Re: [rework docs] a new round of asking and proposing - part two: proposals 1-5
On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 11:48:33PM +0200, Uwe St?hr wrote: > 1. The last months I teached LyX to some colleagues and they all > complained that there is no button in the toolbar for "view/update dvi". > Therefore I designed a new toolbar with new buttons. It looks like in > the attached file toolbar.png. I added two buttons for dvi, one button > for export->pdf, the search and find button, and the button for > depth-decrement. > The latter because nobody understands why we have a button for > depth-increment but not for decrement. > I tested this toolbar for the last month while reworking the userguide, > and I find it very ergonomic. What is your opinion? > (I attached the xpm for the new buttons) Any toolbar changes need to be against current 1.4cvs (which includes, for example, both depth-decrement and depth-increment). There is no view dvi/pdf, but I'm not too happy with two buttons a piece for view/update. I've completely forgotten the mechanism and the code for how update works, but it's not really suitable to have both in a toolbar (unless we add an off-by-default 'Export' toolbar or something). > 2. We should strictly separate > - emphasize and italic > - noun and small caps > Emphasize and noun are logical attributes and every document class can > define its own font for them. Work has started on this in 1.4cvs (much, much more work to do). Explicit modification of italic etc. is eventually going to go away altogether in favour of styles. > 3. A minor change in the Layout->Document->Layout dialog: > + paragraph separation > - separation > Because I noticed that newbies don't understand what to separate. Fixed in Qt frontend at least in 1.4cvs regards john
Re: [rework docs] reasons, plans, questions
On Sat, Jan 08, 2005 at 08:35:11PM +0100, Uwe St?hr wrote: > The UserGuide will also have a short section about needed programs > and install issues for the platforms Linux/Unix, Mac and Win. IMO, whilst such docs would be great, the User Guide is the wrong place for it. I'd prefer such stuff to be on the website / wiki, plus a plain ASCII file in the tarball regards john
Re: LyX: questions and comments from a new LyX user
On Fri, May 14, 2004 at 06:48:11PM -0400, Demaree, Loren wrote: > encountered during reading and learning by practice in the Introduction, > Tutorial, and User's Guide: > > reference to the "Document->Settings" apparently intending or not yet > reflecting the interface revision to "Layout->Document" You seem to have accidentally checked out the 1.4.0cvs version of the docs from CVS and tried to apply them to 1.3.x LyX. regards john
Re: patch for UserGuide.lyx / bug 996
On Fri, Jul 18, 2003 at 08:02:55PM +0200, Christian Ridderstr?m wrote: > Argh.. ok, there was a 'a' missing, here's another patch... Applied. (btw a change log entry would be great next time) thanks john
Re: patch for UserGuide.lyx / bug 996
On Sun, Jul 20, 2003 at 11:00:48PM +0200, Christian Ridderstr?m wrote: > Ok, since the last mail didn't seem to make it, I'm sending the patch > again. Applied in my tree. I can't yet commit until the lyx machines are back up and running. I guess this is one spot I missed the old menu :) thanks john
Re: patch for UserGuide.lyx / bug 996
On Fri, Jul 18, 2003 at 08:02:55PM +0200, Christian Ridderstr?m wrote: > Argh.. ok, there was a 'a' missing, here's another patch... This will have to wait for JMarc. In the meantime, can you do a version for current CVS, where the menu entry is "Edit->Paragraph Settings" ? thanks joohn
Re: minor doc correction
On Sun, Mar 09, 2003 at 10:20:15PM -0800, Todd Lyons wrote: > There are a few places in your documentation where you are doing a list > and have "item1, item2, item3, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera". Now I > remember this after being scolded by an English teacher, that only one > et cetera is allowed per sentence. Heh, OK I'll fix it. JMarc, which version of LyX do I need to use on the trunk lyx-docs ? john
Re: LyX 1.2.0, even more problems/mistakes
On Thu, Sep 12, 2002 at 01:45:12PM +0200, Hartmut Haase wrote: > Index: if you put an index between a word and a label, the index tabel shows >word+label. I think I fixed this in 1.2.1 regards john -- "This *is* Usenet, after all, where virtually every conversation that goes on is fairly ludicrous in the first place." - Godwin's Law FAQ
Re: LyX 1.2.0, more problems/mistakes
On Sun, Sep 08, 2002 at 10:05:03AM +0200, Hartmut Haase wrote: > Menu Separator: if it is underlined accidentally, it is NOT visible in LyX, >therefore hard to find in the output. Please file a bug at bugzilla.lyx.org > pop-up menus: you cannot delete text with del, only with <--. Known xforms problem. > pulldown menus: if you click on a menu, then see it was the wrong one, then move the >mouse > right or left to get another one, the first pulldown stays open. This is different >on most window managers, e. g. KDE. Known (and VERY annoying) xforms problem > Bearbeiten->Einstellungen->Umwamdlungen->Formate: "All formats" should read "Alle >Formate". > > Bearbeiten->Einstellungen->Umwamdlungen->Formatkonvertierung: "All converters" >should read > "Alle Konvertierer". Would be helpful if you could say where these are for English speaking hackers to find and fix :) regards john -- "Are you willing to go out there and save the lives of our children, even if it means losing your own life ? Yes I am. I believe you, Jeru... you're ready."
Re: FW: LyX 1.2.0, german documentation
On Thu, Aug 22, 2002 at 02:24:11PM +0200, Lasgouttes, J.M. wrote: > I forward to this list a mail from Hartmut Haase who > reviewed the UserGuide. Most of his remarks are certainly > valid and it would be nice if somebody could update the UserGuide > accordingly. I've dealt with most of these (by removing stuff mainly ;) It would be really good if we could find somebody to help with these updates: the manuals are SERIOUSLY out of date. Thanks for the suggestions Hartmut. regards john
Re: "Tabular"/"Tabular Material" vs. "Table"
On Mon, Jun 24, 2002 at 10:26:29AM -0700, Mike Ressler wrote:
> Now that floating figures and tables have been moved off into their own
> submenu (Insert->Floats->Table), this isn't so big a deal anymore, but
> then people will ask "What's the difference between Insert->Table and
> Insert->Floats->Table?".
This question isn't magically solved by using a construct like Tabular
Material, which is in fact triply ambiguous.
I think the concept of floats containing content is intuitive and
well-documented enough for the natural phrasing to not be a problem.
> the garbage disposal in my kitchen sink ("Honey, what's this tabular
> material growing out of the disposal?").
heh :)
regards
john
--
"If a thing is not diminished by being shared, it is not rightly owned if
it is only owned & not shared."
- St. Augustine
"Tabular"/"Tabular Material" vs. "Table"
JMarc suggested I ask here about this terminology. My question is, what is our justificatino for exposing the user to the unusual formulation "Tabular Material", or the even worse "Tabular" ? What are the problems with using "Table" everywhere throughout the GUI and the documentation (except where specifically related to the LaTeX construct) ? thanks john -- "If a thing is not diminished by being shared, it is not rightly owned if it is only owned & not shared." - St. Augustine
Re: Could you please document (when you have the time) the keyboardshortcuts in LyX
On Sun, Jun 16, 2002 at 06:21:21PM +1000, Guru - wrote: > Could you please document (when you have the time) the keyboardshortcuts in > LyX. There are lots of them and they're extremly useful but it would be > good if you had a manual devoted to listing all of them (or most of them) > Thanks. We do have a manual (Reference.lyx) but it's out of date. regards john -- "If a thing is not diminished by being shared, it is not rightly owned if it is only owned & not shared." - St. Augustine
Re: LyX and figure/table floats
On Wed, Jun 05, 2002 at 02:19:42PM +0200, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > Did you try to set the layout of the (empty) paragraph to 'Caption'? This is the fifth or so user now. Perhaps we should make this change ? regards john -- "Do you mean to tell me that "The Prince" is not the set textbook for CS1072 Professional Issues ? What on earth do you learn in that course ?" - David Lester
Re: hebrew introduction
On Fri, May 31, 2002 at 05:13:23PM +0300, Gady Kozma wrote: > Since there were no objections to my Hebrew translation of the > introduction, could somebody put it in the CVS? Done, sorry for the delay. We'll need to udpate it to 1.2 format at some point ... john -- "Do you mean to tell me that "The Prince" is not the set textbook for CS1072 Professional Issues ? What on earth do you learn in that course ?" - David Lester
Re: Romanian translation of splash.lyx
On Mon, May 20, 2002 at 01:02:59AM +0300, Adrian Penisoara wrote: > I have attached a translation of the splash file in Romanian. It uses > the latin2 encoding and romanian language for the document layout. I converted this to 1.2 format and added it - it should appear in lyx 1.2.0 regards john -- "I never understood what's so hard about picking a unique first and last name - and not going beyond the 6 character limit." - Toon Moene
Re: fonts
On Mon, May 20, 2002 at 02:01:11AM +0300, Robin wrote: > Is there any reason why my fonts HOWTO isn't the documentation for LyX > 1.2pre5? Does it suck or what? It is merely lack of time. I have a bug open on it. Perhaps Mike could have a look at it for general style issues, if there are any, and correctness http://bugzilla.lyx.org/show_bug.cgi?id=269 regards john -- "It is very difficult to prophesy, especially when it pertains to the future." - Patrick Kurzawe
Re: The LyX Tutorial with 1.2.0pre4
On Mon, Apr 29, 2002 at 09:57:10PM -0500, David Green wrote: > p10, section 2.1.3, there is a "See Section ??" for more WYSIWYM > ... Thanks for these. I've fixed them. Please report anything else you spot :) regards john -- "Please let's not resume the argument with the usual whining about how this feature will wipe out humanity or bring us to the promised land." - Charles Campbell on magic words in Subject: headers
Re: Dates for TeX and LaTeX
On Sun, Mar 10, 2002 at 07:35:44PM +0100, Herbert Voss wrote: > because there is no "official" version of the first > TeX. Knuth started in 1970 and it took nearly ten years > until the first TeX was "bugfree" ... > So all dates after 1977 until 1982 (second version) > maybe all right. I see, thanks Herbert. regards john -- I am a complete moron for forgetting about endianness. May I be forever marked as such.
Re: Dates for TeX and LaTeX
On Sun, Mar 10, 2002 at 06:49:26PM +0100, Herbert Voss wrote: > TeX first published version: 1977 so is tex.ac.uk FAQ wrong ? Are you sure about this ? When should the docs say that Knuth created TeX ? thanks john -- I am a complete moron for forgetting about endianness. May I be forever marked as such.
Re: Dates for TeX and LaTeX
On Thu, Feb 21, 2002 at 12:03:38AM +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Nicolas tells me that TeX has been first published in 1978, and LaTeX in 1982, > and I agree that there is a big difference with the values in the manuals > (1984 and 1985). I've fixed the Knuth date (can I get commit for lyxdocs ? Do I already have it ? I'm going to update all the docs for loading OK into current CVS ...) > The second one is mentioned in > http://www.grappa.univ-lille3.fr/FAQ-LaTeX/1.1.html but latex-project.org says 1985, so I've left this as is for now regards john -- I am a complete moron for forgetting about endianness. May I be forever marked as such.
Re: forms.h problem fixed!
On Fri, Feb 01, 2002 at 11:26:07PM -0700, Reed Loefgren wrote: > The "Missing forms.h" issue is a known failure (I missed it when I flew > through the source docs.) It appears when one does not have, at least, > the kernel header files installed. I had the full kernel source > installed but had recently done a "make mrproper" on them. This wipes > out some symlinks that lyx's configure script uses. Do a "make symlinks" > in the kernel source directory and you should be fine. Note this is irrelevant on any remotely recent Linux distribution. regards john -- ""DoIt or cancel? I'm not a dolt!" - A User
Re: Current Status?
On Mon, Nov 05, 2001 at 10:59:31AM -0500, George De Bruin wrote: > You chopped off a major part that I was responding to: oops ;) > If, under other toolkits, this dialog is layed out differently, groupings > change, or some of the features work differently (say, the margin boxes use > spin boxes in addition to straight input boxes), this will have a significant > impact on the documentation. it certainly will. And it is something I can't solve well ;) regards john -- "All this just amounts to more grist for the mill of the ill." - Elizabeth Wurtzel
Re: Current Status?
On Sat, Nov 03, 2001 at 03:48:29PM -0500, George De Bruin wrote: > > there is e.g. a boolean flag, it will be in both dialogs. > > One of the problems with this is that we aren't documenting to the coding of > the dialogs. We are documenting to the visual aspects, and the individual > functionalities of the dialogs (and for that matter, the menus). So, when > the layout and arrangement of them changes, even if they are minimal and/or > intuitive, the documentation must reflect it. Yes, this amounts to > hand-holding, IMO. However, this also one of the reasons why there is a huge > market for aftermarket books: to hand hold the user through the user > interface of a program. I wasn't talking about code anyway: if there is an on/off switch, it will be in all the dialogs. But yes, where the lyx docs team do need to mention specifics in dialogs is going to be a problem... regards john -- "Homosexuals can't swim, they attract enemy radar, they attract sharks, they insist on being seated at the Captain's table, they get up late, they muck about." - Naval commander
Re: Current Status?
On Fri, Nov 02, 2001 at 02:18:35PM -0800, Mike Ressler wrote: > Aiighh! I smell disaster in the air! Are the xforms/qt2 differences just > because qt2 hasn't "caught up" to the xforms style yet, or are the > differences truly permanent? Mostly permanent. The reasoning is simple: it's far easier to work on the interface in Qt2 than it is with xforms. So personally when I "improve" things[1] I don't tend to do so in xforms too, sometimes because it's tedious, and sometimes because it's basically far too painful / nearly impossible. [1] a lot of my changes are prolly bad or incomplete, I want people to test them ... > This will make the CUA vs. emacs keybindings > issue seem utterly trivial if they are permanently different. For now, > let's declare the xforms version to be "correct", and the only one to be > documented. this makes perfect sense. I would hope that the Qt2 dialogs are intuitive enough to not need documentation. Remeber the dialogs have the same responsibilities, so if there is e.g. a boolean flag, it will be in both dialogs. regards john -- "I'm dismayed whenever libertarianism and programming are associated; in my mind, it is as nebulous as associating people who write books as communists or those who read newspapers as capitalists." - graydon
Re: Current Status?
On Fri, Nov 02, 2001 at 02:08:03PM -0500, Amir Karger wrote: > manual? Hm, I guess so, if the basic way a dialog works is going to be > different in the different systems. the problem is the manual whilst describing e.g. bibtex, is going to want to describe how to add to the bibtex databases. This is/will be different in different frontends I don't have any good suggestions. john -- "I'm dismayed whenever libertarianism and programming are associated; in my mind, it is as nebulous as associating people who write books as communists or those who read newspapers as capitalists." - graydon
Re: Current Status?
On Fri, Nov 02, 2001 at 12:34:00PM -0500, George De Bruin wrote: > Oooh, is that dependent on different toolkits? (ie QT / GTK+?) Or is it true > for the standard xforms interface too? xforms has the option. Qt2 frontend is always modeless unless specifically asked for. I think the vague rule is : document content dialogs default to modeless, others may or may not be, depending on situation. > (This would bring up a whole *other* issue of what we need to document for > different interfaces...) This is a very difficult problem for the manuals. Already qt2 and xforms differ rather a lot on certain dialogs. However, it's also something that can be postponed ;) regards john -- "I'm dismayed whenever libertarianism and programming are associated; in my mind, it is as nebulous as associating people who write books as communists or those who read newspapers as capitalists." - graydon
Re: Current Status?
On Fri, Nov 02, 2001 at 12:08:29PM -0500, George De Bruin wrote: > Query: do we mention anyhwere in the Intro or Tutorial that most dialogs are > not modal in LyX? That is, do we explain any place that most dialogs can > actually stay open while you actually work on your document. That's warning: this is config-dependent in 1.2.0 > something that is very different from most of the similar products out there, > and I think it should be mentioned. What applications have such modal dialogs ? Why aren't they fixed yet ;) > - First deal with the "popups" changes, then send you a patch. > - Second: go through and look for dialog / menu changes. (Send another patch) > - Third: if I find other substantial changes, go back and work on them. > > The third part is where I think we're more likely to encounter the moving > targets, so it's best to hold back a little and see how things shape up. cool ! thanks john -- "I'm dismayed whenever libertarianism and programming are associated; in my mind, it is as nebulous as associating people who write books as communists or those who read newspapers as capitalists." - graydon
Re: Killing of a BUGS.lyx - The Revenge
On Mon, Oct 29, 2001 at 06:27:29PM +0100, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > Yes. Should the URLs use URL inset? yup :) john -- "If the software that a company produces isn't reliable, adding a bunch of 'Mother, may I' rules to the language and the code won't fix it." - Pete Becker
Re: Killing of a BUGS.lyx - The Revenge
On Mon, Oct 29, 2001 at 05:03:20PM +0100, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > It is amusing that your new and improved Intro.lyx mentions the > defunct BUGS.lyx file. eek - missed that. Fixed - is it OK otherwise ? john -- "If the software that a company produces isn't reliable, adding a bunch of 'Mother, may I' rules to the language and the code won't fix it." - Pete Becker
Killing of a BUGS.lyx - The Revenge
here is a re-worked intro.lyx with the useful stuff from BUGS.lyx
If it is OKed I will commit it.
Episode 3 is cvs remove -f BUGS.lyx, and website updates
thanks
john
p.s. should lyxtips on website direct to help/ subdir now ???
--
"If the software that a company produces isn't reliable, adding a bunch of
'Mother, may I' rules to the language and the code won't fix it."
- Pete Becker
#LyX 1.2 created this file. For more info see http://www.lyx.org/
\lyxformat 220
\textclass book
\language english
\inputencoding default
\fontscheme default
\graphics default
\paperfontsize default
\spacing single
\papersize Default
\paperpackage a4
\use_geometry 0
\use_amsmath 0
\use_natbib 0
\use_numerical_citations 0
\paperorientation portrait
\secnumdepth 2
\tocdepth 2
\paragraph_separation indent
\defskip medskip
\quotes_language english
\quotes_times 2
\papercolumns 1
\papersides 2
\paperpagestyle default
\layout Title
Introduction to LyX
\layout Author
by John Weiss and the LyX Team
\layout Standard
\begin_inset LatexCommand \tableofcontents{}
\end_inset
\layout Chapter
The Philosophy of LyX
\layout Quote
\begin_inset Quotes eld
\end_inset
Uncle Cosmo, why do they call this a word processor?
\begin_inset Quotes erd
\end_inset
\layout Quote
\begin_inset Quotes eld
\end_inset
It's simple, Skyler.
You've seen what food processors do to food, right?
\begin_inset Quotes erd
\end_inset
\layout Quote
\hfill
--- Jeff MacNelly in
\begin_inset Quotes eld
\end_inset
Shoe
\begin_inset Quotes erd
\end_inset
\layout Section
What is LyX?
\layout Standard
LyX is a document preparation system.
It excels at letting you create complex technical and scientific articles
with mathematics, cross-references, bibliographies, indices, etc.
It is very good at documents of any length in which the usual processing
abilities are required: automatic sectioning and pagination, spellchecking,
and so forth.
It can also be used to write a letter to your mom, though granted, there
are probably simpler programs available for that.
It is definitely not the best tool for creating banners, flyers, or advertiseme
nts (we'll explain why later), though with some effort all these can be
done, too.
Some examples of what it is used for: memos, letters, dissertations and
theses, lecture notes, seminar notebooks, conference proceedings, software
documentation, books (on PostgreSQL, remote sensing, cryptology, fictional
novels, poetry, and even a children's book or two), articles in refereed
scientific journals, scripts for plays and movies, business proposals \SpecialChar
\ldots{}
you get the idea.
\layout Standard
LyX is a program that provides a modern approach to writing documents with
a computer by using a markup language paradigm, an approach that breaks
with the obsolete tradition of the
\begin_inset Quotes eld
\end_inset
typewriter concept.
\begin_inset Quotes erd
\end_inset
It is designed for authors who want professional output quickly with a
minimum of effort without becoming specialists in typesetting.
The job of typesetting is done mostly by the computer, not the author;
with LyX, the author can concentrate on the contents of her writing.
\layout Standard
Part of the initial challenge of using LyX comes from the change in thinking
that you, the user, must make.
At one time, all we had for creating documents were typewriters, so we
all learned certain tricks to get around their limitations.
Underlining, which is little more than overstriking with the
\begin_inset Quotes eld
\end_inset
_
\begin_inset Quotes erd
\end_inset
character, became a way to emphasize text.
You were forced to figure out column sizes and tab stops, and set them,
before creating a table.
The same applied for letters and other right justified text.
Hyphenation at the end of a line required a careful eye and a lot of foresight.
\layout Standard
In other words, we've all been trained to worry about the little details
of which character goes where.
Consequently, almost all word processors have this mentality.
They still use tab stops for adding whitespace.
You still need to worry about exactly where on the page something will
appear.
Emphasizing text means changing a font, similar to changing the typewriter
wheel.
This is the underlying philosophy of a WYSIWYG word processor:
\begin_inset Quotes eld
\end_inset
What You See Is What You Get
\begin_inset Quotes erd
\end_inset
.
Unfortunately, that paradigm often results in
\begin_inset Quotes eld
\end_inset
What You See Is All You Get
\begin_inset Quotes erd
\end_inset
.
\layout Standard
This is where LyX differs from an ordinary word processor.
You don't concern yourself with what character goes where.
You tell LyX
\emph on
what you're doing
\emph default
and LyX takes care of the rest, following a set of rules called a
\emph on
style.
\emph default
\begin_inset Foot
collapsed true
\layout Standard
To be fair,
Re: Small update to BUGS.lyx
On Tue, Oct 23, 2001 at 05:30:29PM +0100, Angus Leeming wrote: > Attached... I'd rather remove this file anyway. It in no way represents the real major issues with lyx (the tracker + michael's list come a little closer) hopefully, there shouldn't be anything valid in the file that isn't in the tracker regards john -- "If the software that a company produces isn't reliable, adding a bunch of 'Mother, may I' rules to the language and the code won't fix it." - Pete Becker
Re: I'm still here too + revised docs
On Thu, Sep 13, 2001 at 01:21:24PM -0700, Mike Ressler wrote: > and would like people to tear them apart and offer suggestions/ > corrections. If they look okay, then the translators should begin The sentence : To create a table, you figured out beforehand how big each column was to be and set the appropriate tab stops. sounds awkward to me. I would prefer : You were forced to figure out column sizes and tab stops before creating a table. Or something like that. It's warranty not warrantee (not sure) shouldn't it be "The LyX team know" not "The LyX team knows" IMHO, I don't see the point in the entire "stability" section anyway. But it looks good to me ! regards john -- "Who can afford to do professional work for nothing ? What hobbyist can put 3-man years into programming, finding all bugs, documenting his product and distribute for free ?" - Bill Gates
Re: Fonts
On Mon, Sep 10, 2001 at 06:27:41PM +0300, Robin Turner wrote: > Would the doc team be interested in a section on using different fonts to go > in "Extended features"? I have a piece which might be suitable, covering > changing the default font (to use fonts not available in the popup), using > more than one font family in the same document and installing TeX fonts. this sounds like a great idea ! regards john -- "Since when would the sizeof any kind of pointer be zero ? Have you built a zero-bit CPU ?" - Jeffrey Turner
Re: A couple of comments on the new docs
On Mon, Sep 03, 2001 at 10:27:25PM -0400, John Weiss wrote: > during kindergarten.) So, "DocStyle" tends towards the shrill, > because the volunteers wouldn't bother to listen to my polite > requests. Sad but true. I don't doubt that was true then, but I don't think we should a priori assume new people will be like that :) A good ol' Friday flame should have the same effect if necessary. > underneath Linus Torvalds. Sometimes excessive use can be a form of > sarcastic protest .) heh :) regards john -- "Do you mean to tell me that "The Prince" is not the set textbook for CS1072 Professional Issues ? What on earth do you learn in that course ?" - David Lester
Re: A couple of comments on the new docs
On Sun, Aug 26, 2001 at 10:27:38PM -0400, Larry Kollar wrote: > That's good to hear. Will it be "dialog box" or simply "dialog," or has > that been resolved yet? just "dialog" I think. Brvty s good ;) I'm not particular though. > The CVS from Thursday evening. ok regards john -- "Premature generalization is the root of all evil." - Karl Fogel
Re: A couple of comments on the new docs
On Fri, Aug 24, 2001 at 10:33:36PM -0400, Larry Kollar wrote: > - The comment about "'dialog' is a programmer term" is a bit dated. >Even st00p1d Mac users[1] know what a dialog box is. To me, "popup" >is a menu or tooltip. (Not that I think it will get changed, but actually, this will get changed. the doc team agreed some time ago to standardise on "dialog". In other words, I agree completely ;) > - The "put a (tm) after PostScript or we'll get sued" is also, shall >we say, shrill. Unless the team has been warned repeatedly, the worst Which version have you checked ? I think Mike has already made changes in the 1.2.0 CVS doc tree ... > I've noticed a couple of minor glitches here and there as I was > skimming online last night; I'll send edits when I get a little time > to dig in a bit deeper. great > [2] Notwithstanding the very dated presentation, but that's LaTeX's > fault. I would prefer the term "classic" ;) regards john -- "That's just kitten-eating wrong." - Richard Henderson
Re: Proposed reorg
On Thu, Aug 02, 2001 at 07:27:48AM -0400, Larry Kollar wrote: > Mike Ressler wrote: > > > Chapter 1 being a real Introduction; Tutorial and UG have had their > > introductory sections greatly reduced. Let me know what you think. > > > > BTW, you will need a recent LyX-cvs to read these. > > > By this, you mean I have to CVS & compile up the development > version of LyX to read them? Or CVS the documents themselves? > > Larry (he said, expecting the answer "yes") yes seriously, you'll need a current 1.2.0cvs version to read the new lyx docs. regards john -- "They didn't know what the symbols and paradoxes meant. Instead of following the finger that points to the moon, they sat down and worshipped the finger itself. Instead of following the map, they thought it was the territory and tried to live in it. Instead of reading the menu they tried to eat it. Dig ?" - Miss Portinari
Re: Proposed reorg
On Thu, Aug 02, 2001 at 10:50:30AM +0100, Angus Leeming wrote: > given a piece of wood that in cross-section is 2 inches by 4 inches. > > Applying a long length of wood of said cross section might cause considerable > damage if you held one end and swung the other. This is generally called a > club I believe. Very useful computer maintenance tool. such a device is also a useful user maintenance tool, whereby it is called a clue-by-four ... john -- "They didn't know what the symbols and paradoxes meant. Instead of following the finger that points to the moon, they sat down and worshipped the finger itself. Instead of following the map, they thought it was the territory and tried to live in it. Instead of reading the menu they tried to eat it. Dig ?" - Miss Portinari
Re: Proposed reorg
On Sun, Jul 29, 2001 at 09:22:10PM -0400, John Weiss wrote: > On Wed, Jul 25, 2001 at 09:28:34AM -0700, Mike Ressler wrote: > > > > > Also ditch the "DANGER DANGER" thing. It is NOT a good thing to have as the > > > Humorless lot > > > Ducking behind sofa... > bah, I'm not against humour, especially of the dark variety, I just think it shouldn't /terrify/ the user[1] john [1] perhaps I exaggerate a /little/ -- "I'd rather be rudely informed than politely left in the dark."
Re: Proposed reorg
On Sun, Jul 29, 2001 at 09:28:02PM -0400, John Weiss wrote: > > > how about "mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] or see the lyx.org website" ? > > > more accessible > > If you're going to move stuff out of Intro.lyx and into DocStyle.lyx, > then "DocStyle.lyx" needs to live in a more prominent location. How > about generating an HTML or PS version and putting it someplace on the > LyX website? Then the documentation can just make reference to a URL > and be done with it. this makes perfect sense to me. LyX has long needed a good section of the website about contributing anyway, and docs is no exception. regards john -- "I'd rather be rudely informed than politely left in the dark."
bibtex refs
extended tells me to not use the .bib extension, but in fact entering whatever.bib in the bibtex ref dialog works. john -- "I have been a soreheaded occupant of a file drawer labeled 'Science Fiction' ... and I would like out, particularly since so many serious critics regularly mistake the drawer for a urinal." - Kurt Vonnegut
Re: Proposed reorg
On Wed, Jul 25, 2001 at 10:36:36AM -0700, Mike Ressler wrote: > > > > a) not in the gui support > > b) useful for the user > > c) internal only > > > > or whatever > > This still sounds like a developers-only doc, not something for the > general user. "Getting rid of it" is probably too harsh - "moving > Reference to a developer directory, and deleting Help->ReferenceManual" is > really more what I have in mind. > > > I've not been clear enough. the new lyxfunc would automatically create a reference of the types tagged as useful to the user. > > Okay, I think I'll put forth a loud message decreeing 1.1.6 documentation > dead, then if you would be willing to start the popup->dialog > translation in the Tutorial, followed by the User Guide, I'll begin the > Intro rewrite. I'd still like to wait a day or two before beginning to > allow a few more comments on the reorg to filter in - particularly from > John W., if he is lurking about. I think the first thing that should be done with 1.2.0 docs is convert everything to 1.2.0 format. Then we can start making content changes. john -- "I have been a soreheaded occupant of a file drawer labeled 'Science Fiction' ... and I would like out, particularly since so many serious critics regularly mistake the drawer for a urinal." - Kurt Vonnegut
Re: Proposed reorg
On Wed, Jul 25, 2001 at 09:28:34AM -0700, Mike Ressler wrote:
> Excellent suggestion - I had forgotten about DocStyle :-) However,
> DocStyle is not typically installed, so I'd like to keep one line about it
> somewhere in the normal docs. ("If you would like to contribute, please
> see DocStyle.lyx in the .../lib/docs directory of the LyX tarball.")
how about "mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] or see the lyx.org website" ? more accessible
> > it rhymes, it must be true !
>
> Comes from having 3 kids 6 yr and younger ...
heh :)
> Horrendously out of date, and for a _typical_ user, not terribly helpful.
> Do non-developers really care that there is a
> "toggle-cursor-follows-scrollbar" function? Doubtful - they just want to
> know there is an option in Edit->Preferences that allows the cursor to
> follow the scrollbar (which should be in Customization). The
it would be handy if the new lyxfunc stuff when it arrives tags each one
as something of :
a) not in the gui support
b) useful for the user
c) internal only
or whatever
> It also appears as section 1.2 of Extended (Preparing a Bibliography with
> BibTeX). In the Intro, I'd like to list a few of the spiffy capabilities
> of LyX - this would be a Good Thing to mention there.
yep.
> Totally agree. Lot of work, but I'll make it happen.
I can do this sort of thing if you want to delegate parts ...
john
--
"I have been a soreheaded occupant of a file drawer labeled 'Science Fiction' ...
and I would like out, particularly since so many serious critics regularly
mistake the drawer for a urinal."
- Kurt Vonnegut
Re: Proposed reorg
On Tue, Jul 24, 2001 at 03:11:06PM -0700, Mike Ressler wrote: > Philosophy: the Intro should be an intro: it is assumed to be chapter 1 > for all other docs. Place less emphasis on doc team by changing that > section to an appendix. I would rather move all the stuff about contributing (other than reporting bugs) to DocStyle. This is often the first thing they read (it should be) and having this stuff here is just silly IMHO Also ditch the "DANGER DANGER" thing. It is NOT a good thing to have as the first page of an introduction. I'm not suggesting we hide the fact lyx is short on documenters (thought the docs that exist are on the whole very good), but we shouldn't shove it in their faces. > Keep the Tutorial lean and clean: teach, don't > preach. it rhymes, it must be true ! > can twiddle. Reference is no longer pertinent to the average user and > should thus be eliminated (but it should still exist for developer use). why is it not pertitent ? just because it's horrendously out of date ? > 5.2.5 BibTeX >5.2.5 BibTeX is this really where bibtex is hidden ? I think it should be promoted a little more. You don't really need to know latex to use it... > 1.3.2.2 Popups >1.3.2.2 Popups this would be an ideal time to standarise on this terminology. I think we discovered last little survey, that "dialog" was most definitely the better known term. regards john
Re: Unreviewed dvi docs patch
On Mon, Jul 23, 2001 at 09:38:04AM -0700, Mike Ressler wrote: > On Sun, 22 Jul 2001, John Levon wrote: > > Mike, I haven't had an "OK" from you on this patch. Is it ok for 1.2.0 ? > > Arg, I didn't help myself by updating Customization - I have many rejected > chunks when trying to apply your patch, mostly due to the new inset code. > Is your patch 1.2.0 specific, or does it apply to 1.1.6 as well? If "1.1.6 1.1.6 as well. I'd better do it fast for fix3 I guess. So I can commit the change to head for it to get in 116 right ? I'll commit if so > As a side note, I've noticed that diffs are a terrible way of trying to > see what is different in a LyX doc. The diff itself is impossible to read you're not wrong > (and this will be especially true as we convert 1.1.6 to 1.2.0 with all > the inset changes), and applying the doc and opening it in LyX doesn't > provide any way to easily see the changes (anyone want to code a diff mode > into LyX :-) Perhaps we should do something "silly" like put all edits in > blue or underlined or something until the change is mutually agreed on or > some such. Any recommendations for dealing with this? it is ironic the lyxdoc team have requested this feature along with many others :) I think the thing is to support changelog latex package (does this support changebars ?) then we can support collaborative stuff much better. I used to use a unix package (I forget the name -- inter) which supported this pretty well regards john -- "Voodoo Programming: Things programmers do that they know shouldn't work but they try anyway, and which sometimes actually work, such as recompiling everything." - Karl Lehenbauer
Unreviewed dvi docs patch
Mike, I haven't had an "OK" from you on this patch. Is it ok for 1.2.0 ? thanks john -- "Voodoo Programming: Things programmers do that they know shouldn't work but they try anyway, and which sometimes actually work, such as recompiling everything." - Karl Lehenbauer viewdvidoc.diff.gz
Re: Documentation work this week
On Mon, Jul 16, 2001 at 04:46:48PM -0700, Mike Ressler wrote: > declare them set in stone for any possible 1.1.6fix3. The rearranging will > then occur in the 1.2 docs, even though I will be using 1.1.6 to > rearrange/edit them at first. How much work do you estimate this will take ? Specifically, updating the docs for recent LyX versions ? Most of it is fixing menu entries [1] and the like but I imagine there are some sections that really need updating. regards john [1] auto update of these, and Reference.lyx is a bit more long-term I suppose -- "When you start off by telling those who disagree with you that they are not merely in error but in sin, how much of a dialogue do you expect ?" - Thomas Sowell
Re: [moz@compsoc.man.ac.uk: Re: bug: Latest CVS preferences and converters]
On Mon, Jun 25, 2001 at 09:50:22AM -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Sat, 23 Jun 2001, John Levon wrote: > > Until GUI support for this is provided, we need to document this work-around > > somewhere (adding given line to ~/.lyx/preferences or so). > > > > Where should this go ? > > In Customization somewhere, unless it will be GUIized in time for 1.2.0. > If it is very temporary, either in FAQ.lyx or a pointer to Voss's pages > (and make sure it appears there). It probably won't be done by then. How about the attached patch (also has lyx-1.2 update changes in it, the kdvi part is the only relevant change) ? OK to commit ? thanks john -- "Euler's equation contains the five most important numbers in mathematics."
Re: [PATCH] Tiny fixes to Intro.lyx
On Fri, Jun 08, 2001 at 04:23:33PM -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Fri, 8 Jun 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > On Sat, 2 Jun 2001, John Levon wrote: > > > I've also added a changelog (cvs add ChangeLog) as I think this > > > would be useful. > > John, did you actually commit this? I don't see your ChangeLog or the > modifications to Intro.lyx. I don't have enough karma. Lars can you give me permissions on lyxdoc ? thanks john -- "I hope you will find the courage to keep on living despite the existence of this feature." - Richard Stallman
Re: "Popups"
On Fri, Jun 08, 2001 at 09:53:51AM -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On Sat, 2 Jun 2001, John Levon wrote:
> > Are the doc team still insistent on this term ? It seems both unfamiliar
> > to users, and a bad description (the dialogs do /not/ pop up).
>
> IIRC, this was chosen as a compromise - we wanted to avoid the developer
> jargon ("dialog box" was deemed jargon) and use something a typical user
> might say.
I see. Unfortunately I have never heard this term to describe dialog boxes,
even from the many typical users I know ...
> What does M$ Word (shudder!) call such things? That,
> unfortunately, is what we should attempt to be consistent with, since that
> is what typical users will know.
that makes sense. Can someone answer ?
thanks
john
--
"I hope you will find the courage to keep on living
despite the existence of this feature."
- Richard Stallman
"Popups"
Are the doc team still insistent on this term ? It seems both unfamiliar to users, and a bad description (the dialogs do /not/ pop up). thanks john -- "Please crack down on the Chinaman's friends and Hitler's commander. Mother is the best bet and don't let Satan draw you too fast. A boy has never wept ... nor dashed a thousand kim. Did you hear me?" - Dutch Schultz
[PATCH] Tiny fixes to Intro.lyx
I've also added a changelog (cvs add ChangeLog) as I think this
would be useful.
One problem - these changes are partly lyx 1.2.0 specific. Do we need
branches in CVS or what ?
thanks
john
--
"Please crack down on the Chinaman's friends and Hitler's commander.
Mother is the best bet and don't let Satan draw you too fast.
A boy has never wept ... nor dashed a thousand kim. Did you hear me?"
- Dutch Schultz
Index: ChangeLog
===
RCS file: ChangeLog
diff -N ChangeLog
--- /dev/null Tue May 5 22:32:27 1998
+++ ChangeLog Sat Jun 2 18:47:12 2001
@@ -0,0 +1,3 @@
+2001-06-02 John Levon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
+
+ * Intro.lyx: minor fixes and updates for 1.2.0
Index: Intro.lyx
===
RCS file: /usr/local/lyx/cvsroot/lyxdoc/Intro.lyx,v
retrieving revision 1.14
diff -u -r1.14 Intro.lyx
--- Intro.lyx 2001/01/13 00:37:10 1.14
+++ Intro.lyx 2001/06/02 16:47:12
@@ -1,4 +1,4 @@
-#LyX 1.1 created this file. For more info see http://www.lyx.org/
+#LyX 1.2 created this file. For more info see http://www.lyx.org/
\lyxformat 218
\textclass article
\language english
@@ -119,13 +119,15 @@
a separate page as in some of the printed versions.
Nor are any of the footnotes or the Table of Contents visible.
To open a footnote, which looks like this,
-\begin_float footnote
+\begin_inset Foot
+collapsed true
+
\layout Standard
-Hi!
+Hi!
\layout Standard
-To close me, click on the grey box on the left, the one with the word
+To close me, click on the grey box above, the one with the word
\begin_inset Quotes eld
\end_inset
@@ -134,9 +136,10 @@
\end_inset
in it.
-\end_float
+\end_inset
+
click on it with the left mouse button.
- For the Table of Contents, either click on the gray box, or click on the
+ For the Table of Contents, either click on the grey box, or click on the
\family sans
Navigate
@@ -169,7 +172,15 @@
You can go to the section the referred to by clicking the button labeled
"Go to reference".
Going back to where you came from is just as easy.
- Typing
+ Clicking on
+\begin_inset Quotes eld
+\end_inset
+
+Go back
+\begin_inset Quotes erd
+\end_inset
+
+ or typing
\family sans
C-<
\family default
@@ -632,8 +643,8 @@
\end_inset
on Unix systems and use the Emacs editor.
- Unless specifically noted, the keybindings in the documentation are the
- from the default CUA map.
+ Unless specifically noted, the keybindings in the documentation are from
+ the default CUA map.
If you like Emacs, you should be smart enough to read the documentation
and figure out the bindings on your own.
\layout Section
@@ -731,12 +742,16 @@
Tutorial
\emph default
.
-\begin_float footnote
+\begin_inset Foot
+collapsed true
+
\layout Standard
\SpecialChar \ldots{}
or that you have a passing knowledge of LaTeX.
-\end_float
+\end_inset
+
+
\layout Description
@@ -903,12 +918,15 @@
Get the latest LyX source code.
Untar it.
-\begin_float footnote
+\begin_inset Foot
+collapsed true
+
\layout Standard
The more adventurous can grab the latest source anonymously from the LyX
CVS repository.
-\end_float
+\end_inset
+
You will find a directory inside the main tree called
\family typewriter
lib/doc/
Re: Trivial typo.
On Sat, 23 Dec 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > since I don't have CVS access to that particular file. The "view > dvi" instruction recently moved from the "file" menu to the new > "view" menu, so splash.lyx should, in fact, be updated. Just one of the > many things to drive me nuts while trying to have the documentation catch > up to 1.1.6 ... Talking of which, I still vote for moving File->Insert file submenu into the View menu before 1.1.6. I think Dekel suggested this first ... john -- "'National security': the root password to the US Constitution." - Phil Karn
