Re: [IceHorses] X-raying Treeless Saddles
Some x-ray techs on the treeless saddle list are x-raying saddles and finding some interesting things. What are they finding? The only one that I've read that anyone has x-rayed is the Trekker Dressage Master. Isn't that the only one that was x-rayed?It was originally (a year or two ago) promoted as treeless but that claim has since been removed from their website. Now they claim that it has some sort of leather/flex tree. A woman from Australia took hers to be x-rayed, and apparantly the x-ray tech thought it has something much more rigid than leather in much of its length.I've only seen one Trekker treeless saddle, and it was a totally different model from several years ago. Janice had one when she rode in the first Liz clinic that I sponsored in 2006. That particular one Janice had was almost identical to the Barefoot Cheyenne of the same era - I had a Cheyenne at the time, and I compared them. (Neither were on my list of favorite saddles...) Apparently this dressage model is very different. The one Janice had was not only treeless, but very floppy, with nothing at all rigid about it. The x-rayed saddle was supposedly very rigid and also warped - no way a treeless saddle should warp. Honestly, I'm not sure I can tell that it was warped from the x-ray pictures the person provided. For what it's worth, the technician thought some of the parts that were supposed to be leather were probably plastic or fiberglass - not flexible at all. The woman in Australia took hers to the airport to be x-rayed. I most certainly hope people don't start doing that here in the USA. As concerned as I am about saddle fit, I don't want my tax dollars that are marked for homeland security going to do consumer reports in non-threatening situations. My gosh, the delays at airports are long enough these days, thanks to the lines at security checks. Since there has been only one report (that I saw) of an x-rayed saddle, and we don't know the technician who did it, and saddles aren't his (her?) specialty, I really don't think the report was very informative - vaguely interesting, yes, but probably a lot of speculation with not much substance. It's generated a lot of chatter, but not much useful that I see. I used to like that list, but it isn't what it used to be... Karen Thomas, NC
[IceHorses] wind fencing
I'm considering some wind fence at the west end of the riding arena. I've read that a 20% wind break gives protection 12 times the fence height downwind. Does anyone have any experience with the mesh fencing that you sometimes see around tennis courts? We have the wooden slat fencing around one enclosure, and the horses love it. I just don't like the look of it much and am looking for other alternatives. Wanda -- Thoughts become things...
Re: [IceHorses] X-raying Treeless Saddles
- Original Message - From: Judy Ryder [EMAIL PROTECTED] Some x-ray techs on the treeless saddle list are x-raying saddles and finding some interesting things! Like what???Hey Susan -- should we? : ) -- Renee M.
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 06:43:22 -0600, you wrote: Does anyone have any experience with the mesh fencing that you sometimes see around tennis courts? Yes, we've used it here as a 70mph breeze is pretty normal where we are. It does work but it doesn't last that long (ours was fine for a year, tatty for another 2 years, then fell apart) and it was quite expensive too. We did a stretch of about 150 yards to protect the vegetable plot, chicken run and baby orchard. Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk ---
[IceHorses] Re: High Heads / Necks
There are plenty of low-level dressage goals that will help ANY horse, without getting to collection... plenty of worthwhile goals to pursue, like forwardness, relaxation, straightness, implusion... I'm glad you said that. My new teacher works along the lines of the 'training tree' which is as you describe. It is the basics of classical trainng before specialisation into dressage. To see Jolli's sad video cover, go to http://astund.is and select English. Then you can find it at http://astund.is/index.php? id=24activemenu=24prod_cat=73catalog_item=1466 by naviagating through Catalogue then Books and Videos or http://tinyurl.com/54ruvh . Notice the position of the mare's neck...and the fact that the rear legs are trailing out It is awful. Try looking at the 'Astund riders' section. What do you think of the riders positions? Would you buy that saddle with this advert? Huggin doesn't appear to like his. sue Coombes
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do you really think that if a horse both trots and gaits naturally and at liberty, trotting will diminish the ability to gait? I don't think so, as a matter of fact, I have a horse that proves the opposite. I have been pushing Whisper for longer and faster trots, and her slow saddle rack has become a full rack. Not a speed rack by any means, but she used to break gait and trot when pushed for speed. So trotting has improved her gaiting and increased speed in gait. Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/
Re: [IceHorses] O/T Sophie
She is just so cute! Our daughter's chihuahua has always rested on the back of their golden retriever. She apparently makes a nice pillow. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
and her slow saddle rack has become a full rack. Wait until you get her to a ride. She may surprise you. Hunter flies at the rack in competition. Two women riding behind me at Headwaters last year (one gaited, one Arab) were convulsed in giggles at the finish because they had to canter to keep up with him. The gaited girl tried several times to buy him. Isn't it about time for your new saddle to arrive Susan? Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Isn't it about time for your new saddle to arrive Susan? It's supposed to be shipped next week!! I can hardly wait. Whisper is doing so well, once I get the new saddle, I will take her back out on the trail alone. I know at least one place where she will stop, and I will have to get off and walk her past it and with the new saddle, I will be able to re-mount from the ground! It will be a releif to have a saddle I can mount from the ground, as there are lots of times I would like to get off and walk for 5 or 10 minutes, and there just isn't anything in the desert to use as a mounting block! And the treeless are not conducive to mounting from the ground, unless you want to ride on your horse's ribs! I have no one to ride Whisper with today, so I will boot her and put pads in and take her up and down the gravel road. She needs to get use to rocks! Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 06:11:53 -0800, you wrote: Do you really think that if a horse both trots and gaits naturally and at liberty, trotting will diminish the ability to gait? That hasn't been my experience unless the horse is allowed to trot long and low on the forehand all the time. I find it's much easier to lose gait if you have a pacey horse that doesn't trot at all by preference. Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk ---
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
we plant a dense line of cedars or bamboo. yes we have bamboo. oddly, no one knows why, but here in this region we have a lot of plants and insects only found here and in china. There is an old folktale, true or maybe not, that says a missionary returning from china was going down the appalachicola on a barge and her bag fell over board and the bag was full of seeds and insect larvae. anyway. bamboo can make a fence that looks like an elephant enclosure in about a year. Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] X-raying Treeless Saddles
my nephew, age 10, was pulled out of line at the airport and him and my sister taken into a room for questioning by homeland security because he had a turtle in a shoebox that went thru xray. Now I can see maybe a toy gun. But surely they didnt think he had something hidden inside a turtle... as for saddle xray... there is something about a sensation that causes some people to ride in such a manner that where the stirrup hanger is causes rubbing. I thought Tivar's white spots, almost perfect rectangles,. were old things. But now when I ride Trausti I see the rubbing in his hair there. What is it about me? Is it that when the horse goes faster than a walk I sorta balance myself in the stirrups? Its me I know, just wish i could figure out what it is I am doing. It did not happen the first couple of times I rode trausti, but we did not go fast. Only happens when we go fast, and only happens MAYBE when he canters or trots. Because his runningwalk is so smooth I basically am just sitting there with no bracing or stiffness or hanging on at all. anyway. dont want him to get a white spot too! Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
[IceHorses] mental migdests
HAHAHA someone posted this to my youtube biglick hocks video comments. I cant quit laughing about it. henry, You have toi take these anti padded people with a grain of salt. They are mental midgest that give more creedance to the life and their perception of its well being thatn they do a human. Their minds are seared and they have lost their natural affection for their fellow man and worship the animal instead.Rational thought and logic means nothing to them.These are the same people who would have been against farmers using horses to plow 12hours a day on extreme heat back in the early 1900s yes, WE are the mental midgests. Hoot! Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] O/T Sophie
On 7/11/08, Wanda Lauscher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sophie has found a new perch... Oh..the joys of small dogs... Wanda she is saying, someone needs tio kill all these chickens and cats, but it doesnt have to be me. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Janice's Uncle
we are all banned from the internet because this woman at work about 60 years old, looks like olive Oyl with a little bun and a long holy roller skirt and no makeup... was caught running a sex toy business on the internet from her work computer. also a man, a manager, someone we would all look up to and admire as a family man, was emailing hundreds of times a day with women he met on e harmony and matchmaker, and he was a married man of 40 years.both were fired. sorta makes you lose faith in those dating online sites i think. But then she called us in wednesday and started bawling about how each and every one of us is going to be interviewed about our mistakes and constant errors and weaknesses that the word on the street is that we are all on the take haha. I was like honey, if I was on the take I would not be drivin no yaris. heaven aint cheap is all i got to say... someone permitted a montesorri school in a house built in 1821 that didnt even have adequate plumbing much less handicapped facilities and adequate fire flow and fire sprinkler system. 75 kids to be dropped off and picked up each day with no place to park but a single car garage for employees etc. Then she is getting on to EVERYONE and looks at me and realized she hadnt gotten on to me yet and blurted and janice I know by the sign out sheet you have not been performing site visits, these projects need to be looked at and not just on paper! yayda yada on and on. So yesterday I checked out a 4 wheel drive truck at 9 AM and went to a site visit of a 1700 acre proposed development and cranked the stereo up wide open on oldies channel and was blasting through the woods splattering mud everywhere and singing LOUD and whapping the side of the cab in time with the music, my arm out even tho I had the AC blasting, I logged in 97 miles in four hours. So when i got back I told her thank you for reminding me about site visits, today I realized I have been missing a lot I should have noticed before on these sites, and I certainly intend to do this on each and every project that comes in, several times. : she just beamed like, oh, she is such a wonderful mentor for me. and you walk by every desk and each and every employee is hunkered over their cell phones just busy bees. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] OT -- Spirit Orb
my friend died this week. I think we all have abilities we dont know about, to channel things, spirits, etc, to see things. we just dont look. I was meditating at sunset while my horses ate their evening meal and I tried to feel my friends spiirit presence and ask her how she needed me to help her children, a 19 year old and sixteen year old all alone. I am going to see them today. I felt very strongly her presence and that what I need to do most for her children is make them smile again, thats what I have as a valuable gift. I felt that very strongly. that is what she needs me to do. and then my mind wandered and I felt her at my left shoulder, i almost felt her touch, she told me what was going on in the mnd of each horse, and I realized it was something i had known all the time, how Nasi is feeling like he doesnt belong to any horse anymore since Teev left, I put him in with trausti and then took him away in with Fox. he feels insecure about this. about Teev gone and all these changes. i need to put him in with trausti and keep him there. Stonewall bored and wanting out more, he promises he will be good. Trausti still afraid I will ask him to do something terrifying. Jas knows he is sick and knows I am trying to help him. Traveller doesnt understand why I dont give him attention like the others, he doesnt know he is my husbands horse he just feels for whatever reason I ignore him. Fox is ok, but thinks his job is to look after curly and nas, the small ones. He takes it very seriously. But are these things I noticed because i took the time to look at them? Whatever. It doesnt matter. just matters that i looked at it. spiritual musings are wonderful i think. was good to know I shouldnt go over to my friends house and try to take over the world, i just need to make them smile again. that is a simple assignment for me! janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] 33 Truths about Horses
any of these would make a great snigtag. I was totally baffled by this one: 28. A clean stable and a sparkling horse are among life's great pleasures--- until i realized it was sparkling HORSE not sparkling HOUSE. cause i kept thinking my god I have never known a single horse person that had a sparkling house, how can this be?!? I wondered about it for days. It became an obsession. I thought, well maybe they are rich and have a maid. but I know a rich woman, several in fact, and the richest one has a 7,000 square foot house worth about two million and when you walk into the foyer there is a muddy antique moth eaten dull and cracked and flaps rolled awry saddle thats I know for a fact has been in the same spot three years. You cant grind coffee beans at her house cause she has three grinders and all three have bute powder residue. She has an olympic size pool with enclosure that looks like a catfish pond. It may even have fish living in it. She has a 3,000 dollar plasma television in every room, I mean every room. and in the middle of her livingroom floor, christmas wrapping paper, ribbon, and scissors and tape, and here it is july. reindeer and sleigh plywood cutouts stacked precariously on the dining room table. She drives a brand new ford diesel dually and has a hundred thousand dollar horse trailer and insists I camp with her in the trailer when we are off together and to sleep I have to lay in a wet pee spot cause her granddaughter pees the bed but I dont have the heart to tell her. There are at least a dozen pairs of brand new riding tights with tags still on, brand new bridles, gloves, halters, slinkies, winter blankets, piled on the bed she sleeps on when we camp and she doesnt move it, she just sleeps on top of it. But she gets maddern fire if you come into her horse trailer and dont take your shoes off at the door. I guess that makes sense to some... every now and then she gets bored and whines to her husband that she wishes she had a job so he buys her a business, a little coffee shop, a sandwich shop, a bar b que shack, she gtes so bored and offended when people start asking why it wasnt opened at the opening time noted on the door and sells it. She has five sons, not one of them can keep a job and they all have wives and kids and her and her husband support them all, buy them houses etc. She inherited a lot of money when her parents died but i know she had to have run thru it all by now. Her husband owns a large pharmaceutical distrubution company. when we go to coffee after a ride I sit there beside her purse and look down and her coin purse is always gapped open with a wad of twenty and fifty dollar bills that would choke a camel, you could never close it. She is always tight about tipping waitresses. anyway. just thought you all needed to know about how my rich friend acts. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
[IceHorses] Icelandic-Welsh Cross
http://mustangsaga.blogspot.com/2008/07/isnt-this-cute-picture-of-wee-man-in.html Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] OT -- Spirit Orb
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 11:21 AM, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i just need to make them smile again. that is a simple assignment for me! janice I think you are a good and wonderful person. V
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
It's supposed to be shipped next week!! I can hardly wait. One of the gals I ride with uses a Specialized. She rode out a nasty Arab spook a while back and said Well, I feel pretty good about my new saddle. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 10:22 AM, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: bamboo can make a fence that looks like an elephant enclosure in about a year. I remember reading somewhere that bamboo can take over and it's hard to get rid of. Do you have any photos of your bamboo? V
Re: [IceHorses] 33 Truths about Horses
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 11:43 AM, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: anyway. just thought you all needed to know about how my rich friend acts. Janice -- She sounds like an interesting person. V
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One of the gals I ride with uses a Specialized. She rode out a nasty Arab spook a while back and said Well, I feel pretty good about my new saddle. I got the slimline endurance pommel, it makes a great handle. But I will have to swivel my fanney pack stuffed with carrot slices to the side as the fanney pack interferes with the pommel. Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/
[IceHorses] Licking dirt
Orri has a spot in the corner of the pen where he'll stand and lick the dirt. Both horses are now getting a vit/min mix with ACV, Kelp and Flax, but he's obviously still looking for something. I bought an equine salt/mineral block that may help and I think I'll check out thos ABC products. V Virginia Tupper NB, Canada
Re: [IceHorses] OT -- Spirit Orb
I think you are a good and wonderful person. V Thanks V, I think you are too ... I have been hard on myself all week tho. I did not return her call and then when I did, she had passed away. I blubbered around for days about what a horrible terrible friend I am! I worry she had called to tell me she was having health probs and to give me some instruction or pass along some worries she had about her kids. But my daughter says it was meant to be this way so I need to forgive myself and go on. sometimes I feel like, life is hard and then you die. I look at animal abuse and bad people and child abuse and then start feeling sad about even stuff like turtles crossing the road, will they fall in the drainage culvert and not get out and drown and then I think well, I am just a depressed nut and need meds :) I did save two turtles this week tho. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
On 7/11/08, Virginia Tupper [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 10:22 AM, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: bamboo can make a fence that looks like an elephant enclosure in about a year. I remember reading somewhere that bamboo can take over and it's hard to get rid of. Do you have any photos of your bamboo? V no i dont because if I had any bamboo my husband would run out the back door with a machete roaring like a samurai warrior and hack it to peices on the spot. I can however take some pics of it on the trail. Whats interesting... they say pandas eat only bamboo, just tons and tons a day. And when we are on a trail ride and we come up on some bamboo, that is jaspars most favorite snack on the planet, the little tender baby bamboo plants. I let him eat them as a special treat, I will just sit in the saddle and let him eat all he wants. also a plant relative, maiden cane, he is crazy about that too. janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
[IceHorses] icelandic mare for sale
There is an icelandic mare for sale on horsetopia.com. she is in Ocala area. 4,000. she is ten. Regarding: Missy, listing #316438 Webpage: http://horsetopia.horse-for-sale.org/classifieds/ad316438 Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
I love an endurance pommel. Gosh how could anyone go back to a western horn after an endurance pommel... when people say I cant have that, i have to have something to hold on to! i think jeez all they have is that one little horn, an endurance pommel is a huge handle. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
Are there Icelandics that both tolt ventroflexed and trot in true collection? I haven't seen an Icelandic in true collection. Sara Silfverberg has been doing dressage with an Icelandic Horse: http://icehorses.blogspot.com/2008/07/icelandic-horse-dressage.html She notes that this is a first attempt at collection. She says: Principally the shape of the piaffe and the collected tölt are the same. In both exercises the horse should be in a collected shape, with raised neck, arced back and seated on the hindquarters. The different is only the tact of the footfalls, where in the piaffe it is a diagonal two beat, and in the tölt it is a fourbeat. If the horse can load the hindlegs, one should principally be able to ask the horse for a two-pace, and the piaffe would come, and for a four-pace and the horse would than execute a collected tölt, or a three-pace and the collected canter would come. She has an image that shows tolt at the high point of collection: http://www.klassisch-reiten.at/t1_islandpferde_stufenleiter.jpg I think this all shows that there is a misunderstanding at the very basis of what collection is. Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] OT -- Spirit Orb
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 12:57 PM, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have been hard on myself all week tho. I did not return her call and then when I did, she had passed away. Oh my goodness--I think I'd be driving myself crazy if that had happened to me! But, I also think your daughter is right. V
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 1:01 PM, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: they say pandas eat only bamboo, just tons and tons a day. I guess Pandas are meant to keep the bamboo in check. :D V
Re: [IceHorses] Licking dirt
They say V that a horse can stand and lick a mineral block all day every day and not get the minerals he needs, so you have to have loose minerals. I have had probs now and then with bark chewing and think its related to minerals. also the move for you... a place with new soil nutrients, stuff in the grass causing a different balance etc... like here in my area, a documented deficiency in the soil of selenium. also dont know why but when teev came here he was insane wanting minerals and I thought that was just him, but now trausti is too. there must be something at karens that they are feeling a depletion of here. I give my horses loose minerals when i know it isnt gonna rain so it wont melt away but now and then it gets caught in rain and one day i found Trausti was lapping the mineral water he wanted it so bad. I moved a holder further under the shelter and keep minerals in it all the time for him now. I thought it was because it was more hot and humid here but Trausti does not seem excessively sweaty and its not all that different here in summer from karens! in winter yes, but not summer... so it has to be feed/grass/soil even water! water has minerals you know. And if heavy in one thing can cause an imbalance so they need more of anotehr. we have high iron content and no sulphur. water in lousiana for instance, smells like rotten eggs from ten feet away when you turn on a fawcett its so full of sulphur. janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
I have a picture of nasi in true collection at liberty but he is being chased and bitten by a donkey. janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
. I guess Pandas are meant to keep the bamboo in check. :D V yeah! and they say every so many years all the bamboo dies off at once and when it does the chinese people have to scrounge for miles and miles for bamboo to take to the pandas and keep them alive til the bamboo comes back! very interesting, nature. Like now, I am having a chicken a day disappear. then this morning, very early, I heard it, the dang owl that came last year is back so now will lock all my chickens up til he leaves. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Licking dirt
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 1:12 PM, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: They say V that a horse can stand and lick a mineral block all day every day and not get the minerals he needs, so you have to have loose minerals. That's good to know, thanks! V
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 1:16 PM, Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: . yeah! and they say every so many years all the bamboo dies off at once and when it does the chinese people have to scrounge for miles and miles for bamboo to take to the pandas and keep them alive til the bamboo comes back! I didn't know that! chicken a day disappear. then this morning, very early, I heard it, the dang owl that came last year is back so now will lock all my chickens up til he leaves. Would an owl fly away with a chicken?! They must be strong. V
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
--- Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If the horse is trotty, I'll allow, even encourage him to do it, but not to the extend that it kills his gaits. Do you really think that if a horse both trots and gaits naturally and at liberty, trotting will diminish the ability to gait? Being new to gaited horses, I have both of mine both trotting and gaiting. Hunter has been doing this for four years now - admitttedly only a one horse test) and he's still doing several gaits plus trotting. Nancy Remember I was a closet-trotter for years, now one who openly trots, so I wasn't talking about merely trotting some of the time...I was talking about trotting to extent of working towards COLLECTED trot...getting the horse's nose towards the vertical, etc. (Remember, the subject line: heads and necks.) That takes a lot of trotting, and not just any old trot will get you towards collection. I DO think that if you trot that much that it's quite possible to affect the muscle memory of what the horse tends to do naturallyor trotting that much may simply be too much stress for a horse who has a lot of lateralness to his gaits. Karen Thomas, NC Karen Thomas, NC
[IceHorses] white spots from stirrup rubbing
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 08:28:33AM -0500, Janice McDonald wrote: about me? Is it that when the horse goes faster than a walk I sorta balance myself in the stirrups? Its me I know, just wish i could figure out what it is I am doing. It did not happen the first couple of times I rode trausti, but we did not go fast. Only happens when we go fast, and only happens MAYBE when he canters or trots. Because his runningwalk is so smooth I basically am just sitting there with no bracing or stiffness or hanging on at all. anyway. dont want him to get a white spot too! sounds like you are gripping your horse with your feet at the faster gaits, instead of letting gravity and the motion of your seat keep you in touch with your horse. you should *always* be just sitting there with no bracing or stiffness or hanging on at all -- your seat moves to accomodate his back's motion, and that's all that needs to happen. riding without stirrups is the obvious way to practice this, or if you can, perhaps taking some lessons might help. --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
On Fri, 11 Jul 2008 12:54:15 -0300, you wrote: I remember reading somewhere that bamboo can take over and it's hard to get rid of. Do you have any photos of your bamboo? Bamboo dies here in our hard salty winds. Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk ---
Re: [IceHorses] 33 Truths about Horses
2008/7/11 Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED]: bills that would choke a camel, you could never close it. She is always tight about tipping waitresses. anyway. just thought you all needed to know about how my rich friend acts. We have friends we go out for supper with now and then, and we'll take turns paying. I just KNOW when they pay...they don't tip...and it drives me crazy. Wanda -- Thoughts become things...
Re: [IceHorses] OT -- Spirit Orb
2008/7/11 Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Thanks V, I think you are too ... I have been hard on myself all week tho. I did not return her call and then when I did, she had passed away. I blubbered around for days about what a horrible terrible friend I am! Gawd! Janice...and here I am sending in pics of your three legged uncles. It's like I've been picking on a helpless pup. Take care of yourself. I'm very sorry about your friend. Wanda
[IceHorses] Gypsy Vanners Here
Sonoma, California, has a Gypsy Vanner importer/breeder. Stephanie Burlington imported a lovely mare some years ago that she planned to train to drive and fit in with her other stable of various breeds. But the mare turned out to be pregnant and several DNA tests later the colt proved to be of wonderful lines. So, she started a new business. I got to see the baby, named Jazz, when he was about two months old and again when he was 6 months old and big and pushy and in need of ground training before he put on another pound. She will take her Vanners to the Sonoma County Fair (July 25-Aug.6) for the Equine Extravaganza; and if you are within travelling distance I urge you to go see them. Her website begins with a slide show that seems tedious but is arranged as a kind of story of how she got started. As I recall he got her first from Romania. Try www.hiddencreekranch.com Nancy
[IceHorses] TOLT NEWS
The current issue of TOLT NEWS has several good articles, my favorite is on Icelandic coloring - especially cream dilution. Cream on chestnut = palomino or cream on black = blue dun, etc. Great pictures explain so much thanks in large part to Mic who must have access to all the colors of these horses. So now I'll stop calling the horse standing next to mine a buckskin; he is a bay dun. Nancy in Sonoma
[IceHorses] Treeless/mounting from the ground
And the treeless are not conducive to mounting from the ground, unless you want to ride on your horse's ribs! We need to get Kaaren Jordan to give us some mounting from the ground lessons. Granted she weighs about 100 lbs soaking wet, but she has a system that works well for her. I figure it I can drop another 10 or 15 lbs I may demo another Sensation. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] OT -- Spirit Orb
Gawd! Janice...and here I am sending in pics of your three legged uncles. It's like I've been picking on a helpless pup. Take care of yourself. I'm very sorry about your friend. Wanda i needed the three legged uncle pics to keep me smilin :) Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Treeless/mounting from the ground
I figure it I can drop another 10 or 15 lbs I may demo another Sensation. Nancy i have ridden in about every treeless brand there is and they will all slip. The ways to minimize slippage is to have a good pad, and a snug hunter type breast collar. period. no other way if you weigh over about 160. and how you mount factors in. Like if you really spring up there is different than hanging onto the side like you are being air lifted by the coast guard after your boat has capsized in a hurricane, which is how I mount. I am the voice of experience, the benchmark that all heavy treeless riders should aspire to. If there was a way to mount in the desert I feel I would find it cause I am expert at mounting just about anywhere, from anything. I have even mounted by using another horse's leg to brace against and pull my horse, and walk up the other horse's leg. Gotta have two great horses to do that. to me a sensation hybrid is the best treeless for fat people. the worst way to mount is to drop down onto a horses back from a cliff edge like gene autry. I once fell five times in ten minutes doing that. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] 33 Truths about Horses
my rich friends husband bought her a cuban sandwich shop. it went down the tubes because when customers came in she would just keep sitting like she was a customer and not even look up and acknowlege teh customer. ha! can you imagine if she had to have a real job! and all her horses are aqha and all have to have the cream gene. either buckskin or palomino. janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] O/T Sophie
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 8:04 AM, Wanda Lauscher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sophie has found a new perch... Oh..the joys of small dogs... She is so cute. When we ride in the car, Arnie sits on Michael's back, shoulders with the head rest supporting him. He curls his head around Michael's neck and looks down the road. Our now gone Penny used to do the same thing. He has acquired quite a few of Pennny's old little habits even though he never met Penny as she passed away a few months before he was born. -- Anna Southern Ohio
Re: [IceHorses] Treeless/mounting from the ground
I am expert at mounting just about anywhere, from anything. You need to meet my friend Gayle. She is the princess of mounting from weird stuff. I have seen her use a car bumper (she does this all the time) and a picnic table and various other things. She has the most amazing horse. When I first started riding with her, she scared me by making an abrupt stop, throwing herself off her horse, leaving the reins over his neck. He just stood there like a statue while she picked out the feet she'd forgotten to check. She gets away with the most amazing stuff. He just rolls his eyes as if to say, It's just Gayle. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Treeless/mounting from the ground
We need to get Kaaren Jordan to give us some mounting from the ground lessons. Granted she weighs about 100 lbs soaking wet, but she has a system that works well for her. I figure it I can drop another 10 or 15 lbs I may demo another Sensation. Cary weights 235 pounds and he mounts his Sensation from the ground and it doesn't slip - he doesn't use a breastcollar either - granted, his style could use work, but he does it. The system that Kaaren has on her website was copied from Christine Schwartz's Joy of Icelandics book, but it's very similar to the way that Pat Parelli teaches too - it's simply a good way to mount. I CAN mount the Sensations from the ground, but I don't very often. I still have a little sciatic damage in my left (mounting) leg. Stretching that leg is a project I need to work on Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
I have a picture of nasi in true collection at liberty but he is being chased and bitten by a donkey. janice I have one of Isak in true collection, but he's peeing. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
Icelandic Horses generally have shallow curves at the top and wide curves at the bottom. When this inverted curve gets to an extreme, the horse stargazes and doesn't easily go on the bit: http://womenministers.government.is/media/W_Gallery/xlarge/31.jpg http://womenministers.government.is/media/W_Gallery/xlarge/30.jpg http://www.worldofhorses.co.uk/breeds/Images/Ice-Compete.jpg http://images.cafepress.com/product/115109119v4_240x240_Front.jpg http://inlinethumb05.webshots.com/42180/2602770110078559095S425x425Q85.jpg http://www.flickr.com/photos/villiv/2323797761/ Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
When this inverted curve gets to an extreme, the horse stargazes and doesn't easily go on the bit: Wow. If I had seen pictures like that, I would never have gone to look at Icelandics. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] X-raying Treeless Saddles
I thought Tivar's white spots, almost perfect rectangles,. were old things. But now when I ride Trausti I see the rubbing in his hair there. Uhm, Janice, WHAT rectangles? I just looked at Tivar's back, and I don't see any rectangles. There are two tiny patches right on his spine - maybe 6-10 white hairs each, but that's it. Don't I remember that he had them when he came here two years ago, before you ever got him? I think he did. I know that he had an unfortunate accident long before I got him with a trainer and a broken saddle tree - one of his first known bucking episodes, if I remember right. Honestly, that was the first thing I noticed about Tivar when he got here. His back is in great shape - no atrophy from either saddle fit or from his old tolt posture. I know he'd been ridden in a treeless saddle for a long time even before I got him, but he would still go into that dreaded tolt frame whenever he'd get tense, way back then. He had some atrophy when I got him - not from the saddle, but from the posture he held himself in, but what was likely learned from the tolt training he had. I don't think I'd blame you (or the Sensations) for the shape Tivar's back is in...I might give you some credit, but no blame. BTW, two-year-old Tifa has more white hairs in her saddle area than Tivar has...and she's never had a saddle on her back. It's great that people care enough to worry about saddle-fit and white hairs, but not EVERY white hair comes from a bad saddle, and sometimes it takes years for the white hairs to show up. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] Treeless/mounting from the ground
i have ridden in about every treeless brand there is and they will all slip. The ways to minimize slippage is to have a good pad, and a snug hunter type breast collar. period. no other way if you weigh over about 160. and how you mount factors in. Like if you really spring up there is different than hanging onto the side like you are being air lifted by the coast guard after your boat has capsized in a hurricane, which is how I mount. Cary is 235 pounds, doesn't use a breastcollar. He has a bad hip (otherwise fairly athletic) so he has to waller up (to use a Janice phrase) onto the horses' backs. His Sensation doesn't slip. I promise...it doesn't. His mounting technique is NOT pretty - he looks like an old man getting on a horse. BUT, he knows how to hold on so he doesn't torque the saddle, so it stays put nicely. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] Treeless/mounting from the ground
His Sensation doesn't slip. I promise...it doesn't. Which Sensation does Cary use? In pictures he looks quite tall. Is he? And do you think that helps? Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Treeless/mounting from the ground
Which Sensation does Cary use? In pictures he looks quite tall. Is he? And do you think that helps? He uses an English trail with a Saddleright pad. He's 6'2 and ordinarily I think that would help a lot. But, he has such a serious hip issue (probably needs a replacement) that his mounting is seriously impacted. I should see if he'd let me get a video of him mounting - he's pretty easy-going, but I'll betcha he'll veto that one. He literally has to waller up onto the horse's back. I'm sure his disability and his weight more than outweigh any benefit the height provides in mounting. Anyway, I'm only 5'0 tall, not slim, and I'm old and crippled. I can mount the Sensations in a pinch from the ground. Believe me, we are both far from the model of youthful coordination, but we finally got the hang of mounting the right way. I use a breastcollar occasionally (mostly for looks) and I doubt that Cary has ever used one even once. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] Re: High Heads / Necks
I'm glad you said that. My new teacher works along the lines of the 'training tree' which is as you describe. It is the basics of classical trainng before specialisation into dressage. I've quoted Jane Savoie many times on the list. Her Cross Train Your Horse book is what I have in mind when the words dressage and gaited horses are used in the same sentence. The book isn't geared towards gaited horses - just ordinary horses, and horses used for non-dressage sports - but the exercises are so solid, and so basic that they really don't seem like dressage. And honestly, much of the early work, before the specialization you mentioned, can be done at the walk, so gait isn't even a factor. It's just simply good, basic riding. It just flabbergasted me when the new Icelandic-traditionalists started talking about dressage, they just seemed to skip right over the boring stuff, and into the flash-in-the-pan glitz. But, then, you see the results of skipping the basics in that picture of Jolli... It is awful. Try looking at the 'Astund riders' section. What do you think of the riders positions? Would you buy that saddle with this advert? Huggin doesn't appear to like his. I didn't look at them this time, but in the past, they have had some really awful ones. No, I wouldn't buy any products if the horses on their sites are supposed to be testaments of their value. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
When this inverted curve gets to an extreme, the horse stargazes and doesn't easily go on the bit: Wow. If I had seen pictures like that, I would never have gone to look at Icelandics. Next to this picture: http://www.worldofhorses.co.uk/breeds/Images/Ice-Compete.jpg on this page: http://www.worldofhorses.co.uk/breeds/Icelandic_Breed.htm is the text: expressive head supported by a supple, well-set neck Well, no, that's not what the picture shows! This head / neck is not a majestic proud head set. It's an inverted neck with a problematic head set. Sometimes I wonder if the breeders, sellers, judges, and trainers actually understand the words that are being said and how they relate to reality. It seems that there is no depth to the understanding of conformation. If they are trying to breed necks that are set a little higher, perhaps they should first pay attention to breeding necks that are not inverted. That would be a more logical direction to take, especially if they want to have the horse on the bit! Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] An Emergency in the desert and Whisper's response
My original plan this morning when I went to groom Whisper was to put her easy boots on with the dome pads in the front and ride her up and down our gravel road to get he used to riding on rocks. This was because I had no one to ride with. My neighor, who has a very expensive, always in training cutting horse, stops by on her horse and says she is going for a trail ride. I said if she didn't mind waiting for me to saddle up, I'd go with her. Our plan was to do a short, fast ride since both of our mares are in VERY good shape. We get 1/2 way around our 5 mile loop, and her horse ties up. Well shit! She calls the vet, calls our other neighbor (the 3 day eventer) and arranges for the neighbor to get some ace from the vet so we can walk the mare to an area where we can get a horse trailer to. I have a quad, so I tell her I will ride Whisper back alone to pick up Sharon and the Ace, and bring her back in my quad. Well, Whisper has not gone alone in over a year, and we have been working on that, but I still havn't ASKED Whisper to go alone, but she has been leading well. Off we start, and I tell Whisper that she can do it and the mare, Julia, is counting on us. We were on a rescue mission. I think Whisper knew this, because she trotted all the way home with out the first balk and I am so proud of Whisper that I have no words! Just about the time I put Whisper up, Sharon arrives with the Ace and we get water and a tub, and head out to the desert. Julia gets the Ace, and we wait 30-40 minutes for it to take effect (per vet's advice) and we walk Julia to an area where the horse trailer can get to. Julia is at the vet's now, and I hope no damage has been done to her kidneys from this tying up episode. But Whisper came thru for me and for the mare, and she is the best girl in the world!! Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/
Re: [IceHorses] TOLT NEWS
--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Nancy Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The current issue of TOLT NEWS has several good articles, my favorite is on Icelandic coloring - I too enjoyed my issue very much this time. The color series is very good. I will need to read and re-read it many times befor it all sinks in. They had a good article on massaging your horse as well. We also just got our issue of Equine Wellnes, and there are many good articles in that magazine this time about different issues with horses. Skye
Re: [IceHorses] An Emergency in the desert and Whisper's response
But Whisper came thru for me and for the mare, and she is the best girl in the world!! She certainly did and it sounds like it was a good thing you and Whisper decided to join your friend on this particular day. Nancy
[IceHorses] TOLT NEWS
Yes, I also enjoyed the color article. I know now that Hlekkur , my plain old chestnut, is really a red dun. His father was red dun and Hlekkur has all the characteristics of red dun. Renee **Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus0005000112)
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
is the text: expressive head supported by a supple, well-set neck Well, no, that's not what the picture shows! This head / neck is not a majestic proud head set. It's an inverted neck with a problematic head set. How about these images: http://special.equisearch.com/blog/equitrekking/uploaded_images/IMG_4517-740141.JPG http://www.texastolters.org/pics/TexasTolters-large.jpg http://toltnews.com/images/logo.gif http://www.flugnir.50megs.com/images/fluglogo-half-sm_198x250.jpg http://www.flugnir.50megs.com/images/zippy_filter_257x500.jpg Is this the right way to portray the breed? Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 8:55 PM, Judy Ryder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How about these images: Do you have any images of how the head/neck should be in a tolt? V
[IceHorses] The other lesson learned today...
The other valuable lesson I learned during the tying up episode out in the desert was that if you need glasses to see your cell phone numbers in order to call the vet you have pre-programed into your cell phone, you damn better have your glasses with you! Not only could I NOT see my cell phone numbers, Judy did not know how to operate my cell phone to get the vet's number up to call. Just an important FYI so other people do not experience the frustration I experienced in an emergency. I'm going to get a cheap pair of cheaters and wear them on a string around my neck and tuck them inside my shirt from now on! Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/
Re: [IceHorses] Treeless/mounting from the ground
Janice McDonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I figure it I can drop another 10 or 15 lbs I may demo another Sensation. Nancy i have ridden in about every treeless brand there is and they will all slip. Not necessary. I weigh over 160 lbs. and the Sensation does not slip when I mount from the ground -- AND I've been known to ride with a relatively loose girth. Also, I have another treeless that also doesn't slip. But, I think I have about 5.5 of height on you Janice, so I think how tall a person is a factor too in the slippage equation. : ) -- Renee M. in Michigan
Re: [IceHorses] The other lesson learned today...
The other valuable lesson I learned during the tying up episode out in the desert was that if you need glasses to see your cell phone numbers in order to call the vet you have pre-programed into your cell phone, you damn better have your glasses with you! I finally got prescription sunglasses when I realized I couldn't read my heart rate monitor. You can sort of tell where my priorities lie. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
Do you have any images of how the head/neck should be in a tolt? V I think that's just it - there really shouldn't be a preconceived frame. Whatever the horse does naturally - with maybe a little bit of support at times - is what he/she needs, but that will vary a lot from horse to horse. If you are talking about a true rack/tolt (the single-foot version), the horse is likely to hold his/her head higher, in order to achieve the single-foot support phase. I'll see if I can find a picture of Skjoni saddle-racking. He's a saddle-racking fool, and will saddle-rack on a loose rein. It's not that his way is THE right way, it's just the right way for him... Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] High Heads / Necks
If they are trying to breed necks that are set a little higher, perhaps they should first pay attention to breeding necks that are not inverted. That would be a more logical direction to take, especially if they want to have the horse on the bit! That is the issue to me - the inverted necks. I don't even really care if a trail horse has a slightly inverted neck - key word: slightly. What troubles me much more is when the horses are ridden such that the muscles are developed, making the inversion even more extreme. Karen Thomas, NC
[IceHorses] Skjoni saddle-racking
Here's a series of still shots taken a couple of years ago of Cary's horse, Skjoni, saddle-racking. Again, this isn't so much THE frame that a horse should have to saddle rack...it's just the frame that Skjoni naturally assumes on a semi-loose rein. I think it's fairly typical though, of a horse who chooses to saddle-rack. http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=4jh0nhxz.bccf2jvbx=0y=q0g64slocaleid=en_US Skjoni is not collected when he saddle racks, but on the other hand, he's not showing an extreme amount of ventroflexion, nor is he extremely strung out. His head is up (his choice) but he's not star-gazing. Skjoni can walk/trot and canter on the rail in the ring (with me up - Cary usually doesn't bother), and he can do leg yield, and a tiny bit towards shoulder-in. That does NOT mean that he has talent for dressage nor that he he is a dressage horse - it means we've worked on a tiny bit of the basics with him. It also means that he's one fun and versatile horse. :) Here's the video version. http://youtube.com/watch?v=xHdab8atoiA Sometimes Skjoni gaits in the pasture, and when he does, his head/frame is much the same as in the video and the still pictures. He also trots at liberty, but when he does, his head is usually lower - both are his choice. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] An Emergency in the desert and Whisper's response
2008/7/11 susan cooper [EMAIL PROTECTED]: This was because I had no one to ride with. My neighor, who has a very expensive, always in training cutting horse, stops by on her horse and says she is going for a trail ride. Thank heaven you went with her Susan. Your presence on that ride most likely saved that mare's life. Isn't it funny how life can present you with a series of little coincidences? When I hear stories like this I often think a divine hand was guiding you today. Isn't Whisper just a peach? What a lovely horse to pull through for you when you needed her. I know you joke about how you think Nancy is the only one reading and absorbing your posts, but rest assured that I'm up here in Canada reading every word. All your hard work and attention to detail paid off today...in a huge way. Wanda -- Thoughts become things...
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
2008/7/11 Mic Rushen [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Yes, we've used it here as a 70mph breeze is pretty normal where we are. It does work but it doesn't last that long (ours was fine for a year, tatty for another 2 years, then fell apart) and it was quite expensive too. We did a stretch of about 150 yards to protect the vegetable plot, chicken run and baby orchard. Okay...so there goes that idea. We've had some of the wooden slats up here for 10 years and they are still just as solid as the day they were put in. Wanda -- Thoughts become things...
Re: [IceHorses] wind fencing
2008/7/11 Mic Rushen [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Yes, we've used it here as a 70mph breeze is pretty normal where we are. It does work but it doesn't last that long (ours was fine for a year, tatty for another 2 years, then fell apart) and it was quite expensive too. We did a stretch of about 150 yards to protect the vegetable plot, chicken run and baby orchard. Okay...so there goes that idea. We've had some of the wooden slats up here for 10 years and they are still just as solid as the day they were put in. Wanda -- Thoughts become things...
Re: [IceHorses] An Emergency in the desert and Whisper's response
--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Wanda Lauscher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When I hear stories like this I often think a divine hand was guiding you today. I think she knew it, too. She was perfect! My 3 day eventing friend, Sharon, who got the Ace from the vet didn't know if Whisper would get me home because she knows what we've been thru and she has helped me with both Whisper and Andi. She left me a message on my cell while I was in a dead spot and said Go Whisper, get your mom home. And she did! Isn't Whisper just a peach? What a lovely horse to pull through for you when you needed her. I think we are finally working and riding as one instead of butting heads. rest assured that I'm up here in Canada reading every word. Thanks, Wanda! I look forward to your posts, too! Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/
Re: [IceHorses] Yrsa the ramp
--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: tonight the camera was too interesting and she couldn't think about much else. She just knows she is pretty and wanted to make sure you got her good side! Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/
Re: [IceHorses] Yrsa/soccer cones
--- On Fri, 7/11/08, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: generally demonstrated a lack of respect for orange soccer cones. that's because she wants to make sure you realize orange is NOT her color, but she DOES look good in purple! Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/
Re: [IceHorses] Treeless/mounting from the ground
We need to get Kaaren Jordan to give us some mounting from the ground lessons. Granted she weighs about 100 lbs soaking wet, but she has a system that works well for her. I always thought it was embarrasing to need a step to mount a 12.2 HH horse.
Re: [IceHorses] An Emergency in the desert and Whisper's response
But Whisper came thru for me and for the mare, and she is the best girl in the world!! What a great feeling. I am so happy for you and Whisper.
