Re: [leaf-devel] libstdc++

[David Douthitt]

Tom Eastep wrote:
> What about C++ toolkits (fundamental classes such as hash tables, linked
> lists, ... )? I'm trying to understand the trade-off between LUA
> (another language to learn) or C++ (need to re-invent the wheel or learn
> about a toolkit) verses Perl (does everything I need but is apparently
> too big for embedded apps unless the entire embedded app is Perl-based).

I've had my hands in all three pies in the past - and I find Lua to be 
refreshing and exciting.  Consider that Tom's Rootkit converted from 
ash (ksh) over to using Lua for almost everything.  Lua is a delight 
to use, and I wish I knew it better than I do.

I packaged a version of lua here somewhere - the libcxx might even be 
an old version I put together.

Any C++ package at all will require the C++ classes - no doubt there 
are ways to minimize it, but without recompilation (and perhaps some 
porting) the application will require the GNU C++ Libraries - and they 
are NOT small...

> I've ordered the LUA books from Amazon and I'll look at them, but...
> 
> Given that I'm 62 years old, I admit that my enthusiasm for learning yet
> one more programming language to add to the dozen or so that I already
> speak is quite low.

Bah humbug.  Isn't one supposed to learn a new language every year? 
Learning never stops - and can keep us young!

PS: The Lua book is really quite good - though I can't hope to 
pronounce (or spell) the author's name :-)


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Re: [leaf-devel] outdated LEAF derivatives

[David Douthitt]

KP Kirchdoerfer wrote:
> Oxygen is put on very deep hold - David Douthitt from time to time 
> explains interest that something will happen, but then it stops.

That sums it up about right, I'd say...

I like the idea of a historical archive.  I've more or less figured
that any new distro will be a fresh start for me, anyway - and focused
on CDROM or USB stick bootables


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[leaf-devel] KernelKit: a Knoppix-derivative for embedded systems work!

[David Douthitt]

I saw this and thought you all would be interested.  With the mention 
of uClibc, my thoughts went to Bering-uClibc immediately

http://free-electrons.com/community/tools/kernelkit

It has the gcc toolchain for multiple architectures, including i386, 
ppc, and m68k.

It is available in a Live-CD format as well as a root volume archive - 
so you can unarchive it and chroot into it as well.

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Re: [leaf-devel] Announce: Comprehensive Source Database makes Distributor's and Sysop's life easier

[David Douthitt]

Enrico Weigelt wrote:
> Announcing the Comprehensive Source Database Project
> --
> 
> ==> What's it all about ?
> 
> The CSDB project provides an uniform database with dozens of
> packages, their releases and tarball locations. Using this 
> database, package maintainers and self-building sysops do not
> need to keep track of tarball urls by their own. They simply
> query the database by package name and canonical version number.

Sounds interesting, but the CSDB Web Site has either been set up for 
spam or has been spammed quite heavily.

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Re: [leaf-devel] GNU Compliance (section 3) - are you compliant??

[David Douthitt]

Mike Noyes wrote:
> David,
> Eric is correct. The GPL source code availability clause expires after
> three years. Oxygen is exempt.

I wasn't just talking about that; what about Mosquito? WISP? Dachstein? 
Bering?

I suspect most or all fall into the three-year exemption

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Re: [leaf-devel] GNU Compliance (section 3) - are you compliant??

[David Douthitt]

Mike Noyes wrote:

> Everyone,
> We need to release source tarballs in the SF FRS with our binaries.

How does this affect distributions that are not being actively maintained?

I agree with Luis, though - the storage requirements for SF are going to 
be incredible...


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[leaf-devel] GNU Compliance (section 3) - are you compliant??

[David Douthitt]

According to the latest news, it is being reported that the FSF is 
forcing all distributions to carry all source code, including "spinoff" 
distributions.  For example, that means that MEPIS must carry the source 
code to every program that they have released, not just those that they 
have changed - they cannot rely on the Ubuntu distribution on which they 
are based to carry the slack.

Does this affect us or any member distributions?

More can be found on the latest Newsforge

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Re: [leaf-devel] Digg: Bond 3 ADSL Lines

[David Douthitt]

Mike Noyes wrote:
> On Thu, 2006-06-15 at 17:53, David Douthitt wrote:

>> Is there any method of bonding multiple PPP dialup connections without 
>> ISP intervention?
> 
> David,
> Something like MLPPP?

Doesn't that still require ISPs to support MLPPP on their side?




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Re: [leaf-devel] Digg: Bond 3 ADSL Lines

[David Douthitt]

Mike Noyes wrote:
> Everyone,
> You might find this story interesting.
> 
> http://digg.com/technology/How_To_Bond_3_ADSL_Lines_for_Serious_Bandwidth_(with_Photos_Screenshots)

Is there any method of bonding multiple PPP dialup connections without 
ISP intervention?

I remember talking to one ISP about bonding two channels together, and 
the response was "Huh?  What's that?"




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Re: [leaf-devel] Hosts.deny & hosts.allow

[David Douthitt]

Jorn Eriksen wrote:

I guess the question would be then - for new users - how will they know what
to search for (i.e hosts.deny hosts.allow) when they do not know that
is/could be the problem?



If a new users take the Floppy, CD or Stick version, add a package (say
SNMPD) and open the correct ports in Shorewall and try to get snmp to work
(f.ex from MRTG) - it will not work out of the box.


My thoughts would be these:

* Add comments liberally
* Create documentation, both in general (available elsewhere) and within 
the package being added
* Add a script that will configure the proper openings into the firewall 
and/or tcpwrappers


Thoughts?



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Re: [leaf-devel] Hosts.deny & hosts.allow

[David Douthitt]

Martin Hejl wrote:

Hm - I'm not quite sure what you mean. Do you mean that if you hit reply
to a mail on the list (instead of "reply all") it will only go to the
person who wrote the mail, instead of the list? If that's the case, and
you really care to know the gory details, it's something that's part of
the configuration of all our lists (and it's a good thing


...well that's debatable ;-)

I noticed that, while Sourceforge does this as a matter of course, 
Yahoo! does not


For whoever cares about such things...


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Re: [leaf-devel] Re: New server for LFS

[David Douthitt]

Paul G Rogers wrote:

I second the opinion that the server LFS needs must be beyond reproach,
like Caesar's wife.


Took me a while to realize (I think) that you were not talking about 
Linux From Scratch (LFS).  I thought they were above reproach already :-)


(I do not personally endorse any additions after this line. TANSTAAFL 


Isn't *THAT* the truth!

Got to add that to my .sig!



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Re: [leaf-devel] Hosts.deny & hosts.allow

[David Douthitt]

Martin Hejl wrote:

The short version is that it's a sane default, and somebody who wants to
get rid of libwrap checking can simply add "ALL: ALL" to hosts.allow.
IMHO, the default config should not be as open as possible, but rather
as secure as possible, and somebody who wants to open the box to the
outside world has to make the change manually.


Agreed and seconded!

As to why, several rules of good security are in play:

First is "Security in Depth."  If the firewall fails or is 
misconfigured, then the tcpwrappers will be a second line of defense.


Second is the rule that states one should close all ports as much as 
possible.


Lastly, consider that tcpwrappers are more flexible than the standard 
firewall.  Logging and other details are done, and the wrappers are used 
on a per daemon basis.



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Re: [leaf-devel] SF shell cron job: doc-build.sh

[David Douthitt]

Bit again by the mail address meant to send to list.  Grrr..

Mike Noyes wrote:

David,
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll run it by one of the SF staff members
this week. I'm not hopeful they'll allow this, though.


I'm not sure why not.  When I say "user space", I mean cfengine can run
as a regular user program instead of as a system daemon.  We could run
it, and even use it (as I said before) as a sort of 'cron' just for us.

However, it does become a long-running process then - which probably
needs the ok.  Even so, one could use it on demand if need be - rather
than letting it run as a background process.



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Re: [leaf-devel] Flash Stick Image

[David Douthitt]

Jorn Eriksen wrote:

Investigatet that a little bit.  Altough it's a good idea it would require
different versions for different OS/*nix variants and as much explanations
as a simple image.  With my limited knowlegde of this type of script, the
saving would be in the "creation" process and not neccecarily on the "user"
end. There I could see a few other issues.  With a "clean" image it could,
and in fact have been on most of my sticks, as simle as "dd
if=image_file.img of=/dev/sda".  I guess it could not be any simpler than
that :-)  Maybe you have some deeper knowlege that can enlighten me more?


I was thinking of having a single script, with files contained in it in 
the shar format, and then unshar the files and copy to disk.  You could 
even - possibly - unshar a file then use it as an executable (such as 
syslinux).


If you used dd, then the disk would have to be at least a particular 
size, and any larger size disk would waste a lot of space.



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Re: [leaf-devel] SF shell cron job: doc-build.sh

[David Douthitt]

Mike Noyes wrote:

On Thu, 2006-03-30 at 13:47, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:


  A lockfile as used by your
shell script is just a normal file in our SF project space, removable by
anyone with rights to delete the file (should at least be any project
admins, and could safely be any project developer, IMHO).  Normal *nix
file permission rules apply, and no SF staff intervention is required if
something goes wrong.


Charles,
This section of your reply gave me an idea. Instead of me running cron
jobs from my home directory, I'll now run them from our new admin
directory in our project space. All of our project members with project
shell access (group leaf) can now run doc-build.sh. This should remove
me as the sole failure point for our admin scripts.


I don't suppose it would be possible to run a version of cfengine in our 
"user space" to keep this cleaned up automatically?  What's more, you 
can use cfengine as a sort of cron replacement if you like





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Re: [leaf-devel] Flash Stick Image

[David Douthitt]

KP Kirchdoerfer wrote:

We currently have three ideas how to provide an USB image:


Here's another idea for you all:

3) a "pendrive-script", which creates a bootable USB stick by using the ISO 
image and some modifications for USB - nothing to test yet, but maybe soon. 
(I like to add vfat or ext2 to the image, so the modules will be as easy 
loadable as with the ISO image).


How about a self-contained shar script?

That is, a single text file which contains the binaries and scripting 
needed to get it "unravelled" onto a USB stick?



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Re: [leaf-devel] Flash Stick Image

[David Douthitt]

To answer Eric's question, here's Andrea's tips "adjusted" slightly:

Andrea Fino wrote:

I did a working usb this way:

1) build the env with buildroot, so I got the lrp in packages

2) these commands:

mkdosfs /dev/sde1
mount /dev/sde1 /mnt
cd /root/packages
cp -pr * /mnt
umount /mnt
syslinux /dev/sde1


dd if=/dev/zero of=$HOME/usbfile bs=1024k count=20480
mkdosfs $HOME/usbfile
mount -o loop $HOME/usbfile /mnt
cd /root/packages
cp -pr * /mnt
umount /mnt
syslinux $HOME/usbfile

The only added command (dd) creates a zero-filled file of 20M size.


3) syslinux.cfg:

PKGPATH=/dev/sda1:msdos and so LEAFCFG

put initrd_usb.lrp


Hope this helps...


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Re: [leaf-devel] Flash Stick Image

[David Douthitt]

Eric Spakman wrote:

The same question to you, do you know a way to create an image without
using a physical USB stick?


Should be easy, right?  Just replace "/dev/usb/#" with 
"/home/myhome/usbfile".  Under UNIX, devices look just like files to the 
programs involved.  Thus, you should be able to use a file instead of 
the actual specified dev device.




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Re: [leaf-devel] flash usb

[David Douthitt]

Erich Titl wrote:

The nice thing about Knoppix is the device autodetection, [...]


This can be subsumed from Knoppix and adapted for use in LEAF if you 
want.  It might be good sized, I don't know


I _believe_ one could strip down 
Knoppix sufficiently to be of acceptable size for download, build a 
little code to generate the LEAF image. Then we would have one single 
distributable object which might satisfy most people.


Knoppix has been stripped down and adapted innumerable times; the two 
that come to mind off hand is Darn Small Linux (no, I won't say it...) 
and Morphix...


I would create a generic shell script that would work under LEAF, 
Knoppix, or whatever - then you can put it in where-ever you like, and 
use it to create the USB images




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Re: [leaf-devel] flash usb

[David Douthitt]

Natanael Copa wrote:

David Douthitt wrote:



You are right. I guess it failed to mount the device where root.lrp
were. I don't remember the exact kernel panic message but it was
probably "trying to kill init" or something like that.


That usually means that the initial process (#1) was trying to exit or 
was being killed off.


If the startup process has problems, init usually exits, resulting in 
that message




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Re: [leaf-devel] flash usb

[David Douthitt]

Natanael Copa wrote:

FYI. I never got your stick.img to boot. First I got the same "no
operating system" message as previously mentioned. After installing the
syslinux mbr.bin on the stick it found the kernel and booted it up but
ended with a kernel panic:
"Can't open /var/lib/lrpkg/root.dev.own"


That doesn't sound like a kernel panic; after all, wouldn't it be after 
mounting /var and so on?  If the kernel panicked, it would give a 
different message, I'd think.


If you want to debug it, just give the kernel a parameter of:

init=/bin/sh

and root about in the environment after booting...


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Re: [leaf-devel] Flash Stick Image

[David Douthitt]

Natanael Copa wrote:

(firefox tried to display the binary and since link didnt work it isn't
possible to right-click -> "save as")


You could let Firefox "display" it, then select "Save As..." and save 
the "page" and it would be fine...


Just a matter of one wants to wait for Firefox to "download" the "page" 
or not, staring at ugly binary until then...



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Re: [leaf-devel] Development Model

[David Douthitt]

Tim Wegner wrote:
Sure I wish Charles, David D., and Jacques had decided to maintain 
their leaf branches, but like everyone else they do what their time, 
interests, and priorities permit. I'm sure glad the Bering uClibc 
team did what they did. I can't see the future, but whatever happens 
with leaf, it will be driven by those who have an interest they want 
to pursue, and who are willing and able.


I'm still here, and regret that Oxygen is stagnating as I speak.  I 
still have my old documentation that I wrote for CDROM booting et al.


I'm sorry to hear that Bering-uclibc is the only fish still swimming in 
the pond - what happened to Mosquito, and to Dachstein?  What happened 
to the original Bering?


Perhaps I should dive back in most of the discussion seems to lean 
towards making a new version perhaps?  I keep thinking about making CDs 
or something - and I've always been interested in USB booting, too.


My unsolicited advice is enjoy what you have and what leaf is, don't 
regret what you aren't and leaf isn't, take pride in what you have 
accomplished, and continue to contribute as you can and as you wish.


The website and sourceforge project would not exist without you Mike - 
and Oxygen for one owes its continuing "presence" to you I don't 
think that that is a bad thing.




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Re: [leaf-devel] lwp (webconf) packages

[David Douthitt]

Charles Steinkuehler wrote:

It should be possible to make an image that has an HDD partition table
with a smallish (ie: maybe 8 Megs or so, still a *LOT* bigger than a
floppy) FAT partition containing the boot files as the first partition.
 The remaining space could be unused, or formatted and used once the
LEAF system was up and running.


The makebootfat utility that was mentioned previously should be able to 
do that.  According to their docs:


   The BIOS USB boot support is generally differentiated
   in three categories: USB-HDD, USB-FDD and USB-ZIP.

   The USB-HDD (Hard Disk Drive) standard is the preferred
   choice [...]

   [...]

   Generally these standards are incompatible, but using
   the -m, -F and -Z options you can create a disk compatible
   with all of them.

Sounds interesting, eh?


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Re: [leaf-devel] Re: adding a new menu

[David Douthitt]

KP Kirchdoerfer wrote:
We really need a solution for the missing cron on SF - it's disabled for 
nearly two years, and I'm afraid they won't fix the next two years, if ever.


Any possibility of compiling a version of cron and leaving it running in 
user mode?  What about something like fcron?




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Re: [leaf-devel] Re: Guides

[David Douthitt]

Mike Noyes wrote:

On Wed, 2005-08-24 at 05:33, Luis.F.Correia wrote:


Mike, can you please try to re-generate the PDF versions of all our
documentation?



Luis,
Just the leaf guide collection, or the individual guides too?

Note: this will take me a while to generate locally. I'm not
setup currently for pdf generation.


What format are these in again?

If there was a DVI file, a PS file, or even a generic word processing 
file I could probably do it - or LaTeX, or Texinfo... Dunno about 
DocBook, though.




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[leaf-devel] syslinux 3.x and APPEND lines

[David Douthitt]

In syslinux 3.x, the APPEND line has a maximum of 255 characters.
Is this going to have an adverse affect on the LEAF distros?
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Re: [leaf-devel] SF Site Status (2005-01-26)

[David Douthitt]

On Thu, 2005-01-27 at 11:45, Mike Noyes wrote:
> Everyone,
> The SourceForge Staff just announced major service changes. Please read
> the Master RFE below.
> 
> [ 1109940 ] Master RFE: Project web service changes

It sounds like we will not be able to serve up 100M+ files from the web
server.  Does this affect LEAF?

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Re: [leaf-devel] What I don't like about Bering uClibc

[David Douthitt]

Hans Ulrich Niedermann wrote:
2. (buildtool?)
   There is no "build-hdd-image-for-my-board" which copies all the
   necessary lrp files, sets up leaf.cfg with all the lrp names,
   possibly installs grub on the image, and so on.
I'm surprised that LEAF to this day does not automate the process of 
reading in all of the *.lrp files.  This was suggested many, many years 
ago and implemented in Oxygen.  This way you don't have to list all of 
the LRP names.

3. (lrcfg aka "config")
Have you looked at acfg and apkg?  They are shell scripts that are 
packaged as *.lrp and can be used instead of lrcfg.  They use a menu 
interface using dialog and ncurses.

I might add that apkg does check for space constraints (if desired) and 
will verify that there is enough space prior to saving the package.

Charles mentioned that du was limited or unavailable previously; the 
Oxygen build of busybox is quite substantial compared to other systems, 
so this could be a problem - but you never know...


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[leaf-devel] Suggested programs...

[David Douthitt]

Anyone looked at dnrd (DNS Relay) and exepak (Executable Packer)?

Exepak is extremely interesting because it works with uClib executables
and is licensed under the GPL.

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Re: [leaf-devel] Re: lrcfg and generating leaf.cfg

[David Douthitt]

Erich Titl wrote:
Arne Bernin wrote:

Ok. I am about to finish some kind of (very) primitive apt-get clone.
Now i am able to install new packages quite easy (no more downloading
via http, scp to firewall, copying to my harddisk, ...). The only thing
i am still missing is, that after installing all the packages (about 35
on my firewall) i would like to generate the LRP line in leaf.cfg...
just my lazyness...
 

what about
LRP=""
for i in `find $MOUNT -name  \*.lrp`
do
LRP="$LRP `basename $i .lrp`"
done
echo $LRP
This sort of setting a variable inside a loop to be accessed outside has 
been problematical in the past; in most cases (in ksh anyway) the 
variable reverts to its original state after the loop completes.

If you just need the output...
for i in `find $MOUNT -name "*.lrp"` ; do
  echo "#{i%%.lrp} \c"
done

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[leaf-devel] Idea for a new package....

[David Douthitt]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
This looks interesting.
Practical PPP:
http://www.rambris.com/fredrik//
A webbized interface to PPP.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFBmgucgd4eE7zVXo0RAh0yAJwK3pN5C88bpWVHe3dJO8INXR5PogCfXH96
TBGmHf7sXxEnbynXlyc043Y=
=+I5s
-END PGP SIGNATURE-
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Re: [leaf-devel] Bering uClibc vs. Oxygen

[David Douthitt]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Mike Noyes wrote:
| David,
| The Oxygen web content was archived in preparation for new site
| structure and website.
I figured as much.  Shameful the way I haven't kept up.
I've pointed more than one person to the LEAF website, including some
who just want an example of how a website could be done.  To me, the
LEAF site is one of the best sf.net sites out there. thanks, Mike!
I'll take a look at those links
I'm probably going to resurrect Oxygen now that I'm "between jobs" (ouch!).
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFBecRtgd4eE7zVXo0RAihnAJ9klKHPZ51G8IuFHwP2sX1o1AsYBwCfXcC7
a43gJNCD2bpoAMCUTUTmskQ=
=E2uR
-END PGP SIGNATURE-
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Re: [leaf-devel] Bering uClibc vs. Oxygen

[David Douthitt]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Thorsten von Eicken wrote:
| I'm looking for an embedded distro for single-board machines out in
| the field, mostly doing wireless routing but also controlling other
| stuff, such as cameras. In reading the descriptions of the various
| LEAF distros it seems Ogygen is the way to go in that it claims to be
| very flexible and not so much focused on "minimal size firewall with
| a config GUI". But development seems to have ceased in 2002. Is
| Bering-uClibc the way to go now?
Oxygen has indeed stalled out.  I ran out of time and energy, but remain
interested in the ideas and technology behind it.
I keep planning to resurrect it, especially as I have lots of time
(unemployment can do that) and a Virtual PC on my Macintosh.
It is interesting to note that to this day, one has to specify which
packages to load - so that you have to remember to edit this file if you
want a new package to load.
With Oxygen, this is not necessary.  It also uses a standard Linux
kernel, and has split glibc apart so that you can upgrade glibc without
having to rebuild the root.lrp.
A secondary note: all of the resources pointed at by the various home
pages (Oxygen in particular) seem to have vanished Where does one go
to get old material such as the Oxygen/LEAF ISO and the Oxygen floppies?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFBatDDgd4eE7zVXo0RAot/AKCQ1O/IWPU7TXfyzBFZu34PbrYiDQCcCgYR
maJNHIVSWzcxFa93WfIzNxM=
=lew6
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Re: [leaf-devel] SF Tracker reorganization

[David Douthitt]

Mike Noyes wrote:
Everyone,
I just created trackers for each of our active branches. This will allow
branch teams to create their own triage system. The teams can define
Category, Group, Priority, and Canned Response options within their
tracker.

Current teams are:

Oxygen: *David Douthitt
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=13751&atid=676167
Sounds good to me!
Yes, I'm still around ;-)

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[leaf-devel] New use for firewalls?

[David Douthitt]

I've been working with this new Airport (Apple's 802.11b wireless) and 
finding out just how insecure America's wireless networks are.

Seems like a good purpose for a 486 or Pentium with two network cards 
would be to act as a firewall and proxy between wireless clients and 
the rest of the network.  Each base station or access point could then 
be isolated from the rest of the network, and only authorized clients 
could be allowed in.

Authorization could be done over SSL, and all access could be 
controlled via web proxy and ftp proxy.  SSH could be used for terminal 
access (through the firewall).

Are people using these "wireless" solutions that way?  Is there one out 
there already?

--
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LPIC-1, Linux +


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Re: [leaf-devel] Ports to Non-x86 Platforms?

[David Douthitt]

On Thursday, March 20, 2003, at 08:37  PM, Lynn Avants wrote:

On Thursday 20 March 2003 08:15 pm, David Douthitt wrote:
I, too have been interested in a PowerPC port - mainly because the 
most
popular alternative to the Intel PC platform is Apple Macintosh.
Unfortunately, until the introduction of "New ROMs" using OpenBoot, 
the
Macs wouldn't have all of the needed software unless MacOS was booted
first.

Perhaps with some of the newer PowerMacs we could test out a PowerPC
version of LEAF variants?
I'm actually in a good spot to try this - I'm running with a new iBook
and MacOS X 10.2.  My two favorite enironments combined :-)  Of 
course,
it would have to be a CDROM LEAF...

One of my friends has added Linux
to the Mac boot-menu that was considered impossible (until he did it).
I don't know which boot menu you mean, but for several years there's 
been a couple of INITs that would do this.  They depend on MacOS 
loading first.

My installation of Yellow Dog Linux (on a PowerMac 7200) uses a very 
nice and clean one of these.  My installation of OpenBSD/Mac68k uses a 
Mac application called the Booter which runs after MacOS is loaded - 
but I've seen other Linux (and etc.) loaders back on 68k Macs before.

It came up with a picture of the BSD daemon or the Linux penguin and 
you had to click on the picture within so many secs...

Now with OpenBoot firmware, you don't need all that - you don't need 
MacOS at all.

So the possibility of running LEAF on these is very good. There are 
also
a couple of after-market manufacturers making wholesale Mac-machines 
as well.
I thought all of the Mac licenses were revoked - PowerMac, Motorola 
StarMax, UMax - they're all gone, thanks to Apple and Jobs.

Another option for someone in David D's environment is use of "WinTel" 
which
is a custom/extended version of Bochs for Mac's that actually runs as 
well.
Actually, there is a Bochs emulator for MacOS X - I downloaded it.  
Unfortunately, it was corrupt.  Got to try again...

Now I've an AirPort card too.  Watch out... I'm entering the 21st 
century! :-) Most -- all! -- of my other hardware (including PC and Mac 
hardware) is at least 10 to 20 years old...

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Re: [leaf-devel] Ports to Non-x86 Platforms?

[David Douthitt]

On Monday, March 10, 2003, at 07:45  AM, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:

Brian Credeur wrote:
Hi,
Just curious:  Are there any (existing or planned) ports of LEAF to 
non-x86 platforms?
I've been interested in doing a PowerPC port of LEAF since I got my 
first LRP baesd firewall running.  This may actually happen in the 
near future, as a friend and I are discussing plans to build a small 
linux based industrial control computer, which would need a stripped 
linux system like LEAF to run.
I, too have been interested in a PowerPC port - mainly because the most 
popular alternative to the Intel PC platform is Apple Macintosh.  
Unfortunately, until the introduction of "New ROMs" using OpenBoot, the 
Macs wouldn't have all of the needed software unless MacOS was booted 
first.

Perhaps with some of the newer PowerMacs we could test out a PowerPC 
version of LEAF variants?

I'm actually in a good spot to try this - I'm running with a new iBook 
and MacOS X 10.2.  My two favorite enironments combined :-)  Of course, 
it would have to be a CDROM LEAF...

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Re: [leaf-devel] GRUB problem

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, 26 Feb 2003 17:56:13 -0600
Charles Steinkuehler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Spiro Philopoulos wrote:
> > I'm using GRUB to run LRP off a hard drive and I've noticed
> > that /proc/cmdline is truncated and does not include all
> > packages to load. It seems to get truncated after ~255
> > characters. Has anybody that's used GRUB come across this
> > problem? Is there a way to get around this limit? Any
> > info/help would be greatly appreciated. 
> > Thanks.
> 
> This is a FAQ.

> The 255 character limit is from the kernel, not from grub, so
> *ALL* boot-loaders will have this problem (including syslinux,
> lilo, etc).

Knoppix (a nice Live Linux Filesystem CDROM) modifies the kernel
to increase this limit.  He sets it to 512:

--- linux/arch/i386/kernel/setup.c.orig 2002-10-04 01:02:25.0 +0200
+++ linux/arch/i386/kernel/setup.c  2002-10-04 01:03:24.0 +0200
@@ -195,7 +195,7 @@
 #define INITRD_START (*(unsigned long *) (PARAM+0x218))
 #define INITRD_SIZE (*(unsigned long *) (PARAM+0x21c))
 #define COMMAND_LINE ((char *) (PARAM+2048))
-#define COMMAND_LINE_SIZE 256
+#define COMMAND_LINE_SIZE 512 /* The boot commandline in Knoppix can get quite long 
-KK Oct. 2002 */

 #define RAMDISK_IMAGE_START_MASK   0x07FF
 #define RAMDISK_PROMPT_FLAG0x8000


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Re: [leaf-devel] Suggestion for ETC.LRP

[David Douthitt]

On 25 Feb 2003 09:53:25 -0500
"Sean E. Covel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I've been testing it on a Mandrake box, and then moved it to my
> Bering box.  The first thing I noticed was the calls to
> getservbyport() wasn't returning the same information.  I took
> a look at the services file, and saw why.  ITS FROM 1997.  A
> bit out of date.  I suggest we update this to something a
> little more 21st Century.

I have (or had) a file called services.lrp (or something like it)
which contained the extra large services file from (I think)
nmap.  You could try that, but it is at least an order of
magnitude larger than the current /etc/services file.


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Re: [leaf-devel] compact flash ???

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, 19 Feb 2003 19:25:28 -0600
"Michael D. Schleif" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Are you booting off of this?  How?  Any special preparation to
> boot off of USB?

You could say I am.  It's a three-media startup: install CDROM,
boot off of that.  Put the floppy configuration disk in the
floppy drive, and the USB device on the USB chain.

Then tell the floppy to use the floppy configuration (in reality,
a shell script sourced off of floppy).  This floppy script then
runs a script on the USB device which does all of the work.


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Re: [leaf-devel] compact flash ???

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, 19 Feb 2003 17:11:36 -0600
"Michael D. Schleif" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> [1] Are we limited to IDE?  Does anybody have USB working?

I've been using USB quite a lot with Knoppix (a CDROM distro); it works
well.  However, it requires SCSI support.

> [2] What types of media are actually working well?  Has anybody
> tried the new XD?

I use the SanDisk Cruzer with SecureDigital cards.  Works well.

> [3] What are the best media readers/adapters?  Are there brands
> and/or models to be avoided?

Multi-format readers require a special kernel option to be set:
"Scan for all luns on SCSI devices" or something like that.
In most released distributions, this setting is off.

Other than that, just make sure that the USB device can be read
under Linux - most "disk" systems seem to be.


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Re: [leaf-devel] Package Repository

[David Douthitt]

On Sun, 09 Feb 2003 11:12:41 -0800
Matt Schalit <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> *Global Package Repository*

I agree with you...

> If a package works on more than 1 LEAF version, please,
> O' Magnificent Ones, let it be stored in a single global
> package repository.
> 
> Somebody is really going to need some help to find all the
> hundred or so packages David D. has tucked away in his devel
> tree.  And I won't go into the rest.  You all know what it's
> like out there.

Shouldn't be too hard :-)  Single directory, right?  Otherwise, if one must:

devel $ find . -name "*.lrp" -type f -ls

;-)

> It's not fair that we don't do some organization as part of
> our attempt at a new package system!

I had a lua-based script that would generate pages based on a file contained internal 
to the LRP like an RPM .spec file - and the output was akin to rpm2html output - I 
think the "Repository" is still there (with all of four or six packages included...)

> But what delimits if a package will run on a LEAF version?
> Libc?

And included libraries, etc.


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Re: [leaf-devel] Config system

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Feb 05, 2003 at 05:21:05PM -0800, Matt Schalit wrote:

> Hi David, nice to hear from you on this list.

Hi!  Good to be back...

> I'd like to ask off the top, because I don't know
> how you feel, but if a central-config-db is designed,
> and a new package format is developed that interaces
> with the db, would you use it in Oxygen?

Possibly.  I'd have to become informed.

> If you considered making changes along the lines
> of a central-db to eliminate redundancies and simplify
> config/maintanence, what would you focus on in terms
> of better formats?

Simplicity.  Compatability.  Ability to run on a LEAF system.
Compatability and usability with systems on CDROM.

> And as far as the ntpdate thing, the Icon would be a clock,
> and the tooltip text might be:
> 
>  __
> |  |
> | "Automatic time synchronization -- [software]|
> |If your LEAF is connected to the Internet, you|
> |can drag this icon onto the computer image below  |
> |so that your LEAF automatically keeps it's clock  |
> |synchronized with the correct time.   |
> |  |
> |Details   |
> |  *  This clock icon represents the ntpdate package,  |
> | who's URL is here:  http://www.ntpdate.stuff/|
> | who's docs are here:  http://leaf.sf.net/pub/doc/blah|
> |  |
> |Requirements  |
> |  *  To use this piece of software, you need to be|
> | able to provide it with the IP address of the|
> | nearest public master clock.  The closer that|
> | clock is to you, the better.  Find the nearest   |
> | public clock's address here, at  |
> | http://www.timeservers.here/ |
> | or ask you ISP if they provide a time server.|
> | Many do. |
> |  |
> |More Help |
> |  *  Send email to the leaf-user list here:   |
> |mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]|
> |__|

This is good, but when I was designing "setup.sh" I kept several
user questions in mind when I wrote the dialogs, etc:

1. "Why do I want this?"
2. "What does it do for me?"

and also tried to avoid technical explanations and technical terms
at all costs.  For your tooltip, I might write it thus:

"Keeping accurate time.

 Move this icon over your system icon in order to have your
 LEAF system keep accurate time.  This program requires
 a constant Internet connection to be useful."

One doesn't need to know the URL, nor the "more help", nor that
you need to know the IP of a "public master clock" (as this can
be preinstalled and part of the installation.).

> Did the writing of your setup program bog down
> somewhat due to how hard it is to write a wizard
> that will make a functional firewall given all
> the myriad of network setups and protocols Eva
> might have (pppoe, dhcp, etc)?

Somewhat.  The worst part was trying to get the quoting right.
It also was hard to create a system that could be "backed out";
I did that by creating a "subtree" of directories with all of
the new data, which was not added until the okay was given.

> Your idea of just setting the DISPLAY variable
> and to get the same thing in X is *impressive*.

Basically, the DISPLAY var only tells what X display to use;
the setup program checked for the existance of Xdialog and
prompted the user if they wanted to use an Xdisplay - and
asked for the IP to use.

> It seems like the goal of lrcfg and acfg is to get
> you to vi the correct file.  I always thought that
> was a shame.

acfg was designed mostly to be a drop in for lrcfg.

Also, with my goals as stated, any UNIX person, admin
or whatever, will be using vi to edit a text file.
Setup programs tend to be complicated, large, graphical,
and non-extensible - and unaware of programs that they
weren't designed for.

One thing my "setup" program had was a directory structure
so that each program package could have its own setup script -
load the package, and then setup finds it and knows how
to configure it.



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[leaf-devel] Where I've been...

[David Douthitt]

It's been a long and winding road Mostly, I've had other things to 
divert my attention.  There's been installs of FreeBSD, KDE, SuSE, and 
Yellow Dog along the way.  I'm also gained a couple of certifications, 
and have also had fun working with Red Hat's Kickstart.  Very recently, 
I've been working with Knoppix - beautiful!

I've also had my main mail server switch ISPs and IPs in the last six 
months.  Ouch.

I want to get Oxygen development going again.  Once I get geared up for 
cvs again, then I'll start updating the packages and shooting for Linux 
2.4.  I've been working with 2.4.19-aa1; anybody use Andrea's kernels on 
12M machines?  My experience with my SuSE kernel is that it has "swap 
storms" that come out of nowhere - and this in 192M with KDE and X.




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Re: [leaf-devel] Config system

[David Douthitt]

Matt Schalit wrote:


Ray Olszewski wrote:


At 10:13 AM 2/4/03 -0600, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:

But it leaves one thing out ... an important way to simplify the 
interface for configuration is to restrict the range of choices 
available.

LEAF tends to be pulled in two directions all the time --

simplicity, so that common uses of it can be configured 
easily by relatively inexperienced users.
flexibility, so that unusual uses of it are possible for 
relatively skilled, experienced users.

My interest has always been in the first direction, but the diversity 
of our interests means that both directions need to be accommodated.


My interests have always been the latter...


David D. tried to go down this road with Oxygen, and
once he started, his development here drifted off.
So I can't tell you much about it, because it didn't
work very well, but here's what he did.

He made a syslinux boot option to boot into setup
mode where you were presented with several options
on the overall use of your LEAF box: router, print-server,
DMZ, some other choices along those lines.  I probably
got them wrong, but you get the idea.   I thought it
was bad to begin with.

What I think is a good idea, however, is a gui-based, drag
and drop interface where you have a big outline of a computer,
and you drag a couple of nic icons onto it.  Then you drag a
clock icon onto it (ntpdate) and then you drag a firewall
icon into the middle of it, and maybe some other objects.
Then you are walked through configuring each one. 

When I designed my setup program, I thought about what would Adam 
Average want to do? He wants to boot the disk, and be led through all he 
needs.  Someone said he needed a router - so he picks that.  Each dialog 
was designed to lead the uninformed individual along.  If there was no 
getting around the gear talk ("what's your IP?") it specifically 
suggested asking for technical help.

The alternative suggested poses some problems.  Suppose Eva Everybody 
wants to set up something to go between her PC and her DSL.  I can hear 
the questions Eva might be asking:

"NIC?  What's a nic?  What's that card thing?  Why do I need ntpdate? 
What is it?  Where do I get it?  What's an IP?"

My goals for Oxygen evolved into creating a floppy-based, network-based 
Linux that was as UNIX-compatible as possible - no surprises for UNIX 
admins.

My goals for the setup program was much different: create a 
configuration set which was extremely flexible, extensible, and 
compatible with X.  If you specified a DISPLAY variable, you could use 
and X display and answer the same questions there

Biggest problem I had was trying to keep the quotes straight for using 
dialog and Xdialog.  Perhaps I should have used a different shell?




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Re: [leaf-devel] Command recall Oxygen(yes) Bering(no) DF(no)

[David Douthitt]

On Mon, Oct 14, 2002 at 09:31:56PM +0200, Jacques Nilo wrote:

> Sorry for jumping in late in this thread.

Ditto.

> One idea has been suggested:
> Switch to bbox ash.

Oxygen uses a statically compiled busybox with ash included.
busybox comes with about 5 different choices for a shell.

I've found it hard to find any significant differences between
ksh and ash - except "set -o vi" doesn't work :-)



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Re: [leaf-devel] snort and nmap

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Oct 09, 2002 at 02:05:49PM -0400, Eric B Kiser wrote:

> I am looking for the most recent versions of nmap.lrp and snort.lrp. I
> checked the CVS packages repository and the only thing I found was an older
> version of nmap and no snort.

I'm the one who's probably responsible for those packages - and
responsible for them being so old.

I've not kept up development as I ought.  However, I'm planning to get
back into the game.  I recently configured a Pentium with Red Hat 6.x
and Oxygen dual boot; we'll see how it goes.

Also, the Oxygen/LEAF Resource CDROM contains all binaries and sources
and probably also the compile-time options in a patch and so forth.

These days, I've been working towards putting all source code into a
sort of "ports tree" like FreeBSD and Gentoo Linux; it becomes very
flexible.

I'll see if I can compile nmap and/or snort in coming days.



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[leaf-devel] [pedro.inacio@ptnix.com: PHP-Nuke x.x SQL Injection]

[David Douthitt]

Saw this on bugtraq today.  Does this affect our PHP site?

- Forwarded message from Pedro Inacio <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -

Mailing-List: contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]; run by ezmlm
Delivered-To: mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Delivered-To: moderator for [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 25 Sep 2002 17:25:46 -
X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.411 (Entity 5.404)
From: Pedro Inacio
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: PHP-Nuke x.x SQL Injection



Hello,

All PHP-Nuke versions, including the just released 6.0, are vulnerable to a
very simple SQL injection that may lead to a basic DoS attack.

For instance, if you create a short script, to send a few requests, (I have
tested with just 6) similar to this:

http://www.nukesite.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1234%20or%
201=1

after a real short time the load of the machine is so high that it will
become inacessible.
When the script is stopped, the server will take a few minutes to recover
from the load and become acessible again.

Well, the number of requests depends on your MySQL parameters and hardware,
but in general all the tested php-nuke sites where vulnerable and become
inacessible.

If you are running PHP-Nuke, I suggest the creation of some filters to 
avoid
this kind of attack.
Other things can be made, but I will not talk about them now. I will wait
until Francisco fix them.

Francisco was noticed a month ago, but the problems persist.
Maybe he is busy reading the new revision of the "Building Secure Web 
Applications and Web Services" OWASP document. :]

Cheers,

Pedro Inacio


- End forwarded message -


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Re: [leaf-devel] new busybox, tinylogin at busybox.net

[David Douthitt]

On Thu, Sep 19, 2002 at 12:49:37AM +0200, K.-P. Kirchdörfer wrote:

> My idea is: Why not a floppy-based distro based on uClibc, which could be 
> easily enhanced for CD, DOC with a separate glibc-2.x.lrp, for apps which 
> need more than uClibc provides? 

To some extent, Oxygen does this already - the library is libc.lrp, and
this is available in Oxygen 1.9 (development).

Oxygen does not use glibc at all in starting up, but relies on busybox
and snarf compiled with uClibc.  It doesn't use sed at all during the
loading process.



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Re: [leaf-devel] Possible framework for build-from-source system.

[David Douthitt]

On Tue, Sep 17, 2002 at 01:57:26PM -0700, Mike Noyes wrote:
> On Tue, 2002-09-17 at 13:36, David Douthitt wrote:
> > On Tue, Sep 17, 2002 at 10:09:12PM +0200, Ewald Wasscher wrote:
> > > On Tue, 2002-09-17 at 21:22, David Douthitt wrote:
> > 
> > > BTW, your CVS devel/ddouthitt tree has been empty for the last days. Is
> > > that on purpose? I went there to get a fresh copy of your build system,
> > > and noticed this.
> > 
> > Wasn't aware of that!  Why would this be, Mike?
> 
> David,
> You told me off-list I could have devel/ddouthitt/base moved to
> src/oxygen/base. I just forwarded the message where you said it was ok
> to do this to you off-list.

I don't need to see the message to know I've forgotten that;
your word is good enough for me.




msg05619/pgp0.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: [leaf-devel] Possible framework for build-from-source system.

[David Douthitt]

On Tue, Sep 17, 2002 at 10:09:12PM +0200, Ewald Wasscher wrote:
> On Tue, 2002-09-17 at 21:22, David Douthitt wrote:

> BTW, your CVS devel/ddouthitt tree has been empty for the last days. Is
> that on purpose? I went there to get a fresh copy of your build system,
> and noticed this.

Wasn't aware of that!  Why would this be, Mike?

> I have done this a few times (- too many):
> 
> scripts/bootstrap.sh && emerge world && emerge gnome kde evolution
> 
> Building leaf from source will be so fast :-)

Hee hee.  I've being doing this:

cd ports/security/tripwire ; make install

...of course, BSD has portupgrade:

portupgrade tripwire

...which is pretty close to apt + source builds...



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Re: [leaf-devel] Possible framework for build-from-source system.

[David Douthitt]

On Tue, Sep 17, 2002 at 07:18:17PM +0200, Ewald Wasscher wrote:

> I am currently evaluating GAR, the build-system from
> http://www.lnx-bbc.org/ for use with leaf. So far it looks really good.
> It's flexible, quite well documented and there are lots of examples for
> building packages, a bootdisk or an iso image. I encourage anyone
> interested in the subject to take a look at the above site.

Have you looked at my development tree yet?  I've got something built
similar to the FreeBSD Ports Tree.  The FreeBSD Porter's Handbook may also
be a good source of ideas:

http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/porters-handbook/

Another source-driven set up is Portage, part of Gentoo Linux:

http://www.gentoo.org/doc/portage-manual.html
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/portage-user.html

I rather like the source-driven, patch-and-install setup.



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[Leaf-devel] I'm Back (Mail Troubles)

[David Douthitt]

It seems that my mail forwarding provider (callsign.net)
stopped delivering mail or accepting mail or some such
thing; anyway anything that went through my callsign.net
address stopped coming.

I've subscribed again, this time under my own domain
and mail address: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

I plan to start working on updating CVS and making an
updated Oxygen.



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Re: [Leaf-devel] Converting Documentation to DocBook - progress report

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 11:28:28AM -0700, Mike Noyes wrote:

> Recent versions of Abiword will read RTF and export to DocBook XML.

Excellent!  I've Abiword in several places (both FreeBSD and Linux I think).

> > It sounds like the usual way is to edit DocBook using text editors
> > like Emacs and vi.
> 
> I prefer XEmacs+psgml.

Problem with Emacs is 1) it takes up too much space; 2) it is incomparable.
No clone even approaches its capabilities

One job I was on, I worked continually in Emacs (after loading viper
vi emulation of course :-)  The shells - LISP enhancements - etc, etc.
Then you find a clone and are immediately disappointed.

vi is cloned everywhere and all of the good clones are indistinguishable
from the real thing to the average user - and a good number of these
will fit onto a 720k floppy.



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Re: [Leaf-devel] Converting Documentation to DocBook - progress report

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Aug 21, 2002 at 03:27:30PM +0100, Julian Church wrote:

> I've been working on converting your Developers' Guide
> to Docbook for a while now.

I knew that; the reason I brought this up was that I've
plans to overhaul the document and to rework it, and I wanted
to follow the standard LEAF format.

> I emailed you on 12 July not long after I started this work 
> but it seems you didn't get the message.

I did but somehow I must have missed it.  I may receive a couple
hundred messages a day (most from lists and SPAM).

> I spotted a few errors that I made in the conversion that I'd like to sort 
> out first, but I could email you the xml document in the next day or two if 
> you'd like?

Sure.

> >I see that DocBook (v3.1) exists for Red Hat 6.2; will this
> >be sufficient?  Do I have to upgrade?  Will new versions work
> >on Red Hat 6.2?
> 
> I'm sure they will - it will generally be a case of getting together new 
> sets of DTD's and stylesheets, rather than compiling new tools.  At the 
> moment Docbook v4.1.2 is probably the one to go for, because it's XML-based 
> rather than SGML, which is where Docbook is going apparently.

>From the sound of things, I have to install SGMLTools, Jade, OpenJade,
DTDs, DSSSL, and DocBook - right?

I kept looking for ways to use current word processing tools to create
these - but I can't find a lot.  There's YAWC for Word - but that's
not GPL and requires administrator priviledges - I'm not willing to
go that far on my box.

Then there's the convertor for OpenOffice (French isn't a problem
for me -- at least, not much :-)  However, the OpenOffice converter
requires OpenOffice - which can be a problem when you've got UNIX and
X in a space of about 2.1G or so.

Then there's a RTF-to-DocBook converter - but it isn't free.

It sounds like the usual way is to edit DocBook using text editors
like Emacs and vi.

Another question - how well does DocBook formatting translate to
physical book form?  Have any books been published this way?



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Re: [Leaf-devel] Converting Documentation to DocBook - progress report

[David Douthitt]

I've decided I need to revisit the LEAF Developer's Guide,
and want to know what I need to do to make it ready for
this "DocBook" format.

On Thu, Aug 15, 2002 at 11:55:30PM -0700, Greg Morgan wrote:
> Mike Noyes wrote quoting Julian Church:

> > The normal formats are: html, pdf, plain text, and PostScript.

Side Note: Under the GFDL, PDF and PostScript are Opaque formats,
and HTML and Text are Transparent.  Does this affect anything?

> Later Linux distributions have all the docbook tools already.

I see that DocBook (v3.1) exists for Red Hat 6.2; will this
be sufficient?  Do I have to upgrade?  Will new versions work
on Red Hat 6.2?

I just installed Red Hat 6.2 and Oxygen onto separate partitions
on a Compaq 4000N for development.  Nice little boxes!



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Re: [Leaf-devel] LVS and LRP

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Aug 14, 2002 at 02:37:41PM +1200, Simon Blake wrote:

> Before I dive in and spend a bunch of time getting the varios LVS tools
> (mon, heartbeat, fake and so forth) packaged for Bering, has anybody
> done any of this sort of thing before?  Links to packages?  Gotchas?

I've not done it with LEAF, but I have set up a cluster before.
The cluster used a Linux Cluster Director with Piranha, and
had three cluster nodes: a Linux node, a FreeBSD node, and an OpenBSD
node.

Of the three, only Linux required kernel patches and/or extra (unused!)
hardware to function correctly.  BSD works just fine without any
changes to the stock kernel beyond enabling the appropriate number of
loopback network connections - and FreeBSD comes entirely ready to go.

It all revolves around what does this mean:

ifconfig eth0 -arp

For clustering to work, there must be NO ARPs coming from the
interface; BSD does this, the stock Linux kernel does not - even
with this command.  Check the LVS site for more information about
this controversy (!) and the kernel discussions about it.



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Re: [Leaf-devel] Multiple upstream links

[David Douthitt]

On Tue, Aug 13, 2002 at 12:31:22PM -0500, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:

> Also...I recently got a nifty trick from the local linux users group
> regarding time-servers:
> 
> 
> > Does someone knows of a time server that I can use to
> > synchronize my linux box at boot time?
> 
> There are a bunch listed at www.ntp.org, a.k.a. www.eecis.udel.edu/~ntp.
> A possibly better alternative is to use your provider - most ISPs enable
> NTP on their routers.  This is convenient for them, since they can
> correlate router log messages accurately.  It's convenient for you,
> since
> you have a low-latency time source just a few milliseconds away.
> 
> Tru running "ntpdate -q" against a traceroute output, e.g.
> 
>   traceroute -n www.cnn.com | head -5 | awk '{print $2}' | \
> xargs -n 1 ntpdate -q
> 
> You'll usually find an NTP server close by.
> 

That's interesting!

However, the NTP documentation stresses the need to get permission
first - and all of the docs list whether permission is required or not.
It's unfortunate that people don't see a need for a PUBLIC ntp server
instead of one just shared by the community; many have a geographical
restriction on them, many require you to send mail.

I managed to find a source close by: the CompSci department at the
University of Wisconsin has not only three severs providing NTP,
but a Red Hat mirror, a Mandrake mirror, a OpenBSD mirror, a Debian mirror,
a Sendmail mirror, a Linux kernel mirror, a Ximian mirror, a LDP mirror...



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Re: [Leaf-devel] panic kernel argument.

[David Douthitt]

On Tue, Aug 13, 2002 at 06:56:49PM +0200, Ivan Lloro wrote:

>   As LEAF is usually used in stand-alone routers-
> gateways I suggest passing to the kernel the argument
> "panic=X" by default. "X" is the number of seconds
> the system will wait before automatically rebooting
> itself after a kernel panic. I think it's an interesting
> improvement.

This is already in the /proc filesystem; Oxygen should already
be making use of this.

You can set this up (to reset after two minutes - or 120 seconds -
for example) without changing kernel parameters one
of several ways:

1. Command:

sysctl -w kernel.panic=120

2. Control file:

echo "kernel.panic=120" >> /etc/sysctl.conf
sysctl -p

3. /proc filesystem:

echo 120 >> /proc/sys/kernel/panic

The sysctl command should be present in Oxygen, and may not
be present in other versions.



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[Leaf-devel] Anyone else seen this?

[David Douthitt]

VA Software (operators of Sourceforge) signs agreement
with IBM to utilize their proprietary database DB2
in the SourceForge product.

In the article, it notes that VA Software looked at MySQL
and PostgreSQL, but passed them both by.  It also notes
that VA invested in MySQL.

Interesting, eh?

http://news.com.com/2100-1001-949505.html?tag=fd_top



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[Leaf-devel] OpenSSH 3.4p1 Trojaned

[David Douthitt]

There was recently a break-in at the main site for the OpenSSH 3.4p1
sources, and a back-door was inserted.  The modified sources were
caught quickly, but some may have been downloaded.

The originals were not back-doored, and should be okay.

The interesting thing is that this was not caught by some sophisticated
digital signature, but by a FreeBSD porter who saw a bad md5sum and
sat up and took notice...

Time for a security update, Jacques?  You know: "This distribution is
not vulnerable."



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[Leaf-devel] Embedded Systems (new LEAF host?)

[David Douthitt]

Did anyone else besides me see the write-up about the Sega
Dreamcast from DefCon X?

Apparently a couple of security people modified a Linux
distribution for the Sega Dreamcast to "phone home" for use
during penetration testing - that is, you could drop one of
these Dreamcasts in a client's physical site, connect it to
the network, and it would establish a VPN with a site outside
of the host network.

Slick - except it's pretty much limited to pentetration testing
only (this is a GOOD thing... :-) since it doesn't hide it's
identity entirely - i.e., this thing establishes a VPN (which
goes BOTH ways) and has your root ssh key on CDROM in the machine...

But it's still slick... imagine it:

"You got in?  Even with all of our security?  How?"
"See that thing?"
"Oh, that?  That's just somebody's toy, right?"
"That 'toy' connected to our host on the Internet and established
a virtual tunnel into your network"

(ouch!)

See http://www.dcphonehome.com/ for more...



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Re: [Leaf-devel] bering RC3 + grsecurity + sysctl

[David Douthitt]

On Sat, Jul 20, 2002 at 11:43:17AM +0200, Kim Oppalfens wrote:

> Would it be possible to change some of the grsecurity patches settings in 
> bering rc3 using sysctl?

To be able to do this, you have to compile a Linux 2.4 kernel with grsecurity
(of course) and enable the option to control grsecurity via sysctl.

> Or was sysctl left out when Bering rc3 kernel was patched?

sysctl as a binary is available as a package, but except for Oxygen I don't
believe it is included in other distributions.  The only other thing you
need is the /proc filesystem, which should be there.



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[Leaf-devel] [OT?] Upcoming Conferences

[David Douthitt]

[US Conferences, that is]

Anyone going to DefCon 10 in Las Vegas, NV, Aug 2-4, or to
11th Usenix Security Symposium, Aug 5-9, in San Francisco, CA?

Just wondering...  Interesting that they're so close together
in time and space :-)



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Re: [Leaf-devel] CVS structure ???

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Jul 17, 2002 at 03:21:32PM -0500, Michael D. Schleif wrote:
> 
> Jeff Newmiller wrote:

> > CVS is designed to handle directories full of information... so a
> > directory tree of html documents is a natural thing to enter.
> > 
> > An idea...
> > 
> >   net-snmp/
> > README.txt
> > package/
> >   net-snmp.lrp
> > target/
> >   etc/
> > blahblah
> >   usr/
> > bin/
> >   snmpbinary
> >   ...
> > doc/
> >   index.html
> >   images/
> > image1.jpg
> >   ...
> > src/
> >   sourcefiles...
> 
> [ snip ]
> 
> I took a liking to this structure, which you can see here:
> 
> 
> 
> I appreciate *ALL* feedback on this infrastructure, before I get carried
> away with further additions to cvs.
> 
> What do you think?

My model has been the following:

archives/
  .tar.gz
  .bz2
  ...

iproute2/
  distinfo
  Makefile
  patches/
.diff
.diff
...
  work/ {temporary dir; created and used to compile within}
  binaries/ {temporary dir; created and stores binaries ONLY (no path)}
  world/{temporary dir; created and used to store full paths
 and all files needed within the structure}

/
...

My current lrp "package" setup was to have the following:

iproute2-/
  lrp/ {created}
...

Under lrp/ there is a Makefile which contains all of the targets to make packages, etc.
There is also a directory like world/ above which contains all paths and a Makefile
in each directory that needs to have a binary in it.

After this lrp/ directory is correctly configured, then the entire directory is
"wrapped up" into a *.diff file and saved with the unmodified source archive.  Examples
of this can be found in the Oxygen/LEAF Resource CDROM.

Perhaps what I will do is to use this patch as a regular patch in the CVS ports tree
and add the patch to the source code, then use it to create packages at will.



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[Leaf-devel] Current CVS Oxygen Tree

[David Douthitt]

I've been looking at some things, and updated
syslinux and e3 (in the CVS tree) to their apparent
current versions.

I've noticed that CVS can be a major pain, especially with
renaming files, or deleting or moving directories.

Anyway, there are a few updates to the ports-style
setup that need to be done yet:

* Handle multiple distribution files
* Make checksum file use a generic name
* Rename patches and other files to remove version numbers
* Work on a "make lrp" (or "make package")
* Work on some form of "make install"
* A "make world" would be nice - might already be there.



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Re: [Leaf-devel] image extractor program

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Jul 17, 2002 at 01:56:31PM -0400, George Georgalis wrote:

> Below is a little script to mount and extract an image in a way that will
> allow for editing and repackaging of the lrp modules.

Every script is a solution to a problem; I don't see the problem, but
anyway...

> #!/bin/sh
> 
> [ -z $1 ] && echo 'Supply image file to mount and extract' && exit
> [ -z '`du $1 | grep 1688`' ] && echo 'Supply image file to mount and extract' && exit

What if the image file is 1722?

> s=`date +%s`
> mnt='lrp-mnt-'$s
> mkdir $mnt
> 
> super='lrp-super-'$s
> mkdir $super
> 
> mount -oloop $1 $mnt
> 
> cd $super
> pkgs=`ls ../$mnt/*lrp | sed -e 's/^.*initrd.lrp//'`

How about:

pkgs=`ls ../$mnt/*lrp | grep -v initrd.lrp`

> for pkg in $pkgs ; do
> name=`echo $pkg | sed -e 's/^.*\///' -e 's/.lrp$//'`

How about:

name=`basename $pkg .lrp`

> mkdir $name
> cd $name
> tar xzf ../$pkg
> cd ../
> done
> cd ..
> rm -rf lrp-super
> mv $super lrp-super
> umount $mnt ; rm -rf $mnt
> exit 0

Sounds like it populates an image with packages, eh?



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Re: [Leaf-devel] CVS src tree structure

[David Douthitt]

On Mon, Jul 15, 2002 at 10:28:00AM -0700, Mike Noyes wrote:

> I think a system similar to "BSD Ports" or "Gentoo Portage" would be
> great. David already has sample implementation available.
> 
> http://cvs.leaf-project.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/leaf/devel/ddouthitt/base/

Now I've actually (with Mike's help) been able to properly
update this to reflect the current state of my ports configuration.

Be aware that I must go over these again to refresh my memory and to
update any thing that needs updating.

That directory "archive" isn't supposed to be there; I'm going
to try and delete it...

Here is a portion of the comments from one of the Makefiles:

# Standard makes
#
# make all  -- the usual
# make fetch-- get required tar files
# make extract  -- get and extract tar files
# make patch-- get, extract, and patch source
# make binary   -- create binaries
# make clean-- clean out working directory

Things to do:

* update the system so it uses a set of files pretailored for
  most configurations

* further document files

* update all Makefiles

* dependency operations?  Have one "port" check for another and do it
  if need be.  Things like busybox (uClibc) could use this, but most
  things might not need it.

One difficulty is not being able to "install" the code directly;
perhaps this could be overcome with prefixes (PREFIX=xxx)
and other such shenanigans.

One make target I don't see would be "make package" (or "make lrp")
which should probably be there



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Re: [Leaf-devel] CVS src tree structure

[David Douthitt]

On Tue, Jul 16, 2002 at 11:38:49AM -0700, Mike Noyes wrote:

> Both of these actions are performed using "import" from a directory
> outside of your checked out tree.

Does this mean that I can't operate in the cvs checked out directory
structure until all directories have been imported?

I'll try your instructions...



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Re: [Leaf-devel] CVS src tree structure

[David Douthitt]

On Mon, Jul 15, 2002 at 10:28:00AM -0700, Mike Noyes wrote:
> On Sat, 2002-07-13 at 07:48, Mike Noyes wrote:
> > I will create this tree on Monday. However, this tree will need a
> > consensus on its structure before commits can begin.
> > leaf/src/packages

> This is done. The floor is now open to propose structures for our
> src/packages tree.
> 
> I think a system similar to "BSD Ports" or "Gentoo Portage" would be
> great. David already has sample implementation available.
> 
> http://cvs.leaf-project.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/leaf/devel/ddouthitt/base/

As Michael Schleif noted, I was only able to get the directory tree
and the top-level makefile.  No matter what I did, I could NOT find
a way to:

* add to CVS all directories and files recursively from a given path
  on down.

I also don't think I could even:

* add to CVS a directory, including the directory and ALL files
  contained within it.

It appeared that I would have to add EACH and EVERY file ONE by ONE.

I've a CD burnt with the "ports tree" (more of an Oxygen base source tree)
around here, and hope to get it into CVS with help... Maybe I should
upload it to my devel home directory



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Re: [Leaf-devel] CVS structure ???

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 01:14:07PM -0700, Mike Noyes wrote:
> On Wed, 2002-07-10 at 13:01, Jeff Newmiller wrote:
> > David Douthitt has advocated (and it sounds good to me but I haven't done
> > it myself) a mechanism whereby sources obtained from other sources are
> > kept in original form and a parallel directory containing patchfiles and
> > compilation instructions is generated to allow LEAF-specific modifications
> > to be maintained separate from the original source tree if
> > necessary.  Read the archives... :)
> 
> Jeff,
> David's Ports system for packages has my vote for our src/packages tree.
> However, there may be problems with it that I'm unaware of, because I'm
> not a programmer.
> 
> Oxygen base in Ports form:
> http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/leaf/devel/ddouthitt/base/

>From having worked with FreeBSD extensively for several months now,
I've been discovering more and more about the FreeBSD ports system
that I like.  I'll be revisiting the CVS tree and possibly updating it.

I've been away for a bit, but hope to dive into active development soon.



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[Leaf-devel] Mail headers

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Jun 26, 2002 at 01:53:36PM -0700, Mike Noyes wrote:

> Nice job. :-)

Thank you!  I'm still learning.  Mail processing has been a weak point;
now that I've three of my own domains and am serving all of them on
one mailserver  I think I've learned something along the way -
at least I hope so...

> I should have looked for the machine causing the lag also. I'm keeping
> this analysis as a template for future troubleshooting.

Thanks for the compliment!

The biggest thing that helped me was to convert to UTC - and to remember
things like:

1. Some U.S. (North American?) hosts don't report time in 24h format.
   So 01:15:01 -007 could be 08:15:01 UTC or it could be 20:15:01 UTC.

2. Sometimes the timezone is wrong but the time is right... or worse...

3. Don't forget that sometimes headers "lie" - that is, they are
   forged headers - but if you aren't looking at spam, they should
   be valid.

I'm trying to learn all I can about mail; need to be up to speed so
I can do it right.



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[Leaf-devel] Development Annoyances...

[David Douthitt]

There's an annoyance that comes up only in development,
and I was wondering how others handle it.

The problem is this: a development cycle (for me, anyway)
goes like this: boot, fiddle, doesn't work fix,
reboot, fiddle, fiddle, reboot, fiddle... NOW it works...

However. NOW the disk image is configured for my
environment, and needs to be cleaned out.

The usual way is to go back through ALL configurations,
reading and using grep, et al.

Isn't there a better way?

I was wondering... what if you set up some sort of new
.cf (for configuration files) or .sane (for sane
configuration :) file (or whatever it is) that allows you to
ERASE those files entirely.  This would assume that the
configuration files are matched by -dist
files for example...

Perhaps:

cd /var/lib/lrpkg
for i in $(cat $PKG.cf) ; do
   mv ${i}-dist $i
done
rm $PKG.cf

apkg -s $PKG   # save package...

The other annoyance in development is this - to restate
the above dev. cycle slightly:

bot.
diddle, diddle, fix, reboot
diddle, patch, fix, save, rebot

You get the idea :-)  What's the best way to get around this?
Besides getting a cup of coffee, I mean :-)

I've tried UMLinux but that never did work and seemed to require
a patched system.  I think VMWare worked, I forget but $300+?
Someday...



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Re: [Leaf-devel] Hi there, and (bug?) report

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Jun 26, 2002 at 08:09:45PM +0200, Jon Clausen wrote:

> P.S. I posted the first msg *hours* ago... Is this delay normal, or is
> there something in my mail setup that's confusing the list server?
> 
> I recently switched from Kmail to Postfix/Fetchmail/Procmail/Mutt, and I
> wouldn't be surprised if something *is* shady in that department...

I'll tackle these headers, too

Received: from qst.callsign.net (unix.hoseo.ac.kr [203.241.128.39])
by mailbag.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g5QIm5At026632 
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 13:48:05 -0500

26 Jun 18:48:05 UTC > Received at my mailbox (mailbag.com).

Received: from SMTP32-FWD by qst.callsign.net
  (SMTP32) id A0358; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 18:51:36 +
Received: from usw-sf-list2.sourceforge.net [216.136.171.252] by qst.callsign.net with 
ESMTP
  (SMTPD32-7.07) id AD3763000A6; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 18:51:35 +

26 Jun 18:51:36 UTC > Processed by qst.callsign.net.
26 Jun 18:51:35 UTC > Received at my redirection service (callsign.net).

Received: from usw-sf-list1-b.sourceforge.net ([10.3.1.13] 
helo=usw-sf-list1.sourceforge.net)
by usw-sf-list2.sourceforge.net with esmtp (Exim 3.31-VA-mm2 #1 (Debian))
id 17NHmo-0001wp-00; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 11:45:02 -0700
Received: from cicero1.cybercity.dk ([212.242.40.4])
by usw-sf-list1.sourceforge.net with esmtp (Exim 3.31-VA-mm2 #1 (Debian))
id 17NHg0-00052z-00
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 11:38:00 -0700

26 Jun 18:45:02 UTC > Processed by sourceforge.net.
26 Jun 18:38:00 UTC > Received at SourceForge (sourceforge.net).

Received: from a13-8.kinkon (port115.ds1-noe.adsl.cybercity.dk [212.242.52.118])
by cicero1.cybercity.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A82D15FCC8
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 20:09:45 +0200 (CEST)

26 Jun 18:09:45 UTC > Received at cybercity.dk

Received: by a13-8.kinkon (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.0 (i386), from userid 500)
id 146CC1A3CA; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 20:09:45 +0200 (CEST)

26 Jun 18:09:45 UTC > Received at kinkon

In short:

26 Jun 18:48:05 UTC > Received at my mailbox (mailbag.com).
26 Jun 18:51:36 UTC > Processed by qst.callsign.net.
26 Jun 18:51:35 UTC > Received at my redirection service (callsign.net).
26 Jun 18:45:02 UTC > Processed by sourceforge.net.
26 Jun 18:38:00 UTC > Received at SourceForge (sourceforge.net).
26 Jun 18:09:45 UTC > Received at cybercity.dk
26 Jun 18:09:45 UTC > Received at kinkon

This time the message was at cicero1.cybercity.dk for about 30 minutes.

That's how I read it, anyway.



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Re: [Leaf-devel] Hi there, and (bug?) report

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Jun 26, 2002 at 10:57:04AM +0200, Jon Clausen wrote:

> Hi everyone

Hi!  You said you were wondering about mail problems?

My setup must be quite similar to yours; I use Postfix +
Cyrus IMAP + Fetchmail + Mutt, and it works well.  I also
prefer KMail while using KDE...

I'll take an attempt at analyzing this... I like the
challenge.  I trust and hope that someone will tell me
if I get this wrong...

Here's some of the headers from your first message
(some lines'll wrap...):

Received: from qst.callsign.net (unix.hoseo.ac.kr [203.241.128.39])
by mailbag.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g5QHNNAt018534
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 12:23:24 -0500

26 Jun 17:23:24 UTC > Received at my main mailbox (mailbag.com)
  from my redirector.

Received: from SMTP32-FWD by qst.callsign.net
  (SMTP32) id A04BC; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 17:26:54 +
Received: from usw-sf-list2.sourceforge.net [216.136.171.252] by qst.callsign.net with 
ESMTP
  (SMTPD32-7.07) id A95DEB30090; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 17:26:53 +

26 Jun 17:26:54 UTC > Received at my main mail redirection
  service (callsign.net)

Received: from usw-sf-list1-b.sourceforge.net ([10.3.1.13] 
helo=usw-sf-list1.sourceforge.net)
by usw-sf-list2.sourceforge.net with esmtp (Exim 3.31-VA-mm2 #1 (Debian))
id 17NGUW-0004F8-00; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 10:22:04 -0700
Received: from cicero0.cybercity.dk ([212.242.40.52])
by usw-sf-list1.sourceforge.net with esmtp (Exim 3.31-VA-mm2 #1 (Debian))
id 17NGPQ-0004Ls-00
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 10:16:48 -0700

26 Jun 17:22:04 UTC > Processed at SourceForge (sourceforge.net).
26 Jun 17:16:48 UTC > Received at SourceForge (sourceforge.net).

Received: from a13-8.kinkon (port115.ds1-noe.adsl.cybercity.dk [212.242.52.118])
by cicero0.cybercity.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E6B8102942
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 10:57:05 +0200 (CEST)

26 Jun 08:57:05 UTC > Received at cybercity.dk.

Received: by a13-8.kinkon (Postfix on SuSE Linux 8.0 (i386), from userid 500)  
id BF1D31A20E; Wed, 26 Jun 2002 10:57:04 +0200 (CEST)

26 Jun 08:57:04 UTC > Received at kinkon.

In short:

26 Jun 17:23:24 UTC > Received at my main mailbox (mailbag.com)
26 Jun 17:26:54 UTC > Received at my main mail redirection
26 Jun 17:22:04 UTC > Processed at SourceForge (sourceforge.net).
26 Jun 17:16:48 UTC > Received at SourceForge (sourceforge.net).
26 Jun 08:57:05 UTC > Received at cybercity.dk.
26 Jun 08:57:04 UTC > Received at kinkon.

It doesn't appear to be some sort of bad time setting, either on kinkon,
cybercity.dk, OR sourceforge.net.  I deduce this because:

1) the host cicero0.cybercity.dk (212.242.40.52) and kinkon (212.242.52.118)
   are separate hosts yet have same time (8:57 UTC give or take) and same
   timezone (CEST);

2) hosts beyond cicero0.cybercity.dk are all different timezones except they
   have the same time UTC (after accounting for the U.S. 12-hour clock).

>From 08:57:05 UTC to 17:16:48 UTC it remained on cicero0.cybercity.dk (212.242.40.52).
It appears to me that cybercity.dk held your mail for 8.25 hours... (!)



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Re: [Leaf-devel] Hi there, and (bug?) report

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Jun 26, 2002 at 10:57:04AM +0200, Jon Clausen wrote:

> Quick rundown:
> My name is Jon Clausen, I'm 36 and have been using linux (SuSE mostly)
> for some three years now. I've been using LRP/LEAF for little over a
> year.

How about a round of (re)introductions?  Just an idea...

> I then tried renaming .../packages to something else, and *no*
> change in the backup menu(?!)
> So I started looking through the scripts, and found that what is 
> actually checked by lrcfg.back, in the sub SetPkg() is 
> /var/lib/lrpkg/backdisk. So I put 'blinder=-t msdos...' at the end,
> fired up lrcfg, and lo and behold, I had the option :)
> 
> So either something is weird on my host (bering 1.0rc2), there's a bug
> in the backup scripts somewhere, or the documentation is not quite up to
> par...

Isn't backdisk and lrcfg.back specific to Dachstein and Bering?

Oxygen doesn't have it and neither does LRP, as far as I know.

I would also argue that the "problem" you ran into is an example
of a "surprise" and should be fixed.



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Re: [Leaf-devel] OpenSSH security

[David Douthitt]

On Mon, Jun 24, 2002 at 03:14:39PM -0700, Mike Noyes wrote:

> There is a problem with OpenSSH.
> 
> [Fwd: [SECURITY] [DSA-134-1] OpenSSH remote vulnerability]
> Theo de Raadt announced that the OpenBSD team is working with ISS
> on a remote exploit for OpenSSH (a free implementation of the
> Secure SHell protocol). They are refusing to provide any details on
> the vulnerability but instead are advising everyone to upgrade to
> the latest release, version 3.3.

Sounds like the bug isn't "fixed" but a work-around exists...

Here is how the Mandrake Security Release reads:

Mandrake Linux Security Update Advisory


Package name:   openssh
Advisory ID:MDKSA-2002:040
Date:   June 24th, 2002
Affected versions:  7.1, 7.2, 8.0, 8.1, 8.2, Corporate Server 1.0.1,
Single Network Firewall 7.2


Problem Description:

 Details of an upcoming OpenSSH vulnerability will be published early
 next week.  According to the OpenSSH team, this remote vulnerability
 cannot be exploited when sshd is running with privilege separation.
 The priv separation code is significantly improved in version 3.3 of
 OpenSSH which was released on June 21st.  Unfortunately, there are some
 known problems with this release; compression does not work on all
 operating systems and the PAM support has not been completed.

 The OpenSSH team encourages everyone to upgrade to version 3.3
 immediately and enable privilege separation.  This can be enabled by
 placing in your /etc/ssh/sshd_config file the following:
   
   UsePrivilegeSeparation yes
 
 The vulnerability that will be disclosed next week is not fixed in
 version 3.3 of OpenSSH, however with priv separation enabled, you will
 not be vulnerable to it.  This is because privilege separation uses a
 seperate non-privileged process to handle most of the work, meaning
 that any vulnerability in this part of OpenSSH will never lead to a
 root compromise.  Only access as the non-privileged user restricted in
 chroot would be available.
 
 MandrakeSoft encourages all of our users to upgrade to the updated 
 packages immediately.  This update creates a new user and group on the
 system named sshd that is used to run the non-privileged processes.



References:

 http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openssh-unix-dev&m=102495293705094&w=2





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Re: [Leaf-devel] OT Fun with old BattleBots (some linux content)

[David Douthitt]

On Sun, Jun 23, 2002 at 02:17:16PM -0500, Charles Steinkuehler wrote:

> Sorry for the OT post...feel free to hit delete now, if desired.

May I hit "save" instead?  :-)

> In case you haven't heard, this July 4th is the first annual
> wIndepedance day (as declared by the Desktop Linux folks ...

I've tried in the past to make our house Windows-free - but I've
never been able to find any decent fax software and voice mail
and photo editors and greeting card makers and for me,
UNIX printing (and Mac printing) just "doesn't work".

I'd really like to get the family off Windows NT - but with things
like PrintShop Deluxe and TalkWorks Pro and Adobe's PhotoDeluxe on NT,
what am I to do?

Why, ask you all, of course :-)

Now, I'm not talking just Linux here or even just UNIX :-)

Anybody running a Macintosh float for a Windependence day float? :-)

Why isn't it a "Wintel-Independence" day?  :-)

I'll be quiet now...



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Re: [Leaf-devel] Introducing myself

[David Douthitt]

On Wed, Jun 26, 2002 at 09:36:46AM +0100, Luis.F.Correia wrote:

> To my (slight) surprise, Mike invited me to join LEAF as a developer.

Welcome!  Welcome to all!

> My knowledge in Linux is relatively small. 
> My main work, training and experience is with Windoze. 
> It may suck but that's what pays :)

Ah, but for me, UNIX is what pays :P



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Re: [Leaf-devel] Re: [leaf-user] To Bering users: help us to release 1.0

[David Douthitt]

On Monday 03 June 2002 08:22 am, T Burt wrote:

> One feature that I particularly liked in Trinux, is the ability to
> download packages from an ftp or http server during system startup.

Oxygen did this very early on - in fact, Trinux was an inspiration for 
Oxygen development.

> Has anyone considered using snarf to retrieve packages from a
> nearby server?

snarf is a part of the Oxygen base install.  I tried curl but it was 
too big, as was wget.

> Just think..  A real shell, a real vi and sshd
> without giving up something important!

Oxygen uses elvis-tiny, which covers most of the important parts of 
vi, and does it well.

> Also...
>
> In Trinux, Matt dynamically sets up the size of the ramdisk based
> on the available memory.  More memory = more ramdisk.

Ah!  New Oxygen development looms!  :-) :-)


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Re: [Leaf-devel] Oxygen development

[David Douthitt]

Le Jeudi 30 Mai 2002 22:57, Jacques Nilo a écrit :

> If David thinks it can be helpful, I'll be happy to see what I can do
> for him. All the work I did on the 2.4 kernel has been more or less
> documented in devel mail threads and my config kernel file and my kernel
> patches are available on my web site.

Whatever you can do will help.  The only requirements are:

* No LRP-based patches
* GRSecurity required (medium security)

The options I tend to use are probably different from others, but if the 
kernel itself works then it should be okay.

I might see what I can do myself.  I tried to get VMware running with a 
version of Oxygen, but it never did work - but it ran Solaris and FreeBSD 
just fine :-) ...at least, before it expired :-)

These days, I've been busy working with work and with FreeBSD (yes, it's 
true! :-) and with setting up a new mail server and three new domains.


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Re: [Leaf-devel] Bering grsecurity patch?

[David Douthitt]

--On Wednesday, May 29, 2002 6:20 AM -0700 Mike Noyes 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> BTW, how is development progressing on Oxygen? Is there anything the
> rest of us can do to help you?

My present goals are:

* Linux 2.4
* Upgrade binaries

My last attempt at Linux 2.4 resulted in numerous binaries returning an 
unheard of 135 result.

I had this pop up in a totally unrelated area, and it appeared to be 
related to some sort of shell limit being reached or SOMETHING like that.

I know it can be done; a kind soul sent me Oxygen/Linux 2.4 a ways back - 
but that was Linux 2.4 + LRP patches...

Another goal is to clean up the CVS directory even more and get it ALL into 
CVS.  I used the FreeBSD ports model, and it works well.  Nothing but text 
files, and not many at that.


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Re: [Leaf-devel] Bering grsecurity patch?

[David Douthitt]

On Tuesday 28 May 2002 06:25 pm, Mike Noyes wrote:

> David,
> Aren't you working on this with the development version of Oxygen?
> How did you handle the user space program problem?

I use GRSecurity is just about every Linux production kernel I run.  
The user program to use ACLs is only if you want to actually use 
ACLs.  I've not used them; grsecurity works just fine without them.

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Re: [Leaf-devel] Oxygen, /dev/boot and /dev/backup -links?

[David Douthitt]

On Thursday 02 May 2002 07:08 am, you wrote:
> I'm converting Oxygen floppy disk distribution to start from compact
> flash instead of floppy fisk. Now the problem is that I couldn't
> quickly find the settings or scripts that create the /dev/boot and
> /dev/backup links to point to floppy disk device. What settings and/or
> scripts should I modify to make these links point to /dev/hda1?

Sounds like a bug.

The files are in /var/boot/linuxrc if I remember right.

The links /dev/boot and /dev/backup should be configured via the oxygen.cfg 
file in the volumes section, though they may not be getting set properly.  
The /dev/backup file is not yet fully implemented and /dev/boot is used 
instead for this general purpose.

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Re: [Leaf-devel] ttyS0 problem.

[David Douthitt]

On Friday 26 April 2002 11:03 am, Michiel Vreeburg wrote:
> i am making a lpr package for heyu and xtend.(http://heyu.tanj.com/)
> it is an x10 control program for the lights in my home.
> but i have some problems connecting to the /dev/ttyS0 and /dev/ttyS1.
>
> ls ttyS* -l on the lrp(bering) is reporting:
> crwxrwxrwx1 root dialout4,  64 Feb 10 13:25 ttyS0
> crwxrwxrwx1 root dialout4,  65 Feb 10 13:25 ttyS1
>
> my suse machien is reporting (and working):
> crw-rw1 root uucp   4,  64 Jan 19  2001 ttyS0
> crwxrwxrwx1 root uucp   4,  65 Apr 26 13:46 ttyS1
>
> i think that the problem lays in the dailout and uucp.
> but how do i change it?

You never said what your problem was, so it is sort of hard for us to try and 
help you fix it.

uucp and dialout are the "group" that the ttys are owned by.  Groups are 
listed in /etc/group and changing file groups is done with chgrp.  A good 
UNIX book would be of help here.

You shouldn't have to change the groups here, as the permissions are 777 
(world access) - anyone can access the ttys.

Also, none of the machines I have handy seem to have 777 permissions on ttys 
- usually it's one of three: 440 (w--w-) or 666 (rw-rw-rw-) or 600 
(rw---).  In most cases the ttys are owned by root; however, the group 
varies (uucp, ttys, root, others).  I looked at HPUX, Linux, FreeBSD

I'd make the ttys 666:

chmod 666 /dev/tty*


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Re: [Leaf-devel] Package description file proposal

[David Douthitt]

On Friday 19 April 2002 08:13 am, you wrote:
> On Fri, 2002-04-19 at 00:19, David Douthitt wrote:

> > I'm not keen on that either.  Maybe I'm influenced by my RPM bias
> > - but a file of:
> >
> > Tag: 
> > Tag: 
> > Tag: 
> >
> > Seems good enough to me.

> OK. The "Tag: " will be harder for me to parse, but if you
> need to access the information in the file from a running LEAF
> system I don't see many options. :-(

I can concieve of a scenario like this:

A person downloads the LEAF Resource CDROM, then boots with it and 
uses the resulting system as an anonymous FTP site, making the LEAF 
Repository available to all.

This could even be used inside of a corporate or similar setting, 
where packages could be downloaded elsewhere (across the network) at 
will.

> Now that we're going to use the "Tag: " format, don't we
> need something like autospec or dpkg-gencontrol for package
> developers to use?

I'd like to keep it simple, myself.  Having built a few (few) 
RPMs, I can say that the full *.spec file is definitely overkill for 
LEAF :-)

I've never used (or heard of) autospec, so I can't say what that is.

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Re: [Leaf-devel] new lcd.lrp package

[David Douthitt]

On 4/18/02 at 10:52 PM, guitarlynn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I've taken Charles' binaries and created a package for use
> with lcd's using the hd44780 controller (and some clone)
> chipset's. Init script is included and the package
> includes /etc/lcd.conf which contains all needed
> configuration options.

I've been working on an lcdproc.lrp which contains LCDproc in its
latest version.  I included support for SVGA, ncurses, and
MatrixOrbital LCDs.

Is this yet another case of multiple developers crossing paths?
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Re: [Leaf-devel] Package description file proposal

[David Douthitt]

On 4/18/02 at 8:04 AM, Mike Noyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> On Wed, 2002-04-17 at 22:48, David Douthitt wrote:

> This sounds like XML metadata to me.
> 
> > ...and with the following requirements:
> > 
> > * Expandability (add tags at will)
> 
> XML can handle this.

And can it handle a tag that it's never seen before?

> > * Robustness (unknown tags don't matter)
> 
> I believe XML can handle this, if structured properly.
> 
> > * Ability to be used on an LRP system
> > * Analyzed by shell code
> 
> Please explain the necessity for these two requirements?

The latter of the two is implied by the former.  It seems like a
perfect use for a leaf system to be able to fire up boa and access LRP
packages from web or from proftp.

I already had created a CGI that served up any package currently
loaded on the system, and created the package on the fly for
downloading.

> > * Simple
> 
> XML metadata files are simple text files with structure. I
> agree that a CSV file is easier to read.
> 
> > To me, that all works against XML.
> 
> Only the LEAF system and shell requirements are problems for XML
> metadata.
> 
> What was your opinion of CSV (comma separated values)?

I'm not keen on that either.  Maybe I'm influenced by my RPM bias -
but a file of:

Tag: 
Tag: 
Tag: 

Seems good enough to me.
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Re: [Leaf-devel] ldd libc minor version

[David Douthitt]

On 4/18/02 at 7:35 AM, Mike Noyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> The bin/ tree in cvs serves the following purposes:
> 
> * Tracking of updates (change-log, notes, notification of new
> files, etc.) (Note: a ftp repository wont give us any of this.)

It can.  See ftp.kernel.org

> * Facilitates developer coordination on package and
> release/branch updates.

The Debian project has a stated maintainer in charge for each package;
why not us?

> * Fixes the problem that users are unable to locate files in our
> /devel directory on the shell server.

Central FTP server

> * Fixes the problem of a user trying to use an old package/image
> because they're unaware of a newer one.

Central FTP server.

> * Allows us to bring our shell quota in line with SF
> requirements (1G hard, 512M allocated,
> and current usage is 1.3G).

To me, personally, this sounds like The Real Reason this is being
done

> If it was this trivial to accomplish it would have been
> done already. As I stated above, an ftp directory offers
> none of the tracking or coordination capabilities of cvs.
> Additionally, it doesn't solve the problem of us exceeding
> our quota on the SF shell server.

As I said, the former can be solved easier elseways and the latter
sounds logical.

> For example, just take a look at the
> /pub/packages/test.txt. It's a perfect example of why your
> proposed solution doesn't work. There are many old
> packages that have been updated by another project member,
> but the old package remains to confuse our users.

I see... However, for a quick and easy fix, you could do thus:

find . -name "*.lrp" | xargs ls -l | \
  sed 's/\([^ ^I]*\)$/&<\/a>/' \
  > index.html

It isn't necessarily best, but it shows what you can do - and its
quick and easy.

Another thing to note - there are plenty of packages that have the
same name, but serve different purposes or have different
arrangements.  Just like there are multiple PPP servers, or multiple
PPPoE agents, or whatever, there may be multiple ppp.lrp files
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Re: [Leaf-devel] Need Shell Scripting Advise

[David Douthitt]

On 4/18/02 at 10:31 PM, JamesSturdevant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> Is there a way to read everything from stdin without
> having to have a termination character? Something like
> getc() would be great.

How about something like this?

( cat - ; echo ) | while read LINE ; do
   ...
done
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[Leaf-devel] Repositories (Freshmeat, etc.)

[David Douthitt]

I noticed that practically none of our distributions are listed on
www.linux.org as a distribution - including Mosquito, Oxygen,
Dachstein, Eigerstein, DUCLING, PacketFilter - right down to LRP even.

As I remember, most distributions aren't on Freshmeat either.

How should we handle this?  Should each distro developer send in their
own or should someone speak for all?
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Re: [Leaf-devel] Package Repository

[David Douthitt]

On 4/17/02 at 2:10 PM, Mike Noyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> The following packages were not added to our cvs repository.

Most of those appear to be mine.  apkg.lrp needs to be updated, and
brick.lrp probably should be anywhere but "development".  I stopped
working on brick pretty much.
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Re: [Leaf-devel] Package description file proposal

[David Douthitt]

On 4/17/02 at 7:54 AM, Mike Noyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> On Tue, 2002-04-16 at 19:50, David Douthitt wrote:

> Will the .desc/.xml file's primary purpose be indexing our
> packages, or will it be used by the LEAF release/branch
> internally? If its intended use is for indexing, I believe
> we should use a XML metadata format. If its for internal
> use, a CSV text file is probably best.

My thought was to be able to provide the following abilities:

* Indexing (by groups)
* Requirements
* Keyword searching
* Descriptions

...and with the following requirements:

* Expandability (add tags at will)
* Robustness (unknown tags don't matter)
* Ability to be used on an LRP system
* Analyzed by shell code
* Simple

To me, that all works against XML.
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Re: [Leaf-devel] ldd libc minor version

[David Douthitt]

On 4/17/02 at 8:08 AM, Charles Steinkuehler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> I agree whole-heartedly that a bsd /usr/ports (or gentoo
> ebuild) type source tree is most appropriate.  I don't
> think source should go into any of the CVS directories
> mentioned to date.
> 
> That doesn't change the fact, however, that I think Mike's
> trying to migrate binary LRP files into CVS to cut space
> requirements on the SF site.  I think the directory
> arrangement makes sense for binary packages, but is not a
> good idea for the actual source code.

The way you describe it, it almost sounds like one is trying to find a
way to use a CVS server as a pseudo-FTP server for public file access. 
I always thought CVS was for Source Code and for Development Sources,
etc.

> It's still going to be hard to find packages, but
> hopefully, an index page or search engine of some sort can
> make finding a particular binary package easier. 
> Regardless, browsing through a couple of directories in
> CVS already seems simpler than browsing to the ??? current
> directories with LRP files spread throughout the /devel
> tree...

Ah, but that fix is easy: use links.  Separate packages into
directories based on the "Group:" tag, then create links to each file
in the appropriate glibc* directory based on the "Glibc:" tag.

Another quick alternative:

cd /home/groups/l/leaf/ftphome
for i in $(find ../devel -name "*.lrp") ; do \
   ln -sf $i $(basename $i) ; \
   done

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Re: [Leaf-devel] Package description file proposal

[David Douthitt]

On 4/16/02 at 7:26 AM, Mike Noyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> On Tue, 2002-04-16 at 03:46, David Douthitt wrote:

> David,
> I think we should use the program's name, or place it in what RedHat
> calls "Summary". Personally I prefer the deb format, but it doesn't
> include summary/program name information. :-(

Personally, I like the RPM (Red Hat) format :P

> Program: Ultimate Packer for eXecutables = RPM Summary = DEB N/A
> Executable: upx = RPM Name = DEB Package
> Package: upx.lrp = RPM N/A = DEB Filename
> 
> Debian packages provide the following information (apt-cache show):
> Package, Version, Priority, Section, Maintainer, Depends, Suggests,
> Conflicts, Provides, Replaces, Architecture, Filename, Size, MD5sum,
> Description, installed-size.
> 
> RedHat rpms have this summary information (rpm -q -i): 
> Name, Version, Release, Install date, Group, Size, URL,
> Summary, Description, Relocations, Vendor, Build Date,
> Build Host, Source RPM,  License

There's a LOT more than that - rpm -qi  only lists those things
that are used by the current package.

> Who determines what keywords and categories apply to each package?

The creator of the package.

> I believe these tags will cause confusion
> if there is no set categorization template.

I agree.  Personally, I believe that:

1. A consistent standard is a good idea, and should be done.

2. A consistent standard will not be followed by all, and there will
be some confusion.

Go to http://www.rpmfind.org and do a look up by Group and you'll see
what I mean.  Look up by Distribution and it's similar.

One thing I was thinking of - these *.desc files could (should?) be
treated the way HTML is: an unknown keyword (matches the pattern
/^[^:]*:/ ) causes a line to be ignored.  So if someone suddenly
started using a new tag ("Architecture: PPC" for example) then these
lines would be ignored by current code.

Also, to be able to ignore multiline tags, one should ignore all lines
that start with a whitespace character after an unknown tag.

> > > Name: Ultimate Packer for eXecutables
> > 
> > Ouch!  That's neither a program name nor a package name.
> > The program is "upx"
> 
> In my opinion that is the program name, while upx is the
> executable name (see example above).

Program: upx
Summary: Ultimate Packer for eXecutables (UPX)

...and package name is: ${program}.lrp
...and .version is: ${version}-${release}
...and so forth...

> > > Version: 1.20-1
> > 
> > upx is not version 1.20-1 but version 1.20 (at least in
> > this example).
> 
> In your example, why did you indicate a release level of 1? Is the
> release level different than the hyphen would indicate?

A release level indicates the release of the package, and the version
is the version level of the software.

It could have just as easily been:

Version: 2.54BETA20
Release: 2

...like nmap - which leads to nmap.version being "2.54BETA20-2"
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Re: [Leaf-devel] ldd libc minor version

[David Douthitt]

On 4/16/02 at 3:46 PM, Charles Steinkuehler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> I guess so, but I sort of got the idea (perhaps incorrect)
> that there were packages that *did not* require a C
> library.

I'm sure there are...

> If that's the case, the above is misleading (to
> me it implies the package requires a c library, but
> doesn't care which one).  Something like + /glibc-none or
> maybe + /static would indicate packages with no libc
> requirements.

However, some programs have OTHER library requirements.  So I think
I'd be tempted just to have "noglibc" and a "lib" directory for the
libraries:

--+--- glibc2.0
  |
  +--- glibc2.1
  |
  +--- glibc2.2
  |
  +--- noglibc
  |
  +--- libs

Thus, elvis.lrp would be in glibc2.0 - even though it requires
libm.lrp (in libs) and ncurses5.lrp (in libs).

e3.lrp would be in noglibc, however.

I would suggest that these directories be used for archives, and for
source code.

My personal Oxygen tree is shaping up like the FreeBSD /usr/ports
directories - and I would suggest this.  It has the benefits of:

1. No binary code to watch over...
2. Smaller repository: just makefiles and patches.
3. Much more automated, and can generate packages on the fly - so a
glibc 2.0 program could be compiled for glibc 2.2 if one wanted.

Now that I think of it, the above graphic tree would be bad for
development CVS archives:

1. A program that used to compile under glibc 2.0 but didn't any
longer would have to have its entire CVS tree moved.

2. One could never be sure where a package was.

A perfect (recent) example: a program called "remark" (or
regex-markup): the first version compiled under Red Hat 6.2; the
latest version has gcc requirements that mean it won't compile on less
than Red Hat 7 something (7.2 in my case).

I think ntop had some requirements that way too - the networking code
was nasty that way; a lot of networking details seem to change between
glibc 2.0 systems and glibc 2.1 systems.
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Re: [Leaf-devel] Package description file proposal

[David Douthitt]

On 4/14/02 at 11:20 AM, Mike Noyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> David outlines a package description file in his
> "Developing for LRP" guide. The format follows.
> 
> /var/lib/lrpkg/pkg.desc
> Name: upx
> Version: 1.20
> Release: 1
> Packager: David Douthitt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Packaged: Wed Jul 18 09:40:25 CDT 2001
> Keywords: compressor compress
> Description: Use UPX to compress executables and kernels!
> URL: http://upx.sourceforge.net/
> License: GPL2
> Group: Utilities/Compression
> 
> I propose the following changes:

Comments follow...

> use program name instead of package name,

Thought those were supposed to be (close) to the same?  Probably the
actual name of the binary or program should be used.

> use ISO 8601 date format,

I figured the date format could be whatever - ISO 8601 works for
me

> use version format from pkg.version,

Yes and no...

> add glibc version,

Good idea...

> remove "Keywords", "Release", and "Group".

Bad idea.

Keywords allow basic searches:

cd /var/lib/lrpkg
grep -li "^Keywords: .*keyword*" | sed 's/.desc$//'

Release allows you to separate releases from versions.

Group is one of the best reasons for *.desc: what category IS this
package - allows nice creation of FTP repositories.

> Name: Ultimate Packer for eXecutables

Ouch!  That's neither a program name nor a package name.  The program
is "upx"

> Version: 1.20-1

upx is not version 1.20-1 but version 1.20 (at least in this example).

> Packager: David Douthitt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Packaged: 2001-07-18
> glibc: 2.1.3
> Description: UPX is a free, portable, extendable, high-performance
> executable packer for several different executable formats. It
> achieves an excellent compression ratio and offers very fast
> decompression. Your executables suffer no memory overhead or
> other drawbacks.
> URL: http://upx.sourceforge.net/
> License: GPL2
--
David Douthitt
UNIX Systems Administrator
HP-UX, Unixware, Linux
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: [Leaf-devel] Modifications of network.conf to support changing MAC address

[David Douthitt]

On 4/5/02 at 5:28 PM, Robert Sprockeels <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> In the light of recent (and previous) posts on leaf-devel
> and leaf-user about changing a network card's MAC address,
> here's what I did.
> 
> I changed the stock DCD 1.02 network.conf script to
> support this easily and elegantly.

Oxygen should be able to handle changing MAC addresses just by
changing configuration in network.conf - but I considered to be of
"hack" value so I never documented it :)

I'll have to make sure I never removed that capability.
--
David Douthitt
UNIX Systems Administrator
HP-UX, Unixware, Linux
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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