've become smaller, less huskier and sticky within) 5. Carnaval (Sponsored float parades of distilleries, mobile co's, mnc's) Ah! You've got more on your mind:-) Till next time... Cheers! Cajetan Vaz _ Post ads for free - to sell, rent or even buy.www.yello.in http://ss1.richmedia.in/recurl.asp?pid=186
Re: [Goanet] Hindu janajagruti pamphlet- protesting against M F Hussain
--- Bhandare [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In this particular case, certain hindus felt offended (as is their right to be offended) Bhandare, This whole argument is very ironic. You were most eloquent about Janajagruti's right to host an exhibition about Kashmiri pundits. Obviously freedom of speech extends only to the majority sentiments, while the minority should be happy to be second class citizens of India, with their freedom of speech being a selective issue. It's reasoning like this, that will be the death of modern, secular India. I advise everyone to visit HJS's website and see how organisations such as these are bent on fracturing India. http://www.hindujagruti.org/news/1984.html To Sonia Gomes: I'm sorry you find MF Hussain's art offensive. A visit to a European or American museum or art institution (anything post Picasso and Weber) and you will find a plethora of objectionable art especially insensitive to Christians. The point is not whether MF Hussain's art is objectionable or not, it is that our intellectuals should be given space to breath and think even if their thought-processes are distasteful to us. selma Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[Goanet] OpenJudis....
Amazing resource for legal info (in India). Just go here and search for Goa http://judis.openarchive.in/ Rgds, FN -- Frederick Noronha http://fn.goa-india.org Ph +91-832-2409490 The Goa books blog: http://goabooks.wordpress.com Goa1556 (alt.publishing.goa): http://goa1556.goa-india.org
[Goanet] Limerick mhane : )
Konknni morchina. Kai he a.shakya assa tumhala vatt.th. Tichi myrtyu asheatat pushkal zan Bhas ulloitele zantte -- hi pidi sheotoli -- fuddli pidi pottoteli tichea vengent Lajjaspad ghost hi -- anik kai -- kuthea re he Konnkivadi -- nusta kahi tari badbadtat Aiz je loztat falleam tem roddtole -- voi; punn porvam novea urbevont ullovpi ubhe zatele. Man hi utram, bestinch thoddi chintnam --- Bhaguya, Pahuya shanya. Bai/baba sounsar lamb assa. From: Shanti Dhoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Goanet] LIMERICK FOR THE DAY III Will Konkani be dead in fifty years? That's top of the list of Goans' fears. Isn't it a crime That but for a stitch in time Konkani-lovers will be reduced to tears.
Re: [Goanet] Pamphlet Circulated for Hindu Dharmajagruti Sabha - protest against MF Husain !!
To Goanet - I have no issues whatsoever with MF Hussein or anyone else doing erotic and even vulgar paintings of Hindu gods and goddesses. Yes, some of the depiction may offend me, but a mature, civilized society ought to be able to absorb slights to its cherished beliefs, and offer its members freedom of expression without fear. I wish Hindus would show such maturity even in the face of extreme provocation. My problem with the Husseins and his vociferous defenders is entirely different. It is that they are pusillanimous hypocrites. Hussein wouldn't dare sketch a portrait of Allah or Prophet Mohammed for he well knows the outcome of such indulgence, and the prospect of a missing body part or a bomb going off under his feet is not one he would find pleasant to contemplate. Regards, r Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[Goanet] Baseless allegations against HJS
Pravin-da: Can you provide some examples why you are alleging that HJS is a casteist organization? i am in touch with a few of their office bearers and should you provide some evidence i will definitely take up the isue with them and seek clarifications. regards B Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [Goanet] Gandhi
--- Dr. U. G. Barad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Elisabeth rushed with her reply trying to silence me by brain and emotions for a second and in that attempt she tried to shift the goal post to some -- Arrey Dotor Barad, I am not contesting Lady Mountbatten's relationship with Nehru, I am only making the point that neither Mrs Carvalho nor Lady Mountbatten are or were capable of trying to silence anyone's brains and emotions, least of all a man like Nehru's. Nehru was an intellectual par excellence, and holding his relationship with Edwina responsible for the creation of Pakistan, is like saying Bill Clinton couldn't bring about Middle East peace because he was occupied with Monica. selma Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [Goanet] Religion vs Science
Dear Dr.Gilbert, Thanks for your appreciation and support. On a personal level, I see many situations where science will find it difficult to explain. Not infrequently, I will see a patient I have treated with advanced cancer, who with overwhelming statistics is supposed to live for about 4 months. Yet, the patient is alive three years later, without cancer. I could say their survival was because of the radiation that I administered. Or would I rather say (to myself), as this patient embraces me with gratitude that, this is a 'miracle patient'; and I am glad that I was an instrument in God's hand? Is this Religion VS Science? Or is it Religion AND Science? *We face such questions and situations. I would be strict in having a thorough investigation by competent people. I would not say that every healing is a miracle, but there can be an 'extraordinary healing' and a 'true miracle' with all the required conditions. It is up to the physician to say that this is not possible for the medical science. The theologian will say: This is God's intervention. I have heard physicians speak of 'miracles' even within their own specialization. Miracles should not be cheapened. I read about Miracles of Lourdes. Out of 7,000 there are only 67 accepted as true miracles. They are carefully investigated by the Medical Bureau and then submitted to the judgment of the Theological Committee. Regards. Fr.Ivo Here is the procedure followed in Lourdes: Medical Bureau has two different meanings. It is, first of all, a place in the Sanctuary with two offices where a Doctor practices. This Doctor receives the declarations and begins an examination of the facts according to the traditional criteria as it was defined in the 18th century by Cardinal Lambertini the future Pope Benedict XIV for the process of beatification (There are some modifications). If the case appears serious, the doctor arranges a Medical Bureau which is a consultation where all the medical Doctors, regardless of their religious persuasion, present in the Sanctuary on the day may attend. If the Doctor of Lourdes and the gathered medical bureau find in favour the file is sent to the International Medical Committee of Lourdes (C.M.I.L.). This is made up of some 20 members, respected in their own particular area. This committee has been in existence since 1947. In 1954, Bishop Théas wanted it to have a true international dimension. This committee is chaired jointly by the Bishop of Tarbes and Lourdes and one of its members nominated by the Bishop for a set period of time which can be renewed. The doctor of Lourdes is the secretary to this committee. This committee makes a judgement about a case. One or more of its members are then charged with examining it in detail and informing himself on all the medical literature published on related subjects... The person charged with the case may consult with colleagues on the outside. Normally the person concerned is not summoned to be present. The Committee meets once a year, in the autumn. They examine the current files. When everything is in place (this can take some time), the Committee decides by way of a vote whether to declare or refuse to confirm that this cure is inexplicable according to present scientific knowledge. A two-third majority is required for an affirmative vote. The medical result is sent to the Bishop of the Diocese where the cured person lives. The Bishop would, naturally, have been kept up to date with the proceedings. If it appears that the result is going to be positive, the Bishop is advised, in advance, to set up locally a small Medical Committee which can, at the given moment, consider the conclusions of the Committee. In the light of current events, the Bishop can decide or abstain from recognising the miraculous character of this cure. The current attitude of Doctors is very respectful of the Magisterium of the Church. As Christians, they know that a miracle is a spiritual sign. They don't want to be judges on this matter. Moreover, for a modern mentality, it is difficult to say that something is inexplicable. They can only say that it is unexplained. +Jacques Perrier Bishop of Tarbes and Lourdes 17 March 2003
[Goanet] disgraceful, dishonest attacks
Hello Goanet, There are two very important things to remember when looking at the disgraceful baying against M. F. Husain which has had the effect of hounding a grand old man from his homeland. 1) Few in the ragged mob of Husain-bashing extremists have actually seen the paintings they are so eager to burn. To pick just one example from a very recent post on Goanet, there is no Husain painting of nude sita in a sexually explicit pose with hanuman. 2) Husain has a huge number of paintings in a very long, improbable and distinguished career. These include literally thousands which interpret episodes and themes from our common cultural inheritance. Anyone familiar with this ouevre will attest to Husain's overtly devotional treatment of Indian themes, prominently shaded by Hinduism, in a lifelong trend that's lasted a solid sixty years! You may not like his art, or respect it very much (I confess I'm in this category), but it is entirely shameless to pillory Husain on trumped-up charges. This recent interview with Husain, from Tehelka magazine, is poignant and revealing: http://www.tehelka.com/story_main37.asp?filename=Ne020208in_hindu_culture.asp VM
