Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

[Scott Davies]

>One other thing is when I start with a new task, sometimes a lot of work
is already done but also sometimes very poorly, buildings not squared or
misplaced. I wonder, should I correct that or leave it for the validators?

Hi Henk. Yes, the idea is to ensure the square is in a finished state
before marking it as done, including fixing up any errors done by a
previous mapper. In cases where you can see something's not right and
you're not sure how to fix it, probably best to leave a comment explaining
the problem as you see it.

John, without weighing in on your main point (to which I'm generally
sympathetic), in the cases you speak of where it's easier to map from
scratch, why not just do so and use ctrl+shift+g to preserve history?

-Scott


On 20 November 2017 at 16:15, john whelan  wrote:

> >One other thing is when I start with a new task, sometimes a lot of work
> is already done but also sometimes very poorly, buildings not squared or
> misplaced. I wonder, should I correct that or leave it for the validators?
>
> Interesting question I think its like hoping the fairies will  come in
> the night and fix everything up.
>
> >I agree with Blake iD is absolutely the best tool to use for new mappers.
> Yes is requires a bit more clean up from a validator but that is ok, and is
> best practice anyway.
>
> I think we are missing something here.  I do a fair amount of validation.
> Highways untagged I don't have a problem with but when it comes to
> correcting buildings I do have a problem.  It is faster to delete and remap
> than to correct a badly mapped building but in OSM the official preference
> is to correct what is there to preserve the history.  I'll tag buildings
> but even if they are badly drawn I will very very rarely correct them.
> It's too much hassle.  I tend to avoid building projects when validating.
>
> I don't think it is OK to expect validators to spend more time cleaning up
> than it takes to map.  I don't know where Dale's magic pool of validators
> are but I think we are all agreed we don't have enough validation done so
> are they bogged down correcting buildings?  Best practice to correct work
> rather than do it right in the first place?  This goes against every best
> practice I've ever seen in the real world.
>
> Oh and Dale do note that the maperthon I attended 75% were not familiar
> with JOSM but the quality of the work they produced was excellent in JOSM
> with the building_tool plugin.  Were they some sot of strange group?  I
> certainly didn't preselect them.  They were brand new mappers and they
> worked happily in JOSM.  The amount of support they got might have been
> higher than at a large maperthon with fewer experienced mapper per newbie
> and there are good reasons for using iD which Ralph has covered but I
> differ from your opinion, in mine iD is not absolutely the best tool for
> new mappers and I have demonstrated that.
>
> Cheerio John
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 20 November 2017 at 10:34, Dale Kunce  wrote:
>
>> Hey all,
>> I agree with Blake iD is absolutely the best tool to use for new mappers.
>> Yes is requires a bit more clean up from a validator but that is ok, and is
>> best practice anyway.
>>
>> The iD team is working on the building tool but doesn't have a release
>> date. Having this tool would be a game changer and would be the biggest
>> improvement to beginning mappers.
>>
>> Over the past year Missing Maps and is partners have added over 30k
>> mappers. We are constantly looking for ways to improve mapathons and the
>> tools we use however, JOSM is not practical for a variety of reasons for
>> mapathons of any significant size. The London group has integrated it the
>> best with a dedicated small group everytime to learning JOSM.
>>
>> The material on learnosm originally came from the Missing Maps host page (
>> http://www.missingmaps.org/host/).
>>
>> Dale
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 7:52 AM, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM <
>> blake.girar...@hotosm.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool
>>> like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in
>>> to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish
>>> it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time
>>> fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers
>>> increase their productivity and accuracy.
>>>
>>> iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any
>>> desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great
>>> built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping
>>> improve iD.
>>>
>>> If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the
>>> building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed)
>>> please contact me directly :)
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Blake
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan 
>>> wrote:
>>> > and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
>>> >
>>> > We asked people who were 

[HOT] See HOT HQ and DC Mapathon!

[Rachel VanNice]

Hi all,
*World AIDS Day 2017* is *December 1* and we are excited to host the second
annual PEPFAR Mapathon the day before on *November 30, *with some of our
awesome local partners, MapGive, PEPFAR, YouthMappers and the OpenGov Hub.
We'll be at HOT's US office in Washington, D.C. at the OpenGovHub. All are
welcome, we'll have some space for both beginners and more advanced
mappers, and as always, LOTS of lovely pizza! Register here
 and
hope to see you there!

-- 
Rachel VanNice
Operations Coordinator
E-Mail: rachel.vann...@hotosm.org
Skype: rachel.vannice

Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team
Using OpenStreetMap for Humanitarian Response & Economic Development
web  | twitter  | facebook
 | donate

___
HOT mailing list
HOT@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

[john whelan]

>One other thing is when I start with a new task, sometimes a lot of work
is already done but also sometimes very poorly, buildings not squared or
misplaced. I wonder, should I correct that or leave it for the validators?

Interesting question I think its like hoping the fairies will  come in the
night and fix everything up.

>I agree with Blake iD is absolutely the best tool to use for new mappers.
Yes is requires a bit more clean up from a validator but that is ok, and is
best practice anyway.

I think we are missing something here.  I do a fair amount of validation.
Highways untagged I don't have a problem with but when it comes to
correcting buildings I do have a problem.  It is faster to delete and remap
than to correct a badly mapped building but in OSM the official preference
is to correct what is there to preserve the history.  I'll tag buildings
but even if they are badly drawn I will very very rarely correct them.
It's too much hassle.  I tend to avoid building projects when validating.

I don't think it is OK to expect validators to spend more time cleaning up
than it takes to map.  I don't know where Dale's magic pool of validators
are but I think we are all agreed we don't have enough validation done so
are they bogged down correcting buildings?  Best practice to correct work
rather than do it right in the first place?  This goes against every best
practice I've ever seen in the real world.

Oh and Dale do note that the maperthon I attended 75% were not familiar
with JOSM but the quality of the work they produced was excellent in JOSM
with the building_tool plugin.  Were they some sot of strange group?  I
certainly didn't preselect them.  They were brand new mappers and they
worked happily in JOSM.  The amount of support they got might have been
higher than at a large maperthon with fewer experienced mapper per newbie
and there are good reasons for using iD which Ralph has covered but I
differ from your opinion, in mine iD is not absolutely the best tool for
new mappers and I have demonstrated that.

Cheerio John






On 20 November 2017 at 10:34, Dale Kunce  wrote:

> Hey all,
> I agree with Blake iD is absolutely the best tool to use for new mappers.
> Yes is requires a bit more clean up from a validator but that is ok, and is
> best practice anyway.
>
> The iD team is working on the building tool but doesn't have a release
> date. Having this tool would be a game changer and would be the biggest
> improvement to beginning mappers.
>
> Over the past year Missing Maps and is partners have added over 30k
> mappers. We are constantly looking for ways to improve mapathons and the
> tools we use however, JOSM is not practical for a variety of reasons for
> mapathons of any significant size. The London group has integrated it the
> best with a dedicated small group everytime to learning JOSM.
>
> The material on learnosm originally came from the Missing Maps host page (
> http://www.missingmaps.org/host/).
>
> Dale
>
> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 7:52 AM, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM <
> blake.girar...@hotosm.org> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool
>> like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in
>> to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish
>> it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time
>> fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers
>> increase their productivity and accuracy.
>>
>> iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any
>> desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great
>> built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping
>> improve iD.
>>
>> If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the
>> building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed)
>> please contact me directly :)
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Blake
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan 
>> wrote:
>> > and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
>> >
>> > We asked people who were attending to install JAVA before they arrived
>> and I
>> > had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the stress on the
>> wifi
>> > network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of mice. The
>> particular
>> > maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had someone from the
>> local
>> > OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where mapping took
>> place.
>> >
>> > Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM with the plugins
>> > already installed so it was just a matter of "come in, sit down, create
>> an
>> > account, wiggle the mouse now you've mapped your first building."
>> Upload,
>> > then we got them to install JOSM on their own machine and when we
>> downloaded
>> > the tile again their previous mapping was there which reinforced the
>> idea
>> > that they were mapping on a live database.
>> >
>> > It could be just me but my feeling was we got a bit more engagement with
>>

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

[Dale Kunce]

Hey all,
I agree with Blake iD is absolutely the best tool to use for new mappers.
Yes is requires a bit more clean up from a validator but that is ok, and is
best practice anyway.

The iD team is working on the building tool but doesn't have a release
date. Having this tool would be a game changer and would be the biggest
improvement to beginning mappers.

Over the past year Missing Maps and is partners have added over 30k
mappers. We are constantly looking for ways to improve mapathons and the
tools we use however, JOSM is not practical for a variety of reasons for
mapathons of any significant size. The London group has integrated it the
best with a dedicated small group everytime to learning JOSM.

The material on learnosm originally came from the Missing Maps host page (
http://www.missingmaps.org/host/).

Dale

On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 7:52 AM, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM <
blake.girar...@hotosm.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool
> like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in
> to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish
> it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time
> fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers
> increase their productivity and accuracy.
>
> iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any
> desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great
> built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping
> improve iD.
>
> If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the
> building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed)
> please contact me directly :)
>
> Cheers,
> Blake
>
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan 
> wrote:
> > and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
> >
> > We asked people who were attending to install JAVA before they arrived
> and I
> > had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the stress on the wifi
> > network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of mice. The particular
> > maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had someone from the local
> > OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where mapping took
> place.
> >
> > Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM with the plugins
> > already installed so it was just a matter of "come in, sit down, create
> an
> > account, wiggle the mouse now you've mapped your first building."
> Upload,
> > then we got them to install JOSM on their own machine and when we
> downloaded
> > the tile again their previous mapping was there which reinforced the idea
> > that they were mapping on a live database.
> >
> > It could be just me but my feeling was we got a bit more engagement with
> > JOSM as they could see the underlying tags and having shown one mapper
> how
> > to join up two rectangles for an L shaped building I asked them to show
> > another mapper how to do it when they wanted to know which helps on the
> > confidence building side.
> >
> > For highways there is less to choose between the two editors but for
> > buildings certainly for accuracy currently JOSM and the building_tool
> plugin
> > wins hands down.
> >
> > I think the large maperthons have their place but perhaps we need more
> > mini-maperthons?
> >
> > Cheerio John
> >
> > On 19 November 2017 at 03:07,  wrote:
> >>
> >> A useful guide to running your Mapathon can be found here
> >> http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> There is no hard and fast rule to running a successful Mapathon. As I
> >> point out, each Mapathon will evolve at it’s own pace and in it’s own
> >> direction dependent the expertise of the people organizing and leading,
> on
> >> the people attending, the facilities available and the number of people
> >> involved.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> As to the choice of Editor used, I agree with John that JOSM is
> preferred,
> >> unfortunately that choice is not always available. We have found that
> >> dealing with new mappers using school or corporate computers/laptops it
> is
> >> not always permitted to download other programmes, or if you have a
> large
> >> group uploading/downloading at the same time can cause problems for the
> >> available WiFi, and with one really large group we overloaded the OSM
> >> server. So our choice is to start the large group of new mappers with iD
> >> Editor so that we can get them mapping as quickly as we can and then
> deal
> >> with any questions they have during the session.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I do not count any success on how many squares have been completed
> >> although it is encouraging to the group to be shown at the end how much
> >> their contribution has advanced the project they are working on. I
> prefer to
> >> concentrate on getting the mappers to a stage where they are comfortable
> >> with their mapping and confident enough to try mapping further on their
> own
> >> at home and hopefully interested en

[HOT] Looking for a contact with OSM contributors in the area of Varanasi, Uttar Pradesh, India

[Cristian Consonni]

Hi.

I am Cristian and I am member of OpenStreetMap Italia. I have been asked
by a student - at the University of Bergamo, Italy - that wants to
perform some analysis on OpenStreetMap around the area of Varanasi,
Uttar Pradesh, India if I could put her in contact with some local OSM
contributors. Does anybody contribute to OSM in that area or can you
point me towards some local user and/or group?

Thank you.

Cristian

___
HOT mailing list
HOT@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot

[HOT] HOT Tech Challenge | Mapping Visualisation Tool

[Mhairi O'Hara]

The Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team has released a new TECH CHALLENGE!

:: https://www.hotosm.org/job/hot_mapping_visualisation_tool/2017 ::

We are seeking an experienced developer and UX designer to create a
'Mapping Visualisation Tool',

The tool aims to easily automate the creation of downloadable and
embeddable animations, showing the progress of OSM mapping for an area of
interest over a given time period.

Check out the details of the tech challenge and share it with potentially
interested parties. Please note that the application deadline is on the
30th November 2017.

Hope to hear from some of you soon!

Kind regards,

Mhairi

-- 
*Mhairi O'Hara*
Project Manager
mhairi.oh...@hotosm.org
@mataharimhairi

*Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team*
*Using OpenStreetMap for Humanitarian Response & Economic Development*
web 
 | twitter 
 | facebook 
 | donate 
___
HOT mailing list
HOT@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

[Martin Noblecourt]

Hi,

Agree with Blake this would probably be the thing that would save the 
most time among all the possible tools to develop.


We don't have tech volunteers that know well the ID system but fully 
support the initiative ;-)


Martin




Message: 2
Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2017 16:52:35 +0100
From: "Blake Girardot HOT/OSM"
To:"hot@openstreetmap.org"  
Subject: Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon
Message-ID:

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

Hi,

A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool
like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in
to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish
it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time
fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers
increase their productivity and accuracy.

iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any
desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great
built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping
improve iD.

If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the
building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed)
please contact me directly:)

Cheers,
Blake


___
HOT mailing list
HOT@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

[john whelan]

Certain projects have a validator sitting on them.

https://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2657

https://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2656

https://tasks.hotosm.org/project/3770

https://tasks.hotosm.org/project/3732

are four.  There are others.

Everything you mark as done will be validated, if your work is on a tile
that gets marked done it will be validated as well.  Normally it gets
validated within 24 hours.

Cheerio John

On 20 November 2017 at 08:44, hnugter  wrote:

> Dear Everybody,
>
> I'm one of the new mappers and a read alle these mails with great interest.
> I just started to map 6 months ago because of an article in our local
> paper. First I started to map with ID, very easy to use but recently I
> learned myself to work with JOSM and the building plugin.
> My problems are somewhat differen from what I read in the discussions,
> When I finish mapping I often ask for comment but during the last six
> months I recieved only once a comment on my work. I think that new mappers
> would love to get feedback as soon as possible. One other thing is when I
> start with a new task, sometimes a lot of work is already done but also
> sometimes very poorly, buildings not squared or misplaced. I wonder, should
> I correct that or leave it for the validators?
> An other thing is that everything on the map is out of place, buildings,
> roads etc. Probebly the previous mapper has used an other image than
> described in the instructions where it is written to use Bing, again should
> I correct that or is there an other way to continue with that task?
> I'm a beginner with JOSM but for me it's easyer to work with than ID.
>
> And than finaly, it seems there is not much to do now for beginners,
>
> Best regards
>
> Henk Nugter
>
> Op 20-11-2017 om 14:05 schreef Bjoern Hassler:
>
> Dear friends,
>
> thanks for the replies and engaging discussion. Can I propose that we
> start a google document to put down some of the ideas, and perhaps organise
> a follow-up chat or community seminar where the ideas can be discussed
> further? Outcomes can then be added to  http://learnosm.org/en/coo
> rdination/mapathon/ ?
>
> I'll send you all invites to the document off list. I'll leave the
> document so that no sign-in is required, in case you don't want to have a
> google account!
> Bjoern
>
> On 20 November 2017 at 12:53, john whelan  wrote:
>
>> The interesting thing is when the very experienced iD specialist mapped a
>> building they did it by placing a dot in the four corners of the building
>> then the ways and tag were added very quickly by a short cut perhaps?
>>
>> By placing the four corners first you could see clearly where they should
>> go.  I don't know how it was done but as an interim measure perhaps we
>> could teach this method of mapping buildings?
>>
>> Cheerio John
>>
>> On 20 November 2017 at 07:36, Stuart Ward  wrote:
>>
>>> Having spent considerable time fixing iD editor squares non-square
>>> buildings, with random shared nodes, connected to roads, and areas, getting
>>> a better first time result is so important.
>>>
>>> I pains where you come across a square that they have clearly spent
>>> quite a lot of time mapping all the ins and outs of buildings.
>>>
>>> Stuart
>>>
>>> --
>>> Stuart Ward M +44 7782325143 <+44%207782%20325143>
>>>
>>> On 19 November 2017 at 15:52, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM <
>>> blake.girar...@hotosm.org> wrote:
>>>
 Hi,

 A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool
 like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in
 to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish
 it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time
 fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers
 increase their productivity and accuracy.

 iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any
 desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great
 built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping
 improve iD.

 If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the
 building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed)
 please contact me directly :)

 Cheers,
 Blake



 On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan 
 wrote:
 > and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
 >
 > We asked people who were attending to install JAVA before they
 arrived and I
 > had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the stress on the
 wifi
 > network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of mice. The
 particular
 > maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had someone from the
 local
 > OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where mapping took
 place.
 >
 > Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM with the plugins
 > already installed so it was just a matter of "come in, sit dow

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

[hnugter]

Dear Everybody,

I'm one of the new mappers and a read alle these mails with great interest.
I just started to map 6 months ago because of an article in our local 
paper. First I started to map with ID, very easy to use but recently I 
learned myself to work with JOSM and the building plugin.
My problems are somewhat differen from what I read in the discussions,  
When I finish mapping I often ask for comment but during the last six 
months I recieved only once a comment on my work. I think that new 
mappers would love to get feedback as soon as possible. One other thing 
is when I start with a new task, sometimes a lot of work is already done 
but also sometimes very poorly, buildings not squared or misplaced. I 
wonder, should I correct that or leave it for the validators?
An other thing is that everything on the map is out of place, buildings, 
roads etc. Probebly the previous mapper has used an other image than 
described in the instructions where it is written to use Bing, again 
should I correct that or is there an other way to continue with that task?

I'm a beginner with JOSM but for me it's easyer to work with than ID.

And than finaly, it seems there is not much to do now for beginners,

Best regards

Henk Nugter


Op 20-11-2017 om 14:05 schreef Bjoern Hassler:

Dear friends,

thanks for the replies and engaging discussion. Can I propose that we 
start a google document to put down some of the ideas, and perhaps 
organise a follow-up chat or community seminar where the ideas can be 
discussed further? Outcomes can then be added to 
http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/ 
 ?


I'll send you all invites to the document off list. I'll leave the 
document so that no sign-in is required, in case you don't want to 
have a google account!

Bjoern

On 20 November 2017 at 12:53, john whelan > wrote:


The interesting thing is when the very experienced iD specialist
mapped a building they did it by placing a dot in the four corners
of the building then the ways and tag were added very quickly by a
short cut perhaps?

By placing the four corners first you could see clearly where they
should go.  I don't know how it was done but as an interim measure
perhaps we could teach this method of mapping buildings?

Cheerio John

On 20 November 2017 at 07:36, Stuart Ward mailto:stuart.w...@bcs.org>> wrote:

Having spent considerable time fixing iD editor squares
non-square buildings, with random shared nodes, connected to
roads, and areas, getting a better first time result is so
important.

I pains where you come across a square that they have clearly
spent quite a lot of time mapping all the ins and outs of
buildings.

Stuart

-- 
Stuart Ward M +44 7782325143 


On 19 November 2017 at 15:52, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM
mailto:blake.girar...@hotosm.org>>
wrote:

Hi,

A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building
mapping tool
like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get
that added in
to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to
accomplish
it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours
volunteer time
fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help
new mappers
increase their productivity and accuracy.

iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs
on any
desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a
great
built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by
helping
improve iD.

If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help
complete the
building tool for iD (it is already started, just not
completed)
please contact me directly :)

Cheers,
Blake



On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan
mailto:jwhelan0...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
>
> We asked people who were attending to install JAVA
before they arrived and I
> had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the
stress on the wifi
> network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of
mice. The particular
> maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had
someone from the local
> OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where
mapping took place.
>
> Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM
with the plugins
> already installed so it was just a matter of "come in,
sit 

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

[Bjoern Hassler]

Dear friends,

thanks for the replies and engaging discussion. Can I propose that we start
a google document to put down some of the ideas, and perhaps organise a
follow-up chat or community seminar where the ideas can be discussed
further? Outcomes can then be added to  http://learnosm.org/en/
coordination/mapathon/ ?

I'll send you all invites to the document off list. I'll leave the document
so that no sign-in is required, in case you don't want to have a google
account!
Bjoern

On 20 November 2017 at 12:53, john whelan  wrote:

> The interesting thing is when the very experienced iD specialist mapped a
> building they did it by placing a dot in the four corners of the building
> then the ways and tag were added very quickly by a short cut perhaps?
>
> By placing the four corners first you could see clearly where they should
> go.  I don't know how it was done but as an interim measure perhaps we
> could teach this method of mapping buildings?
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 20 November 2017 at 07:36, Stuart Ward  wrote:
>
>> Having spent considerable time fixing iD editor squares non-square
>> buildings, with random shared nodes, connected to roads, and areas, getting
>> a better first time result is so important.
>>
>> I pains where you come across a square that they have clearly spent quite
>> a lot of time mapping all the ins and outs of buildings.
>>
>> Stuart
>>
>> --
>> Stuart Ward M +44 7782325143 <+44%207782%20325143>
>>
>> On 19 November 2017 at 15:52, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM <
>> blake.girar...@hotosm.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool
>>> like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in
>>> to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish
>>> it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time
>>> fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers
>>> increase their productivity and accuracy.
>>>
>>> iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any
>>> desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great
>>> built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping
>>> improve iD.
>>>
>>> If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the
>>> building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed)
>>> please contact me directly :)
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Blake
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan 
>>> wrote:
>>> > and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
>>> >
>>> > We asked people who were attending to install JAVA before they arrived
>>> and I
>>> > had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the stress on the
>>> wifi
>>> > network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of mice. The
>>> particular
>>> > maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had someone from the
>>> local
>>> > OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where mapping took
>>> place.
>>> >
>>> > Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM with the plugins
>>> > already installed so it was just a matter of "come in, sit down,
>>> create an
>>> > account, wiggle the mouse now you've mapped your first building."
>>> Upload,
>>> > then we got them to install JOSM on their own machine and when we
>>> downloaded
>>> > the tile again their previous mapping was there which reinforced the
>>> idea
>>> > that they were mapping on a live database.
>>> >
>>> > It could be just me but my feeling was we got a bit more engagement
>>> with
>>> > JOSM as they could see the underlying tags and having shown one mapper
>>> how
>>> > to join up two rectangles for an L shaped building I asked them to show
>>> > another mapper how to do it when they wanted to know which helps on the
>>> > confidence building side.
>>> >
>>> > For highways there is less to choose between the two editors but for
>>> > buildings certainly for accuracy currently JOSM and the building_tool
>>> plugin
>>> > wins hands down.
>>> >
>>> > I think the large maperthons have their place but perhaps we need more
>>> > mini-maperthons?
>>> >
>>> > Cheerio John
>>> >
>>> > On 19 November 2017 at 03:07,  wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> A useful guide to running your Mapathon can be found here
>>> >> http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> There is no hard and fast rule to running a successful Mapathon. As I
>>> >> point out, each Mapathon will evolve at it’s own pace and in it’s own
>>> >> direction dependent the expertise of the people organizing and
>>> leading, on
>>> >> the people attending, the facilities available and the number of
>>> people
>>> >> involved.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> As to the choice of Editor used, I agree with John that JOSM is
>>> preferred,
>>> >> unfortunately that choice is not always available. We have found that
>>> >> dealing with new mappers using school or corporate computers/laptops
>>> it is
>>> >> not always permitted to download other programmes, or if you have a
>>> 

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

[john whelan]

The interesting thing is when the very experienced iD specialist mapped a
building they did it by placing a dot in the four corners of the building
then the ways and tag were added very quickly by a short cut perhaps?

By placing the four corners first you could see clearly where they should
go.  I don't know how it was done but as an interim measure perhaps we
could teach this method of mapping buildings?

Cheerio John

On 20 November 2017 at 07:36, Stuart Ward  wrote:

> Having spent considerable time fixing iD editor squares non-square
> buildings, with random shared nodes, connected to roads, and areas, getting
> a better first time result is so important.
>
> I pains where you come across a square that they have clearly spent quite
> a lot of time mapping all the ins and outs of buildings.
>
> Stuart
>
> --
> Stuart Ward M +44 7782325143 <+44%207782%20325143>
>
> On 19 November 2017 at 15:52, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM <
> blake.girar...@hotosm.org> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool
>> like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in
>> to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish
>> it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time
>> fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers
>> increase their productivity and accuracy.
>>
>> iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any
>> desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great
>> built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping
>> improve iD.
>>
>> If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the
>> building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed)
>> please contact me directly :)
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Blake
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan 
>> wrote:
>> > and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
>> >
>> > We asked people who were attending to install JAVA before they arrived
>> and I
>> > had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the stress on the
>> wifi
>> > network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of mice. The
>> particular
>> > maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had someone from the
>> local
>> > OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where mapping took
>> place.
>> >
>> > Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM with the plugins
>> > already installed so it was just a matter of "come in, sit down, create
>> an
>> > account, wiggle the mouse now you've mapped your first building."
>> Upload,
>> > then we got them to install JOSM on their own machine and when we
>> downloaded
>> > the tile again their previous mapping was there which reinforced the
>> idea
>> > that they were mapping on a live database.
>> >
>> > It could be just me but my feeling was we got a bit more engagement with
>> > JOSM as they could see the underlying tags and having shown one mapper
>> how
>> > to join up two rectangles for an L shaped building I asked them to show
>> > another mapper how to do it when they wanted to know which helps on the
>> > confidence building side.
>> >
>> > For highways there is less to choose between the two editors but for
>> > buildings certainly for accuracy currently JOSM and the building_tool
>> plugin
>> > wins hands down.
>> >
>> > I think the large maperthons have their place but perhaps we need more
>> > mini-maperthons?
>> >
>> > Cheerio John
>> >
>> > On 19 November 2017 at 03:07,  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> A useful guide to running your Mapathon can be found here
>> >> http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> There is no hard and fast rule to running a successful Mapathon. As I
>> >> point out, each Mapathon will evolve at it’s own pace and in it’s own
>> >> direction dependent the expertise of the people organizing and
>> leading, on
>> >> the people attending, the facilities available and the number of people
>> >> involved.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> As to the choice of Editor used, I agree with John that JOSM is
>> preferred,
>> >> unfortunately that choice is not always available. We have found that
>> >> dealing with new mappers using school or corporate computers/laptops
>> it is
>> >> not always permitted to download other programmes, or if you have a
>> large
>> >> group uploading/downloading at the same time can cause problems for the
>> >> available WiFi, and with one really large group we overloaded the OSM
>> >> server. So our choice is to start the large group of new mappers with
>> iD
>> >> Editor so that we can get them mapping as quickly as we can and then
>> deal
>> >> with any questions they have during the session.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I do not count any success on how many squares have been completed
>> >> although it is encouraging to the group to be shown at the end how much
>> >> their contribution has advanced the project they are working on. I
>> prefer to
>> >> concentrate on getting the ma

Re: [HOT] Mapping buildings with new mappers at a maperthon

[Stuart Ward]

Having spent considerable time fixing iD editor squares non-square
buildings, with random shared nodes, connected to roads, and areas, getting
a better first time result is so important.

I pains where you come across a square that they have clearly spent quite a
lot of time mapping all the ins and outs of buildings.

Stuart

-- 
Stuart Ward M +44 7782325143

On 19 November 2017 at 15:52, Blake Girardot HOT/OSM <
blake.girar...@hotosm.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> A lot of this would be addressed if iD had a building mapping tool
> like JOSM does. I am going to restart the effort to get that added in
> to iD, I have some new ideas for how we might be able to accomplish
> it. I think it would save literally hundreds of hours volunteer time
> fixing buildings that are mapped by new mappers and help new mappers
> increase their productivity and accuracy.
>
> iD is by far the more approachable editor for OSM, it runs on any
> desktop or laptop with zero installation issues and has a great
> built-in tutorial, so I think we would be well served by helping
> improve iD.
>
> If there are any JS wizards out there who want to help complete the
> building tool for iD (it is already started, just not completed)
> please contact me directly :)
>
> Cheers,
> Blake
>
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:40 PM, john whelan 
> wrote:
> > and I totally concur with what Ralph has said.
> >
> > We asked people who were attending to install JAVA before they arrived
> and I
> > had josm-tested.jar available on a DVD to minimise the stress on the wifi
> > network. I had a USB DVD device with me and a bag of mice. The particular
> > maperthon I was at was a one off affair but we had someone from the local
> > OSM group mention how to find the monthly meetings where mapping took
> place.
> >
> > Note I had two machines available that had JAVA, JOSM with the plugins
> > already installed so it was just a matter of "come in, sit down, create
> an
> > account, wiggle the mouse now you've mapped your first building."
> Upload,
> > then we got them to install JOSM on their own machine and when we
> downloaded
> > the tile again their previous mapping was there which reinforced the idea
> > that they were mapping on a live database.
> >
> > It could be just me but my feeling was we got a bit more engagement with
> > JOSM as they could see the underlying tags and having shown one mapper
> how
> > to join up two rectangles for an L shaped building I asked them to show
> > another mapper how to do it when they wanted to know which helps on the
> > confidence building side.
> >
> > For highways there is less to choose between the two editors but for
> > buildings certainly for accuracy currently JOSM and the building_tool
> plugin
> > wins hands down.
> >
> > I think the large maperthons have their place but perhaps we need more
> > mini-maperthons?
> >
> > Cheerio John
> >
> > On 19 November 2017 at 03:07,  wrote:
> >>
> >> A useful guide to running your Mapathon can be found here
> >> http://learnosm.org/en/coordination/mapathon/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> There is no hard and fast rule to running a successful Mapathon. As I
> >> point out, each Mapathon will evolve at it’s own pace and in it’s own
> >> direction dependent the expertise of the people organizing and leading,
> on
> >> the people attending, the facilities available and the number of people
> >> involved.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> As to the choice of Editor used, I agree with John that JOSM is
> preferred,
> >> unfortunately that choice is not always available. We have found that
> >> dealing with new mappers using school or corporate computers/laptops it
> is
> >> not always permitted to download other programmes, or if you have a
> large
> >> group uploading/downloading at the same time can cause problems for the
> >> available WiFi, and with one really large group we overloaded the OSM
> >> server. So our choice is to start the large group of new mappers with iD
> >> Editor so that we can get them mapping as quickly as we can and then
> deal
> >> with any questions they have during the session.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I do not count any success on how many squares have been completed
> >> although it is encouraging to the group to be shown at the end how much
> >> their contribution has advanced the project they are working on. I
> prefer to
> >> concentrate on getting the mappers to a stage where they are comfortable
> >> with their mapping and confident enough to try mapping further on their
> own
> >> at home and hopefully interested enough to return for further guidance.
> >> Going around the room and looking at what they are doing is paramount to
> >> this success. Telling them that they have got it and their work is good
> >> gives them the assurance they need to continue and even become more
> >> adventurous, so John is correct in saying that the one-to-one does show
> more
> >> promise and achieve better mapping. Even stopping to show a new mapper
> how
> >> to improve and correct their work

Re: [HOT] 3637

[Philippe Verdy]

Note that if you are a project manager, you should still be able to
map/split any task on this project. This was possible in TM2 (including all
drafted and archived projects), but since TM3 this is no longer possible.

This is a regression bug (already filed in GitHub since the day of launch
of TM3).

The only work around is, if you are aproject manager, to lower the priority
to lowest and increase the difficulty to advanced for experienced mappers,
then publish it (but anyone will still be able to work on it: look at
what's going on while you are doing the preediting task you need). Once you
have done this preediting/presplitting task, you can reedit the project and
set the actual priority and level.

2017-11-20 12:38 GMT+01:00 Philippe Verdy :

> It has effectively never been published (still a draft, not started at
> all). It's up to the project manager to publish it when he needs it...
>
> Not a bug
>
> 2017-11-20 6:16 GMT+01:00 Daniel Specht :
>
>> I tried to map a tile on #3637 (Bangladesh) and got this message: The
>> task could not be locked for mapping. Mapping not allowed because:
>> PROJECT_NOT_PUBLISHED
>>
>> --
>> Dan
>>
>> ___
>> HOT mailing list
>> HOT@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
>>
>>
>
___
HOT mailing list
HOT@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot

Re: [HOT] 3637

[Philippe Verdy]

It has effectively never been published (still a draft, not started at
all). It's up to the project manager to publish it when he needs it...

Not a bug

2017-11-20 6:16 GMT+01:00 Daniel Specht :

> I tried to map a tile on #3637 (Bangladesh) and got this message: The
> task could not be locked for mapping. Mapping not allowed because:
> PROJECT_NOT_PUBLISHED
>
> --
> Dan
>
> ___
> HOT mailing list
> HOT@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
>
>
___
HOT mailing list
HOT@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot