Re: Moving from Maclaunch to Google Groups

[Jerome Vernet]

Sorry, forget this mail. I found a way.

Jerome
Le 8 mars 06, à 15:08, Jerome Vernet a écrit :


Hi,

I don't like Google Group. I do not found where to change the email 
adress to receive mail digest from the list, and I don't use the gmail 
account.



Jerome




--
LisaList is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...

Shop buy.com and save. <http://lowendmac.com/ad/buy.com.html>

 Support Low End Mac <http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html>

LisaList info:  <http://lowendmac.com/lists/lisa.html>
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  <mailto:lisalist@mail.maclaunch.com>
To unsubscribe, email:  <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
For digest mode, email: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subscription questions: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Archive: <http://www.mail-archive.com/lisalist%40mail.maclaunch.com/>

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Moving from Maclaunch to Google Groups

[Jerome Vernet]

Hi,

I don't like Google Group. I do not found where to change the email  
adress to receive mail digest from the list, and I don't use the gmail  
account.



Jerome
Le 7 mars 06, à 14:29, Dan Knight a écrit :


We've already moved half of our email lists to Google groups. Today
we're starting the transition for our three non-Mac Apple-related email
lists: Apple2list, LisaList, and Newtonlist.

If you wish to remain in the group, you must subscribe to the new
Google Groups list. We have no way of exporting addresses from
Maclaunch and doing this for you. I'll be updating the list FAQs, but
you can go to one of the following pages to join:

http://groups.google.com/group/apple2list
http://groups.google.com/group/lisalist
http://groups.google.com/group/newtonlist

There are several benefits of moving to Google Groups. Although you can
continue to treat this like a regular email list, you now gain the
ability to read threaded postings online and, once you've logged in,
even post replies online. You can also use Google's search engine to
search the list archive.

On top of that, you have total control of your subscription once you've
registered with Google. You can set your account to digest mode - or to
"no email" mode when you go on vacation.

Best of all, we'll never have that "out of server space" problem that
we've had so often with Maclaunch due to spam filling our mailboxes.

I think the many advantages outweigh the few drawbacks, and I hope to
see all of you sign up in the next few days.

Dan the listmom

--  
LisaList is sponsored by  and...


Shop buy.com and save. 

  Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
  --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com
--- 

Wanadoo vous informe que cet  e-mail a ete controle par l'anti-virus  
mail.

Aucun virus connu a ce jour par nos services n'a ete detecte.







--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive (Working !!!)

[Jerome Vernet]

macmoni a écrit :

Hi Jerome,

check the October 2005 postings in LisaList and use the search or filter 
option with profile




I found in the list archive at mail-archive:
* Static brush to move sideway, or
* lubricate the flywheel

I don't know if I will have courage to do that... Does the noise I heard 
can kill the disk ?
I do not have to use it a lot, just to play around with Lisa Tools... I 
just need my wife out and a good earset.


Jerome


--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive (Working !!!)

[Jerome Vernet]

Hi All,

So, finally, thanks to macmoni and Guido, I finally get my drive 
working.


I changed the Profile (I have two Profile) to manage to install LisaOS 
3.1, done without any problem.
The only problem is that the Profile made an astounishing squeaking 
noise ! The bearings are absolutely dead, so the drive will fail sooner 
or later :(.
I don't think I can do something for it, and have to play around with a 
ear-protection headset ;)


After so long, I was able to see what Lisa OS look like. I was thinking 
that it was much nearer to macos, but it's really something different.


A little AVI film: 
http://membres.lycos.fr/jeromevernet/images/IMGP0616.AVI



I'm happy !


Jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 26 févr. 06, à 22:45, Guido Deiana a écrit :


No. A not good and stable contact on the mouse connector. A dry 
antioxidant spray

perhaps will solve again the problem.



The mouse work well in the boot screen. as long I am in this boot 
screen, it work. I start on the profile (MacOs), the mouse stop 
responding... But the Lisa is not dead, it show a disk when I insert 
it.


I try with the Lisa 7/7 disk too, same thing..;

Jerome


--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

rome


No. Is really difficult that the problem is on this side. Check the 
INTERNAL
connectors where the card cage go to be inserted. Open the back cover, 
remove the card

cage and clean the left big connector.

Guido




Guido,

It's working !!! Thank you very much, all people !

I've cleaned as much as I can the contacts, and was able to read some 
disks !


I've tried the second board, it's a H/A8. It work, but for some point: 
I have the mouse when the pre boot process (choosing a disk), then no 
mouse, in macOs or in le Lisa 7/7 restore disk. Curious ? Not the good 
mouse ?


Now, the next thing will be to install lisa OS on my second Profile. I 
will have a lot of questions ;)


Have a good night, thank you all again !


Jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 26 févr. 06, à 21:48, Guido Deiana a écrit :


On Sun, 26 Feb 2006 21:33:22 +0100, Jerome Vernet wrote


I have two IO card, both tested with same behavior. I have in fact 
two

back plane with CPU, IO and mem, same thing :( :(


Last thing: my Lisa show a D/A8 ROM.

While i'm testing, i get one time an error '23', that is, no system
disk. That was when boot from 'disk 2' in the menu. never able to get
it again...


Normally you get an error 23 when, passed the initial test, the Lisa 
try to boot from
the floppy (the first device available when the hdd is not present) 
and it do not find
any floppy inserted on it. If during the initial test and after the 
first click you

press any key eccept the Option key, the boot menu is shown.
If you see 2 floppy icons, this is because the D/A8 Roms. These are 
Lisa 1 Roms, and
Lisa 1 have 2 Twiggy drives. In your situation only Apple-2 can work. 
Infact, when
upgraded to Lisa 2 with the 400K drive only the second flat was used 
and connected to

the Lisalite board.


Goog to know ! I alway try to boot on the floppy with Apple-1, and have 
to wait a while


I ask myself if the second board I have isn't a H/A8 ? I will try.




I try to see where the cable that connect main board to the Lite
Adapter is connected, but I cannot see the connector without dismantle
it all, I think.


Is not easy to see without dismantle. Anyway the two cables are 
connected that
connector in which the motherboard is inserted (looking from the back 
of the Lisa,

it's that bigger on the left.




have to dismantle it...

Thanks you

jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...

Shop buy.com and save. <http://lowendmac.com/ad/buy.com.html>

 Support Low End Mac <http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html>

LisaList info:  <http://lowendmac.com/lists/lisa.html>
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  <mailto:lisalist@mail.maclaunch.com>
To unsubscribe, email:  <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
For digest mode, email: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subscription questions: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Archive: <http://www.mail-archive.com/lisalist%40mail.maclaunch.com/>

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 26 févr. 06, à 21:31, Guido Deiana a écrit :


On Sun, 26 Feb 2006 21:20:52 +0100, Jerome Vernet wrote

I have two IO card, both tested with same behavior. I have in fact two
back plane with CPU, IO and mem, same thing :( :(

It all for today, I will bring the Lisa back to my stock for a long
time...


Hi Jerome,
I've had the same problems with the Lisa internal connectors oxided.
The drive began to read for 1 second and after the floppy (tested 
working!) is ejected.
Testing with a second complete (tested working) cards cage I've got 
the same results.
Only after to have well cleaned the female connectors (these present 
internally on the
Lisa case) with Sidol and a Dry Antioxidant Spray the floppy drive has 
began to works

again.

It may help, yes. I will try to check the connection between the Lite 
Adapter and the disk (tested with 2 different cable, connector on the 
Lite seems to be clean).


Then, the ribbon between the board and the lite adapter: where this 
cable is connected to the mainboard? How I can remove it ?


Jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...

Shop buy.com and save. <http://lowendmac.com/ad/buy.com.html>

 Support Low End Mac <http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html>

LisaList info:  <http://lowendmac.com/lists/lisa.html>
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  <mailto:lisalist@mail.maclaunch.com>
To unsubscribe, email:  <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
For digest mode, email: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subscription questions: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Archive: <http://www.mail-archive.com/lisalist%40mail.maclaunch.com/>

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

I have two IO card, both tested with same behavior. I have in fact two 
back plane with CPU, IO and mem, same thing :( :(



Last thing: my Lisa show a D/A8 ROM.

While i'm testing, i get one time an error '23', that is, no system 
disk. That was when boot from 'disk 2' in the menu. never able to get 
it again...


I try to see where the cable that connect main board to the Lite 
Adapter is connected, but I cannot see the connector without dismantle 
it all, I think.



Jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 26 févr. 06, à 20:57, Jerome Vernet a écrit :




perhaps the drive is also dead, so I will retry with another one 
(without killing anything on the drive itself).


Ok, I've just tested with another drive (F75W, 1,44). This time, with 
the ribbon cutted in 9 and 20, I have exactly the same behavior than 
with the original disk.


So, it's not the drive. It may be the Lite Adapter, wich is dead. :( No 
way to find one, I suppose...


Or what else can I do ? There is two ribbon that can connect to the 
Lite Adapter. I usually use the first one, I've tested with the other 
with no success (the drive is not seen at all).


I have two IO card, both tested with same behavior. I have in fact two 
back plane with CPU, IO and mem, same thing :( :(


It all for today, I will bring the Lisa back to my stock for a long 
time...



Thanks for your help !

jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...

Shop buy.com and save. <http://lowendmac.com/ad/buy.com.html>

 Support Low End Mac <http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html>

LisaList info:  <http://lowendmac.com/lists/lisa.html>
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  <mailto:lisalist@mail.maclaunch.com>
To unsubscribe, email:  <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
For digest mode, email: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subscription questions: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Archive: <http://www.mail-archive.com/lisalist%40mail.maclaunch.com/>

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 26 févr. 06, à 20:46, macmoni a écrit :


Hi Jerome,

if the drive ejects the disks always, whether a disc is inserted or 
not, then you didn't cut the PIN 9 and PIN 20, that's all.
You do not need to have some parts soldered out, just cut the cable or 
the wire on the board of the floppy



Hi,

I'm pretty sure that I had cut the right pin. take a look at my photo:
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/jerome.vernet/images/MP-F51Wb.jpg

I put in red what i had removed, and the track cutted under the red 
cross.


For the ribbon (20 wires), wire 1 is the red (colored, some time) and 
goes to the left on my picture. I count 9 wire, cut this one. I cut the 
last (20). Not working.


It sould have worked ! It's equal to cut on the ribbon or remove the 
pin or cut track from the pin.


So, I cut the track that goes to PIN 9 to a resistor -I ve checked that 
with un mutlivolter- then cut the 20th. Same thing...


perhaps the drive is also dead, so I will retry with another one 
(without killing anything on the drive itself).


I really need your grateful help, stay tuned !

Jerome


--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Hi,

So do I... And, not working !!!
First try, simply by cutting wires 9 and 20 on the ribbon (I have some  
spare !): the 800k disk eject imediatly the disk.


So I remove the resistor (desolering) on PIN 20, and cut track on the  
board for PIN 9. Tested again, the drive still eject the disk  
imediatly.


I will check with a voltmeter if the track for PIN 9 is really cutted  
(how hard I have to cut ?).


:( :( :(

Jerome

Le 26 févr. 06, à 12:47, macmoni a écrit :


Hi Jerome,

I take the first MP-F51W-03 I found on my desk, hoping it is working.  
I don't know if it's a 1,44 or 800k drive ;)

That's a 800k Floppy-Drive

I hope you understood the text correctly. You don't have to cut some  
connections on any Lisa-Board
ONLY PIN 9 and PIN 20 from the connection to the ribbon-cable of any  
Mac 3,5" Floppy-Drive, whatever you can find.
If you break that connection from the drives Board, you laten can  
resolder that connection again, simply using a wire and solder it on  
the two points again.


C'est tout le meme chose, et n'est pas trés difficile - d'accord?

TOM le Bavarois :-)


--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com
--- 

Wanadoo vous informe que cet  e-mail a ete controle par l'anti-virus  
mail.

Aucun virus connu a ce jour par nos services n'a ete detecte.







--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Guido Deiana a écrit :

On Sun, 26 Feb 2006 10:06:00 +0100, Jerome Vernet wrote




Hi Jerome,
just work on the other side of the circuit board. Use a solder and take the pin 9 and 
20 out of the board. It's immediate and this way you can restore the connections 
anytime.
It look hard to remove the board to access the other side. I though 
about it, but removing the pin by desoldering it look hard.


If macmomi confirm that I just have to cut the track from PIN 9 to RJ4 
and PIN 20 to RJ5, i will do that, much more easy. The macplus from wich 
I take it is dead, so I can kill the drive too...


What happen if I plug the drive without that ? Kill the Lisa ? Doesn't 
work at all ?



If it's working (I hope ), the next problem is to fine a way to 
mount it in the Lisa drive bay, facing the eject mechanics of the drive 
to the Lisa disk hole. I have the MacPlus drive bay, look like it can 
fit (some holes to do, perhaps).


Jerome


Ciao,

Guido Deiana
Padova, Italy  





--
LisaList is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...

Shop buy.com and save. <http://lowendmac.com/ad/buy.com.html>

 Support Low End Mac <http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html>

LisaList info:  <http://lowendmac.com/lists/lisa.html>
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  <mailto:lisalist@mail.maclaunch.com>
To unsubscribe, email:  <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
For digest mode, email: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subscription questions: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Archive: <http://www.mail-archive.com/lisalist%40mail.maclaunch.com/>

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 26 févr. 06, à 07:54, macmoni a écrit :


Hi Jerome,
No, but it was easy for me to type that in. Of course you will 
disconnect the PIN 9 wire and the PIN 20 wire on the Sony Floppy Board 
by cutting it with a sharp knife

 Remove the PIN from the disk ?

Yes
 Assuming that the red wire is '0', on the drive, where are PIN 9 and 
20 ?
Look on the Sony Floppy-Board and search the ribbon connection (mostly 
left bottom when the drive lays with insertion side awya from you): 
they're often marked with 1 (and below 2) on the left side of the 
double array PINs and 19 (and below 20) on the right side.


I take the first MP-F51W-03 I found on my desk, hoping it is working. I 
don't know if it's a 1,44 or 800k drive ;)


I may dismantle a Mac Plus later to get it's drive, may fit better in 
the lisa drive cage.



You can count:
1 3 5 7  9 11 13 15 17 19
2 4 6 8 10 12 14 16 18 20
You will see PIN 9 and also PIN 20 connected to a bridge or/and to a 
resistor. Cut this connections!




I take a picture:
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/jerome.vernet/images/MP-F51Wb.jpg

Please confirm that I only have to cut the track that go from PIN 9 
under cap C2 (*not* remove C2 !), and remove the RJ5 resistor ?


I don't want to kill my Lisa board, killink the drive itself is not a 
problem...


Thanks, anyway ! I never heard about this on the net before !


Jerome


--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: PC Crap

[Jerome Vernet]

macmoni a écrit :

Hi everybody,

I didn't ever expect to read such a lot of postings about PCs in the 
Lisa List :-0
... nor, that I will type the word "PC" in a mail and send that to the 
LisaList


I always thought:
Never put a Lisa too close to a PC

Agreed !

Never put any Apple near anything else, too. That why I have 70 apple 
system at home, and only 5 'PC':

- IBM AT
- Amstrad PC 1512, 164 and PPC 1640, because they are the first 
afordable computer

- a more 'recent' PC, Pentium III 900 Mhz

Jerome


--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

macmoni a écrit :

Hi Jerome,

you can use every MacIntosh Disk-Drive, e.g. the Sony F51W or F75W to 
replace the original OA D34V 3,5" Floppy Drive from Sony.

Perhaps you have to add the Lisa Lite Card (depends on your Lisa).
The Lisa Lite Card is the little card in the disk cage ? The drive is 
connected to a little card, wich is itself connected to the mainboard.
The only modifications are: Just pull PIN 9 and PIN 20 of the ribbon 
cable, when you use a 800k Mac Drive or the 1,44MB Mac Super Drive.
You say I really can use any 1.44 drive ? To 'pull PIN 9 and PIN 20' do 
I need to cut the ribon ? Remove the PIN from the disk ? Assuming that 
the red wire is '0', on the drive, where are PIN 9 and 20 ?




So you can easily reduce your time of searching the cause for the 
Timeout-Error, by switching the complete Floppy-Drive.


I have plenty of 800k drive, but no 400k drive...


Jerome


--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Lisa Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Si, I come back for my disk drive: it's not working.

I've dismantled it completly, greased everywhere, cleaned the head with 
special alcohol, then mounted it back and look how does it go when 
power up the Lisa, disk inserted:


-head move to the outside of the disk
-drive spin

Waiting 3 minutes without anything, I don't know if the disk -Lisa 7/7- 
is good, then I have an IO Error 39 (Timeout).


Starting the Lisa on the profile under MacOs, I 've inserted a disk. I 
got a message 'this disk is not a macintosh disk' immediatly (the head 
move a little, disk still spinning).
Try to initialise: the Lisa eject (the head move very little) the disk 
immediatly with 'Initialization failed'.


Any idea, advice ?

The disk drive seems to be dead, anybody have a replacement disk drive 
for me, as I want to test Lisa OS instead MacOs...


Thanks in advance.


Jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: PC Crap

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 24 févr. 06, à 22:32, Jerome Vernet a écrit :



Le 24 févr. 06, à 21:14, [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit :


The IBM AT doesn't interest me a great deal because of its primitive 
OS
and bland hardware. But, it is interesting from a historical 
perspective,

because it was so successful in the market.


The only interest of the IBM is that it his the grandaddy of your 
actual PCs. Nothing changed from this time for the PC technology.



Anyway, this afternoon, I put my AT face to face my Lisa.




On one side,  Lisa 2 (upgraded Lisa 1) with 2 Mb of RAM, one parallel 
card, an 5 Mb Profile with  MacOs 4 on it.
On the other side, the AT: 3,5 Mb of RAM, an EGA card, a 32 Mb hard 
drive with MSDOS 5.0 and Windows 3.1


Power up the Lisa is a matter of expert: plug keyboard and mouse; plug 
the cable between Lisa and Profile, plug power cord, start the Profile 
-waiting 3 mn for 'ready' LED, then start the Lisa, hold on Apple key-3 
key. Enjoy macOs 4. I found Excel 1 and Word 3 on the disk. Not too 
much noisy. Look great !


For the AT, plug the monitor, plug power cord, plug keyboard and mouse 
(Microsoft one). Start the engine (litterally: high noise, the 5,25 
hard drive made an loud noise, fan, etc... Even the keyboard 'click' 
awfully ;) ). Wait 3 minute for the AT to test memory... Enjoy Windows 
3, with Excel 2 and Word 3 for windows.


Nothing to do, I still prefer Apple stuff!

This was also time to try to repair the disk drive of my Lisa: see 
separate post.



jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by <http://lowendmac.com/> and...

Shop buy.com and save. <http://lowendmac.com/ad/buy.com.html>

 Support Low End Mac <http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html>

LisaList info:  <http://lowendmac.com/lists/lisa.html>
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  <mailto:lisalist@mail.maclaunch.com>
To unsubscribe, email:  <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
For digest mode, email: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subscription questions: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Archive: <http://www.mail-archive.com/lisalist%40mail.maclaunch.com/>

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: The PC Junk Challenge

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 25 févr. 06, à 16:35, John Woodall a écrit :

I hereby issue a PC Junk Challenge. Since this hardware is so 
unbelievably valuable...I make the following offer. I have in my 
current PC Dumpster stack 2 IBM XTs, 1 IBM XT Case, 2 Original IBM 
PCs..one with an internal 3.5 disk drive, and 1 PC AT. Also 2 IBM Mono 
Monitors and 3 IBM Original Keyboards. I offer all of this stuff for 
free to anyone willing to do the following..

I haven't an original PC nor XT in my collection...:(
#1. Come and pick it up. You must take all of it. No pick and choose. 
Or #2. You arrange for the freight, prepay the freight cost and 
arrange for pickup. I will strap it all onto a pallet for you. The 
pallet is free ;-) All the units appear undamaged but I will not take 
any time to apply power or do any evaluation. But hey This stuff 
has such intrinsic value...this is the offer of a lifetime!

Unfortunately, I'm too far !
Any takers? Oh yes, if you have posted a personal attack against 
me and want this stuff, you need to post an apology to this 
group...then you can have ALL of this magnificant hardware. Heck, I 
will throw in the rare and also valuable IBM PC Manual! Still in the 
original binder! WOW!

So, who wants it??? If no one steps up...it is dumpster bound.



jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: PC Crap

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 24 févr. 06, à 21:14, [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit :


The IBM AT doesn't interest me a great deal because of its primitive OS
and bland hardware. But, it is interesting from a historical 
perspective,

because it was so successful in the market.


The only interest of the IBM is that it his the grandaddy of your 
actual PCs. Nothing changed from this time for the PC technology.




The inclusion of a working
hard disk seems to add value to the unit.


My AT have a working 32 Mb drive, 3 Mb of RAM and an EGA card/monitor.


Lisa owners know about how vital
a working vintage hard disk is!

Yes !


Does anyone have experience with 80186 machines? That was the black 
sheep

of the family, like Motorolla's 68010. ;)
Yes, I have a French computer, a Goupil G4, I think none of you had 
ever heard about ;). It have a 8 Mhz 80186, a working 5 Mb Hard Drive.
This computer was the faster PC at the time it was launched. It was 
also more expensive than the IBM at the same time ;) because 
essentially built for french administration.
An impressive system that actually run Microsoft Windows 1.0 (yes, it 
does !). I cannot compare to LisaOS, as my Lisa run only MacOs.

Jerome




--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Free IBM AT

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 24 févr. 06, à 04:15, Chris M a écrit :


Im sure some of those stories would prove very
interesting. How about publishing memoirs ;)? What
could be said, and this will seem in stark contrast to
my prior rambling, is that the AT was THE machine for
its time. The Lisa was the machine for ANOTHER time.



The Lisa is a sort of UFO in the microcomputer history. In fact, it's 
not a microcomputer, to my mind. It's much closer to a 'minicomputer' 
in it's conception (separate cards, esay replacement of part). This 
conception made his cost too high and kill him.


Jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Free IBM AT

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 24 févr. 06, à 03:44, Justaname a écrit :

My opinion as an Apple employee at the time (79 to 86 in MIS) supports 
your opinion.  It was just plain hubris that John Couch's team thought 
they knew what people needed (not what they wanted).  I just don't 
have the energy to regale the list with stories from meetings with 
Lisa development staff.  Don't misunderstand.


Oh, please, tell us more ! There where so much story about Lisa !
These were very bright and hardworking people.  We had all be blinded 
to some degree by our successes.  We just thought we could do it all 
and do it alone.  We didn't get it.


Jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Free IBM AT

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 23 févr. 06, à 18:50, Jason Perkins a écrit :

I don't know if you guys are into collecting vintage PCs at all, but I 
just got a free IBM AT that I simply don't have the time to mess with 
or room to store. It's got 512k of ram, a 286 (w/ the co proc I think, 
I'll have to look), a VGA card of that vintage, and a 20M Seagate disk 
(not a Computer Memories unit :( ), and the usual 5 1/2" disk. The 
case is in very nice shape, the front plastic is not faded.


I can send you pictures if you like. It's all original.. I would like 
to keep it, but I really need to do some invatory reduction.




Lisa and IBM PC AT...Both famous historicals systems ;). I have both of 
them, it's really a pity to compare them !


Apart the weight, may be ;)


Jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: ROM versions

[Jerome Vernet]

To what I read, the ROM version is in two part: CPU ROM/IO ROM

So, D/A8 seams to be for an upgraded Lisa 1 to Lisa 2 (that what mine  
is, according to it's last owner). H/A8 stand for a Lisa 2/5.


One thing about my Lisa: the guy who sell it to me -about 250$- said  
that they trashed, 2 years ago, 10 Lisa, at least two of them was Lisa  
1, the rest was upgraded Lisa. They also trashed all the parts that was  
before the upgrade, CPU, card, Twiggy drives, Profile, printer


Argh...


Jerome

Le 23 nov. 05, à 01:36, Scott Lewis a écrit :


Hi all,

Rev. D is a Twiggy ROM. My Lisa 1 comes up with D/40 during bootup.

Scott

On Nov 20, 2005, at 6:06 AM, James MacPhail wrote:


This second board as a different ROM version (H/A8) athough the first
one is D/A8.


The "H" is the CPU board ROM version. The "A8" is the I/O board ROM  
version.


I believe Rev. D is the first version released to support the single  
3.5"
floppy drive configuration (ie. the Lisa 2). Earlier revisions were  
for the

dual 5" "twiggy" drive configuration (ie. the Lisa 1).

Rev. H is the last version that will run the Lisa Office System.

After that, there is a 3A version (which is part of the Macintosh XL  
screen
modification kit). This changes the screen resolution to provide  
square
pixels so that Macintosh software looks more like a Macintosh. With  
the 3A

ROM version installed you cannot run the Lisa Office System.

The various MacWorks Plus and MacWorks Plus II versions work with  
both 3A

and H ROM versions (and possibly D-G too).

MacWorks XL 3.0 comes in two varieties -- you have to use the one that
corresponds to the square pixel rev. 3A ROM if that is installed.


Is there any real differences ? Which one is better ?
When started with the H/A8 board, the Lisa will only ask to boot on
drive 2, although it let choose Drive 1 (which does'nt exist ?) and
Drive 2.


The "ghost of Floppy 1" in the "Startup From" menu is, I think the  
only
obvious difference. I don't recall off-hand what other "bug fixes"  
there

are. I would suggest using Rev H or 3A.

Maybe someone else has a list of the ROM differences handy?

James

James MacPhail   "Think not of engineering as art,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] but of art as engineering"
Sigma Seven Systems Ltd.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]



--  
LisaList is sponsored by  and...


Shop buy.com and save. 

  Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
  --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com



--  
LisaList is sponsored by  and...


Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com
--- 

Wanadoo vous informe que cet  e-mail a ete controle par l'anti-virus  
mail.Aucun virus connu a ce jour par nos services n'a ete detecte.








--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa 2: Bad Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 20 nov. 05, à 12:42, James MacPhail a écrit :



*but* despite all my effort, the diske drive remain not functionnal. 
It

make some noise at startup, like if head are blocked... I will try
again to dismantle it and grease everywhere again... May be somebody
have a spare diske drive ? Or Macintosh drive may work ?


The 400K drive is the same as in the 128K and 512K Macintosh, so if you
have one of those (and it sounds like you do), you could connect it to 
see

if it works.
Yes, I have a 128 and a 512k macintosh. Do you think that a 800k drive 
from a Mac Plus -less value than the 128 or 512 ;)- will work, at least 
as a 400 k drive ?


Other than the sticky grease problem, check to see if the pressure pad 
is
still on the drive. It is a small felt pad opposite the read/write 
head,

when a disk is inserted, it is the thing that holds the magnetic disk
against the head.


I saw the presure Pad, seems to be OK.

In fact, the drive don't spin, or try to spin then go off, and Lisa 
eject the disk with Error 23 or IO board error 39 (timeout).


This is done with both IO card.


Jerome 



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa won't stay off (was Lisa 2: Bad Disk Drive)

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 12 nov. 05, à 00:33, James MacPhail a écrit :



This was an aside to another problem, so it looks like it didn't get 
any

attention:


when I switch the Lisa off, it goes off then on immediately.


I have seen a couple of causes for this problem, ones that come to 
mind are:


1) Damaged (broken) traces on the I/O Board due to corrosion from 
leaking

batteries.

After removing battery, and cleaning as much as I can the board, it's 
OK !


I also clean all socket.


Great !

More over, I test second second board (Cage, CPU, IO, 2 RAM Card and 
one // card) and it's working also :happy:.


This second board as a different ROM version (H/A8) athough the first 
one is D/A8. Is there any real differences ? Which one is better ?


When started with the H/A8 board, the Lisa will only ask to boot on 
drive 2, although it let choose Drive 1 (which does'nt exist ?) and 
Drive 2.


Both Profile start on MacOs.

*but* despite all my effort, the diske drive remain not functionnal. It 
make some noise at startup, like if head are blocked... I will try 
again to dismantle it and grease everywhere again... May be somebody 
have a spare diske drive ? Or Macintosh drive may work ?



Lisa is my best piece of old computers, far away from my other Apple 
pieces likes Apple II, macintosh 128 What a beautiful thing !



Jerome 



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa won't stay off (was Lisa 2: Bad Disk Drive)

[Jerome Vernet]

Thank you, I will try.

Jerome
Le 12 nov. 05, à 00:33, James MacPhail a écrit :



This was an aside to another problem, so it looks like it didn't get  
any

attention:


when I switch the Lisa off, it goes off then on immediately.


I have seen a couple of causes for this problem, ones that come to  
mind are:


1) Damaged (broken) traces on the I/O Board due to corrosion from  
leaking

batteries.

If your I/O Board once had batteries on it, check the continuity of the
traces in that area carefully.

If it still has batteries on it, you should probably remove them and  
clean
the circuit board in that area before battery leakage causes (more)  
damage.


The battery is not required for startup or operation of the Lisa; it is
only to keep the clock running and preserve some preference settings in
RAM. Unlike a modern computer whose clock can run from the battery for
years with no external power, the Lisa battery only lasts for a few  
hours

when external power is interrupted.

2) Bad COPS, or perhaps poor contact with its socket.

It may be enough to remove and re-insert the COPS to improve the  
connection.


If not, replace the COPS with one from another I/O board... if it still
doesn't work, then it probably isn't the COPS.

3) A couple of other parts on the I/O board can fail causing this sort  
of

problem, so if the above don't help, let us know and we can start
trouble-shooting.

Good luck!

James

James MacPhail   "Think not of engineering as art,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] but of art as engineering"
Sigma Seven Systems Ltd.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]



--  
LisaList is sponsored by  and...


Shop buy.com and save. 

  Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
  --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com
--- 

Wanadoo vous informe que cet  e-mail a ete controle par l'anti-virus  
mail.

Aucun virus connu a ce jour par nos services n'a ete detecte.







--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Re: Lisa 2: Bad Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Le 6 nov. 05, à 12:54, Philip Lord a écrit :

I think you need the upgraded roms to use 800k drives. I can't tell if 
you have theses.


I don't really want to use the 800k drive as a 800k, but as a 400k. My 
Lisa -an Lisa upgraded system- have D/A8 ROM, so no 800k support.


I saw the pics. The first think I would do is remove the leaking 
batteries from the I/O board, and clean the area below. Do this soon 
or the leaking acid will destroy your board.


That exactly what's I'm currently doing ;)! I train myself on the 
second CPU board -I received my Lisa with an additional PSU, additional 
CPU/IO/RAM/ and // board-.


Thanks for your help.


Phil





--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com

Lisa 2: Bad Disk Drive

[Jerome Vernet]

Hi,

After years, I finally get a Lisa 2. It come with 2 working Profile 5 
Mb, loaded with Macwork (?) and MacOs 5.

I Have two problems:
- the 3,5" disk drive seem to be dead. Make some noise at startup, but 
do not spin... I've dismantle it, cleaning grease, add grease, but no 
way Like if the head driver was dead.
Can I put a 800k drive from a MacPlus in it ? Even if it will be 
recognized as a 400k drive.


- the "on/off" switch: when I switch the Lisa off, it go off then on 
immediatly.


Any advice ?

My Lisa: http://perso.wanadoo.fr/jerome.vernet/specs/lisa.htm


Jerome



--
LisaList is sponsored by  and...

Shop buy.com and save. 

 Support Low End Mac 

LisaList info:  
 --> AOL users, remove "mailto:";
Send list messages to:  
To unsubscribe, email:  
For digest mode, email: 
Subscription questions: 
Archive: 

iPod Accessories for Less
at 1-800-iPOD.COM
Fast Delivery, Low Price, Good Deal
www.1800ipod.com