subject:"accounting software"

Re: ITA approved accounting software that runs on linux

2014-02-10 Thread vordoo


  
  
Hi,
  
  Hopefully you will get or find a striate answer but as I follow
  this question for a long time with no actionable resoles I would:
  
  1. Rephrase the question to: "Is anyone hear using or knows
  someone who uses a linux desktop application (not a web based
  site) for an IL business accounting?"
  
  2. Consider using the old windows program in a virtual machine, it
  maybe even better then the present setup, as you can access it
  from other PCs in the network.
   *** you may need to make sure more then one concoction is not
  aloud, depending on the original software design ***.    
  
  HTH,
  :-)       
  

On 2014-02-10 00:16, E.S. Rosenberg
  wrote:


  

  

  Hi all,
  
  I know this subject has been dealt with in the past but
  since the field is fluid I'm bringing it up again.

A friend of mine manages the books for several zedaka funds,
currently he still does this on an old DOS machine running
chashavshevet, but the machine is starting to display some
potential signs of problems so he is starting to look at
other solutions.

  
  Sadly (but understandably) gnucash is not Israel Tax Authority
  approved so it's not an option, are there any Linux friendly
  options or will they have to have a windows machine in the
  house again (I switched them to all linux + 1 dos about 1-1.5
  years ago).
  

Thanks,
Eliyahu - אליהו
  
  
  
  
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Re: ITA approved accounting software that runs on linux

2014-02-10 Thread Amichai Rotman

Hi Eliyahu,

I wonder: Will Hashavshevet run on FreeDOS?

Theoretically, you could buy a new machine, install FreeDOS as the OS and
copy the Hashavshevet DOS files to it...

Could you give it a try and let us all know?

Amichai.


2014-02-10 11:42 GMT+02:00 vordoo vor...@yahoo.com:

  Hi,

 Hopefully you will get or find a striate answer but as I follow this
 question for a long time with no actionable resoles I would:

 1. Rephrase the question to: Is anyone hear using or knows someone who
 uses a linux desktop application (not a web based site) for an IL business
 accounting?

 2. Consider using the old windows program in a virtual machine, it maybe
 even better then the present setup, as you can access it from other PCs in
 the network.
  *** you may need to make sure more then one concoction is not aloud,
 depending on the original software design ***.

 HTH,
 :-)

  On 2014-02-10 00:16, E.S. Rosenberg wrote:

   Hi all,
  I know this subject has been dealt with in the past but since the field
 is fluid I'm bringing it up again.
  A friend of mine manages the books for several zedaka funds, currently he
 still does this on an old DOS machine running chashavshevet, but the
 machine is starting to display some potential signs of problems so he is
 starting to look at other solutions.

  Sadly (but understandably) gnucash is not Israel Tax Authority approved
 so it's not an option, are there any Linux friendly options or will they
 have to have a windows machine in the house again (I switched them to all
 linux + 1 dos about 1-1.5 years ago).

  Thanks,
 Eliyahu - אליהו


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Re: ITA approved accounting software that runs on linux

2014-02-10 Thread Udi Finkelstein

The question is not if it will run under FreeDOS, but if it will be usable
under FreeDOS.
How will you back it up? The old machine probably had a floppy drive. I
don't think that's a solution you want to stick to.
In any case, you can always run it under VirtualBox and then backup the
virtual HD file.
You can even use the original DOS if you want.
In fact you can create a disk image from the original HD and move it to the
virtual machine.

Another question is if Hashavshevet has a dongle (copy-protection). If yes,
what type (parallel port?) and how these can be supported.
I'm not sure you can even find a motherboard with an on-board true parallel
port anymore. a USB to parallel adapter may not be compatible with copy
protected programs that expects to access the parallel port via the
original I/O locations in the PC memory map.

This may be of help:
http://www-user.tu-chemnitz.de/~heha/bastelecke/Rund%20um%20den%20PC/USB2LPT/ul-15.en.htm

Udi


On Mon, Feb 10, 2014 at 11:53 AM, Amichai Rotman amic...@iglu.org.ilwrote:

 Hi Eliyahu,

 I wonder: Will Hashavshevet run on FreeDOS?

 Theoretically, you could buy a new machine, install FreeDOS as the OS and
 copy the Hashavshevet DOS files to it...

 Could you give it a try and let us all know?

 Amichai.


 2014-02-10 11:42 GMT+02:00 vordoo vor...@yahoo.com:

  Hi,

 Hopefully you will get or find a striate answer but as I follow this
 question for a long time with no actionable resoles I would:

 1. Rephrase the question to: Is anyone hear using or knows someone who
 uses a linux desktop application (not a web based site) for an IL business
 accounting?

 2. Consider using the old windows program in a virtual machine, it maybe
 even better then the present setup, as you can access it from other PCs in
 the network.
  *** you may need to make sure more then one concoction is not aloud,
 depending on the original software design ***.

 HTH,
 :-)

  On 2014-02-10 00:16, E.S. Rosenberg wrote:

   Hi all,
  I know this subject has been dealt with in the past but since the field
 is fluid I'm bringing it up again.
  A friend of mine manages the books for several zedaka funds, currently
 he still does this on an old DOS machine running chashavshevet, but the
 machine is starting to display some potential signs of problems so he is
 starting to look at other solutions.

  Sadly (but understandably) gnucash is not Israel Tax Authority approved
 so it's not an option, are there any Linux friendly options or will they
 have to have a windows machine in the house again (I switched them to all
 linux + 1 dos about 1-1.5 years ago).

  Thanks,
 Eliyahu - אליהו


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Re: ITA approved accounting software that runs on linux

2014-02-10 Thread E.S. Rosenberg

It may very well be chashavshevet and not the computer that is starting to
flake out, he has to still try stuff, but since chashavshevet are unwilling
to give any form of support on it anymore he is now really starting to
think he needs to replace it...

IIRC I may have gotten it working on dosbox years ago just as a testcase to
move him to linux but at the time he didn't want to rock the boat, now I
would have to see if I can duplicate that again, but that still doesn't
solve the problem if it's chashavshevet and not the computer.

I would love to use a desktop application instead of a website but I can
imagine that unless some body wants to release signed versions of gnucash
that sign the files to guarantee they were only used in the approved builds
ITA won't like it

Though I'm sure people like Ori who have interacted with ITA and know what
they demand can shed more light on that side then me...

Regards,
Eliyahu - אליהו

2014-02-10 12:08 GMT+02:00 Udi Finkelstein linux...@udif.com:

The question is not if it will run under FreeDOS, but if it will be usable
under FreeDOS.
How will you back it up? The old machine probably had a floppy drive. I
don't think that's a solution you want to stick to.
In any case, you can always run it under VirtualBox and then backup the
virtual HD file.
You can even use the original DOS if you want.
In fact you can create a disk image from the original HD and move it to
the virtual machine.

Another question is if Hashavshevet has a dongle (copy-protection). If
yes, what type (parallel port?) and how these can be supported.
I'm not sure you can even find a motherboard with an on-board true
parallel port anymore. a USB to parallel adapter may not be compatible with
copy protected programs that expects to access the parallel port via the
original I/O locations in the PC memory map.

This may be of help:

http://www-user.tu-chemnitz.de/~heha/bastelecke/Rund%20um%20den%20PC/USB2LPT/ul-15.en.htm

Udi

On Mon, Feb 10, 2014 at 11:53 AM, Amichai Rotman amic...@iglu.org.ilwrote:

Hi Eliyahu,

I wonder: Will Hashavshevet run on FreeDOS?

Theoretically, you could buy a new machine, install FreeDOS as the OS and
copy the Hashavshevet DOS files to it...

Could you give it a try and let us all know?

Amichai.

2014-02-10 11:42 GMT+02:00 vordoo vor...@yahoo.com:

Hi,

Hopefully you will get or find a striate answer but as I follow this
question for a long time with no actionable resoles I would:

1. Rephrase the question to: Is anyone hear using or knows someone who
uses a linux desktop application (not a web based site) for an IL business
accounting?

2. Consider using the old windows program in a virtual machine, it maybe
even better then the present setup, as you can access it from other PCs in
the network.
*** you may need to make sure more then one concoction is not aloud,
depending on the original software design ***.

HTH,
:-)

On 2014-02-10 00:16, E.S. Rosenberg wrote:

Hi all,
I know this subject has been dealt with in the past but since the field
is fluid I'm bringing it up again.
A friend of mine manages the books for several zedaka funds, currently
he still does this on an old DOS machine running chashavshevet, but the
machine is starting to display some potential signs of problems so he is
starting to look at other solutions.

Sadly (but understandably) gnucash is not Israel Tax Authority approved
so it's not an option, are there any Linux friendly options or will they
have to have a windows machine in the house again (I switched them to all
linux + 1 dos about 1-1.5 years ago).

Thanks,
Eliyahu - אליהו

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Re: ITA approved accounting software that runs on linux

2014-02-10 Thread vordoo


  
  
On 2014-02-10 12:08, Udi Finkelstein
  wrote:


  

  
Another question is if Hashavshevet has a dongle
  (copy-protection). If yes, what type (parallel port?) and
  how these can be supported.

  

  

You may have better luck with KVM or vmware  regarding this issue.
 
  


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Re: ITA approved accounting software that runs on linux

2014-02-10 Thread E.S. Rosenberg

Anyone know if moneydance is approved? (I remember I looked at it years ago
for someone else as an alternative to QuickBooks but that never worked out
because something went wrong with the import)

Thanks,
Eliyahu - אליהו


2014-02-10 18:44 GMT+02:00 vordoo vor...@yahoo.com:

  On 2014-02-10 12:08, Udi Finkelstein wrote:

   Another question is if Hashavshevet has a dongle (copy-protection). If
 yes, what type (parallel port?) and how these can be supported.

 You may have better luck with KVM or vmware  regarding this issue.


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ITA approved accounting software that runs on linux

2014-02-09 Thread E.S. Rosenberg

Hi all,
I know this subject has been dealt with in the past but since the field is
fluid I'm bringing it up again.
A friend of mine manages the books for several zedaka funds, currently he
still does this on an old DOS machine running chashavshevet, but the
machine is starting to display some potential signs of problems so he is
starting to look at other solutions.

Sadly (but understandably) gnucash is not Israel Tax Authority approved so
it's not an option, are there any Linux friendly options or will they have
to have a windows machine in the house again (I switched them to all linux
+ 1 dos about 1-1.5 years ago).

Thanks,
Eliyahu - אליהו
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Re: accounting software free open source

2013-10-25 Thread E.S. Rosenberg

2013/7/7 Ori Idan o...@helicontech.co.il:



 On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 1:53 AM, Geoffrey S. Mendelson
 geoffreymendel...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 7/7/2013 1:20 AM, Micha Feigin wrote:

 On the other hand as memory serves, you can run your books using an open
 source software and then submit the printouts to a certified accounted
 to make a legal report. You may need to work with generic receipts in
 parallel though.



 As it was explained to me by my accountant, the tax authorities don't care
 how you keep YOUR books, they only care that the submissions to them are
 done properly.

 Properly means that an accepted (certified?) program is used and that the
 data was entered by a level 3 (starts at 1) certified bookkeeper or a
 certified public accountant (CPA).

 In real terms this means for small business the data is sent to your
 accountant and they (or their certified bookkeeper) enters it into their
 program on their computer and submits that to the tax authorities.

 At that point the responsibility for the data being entered properly and
 the program being a legal one is borne by your accountant and not you.

 IMHO this is preferable because my experience in being an independent
 consultant, the owner of a small consulting firm, and involved with startups
 over various times, is that any money spent paying a professional to keep
 your books and prepare your tax returns is well worth it. YMMV.

 Most accountants will accept data in XLS (Excel spreadsheet format), so
 you can enter the data in an Excel spreadsheet and send them the file.

 I assume that an Excel spreadsheet created and maintained by OpenOffice
 would be acceptable to them.

 Geoff.


 Tax authorities has nothing against OSS software and they already gave
 approval to OSS software twice (Drorit, my software and it's fork Linet,
 both GPL).
 The real truth is that they only ask to see several things:
 1. Invoices can not be deleted and numbered sequentially without repeating.
 2. No simple ability to delete transcations
 3. Output of what they call Open Format files, these are files with all
 transactions in a special format they require.

 That is all, no question about OSS or not.
 There was a debate last time they registered Linet and they agreed to
 register it so they have nothing against OSS.
 GNUCASH can not be registered since it can not output Open Format files.

 Note that I have good experience and knowledge about the subject as I make a
 living out of Accounting software.
 I have written several software packages and also consult business about the
 same.

Both drorit and linet run server side, gnucash runs on my computer and
the tax authority has no way of knowing whether I doctored my version
of gnucash.
Even with drorit and linet, will the tax authority accept it if I
install it on my server (and as a result have full control over all
the demands you listed) or did they only approve the version running
on company X's servers?
Logically it seems only the second would be the case...
Regards,
Eliyahu - אליהו

 --
 Ori Idan


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Re: accounting software free open source

2013-07-07 Thread Geoffrey S. Mendelson


On 7/7/2013 4:51 AM, Ori Idan wrote:



Tax authorities has nothing against OSS software and they already gave
approval to OSS software twice (Drorit, my software and it's fork Linet,
both GPL).


I never said anything about FOSS, what I was commenting on was the
requirement to have either be a  CPA or a have a level 3 bookkeeper
certificate in order to be legally able to enter the data into you
approved (Open source or not) program.


Has that restriction been lifted?

Geoff.


--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson,  N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson,  N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379



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Re: accounting software free open source

2013-07-07 Thread E.S. Rosenberg

re:all

2013/7/7 Ori Idan o...@helicontech.co.il:



 On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 1:53 AM, Geoffrey S. Mendelson
 geoffreymendel...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 7/7/2013 1:20 AM, Micha Feigin wrote:

 On the other hand as memory serves, you can run your books using an open
 source software and then submit the printouts to a certified accounted
 to make a legal report. You may need to work with generic receipts in
 parallel though.



 As it was explained to me by my accountant, the tax authorities don't care
 how you keep YOUR books, they only care that the submissions to them are
 done properly.

 Properly means that an accepted (certified?) program is used and that the
 data was entered by a level 3 (starts at 1) certified bookkeeper or a
 certified public accountant (CPA).

 In real terms this means for small business the data is sent to your
 accountant and they (or their certified bookkeeper) enters it into their
 program on their computer and submits that to the tax authorities.

 At that point the responsibility for the data being entered properly and
 the program being a legal one is borne by your accountant and not you.

 IMHO this is preferable because my experience in being an independent
 consultant, the owner of a small consulting firm, and involved with startups
 over various times, is that any money spent paying a professional to keep
 your books and prepare your tax returns is well worth it. YMMV.

 Most accountants will accept data in XLS (Excel spreadsheet format), so
 you can enter the data in an Excel spreadsheet and send them the file.

 I assume that an Excel spreadsheet created and maintained by OpenOffice
 would be acceptable to them.

 Geoff.


 Tax authorities has nothing against OSS software and they already gave
 approval to OSS software twice (Drorit, my software and it's fork Linet,
 both GPL).
 The real truth is that they only ask to see several things:
 1. Invoices can not be deleted and numbered sequentially without repeating.
 2. No simple ability to delete transcations
 3. Output of what they call Open Format files, these are files with all
 transactions in a special format they require.

 That is all, no question about OSS or not.
 There was a debate last time they registered Linet and they agreed to
 register it so they have nothing against OSS.
 GNUCASH can not be registered since it can not output Open Format files.

 Note that I have good experience and knowledge about the subject as I make a
 living out of Accounting software.
 I have written several software packages and also consult business about the
 same.
Both drorit and linet run server side, gnucash runs on my computer and
the tax authority has no way of knowing whether I doctored my version
of gnucash.
Even with drorit and linet, will the tax authority accept it if I
install it on my server (and as a result have full control over all
the demands you listed) or did they only approve the version running
on company X's servers?
Logically it seems only the second would be the case...
Regards,
Eliyahu - אליהו


 --
 Ori Idan


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Re: accounting software free open source

2013-07-07 Thread Ori Idan

On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 8:16 AM, E.S. Rosenberg e...@g.jct.ac.il wrote:

 2013/7/7 Ori Idan o...@helicontech.co.il:
 
 
 
  On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 1:53 AM, Geoffrey S. Mendelson
  geoffreymendel...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  On 7/7/2013 1:20 AM, Micha Feigin wrote:
 
  On the other hand as memory serves, you can run your books using an
 open
  source software and then submit the printouts to a certified accounted
  to make a legal report. You may need to work with generic receipts in
  parallel though.
 
 
 
  As it was explained to me by my accountant, the tax authorities don't
 care
  how you keep YOUR books, they only care that the submissions to them are
  done properly.
 
  Properly means that an accepted (certified?) program is used and that
 the
  data was entered by a level 3 (starts at 1) certified bookkeeper or a
  certified public accountant (CPA).
 
  In real terms this means for small business the data is sent to your
  accountant and they (or their certified bookkeeper) enters it into their
  program on their computer and submits that to the tax authorities.
 
  At that point the responsibility for the data being entered properly and
  the program being a legal one is borne by your accountant and not you.
 
  IMHO this is preferable because my experience in being an independent
  consultant, the owner of a small consulting firm, and involved with
 startups
  over various times, is that any money spent paying a professional to
 keep
  your books and prepare your tax returns is well worth it. YMMV.
 
  Most accountants will accept data in XLS (Excel spreadsheet format), so
  you can enter the data in an Excel spreadsheet and send them the file.
 
  I assume that an Excel spreadsheet created and maintained by OpenOffice
  would be acceptable to them.
 
  Geoff.
 
 
  Tax authorities has nothing against OSS software and they already gave
  approval to OSS software twice (Drorit, my software and it's fork Linet,
  both GPL).
  The real truth is that they only ask to see several things:
  1. Invoices can not be deleted and numbered sequentially without
 repeating.
  2. No simple ability to delete transcations
  3. Output of what they call Open Format files, these are files with all
  transactions in a special format they require.
 
  That is all, no question about OSS or not.
  There was a debate last time they registered Linet and they agreed to
  register it so they have nothing against OSS.
  GNUCASH can not be registered since it can not output Open Format files.
 
  Note that I have good experience and knowledge about the subject as I
 make a
  living out of Accounting software.
  I have written several software packages and also consult business about
 the
  same.

 Both drorit and linet run server side, gnucash runs on my computer and
 the tax authority has no way of knowing whether I doctored my version
 of gnucash.
 Even with drorit and linet, will the tax authority accept it if I
 install it on my server (and as a result have full control over all
 the demands you listed) or did they only approve the version running
 on company X's servers?
 Logically it seems only the second would be the case...


Linet does not run on a server it is run locally.
The request is that you can not change or delete transactions from the
software itself or by a normal user.
There is no request to not be able to change at all. They accept that
knowledgeable user with root privileges on the system can delete
transactions.

-- 
Ori Idan
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