[hlds] VAC issue
Hello guys and gals.. im still waiting on a response about why my server is not VAC protected... need help.. freakin dumba** hackers come in daily.. HELP!!! ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] VAC issue
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] VAC2 doesn't seem to do a damn thing for HLDS, the cheats are as rampant as ever. For SRCDS though it seems to be doing a pretty good job. Time to break out the tin foil hats On 11/21/05, archie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Hello guys and gals.. im still waiting on a response about why my server > is > not VAC protected... need help.. freakin dumba** hackers come in daily.. > HELP!!! > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] VAC issue
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] I can't beleive we don't have a serverwiki article about VAC yet and how to ensure that it comes up On 11/21/05, Whisper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > VAC2 doesn't seem to do a damn thing for HLDS, the cheats are as rampant > as ever. For SRCDS though it seems to be doing a pretty good job. > Time to break out the tin foil hats > On 11/21/05, archie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Hello guys and gals.. im still waiting on a response about why my server > > is > > not VAC protected... need help.. freakin dumba** hackers come in daily.. > > > > HELP!!! > > > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] VAC issue
-secure in the command line right? or was it secure "1" in liblist.gam file? I forget to be honest haven't messed with a 1.6 server in almost a year. I know it was one of those two. Just can't remember which, but I agree with whisper this should be in the wiki *) ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] VAC issue
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Default is on anyway. Part of vac2 ip & port setting is broken (valve aware and fixing) so some of the problems "may" be because of that, I've certainly had that before anyway. Quite possibly its a different problem though, was it working beforehand and just stopped, or never worked? On 11/21/05, StealthMode <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > -secure in the command line right? > > or was it secure "1" in liblist.gam file? > > I forget to be honest haven't messed with a 1.6 server in almost a year. I > know it was one of those two. Just can't remember which, but I agree with > whisper this should be in the wiki *) > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
I really cannot believe that this list is still being populated by people that DO NOT UNDERSTAND THIS ISSUE CLEARLY. Morover they are willing to ENFORCE INCORRECT SETTINGS ON OTHERS! With the apparent reliance on those settings coming from BAD SERVER CONFIGURATION. Wake up, and stop abusing cexec, which you SHOULD NOT USE TO DO THIS. More inline... > Is using a cmdrate that is lower then it should be aka > cl_cmdrate 0-10 on broadband connections considered cheating? If sv_minupdaterate is set to 0, this can be a problem. If you want to solve your problem, set this to a non-moronic level, like 12 or so to support low bandwidth clients, or if you have predominantly broadband players, set it to 20. Don't bother to set it higher than 20 or your clients with default settings may "lag". > I ask because I am seeing this widespread throughout the > servers I have travelled (as well as my own). I ban for it, > because imo it is rate hacking, just wanted the communities > input on this one. Cl_cmdrate when set very low produces a false value for ping in the score panel. This doesn't seem to affect the servers internal RTT's, although I don't know why there is a difference, Alfred? > From what I can tell using this setting on broadband causes > you to warp to other players making you almost impossible to hit. 1. This shouldn't cause warping unless sv_maxunlag is set too low, along with YOUR (not the rater, but YOU) cl_interp is too low! 2. Warping affects that player aswell as his adversary (*if* it's a problem with *his* setting, else it's actually just your settings!). His bullets will fire from the position he was in (by the servers knowledge) at the angle he was facing, this does not properly sync at such low rates. In other words, is as much a trouble for him as it is for you. > I have written vALVE offlist in hopes they look at this issue > and lock the cvar someday. But I am curious what my fellow > admins think. So please reply with your thoughts. And please, > lets keep it civil, no feeding the trolls. 8) I don't think locking it is the right thing to do. I love playing on a server where I can get 100/100, but in order to do so, I have to turn my client graphics settings down till I get consistently over 100fps to use it without client choke. At the moment many of my personal regular games are coming from a 33 tick server though, and as such I play with 33/33. I am on a very high bandwidth link, so networking issues aren't much of a problem for me, but still, I DON'T want to see these vars "locked", a restricted range might make sense. To be honest though, people just need to learn to configure their server cvars properly. Personally I don't suffer issues with rates, mine or anyone else's. I've run test servers from ADSL connections with sv_maxupdaterate 12, and they feel smoother than most of the commercial gameservers out there, despite the average ping ending up over 50 for more than 8 players. Each and every player was happy with the performance. Clearly, you're rates are probably set too high, not too low, and your latency timers are far too short. > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bush > Sent: 21 November 2005 06:49 > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: Re: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > I fix their rates for them.. I have a key binded on my server > to adjust everyones rates at the same time. this is done > using mani mod > > ma_cexec_all cl_cmdrate 60; ma_cexec_all cl_update 100; > ma_cexec_all rate 25000 > > Bush WELL THANKS FOR CHOKING EVERYONE UP YOU MORON. No really, this kind of admin abuse really gets me riled. YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE ACCESS TO THAT, MANI's CHOICES ARE IMO DANGEROUS. Ever found host_writeconfig? I bet after mentioning it, you'll hit that too. Before you do though, would you mind going onto a low end client who's getting around 30fps, and setting those values. Try and play for a bit. ~Notice the massive choke on both channels - these settings ARE NOT GOOD FOR EVERYONE. Stop forcing people to run you're un-educated settings. Thanks. > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Payton > Sent: 21 November 2005 07:03 > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > -- > How about locking it down to a specific range? Like 20 to 100 > - no higher, and definately no lower? It's a good command to > leave adjustable, as I regularly adjust mine depending on the > server I play on. > > Make to where if someone puts in a value between 0-19, it > defaults to 20. NO NO NO NO NO. Sv_maxupdaterate < 20 is used in many places, and produces more than workable servers. You're clearly totally inexperienced with low rate servers, which suggests your true understanding of rates is poor anyway. If you're servers "lagging" with someones rate set to 12, you have incorrect
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
I'll just get right to the point: 1) Even tho it seems like it sometimes, not all of the admins who contribute to this list are morons. In fact, some of them just might have been doing this longer than you. 2) Some of the server side cvars for source are broken - sv_minrate for example. 3) Last I checked, cl_cmdrate isnt affected by sv_minupdaterate/sv_maxupdatearte so much as cl_updaterate is. 4) A player with a cl_cmdrate rate lower than default, gains an advantage by not being able to be hit like other legit players in the server are. The closer cl_cmdrate gets to 0, the more difficult it becomes. It doesn't matter how your server cvars are set, that's a fact. 5) My server, my rules - if I choose to use cexec on a client that's cheating/exploiting, I'll do it and I am well within my rights to do so. As is every other admin who pays for and runs a server. James, you almost always have something useful to contribute to the mailing list here. This time tho, you're out of line. Have I learned a few tips and tricks from the list? Sure... Anyone who can sift thru the bullshit here has. However, I don't need you or anyone to tell me how I should be running my server, I've been doing this for a helluva long time, and I'm pretty sure I can tell when someone is using a setting they shouldn't be that is giving them an unfair advantage over others. Try staying on topic, contribute to the discussion where it counts, and lose the holier-than-thou attitude. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Tucker Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 11:40 PM To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate I really cannot believe that this list is still being populated by people that DO NOT UNDERSTAND THIS ISSUE CLEARLY. Morover they are willing to ENFORCE INCORRECT SETTINGS ON OTHERS! With the apparent reliance on those settings coming from BAD SERVER CONFIGURATION. Wake up, and stop abusing cexec, which you SHOULD NOT USE TO DO THIS. More inline... > Is using a cmdrate that is lower then it should be aka cl_cmdrate 0-10 > on broadband connections considered cheating? If sv_minupdaterate is set to 0, this can be a problem. If you want to solve your problem, set this to a non-moronic level, like 12 or so to support low bandwidth clients, or if you have predominantly broadband players, set it to 20. Don't bother to set it higher than 20 or your clients with default settings may "lag". > I ask because I am seeing this widespread throughout the servers I > have travelled (as well as my own). I ban for it, because imo it is > rate hacking, just wanted the communities input on this one. Cl_cmdrate when set very low produces a false value for ping in the score panel. This doesn't seem to affect the servers internal RTT's, although I don't know why there is a difference, Alfred? > From what I can tell using this setting on broadband causes you to > warp to other players making you almost impossible to hit. 1. This shouldn't cause warping unless sv_maxunlag is set too low, along with YOUR (not the rater, but YOU) cl_interp is too low! 2. Warping affects that player aswell as his adversary (*if* it's a problem with *his* setting, else it's actually just your settings!). His bullets will fire from the position he was in (by the servers knowledge) at the angle he was facing, this does not properly sync at such low rates. In other words, is as much a trouble for him as it is for you. > I have written vALVE offlist in hopes they look at this issue and lock > the cvar someday. But I am curious what my fellow admins think. So > please reply with your thoughts. And please, lets keep it civil, no > feeding the trolls. 8) I don't think locking it is the right thing to do. I love playing on a server where I can get 100/100, but in order to do so, I have to turn my client graphics settings down till I get consistently over 100fps to use it without client choke. At the moment many of my personal regular games are coming from a 33 tick server though, and as such I play with 33/33. I am on a very high bandwidth link, so networking issues aren't much of a problem for me, but still, I DON'T want to see these vars "locked", a restricted range might make sense. To be honest though, people just need to learn to configure their server cvars properly. Personally I don't suffer issues with rates, mine or anyone else's. I've run test servers from ADSL connections with sv_maxupdaterate 12, and they feel smoother than most of the commercial gameservers out there, despite the average ping ending up over 50 for more than 8 players. Each and every player was happy with the performance. Clearly, you're rates are probably set too high, not too low, and your latency timers are far too short. > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bush > Sent: 21 November 2005 06:49 > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: Re: [hlds]
Re: [hlds] VAC issue
Perviously posted here on the list but repeated for those asking: for HLDS: 1. The server will only enter secure mode when it first runs. 2. There is nothing you can do to change the server secure or insecure status once it's running. 3. There is no sv_secure command. 4. There is no -secure console command. 5. "-insecure" is a command line switch only and does not work in the console 6. -insecure overrides both the liblist secure "1" and the GUI checkbox 7. by default the server will start secure if secure is set in liblist.gam. 8. secure "1" must be in liblist.gam for secure to work at all. 9. secure "1" is missing from liblist.gam (or commented out) the server will not be able to enter secure mode (interpreted as "0") 10. unchecking the box in the GUI or adding -insecure in the command line overrides the secure "1" setting in liblist.gam 11. secure "0" in liblist.gam always disables VAC regardless of any other setting. 12. You must shut the server down, change the settings and then restart for the server to change it's secure or insecure state. so here is the table: --- liblist cmdline . GUI secure -insecure .. checkbox VAC . comment . --- 0, .. not present, unchecked ... OFF 0, .. not present, checked .. OFF 0, .. present, . unchecked OFF 0, .. present, . checked ... OFF 1, .. not present, unchecked OFF .. NOTE: -console VAC mode ON 1, .. not present, checked ON ... NOTE: -console VAC mode ON 1, .. present, . unchecked OFF 1, .. present, . checked ... OFF - Original Message - From: "StealthMode" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 1:13 AM Subject: Re: [hlds] VAC issue -secure in the command line right? or was it secure "1" in liblist.gam file? I forget to be honest haven't messed with a 1.6 server in almost a year. I know it was one of those two. Just can't remember which, but I agree with whisper this should be in the wiki *) ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] change of email question
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] The answer was in the message you sent! On 21/11/05, Osamah Anjum <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > how would i go about changing my email address for my subscription for > this as well as hlds_annouce list. > > thanx > > > > - > Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] Spammers harvesting from this list?
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] No spam for me. Dan On 21/11/05, Whisper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > 2nd gmail > Hardly any spam at all. > > On 11/21/05, bob jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > On 11/20/05, Mark Mandelaro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > -- > > > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > > fortunately no. i use gmail, it has a great filter. > > > > > > On 11/20/05, Ook <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > During the last few weeks I've been innundated with spam to the > email > > > > address I use on the list, and I'm wondering if some spammer has > come > > here > > > > to harvest email address. Has anyone else had problems with extra > spam > > to > > > > the address you use here? > > > > > > > > > > > > ___ > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > archives, > > > > please visit: > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > ___ > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > nope > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] why should cl_cmdrate be considered a cheat cvar or locked down? As a player I run at an 85 cmdrate OR ELSE I GET CHOKE CONSTANTLY. Why the hell do you want to 'fix' a client side rate setting anyway?? Just because a server is hooked up to a xx MB/s line does not mean the client is as fortunate!!! Add to that, I need to run a cl_updaterate of 15 for servers I ping over 50 for, whereas I can run this setting at 100 or even 200 on low-ping servers. Instead of suggesting locking this or locking that or messing up this rate value etc, why don't you find a config that works and on top of that stop inducing choke and loss with low rate settings on the server. All you are doing is ruining a game experience by making the game 'unfun' with skippy erratic response and it just turns people off. Until then, leave the client settings alone. We don't appreciate it. --Ozz p.s. yes I run servers too. -- Original message -- > Actually, 20 is too low for cl_cmdrate - 30 is the default setting for that. > I agree that having a usable range for that cvar is a better option. Some > cvars however, like cl_interpolate, need to be locked down to 1. > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Payton > Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 9:03 PM > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > -- > How about locking it down to a specific range? Like 20 to 100 - no higher, > and definately no lower? It's a good command to leave adjustable, as I > regularly adjust mine depending on the server I play on. > > Make to where if someone puts in a value between 0-19, it defaults to 20. > > Rick Payton, IT Support > Morikawa & Associates > (808) 572-1745 > http://www.mai-hawaii.com/ > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of K2 > Sent: Sun 11/20/2005 9:06 PM > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > I have also recently emailed Alfred about a few things, and did mention > certain cvars (cl_cmdrate was one of 'em) that at this point need to be > locked down or at the very least under the realm of sv_cheats. If enough > admins voice their concerns, maybe something will be done about it. > > - K2 > -- > [ winmail.dat of type application/ms-tnef deleted ] > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please > visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] change of email question
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] oh my god - that's funny LoL! On 11/21/05, Dan Stevens (IAmAI) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > The answer was in the message you sent! > > On 21/11/05, Osamah Anjum <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > -- > > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > how would i go about changing my email address for my subscription for > > this as well as hlds_annouce list. > > > > thanx > > > > > > > > - > > Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. > > -- > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
Ozz, please... Read the entire thread before posting. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 1:24 AM To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] why should cl_cmdrate be considered a cheat cvar or locked down? As a player I run at an 85 cmdrate OR ELSE I GET CHOKE CONSTANTLY. Why the hell do you want to 'fix' a client side rate setting anyway?? Just because a server is hooked up to a xx MB/s line does not mean the client is as fortunate!!! Add to that, I need to run a cl_updaterate of 15 for servers I ping over 50 for, whereas I can run this setting at 100 or even 200 on low-ping servers. Instead of suggesting locking this or locking that or messing up this rate value etc, why don't you find a config that works and on top of that stop inducing choke and loss with low rate settings on the server. All you are doing is ruining a game experience by making the game 'unfun' with skippy erratic response and it just turns people off. Until then, leave the client settings alone. We don't appreciate it. --Ozz p.s. yes I run servers too. -- Original message -- > Actually, 20 is too low for cl_cmdrate - 30 is the default setting for that. > I agree that having a usable range for that cvar is a better option. > Some cvars however, like cl_interpolate, need to be locked down to 1. > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Payton > Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 9:03 PM > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > -- > How about locking it down to a specific range? Like 20 to 100 - no > higher, and definately no lower? It's a good command to leave > adjustable, as I regularly adjust mine depending on the server I play on. > > Make to where if someone puts in a value between 0-19, it defaults to 20. > > Rick Payton, IT Support > Morikawa & Associates > (808) 572-1745 > http://www.mai-hawaii.com/ > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of K2 > Sent: Sun 11/20/2005 9:06 PM > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > I have also recently emailed Alfred about a few things, and did > mention certain cvars (cl_cmdrate was one of 'em) that at this point > need to be locked down or at the very least under the realm of > sv_cheats. If enough admins voice their concerns, maybe something will be done about it. > > - K2 > -- > [ winmail.dat of type application/ms-tnef deleted ] > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please > visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] This is what got me started: > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of K2 > Sent: Sun 11/20/2005 9:06 PM > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > I have also recently emailed Alfred about a few things, and did > mention certain cvars (cl_cmdrate was one of 'em) that at this point > need to be locked down or at the very least under the realm of > sv_cheats. If enough admins voice their concerns, maybe something will be done about it. > > - K2 I don't want Alfred thinking you speak for me on this one. As a player and as an admin. --Ozz -- Original message -- > Ozz, please... Read the entire thread before posting. > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 1:24 AM > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > why should cl_cmdrate be considered a cheat cvar or locked down? As a > player I run at an 85 cmdrate OR ELSE I GET CHOKE CONSTANTLY. Why the hell > do you want to 'fix' a client side rate setting anyway?? Just because a > server is hooked up to a xx MB/s line does not mean the client is as > fortunate!!! > > Add to that, I need to run a cl_updaterate of 15 for servers I ping over 50 > for, whereas I can run this setting at 100 or even 200 on low-ping servers. > > > Instead of suggesting locking this or locking that or messing up this rate > value etc, why don't you find a config that works and on top of that stop > inducing choke and loss with low rate settings on the server. All you are > doing is ruining a game experience by making the game 'unfun' with skippy > erratic response and it just turns people off. > > > Until then, leave the client settings alone. We don't appreciate it. > > --Ozz > > p.s. yes I run servers too. > > -- Original message -- > > > Actually, 20 is too low for cl_cmdrate - 30 is the default setting for > that. > > I agree that having a usable range for that cvar is a better option. > > Some cvars however, like cl_interpolate, need to be locked down to 1. > > > > -Original Message- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Payton > > Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 9:03 PM > > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > -- > > How about locking it down to a specific range? Like 20 to 100 - no > > higher, and definately no lower? It's a good command to leave > > adjustable, as I regularly adjust mine depending on the server I play on. > > > > Make to where if someone puts in a value between 0-19, it defaults to 20. > > > > Rick Payton, IT Support > > Morikawa & Associates > > (808) 572-1745 > > http://www.mai-hawaii.com/ > > > > -Original Message- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of K2 > > Sent: Sun 11/20/2005 9:06 PM > > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > > > > I have also recently emailed Alfred about a few things, and did > > mention certain cvars (cl_cmdrate was one of 'em) that at this point > > need to be locked down or at the very least under the realm of > > sv_cheats. If enough admins voice their concerns, maybe something will be > done about it. > > > > - K2 > > -- > > [ winmail.dat of type application/ms-tnef deleted ] > > -- > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please > > visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please > visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
Alright, lemme clear up any mis-understanding. What would be ideal is if certain cvars, such as cl_cmdrate, were limited to limited range of settings. That range being 30 (default) up to 100 would be ideal. Going lower than 30 for cl_cmdrate is where we start to have issues. For a cvar like cl_interpolate, that's something in my opinion that should be locked in at 1. Sorry for any confusion there. - K2 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 7:08 AM To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] This is what got me started: > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of K2 > Sent: Sun 11/20/2005 9:06 PM > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > I have also recently emailed Alfred about a few things, and did > mention certain cvars (cl_cmdrate was one of 'em) that at this point > need to be locked down or at the very least under the realm of > sv_cheats. If enough admins voice their concerns, maybe something will > be done about it. > > - K2 I don't want Alfred thinking you speak for me on this one. As a player and as an admin. --Ozz -- Original message -- > Ozz, please... Read the entire thread before posting. > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 1:24 AM > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] why should cl_cmdrate > be considered a cheat cvar or locked down? As a player I run at an > 85 cmdrate OR ELSE I GET CHOKE CONSTANTLY. Why the hell do you want to > 'fix' a client side rate setting anyway?? Just because a server is > hooked up to a xx MB/s line does not mean the client is as > fortunate!!! > > Add to that, I need to run a cl_updaterate of 15 for servers I ping > over 50 for, whereas I can run this setting at 100 or even 200 on low-ping servers. > > > Instead of suggesting locking this or locking that or messing up this > rate value etc, why don't you find a config that works and on top of > that stop inducing choke and loss with low rate settings on the > server. All you are doing is ruining a game experience by making the > game 'unfun' with skippy erratic response and it just turns people off. > > > Until then, leave the client settings alone. We don't appreciate it. > > --Ozz > > p.s. yes I run servers too. > > -- Original message -- > > > Actually, 20 is too low for cl_cmdrate - 30 is the default setting > > for > that. > > I agree that having a usable range for that cvar is a better option. > > Some cvars however, like cl_interpolate, need to be locked down to 1. > > > > -Original Message- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Payton > > Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 9:03 PM > > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > -- > > How about locking it down to a specific range? Like 20 to 100 - no > > higher, and definately no lower? It's a good command to leave > > adjustable, as I regularly adjust mine depending on the server I play on. > > > > Make to where if someone puts in a value between 0-19, it defaults to 20. > > > > Rick Payton, IT Support > > Morikawa & Associates > > (808) 572-1745 > > http://www.mai-hawaii.com/ > > > > -Original Message- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of K2 > > Sent: Sun 11/20/2005 9:06 PM > > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > > > > I have also recently emailed Alfred about a few things, and did > > mention certain cvars (cl_cmdrate was one of 'em) that at this point > > need to be locked down or at the very least under the realm of > > sv_cheats. If enough admins voice their concerns, maybe something > > will be > done about it. > > > > - K2 > > -- > > [ winmail.dat of type application/ms-tnef deleted ] > > -- > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > archives, please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > archives, please > > visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please > visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mai
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
Oz, some people on broadband are using a cl_cmdrate setting that causes warping. They are purposely doing this to become harder to hit. This has been deemed a rate hack by quite a few people both on and off this list. In response to this widespread rate hack, some of us server ops would like to see the minimum raised or worst case the cvar to be locked totally, and determined by valve depending on how you ping to their servers. So please don't come at us in this fashion, instead seek out those that would hack this rate and confront them. We are merely dealing with a problem we are facing every day. And asking valve to help us. By default, the lowest cmdrate I have ever seen steam assign is 30. People who are using lower settings on broadband know what they are doing. They are doing it purposely and unbalancing the playing field with their intentional warping, hence cheating. StealthMode ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] I play on dial-up and personally have never found the need to go below the 30 default. I also adjust it for people who have it below default on my servers, most of the time they never even notice. On 11/21/05, StealthMode <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Oz, some people on broadband are using a cl_cmdrate setting that causes > warping. They are purposely doing this to become harder to hit. This has > been deemed a rate hack by quite a few people both on and off this list. > > In response to this widespread rate hack, some of us server ops would like > to see the minimum raised or worst case the cvar to be locked totally, and > determined by valve depending on how you ping to their servers. > > So please don't come at us in this fashion, instead seek out those that > would hack this rate and confront them. We are merely dealing with a > problem > we are facing every day. And asking valve to help us. By default, the > lowest > cmdrate I have ever seen steam assign is 30. People who are using lower > settings on broadband know what they are doing. They are doing it > purposely > and unbalancing the playing field with their intentional warping, hence > cheating. > > StealthMode > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
Now look, you clearly haven't done your homework, and this is why I get so
goddamn riled over this issue, which people
eventually come to agree over, then a couple of months later, the same stupid
suggestion is made.
30 is ONLY the default for broadband settings in Steam. You clearly DON'T as I
said in my last mail, have any experience
optimising slower links or servers for clients with slower links.
If you think cl_cmdrate < 30 is a problem - you haven't tested in a sandboxed
environment. -I HAVE. IT WORKS FINE.
I DID POST A TEST SERVER ADDRESS AS PROOF, WHICH YOU FAILED TO CHECK.
I know I was rude, but there is a reason, -the community never bloody listens-.
It's not targeted at any particular
individual, but the NOTION that your suggestions are workable. Before you know
it, half the CS:S community are crying
out for something that will only damage the gameplay of nearly half the
community. Talk about self harm.
You may want to have _some_ restriction put on cl_cmdrate, however, above 30 IS
NOT IT. (Note, there is one, which I
think also hasn't been noticed, it's 10).
Once again, as I said in my previous mail, settings of cl_cmdrate 12 SHOULD NOT
CREATE LAG. If they do, your server or
client or both are malconfigured. This is a fact, please figure this one out
before you respond with the same thing
again, as I've seen it enough times already.
Cl_interpolate 0 does not help clients win, again, unless your server is
malconfigured. The bug that allows for
cl_interpolate 0 and cl_interp still to delay _may_ contribute to some kills,
however we have proven that if someone can
react so accurately to clear space, accurately with a Xms delay, they can react
just as well seeing in the first place.
In short, it's not really an advantage, people just think it is, and whinge. In
case you've never noticed, the only
players that whinge are players that are loosing at the time, and this accounts
for most of the CS:S community. The game
isn't broken, the player isn't playing properly. Yes, CS:S is the kind of game
where you die very very quickly if you're
not on good form, and YES it is frustrating, especially for most kids. This IS
the true source of most of the community
complaints, the rest are from malconfigurations.
Now please, if you want to suggest some restrictions or major changes to the
game's netcode, would you please be so kind
as to research ALL areas of it's use first. Not just focus on one server and
one sub-community of settings.
With regard to cl_updaterate and cl_cmdrate interacting with sv_minupdaterate:
You are correct that sv_minupdaterate does not affect cl_cmdrate, however it is
also the case that cl_cmdrate has a
minimum setting of 10. If sv_maxunlag is set to 1, you can miss over 100
packets before the server refuses to unlag. If
are observing a player with these settings, then a cl_interp 0.1 will allow 10
losses prior to a warp, if you have
cl_interp 0.05 it's only 5. The round trip time between you and the server can
also affect this, as mismatched rates
will not allow for the significant turn around time of 100ms + enemy ping +
server delay + your ping + your interp. Once
again, there are server settings required to alleviate the problem, along with
reasonable client settings. Just out of
interest, with those same players on have you tried "revert all" on both the
client and the server?
Finally, a note about some wireless players ("the common warp" / "warp factor
nine") - I have noticed that there are an
increasing number of wireless users who have been encouraged to turn their
rates down to help warping issues. These
players seem to have no understanding of the reason behind their periodic
choke+/loss issues. FYI - wireless
(802.11(a/b/g)) does not provide a stable continual packet stream - all
suggestions to the contrary are false. As a
consiquence of this, wireless users, depending on their configuration, frame
sizes and TDMA policy will receive lag
occasionally. This is a problem BELOW the IP layer, and is NOT solvable by
client or server settings. Wireless clients
should be encouraged to go get wires.
N.B. This does not apply to long range microwave links (necessarily), however
these links have typically higher latency
than copper anyway, and aren't used too much in this industry.
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of K2
> Sent: 21 November 2005 18:05
> To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com
> Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate
>
> Alright, lemme clear up any mis-understanding. What would be
> ideal is if certain cvars, such as cl_cmdrate, were limited
> to limited range of settings. That range being 30 (default)
> up to 100 would be ideal. Going lower than 30 for cl_cmdrate
> is where we start to have issues.
>
> For a cvar like cl_interpolate, that's something in my
> opinion that should be locked in at 1.
>
> Sorry for any confusion there.
>
> - K2
>
> -Original Message-
> From:
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
Check net_channels to see whats really going on > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian > M Frain (eternal) > Sent: 21 November 2005 19:25 > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: Re: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] I play on > dial-up and personally have never found the need to go below > the 30 default. I also adjust it for people who have it below > default on my servers, most of the time they never even notice. > > > On 11/21/05, StealthMode <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Oz, some people on broadband are using a cl_cmdrate setting that > > causes warping. They are purposely doing this to become > harder to hit. > > This has been deemed a rate hack by quite a few people both > on and off this list. > > > > In response to this widespread rate hack, some of us server > ops would > > like to see the minimum raised or worst case the cvar to be locked > > totally, and determined by valve depending on how you ping > to their servers. > > > > So please don't come at us in this fashion, instead seek out those > > that would hack this rate and confront them. We are merely dealing > > with a problem we are facing every day. And asking valve to > help us. > > By default, the lowest cmdrate I have ever seen steam assign is 30. > > People who are using lower settings on broadband know what they are > > doing. They are doing it purposely and unbalancing the > playing field > > with their intentional warping, hence cheating. > > > > StealthMode > > > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the > list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > archives, please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] Plugins for AdminMod
Edson Sossai wrote: M0gely Why you basically change from AdminMod to AMX? I used AMX for years and i always liked. The probleam was that my server was really lagging when sonebody said to give it a try to AdminMod because is to way less CPU usage and true or not my server never choke or froze after i switched to AdminMod. Does that make sense at all? Or i was probably with some bad AMX plugins running that caused that? I know is hard to answers without seem the server and stuff but this thing about AMX being much more CPU Usage than AdminMod it really true? A while ago I did some performance testing with Adminmod and AMX. In their default configuration, and with a few light weight plugins added to each, neither one showed any significant cpu load over the other at 16 players. Certainly AMX & AMXx have the potential more so than Adminmod to bog down a machine, but with any of the three in their default states I don't think there is an issue. On the AMX forum (I'm on their team) I see people complain of performance at times. Of those people that complain, I will ask them to show me their plugins.ini for AMX and usually they've added 30 more plugins to the list. A third of which conflict with default or other 3rd party plugins they added. Several people had no idea what some of those plugins they added even did. (!) Now I'm not saying this is you, but try the default install and see what happens. Then add a couple plugins at a time and keep an eye on things. -- - m0gely http://quake2.telestream.com/ Q2 | Q3A | Counter-strike ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
James, there's no reason for me to optimize my server for slower
connections. The average ping on my server is around 40ms. Anyone with a
ping consistently higher than 250ms usually gets the boot.
My server settings are set inline to get optimal performance for broadband
players (sv_maxrate at 2, sv_minrate at 2000 which doesn't seem to work)
and being set at a tickrate at 66 (not gonna post all my settings here, but
thx Whisper for the guide and leg work). Right now my sv_maxunlag is set for
0.5, which is CAL standard (I get a significant amount of league players).
If I am missing something with THAT setting, by all means, enlighten us. But
the fact of the matter is, any player coming into MY server and most
everybody else's server, with a cl_cmdrate lower than default, is creating a
condition to where they have an unfair advantage over other players. Period.
Throw figures and calculations at me all ya want, that doesn't change what I
see happening when a player logs into my server with the express purpose of
rate hacking.
And it's obviously not an isolated incident - otherwise there wouldn't be
such a debate about it, now would there?
- K2
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Tucker
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:21 AM
To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com
Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate
Now look, you clearly haven't done your homework, and this is why I get so
goddamn riled over this issue, which people eventually come to agree over,
then a couple of months later, the same stupid suggestion is made.
30 is ONLY the default for broadband settings in Steam. You clearly DON'T as
I said in my last mail, have any experience optimising slower links or
servers for clients with slower links.
If you think cl_cmdrate < 30 is a problem - you haven't tested in a
sandboxed environment. -I HAVE. IT WORKS FINE.
I DID POST A TEST SERVER ADDRESS AS PROOF, WHICH YOU FAILED TO CHECK.
I know I was rude, but there is a reason, -the community never bloody
listens-. It's not targeted at any particular individual, but the NOTION
that your suggestions are workable. Before you know it, half the CS:S
community are crying out for something that will only damage the gameplay of
nearly half the community. Talk about self harm.
You may want to have _some_ restriction put on cl_cmdrate, however, above 30
IS NOT IT. (Note, there is one, which I think also hasn't been noticed, it's
10).
Once again, as I said in my previous mail, settings of cl_cmdrate 12 SHOULD
NOT CREATE LAG. If they do, your server or client or both are malconfigured.
This is a fact, please figure this one out before you respond with the same
thing again, as I've seen it enough times already.
Cl_interpolate 0 does not help clients win, again, unless your server is
malconfigured. The bug that allows for cl_interpolate 0 and cl_interp still
to delay _may_ contribute to some kills, however we have proven that if
someone can react so accurately to clear space, accurately with a Xms delay,
they can react just as well seeing in the first place.
In short, it's not really an advantage, people just think it is, and whinge.
In case you've never noticed, the only players that whinge are players that
are loosing at the time, and this accounts for most of the CS:S community.
The game isn't broken, the player isn't playing properly. Yes, CS:S is the
kind of game where you die very very quickly if you're not on good form, and
YES it is frustrating, especially for most kids. This IS the true source of
most of the community complaints, the rest are from malconfigurations.
Now please, if you want to suggest some restrictions or major changes to the
game's netcode, would you please be so kind as to research ALL areas of it's
use first. Not just focus on one server and one sub-community of settings.
With regard to cl_updaterate and cl_cmdrate interacting with
sv_minupdaterate:
You are correct that sv_minupdaterate does not affect cl_cmdrate, however it
is also the case that cl_cmdrate has a minimum setting of 10. If sv_maxunlag
is set to 1, you can miss over 100 packets before the server refuses to
unlag. If are observing a player with these settings, then a cl_interp 0.1
will allow 10 losses prior to a warp, if you have cl_interp 0.05 it's only
5. The round trip time between you and the server can also affect this, as
mismatched rates will not allow for the significant turn around time of
100ms + enemy ping + server delay + your ping + your interp. Once again,
there are server settings required to alleviate the problem, along with
reasonable client settings. Just out of interest, with those same players on
have you tried "revert all" on both the client and the server?
Finally, a note about some wireless players ("the common warp" / "warp
factor nine") - I have noticed that there are an increasing number of
wireless users who have been encouraged to turn their rates down to help
warping issues. These players se
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
Mr. Tucker, Did my homework, been doing my homework as a server admin since oh 1999-2000 or so. cmdrate was in previous versions as well. I started out on 56k dialup through aohell. So I know a thing or two about optimizing. My cmdrate in those days was 25, and my updaterate was 30. Those were my optimized settings with no loss no choke (even on AOHell), unless there were network issues from the isp or the gsp. This new mis-use of this cvar is mostly by broadband users who have no reason to be using a cmdrate setting that low anyway. And lets be honest, its valves game, they should be the determiner of what the rates should be for any given connection. Problem is its changable in its present form, and being abused by a multitude of persons. Cal in its infinite wisdom stopped anyone from using a cmdrate below 10, but this value is still too low for broadband users. I agree a minimum of 25-30 would be nice. Still not updating to the server as fast as most broadband users (those using 100 cmdrate such as myself). In the end its connection dependent, and I would like to see valve determine the value based on upload speed, and once valve determined that value it to be locked and unchangable on a local client. What about slowband you say? Well, this idea I had while reading your argument. Lets say valve had a different ruleset for each connection type. Lets say slowband had a maximum cap of say 50, and a minimum cap say of 20-25. Perfectly reasonable. Lets hypothesis further and say how about a cap of 100 and a minimum of 30 for any broadband users. This would ensure slowband got what they needed, and broadband got a minimum cap where it was needed. This is what I am sure my fellow admins who are petitioning valve (like myself) are recommending in their private emails to valve offlist. And I hate to say it, but a double standard would be needed but valve would need to be the determining factor because to be honest some people just aren't (honest). We can also look at it from this point of view. Broadband has been out for many years in many areas. 56k is kind of like the 300 baud modem, a thing of the past. The game's bare minimums support 56k barely. In almost every resource I have checked it is recommended that you get broadband if you wish to play this game. Satelite, wireless, as you have pointed out have latency, and should never be used for real time gaming. There are countless articles published on the web that support this fact. To these persons I would recommend a different type of service if this is what they want to do with their online time. Dsl, and cable are in just about every area nowadays in one form or another. If they choose to play over wireless that is their choice, and they should accept the fact they are going to get "lag", packet choke and loss. Now, to addresss the optimizations because of dialup, like I said, broadband is recommended. See my comparison of dialup above. And no amount of "optimizing" on your part is going to fix a network issue with an isp. Because your fix today may not work tommorow, because networks ARE that unstable. Now imagine each and every time you logged into source, your rates were determined automatically by valve servers. So no matter how your connection was today or yesteday or tommorow, you would have a smooth game courtesy of vALVE, in an ideal world, this is what we would have. (Crosses fingers) StealthMode ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] Plugins for AdminMod
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Another good admin tool is UAIO admin. I actually have AMXX, AdminMOD and UAIO admin and CPU has been fine. -DOA CyberGameZone.com m0gely <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Edson Sossai wrote: > M0gely > > Why you basically change from AdminMod to AMX? I used AMX for years and i > always liked. The probleam was that my server was really lagging when > sonebody said to give it a try to AdminMod because is to way less CPU usage > and true or not my server never choke or froze after i switched to AdminMod. > > Does that make sense at all? Or i was probably with some bad AMX plugins > running that caused that? I know is hard to answers without seem the server > and stuff but this thing about AMX being much more CPU Usage than AdminMod it > really true? A while ago I did some performance testing with Adminmod and AMX. In their default configuration, and with a few light weight plugins added to each, neither one showed any significant cpu load over the other at 16 players. Certainly AMX & AMXx have the potential more so than Adminmod to bog down a machine, but with any of the three in their default states I don't think there is an issue. On the AMX forum (I'm on their team) I see people complain of performance at times. Of those people that complain, I will ask them to show me their plugins.ini for AMX and usually they've added 30 more plugins to the list. A third of which conflict with default or other 3rd party plugins they added. Several people had no idea what some of those plugins they added even did. (!) Now I'm not saying this is you, but try the default install and see what happens. Then add a couple plugins at a time and keep an eye on things. -- - m0gely http://quake2.telestream.com/ Q2 | Q3A | Counter-strike ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds YIM: cybergamezone2002 Gaming Portal and Clan Website: http://www.cybergamezone.com Main email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
[hlds] (no subject)
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] I am trying to set up a dedicated server, my server has Windows 2000 Server Edition, and when ever I start up steam it runs good for a while and after a few mins it just stops and crashes, I do have the latest version of steam as well. Before the last steam update the same thing happend but, steam wouldnt even start. So I was wondering if there was something I could do to correct this problem? -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
[hlds] RE: hlds digest, Vol 1 #4190 - 7 msgs
How is this considered hacking? This command has been in counter-strike for years without anyone complaining about it. 101 is the best setting for lan. I play with 80 cmdrate, and so does just about every other person I've ever played with in CAL. -bzr -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 4:12 PM To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: hlds digest, Vol 1 #4190 - 7 msgs Send hlds mailing list submissions to hlds@list.valvesoftware.com To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can reach the person managing the list at [EMAIL PROTECTED] When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of hlds digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: cl_cmdrate (Brian M Frain (eternal)) 2. RE: cl_cmdrate (James Tucker) 3. Re: Plugins for AdminMod (m0gely) 4. RE: cl_cmdrate (K2) 5. RE: cl_cmdrate (StealthMode) 6. Re: Plugins for AdminMod (CyberGameZone.com) 7. (no subject) (Ron Saunders) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 14:24:50 -0500 From: "Brian M Frain (eternal)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: Re: [hlds] cl_cmdrate Reply-To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] I play on dial-up and personally have never found the need to go below the 30 default. I also adjust it for people who have it below default on my servers, most of the time they never even notice. On 11/21/05, StealthMode <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Oz, some people on broadband are using a cl_cmdrate setting that > causes warping. They are purposely doing this to become harder to hit. > This has been deemed a rate hack by quite a few people both on and off this list. > > In response to this widespread rate hack, some of us server ops would > like to see the minimum raised or worst case the cvar to be locked > totally, and determined by valve depending on how you ping to their servers. > > So please don't come at us in this fashion, instead seek out those > that would hack this rate and confront them. We are merely dealing > with a problem we are facing every day. And asking valve to help us. > By default, the lowest cmdrate I have ever seen steam assign is 30. > People who are using lower settings on broadband know what they are > doing. They are doing it purposely and unbalancing the playing field > with their intentional warping, hence cheating. > > StealthMode > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "James Tucker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 19:31:52 - Organization: ra66i.co.uk Reply-To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com Check net_channels to see whats really going on > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian M Frain > (eternal) > Sent: 21 November 2005 19:25 > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: Re: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] I play on dial-up and > personally have never found the need to go below the 30 default. I > also adjust it for people who have it below default on my servers, > most of the time they never even notice. > > > On 11/21/05, StealthMode <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Oz, some people on broadband are using a cl_cmdrate setting that > > causes warping. They are purposely doing this to become > harder to hit. > > This has been deemed a rate hack by quite a few people both > on and off this list. > > > > In response to this widespread rate hack, some of us server > ops would > > like to see the minimum raised or worst case the cvar to be locked > > totally, and determined by valve depending on how you ping > to their servers. > > > > So please don't come at us in this fashion, instead seek out those > > that would hack this rate and confront them. We are merely dealing > > with a problem we are facing every day. And asking valve to > help us. > > By default, the lowest cmdrate I have ever seen steam assign is 30. > > People who are using lower settings on broadband know what they are > > doing. They are doing it purposely and unbalancing the > playing field > > with their intentional warping, hence cheating. > > > > StealthMode > > > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the > list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] I'm not debating that it shouldn't have a floor cap value, I'm saying do not make this a cheat cvar, it isn't one, and if it's being misused then that is the server op's fault. We have plenty of tools available to 'fix' a degenerate rate hacker, and more tools are in develepment that will help us control this problem. But don't take away from the honest user who needs to adjust these things because of all the factors that go into how the engine's netcoding reacts on all the different users out there. You have determined that your cmdrate should be 80, mine is 85, I know others that can't get above 20 without choke. They aren't trying to cheat, or abuse, they are simply trying to get smooth game performance with what they have [for equipment]. Now although your suggestion would work, in theory, for fixing the ranges associated with connection type, you are now once again right back to relying on the user to be 'honest' in picking their connection type in the Steam settings interface. Who's to say the user doesn't pick dial-up to try and abuse the rate settings when he is indeed on a high-speed cable connection? The answer lies in the server ops using a wwcl type config adjuster for use on the servers. This way, as server op, you can adjust your client's settings as you see fit without imposing sanctions on the next server op who may feel your settings are inadequate and would prefer to use his own methods of controlling his clients without restricting other server ops in the process. If there are a large majority of you complaining of this problem, I don't know it. It used to be a problem before in goldsource, and it was remedied, quickly. You really don't have to lean on Valve for this issue, you can rectify it yourselves, without affecting the next guy. --Ozz -- Original message -- > Mr. Tucker, > > Did my homework, been doing my homework as a server admin since oh 1999-2000 > or so. cmdrate was in previous versions as well. I started out on 56k dialup > through aohell. So I know a thing or two about optimizing. > > My cmdrate in those days was 25, and my updaterate was 30. Those were my > optimized settings with no loss no choke (even on AOHell), unless there were > network issues from the isp or the gsp. > > This new mis-use of this cvar is mostly by broadband users who have no > reason to be using a cmdrate setting that low anyway. And lets be honest, > its valves game, they should be the determiner of what the rates should be > for any given connection. Problem is its changable in its present form, and > being abused by a multitude of persons. > > Cal in its infinite wisdom stopped anyone from using a cmdrate below 10, but > this value is still too low for broadband users. I agree a minimum of 25-30 > would be nice. Still not updating to the server as fast as most broadband > users (those using 100 cmdrate such as myself). In the end its connection > dependent, and I would like to see valve determine the value based on upload > speed, and once valve determined that value it to be locked and unchangable > on a local client. > > What about slowband you say? Well, this idea I had while reading your > argument. Lets say valve had a different ruleset for each connection type. > Lets say slowband had a maximum cap of say 50, and a minimum cap say of > 20-25. Perfectly reasonable. Lets hypothesis further and say how about a cap > of 100 and a minimum of 30 for any broadband users. This would ensure > slowband got what they needed, and broadband got a minimum cap where it was > needed. > > This is what I am sure my fellow admins who are petitioning valve (like > myself) are recommending in their private emails to valve offlist. And I > hate to say it, but a double standard would be needed but valve would need > to be the determining factor because to be honest some people just aren't > (honest). > > We can also look at it from this point of view. Broadband has been out for > many years in many areas. 56k is kind of like the 300 baud modem, a thing of > the past. The game's bare minimums support 56k barely. In almost every > resource I have checked it is recommended that you get broadband if you wish > to play this game. > > Satelite, wireless, as you have pointed out have latency, and should never > be used for real time gaming. There are countless articles published on the > web that support this fact. To these persons I would recommend a different > type of service if this is what they want to do with their online time. Dsl, > and cable are in just about every area nowadays in one form or another. If > they choose to play over wireless that is their choice, and they should > accept the fact they are going to get "lag", packet choke and loss. > > Now, to addresss the optimizations because of dialup, like I said, broadband > is recommended. See my comparison of dialup above. And no amount of > "optim
Re: [hlds] (no subject)
Highly recommend you get the standalone server files. Steam hlds has always had issues, because when updating sometimes it forgets to download content it needs to run correctly. So download the hldsupdatetool and run it for whichever mod you are using. The standalone dedicated server files for your flavor os are at the link below. The updater has never failed me for the standalone files, and it eats less resources too. http://storefront.steampowered.com/download/hldsupdatetool.exe Hope this helps. StealthMode ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
Oz, in reply to your last post to the thread. Under my thoughts, the user would not ever be prompted to choose his/her internet settings, steam would connect to valve servers and determine this upon startup and this cvar would not be changed except upon connection to steam servers if bandwidth changed. EG: I connect to steam during non peak hours and my bandwidth is blazing, no network congestion at all. It sets my rates to rate 25000, cl_updaterate 100, cl_cmdrate 100. I reconnect some hours later (during peak hours) with heavy network congestion and say my 3meg down 768k up dsl is not hitting max bandwidth (minus overhead). Valve servers notice this change from my previous bandwidth and adjust my rates to say...rate 15000, cl_updaterate 60, cl_cmdrate 30 to adjust for the network issues. Basically a discovery code that would determine the users rates for them automatically at steam startup with no user input as to connection type. Now I am no coder by any means, but I know this is in the realm of feasible. This would ensure that every user is using optimal settings for their connection at time of connection to the steam network, and lock out any chance of any rate hacking. This type of "discovery based on bandwidth detection results" would stop the rate hackers dead in their tracks. The question is, is Valve willing to invest the programming time and the resources necessary to scan some 1 million + clients at startup to ensure this issue goes away forever. 8) EG: Say the code does a ping with a packet size the avg size of a hlds/srcds server packet, does this say 10x, and uses the average to base its rates on. This script/code then takes the results calculates (based on tabled data) what the best rates were for the returned information, and sets these rates on the client. Basically 3 different tables would be needed, one for rate, one for cmdrate, one for updaterate, depending on ones up and down bandwidth. This form of detection could be taken a step further, and incorporated into the hlds/srcds engine itself, and say whatever server you connect to executes this test, then it sets your rates based on your connection to that particular server, and could update at map change, and if you left and went to a different server, that new server would set your rates best for that particular server. Guaranteeing an optimal rate setting no matter what server you connected to. Taking the ability away to abuse it. Least thats what idea is cooking in my mind. And yeah, this could easily be adapted into a server side plugin. But the rate hacking is cheating, and valve doesn't like cheating. So why not submit it to them and ask them to consider a fix for it on a global level instead of just a local one? StealthMode ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
"Rate Hacking" is just yet another KTE
/p
Quoting K2 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
James, there's no reason for me to optimize my server for slower
connections. The average ping on my server is around 40ms. Anyone with a
ping consistently higher than 250ms usually gets the boot.
My server settings are set inline to get optimal performance for broadband
players (sv_maxrate at 2, sv_minrate at 2000 which doesn't seem to work)
and being set at a tickrate at 66 (not gonna post all my settings here, but
thx Whisper for the guide and leg work). Right now my sv_maxunlag is set for
0.5, which is CAL standard (I get a significant amount of league players).
If I am missing something with THAT setting, by all means, enlighten us. But
the fact of the matter is, any player coming into MY server and most
everybody else's server, with a cl_cmdrate lower than default, is creating a
condition to where they have an unfair advantage over other players. Period.
Throw figures and calculations at me all ya want, that doesn't change what I
see happening when a player logs into my server with the express purpose of
rate hacking.
And it's obviously not an isolated incident - otherwise there wouldn't be
such a debate about it, now would there?
- K2
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Tucker
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:21 AM
To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com
Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate
Now look, you clearly haven't done your homework, and this is why I get so
goddamn riled over this issue, which people eventually come to agree over,
then a couple of months later, the same stupid suggestion is made.
30 is ONLY the default for broadband settings in Steam. You clearly DON'T as
I said in my last mail, have any experience optimising slower links or
servers for clients with slower links.
If you think cl_cmdrate < 30 is a problem - you haven't tested in a
sandboxed environment. -I HAVE. IT WORKS FINE.
I DID POST A TEST SERVER ADDRESS AS PROOF, WHICH YOU FAILED TO CHECK.
I know I was rude, but there is a reason, -the community never bloody
listens-. It's not targeted at any particular individual, but the NOTION
that your suggestions are workable. Before you know it, half the CS:S
community are crying out for something that will only damage the gameplay of
nearly half the community. Talk about self harm.
You may want to have _some_ restriction put on cl_cmdrate, however, above 30
IS NOT IT. (Note, there is one, which I think also hasn't been noticed, it's
10).
Once again, as I said in my previous mail, settings of cl_cmdrate 12 SHOULD
NOT CREATE LAG. If they do, your server or client or both are malconfigured.
This is a fact, please figure this one out before you respond with the same
thing again, as I've seen it enough times already.
Cl_interpolate 0 does not help clients win, again, unless your server is
malconfigured. The bug that allows for cl_interpolate 0 and cl_interp still
to delay _may_ contribute to some kills, however we have proven that if
someone can react so accurately to clear space, accurately with a Xms delay,
they can react just as well seeing in the first place.
In short, it's not really an advantage, people just think it is, and whinge.
In case you've never noticed, the only players that whinge are players that
are loosing at the time, and this accounts for most of the CS:S community.
The game isn't broken, the player isn't playing properly. Yes, CS:S is the
kind of game where you die very very quickly if you're not on good form, and
YES it is frustrating, especially for most kids. This IS the true source of
most of the community complaints, the rest are from malconfigurations.
Now please, if you want to suggest some restrictions or major changes to the
game's netcode, would you please be so kind as to research ALL areas of it's
use first. Not just focus on one server and one sub-community of settings.
With regard to cl_updaterate and cl_cmdrate interacting with
sv_minupdaterate:
You are correct that sv_minupdaterate does not affect cl_cmdrate, however it
is also the case that cl_cmdrate has a minimum setting of 10. If sv_maxunlag
is set to 1, you can miss over 100 packets before the server refuses to
unlag. If are observing a player with these settings, then a cl_interp 0.1
will allow 10 losses prior to a warp, if you have cl_interp 0.05 it's only
5. The round trip time between you and the server can also affect this, as
mismatched rates will not allow for the significant turn around time of
100ms + enemy ping + server delay + your ping + your interp. Once again,
there are server settings required to alleviate the problem, along with
reasonable client settings. Just out of interest, with those same players on
have you tried "revert all" on both the client and the server?
Finally, a note about some wireless players ("the common warp" / "warp
factor nine") - I have noticed that there are an increasing number of
wireless users who hav
RE: [hlds] Plugins for AdminMod
M0gely That was the kind of answer I was hoping to get. I will try AMX back on with the default and see what it does. If I found any issue I will send my plugins.ini to you. Last question do you recommend to use the new AMX2005 at this point? Thanks -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of m0gely Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 2:45 PM To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: Re: [hlds] Plugins for AdminMod Edson Sossai wrote: > M0gely > > Why you basically change from AdminMod to AMX? I used AMX for years and i always liked. The probleam was that my server was really lagging when sonebody said to give it a try to AdminMod because is to way less CPU usage and true or not my server never choke or froze after i switched to AdminMod. > > Does that make sense at all? Or i was probably with some bad AMX plugins running that caused that? I know is hard to answers without seem the server and stuff but this thing about AMX being much more CPU Usage than AdminMod it really true? A while ago I did some performance testing with Adminmod and AMX. In their default configuration, and with a few light weight plugins added to each, neither one showed any significant cpu load over the other at 16 players. Certainly AMX & AMXx have the potential more so than Adminmod to bog down a machine, but with any of the three in their default states I don't think there is an issue. On the AMX forum (I'm on their team) I see people complain of performance at times. Of those people that complain, I will ask them to show me their plugins.ini for AMX and usually they've added 30 more plugins to the list. A third of which conflict with default or other 3rd party plugins they added. Several people had no idea what some of those plugins they added even did. (!) Now I'm not saying this is you, but try the default install and see what happens. Then add a couple plugins at a time and keep an eye on things. -- - m0gely http://quake2.telestream.com/ Q2 | Q3A | Counter-strike ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
> If I am missing something with THAT setting, by all means, > enlighten us. But the fact of the matter is, any player > coming into MY server and most everybody else's server, with > a cl_cmdrate lower than default, is creating a condition to > where they have an unfair advantage over other players. Period. So please, do tell us that we should ALL run your configuration, and that Valve should make way for your configuration. > Throw figures and calculations at me all ya want, that > doesn't change what I see happening when a player logs into > my server with the express purpose of rate hacking. If you want to stop them abusing your server configuration with low rates, then you have a number of options: 1. Use rates that are not damaged by their settings. 2. Build/Find an admin mod that will lock rates to settings that are supported by your server. 3. Campaign for minimum and maximum cvars for those variables you need to set within a specific range. Please DO NOT continue to suggest that everyone should run your setup, it is not workable in other scenarios, as you can clearly see by the warping effects. > And it's obviously not an isolated incident - otherwise there > wouldn't be such a debate about it, now would there? I didn't say it was isolated, poor choices of settings are not isolated at all, look at CPL's settings for example. > > - K2 > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Tucker > Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:21 AM > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > Now look, you clearly haven't done your homework, and this is > why I get so goddamn riled over this issue, which people > eventually come to agree over, then a couple of months later, > the same stupid suggestion is made. > > 30 is ONLY the default for broadband settings in Steam. You > clearly DON'T as I said in my last mail, have any experience > optimising slower links or servers for clients with slower links. > > If you think cl_cmdrate < 30 is a problem - you haven't > tested in a sandboxed environment. -I HAVE. IT WORKS FINE. > > I DID POST A TEST SERVER ADDRESS AS PROOF, WHICH YOU FAILED TO CHECK. > > I know I was rude, but there is a reason, -the community > never bloody listens-. It's not targeted at any particular > individual, but the NOTION that your suggestions are > workable. Before you know it, half the CS:S community are > crying out for something that will only damage the gameplay > of nearly half the community. Talk about self harm. > > You may want to have _some_ restriction put on cl_cmdrate, > however, above 30 IS NOT IT. (Note, there is one, which I > think also hasn't been noticed, it's 10). > > Once again, as I said in my previous mail, settings of > cl_cmdrate 12 SHOULD NOT CREATE LAG. If they do, your server > or client or both are malconfigured. > This is a fact, please figure this one out before you respond > with the same thing again, as I've seen it enough times already. > > Cl_interpolate 0 does not help clients win, again, unless > your server is malconfigured. The bug that allows for > cl_interpolate 0 and cl_interp still to delay _may_ > contribute to some kills, however we have proven that if > someone can react so accurately to clear space, accurately > with a Xms delay, they can react just as well seeing in the > first place. > In short, it's not really an advantage, people just think it > is, and whinge. > In case you've never noticed, the only players that whinge > are players that are loosing at the time, and this accounts > for most of the CS:S community. > The game isn't broken, the player isn't playing properly. > Yes, CS:S is the kind of game where you die very very quickly > if you're not on good form, and YES it is frustrating, > especially for most kids. This IS the true source of most of > the community complaints, the rest are from malconfigurations. > > Now please, if you want to suggest some restrictions or major > changes to the game's netcode, would you please be so kind as > to research ALL areas of it's use first. Not just focus on > one server and one sub-community of settings. > > With regard to cl_updaterate and cl_cmdrate interacting with > sv_minupdaterate: > > You are correct that sv_minupdaterate does not affect > cl_cmdrate, however it is also the case that cl_cmdrate has a > minimum setting of 10. If sv_maxunlag is set to 1, you can > miss over 100 packets before the server refuses to unlag. If > are observing a player with these settings, then a cl_interp > 0.1 will allow 10 losses prior to a warp, if you have > cl_interp 0.05 it's only 5. The round trip time between you > and the server can also affect this, as mismatched rates will > not allow for the significant turn around time of 100ms + > enemy ping + server delay + your ping + your interp. Once > again, there are server settings required to alleviate the > problem, along with reasonable client settings. Just
[hlds] status bar at top not updating.
Check out this screen shot: http://ooksserver.no-ip.info/stuff/badhldsstatus.jpg Notice the current map is ook_hoover, with one player. Notice that the status bar shows op4_meanie and no players. After watching this for a while, I realized that the status bar has frozen and no longer updates. Not a show stopper, more of a curiosity. Anyone else ever see this? I'm sure that rebooting the server fixes it, will do that when I get around to it. ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
This is why I rarely post to the public list. Peoples intent get skewered by those who only want to see or believe what they think is the only way to do things. At no point did I say everyone should use my config. I havent even posted it here save for a couple key cvar examples. My initial post was to the effect that I made a suggestion/recommendation/opinion/whatever for certain cvars to either have a certain range set, or locked down to a specific value - the intent is to keep everyone on a more even playing field. The only thing you have said correctly in your entire post James, was this: '3. Campaign for minimum and maximum cvars for those variables you need to set within a specific range.' - last I checked, this was exactly what myself and others have been trying to do during this entire thread. Except now it's turning into a pissing contest thanks to your initial comments. Like I said before guy, lose the holier-than-thou attitude, only person you're making out to be a fool is yourself. I'm done responding publically on this thread. "James Tucker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > If I am missing something with THAT setting, by all means, > > enlighten us. But the fact of the matter is, any player > > coming into MY server and most everybody else's server, with > > a cl_cmdrate lower than default, is creating a condition to > > where they have an unfair advantage over other players. Period. > > So please, do tell us that we should ALL run your configuration, and that Valve > should make way for your configuration. > > > Throw figures and calculations at me all ya want, that > > doesn't change what I see happening when a player logs into > > my server with the express purpose of rate hacking. > > If you want to stop them abusing your server configuration with low rates, then > you have a number of options: > 1. Use rates that are not damaged by their settings. > 2. Build/Find an admin mod that will lock rates to settings that are supported > by your server. > 3. Campaign for minimum and maximum cvars for those variables you need to set > within a specific range. > > Please DO NOT continue to suggest that everyone should run your setup, it is > not workable in other scenarios, as you can > clearly see by the warping effects. > > > And it's obviously not an isolated incident - otherwise there > > wouldn't be such a debate about it, now would there? > > I didn't say it was isolated, poor choices of settings are not isolated at all, > look at CPL's settings for example. > > > > > - K2 > > > > -Original Message- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Tucker > > Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:21 AM > > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > > Now look, you clearly haven't done your homework, and this is > > why I get so goddamn riled over this issue, which people > > eventually come to agree over, then a couple of months later, > > the same stupid suggestion is made. > > > > 30 is ONLY the default for broadband settings in Steam. You > > clearly DON'T as I said in my last mail, have any experience > > optimising slower links or servers for clients with slower links. > > > > If you think cl_cmdrate < 30 is a problem - you haven't > > tested in a sandboxed environment. -I HAVE. IT WORKS FINE. > > > > I DID POST A TEST SERVER ADDRESS AS PROOF, WHICH YOU FAILED TO CHECK. > > > > I know I was rude, but there is a reason, -the community > > never bloody listens-. It's not targeted at any particular > > individual, but the NOTION that your suggestions are > > workable. Before you know it, half the CS:S community are > > crying out for something that will only damage the gameplay > > of nearly half the community. Talk about self harm. > > > > You may want to have _some_ restriction put on cl_cmdrate, > > however, above 30 IS NOT IT. (Note, there is one, which I > > think also hasn't been noticed, it's 10). > > > > Once again, as I said in my previous mail, settings of > > cl_cmdrate 12 SHOULD NOT CREATE LAG. If they do, your server > > or client or both are malconfigured. > > This is a fact, please figure this one out before you respond > > with the same thing again, as I've seen it enough times already. > > > > Cl_interpolate 0 does not help clients win, again, unless > > your server is malconfigured. The bug that allows for > > cl_interpolate 0 and cl_interp still to delay _may_ > > contribute to some kills, however we have proven that if > > someone can react so accurately to clear space, accurately > > with a Xms delay, they can react just as well seeing in the > > first place. > > In short, it's not really an advantage, people just think it > > is, and whinge. > > In case you've never noticed, the only players that whinge > > are players that are loosing at the time, and this accounts > > for most of the CS:S community. > > The game isn't broken, the player isn't playing properly. > > Yes, CS:S is the kind of game where
Re: [hlds] Plugins for AdminMod
Edson Sossai wrote: Last question do you recommend to use the new AMX2005 at this point? 2005 RC1a is only lacking the new SQL module and is basically "final release" quality otherwise. Go for it. :) -- - m0gely http://quake2.telestream.com/ Q2 | Q3A | Counter-strike ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
[hlds] Half-Life 1 Engine update
We have released an update to the Half-Life 1 Engine. If you run any mod that uses the Half-Life 1 Engine you should get this update. To get the update run the hldsupdatetool. This update fixes the "-sport" parameter and makes Steam use the same IP as your server (for multi-homed machines). This update also increases the minimum OS requirements for Linux users to GLIBC 2.3.2 (to match the current requirement for the Source Engine). The hldsupdatetool will verify your OS version and tell you if there is a problem. For more details on the release go here: http://steampowered.com/index.php?area=news&id=481 ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
[hlds] RE: [hlds_linux] Half-Life 1 Engine update
This update should be applied when convenient as it is backwards compatible with existing clients. However, there will be an update in the near future that will NOT be backwards compatible, so don't procrastinate. - Alfred Alfred Reynolds wrote: > We have released an update to the Half-Life 1 Engine. If you run any > mod > that uses the Half-Life 1 Engine you should get this update. To get > the > update run the hldsupdatetool. > > This update fixes the "-sport" parameter and makes Steam use the same > IP > as your server (for multi-homed machines). > > This update also increases the minimum OS requirements for Linux users > to GLIBC 2.3.2 (to match the current requirement for the Source > Engine). > The hldsupdatetool will verify your OS version and tell you if there > is > a problem. > > For more details on the release go here: > http://steampowered.com/index.php?area=news&id=481 > > > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > archives, please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] (no subject)
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Ron, please provide all the information you would expect from somebody else, if they came to you asking for your help to fix their problem. Hardware Setup Patch Status of your Windows 2000 HLDS cmd line startup Mods server.cfg On 11/22/05, Ron Saunders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > I am trying to set up a dedicated server, my server has Windows 2000 > Server Edition, and when ever I start up steam it runs good for a while and > after a few mins it just stops and crashes, I do have the latest version of > steam as well. Before the last steam update the same thing happend but, > steam wouldnt even start. So I was wondering if there was something I could > do to correct this problem? > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
[hlds] (no subject)
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Ok, I have Windows 2000 Service Pack 4, the computer it self has duel processors approximately 1.5 to 2 GHz each, 261612 KB of RAM, I have no mods installed yet but I plan to install Garry's mod. I haven't been able to start a dedicated server yet because steam will not run properly, when steam starts I don't have the time to start up any steam apps, so I'm guessing that steam is my problem. -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
Re: [hlds] cl_cmdrate....
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] I think the problem with broadband users exploiting this cl_cmdrate can easily be settled by only allowing a certain diffential between cl_cmdrate and cl_updaterate. The default of 10 (20/30 respectively) means that a player who has a cl_cmdrate of 10 should be forced to use a cl_updaterate of 20. Thus people who do not have the bandwidth can within reason reduce their settings to suit their connections. In any case James, I doubt anybody here was complaining about non-broadband users using lower rates. They already have to content with > 100ms pings, so it evens out. It is when people with connections that can clearly sustain higher rates that deliberately set them lower to gain an advantage, is where the problem arises. Moreover, the cl_interpolate 0 bug is real and it causes the exact same effect for < 50ms players as it it does for players on > 100ms pings and cl_interpolate 1, except when the >100ms player does it to you, the player shot me on their screen 150ms ago, the server made the adjustment calculations and deemed that the player honestly hit me on their screen and you die and then you look at the scoreboard and go, ok, thats lag. Where as when a 5ms player does it to you and drags you half way back down a ramp to kill you, because you are out of their sight long enough to actually notice that you are out of sight, then thats cl_interpolate 0 being exploited. BTW, its only a matter of setting your cl_interp to 0.1 or 0.15 to give the required advantage with cl_interpolate 0, as that is about the reflex delay of your average human being. On 11/22/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > This is why I rarely post to the public list. Peoples intent get skewered > by > those who only want to see or believe what they think is the only way to > do > things. At no point did I say everyone should use my config. I havent even > posted it here save for a couple key cvar examples. My initial post was to > the > effect that I made a suggestion/recommendation/opinion/whatever for > certain > cvars to either have a certain range set, or locked down to a specific > value - > the intent is to keep everyone on a more even playing field. > > The only thing you have said correctly in your entire post James, was > this: > '3. Campaign for minimum and maximum cvars for those variables you need to > set > within a specific range.' - last I checked, this was exactly what myself > and > others have been trying to do during this entire thread. Except now it's > turning into a pissing contest thanks to your initial comments. > > Like I said before guy, lose the holier-than-thou attitude, only person > you're > making out to be a fool is yourself. > > I'm done responding publically on this thread. > > > "James Tucker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > If I am missing something with THAT setting, by all means, > > > enlighten us. But the fact of the matter is, any player > > > coming into MY server and most everybody else's server, with > > > a cl_cmdrate lower than default, is creating a condition to > > > where they have an unfair advantage over other players. Period. > > > > So please, do tell us that we should ALL run your configuration, and > that > Valve > > should make way for your configuration. > > > > > Throw figures and calculations at me all ya want, that > > > doesn't change what I see happening when a player logs into > > > my server with the express purpose of rate hacking. > > > > If you want to stop them abusing your server configuration with low > rates, > then > > you have a number of options: > > 1. Use rates that are not damaged by their settings. > > 2. Build/Find an admin mod that will lock rates to settings that are > supported > > by your server. > > 3. Campaign for minimum and maximum cvars for those variables you need > to > set > > within a specific range. > > > > Please DO NOT continue to suggest that everyone should run your setup, > it is > > not workable in other scenarios, as you can > > clearly see by the warping effects. > > > > > And it's obviously not an isolated incident - otherwise there > > > wouldn't be such a debate about it, now would there? > > > > I didn't say it was isolated, poor choices of settings are not isolated > at > all, > > look at CPL's settings for example. > > > > > > > > - K2 > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Tucker > > > Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:21 AM > > > To: hlds@list.valvesoftware.com > > > Subject: RE: [hlds] cl_cmdrate > > > > > > Now look, you clearly haven't done your homework, and this is > > > why I get so goddamn riled over this issue, which people > > > eventually come to agree over, then a couple of months later, > > > the same stupid suggestion is made. > > > > > > 30 is ONLY the default for broadband settings in Steam. You > > > clearly DON'T as I said in my last mail, have an
Re: [hlds] (no subject)
On 11/21/05, Ron Saunders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > Ok, I have Windows 2000 Service Pack 4, the computer it self has duel > processors approximately 1.5 to 2 GHz each, 261612 KB of RAM, I have no mods > installed yet but I plan to install Garry's mod. I haven't been able to start > a dedicated server yet because steam will not run properly, when steam starts > I don't have the time to start up any steam apps, so I'm guessing that steam > is my problem. > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please > visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > don't have to touch steam, to run a dedicated you need the hlds tool of > steam. It's a stand alone client. Find yourself a guide and give yourself a > few hours to complete the installation ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
[hlds] RE: VAC issue (archie)
Ok guys maybe I should be little more specific as to what I run.. How do I get VAC to work on my CS:S dedicated server that is ran thru Steam. I have winXP. Come guys and gals need ur help. Not sure why it's Not on my server now but it was on it before I had to redo it. I have 2 servers on 2 different computers and the other server has VAC. Your help Is need... arch ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
