RE: [IceHorses] Icelandics' Feet
OK, so can we assume that it is the shoe that is causing a problem to the horse's feet? ...Not that the horse is sore because he's not wearing shoes, but sore because the shoes have caused a problem which shows up when the shoes are removed? ... Does that sound plausible / possible? I'm sure that's plausible in a lot of cases, especially in horses that have really strong feet...and as a rule, I certainly think Icelandic's do. I'd clarify though, that there are other causes for pain, that shoes can help - some horses get pain relief from shoes when they have navicular, and my horses certainly were made more comfortable with shoes as treatment for their laminitis attacks. And, both of my horses who had laminitis, were barefoot before the attacks and returned to barefoot about three months after. (Sundance has one attack here, likely at least one case before we got him. Holly had two attacks here, about six months apart.) But, that gets us back to the category of shoeing for therapy, not shoeing for gait. The most important thing I see in my own horses' cases was that, be they barefoot, shod for therapy, whatever, they had a good balanced trim in place at all times before, during and after the laminitis. The only one of my horses who was ever trimmed/shod for gait, was Mac, and he had a long transition to more reasonable, normal hoof angles. Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
RE: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
How much contact does the rider have in this picture? Poor horse. I wonder why they take it. I've been sort of distracted away from the Parelli program for a while, and I doubt I'll ever follow it by-the-book, or go for any of their certifications. But, with Sina back, ready and willing for riding duty, I want to get back to working on my riding. (I've been working with green horses for a while, and I'm not good enough to focus on them and on my riding at the same time.)I've been watching the Fluidity DVDs again, and I'm ready to get started with some of that again. I don't care for riding with contact, and I can see no reason that a horse would want any more than a bare minimum - just enough to make our requests clearly. One thing that struck me this time watching them, is that Pat and Linda not only ride with minimal contact (if any), but they really don't use their legs so much either. I'm not opposed to using leg aids, but I'd like for my leg cues to be as subtle as possible. I've heard this before, and I've tried it enough to know it's true, but by allowing your body to mirror your horse's body, and do anticipate what you want him to do with your own body, the horse will respond. It's one of those things that I KNOW...but gosh, translating what I KNOW to what I DO isn't always so easy! When I watch the Icelander show riders ride, I can't help but notice they don't use their legs at all, and the rein contact is invariably hideously heavy compared to any rider I'd care to emulate. And, when I watch them do that awful, bouncy, pogo-stick trot, then that tells me that they aren't using their seats/bodies effectively either. The Icelandic show riders are inevitably stiff as boards through their shoulders too. I also think back to the many times I've heard people say that you shouldn't use your legs on Icelandic horses. Well, if you don't use your legs on them, and your upper body is stiff and braced, then what's left? I sure don't see any fluidity in that kind of riding. If the horses need contact, I think that's telling us that something else (maybe a lot of somethings) are seriously lacking. Judy, that picture made me think back to your recent question about resistance. That horse may be winning Icelandic shows, but he just screams resistance to me. Karen Thomas, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
RE: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
SOME Icelander show riders, please?! ; ) Ok, I'll rephrase that: ALL the ones I see wining at the big shows like Landsmot and the World Championships...those are the primary pictures/videos that I see, but it's pretty telling that they are the ones that win. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM IceHorses Community for Photos and Videos: http://kickapps.com/icehorses The greatest enemy of the truth very often is not the lie- deliberate, contrived and dishonest -- but the myth -- persistent, persuasive and unrealistic. All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. ~ Arthur Schopenhauer [] Lee Ziegler http://leeziegler.com [] Liz Graves http://lizgraves.com [] Lee's Book Easy Gaited Horses http://tinyurl.com/7vyjo [] IceHorses Map http://www.frappr.com/IceHorses Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:30:40 -0500, you wrote: When I watch the Icelander show riders ride Growl. I hate generalisations. SOME Icelander show riders, please?! ; ) Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Re: [IceHorses] trainers
--- Lorraine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -- That would be great. He would never see it coming. And if the .22 doensn't do the trick, we have .38's and 9mm you could try! ;-) Susan in NV Nevermore Ranch http://users.oasisol.com/nevermore/ Disclaimer CAUTION: DO NOT DRIVE WITH HOT COFFEE IN YOUR LAP Be a better sports nut! Let your teams follow you with Yahoo Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9_qDKvtAbMuh1G1SQtBI7ntAcJ
[IceHorses] OT but just too cute
*http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_EZDBVuOk4*http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_EZDBVuOk4 -- Laree in NC Doppa Mura Simon, Sadie and Sam (the S gang) Yet when all the books have been read and reread, it boils down to the horse, his human companion, and what goes on between them. - William Farley
Re: [IceHorses] Removing Back Shoes
I had never heard of these poly shoes. I will have to check them out. How long do they last? Do you have to replace the shoe every six weeks or can they be reused? That could get a littel expensive at $22.00 a shoe every 6 weeks beside the usual farrier fees. [moderator's note: please use email list netiquette when posting to the list, by deleting the previous post from the bottom, or only quoting a line from the previous post and putting your response below that quote; thanks]
Re: [IceHorses] Senior Ice Ponies Looking for New Home
On Nov 29, 2007 9:40 AM, Annie Shields [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do you mind my asking, how old are you? Who are you asking? V NB Canada
Re: [IceHorses] Fw: [CascadeIceHorseClub] Sleighs
On 11/28/07, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I thought you all might like to see these photos taken by Linda Templeton of the Cascade Icelandic Club. She lives in Trout Lake, Washongton. oh myGOSH a christmas card!! Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
On Thu, Nov 29, 2007 at 09:02:16AM -0500, Karen Thomas wrote: SOME Icelander show riders, please?! ; ) Ok, I'll rephrase that: ALL the ones I see wining at the big shows like Landsmot and the World Championships...those are the primary pictures/videos that I see, but it's pretty telling that they are the ones that win. perhaps you should rail against the show scene rather than icelanders then. don't they also do loose-rein tolt classes there? i have noticed similar contact and expressions on the faces of american thoroughbreds winning races on the track. --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Icelandics' Feet
I'd clarify though, that there are other causes for pain, that shoes can help - some horses get pain relief from shoes when they have navicular, and my horses certainly were made more comfortable with shoes as treatment for their laminitis attacks. IMHO navicular is almost entirely a manmade/shoe caused condition. Cheryl Sand Creek Icelandics Icelandic Horses Icelandic Sheepdogs website: www.toltallyice.com
Re: [IceHorses] It's cold!
that is so awesome wanda. My daughter and I both think we were from India in our past lives. because she has a total inexplicable fascination with India and I have a total inexplicable fascination with Mount Everest. But I have always thought it was the snow. It has snowed here like 3 times in 50 years and each time I just went nuts. The first time was in 3rd grade. Our teacher let us go outside and pour coolaid into paper cups of snow, it is one of my most treasured childhood memories. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] mccurdy
here is info I received from the seller. he came from the same place as our Traveller! no doubt related, but she is checking the pedigree to let me know. I wish someone nice would buy him! These are great horses. Dear Janice, Wow. What a coincidence! Mann came from BentOak Farms also and I have ridden with Tammy Mason at a field trial in Alabama. I have been to that farm twice and I've also been to Colleen Cates farm (Destiny Hills) in Athens Texas where we have purchased McCurdy horses. Two of our McCurdy horses are in the Storey Book of North American Breeds that came out last year. About Mann, I am at work and do not have access to his registration right now. I will be home tomorrow and check his papers and email you again. We are selling him first and foremost because we have too many horses (7 at the moment). Mann was originally intended to be my husband's field trial horse, but he really isn't suited for my husband. The easiest way I can explain it is that my husband's hands are a bit insensitive and this horse simply can't tolerate that--he gets downright mad if people are yanking on his head and he doesn't understand what they want. I hope the video I made (which was in response to someone else's inquiry about basic behaviors while approaching in the pasture, saddling, and cantering) shows you that this horse has a calm heart of gold. He has been to two Parelli week-long clinics in Colorado (not at the ISC in Pagosa Springs but with David Ellis at another site). I took him to a Jack Leiser clinic this summer in Minnesota and had a blast with him. Colleen Cates (of Destiny Hills) reviewed my promo video at my request--she is a horsewoman I really admire--and she really liked what she saw. Her advice to me was don't sell him to just anyone but only to someone who can bring out the best in him (which is really great!). So with that, I'll send you blood line information tomorrow and if you would please email me with more information about yourself I would love it. Thanks for the inquiry, Janice! -- yipie tie yie yo
[IceHorses] Re: Removing Back Shoes
Skye: We thired the Ground Controls a few years back with both race nails e-heads with the washers they rec. to prevent shoe wiggle. We live in Santa Ynez Calif have about 22 of rain mostly Nov-March (not this year though..vvvery dry!!). With wide swings in alternating wet/dry. The GC's kept loosening up in the nail holes which we never had problems with in the St. Croix Lite's etc. Any suggestions as we keep our 2 Iceys shod all around because of the living enviroment footing vs. the trail footing. They seem to wear their feet faster than they can lay feet down where we live even with supplements daily acupressure from me. Farrier (many classes with Gene/20 years experience) hardly touched anything except to keep feet balanced with a light rasping the years we tried to go BF . Boots did not seem to help the issue as we did not want to boot them 24/7. Kaaren
Re: [IceHorses] Sensation wanted
i don't really remember how much i paid for it, and it may have been somewhat extra for some extras i got (rings to attach stuff, c). i'd be looking for offers in the $800-$1000 range i guess, and can ship quite promptly -- i bought a new english trail model to accomodate my short legs and stjarni's recently-discovered fondness for jumping :) Can you send a picture. I can't buy anything like that until after Christmas. If you have to buy it go ahead. Lorraine Be a better sports nut! Let your teams follow you with Yahoo Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9_qDKvtAbMuh1G1SQtBI7ntAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] OT but just too cute
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_EZDBVuOk4 oh my gosh thats one of the sweetest things Ive ever seen! Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] OT but just too cute
What a sweet, patient dog! Cherie
RE: [IceHorses] Icelandics' Feet
IMHO navicular is almost entirely a manmade/shoe caused condition. I have no personal experience with navicular, so I'm not sure about that, but there's no point in playing the blame game right off the bat. A friend of mine has a navicular horse that she adores, and has spent a fortune trying to make comfortable. This mare is her heart and soul. Like a lot of owners, she bought the mare as a mature, trained riding horse - with past baggage - so it's certainly nothing SHE did to the horse. After damage is done, no matter what the cause, we have to do what we can. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
Re: [IceHorses] Iceland
On 11/27/07 10:50 PM, Raven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Iceland has overtaken Norway as the world's most desirable country to live in There is no way that I could live in Iceland. I need more than an hour or two of sunlight during the winter. ~;] I enjoy warm (75+) summers, like seeing the sunsets in the evening and love camping under a summer moon. I agree that Iceland has a stark beauty; I have visited Iceland in various places several times and at different times of the year. But for me, it is too stark by far. I remember that each time I spent any time at all in Iceland I simply could not wait to get back to beautiful, hilly, wooded Kentucky. Anneliese
[IceHorses] Living in Iceland
I had the same feeling about Wyoming terrain when I went to Yellowstone years ago. I live in Maryland which is very hilly and has 4 seasons, I couldn't get over the lack of vegetation everywhere I went in Wyoming, you had to get to the west side in Idaho before you saw much for grass and trees for shade for that matter. I don't need lots of neighbors or the development but I am quite use to having greenery growing and fall colors and lots of trees. I guess my only wish is that the spring and fall would be longer so we didn't have the extreme heat. I don't mind the winter at all, just the short daylight is depressing sometimes when you have long stretches of cloud cover. I think the pictures of Iceland that Ihave seen look very beach shore like, and some arid plains. Is that what you saw Annelise? My friends in Colorado have tried to get me and my husband to move west near them, but I am hooked on the east, don't think I could ever leave. Jeannette
Re: [IceHorses] barn sour
On 11/27/07 11:19 PM, Lorraine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Scooter bucked - was that today Lorraine? Yesterday. I don't think my horses like me. LOL or Crying OL Lorraine Lorraine: This may be a really stupid question and it is a question that you don't have to answer but ask only of yourself: do you truly RESPECT you horses? To get a true partnership with your horses requires love and respect on your part, and I don't mean that you should be subservient. Let me tell you little story. My son Eric and our stallion Landi got along really well. Then one day, Eric, just for the fun of it, got on the saddle facing backward. Landi bucked him off immediately. I think he felt that Eric was making fun of him and did not like it. I think if Eric had approached more respectfully and somehow explained to him that he wanted to see of he could stay in the saddle that way. Landi would have been careful with him. I can't really explain this too well. It has something to do with how you feel in your heart. Horses feel respect and they feel if you are making fun of them. Anneliese
Re: [IceHorses] trainers
We have a dirty Harry gun. I think that is a 45. Luckily I don't carry on when Iride. which reminds me, on a ride recently a woman carried a pistol in a holster on her hip. she said she always liked to carry a gun when she rides, because of snakes etc. After a while I realized I was tense. i kept looking at that gun. For one thing, it was exactly on the spot on her hip where I landed last time i fell off a horse. I kept thinking man that would hurt if you landed on it there, sorta right over the kidney kinda on one side of the lower back. Then i got to thinking, man, if she falls and lands on that pistol, it could go off and shoot ME or my HORSE. It made me nervous. i think if you carry a gun on a horse maybe it should be in a scabbard?? and what if she had shot at a snake, all the horses would have freaked... someone would have hit the ground with the snake. My husband said that type of handgun was very hard to aim and hit a mark from even five feet away. and why shoot snakes really. We are after all in THEIR domain. I believe in killing snakes in my chicken house, poisonous ones, but not in the wild... Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Iceland
i thought iceland was way expensive. yes janice it is very expensive country to live in buy food clothes and to go out and dinner for an example a bog meal at macdonalds coast more than 900 isl kr ok somebody transfere that into dollars Regards malin
Re: [IceHorses] OT but just too cute
On 11/29/07, Cherie Mascis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What a sweet, patient dog! This video brought back a lot of memories for me of when our girls were little. We never let the dogs and the toddlers alone together but there were many scenes like this. My girls learned to walk steadying themselves on our big dogs and loved to climb on them and lay in the floor with them - they (the dogs) were unbelievably sweet and patient. If the dogs started to get tired of this we just ended play time and made the girls leave them alone. They seldom wanted the attention to stop. The breed - dobermans. -- Laree in NC Doppa Mura Simon, Sadie and Sam (the S gang) Yet when all the books have been read and reread, it boils down to the horse, his human companion, and what goes on between them. - William Farley
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
SOME Icelander show riders, please?! I hate generalisations. I know, but we generally live by generalizations, don't we? :-) Western riders ride with casual reins, Icelanders ride with substantial contact... in general. Of all the Icelanders that I correspond with, I always am asking them for pictures and / or video of anyone they know who rides without a noseband, or with a casual rein. So far, have not gotten any pictures of either one. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Icelandics' Feet
On 11/29/07, IceDog [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd clarify though, that there are other causes for pain, that shoes can help - some horses get pain relief from shoes when they have navicular, and my horses certainly were made more comfortable with shoes as treatment for their laminitis attacks. IMHO navicular is almost entirely a manmade/shoe caused condition. Cheryl i have a friend whose horse has a mystery lameness. at first they thought navicular. he never wore shoes i dont think. But he is 1/2 peruvian and I have wondered if he doesnt have DLSD the peruvian thing... Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Iceland
On 11/29/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: yes janice it is very expensive country to live in buy food clothes and to go out and dinner for an example a bog meal at macdonalds coast more than 900 isl kr ok somebody transfere that into dollars Regards malin i work with a guy... he travels everywhere. when he gets there he rents a car at the airport and then travels around the country sleeping in the car and making sandwiches. I wonder if you could do that in June at landsmot. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
Okay, Anneliese, I am going to take this even farther. About 2 1/2 years ago I bought my TWH, Hunter. For about two weeks, I went around grunbling, I have made a HUGE mistake. The horse had some very seious baggage. I began to ride him a lot, handle him a lot, spend plenty of time with him and I began to appreciate some things about him. Hope this doesn't come off as too weird, but I decided to sort of invest myself in him. I determined to like a horse who didn't particularly relate to people at all, including me. The more I willed myself to like him, the more I actually did like him. Yesterday morning he actually came to meet me when I went our to ride him (this is about the third time in three years) and I can now handle him with a loose cotton rope over his neck. He's a great horse and may now be my favorite of many we've owned, but it did not happen over night or automatically. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
On 11/29/07, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Okay, Anneliese, I am going to take this even farther. About 2 1/2 years ago I bought my TWH, Hunter. For about two weeks, I went around grunbling, I have made a HUGE mistake. The horse had some very seious baggage. I began to ride him a lot, handle him a lot, spend plenty of time with him and I began to appreciate some things about him. Hope this doesn't come off as too weird, but I decided to sort of invest myself in him. the respect thing, i am so GLAD anneliese brought that up. Some of my horses have been hard to get thru to, and all of them began to change almost overnite when, like you said, nancy, I began to see the good in them, to look for it to INVEST myself in them. If its true what they say, that horses are the most perceptive of all mammals... then think about how you can always tell when someone cant stand you or thinks you are crazy... sorta makes you want to stay away from them and dread seeing them coming doesnt it?! and none of this is supposed to be about you Lorraine, we are on a whole nuther subject now haha Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
Oh, good point, Janice. I confess I wasn't even thinking about Loraine when I wrote that. I was off on a tangent - thinking about how my least favorite horse became my very favorite horse, not through something he did, but because of my attitude toward him. Nancy
RE: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
Hi Vicka perhaps you should rail against the show scene rather than icelanders then. I would agree. I think competition is just that, competition, and some people will go to any extreme to win. I don't think that the Icelandic world is by any means alone - look at most competitions and you seldom see horses that are not in some kind of stress. Doesn't matter what discipline - look at what they are rewarding in the dressage ring. don't they also do loose-rein tolt classes there? Yes they do but IMO if they ride in anything but a snaffle there is still contact from the shank and the weight of the bit. Robyn Icelandic Horse Farm Robyn Hood Phil Pretty Vernon BC Canada www.icefarm.com
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
On 28/11/2007, Judy Ryder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How much contact does it take an icelander-style rider to tolt? Is that blood in the horse's mouth? Wanda
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
http://www.icelandichorses2007.nl/event/gallery/Aerial.do;jsessionid=9A39E7F22C5E04E0D9A8222AE152737F or: http://tinyurl.com/2te5jx Go to Sunday, 5 August, the seventh picture. What gait? Is this horse collected? How much contact? Is the horse resistant? Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Sensation wanted
On Thu, Nov 29, 2007 at 06:54:49AM -0800, Lorraine wrote: Can you send a picture. I can't buy anything like that until after Christmas. If you have to buy it go ahead. as soon as i find my camera, sure :) --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Iceland
On Thu, Nov 29, 2007 at 10:06:49AM -0500, Anneliese Virro wrote: I agree that Iceland has a stark beauty; I have visited Iceland in various places several times and at different times of the year. But for me, it is too stark by far. I remember that each time I spent any time at all in Iceland I simply could not wait to get back to beautiful, hilly, wooded Kentucky. i've never been to iceland, but yesterday my ethnically-icelandic trainer was telling me that she feels comfortable here in hilly, wooded new england after the leaves fall, because she could see more sky which she misses from home. having lived in the far-more-seriously hilly and wooded pacific northwest i had to laugh -- there's a big sky there, but the trees are easily three times the size of your typical new england oaks and maples. i think each has its own beauty, but i did not suggest she visit :) --vicka
[IceHorses] Re: Icelandics' Feet
I do have in our animal family what was labelled as a Navicular Syndrome Quarter Horse mare. Some of her damage was the result of breeding very small feet on a very large horse, some of it from IMPROPER shoeing, some of it from being used as a futurity cutting horse at age 2. I don't believe in throwing the baby out with the bathwater, so don't believe that ALL shoeing is evil nor do I believe that ALL barefoot is better for every ridden horse on the planet. It depends on who is doing it how appropriate what they are doing is for that individual taking into account the entire situation they are in. Being an equine/human holistic health care practitioner, I've seen damage done from both camps over the years, more so from the barefoot trimmers that have taken a few weekend workshops set out a shingle in recent years. I'm sure not all of them are that way, but what natural trimmers that have breezed through our area in Calif. seem to be creating quite a few soundness issues with their methods. I think we need to educate ourselves so we can decide what is best for our individual charges hire the best people in that field to do the work whether it be barefoot of shod or if you have the time/talent are so inclined learn to do it yourself. My mare needs the support in front from properly applied shoes, but does better with no shoes behind. We had 2 well-trained/talented BF trimmers working with her fronts for quite a while (over a year), but when we switched to a farrier that had all that training + 20 years experience + training from Gene Ovnicek, she took a turn for the better. Also found the correct supplementation that works for her twice weekly Jin Shin acupressure from me has helped her to be comfortable at 25 despite the Navicular Syndrome label 18 years ago. She is also partially blind from being hit in the head from a falling tree during a severe storm, otherwise I would lightly ride her still in an arena. Kaaren
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
--- Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: here is a photo of a horrible case where a horse is being ridden with so much contact it is looking for a way out, is probably about to rear. Note how the riders hat has blown off from the force of the sudden harsh rein contact. Oh my gosh!! What was that crazy rider thinking! Susan in NV Nevermore Ranch http://users.oasisol.com/nevermore/ Disclaimer CAUTION: DO NOT DRIVE WITH HOT COFFEE IN YOUR LAP Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
[IceHorses] Re: trainers
Yes all Janice's concerns from what I've heard from experts , it isn't safe to fire a gun in the open unless you have a back stop really good aim as bullets can travel; quite a way un-intentionally injure animals or humans. I also wonder about falling on a gun ..would it cause a broken hip/ribs or worse discharge hit someone. Recently a woman in our area took a bad tumble her cell phone strapped onto her waist caused a few broken lower ribs from landing on it..ouch!!! Some of our back country female riders around here carry Mace for personal protection as a safety against a derranged human encounter, but I don't know how effective it would be with wildlife. Kaaren
[IceHorses] Re: Sensation wanted
Lorraine: The Sensation I have for sale is a standard English Trail just like the pictures on my web-site. Who knows...I'm a firm believer that if something is meant to be, it happens. Call me when you're ready see if I still have it. I'm in Calif., so time zones are similar. Kaaren
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
I think competition is just that, competition, and some people will go to any extreme to win. I think the problem is that the same people come over here and teach the same type of riding as norm for Icelandics. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Iceland
On 29/11/2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i've never been to iceland, but yesterday my ethnically-icelandic trainer was telling me that she feels comfortable here in hilly, wooded new england after the leaves fall, because she could see more sky which she misses from home. I could understand that. When I get into the mountains I feel claustrophobic...and breathe a sigh of relief when I get back into the foothills. I guess I'll always be a prairie girl. I love the wide open sky. I'll send a pic of the sky taken a few years ago from my front deck Wanda attachment: sunset.JPG
Re: [IceHorses] Iceland
I'll send a pic of the sky taken a few years ago from my front deck What an incredible picture, Wanda - beautiful. The NC mountains are the place for me even though I grew up in Ohio. As I drive into the mountains I always sigh and release the lowlander tension - I feel like I'm coming home. Thanks goodness there's a variety of places and a variety of people.-- Laree in NC Doppa Mura Simon, Sadie and Sam (the S gang) Yet when all the books have been read and reread, it boils down to the horse, his human companion, and what goes on between them. - William Farley
Re: [IceHorses] Re: trainers
Recently a woman in our area took a bad tumble her cell phone strapped onto her waist caused a few broken lower ribs from landing on it..ouch!!! One of the most bizarre accidents I have ever heard of was at a hunter/jumper show. A competitor came off her horse and had the loop on her crop wrapped around her wrist. The crop punctured her body when she feel on it because it didn't drop free. It didn't kill her but it was touch and go for awhile. I always cut the loop off of my daughters crops after that so they weren't tempted to loop it on their wrists. Laree in NC Doppa Mura Simon, Sadie and Sam (the S gang) Yet when all the books have been read and reread, it boils down to the horse, his human companion, and what goes on between them. - William Farley
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
I would agree. I think competition is just that, competition, and some people will go to any extreme to win. I don't think that the Icelandic world is by any means alone - look at most competitions and you seldom see horses that are not in some kind of stress. Doesn't matter what discipline - look at what they are rewarding in the dressage ring. That is so true -- Laree in NC Doppa Mura Simon, Sadie and Sam (the S gang) Yet when all the books have been read and reread, it boils down to the horse, his human companion, and what goes on between them. - William Farley
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
On Thu, Nov 29, 2007 at 10:42:16AM -0800, Judy Ryder wrote: I think competition is just that, competition, and some people will go to any extreme to win. I think the problem is that the same people come over here and teach the same type of riding as norm for Icelandics. having taken lessons from two icelanders, i could not disagree with this sentiment more. at gudmar's recent clinic he rode with a d-ring snaffle, a caveson, and a loose rein, stressing control of the horse with the rider's balance alone. at my lesson with ebba yesterday, she insisted that i need to move my arms more to allow stjarni to canter with more freedom for his head, and to press on his withers and use a completely loose rein to encourage him to stretch down and maintain his trot. how many lessons have you had from how many icelandic people? --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Removing Back Shoes
--- Gale Dunn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How long do they last? Do you have to replace the shoe every six weeks or can they be reused? Well like metal shoes it depends upon your terrain and where and how much you ride. But generally speaking we can reset them onceIf you call ground control and make a larger order you can get the farrier rate which is $12 per set (The order would be around $150 or less so it is not a huge expense) The owner is very nice, tell her that Storme in Hawaii sent you(I have not changed my name with her yet) When you reset it is better to use the nail holes that were not used before, or to nail through in between the mfg holesorder the clear ones as it is much easier for the farrier to nail them on...you can actually see the white line as you are nailing, very nice benefit. When the farrier pulls them off to be reset it is much easier on them and your horse if he takes the crease nail pullers and takes out each nail one by onethe shoes move and flex so it is too hard to use the horses hoof as a resistance point when pulling. This is much easier on the horse for any shoes actually. They are shaped with the nippers after being nailed onyou put the hoof on the hoof stand and nip the excess and rasp the rest. We use these as an alternative to barefoot...you get hoof movement, flexion and protectionin wet areas (also in very rocky areas where a small rock could wedge itself under the sole) we use a sole pack by epona to fill the hole under the hoof with a antibacterial granulesand we always use hoof putty on top of each nail hole to prevent more water from going into the hoof. Just that practice has helped many horses in our business keep the thrush away or at bay If you have any questions feel free to contact me. Note: These shoes do not wok for every horse in every terrainbut are amazing for most that we have tried them on. Skye Fire Island Eco-Treks-808-443-6085 Fire Island Professional Farrier Service-640-6080
Re: [IceHorses] Iceland
I'll send a pic of the sky taken a few years ago from my front deck oh WOW. --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Re: trainers
In a message dated 11/29/2007 11:04:55 AM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) Mace, where does one buy mace to carry? That sounds like a good idea. Sylvia **Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop000301)
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
Okay - that's definitely a laugh-out-loud shot. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
On 11/29/07, susan cooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh my gosh!! What was that crazy rider thinking! Susan in NV Nevermore Ranch http://users.oasisol.com/nevermore/ Disclaimer CAUTION: DO NOT DRIVE WITH HOT COFFEE IN YOUR LAP she was on her way to mcdonalds to get a cup of coffee to go, she spilled it in her lap. no one was burned but I shot her with a 22 for spilling coffee on my sensation hybrid. Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Removing Back Shoes
helped many horses in our business keep the thrush away or at bay If you have any questions feel free to contact me. Note: These shoes do not wok for every horse in every terrainbut are amazing for most that we have tried them on. Skye Thanks Skye, I am going to ask my farrier about it next time I see him. Sounds like it would be a great alternative to totally removing the back shoes.
Re: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
Doesn't matter what discipline - look at what they are rewarding in the dressage ring. That is so true Absolutely, and it's kind of sad that the Icelanders, just trying to learn more about riding styles are copying what is done in dressage shows, not knowing or understanding what is good and what is bad. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Removing Back Shoes
--- Kaaren Jordan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Skye: With wide swings in alternating wet/dry. The GC's kept loosening up in the nail holes which we never had problems with in the St. Croix Lite's etc. Kaaren Ok. Sounds like he did a nice job. We have been using these for the past couple of years on many horses in I would say a much more challenging environment than where you are right now with your horses. With trial and error these are the things we have found that work with these shoeswe have been dedicated to these as we really wanted our horses barefoot, so this was the next best alternative.. 1. You can put a very thin rolled amount of a 2 part epoxy under the shoe where the hoof is...you can find this at any hardware store, they come in little tubes (tubes are about 4 long) for about $5 bucks a tube. They have some for wood, metal, poly etcwe purchase all the colors and use them on the hoof that matches as they all work all the same. 2. The farrier must Deep seat the nail in the channel. Sally does this by either using a nail set tool, or now she is able to turn her hammer sideways and hit the nail deep into the shoe, it must seat all the way down. 3. When the farrier cuts the nail after driven , you must leave slightly more nail than with a metal shoe...this is imperative in our opinion as it works to keep the shoe from wiggling. 2-3 mm in length. 4. The farrier should put a small groove directly and under the nails before clinching...this can be done with the side of the rasp...this helps the clinch seat tighter. A lot of farrier do this already, some do not, but it really helps a lot with the polys. You also make a small groove in the nail while doing this, it helps the nail lay flat against the hoof. 5. The clinch must be clinched straight down and tight. Sally uses the GE Easy Clincher...the cadillac of farrier clinchers. I think if that clincher was not on the market she would not be a farrier. It is a curved jaw clincher and really sets the clinch. 6. After clinching, then slightly flatten the top of the clinch with light rasping with the metal side of the rasp. This helps in some way that we have not figured out yet. 7. We fill each nail hole with hoof putty to keep moisture from coming into the white line. We actually do this for all of our horses, poly or steel. It helps address the white line exposed to air and wet issue and our horses in our business have healthier feet because of it. Now we these extra measures we have successfully used Ground Controls in the humid rain forest, in the dry desert, in the wet and cold mountainsin our immediate area where we have 70 inches of rain a year we use them or eponas and we go from wet to dry all year round... When it is wet we use the sole pack from Epona underneath to keep out the moisture so that thrush does not develop Any other questions Kaaren, always feel free to write or you can call us directly, Sally is always eager to share information. Skye Fire Island Eco-Treks-808-443-6085 Fire Island Professional Farrier Service-640-6080
Re: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
On Thu, Nov 29, 2007 at 10:38:19AM -0600, Janice McDonald wrote: If its true what they say, that horses are the most perceptive of all mammals... then think about how you can always tell when someone cant stand you or thinks you are crazy... sorta makes you want to stay away from them and dread seeing them coming doesnt it?! *nodsnodsnods.* i think this is seriously true. i make all my students ride facing backwards sooner or later, not to make fun but to increase their confidence and freedom to follow unfamiliar movements, and stjarni knows this is serious stuff and takes care of them. lately i get the impression he thinks i'm not fun enough, though. when i've been schooling too much in the ring, he'll just walk to the center and sidepass and do turns on the forehand and all the other lateral work we've been practicing -- like okay, here you go, are we done yet?? whereas if we get out on the trail with other horses and run around like crazies for an hour or so, he's an angel in the ring for days :) just to stress that this isn't about lorraine being bucked off though -- i got bucked off miss molly in a similar lesson where i was the student. i don't think she thought i was making fun of her though, i think i got stuck sitting over her kidneys while trying to slide off over her bum, and she started bucking right there on the crossties, probably out of pain. fortunately (and i do credit all these vaulting lessons my old instructor gave) i was able to land on my feet -- but it was still scary and embarrassing, and i felt pretty bad for doing that to molly, too. --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Low Heel / High Heel Syndrom, Part 4
LOW HEEL / HIGH HEEL SYNDROME - UNRECOGNIZED PROBLEMS CONSIDERATIONS by Dr. Kerry J. Ridgway, DVM High Heel / Low Heel Set Up The Likelihood Of A Long Toe / Low Heel Syndrome: With regard to the foot itself, the syndrome produces a long toe with the heel becoming under-run. This, as we know from Dr. Robert Bowker's work at Michigan State University Veterinary School of Medicine, long toe / low heel syndrome, leads to inadequate support in the posterior part of the foot and eventually to degeneration of the digital cushion. Digital cushion failure when present, leads to a broken pastern axis that is very difficult and in some cases, impossible to correct. It is not uncommon to see large, flat and splayed out frogs accompanying the foot with a degenerated digital cushion as the frog tries to compensate and support the posterior portion of the foot. There is an obvious consequence to be recognized with regard to major factors leading to navicular syndrome. Among these factors a horse with long toe/low heel tends to break the pastern axis and place much more stress on the deep digital flexor tendon. The deep flexor tendon is, in turn, putting pressure on the navicular bursa and impar ligament. There is a wonderful adage that when one finds a problem look elsewhere for the cause. An unacceptable level of heel height asymmetry, I propose, is the root cause for asymmetry and pathology at the level of the topline. But, for the many reasons presented, I feel quite strongly that it is inadequate to address the foot without appreciating the consequences on the topside of the horse. Without seeking and correcting the root cause (in this case the high/low heel syndrome) any other treatment is only palliative. By properly addressing the high heel, low heel syndrome the farrier can be of enormous help to both the rider and the horse. There have been many theories advanced as to reasons for the low heel. Regardless of the originating factor whether genetic or acquired, we are all aware that the horse, once the condition is established, will typically graze with the lower heeled limb advanced. It is certainly a reasonable theory that pressure (on the heel), maintained through many grazing periods, distorts the hoof capsule, unbalances the foot, advances the break-over location and causes the heel to become under-run. Pressure over time creates distortion. Distortion equals an unbalanced foot. Corrective measures for the High Heel/Low Heel Syndrome: Should one universally be concerned and looking to correct every horse who as heel height asymmetry? Absolutely not! I do not advocate any of the several possible corrections such as wedges, lifts, etc. unless by thorough examination (static and moving) and the history and way of going indicate that interference is needed. I do this by evaluation of reactive trigger and acupuncture points, evidence of inadequate or inappropriate vertebral segment motion and muscle palpation and recognition of hypertonicity within a muscle or group of muscles. The role of the saddle and its proper fit needs to be critically evaluated as it may be a very key link. This is an area where well educated body workers, chiropractors and acupuncturists can be of great help to the veterinary profession. What is the appropriate shoeing for this condition? I feel that a cardinal rule is to work primarily with the foot that has the lower heel. Additional problems are incurred if the heel of a true clubbed foot is lowered excessively. Structures in the muscles called spindle cell receptors and receptors in the musculo-tendonous portion called Golgi bodies provide signals from the muscle or tendon to the spinal cord. This data provides information to the central nervous system (CNS) about the tension that exists in the muscles and tendonous structures. When the heel is lowered on a clubbed foot the receptors in the deep flexor tendon are activated and signal the CNS that there is too much stretch in the tendon. The response from the CNS is to issue a signal to shorten the muscle or tendon structures to prevent injury. This response provides one of the reasons why that by the end of a shoeing period, a clubfoot that has had the heel lowered usually looks as bad or worse as when originally seen. Lowering the heel on a non-clubber foot but one in which the heels have been allowed to be high must be done in small increments over several shoeings. It bears repeating that the primary focus should be on the low heeled foot. I make no claims to be a farrier. I have undertaken indepth study of foot issues, shoeing and podiatry for many years now, because no horse can be corrected if the feet are no reasonably balanced. My work will not achieve long range solution without attention to the feet. My experience, until recently, had lead to the conclusion that the best course of corrective shoeing is the use of wedges as orthotic devices applied
RE: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
i got bucked off miss molly in a similar lesson where i was the student. i don't think she thought i was making fun of her though, i think i got stuck sitting over her kidneys while trying to slide off over her bum, and she started bucking right there on the crossties, probably out of pain. I've always been told - and I believe - that you should NEVER mount a horse that's tied, particularly cross-tied. A horse that's tied is much more likely to panic if something goes wrong, and a tied horse in a panic is prone to pull back, or even go over on his/her back. That's very dangerous for the rider - and probably not too cool for the horse either. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM IceHorses Community for Photos and Videos: http://kickapps.com/icehorses The greatest enemy of the truth very often is not the lie- deliberate, contrived and dishonest -- but the myth -- persistent, persuasive and unrealistic. All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. ~ Arthur Schopenhauer [] Lee Ziegler http://leeziegler.com [] Liz Graves http://lizgraves.com [] Lee's Book Easy Gaited Horses http://tinyurl.com/7vyjo [] IceHorses Map http://www.frappr.com/IceHorses Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
I think the problem is that the same people come over here and teach the same type of riding as norm for Icelandics. Yep. There was a special Trail Breeds issue of Trail Rider magazine that had a segment on Icelandics. The Icelandic riders didn't look like they fit in that magazine, with stiff upper bodies, whips and dropped nosebands - looked about the same as the show pictures, compared to the other riders in the magazine. Most of the riders pictured in Trail Rider are pretty relaxed and casual, many horses with plain old nylon halters under their bridles, very few with any bridle with a noseband. I know plenty of people who trail ride in English type (no horn) saddles on the trail, but I sure don't know many trail riders who ride with contact, in a dropped nosebands and dressage whips. It's not so much the particular tack that made the riders stick out, but the way they were riding. I don't know anyone who trail-rides like that. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
RE: [IceHorses] How Much Contact
I would agree. I think competition is just that, competition, and some people will go to any extreme to win. It's not JUST competition though. I just referred to the article in Trail Rider magazine - the Icelandic riders just didn't fit in to my eye. And the big Equine Affair type demos have mostly been show style riding, although HOPEFULLY that is getting a little better. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM IceHorses Community for Photos and Videos: http://kickapps.com/icehorses The greatest enemy of the truth very often is not the lie- deliberate, contrived and dishonest -- but the myth -- persistent, persuasive and unrealistic. All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. ~ Arthur Schopenhauer [] Lee Ziegler http://leeziegler.com [] Liz Graves http://lizgraves.com [] Lee's Book Easy Gaited Horses http://tinyurl.com/7vyjo [] IceHorses Map http://www.frappr.com/IceHorses Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [IceHorses] trainers
On 29/11/2007, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: which reminds me, on a ride recently a woman carried a pistol in a holster on her hip. she said she always liked to carry a gun when she rides, because of snakes etc. Well...if she can shoot a snake...she must be some kind of dead eye. More likely she's just afraid of everything. Wanda
[IceHorses] Re: Iceland
Wanda: I second that. Beauty/comfort zone is such a personal thing. I love where we live in the rolling oak studded hills of Central California with it's open vistas/lots of sunny blue skys of course greatweather year round..but the trails are disappearing our valley is getting overpopulated as much of Calif is. A few weeks ago, we looked in the Medford /Ashland area for possible places to re-locate. It has many areas with densely forrested canyons spotted with smaller meadows. Further out you get some rolling hills, but not the same as home. Even though it was breath takingly gorgeous with losts of BLM Land to ride on, I felt claustophobic couldn't wait to get back to Santa Ynez. We're going to look next in the Bend/Crooked River Oregon area that has more open vistas blue skys nearly year round. We'll see if we can adjust to the colder than Calif. winters/year round dryness/and starker high desert look. The plus side is there are lots of trails near enough to ride to property is about 1/3 of what a comparable horse property would be here with mostof the amenities we are used to here in Calif. I feel like Goldilocks in our searcheither too wet, too dry, too closed in, too much fire danger. what to do???!!! Anyone want to weigh in on this?? Kaaren
Re: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
I've always been told - and I believe - that you should NEVER mount a horse that's tied, particularly cross-tied. A horse that's tied is much more likely to panic if something goes wrong, and a tied horse in a panic is prone to pull back, or even go over on his/her back. That's very dangerous for the rider - and probably not too cool for the horse either. my instructor was at her head with the quick-release snaps i think for just that reason. that said, miss molly did not pull back at all, just bucked straight up and down with her hind end. --vicka
[IceHorses] Re: trainers
Sylvia: I'd contact your local Sheriff take some of the classes they offer. Years ago when I was single lived in LA with just my greyhound, I got some pepper spray on-line so I would feel safer on our early morning/late afternoon walks in the hills ( my greyhound wasn't a great protector!). I decided to try it out at home by discharging some in my kitchen sink wearing sunglasses protective gloves. Boy was that a BAD idea!!!The fine mist permeated everywhere in my 1200sf townhouse . Lexi I had to vacate immediately choking tearing profusely. My eyes /chest throat burned for at least 2 hours probably Lexi too who even was upstairs when the blast went off. We had to air the place out for 24 hours stay with a neighbor. After that I threw my pepper spray away for fear if I used it on an assailant, I could get back gassed as well. Maybe now they have a more uni-directional spray vector??? I hear from some of my LA clients that they also have Taser type personal protectors , with classes available on how to use. Whatever, you decide to buy as personal protection, make sure you get some training in how to effectively safely use it. Kaaren
RE: [IceHorses] Was Icelandics' Feet--Now Navicular
--- Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: IMHO navicular is almost entirely a manmade/shoe caused condition. Like a lot of owners, she bought the mare as a mature, trained riding horse - with past baggage - so it's certainly nothing SHE did to the horse. After damage is done, no matter what the cause, we have to do what we can. Karen Well I agree. And like Karen said the owners of the horse at the time might not be at blame. We have never shod a horse with nice big feet and a big wide frog that has navicular, never. We have some horses we shoe that have navicularthey are Qh who have huge bodies, small little feet.. Question is Is it the shoeing of these horses at a very young age (sometimes as yearlings!), or is it that they also keep breeding Halter horses with 'pretty' little feet and huge bodies? One of the professional trainers we work with at a ranch who worked at King Ranch and at Parker ranch who now works with Dr. Miller says that they never even ride the halter horses anymore, they show them and breed them, and sell the ones that do not make it or are retired (retired at age 6, 7 ...very young!) Then these horses are sold to the general public who have this horse with a 'good pedigree' who really have soundness issues. Its really sad. We have noticed that with either barefoot or shod that if the farrier can keep the frog weight bearing, this really helps a lot.as well as taking a horse who has navicular and putting them in a poly shoe, this has changed some horses lives over herethey can go from lame to sound in a shoeing if it is not too far along.and it just keeps getting better, not worse With using a egg bar steel shoe...it will cover the pain up for a while then you usually have issues come up later...those just buy you a little timeJust what we have seen. Skye Fire Island Eco-Treks-808-443-6085 Fire Island Professional Farrier Service-640-6080
Re: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
in that last pic tho i think her stirrups need adjusting and again, she is using too much pressure on the bit. She would never receive her john lyons certification if she continues like this. janice -- yipie tie yie yo
RE: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
also i think she was not balanced properly. She hadnt been watching her Lynn Palm finding your seat video. I told her that too! Her seat looks fine to me...but I do think she needs to work on getting her legs around him. Maybe you should get her the Centered Riding book. That image of letting your legs grow like tree roots might help her. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
Re: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
Obviously, she needs to spend her winter watching RFDTV. Nancy
RE: [IceHorses] Re: Swedish Woman Saves Icelandic Ponies/karen
What I see as the main issues are: 1) how the mares are kept during the collection process the mare´s are roaming free in pasture/field with salt buckets and lot´s of water during the time they are taken blood from them. And then the veterinary come´s one´s a week and all the mare´s are put in a pen and thoose that are healthy and pregnant with the right amount of hormon will go on into stable where the vet. will take blood from the mare´s and afterwards they are let out in the field again untill next week and it only take´s a few mininuet´s (spelling !?). 2) what happens to the unwanted foals that are a by-product. the unwanted foal´s that are not sold will be slaughtered. Regards Malin in Iceland
Re: [IceHorses] Iceland
i work with a guy... he travels everywhere. when he gets there he rents a car at the airport and then travels around the country sleeping in the car and making sandwiches. I wonder if you could do that in June at landsmot. sleep in the car yes why not we bring a tent and a good sleeping bag and do you not forgett the rain clothe´s !!! and sun Lotion here the sun when it show up burn´s!! regards Malin
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Swedish Wom...Anneliese
Malin: Forgive me for being curious: what is the blood used for? Anneliese Hi , I had to make a few phone call´s to find it out (first to find a blood farmer) they use the hormons on sheep´s and pig´s when they use insemination. ok as I´m a sheep farmer a say whow we apperently use it with get a soft ??? with this hormon in and put it into the sheep´s vagina where it is in 15 -16 day´s and then we pull it out and after 55-60 hours she´s in heat and we insemin we do this to around 30-40 sheep´s (of 640) in the same time and get semin from inseminstation where good male sheeps are keept as to get good offsprings (male´s) to continueing our breeding program. Regard´s Malin in Iceland and apperently the swedish woman had not done her home work as this is done in more conrties than iceland as for sweden for an example I heard.
Re: [IceHorses] Angie
On 11/29/07, Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My newest addition, Angie. What a pretty, sweet looking girl! I'm glad she's there safe and sound -- Laree in NC Doppa Mura Simon, Sadie and Sam (the S gang) Yet when all the books have been read and reread, it boils down to the horse, his human companion, and what goes on between them. - William Farley
RE: [IceHorses] Re: Swedish Woman Saves Icelandic Ponies/karen
the mare´s are roaming free in pasture/field with salt buckets and lot´s of water during the time they are taken blood from them. And then the veterinary come´s one´s a week and all the mare´s are put in a pen and thoose that are healthy and pregnant with the right amount of hormon will go on into stable where the vet. will take blood from the mare´s and afterwards they are let out in the field again untill next week and it only take´s a few mininuet´s (spelling !?). That wouldn't bother me so much then, Malin. I think someone implied earlier that they were PMU mares, where they collect urine, not blood. Those mares have to be kept in a stall (many tied, I think) so that they don't tear their harnesses off - people can choose when to collect blood, but urine has to be taken when it's offered. the unwanted foal´s that are not sold will be slaughtered. That bothers me, but we know that's a cultural difference in Iceland. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
Re: [IceHorses] Angie
Ohmigosh - is she ever sweet. Tell us about her?? Nancy
RE: [IceHorses] Angie
What a pretty, sweet looking girl! I'm glad she's there safe and sound Thanks. I always worry about them on the trailer trip, but Terry takes good care of them. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
[IceHorses] Books - again
I need to think of a gift for the teenage boy who feeds our animals when we're away. I know that sounds a little far out there, but he stays at the house and helps his sister and another young woman with the lifting of the kids. He's very special in our complicated lives. So - I was thinking, since he's struggling with his riding and with taking instruction (apparently), that maybe I'd but him a book. If you were going to choose one book that would help a fifteen year old boy to be a better horse handler and more sensitive rider, what would you buy? Nancy
RE: [IceHorses] Books - again
If you were going to choose one book that would help a fifteen year old boy to be a better horse handler and more sensitive rider, what would you buy? How about one of the Mark Rashid books? They are training books, but read more like stories. A fifteen-year-old might be old enough to get them. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
RE: [IceHorses] Angie
Ohmigosh - is she ever sweet. Tell us about her?? She's 11, probably 12.3-13H, and been a brood mare, and never had any saddle training. In fact, she hasn't had much training at all. She leads, and stands pretty well to have her feet picked, etc., but she doesn't trust people fully and she can be pretty jumpy. I understand she can be very hard to catch. I believe she was one of the leave 'em alone types for a long time - having virtually no handling as a youngster.Her conformation looks good to me, but of course, I'm essentially out of the breeding business anyway. I wanted her when I found out she was available as a project horse because I know many of her relatives...who happen to be some of our favorite horses. Once I saw how much she looked like my Bjola, her half-sister, I wanted her. She is built almost exactly like Bjola, and she has eyes like her niece, Maja. My Ima is another of her nieces, and Kola is her great-niece. Bjola and Maja are two of our Einstein's, eerily smart, as are their daughters, but we'll try not to set our expectations too high for our new girl. She's Angie and no one else, so she'll be special for what she is. :) She has a lovely, floating trot - not sure what else is in there yet. I'm not sure what we're going to do with her, or when. We'll just take it one day at a time. Maybe I'll ride her sometime, maybe not. Right now, she just needs to know she's special and that someone loves her, and we do already. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
[IceHorses] OT good lord
i contacted a scottie dog rescue for my little Lucky I somehow got stuck with and someone is flying him to ohio! amazing. now to get my husband to let him go... i cant take four dogs right now. its just overwhelming. I got him for a coworker and he peed on her floor and that was it for her, she wouldnt take him and I had already promised the owner I would find him a good home, he had to give him up for medical reasons (he was going blind and moving into a home). anyway. now i feel sad. Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
[IceHorses] Re: Removing Back Shoes
Skye: Awesome info.!!! Our farrier did all of the points except #2 3 which lookk like they are key. Putting putty type stuff over the nails/old holes sure is a good thing. Our new farrier does this. Our great much beloved one that bailed on did not..makes a huge difference in hoof quality year round I have observed. Thank you sooo much for taking the time to post on the list!!! Kaaren
[IceHorses] sugar and starch testing
fyi from the Horse online: According to Watts, very few feed companies routinely test for sugar and starch. Even when they do, questions arise: Has the manufacturer provided consumers with an average per batch number, with a large variation between bags? How much variation is there from one batch to another? Do they always use the same testing lab and testing procedure? To eliminate all the guessing, Safergrass.org will provide a service to consumers, horse feed companies, and hay producers to provide independent testing of horse feeds for carbohydrates at the same, approved professional laboratory. Results will be posted on the Web site to help consumers make more informed feed choices. Horse feed companies who keep nonstructural carbohydrates reliably lower will have this information readily available for comparison by the consumer. There is also a growing market for low sugar hay, Watts said, and many of these consumers already look to the Web site for advice on management of carbohydrate intolerant horses. Hay growers who participate in the CertiCarb program will be able to list low sugar hay on Safergrass.org. -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Angie
what a doll! tell me more about her. raven
Re: [IceHorses] Books - again
On Thu, Nov 29, 2007 at 02:05:29PM -0800, Nancy Sturm wrote: If you were going to choose one book that would help a fifteen year old boy to be a better horse handler and more sensitive rider, what would you buy? centered riding by sally swift. or if you think that's too femme or too instructive rather than storyish, my horses, my teachers by alois pohadjsky. happy gifting! --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Icelandic horses do not go fishing on their own accord!
what choices !? Hayroll´s and pasture grassin the hard time around 1780 and forward into the 1800 and longer the people keept the herring for themself not giving any horse anything around 1750-1830(little iceage ) the population of people went from 50.000 down to 25.000 (starwed to death )and the horses that where left after it was only 3000 they think and for long time after that horses was not feed anything from human hand only the riding/working horse that was keept in the stable during winter for transportation. this weekend I am going to lay an anchovie out in the sun til it dries and then get a video of me offering nasi and tivar a choice between a handful of hay or a dried anchovie. Then I will offer some grass or an anchovie and then a nicker maker treat or an anchovie. we will get to the bottom of this and settle it once and for all. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
[IceHorses] adobe photoshop
does anyone know how in photoshop to take the head off something and put it on someone elses body? I did the magic extractor on my neices photo and removed her face and now I need to put curly rays head in place of hers. (dont ask) Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Angie
My newest addition, Angie. i dont know why you didnt just go ahead and name her Teevette karen. I knew you couldnt rest til you got a replacement for him you are SO jealous. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Icelandic horses do not go fishing on their own accord!
On Thu, Nov 29, 2007 at 04:08:30PM -0600, Janice McDonald wrote: this weekend I am going to lay an anchovie out in the sun til it dries and then get a video of me offering nasi and tivar a choice between a handful of hay or a dried anchovie. Then I will offer some grass or an anchovie and then a nicker maker treat or an anchovie. we will get to the bottom of this and settle it once and for all. shall i try to replicate this with a handful of grass, a tuna salad, and stjarni? :) --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Eating hay
I sure like the way she's made. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] OT good lord
I found a perfect home for our two finches today and had a backup home waiting, but still felt horrible when I delivered them. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Books - again
My Horses My Teachers is my all time favorite. I already gave it to his sister. Nancy
RE: [IceHorses] Books - again
My Horses My Teachers is my all time favorite. I already gave it to his sister. Sorry not to have any fresh ideas! I really liked Considering the Horse, but they are all good. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
RE: [IceHorses] Angie
i dont know why you didnt just go ahead and name her Teevette karen. I knew you couldnt rest til you got a replacement for him you are SO jealous. Busted! Yes, I am jealous that you have Tivar - he's still my sweetie. But, I don't have a Ruby-Red Baroness to ride him, so I know he's better off where he is. :) Angie really does remind me of him... Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
RE: [IceHorses] Angie
Tell us about Angie??? I answered this once, but I think the post was a little slow going through. If it hasn't shown up soon, I'll resend. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM IceHorses Community for Photos and Videos: http://kickapps.com/icehorses The greatest enemy of the truth very often is not the lie- deliberate, contrived and dishonest -- but the myth -- persistent, persuasive and unrealistic. All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. ~ Arthur Schopenhauer [] Lee Ziegler http://leeziegler.com [] Liz Graves http://lizgraves.com [] Lee's Book Easy Gaited Horses http://tinyurl.com/7vyjo [] IceHorses Map http://www.frappr.com/IceHorses Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [IceHorses] Eating hay
She looks happier already! Cherie
Re: [IceHorses] Runa: an autumn
On 11/29/07, Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Janice has always said that Runa is an autumn, and I thought this picture shows it well. Karen Thomas, NC in this picture she looks like Runa, Goddess of the fallen leaves and has her runway model leg-out pose like nasi does when he is trying to strike a dashing image. Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Icelandic horses do not go fishing on their own accord!
shall i try to replicate this with a handful of grass, a tuna salad, and stjarni? :) yes, video it. have it well documented. open the sandwich and show the tuna. I'll do the same. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
RE: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
that said, stjarni ground-ties and will just stand there whether i hold him or not, and i don't think my instructor's ponies were trained to ground-tie. I don't think I've ever literally trained a single horse to ground-tie, but they are usually engaged in the situation enough to stand quietly. I can't imagine using a less-than-100%-engaged horse for teaching beginners to vault. If you MUST hold a horse for mounting, let someone hold a lead line. A lead line has some give via its length, and won't trigger a panic reaction nearly so easily...assuming the handler doesn't hold the line by the snap with a death grip. That's a standard joke Pat Parelli tells at the start of each of his weekend tour stops. The three project horses come into the arena, led by their owners, who invariably are tense and nervous. Almost without fail, they have a white-knuckled grip on the snap of the lead line. Then Pat, or one of his instructors, will take the horse, giving the horse most of the 12' lead line, and the horse almost instantly relaxes. Pat then says something like, We sell 12-foot lines, so feel free to use the full length. We don't sell buckles alone, but I guess we could start stocking them. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM IceHorses Community for Photos and Videos: http://kickapps.com/icehorses The greatest enemy of the truth very often is not the lie- deliberate, contrived and dishonest -- but the myth -- persistent, persuasive and unrealistic. All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. ~ Arthur Schopenhauer [] Lee Ziegler http://leeziegler.com [] Liz Graves http://lizgraves.com [] Lee's Book Easy Gaited Horses http://tinyurl.com/7vyjo [] IceHorses Map http://www.frappr.com/IceHorses Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [IceHorses] Runa: an autumn
On Nov 29, 2007 6:32 PM, Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Janice has always said that Runa is an autumn, and I thought this picture shows it well. Beautiful! All your horses are beautiful--I can't decide which one I like best! V
[IceHorses] Tonight's show
By Anita, of the gaitedhorse list: It's Thursday so it's once again time for The ARAPA Hour, sponsored by the Arkansas Animal Producer's Association! Tonight's guest is Joe Alexander of Arkansas. Joe Alexander is a very accomplished individual, he's an artist of well known repute, an activist and a writer. Joe has authored a book on raw foods called the Blatant Raw Foods Propagandist, extolling the benefits of raw foods incorporated into one's lifestyle. He is a member on the steering committee of ARAPA and an outstanding community activist. Yes, Joe's subject has to do with the NAIS, too. http://arkansasanimalproducers.8k.com/about_15.html Click on this link: http://network.theamericanvoice.com/schedule.htm Using the bar on the right, scroll down to Thursday night and you will see THE ARAPA HOUR. This is this week's show. Last week's program can be heard on Wednesday night at the 5:00 p.m. CST slot (listed as 3:00 Pacific time on this schedule). If you have dial up and want to listen to the program, go back to the top of the screen and click on Server #2 16 kbps listed under the heading, Windows Media LISTEN LIVE. This is a ONE HOUR PROGRAM. IF YOU ARE USING A PHONE TO LISTEN, USE THE PHONE BRIDGE: 712-580- 1100 ENTRY CODE: 97524# THIS WILL REMAIN THE PHONE NUMBER UNTIL OTHERWISE NOTED. THIS NUMBER IS MADE AVAILABLE FOR ANYONE WHO DOES NOT HAVE AN INTERNET CONNECTION. YOU CAN CALL INTO THE SHOW AT THE TIME IT STARTS, TO LISTEN IN TO WHAT IS BEING SAID. WHEN THE PROGRAM GETS TO THE POINT WHERE LISTENERS MAY CALL IN TO ASK QUESTIONS AND MAKE COMMENTS, IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION TO ASK, USE: 800- 433-1429. We now know that those listening to this program via the internet is up into the THOUSANDS (that's not counting the ones listening by phone). We already have some regular FM stations in Ohio looking into broadcasting our program in cities like Toledo Cincinnati. Please help us to continue to spread the word about this program. If there are any guests that we've already had that you would like to have us bring them back again, tell us which ones. We will be having a program in the next few weeks where the phone lines will be open for callers to ask questions. Anita in Arkansas http://arkansasanimalproducers.8k.com http://nonais.org NO TO THE NAIS!!!
RE: [IceHorses] Eating hay
She looks happier already! She's funny in that she claimed Runa as hers almost instantly. She won't let Runa get near the herd in the next pasture. This phase is a little delicate. I'd like to let her go running around in the pasture for the exercise benefits, but since she's tentative about people, I also want to be sure I can easily catch her in an emergency. She was pretty easy in the stall/little paddock, but a little harder to approach in the oval pen. She likes cookies though, so hopefully she'll come around pretty quickly - she's some better already. The LAST thing I want to do is get into some crisis where I have to chase her to get her into a stall or small paddock. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.9/1158 - Release Date: 11/28/2007 9:11 PM
RE: [IceHorses] barn sour/respect/like
Hi Vicka, my instructor was at her head with the quick-release snaps i think for just that reason. that said, miss molly did not pull back at all, just bucked straight up and down with her hind end. Why was the horse cross-tied for you to mount? I might have missed something but I have to say I can't imagine having someone get on in that situation, even though she didn't pull back horses feel restrained on cross-ties or tied so don't have much choice. Robyn Icelandic Horse Farm Robyn Hood Phil Pretty Vernon BC Canada www.icefarm.com
Re: [IceHorses] Angie
On Nov 29, 2007 5:48 PM, Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My newest addition, Angie. Oh my goodness--she makes me want to hug her! What a sweet face. V
