Re: [MBZ] 123 trunk lock
You can get the original build data including key code from the Benzes. Given that, you can buy an original code ignition key and a valet key from them also. Cost is high enouygh but not outrageoue. Takes a little while; you may have to furnish proof of ownership, especially for a European model. BTDT 1. Re: W123 Trunk Lock (Rick Knoble) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 06:56:06 -0500 From: Rick Knoble rickkno...@hotmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] W123 Trunk Lock Max wrote: If you order a new ignition cylinder, odds are good that it will come with a new steel key. Yup. That is what I hope for. Perhaps I can get the valet key also. But first I must get the trunk lid open... Rick Sent from my iPhone ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 123 Ignition removal
Today's Topics: 2. 123 ignition removal (Curt Raymond) Can be done with bare hands. Ain't easy. Turn key so that big paper clip reaches in and enters recess (you can feel it). Unscrew bezel that surrounds lock - a real bear, but you can do it; it's a right hand thread. Piece of cake after that. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - Morgages
Long ago, I read, particularly in Consumer Reports, how credit unions are a much better deal for their members, etc. I tried to put that into practice. My sad experience is that I always could do better at a bank. That's even before an old friend became president of my bank. I don't know why, but I do know what. 9 and 11. Re: OT - mortgages Message: 9 Date: Sat, 18 Jun 2011 17:11:47 -0500 From: OK Don okd...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com I'd forgotten them. The last time I went to them for a new car loan (1997) they were more expensive than a local bank, but it's worth checking. Thanks -- On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 4:04 PM, Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: Don't forget credit unions, too. Our local CU has very competitive rates and products, not to mention they are very good to work with. After all, we're not just a depositor, we're an owner. We are getting closed to wrapping up a short sale (hopefully!) and have the CU on the hook with everything poised and ready to go. I can call my loan officer directly, ask questions, etc., whenever I want. They are so much easier to work with, not to mention that we pay nothing in fees for our bank accounts, and we even earn interest on them (albeit MIT much these days...) Dan Message: 11 Date: Sat, 18 Jun 2011 18:17:04 -0400 From: Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - mortgages The rates at our CU are competitive, as well them having an in-house title and real estate group that gives discounted fees to members. We will save about $1500 on our closing costs due to this. I did shop around for better terms/rates but didn't find any. Another nice thing is their ability to offer non-traditional products, such as a 20 year mortgage. I couldn't find any any local banks that would do a 20 year note - they would only do a 15 or 30 year note. Dan Sent from my iPhone On Jun 18, 2011, at 6:11 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: I'd forgotten them. The last time I went to them for a new car loan (1997) they were more expensive than a local bank, but it's worth checking. Thanks -- On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 4:04 PM, Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: Don't forget credit unions, too. Our local CU has very competitive rates and products, not to mention they are very good to work with. After all, we're not just a depositor, we're an owner. We are getting closed to wrapping up a short sale (hopefully!) and have the CU on the hook with everything poised and ready to go. I can call my loan officer directly, ask questions, etc., whenever I want. They are so much easier to work with, not to mention that we pay nothing in fees for our bank accounts, and we even earn interest on them (albeit MIT much these days...) Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Terraplane story
The Terraplane (aka Terrible pain) was a factory hot rod, intended as such. Higher power to weight ratio than any other contemporary production car. 1933 Model KT set Pike's Peak Hill Climb record that stood for 25 yr. John Dillinger preferred 1933 Model KT - of course John only lasted until the summer of 1934. I have had a fellow who ought to know tell me with a a straight face A Terraplane will outrun anything contemporary, except maybe a Duesenberg. Maybe he was stretching it a little. You just had to be there. 10. Re: Reputable shipping company for used engines (WILTON) -- Message: 10 Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 18:21:01 -0400 From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Reputable shipping company for used engines Okay, now I'm gonna hafta tell my Terraplane story: On a rainy Sunday afternoon in late Spring of 1941, my mom, dad and 3 or 4 of us younger children were visiting our oldest brother and his wife 10 or 12 miles from our home. The brother was not there when we arrived, but he soon came in with his brother-in-law - both had been drinking. The BIL's wife was there, also, and jumped him immediately about his drinking. He stormed out of the house, jumped into his '34 Terraplane and sped out of the yard. At the end of the driveway, he was going way too fast to make the turn into the road, flew across the road and jumped the ditch into a cornfield. It was a small field of about 3 to 5 acres; the corn was not mature - maybe, about 4 feet tall. The car never faltered, never slowed, but continued at full throttle to crisscross the field many times with corn and mud flying until it had obliterated about every stalk of corn in the field, finally jumping the ditch again and speeding away up the road. This incident and others also involving the oldest brother had a profound effect on me such that I've always been a teetotaler - I've always thought that I can make big enough fool of myself completely sober. Wilton ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Reputable shipping company for used engines
Once I thought about buying a 1934 or 35 Terraplane engine and transmission off ebay that was posted for local pickup only. Location in some rural town in MA. UPS says they will pickup and ship and thing to anywhere. I found they don't include Terraplane engines and transmissions in anything. They sent me to someone who referred me to a group called Craters and Freighters. 800 number. The 800 number people referred me to CF not far from where the engine was. Boston I think. Must be a franchise or similar. They want to know dimensions and where to and where from and weight etc. I had to make my best guesses. They gave me a quote to go get it, crate it, and deliver it to me. The quote was large enough, but I'm convinced it was real. Five or six times what it would have cost to buy the engine on the ground; a lot less than it would havae cost to go get it. They said they would adjust for actual size and weight. I decided against it, once again learning when something you want that is rare is offered for sale, get it. Don't screw around. I may never see another comparable deal. We get so soon old and so late smart. I have had a Benz engine shipped from England to Texas by DHL, but I think they are now out of business in the USA. German company. 3 day service from Bloody old England to Texas. Pretty cheap I thought. Ought to be easy to find Craters and Freighters, and maybe DHL. Good luck. 2. Reputable shipping company for used engines (andrew strasfogel) -- -- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 07:31:58 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com Subject: [MBZ] Reputable shipping company for used engines I posted my used 300D turbo engine on eBay for local pickup only. It would be nice to quote a shipping price. Can anyone recommend a reputable shipping company so I can do this? Thanks, Andrew 1983 and 1985 300TD -- ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Reputable shipping company for used engines
I agree that a crate built up from a pallet with plywood and/or 2x4's is a good idea. My engine from England came that way with nary a hitch. You could also consider cocooning the thing in plastic wrap. 2. Re: Reputable shipping company for used engines (Allan Streib) -- Message: 2 Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2011 14:02:58 -0400 From: Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu Subject: Re: [MBZ] Reputable shipping company for used engines Might even want to check into an engine shipping container, heavy polyethylene plastic to contain any oil or other fluid that may spill, will make the freight company happier to accept it. Example: http://www.scribnerplastics.com/engcase.htm Possibly too expensive to justify for a single shipment, though. Allan On Wed, 01 Jun 2011 11:28 -0500, Randy Bennell rbenn...@bennell.ca wrote: Let me offer one further suggestion. If you are the shipper, make sure that you protect the package to avoid later issues with the buyer and the shipping company. I would not only strap it on a pallet. I would build a solid box around it out of plywood or something similar. I had an item shipped in from Regina to Winnipeg and the shipper did not package it well. It was damaged as the truckers are a bunch of monkeys who could care less. The trucking company essentially denied liablitity and suggested it was not packed well enough. The vendor/shipper has ultimately provided some replacement parts but I wish it had not been necessary. I also bought a machine from a fellow in Vancouver and he packed it very well. No problems apart from the fact that it took quite a while to get the box open and the machine out of it. I cannot recall the number of screws but there were lots. The box was made out of scrap plywood and 2X2's etc but was very solid and did not add a whole lot of weight. Pack well and avoid issues later is my basic advice. Randy ___ ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] MBZ] Garbage Disposers Banned
The justification of this is overload on sewage treatment facilities by stuff that would otherwise go into the trash. Ground up stuff adds biochemical oxygen demand (BOD), which is what sewage treatment plants remove. The more BOD in the waste stream, the more sewage treatment plant is required for adequate treatment. Ground up stuff adds to sludge volume also. Sludge has to be digested and finally dried. Volume is a problem. It is possible (note that I didn't say theoretically or readily possible) to so overload a sewage treatment plant with BOD from a particularly strong source, in one case a chicken slaughtering plant, that the effluent from the treatment plant is way too strong; it may still have a substantial BOD. Stinks. Solution in that case was pre-treatment at the chicken plant. You may not be able to do that with domestic kitchen waste unless it is really loaded up with blood or meat waste. Grease inhibits the bacteria that remove BOD. But that is why. Message: 7 Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 16:55:03 -0700 From: Jerry Herrman jer...@san.rr.com Subject: [MBZ] Garbage Disposers Banned So, we have a rental and as we are leaving our house yesterday evening to attend a meeting, the resident calls to say that the kitchen sink is clogged up. Being booked solid for the next 24 hours or so, I call a plumber to take care of the problem. He calls after doing the job to say that sweet potato peelings were run through the garbage disposer (GD) and bunched up in the J bend causing the blockage. He removed and replaced the trap, and took out the peelings. He proceeds to say that this house was built before the use of garbage disposers, and is not designed to have a GD. He recommends removing the disposer and restoring the original configuration under the sink. I am not inclined to follow his reommendation, believing it to be a desirable feature for residents. He says that NYC and other cities have banned garbage disposers. My question: Why have some cities banned GD's? Jerry 1982 240D Does not run on potato peels ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] It's not as bad as I thought
I have known numbers of owners who had the car totalled and bought the salvage for almost nothing. Then they rebuilt, as you contemplate. Only problem I know of with that is the salvage title will follow the car around. You need an expert, and I'm not the man. Good luck. 1. Its not as bad as I thought (Kaleb C. Striplin) Message: 1 Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 22:27:35 -0500 From: Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net To: mercedes Mailing List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Its not as bad as I thought I can fix this myself, all it appears to need is a fender, door, some trim, and a little suspension work on the drivers side. Door is bowed at the top because it is crunched in the middle and the hinges are bent. Did not get into the structure of the car at all nearest I can tell. So, I guess I can put it back on the road even if it turns out the white walmart trash has no insurance. http://www.okiebenz.com/pics/e430%20wreck/ -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 99 E430, 99 E320, 95 E300, 94 S500, 92 500SEL, 92 300SD, 92 300E 4Matic, 91 350SDL, 91 300D, 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL x2, 85 190D, 84 190D, 84 300D euro manny, 76 240D, 76 300D, ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] I have found a problem with following the tracks of a wealthy owner (Low profile tires)
I read somewhere that extreme low profile tires (compared to a rubber band stretched around a quarter), the really fashionable ones, have big problems with traction and braking - that is, they don't do it well. FWIW - don't know if true. 3. I have found a problem with following the tracks of a wealthy owner ... (Bill Ringgold) 6. Re: I have found a problem with following the tracks of a wealthy owner ... (Peter Frederick) -- Message: 3 Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2011 10:52:58 -0400 From: Bill Ringgold billr32...@comcast.net Subject: [MBZ] I have found a problem with following the tracks of a wealthy owner ... My new S420 Prius is a dream car and drives like it, BUT, I hit what seemed an insignificant enough pothole that I didn't work very hard to avoid. Apparently it had a hard edge that was too hard for the Pirelli 225/40 R18's on the front [235/50's on the rear]. Lots of tread on the tires but suddenly I have a bubble on the sidewall and cupping on the tread from that bump [that would have been quickly forgotten in my wife's S320 with 'normal' wheels]. This guy paid $239 each for the front tires [more for the back I would assume]. The spare [a Michelin 18 235/50] doesn't match the front, and I sure don't want to pay that for a single tire. I'm glad he had the $ to plunk down for the car and the $ to maintain it properly, I just wish the $2,500 tab for the wheels and tires had stopped him from getting those, even though they do look nice. I need to start saving my pennies now for the full replacement set in a year ... I did find a tire store that has one slightly used [7/32 tread depth] matching Pirelli P Zero Nero that I got for $90 shipped, and will be $20 to install. If I manage to avoid potholes I should get @ 10K more miles, but then I'll either sell the AMG 18 rims or buy cheaper tires for them. A positive note - I got 21 MPG on the first tank of mixed city / highway, though much of that was without using the AC, which won't be happening again until late fall. Much better than I had expected. Bill R Message: 6 Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2011 11:08:04 -0500 From: Peter Frederick psf...@earthlink.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] I have found a problem with following the tracks of a wealthy owner ... Low profile tires are VERY expensive on moderate to poor quality roads (meaning 90% of America these days of scrimping on road maintenance to build new interstates). A buddy of mine a few years back ruined three tires and two aftermarket rims before he learned to stay with /60 profile tires in this town, well known for terrible streets. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 65, Issue 6
Not a bunny. I'm driving a two door white bunny, and that ain't it. Dunno what it is. 1. Re: They see me rollin', they be hatin'. (Alex Chamberlain) -- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2011 13:00:34 -0700 From: Alex Chamberlain apchamberl...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] They see me rollin', they be hatin'. On Fri, Apr 1, 2011 at 4:31 PM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote: http://www.picrandom.com/images/39606.jpg Wilton's new ride, obviously. Is that a Rabbit or an Omni? Unlike a lot of big wheel on little car pictures, that actually looks real, unless someone went to a lot of trouble with Photoshop to make convincing-looking welding on the fender flares. Alex ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 64, Issue 38
Thank both of you. Now I know. Saw another one last evening - A wagon, no less. Think I saw one like it on The Sopranos once. Four wheel drive seems to have a reputation, no matter where it may be installed. 1. Re: Was ist 4Matic? (Peter Frederick) 3. Re: Was ist 4Matic? (Allan Streib) -- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2011 20:33:32 -0600 From: Peter Frederick psf...@earthlink.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Was ist 4Matic? Automatic 4 wheel drive. Peter Message: 3 Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2011 22:35:14 -0500 From: Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu Subject: Re: [MBZ] Was ist 4Matic? Robert Bigham edward_baldh...@earthlink.net writes: What in hell is a 4matic mercedes? A drain on your finances. Allan -- 1983 300D 1979 300SD ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Was ist 4Matic?
What in hell is a 4matic mercedes? I came up behind one today. 530 something
or other 4matic. I've seen 4matics before, so it's nothing new and mysterious.
Inquiring minds want to know.
-Original Message-
From: mercedes-requ...@okiebenz.com
Sent: Mar 10, 2011 2:00 PM
To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Mercedes Digest, Vol 64, Issue 36
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than Re: Contents of Mercedes digest...
Today's Topics:
1. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Mike Esh)
2. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Rich Thomas)
3. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (andrew strasfogel)
4. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Mike Esh)
5. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Max Dillon)
6. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Alex Chamberlain)
7. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Greg Fiorentino)
8. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Max Dillon)
9. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Mitch Haley)
10. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Allan Streib)
11. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (WILTON)
12. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Max Dillon)
13. Re: 123 rear bumper, was test (Rusty Cullens)
--
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2011 13:46:51 -0500
From: Mike Esh michael...@me.com
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] 123 rear bumper, was test
Message-ID: cf0e1739-1eb0-4ecf-aac2-f92503e72...@me.com
Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII
The item # I looked up is 230593805154. I asked if he had others for less
money.
Phone is906-322-0641. He is out of Rudyard, Mi
Michael Esh
231.894.5505
On Mar 10, 2011, at 1:26 PM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote:
Mike Esh wrote:
Looks like I can pick up one locally for 50.00
Thanks anyway.
Where?
Do they have similar deals on W116/126 seats?
Mitch.
___
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--
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2011 13:54:37 -0500
From: Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] 123 rear bumper, was test
Message-ID: 4d791e6d.9020...@constructivity.net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Ravenel on 17 almost to, uh, Ravenel!
--R
On 3/10/2011 12:38 PM, Max Dillon wrote:
Rich, which yard is that? I'm busy looking for a used OM603 head #17 or
later... maybe we (the OP and I) could work a swap of some kind?
Very respectfully,
/s/
Max Dillon
'87 300TD 334k miles
'95 E300 280k miles
'73 Balboa 20
Charleston SC
--
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2011 13:58:48 -0500
From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Subject: Re: [MBZ] 123 rear bumper, was test
Message-ID:
aanlktikn4f8od5jr6la1fupyxmrdcvjwft8et3d5-...@mail.gmail.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
I may need a part that's unique to a 1985 300CD turbo coupe. Anyone parting
one out?
On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 11:02 AM, Dwight Giles Jr. degco...@cox.net wrote:
Curt might have one from Hammie-he seems to be away this week. Also will
one
from a 123 coupe fit a sedan?
Dwight
Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD 220K miles
1990 300D 2.5t 190K miles
Wickford RI
-Original Message-
From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com]
On Behalf Of Jim Cathey
Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 10:42 AM
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Subject: Re: [MBZ] 123 rear bumper, was test
Are rear bumpers still available new or used? My 1984 300D had it's
fall off yesterday.
Mine ('83) did that, it corroded under the glue. I put on a used one from
the junkyard.
-- Jim
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[MBZ] Valet lock
Hello Allan I dunno about the W116, but I do know about the W123 valet lock. It is a keyway and a key - nothing else. The valet key will not unlock the trunk. Will unlock the driver's door and the ignition key switch. Keyway on driver's door and ignition lock are wedge-shaped, wider at the entry than at the tip, and may appear quite worn. They're not. They're made that way. Keyway on trunk is narrow and fits the regular key. Valet key will not enter it. Lock the trunk with the regular key, give the valet the valet key. He can't unlock the trunk. He can of course break in. He can lock/unlock the driver's door and the ignition key switch. Hope this is of some use. It is all true. I found out by doing my homework the hard way. I have a valet key for my car, bought from the Benzes, and it wasn't easy to do that. It's somewhere. REB Message: 9 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 14:23:33 -0500 From: Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu Subject: [MBZ] valet lock? OK so the guy with the W116 300SD says he has set the valet lock on the trunk... and there is some magic combination needed to unlock it now. Anyone know what that is? He thought it might be left-right-right ??? Not a feature I'm familiar with. Allan -- 1983 300D ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Advice on Bunny repair (Was Another day, another wheel bearing)
8. Re: Another day another wheel bearing (Max Dillon) Message: 8 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 05:14:20 -0800 (PST) From: Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Another day another wheel bearing Robert, PLEASE give the bunny new front wheel bearings BEFORE the car goes one direction and the wheel(s) go in another... THIS IS NO DOUBT THE BEST ADVICE ON THE BOARD TODAY. THANK YOU. I LOST THE FORD WHEEL BEARING AT LOW TOWN DRIVING SPEED - SCATTERED PIECES LIKE SOMEONE OTHER THAN YOU MIGHT NOT BELIEVE. I MAY BE DRIVING THE BUNNY AS IT IS BECAUSE MY GOOD FRIEND AND INDEPENDENT MECHANIC IS SO CONCERNED ABOUT IT HE HAS OFFERED TO CHANGE THE STRUT/BEARING ASSEMBLIES ON THE CUFF -PAY ME WHEN YOU CAN. I JUST SPENT A TON ON ENGINE OVERHAUL WITH HIM. I SHOULDN'T THINK THAT WAY. THANK YOU AGAIN FOR YOUR GOOD ADVICE. I HAD A FRONT WHEEL BEARING SPLIT A ROLLER ON A MODEL A FORD ONCE. MADE A SMALL NOISE - STOPPED AND LOOSENED BEARING ADJUSTMENT WENT ON FIXED IT SOONEST. NO PROBLEM THEN. GOD TAKES CARE OF FOOLS AND DRUNKS, OR IT IS SAID HE DOES. My father and I were traveling in a '69 Benz (newly purchased) through the desert southwest when the left front wheel bearing let go. It had been making a noise for a hundred miles or so, and we had stopped several times attempting to diagnose (water pump? power steering? transmission?). We were blessed in that no other cars were nearby and the road was straight, sun was shining and the weather was good. Control of the car was momentarily lost but recovered and we safely pulled over. In different circumstances we might easily have crashed. The wheel remained on the spindle _barely_. -Max From: Robert Bigham edward_baldh...@earthlink.net To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Mon, January 31, 2011 11:30:51 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Another day another wheel bearing More on point, I once had an inner front wheel bearing on a Ford pickup disintegrate on the road after making a noise like a rock in hub cap off and on for about a year. I had spent a lot of time and effort trying to find the problem. A friend remarked it was a good thing it disintegrated, since I might never have figured it out. When it went, it took the hub and spindle with it. Right now I'm driving a 1981 VW Rabbit (Diesel, yes) with bad front wheel bearings, especially the right. Makes a lot of noise; roars; sounds like an airplane flying over. I've made two recent 400 mile round trips with it making the noise and an 800 mile trip earlier. Sound better all the time. I have new hubs/struts made up to go on the bunny and hope the bearings don't disintegrate before I'm ready to change them. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Life of CV Joints
7. Re: Life of CV joints (Robert Bigham) 8. Re: Life of CV joints (Benz Hogs) 9. Re: Life of CV joints (Mitch Haley) 10. Re: Life of CV joints (Allan Streib) 13. Re: Life of CV joints (Fmiser) Message: 7 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2011 11:25:12 -0600 (GMT-06:00) From: Robert Bigham edward_baldh...@earthlink.net To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Life of CV joints THANK ALL OF YOU FOR SHARING YOUR EXPERIENCE. I DON'T MEAN TO YELL BY USING CAPS. I DON'T SEEM TO BE ABLE TO GET ANOTHER FONT. SORRY FOR BEING SO DUMB. Message: 8 Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2011 12:30:54 -0600 From: Benz Hogs benz-n-h...@gulseth.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Life of CV joints The right rear axle on my SDL has a boot that has been cracked for over 2 years/40,000mi and is now completely missing. The axle has not made any noise yet. !! WOW !! !! DOUBLE WOW !! WHY DON'T YOU TRY THIS WITH OIL CHANGES/ REPLENISHMENT? THEY MAY NOT BE REALLY NECESSARY. THINK OF WHAT YOU MIGHT PROVE !! JUST KIDDING. I had to replace both axles on my '82 300CD when they were thumping constantly. The CD's axle boots were not cracked open like the SDL's boot. Luther KB5QHUOak Park, IL '87 300SDL (312,xxx mi) '91 Dodge Ram 150 (290,xxx mi) -- Message: 9 Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2011 13:37:41 -0500 From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Life of CV joints In FWDs, I've had the telescoping tripod joints on the inboard end wear out enough to induce vibration through the steering wheel at speed. Usually well beyond 100,000 miles when that happens. IIRC, on old Saab 99s you could swap the tripod cups from right to left to get a new driving face for the joint. Mitch. INTERESTING. IT WOULD SEEM TO STAND TO REASON THAT CV JOINTS HAVE A HORSEPOWER RATING LIKE MOST OTHER POWER TRANSMITTING PARTS. MIGHT THE POWER OF THE ENGINE HAVE SOMETHING TO DO WITH THE VARIED EXPERIENCES RELATED HERE? VW KINDA LOW POWERED. BENZ NOT NECESSARILY SO. FWD - OFTEN SEEMS LIKE HIGH POWERED MACHINE, AT LEAST TO ONE IN A LITTLE VW. -- Message: 10 Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2011 13:58:02 -0500 From: Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Life of CV joints The MB joints are factory-filled with oil, not grease, so any leak in the boot and the lubrication will drain out. Look for oil on the bottom of the car above the boots. I AM NOT PREPARED TO COMMENT ON BENZ FACTORY FILLING OF LUBRICANT IN CV JOINTS. MY FRIEND AND INDEPENDENT MECHANIC SAYS HE IS QUALIFIED, AND IT IS MOLY GREASE SIMILAR TO THAT USED BY VW. GREASE IS COMPOSED OF OIL AND SOAP, AND THE OIL CAN SEPARATE OUT AFTER A LONG ENOUGH TIME. PERHAPS THAT EXPLAINS WHQT YOU SAW. WORLD PACK CV BOOT KITS CONSIST OF A BOOT NOT GREATLY DIFFERENT THAN USED BY VW, (ALTHOUGH THICKER AND MORE ROBUST), HOSE-TYPE CLAMPS, TWO TIN COVERS (AND SOME O-RINGS(?)) FOR THE OUTERS, AND A TUBE OF GREASE. THE INNER JOINT HAS A COVER OR SOMETHING SIMILAR THAT IS CRIMPED TOGETHER COVERING THE ACTUAL BOOT. YOU (OR ACTUALLY I) CAN'T SEE THE ACTUAL INNER BOOT FROM UNDER THE CAR. SEE THE PART I CALLED A COVER. OUTER BOOT LOOKS MUCH LIKE THE VW BOOT EXCEPT FOR THE TIN COVERS. INNER DOES NOT HAVE THE TIN COVERS OR THE BOX-LIKE THING THAT ENCLOSES THE INNER BOOT NEXT TO THE DIIFERENTIAL. THESE ARE febi-labeled PRODUCTS REPORTEDLY MADE BY BILSTEIN. I DO NOT KNOW, BUT AM INCLINED TO BELIEVE IT IS BENZ OEM. RUSTY WOULD KNOW. PLEASE TELL US, RUSTY. THE BENZ JOINTS THAT I REBOOTED, OR ACTUALLY HAD BEBOOTED BY MY FRIEND AND INDEPENDENT MECHANIC WERE FILLED WITH MOLY GREASE SIMILAR TO THAT USED IN VW JOINTS. ONE OLD (GOD ONLY KNOWS HOW OLD) ONE LEAKED AFTER 25,000 OR SO MILES FOR BY ME, ALL FOUR REBOOTED 2009. STILL GOING STRONG. I DID ALL THE VW JOINTS BUT ONE MYSELF. SHOULDER SURGERY IN 2008 HAS HAD MY MECHANIC TOOLS GATHERING DUST AND RUST UNTIL VERY RECENTLY. When I rebooted my 300D axles using the Flexx boots, one boot had started leaking but I don't think the crack was big enough to admit any dirt yet. There was still some oil in that joint and it was clean. MY INDEPENDENT MECHANIC SNIFFS AT THE IDEA OF UNIVERSAL BOOTS - USES ONLY THE ONES I DESCRIBED. SAYS THE RUBBER IN THE UNIVERSAL BOOTS WAS AT ONE TIME IF NOT NOW, INCOMPATIBLE WITH SYNTHETIC LUBRICANTS. OIL IN SYNTHETIC GREASE ATE THEM UP. BTW, WHY PREFER MOBIL 1 ATF OVER MOLY GREASE FORMULATED FOR CV JOINT USE? THE VW STUFF IS SPECIAL SCHMEIRFETT IIRC. When I replaced the boots I used the grease that came with the boots, as I would not know what oil to use otherwise (maybe M1 ATF?). So now my CV joints are greased, not oiled. Hoping they last a good while longer. Allan -- 1983 300D Message: 13 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2011 15:15:54 -0600 From: Fmiser fmi...@gmail.com To: Mercedes
Re: [MBZ] Outsourcing
I'll bet they also have the inside track to get you the $Eleventy Zillion that were left in the bank in someone's name similar to yours. Will only cost you maybe $45K in fees/bribes to get it released to them for your benefit. Honestly, how can we view these kind of things as other than scams? Ed 11. OT - outsourcing (R A Bennell) -- Message: 11 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 15:28:41 -0600 From: R A Bennell b...@mts.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] OT - outsourcing Yesterday afternoon I received an email message from someone in Lahore, Pakistan offering to do work for my law office: Typing ? Transcription ? Editing ? Formatting ? Diagrams ? Working on Incorporation Documents and Annual Return files ? Drafting Agreements ? Forms as per requirement ? Time Sheet Management ? Drafting PDF into MS Word, MS Excel or other Applications ? Data Entry (QBook, Simply Accounting, etc...) Cheaply and securely. The computer age is a bit scary. Pretty soon, they will be offering to haul my old car over there for a tuneup and then ship it back, cheaper than the fellow down the block can do it. Randy -- ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com End of Mercedes Digest, Vol 63, Issue 50 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Life of CV joints
I wrote that CV joints in my experience last forever if the boot is good, or words to that effect. My experience is just that. I have driven hundreds of thousands of miles in CV joint equipped cars, mostly Volkswagens. If the boots survive, so do the joints. Good boot, holds grease in and gritters/water out yields happy CV joint that becomes an auto part senior citizen. That's my normal expectation. I do keep an eye on the boots and their grease retention. On Benzes (perhaps I should say On the Benz, so I will) I have had boots start to sling out grease with no visible indication of trouble except the slung out grease under the car. I replace the boot(s) and repack the joints if that happens. On VWs, the boots are somewhat different than on the Benz, and highly visible. If a VW joint is losing grease, you can almost always see why. A couple of people said that they have had CV joint failure without boot failure, that is, a joint or joints failed while packed in grease in intact boots. At least I got that from what they wrote. They didn't say about water or gritters. I find that really strange. Do others experience CV joint failure without warning with intact boots, like the two seem to have experienced? Does VW have a joint/boot design that is much superior to that on Benzes? Why the difference? Inquiring minds want to know. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Another day another wheel bearing
Hello all I'm no wheel bearing expert, but I play one on TV, and I did once stay in a Holiday Inn Express. More on point, I once had an inner front wheel bearing on a Ford pickup disintegrate on the road after making a noise like a rock in hub cap off and on for about a year. I had spent a lot of time and effort trying to find the problem. A friend remarked it was a good thing it disintegrated, since I might never have figured it out. When it went, it took the hub and spindle with it. Right now I'm driving a 1981 VW Rabbit (Diesel, yes) with bad front wheel bearings, especially the right. Makes a lot of noise; roars; sounds like an airplane flying over. I've made two recent 400 mile round trips with it making the noise and an 800 mile trip earlier. Sound better all the time. I have new hubs/struts made up to go on the bunny and hope the bearings don't disintegrate before I'm ready to change them. I once drove a 1964 Ford with a bad rear wheel bearing until the axle slipped in the bearing and the splines pulled out of the spider gear on tnat side. Made a grinding noise. I changed the front wheel bearings in my 123 because I thought they might be bad. My billfold stopped making such a stuffed noise after that. Benz was not much different. Brown grease may be other color grease with added rust. You need both the center cap on the hub and an outer hub cap or wheel cover to keep water out of front wheel bearings. How I know this should be obvious. Whup, whup, whup and variations sounds more like tire to me. If it is, take tire off car and roll it. Separated tire (source of whup, etc) will not roll straight. Tire is dangerous junk if this is the case. CV joints in my experience last forever if their boots survive. If the boots fail, the grease will preserve the joint for a while. New boot gives new life if joint not already kaput. Bad joint is likely to hum at moderate to high speed until it breaks, whereupon it will make a hell of a noise. How I know this should be obvious. Check under car for grease slung out of CV joint boots. As long as grease stays in boots, CV joints are OK. Grease may dry out and become waxy, but I think not in this lifetime. If bearing are bad, races are bad also. Should have a polished appearance not in the least frosted. Likewise rollers in bearings. Bearings/races (cones and cups)that are not perfect equal to new may work entirely well enough to suit most. Good luck Message: 13 Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:24:32 -0500 From: Mike Esh michael...@me.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Another day another wheel bearing How hard is it replace race? Mike On Jan 29, 2011, at 3:23 PM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: Does whup whup whup in time with the car's speed sound like a wheel bearing? I thought it might and as my wife and I both pointed to the right front of the car as the source of the sound I figured I'd give it a shot. This is on my '78 240D. The bearings looked merely okay and as they had both MB green grease and some brown (does MB green grease degrade into brown?) and as I'd already bought the bearings (Car Quest, $39 for the bearings AND the seal and they had them in stock last night) I figured I might as well get to it. I'm getting better at this, the bearing plus an oil change took just on 2 hours. Gotta take the dog for a walk, then I'll be able to see if the noise is gone, won't know definitively for a day or two though, the noise would come and go. -Curt 5. Re: Another day another wheel bearing (Curt Raymond) 6. Re: Another day another wheel bearing (Peter Frederick) Message: 5 Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 15:14:46 -0800 (PST) From: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com To: Diesel List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Another day another wheel bearing Its not that kind of noise though... The noise is back BTW, I was listening to it today, its more of a do,do,do sound. You know the pop for freshness buttons on glass bottles? Its sort of like somebody popping one of those (like holding the cap in your fingers and pushing with your thumb) over and over rapidly. I can't imagine what it is, absolutely no idea. It seems to be coming from the front right. The only thing I saw that was even moderately not right was that the shock is leaking so its on my list for replacement once I can get to the parts car again once we lose some snow about March or so... -Curt Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 11:13:40 -0500 From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Another day another wheel bearing What if you had ice inside the wheel? That would cause a variable imbalance, with possible thumping if the bearing were 10x as loose as it should be. -- Message: 6 Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 17:45:29 -0600 From: Peter Frederick psf...@earthlink.net To: Mercedes
Re: [MBZ] Buick straight eight (was More Holes)
Buick Straight Eight Lore: The engine we are writing about was first used in the 1936 Buick Roadmaster. There were earlier Buick Straight Eights, IIRC. The last year for the 1936-derived engine was the 1953 Series 40 Buick Special. Other series had the new for 1953 nailhead V8. In 1953 I was one of a group that traveled from Central Texas to the Big Bend National Park and points nearby in a 1941 Buick Super Club Coupe. The club coupe was packed with people and stuff. The Buick had what was called compound carburetion. It had two carburetors, one of which functioned all the time, and the second when the driver stepped on it. I remember several times seeing the speedometer vault from about 60 mph to about 90 mph when he stepped on it. The straight eight was not underpowered in the least. As I remember the car had three little square or rectangular holes in the chrome trim in the vicinity of the hood release (on the side of the hood near the back) that might have been the first tentative ventiports, although the story is that they came after the War, not before. Those were the days. 5. Re: more holes (Dieselhead) Message: 5 Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 22:47:22 -0600 From: Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] more holes The buick straight 8 was produced from 1931 to 1953 A guy I knew in HS had a 30something buick straight 8. It was a phenomenal car. The only buick I ever wanted was a big old Buick straight 8 like that one. Unfortunately, being a dumb HS kid, he over revved it too much and snapped the crank. It had a sound all its own. ...Beg pardon, weren't those holes originally where the exhaust come out of the hood? Sure was a straight eight in there for a long time in the 30's 40's! All the holes were on one side in those days, and had an exhaust header going through them, eh?.. You are thinking of my friend CB's Bugatti 35B. Looks like the Buick holes appeared in 1949. RLE ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] who was it that was talking about Buick fender gills
Hey folks, The Buicks I remember had round ventiports, or rectangular ventiports with rounded corners (a whole lot like an oval track) or elliptical ventiports, or maybe other shapes,depending on year model. There may have been some square ones very early. The first idea was to have a flashing light in each of 8 ventiports (four on each side, with the flashing related to the spark plugs of the straight eight engine firing) but that idea was scrapped. Or so the story goes. There were indeed three holers and four holers (on each side). Three holers were Buick Specials (Series 40) or Supers (Series 50). Four on a side originally marked the Roadmaster (Series 70). My Buick Roadmaster will pass anything on the road but a gas station. In the mid-1950's Buick revived the Century (Series 60), which had the Roadmaster engine in the Special body, and would pass almost anything on the road, and gave them four holes. But none of this pointed JC Whitney junk, IIRC. There may be something in worse taste, but I can't think of it right now. Nuf Sed. Ed Today's Topics: 1. Re: who was it that was talking about the Buick fender gills. (Dieselhead) 4. Re: who was it that was talking about the Buick fender gills. (E M) 5. Re: who was it that was talking about the Buick fender gills. (Dieselhead) Message: 1 Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 18:38:49 -0600 From: Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] who was it that was talking about the Buick fender gills. What a moron. 3 on each fender is a 6 holer meaning a 6 cylinder. The 560 V-8 is an 8 holer in bu-ick terminology.If you are going to be moron enough to put brick holes on an MB, at least don't be such a moron that you can't count holes. That is a double Moron. Message: 4 Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 20:21:57 -0500 From: E M pokieba...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] who was it that was talking about the Buick fender gills. Hey if they're already in that deep, why not go for 6 holes on each side, and slap a V12 badge on the trunk while they're at it. Message: 5 Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 19:15:05 -0600 From: Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] who was it that was talking about the Buick fender gills. Woger? Who knows why I remember stuff like this but Buick named those things Cruiseliner Ventiports BTW, I was driving I-5 yesterday in the Seattle area and passed a Maserati sedan...a rare enough sight. To my surprise the thing had Cruiseliner Ventiports! Greg -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Kaleb C. Striplin Sent: Monday, January 03, 2011 3:53 PM To: mercedes Mailing List Subject: [MBZ] who was it that was talking about the Buick fender gills. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Hueco?
German eggs: eir Dunno if R is making a joke. Message: 14 Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2010 13:27:57 -0500 From: Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Hueco? German eggs --R ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 123 Heater Fan
Hello Tim C. www.mercedessource.com in Washington state has a repair kit and instruction flyer you might be interested in. Not too hard to understand and not too high IIRC. My 123 has an aftermarket Heater/Air Conditioner and the repair kit did nothing for me. Lo siento ! 3. W123 heater fan (Tim C) 4. Re: W123 heater fan (Rolf) 5. Re: W123 heater fan (Greg Fiorentino) Message: 3 Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2010 15:07:21 -0400 From: Tim C bb...@crone.us Subject: [MBZ] W123 heater fan I'm driving the '77 300D again this week (gotta keep it running and all) and remembered that the heater is broken. It is the old style with the Chrysler ACC, but everything else is working so I have assumed that the fan itself is the problem. This leads me to three questions: 1) Fan is in the passenger kick panel, right? Just a few screws? Any gotchas on taking it in and out? 2) Where would I get such a fan? Our junkyard has a lot of 126s but it looks like those are incompatible, and from BIMBY it looks I would need chassis number 110886. That link is broken but I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be willing to pay the new price. :) Could I scavenge a motor from a 126 fan? 3) Anything else it could be? Other elements of the climate system seem to work, I just don't get heat. Thanks! -Tim -- Message: 4 Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2010 15:15:26 -0400 From: Rolf r...@winmutt.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] W123 heater fan 1) yup, straight forward. 2) car-part.com is always a good resource when all else fails 3) The FSM has a great step by step diag Message: 5 Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2010 12:19:27 -0700 From: Greg Fiorentino gf...@dslnorthwest.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] W123 heater fan The fan and motor last a long time. What usually goes first are the brushes. They are not too tough to replace (and cheap) if you can find them. I've done this a couple of times on a 123. Greg ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Carbonite data backup service
I don't know anything about Carbonite per se, but I do know something about crashed hard drives. Some crashed hard drives can have the data recovered by purpose made software. Easy, takes a short time. Others have to be painstakingly repaired (I mean physically restored) and restored to function in order that the data on them can be recovered by the same software. Also easy (for the owner), takes maybe a week. In the first case, one is talking about $100 to $250, depending on who does the work with the software. In the second case, I spent about $4,500 (Yes, it was worth it to me.) to have my data recovered from my crashed (No Operating System Found) 40 gig hard drive, written on a replacement hard drive, and returned. You can bet your sweet ass I will use something like Carbonite in the future. Having my data on someone else's computer is a non-issue to me, and ought to be such in almost any case. Who wants your data? Answer: Almost nobody. It may be valuable to you. It is (mostly incomprehensible) junk to others. If you have some truly sensitive stuff, and I doubt that many do, write it on two password protected flash drives. Encase one in concrete. Store the other in a bank safe-deposit box. Alternatively, have them inserted under the skin on your back. It's thick. Problem solved. Regards. ed 11. Carbonite: si or no? (Van Knutson) 15. Re: Carbonite: si or no? (Craig) -- Message: 11 From: Van Knutson southpaw0...@yahoo.com Subject: [MBZ] Carbonite: si or no? Re: discussions of crashed hard drives, what does the august body assembled here think of carbonite--the $54.95 unlimited online data backup service? DBV, inquiring mind wants to know information ?minister _ Message: 15 From: Craig diese...@pisquared.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Carbonite: si or no? Re: discussions of crashed hard drives, what does the august body assembled here think of carbonite--the $54.95 unlimited online data backup service? I don't have any experience with them, but I am hesitant with storing all my information on someone else's computer. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Overheating - proven to be lack of waterpump output
Hello all Engine 102.980 Has anyone else had overheating from no waterpump output? I like to never found the cause of my overheating. Mercifully, it's a hot weather thing only. You might not beleive some of the speculations as to the cause. Not the radiator. New a year or so back; came from the fatherland. 20 deg drop from head to bottom inlet on pump. Water pump Meyle new at same time. Not the cap; same reason as radiator. Not thermostat; same reason. No loss of coolant. Temperature gauge moves inexorably toward the top, particularly at low speed/idle. Does not reach red mark (shut off first). No coolant loss. Laser thermometer says temperature gauge in dash essentially correct. Radiator tubes or heat exchanger fins not blocked anywhere. Stop engine, it depressurizes and cools off pretty quickly. Gutted old thermostat to make gasketed plate with hole about 1 in. diameter: made it worse if anything. Finally, disconnect top hose at radiator, lay it on top of tank, block top radiator nozzle, top up coolant, start engine. No water pump output. Problem found. How did this happen? Pump makes no noise; seems OK until shown to have no output. Pump not off yet. Several are interested to see it when it comes off. Argh! ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Overheating - proven to be lack of waterpump output
Hello Thank you for your comment. I neglected to say that the gutted thermostat was gutted and installed after the new thermostat, which was thought to be the cure of the problem (everything else having been thought to be eliminated) did nothing that anyone could tell. New Wahlert thermostat installed, (opens at 90 deg C by test)has no efffect on overheating that anyone can see. Without doubt the path of coolant with thermostat installed and working should be from the pump toward the back of the block, back to the front through the head and block, and then out through the open thermostat through the top hose to the radiator top tank. Removal of the thermostat should not have a material effect on the path coolant; otherwise running without thermostat would be engine death, which it is not, as all know. Removal of thermostat generally results in overcooling. It is certain the top hose will discharge coolant if the water pump is pumping, or I say so. Do you agree or disagree? If you disagree, why? Thanx RE Bigham, alter ego and enablere of Edward Baldhead Message: 13 Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2010 15:10:26 -0400 From: Dillon, Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC, 53310 meade.m.dil...@navy.mil Subject: Re: [MBZ] Overheating - proven to be lack of waterpump output If you have a good thermostat installed, all water pump output would stay within the engine and I would not expect anything to come out of the top radiator hose until normal engine temperature was reached and the t-stat opened. If the car has your gutted t-stat with hole installed, all bets are off as to where the water pump output would go. Some would probably flow out the top radiator hose. -Max -Original Message- Robert Bigham Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 3:04 PM Subject: [MBZ] Overheating - proven to be lack of waterpump output Hello all Engine 102.980 Has anyone else had overheating from no waterpump output? I like to never found the cause of my overheating. Mercifully, it's a hot weather thing only. You might not beleive some of the speculations as to the cause. Not the radiator. New a year or so back; came from the fatherland. 20 deg drop from head to bottom inlet on pump. Water pump Meyle new at same time. Not the cap; same reason as radiator. Not thermostat; same reason. No loss of coolant. Temperature gauge moves inexorably toward the top, particularly at low speed/idle. Does not reach red mark (shut off first). No coolant loss. Laser thermometer says temperature gauge in dash essentially correct. Radiator tubes or heat exchanger fins not blocked anywhere. Stop engine, it depressurizes and cools off pretty quickly. Gutted old thermostat to make gasketed plate with hole about 1 in. diameter: made it worse if anything. Finally, disconnect top hose at radiator, lay it on top of tank, block top radiator nozzle, top up coolant, start engine. No water pump output. Problem found. How did this happen? Pump makes no noise; seems OK until shown to have no output. Pump not off yet. Several are interested to see it when it comes off. Argh! ___ ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] 230E, 123 chassis.
One asked about 230E cars and others opined on them. I can help a little. Today's Topics: 1. 230E? (Curt Raymond) 2. Re: 230E? (Mitch Haley) 3. Re: 230E? (LWB250) -- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2010 09:03:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com Subject: [MBZ] 230E? Doesn't somebody on the list have a 230E? Theres a Euro 230E 5spd on Craigslist that looks pretty nice. The ad says it needs stuff like shocks, seems like those are probably the same across the 123 line. My 240D did 28mpg long term (7 years) mix of highway and city so if a 230E was capable of the mid 20s it'd be good enough considering gas being cheaper than diesel... -Curt Message: 2 Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2010 12:36:33 -0400 From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] 230E? Buy it, install your 240D shocks, and drive it until you find a $500 rustbucket with a strong running 617 turbo in it. (actually, check to see which 2.3 is in it. Its tranny might bolt up to a 190D engine) Message: 3 Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2010 09:51:58 -0700 (PDT) From: LWB250 lwb...@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] 230E? Even fuel injected, a 230E is unlikely to ever hit 20 mpg unless it's highway and downhill all the way. These were not terribly efficient cars for their time. Dan edward-baldhead says: Hello all: I have a 1983 230E on 123 chassis WDB12322312170440. Has 102.980 engine (9:1 compression ratio, 100 KW (136 HP)), 4 speed automatic with anti-rollback device in transmission [Please don't try to tell me they didn't make them that way. It is indeed there.], anti-lock brakes, CIS injection, and that's about it. AFAIK, no EGR, no O2 sensor, no CAT. Marked for Bleifrei Super, but I use 87 octane regular with no problems that I can tell. Regarding swaps of another engine into this chassis: Be sure the crankshaft on the new engine is sompatible with the transmission in the car (fit to receive a torque converter or a pilot bearing). Otherwise you may be changing transmission also. Originally delivered at der Benzwerke Stuttgart to a guy who drove it around Europe for a couple of years and then imported it to the states. His name is on the driver's doorpost. Federalized by some outfit in North Carolina. Their name is there too. Car has 167,6xx miles, about 43,000 of which are mine. It was stored for several yr in a dispute over a repair bill. The then owner ran over a curb or something and broke the oil pan. Big cast aluminum thing. Replacement oil pan and new skid plate cost more than he would pay. I bought it from the repair shop because I needed some cheap wheels that day, and it was all I could find that I could buy and would have. Something of a haoppy accident. As far as I'm concerned it is a jewel. It has had some problems and some hiccups and I spent money sorting out fuel and ignition problems, but those are all done now. Replaced pump and accumulator and added a pre-filter ahead of pump. Lots of fine rust coming out of tank. Still does. The CIS fuel system is somewhat like a diesel: It is a closed loop with supply and return lines. Supposed to flow more fuel than the engine requires, and excess returns to tank. Fuel flow cools pump. At first, the pump, which was an off-breed brand, would not flow enough fuel to cool itself, and after enough road miles (around 120) it would boil the fuel and vapor lock. Wait for cool off, start up again. I finally got enough of that. Correct Bosch pump replaced off-breed. End of problem. Accumulator affects hot restart. A bad one will require what seems like lots of cranking. Doesn't affect cold start. Lead from ignition control box to distributor had some problems at distributor connection, which resulted in car dying; lost spark for no apparent reason. It took a while to figure that out, but it's fixed now. It used to get as much as 27 mpg on highway (automatic trans), and a solid 22 mpg in mixed driving before they started adulterating the gas with ethanol. Now more like 24-25 and 20-21. Uses no oil for 4,000 miles, after which it starts to consume about 1 qt/1000 mi. I typically drive 70's in highway because I'm not in a hurry, and that keeps up with most traffic. Car would like to go faster, like 80 to 90 mph. I have driven it at indicated 105 mph, and it had some more left. The repair shop owner says he has driven it at indicated 120 mph. I have replaced the CV boots on the half-shafts and the side seals on the differential. Replaced upper control arms and one tie rod. Replaced front wheel bearings and shocks all around. Bilstein regulars. Accept no substitutes. Got them from Rusty. Working on second set of tires, counting the ones on it when I got it. Original equipment size no longer availible in the states; I use a fatter tire and no
Re: [MBZ] 230E, 123 Chassis: Anti-rollback device
Hello Alex and others Regarding the anti-rollback device: My son, who is smarter than I, found it. Here's how it operates (I don't know how it works.): In normal operation, that is, moving under its own power with transmission in a forward gear, most probably D, although it may work in L and S (I just don't know or don't remember.), one rolls to a stop made with the brakes on an upgrade. Front end of car is noticeably higher than back. Upgrade must be larger than some inconsequential minimal grade. Take foot off brake. Car does not roll back. Nudge gas, car starts forward. Take foot off gas, car rolls back. Apply brake, car stops. Take foot off, car does not roll back. The reason I say it's in the transmission is that if one shifts into N while standing fast, car then rolls back. I also believe if it were in the brakes, FSM would say so, which it does not as far as I can tell. Factory transmission manual might enlighten us. I have only Automatic Transmission Service Group (ATSG) Manual. BTW, 1934 and 1935 Hudsons and Terraplanes had an optional anti-rollback device which was a geared thing on the back of the transmission. One had to (IIRC) shift into reverse and then neutral to disable the thing so the car could be rolled back. These cars had mechanical brakes. Anti-rollback device on 230E does not operate as anti-rollforward device. What a deal. I have had people try to tell me there ain't no such animal when they cannot possibly be expert on all models of Mercedes-Benz, of which there are hundreds on the 123 chassis. But of course they don't think about it that way. I hope this explanation makes sense. I tried to make it clear. Best regards ed __ 12. Re: 230E, 123 chassis. (Alex Chamberlain) Message: 12 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2010 11:04:29 -0700 From: Alex Chamberlain apchamberl...@gmail.com On Tue, Aug 3, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Robert Bigham edward_baldh...@earthlink.net wrote: 4 speed automatic with anti-rollback device in transmission [Please don't try to tell me they didn't make them that way. It is indeed there.], That's interesting. How does it work? You step on the brake pedal on a hill, take your foot off and then when you hit the accelerator it holds the brake down for you until the car is actually moving, like the Studebaker Hillholder? Alex -- ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com End of Mercedes Digest, Vol 57, Issue 20 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Is this a factory color?
Yes it is a factory color. I see a derelict W123 here that is the same color. I understand the color is called Nipple Beige. 11. Is this a factory color? (Alex Chamberlain) 12. Re: Is this a factory color? (Walt Zarnoch) -- Message: 11 Date: Sun, 6 Jun 2010 12:44:55 -0700 From: Alex Chamberlain apchamberl...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Is this a factory color? Message-ID: aanlktiltmhzp7sfh98cpmwiyff_xowva2rxzeu-cz...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 http://portland.craigslist.org/clc/cto/1769089048.html If not, who in their right mind would paint a car like that? I guess maybe it's white or beige and the white balance on the digital camera they used was way off. Any bets on how much longer an OM616 with 400,000 miles on it already will last? Alex -- Message: 12 Date: Sun, 6 Jun 2010 15:50:43 -0400 From: Walt Zarnoch zarnoch...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Is this a factory color? Message-ID: aanlktikqnucne0lskf2impbyr8dhgl9cky_chwatp...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 That looks factory to me, I think the donor I pulled my engine from was that color. Walt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Insurance claim: Mercedes Digest, Vol 55, Issue 12
You do not have to agree to some lowball offer: Sir, this car is not even in the book. That means nothing. Their insured has to put you back where you were before the crash. The adjuster's main concern is to settle the claim. The company's main concern is to settle the claim as cheaply as possible. If your son had some injury resulting from the crash (These can take a while to show up.), your position will be enhanced. Do not agree to the adjuster's offer unless you do indeed agree. It is that simple. The power of No is very large. A man who is in the wrong can't stand up to a man who is in the right and keeps on a'comin'. Bill McDonald, Texas Ranger Captain. 1. Insurance Claim (LWB250) Message: 1 Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2010 08:23:51 -0700 (PDT) From: LWB250 lwb...@yahoo.com Subject: [MBZ] Insurance Claim My biggest concern at this point is that they will try to total out the car. ?The adjuster is supposed to contact us within the next 48 hours, so I'll know more once they can get the car to a repair place and look it over. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Licensing engineers, was Re: more reasons not to be in a Toada
In Texas, the job title Engineer or engineer is reserved for persons licensed under the Texas Engineering Practice Act. Software Engineers, System Engineers, and similar persons identify themselves publicly with The E-word at their own risk. The Texas Board of Professional Engineers will get an order aginst them and a civil penalty. Just about the only exception is persons working for the telephone company, who do not have to be licensed under tha Act. 4. (Jaime Kopchinski) Message: 4 Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2010 16:44:22 -0500 From: Jaime Kopchinski jaime...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Licensing engineers,was Re: more reasons not to be in aToada There is a difference in being a PE (Professional Engineer) and an Engineer. A PE license isn't very useful in many forms of engineering, including what I do: computer engineering (you could say software engineer, too). My degree is in Electrical and Computer Engineering, so consider it what you'd like. Studying for a PE wouldn't even be recognized by my company. Now, if you're a civil engineer, mechanical, etc, this is different. A PE is required to sign off on design plans, etc. Unfortunately, its become common with some of my competitors to hire people with technical training or experience, give them an engineering title. I personally find this quite offensive, having a BS in engineering. But that's another topic all together. Jaime On Wed, Feb 17, 2010 at 11:31 AM, Tim C bb...@crone.us wrote: On Tue, Feb 16, 2010 at 9:55 PM, Greg Fiorentino gf...@dslnorthwest.net wrote: Back is the days before the occupation software engineer existed, my brother received a BS in mechanical engineering and a MS in industrial engineering. In those days, such degrees were adequate credentials for a working engineer. Perhaps today other qualifications work for someone to be an engineer, and so perhaps licensing is a credential that should be required. The whole business is kinda confusing. Interesting, what state? NC has required PE licensure since 1977 and I thought we were usually behind the median on such things. The license isn't that difficult to get: accredited BS or greater in engineering, some number of years progressive work experience, recommendations, pass two day-long knowledge tests, and agree to protect the health and well-being of the public above allegiance to employer. The carrot is that you know people who are licensed are at least minimally competent to pass the tests [but doesn't necessarily mean they are good at what you need them to do, or would make good employees]. The stick is that, if you build Tacoma Narrows, you probably are going to lose your license and never be able to work in engineering again, so you have personal incentive to think before you sign your name on that drawing. In NC there are exceptions to licensing if you are working strictly on in-company products, maintenance, under the direction of a PE (which can be interpreted pretty loosely :), etc., so it may be that it just didn't apply in his case. If you were looking for work with a company I don't think anyone would enforce that you couldn't use engineer, but advertising services to the public technically crosses the line set out in the statute. -Tim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 1984 230E
OMG! The misinformation I would propagate without Hendrik to keep me straight. Thanks Hendrik I mean well. 18. Re: 1984 230E (Hendrik Fay) From: Hendrik Fay heni...@ozemail.com.au Subject: Re: [MBZ] 1984 230E Actually the 102 did not make an appearance until 1980, prior to that the M115 was the I4 engine. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mercedes-Benz_engines Hendrik who used to own a 200 with 4sp man and a 230E with auto and later with a 5sp man box Robert Bigham wrote: I have a greymarket 1983 230E. It's fuel injected; that's what the E means. Einspritzmotor. As you may suspect, I've had to learn things about it that I didn't really want to know; the parts places (not Rusty) know nothing. MBUSA knows all about it. The dealers generally pull a Sergeant Schultz. It's not in their databases. To some, it's just a 240D in drag. The earlier, 1977-78 or so, cars were 230 without the E or maybe 200. Still a 102 engine. They had carburetors. 230, 230C, and 230 something else, IIRC. -- ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com End of Mercedes Digest, Vol 50, Issue 156 * ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 1984 230E
I have a greymarket 1983 230E. It's fuel injected; that's what the E means. Einspritzmotor. As you may suspect, I've had to learn things about it that I didn't really want to know; the parts places (not Rusty) know nothing. MBUSA knows all about it. The dealers generally pull a Sergeant Schultz. It's not in their databases. To some, it's just a 240D in drag. The earlier, 1977-78 or so, cars were 230 without the E or maybe 200. Still a 102 engine. They had carburetors. 230, 230C, and 230 something else, IIRC. 1. Re: 1984 230E (Kaleb C. Striplin) 2. Re: 1984 230E (Kaleb C. Striplin) 3. Re: 1984 230E (Curt Raymond) -- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 11:28:55 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] 1984 230E Message-ID: 4b5dd4d7.7090...@striplin.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed If it was carburated, it would just be a 230C, the E means its fuel injected. I sure have never heard of such a beast though. tom tomscat wrote: Hi Dieselhead, I believe your info is incomplete. My info says that engine was available in a carburetor version until 1990. I am now at work, more or less, and I checked my records. The car I had (in March 2006) was a 1984 230CE and it was carbureted. Last 7 digits of the VIN were: AO95696. I distinctly remember the carburetor, because it backfired repeatedly thru the carburetor when we tried to start it, and I had to put out more than one minor flame-up. Which put the Fear of God into a couple of casual onlookers, btw. :) It was a great little collectible car, but it needed a lot of restoration. Thanks, Dwight, for the pics. That is definitely a different car than the one I briefly had custody of, from what I can tell from those lousy pics. Mine was a coupe. Sheesh, could he have taken a WORSE picture???They reminded me of the pics Vinny Gambini had in MY COUSIN VINNY, taken through a filthy screen. :) God, I love that movie! Tom Schuch SE Connecticut 1975 W115 300D (may be going up for sale shortly to make some room) and a bunch of BMWs (adding a 6th today) Message: 2 Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 23:25:21 -0600 From: Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] 1984 230E Message-ID: a0624081dc782db88f...@[192.168.1.112] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii ; format=flowed Carb engined 123 was only in 77 and 78 according to the info I found. All from 79 on were einspritz Hi Curt, I run a residential facility here in CT. I have had a car donation fundraising program for the past several years. A couple of years ago someone donated a grey market 230E, cant remember if it was an 1983 or 1984. (I am gonna check my records at work tomorrow, it may have been a 230CE.) It was a W123 chassis, however, in need of restoration. I only had it on hand for a short time before selling to some gearhead immigrants from western CT. Since it was an unregistered vehicle, and badly in need of a tuneup, we had no real idea of the power and economy. It was a neat car, though, with a carbureted gasoline engine in the w123 chassis. FWIW, wikipedia has some info on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_W123 I am curious if that is the same car that Dwight saw. The one I had was white with a blue cloth interior. Tom Schuch 1975 W115 300D and a bunch of BMWs ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Adjustable shocks - Koni
I had some Konis on a VW Rabbit once. They were adjustable for wear. The adjustable feature proved to be more trouble than it was worth. I never actually used it over 50 or 60 thousand miles. Doesn't Rusty have regular Bilsteins? Used to. 1. Adjustable shocks - Koni? (David Bruckmann) Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 02:36:55 -0800 From: David Bruckmann bruckma...@transcontinental.ca Subject: [MBZ] Adjustable shocks - Koni? Gang, Has anyone here had experience with Koni adjustable shocks? I replaced the crappy Monroe shocks in the W108, hoping it would improve the harsh ride. Unfortunately, Bilstein only seems to offer HD shocks, and so not unexpectedly the car is better but still too firm for my liking. Sachs/Boge only lists one shock, which I assume is also an HD type (although I've not called them to verify). The MB-EPC has superceded the original shocks with - you guessed it - the HD version. I understand that Koni offers adjustable shocks that will fit the W108. It would also seem that Koni is a top-tier OEM supplier to various reputable auto marques, apparently including MB on certain performance models. I'm trying to achieve a softer ride, closer to a W123. Right now the W108 is riding more like a skateboard/Honda Civic. I have already replaced the hydropneumatic compensator with a spring, and in turn replaced that spring with the weakest available configuration from MB. That helped, but the shocks are definitely too hard. Hoping someone has something good to say about the Koni adjustables... D. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fuel tank repair
Correctamundo. Get it clean so solder will stick. Clean the area to be soldered with brush or somehow. Use acid core solder or acid flux. Heat the copper up well and it will do the whole job in one heating. One of the gas tank repair places like in Hemmings can do the welding if anyone really wants welding per se. Otherwise, do not try this at home. We are professionals. Ha ! ed Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 12:02:03 -0600 From: R A Bennell b...@mts.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuek leak/Fuel tank repair My father used to do this sort of thing as well. Not commercially, but I do recall him soldering tanks that leaked. I think the primary concern is getting the area clean enough for the solder to stick properly. My guess is that what you want is the flux - essentially acid - that was used when soldering eavestroughing back when it was galvanized steel instead of aluminum or plastic. Wipe that stuff on and it would eat anything that might cause trouble. Then the solder joint would stick pretty good. Randy -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com]on Behalf Of Robert Bigham Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 11:54 AM To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuek leak/Fuel tank repair Hello All The safe way to repair a fuel tank is with soft solder and an old-fashioned soldering copper. In this process, there need not be fire anywhere near the tank, there is no spark ever, and the temperature of the tank can be moderated with partial water fillingor sponging with water similar to in bodywork welding. One of my many old bosses used to do this a lot. It was something of a trade secret to him; he would not allow outsiders to actually see him do it. He used to cackle about how much money he could get for so little work on tank repair. But he used to cackle about a lot of things. Stay away from fuel tank welding; it's too dangerous. Regards ed 3. Re: fuel leak (Dillon, Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC, 53310) 4. Re: fuel leak (pm7...@comcast.net) 6. Re: fuel leak (R A Bennell) Message: 3 Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 14:21:50 -0500 From: Dillon, Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC, 53310 Subject: Re: [MBZ] fuel leak Another trick that I've heard about but never witnessed is called 'pressing up' the tank, whereby you fill it with water so that the fuel is pressed up to the top of the tank, and then you weld so that the water gets heated and not the fuel. How do you keep the water leaking out of the break from mucking up your welding? I don't know... -Max [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Jim Cathey Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 9:14 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] fuel leak What do I use to weld this? Torch? Fuel tank welding is rather tricky. I've done it. The secret ingredient is a lawnmower putting away filling the tank with non-oxygen, and keeping it that way. I don't really recommend it. -- Jim Message: 4 Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 19:57:00 + (UTC) From: pm7...@comcast.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] fuel leak Oh my, this is going to require ear plugs so the large BANG does't scare you too much. Than of course there is all the hollering and screaming that comes from burn victims. I've used epoxy with good results, not as dramatic of course -- Peter Arnold Windsor, CT ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- Message: 13 Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 12:05:37 -0600 From: Fmiser fmi...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT '95 E300 project - OM606 fun (was oscope) Message-ID: 20100122120537.a61ca2c7.fmi...@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Curt Raymond wrote: I think Marshall said heat and time and that heat was a function of RPM and load. IIRC Marshall suggested getting some big friends to ride in the backseat while you drove up big hills... Hmm. That requires big hills. And friends -- Philip -- Message: 14 Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 13:12:24 -0500 From: Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] looking at '87 300D Message-ID: 1264183944.22213.1356069...@webmail.messagingengine.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Well I had said that I was not buying any cars this year but I'd seen this W124 sitting in a yard with a for sale sign for a while. I had some time this morning so I stopped to look at it. It's an '87 300D with (if the odo is correct) about 173K miles. Nobody was around so I noted the phone number. The car looked solid, no visible rust, but paint was flat on the hood. Interior looked decent, no rips or obvious abuse. If I were
Re: [MBZ] Fuek leak/Fuel tank repair
Hello All The safe way to repair a fuel tank is with soft solder and an old-fashioned soldering copper. In this process, there need not be fire anywhere near the tank, there is no spark ever, and the temperature of the tank can be moderated with partial water fillingor sponging with water similar to in bodywork welding. One of my many old bosses used to do this a lot. It was something of a trade secret to him; he would not allow outsiders to actually see him do it. He used to cackle about how much money he could get for so little work on tank repair. But he used to cackle about a lot of things. Stay away from fuel tank welding; it's too dangerous. Regards ed 3. Re: fuel leak (Dillon, Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC,53310) 4. Re: fuel leak (pm7...@comcast.net) 6. Re: fuel leak (R A Bennell) Message: 3 Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 14:21:50 -0500 From: Dillon, Meade M CIV SPAWARSYSCEN-ATLANTIC, 53310 Subject: Re: [MBZ] fuel leak Another trick that I've heard about but never witnessed is called 'pressing up' the tank, whereby you fill it with water so that the fuel is pressed up to the top of the tank, and then you weld so that the water gets heated and not the fuel. How do you keep the water leaking out of the break from mucking up your welding? I don't know... -Max [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Jim Cathey Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 9:14 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] fuel leak What do I use to weld this? Torch? Fuel tank welding is rather tricky. I've done it. The secret ingredient is a lawnmower putting away filling the tank with non-oxygen, and keeping it that way. I don't really recommend it. -- Jim Message: 4 Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 19:57:00 + (UTC) From: pm7...@comcast.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] fuel leak Oh my, this is going to require ear plugs so the large BANG does't scare you too much. Than of course there is all the hollering and screaming that comes from burn victims. I've used epoxy with good results, not as dramatic of course -- Peter Arnold Windsor, CT ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Engine 102, 103, 104 displacement
I can only be amazed at the depth of knowledge some of you have. I only know about 102.980. OMG. But 2299 cc is 575 cc/cylinder, and 2800 cc is 467 cc, and the 103 is not just a 102 with 2 more cylinders. QED. Dunno about 104. Message: 14 Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2010 12:51:03 -0500 From: Gary Hurst jabbahur...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Engine 102/3/4 displacement 103 standard is 3.0 and 2.6 litre. 104 in 3.2 and 2.8. no self respecting american would ever know anything about 102 On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 7:55 AM, Hendrik Fay heni...@ozemail.com.auwrote: Your brain is really farting now, the 103 never came out in 2.8 capacity (that's the 104) only in 2.6 and 3 liter form (unless modified by AMG to 3.2). The 102 came in 1.8, 2, 2.3 and 2.5 liter, however the 1.8 was a limited to Oz only thing and the 2.5 was a Cosworth special. So technically when you compare the 2 (1997cc) liter 102 and 3 (2960cc) liter 103 you can come up with a variation 6cc per cylinder. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_M103_engine http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_M102_engine Hendrik Robert Bigham wrote: Date: Wed, 30 Dec 2009 13:05:39 -0600 (GMT-06:00) From: Robert Bigham edward_baldh...@earthlink.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Ethanol or not? Idiot I wrote the following:. Engine 103 is not just Engine 102 with two more cylinders. 102 has 2,399 cc displacement = about 600 cc per cylinder. Engine 103 has about 2,800 cc displacement (they are rare around here, as is Engine 102) = about 467 cc per cylinder. And now for the real story: Engine 102 has 2299 cc, about 575 cc per cylinder. I think Engine 103 has 2800 cc, about 467 cc per cylinder. Any who were revising their reference materials can correct them now. Sorry. Brain fart. ___ ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Engine 102 displacemenet
Date: Wed, 30 Dec 2009 13:05:39 -0600 (GMT-06:00) From: Robert Bigham edward_baldh...@earthlink.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Ethanol or not? Idiot I wrote the following:. Engine 103 is not just Engine 102 with two more cylinders. 102 has 2,399 cc displacement = about 600 cc per cylinder. Engine 103 has about 2,800 cc displacement (they are rare around here, as is Engine 102) = about 467 cc per cylinder. And now for the real story: Engine 102 has 2299 cc, about 575 cc per cylinder. I think Engine 103 has 2800 cc, about 467 cc per cylinder. Any who were revising their reference materials can correct them now. Sorry. Brain fart. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Ethanol or not?
3. Ethanol or not? (Max Dillon) 7. Re: E10 (relng...@aol.com) 8. Re: Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? (OK Don) -- If they're advertising No ethanol, I suppose it pretty nearly has to be true. Salut! New and newish pumps around here, including Exxon, all say Contains 10% Ethanol, sometimes they also say by volume. Hendrik is correct that there are many 102 engines, and several compression ratios. The differences are in the pistons and the head. 102.980 is European, British (UK), and most of rest of world, has pop-up pistons, and does indeed have 9.0 to 1 compression, which I believe is as high as MBZ attained on Engine 102. Zoom zoom. Other 102's I have seen have flat top or similar two-level top pistons. I believe the highest compression on any other 102 engine is 8.0 or 8.5 to 1 0n 102.961 and/or possibly 102.965. I think I could look it up if it were vital to get it correct. Engine 103 is not just Engine 102 with two more cylinders. 102 has 2,399 cc displacement = about 600 cc per cylinder. Engine 103 has about 2,800 cc displacement (they are rare around here, as is Engine 102) = about 467 cc per cylinder. Some 102 and 103 parts do interchange, so the difference may be in part one of scale on the rotating assembly. I think the timing components interchange. Don't bet the rent on that, though. -- Message: 3 Date: Tue, 29 Dec 2009 18:18:59 -0500 From: Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.net Subject: [MBZ] Ethanol or not? FWIW, there is a station here in Charleston with a big sign proclaiming ethanol-free gasoline is sold. I think it is an Exxon station. It is on North Rivers Ave, near the intersection with Aviation Ave. - Max -Original Message- From: mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Robert Bigham Sent: Tuesday, December 29, 2009 4:14 PM Subject: [MBZ] Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? My 1983 123.223 has 9.0 to 1 compression on 102.980 (Euro and Rest of World Specification) engine. Has Bosch CIS not CIS-E injection. Marked on body at fuel cap BLEIFREI SUPER. Book says use 93 RON (Research Octane?). For a long time I ran 92 octane (R+M)/2. Finally I said what the hey and tried 87 (R+M/2). Timing set per book. No problems whatsoever. 27 mpg on highway 80 mph and less. 20-22 mpg in general driving mostly in town lots of starts and stops. Top speed well exceeds 105 mph indicated. I understand 120 mph indicated is close. I haven't tried it. FWIW I think the 102 engine may be a little technically advanced in design compared to a 103. Maybe not. Has hemispherical combustion chambers, sohc with long rocker arms, and I think canted valves. I know my 102.980 hung the moon in my book. Zoom zoom at all of you. Yesterday a 123 (diesel?) that must have been going at least 90 mph on Interstate 20 in Fort Worth came up behind me, passed, and continued off into the distance. Perhaps no Zoom zoom at him. And I'm pretty sure there's no pump gasoline now that doesn't contain 10% ethanol, which ought to allow slightly higher compression, regardless of octane rating. I know there doesn't seem to be any without ethanol around here in Texas, and we make the stuff (gasoline,that is). Racing fuel has all the goodies and OMG the price. Blame the ethanol on others. I doubt there are many real problems associated with 10% ethanol and Benz 102 or 103 engines. Date: Tue, 29 Dec 2009 13:46:15 -0500 From: LarryT l02tur...@comcast.net Message: 14 Date: Tue, 29 Dec 2009 13:49:34 -0500 You asked fuel with ethanol in a '91 300E I think the question is moot - can you buy fuel *without* 10% E? LarryT 91 300D Message: 5 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 2009 21:01:17 +1030 From: Hendrik Fay heni...@ozemail.com.au Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? FAIK the 103 is the same as the 102 but has two more pistons and more get up and go. Also compression in the 102 is not the same, UK motors have higher comp than the Oz models. Hendrik Robert Bigham wrote: My 1983 123.223 has 9.0 to 1 compression on 102.980 (Euro and Rest of World Specification) engine. Has Bosch CIS not CIS-E injection. Marked on body at fuel cap BLEIFREI SUPER. Book says use 93 RON (Research Octane?). For a long time I ran 92 octane (R+M)/2. Finally I said what the hey and tried 87 (R+M/2). Timing set per book. No problems whatsoever. 27 mpg on highway 80 mph and less. 20-22 mpg in general driving mostly in town lots of starts and stops. Top speed well exceeds 105 mph indicated. I understand 120 mph indicated is close. I haven't tried it. FWIW I think the 102 engine may be a little technically advanced in design compared to a 103. Maybe not. Has hemispherical combustion chambers, sohc with long rocker arms, and I think canted valves. I know my 102.980 hung
[MBZ] Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not?
My 1983 123.223 has 9.0 to 1 compression on 102.980 (Euro and Rest of World Specification) engine. Has Bosch CIS not CIS-E injection. Marked on body at fuel cap BLEIFREI SUPER. Book says use 93 RON (Research Octane?). For a long time I ran 92 octane (R+M)/2. Finally I said what the hey and tried 87 (R+M/2). Timing set per book. No problems whatsoever. 27 mpg on highway 80 mph and less. 20-22 mpg in general driving mostly in town lots of starts and stops. Top speed well exceeds 105 mph indicated. I understand 120 mph indicated is close. I haven't tried it. FWIW I think the 102 engine may be a little technically advanced in design compared to a 103. Maybe not. Has hemispherical combustion chambers, sohc with long rocker arms, and I think canted valves. I know my 102.980 hung the moon in my book. Zoom zoom at all of you. Yesterday a 123 (diesel?) that must have been going at least 90 mph on Interstate 20 in Fort Worth came up behind me, passed, and continued off into the distance. Perhaps no Zoom zoom at him. And I'm pretty sure there's no pump gasoline now that doesn't contain 10% ethanol, which ought to allow slightly higher compression, regardless of octane rating. I know there doesn't seem to be any without ethanol around here in Texas, and we make the stuff (gasoline,that is). Racing fuel has all the goodies and OMG the price. Blame the ethanol on others. I doubt there are many real problems associated with 10% ethanol and Benz 102 or 103 engines. 9. Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? (OK Don) 10. Re: Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? (Dieselhead) 11. Re: Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? (OK Don) 12. Re: Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? (Mitch Haley) Message: 9 Date: Tue, 29 Dec 2009 11:15:48 -0600 From: OK Don okd...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List Mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? What is the general thought on fuel with ethanol in a '91 300E? -- OK Don Date: Tue, 29 Dec 2009 12:04:42 -0600 From: Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? 10% blend worked fine in our 230TE M103 Being a Euro tuned engine, I think it has higher compression than US models. Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? Message-ID: No issues with disolving seals, etc. in the fuel system? On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 12:04 PM, Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com wrote: 10% blend worked fine in our 230TE M103 Being a Euro tuned engine, I think it has higher compression than US models. Message: 12 Date: Tue, 29 Dec 2009 13:38:52 -0500 From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel for a 103 Vergasser engine? Ethanol or not? OK Don wrote: No issues with disolving seals, etc. in the fuel system? I never had any issues in my 1977 SAAB with Bosch CIS running E10 in the mid-late 1980s. Anything made after about 1985 should have been built with E10 in mind. Mitch. Message: 13 Date: Tue, 29 Dec 2009 13:46:15 -0500 From: LarryT l02tur...@comcast.net Message: 14 Date: Tue, 29 Dec 2009 13:49:34 -0500 You asked fuel with ethanol in a '91 300E I think the question is moot - can you buy fuel *without* 10% E? LarryT 91 300D ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Secret message for OK Don
You are just jealous because the voices are talking to me and not you. 1. Re: Secret message for OK Don (OK Don) Message: 1 Date: Fri, 16 Oct 2009 20:45:23 -0500 From: OK Don okd...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Secret message for OK Don Enjoy! On Fri, Oct 16, 2009 at 5:43 PM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: The eagle has landed. Looks good. Thanks again -Curt -- OK Don ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] ticketable
Unfortunately, we have let the same power-hungry pol grou get into the Texas Legislature. Now it's all passengers in any seat muset be beltedsince September 2009. On the other hand, not wearing belts does indeed help eliminate the bottom of the gene pool. I have worn seat belts since 1963, and they help your ass hold on to the seat. Seat belts have saved my life twice, the way I see it. From: pm7...@comcast.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] ticketable To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Rotten Cop, pulling you over so he could give you a Phony citation for not wearing a seat belt. And he used his supervision to see this wile you were driving past at 54mph. My intended retirement domicile is in Texas, according to the local newspaper about once every 2 weeks someone is dead or grievously injured after being ejected from their pick-up truck. No seat belt rule there, helps to purify the gene pool. -- Peter Arnold Windsor, CT ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Black goo in fuel
Hello Lee If no one else comes up with a remedy other than new fuel tank, let me know and I'll copy some information on getting rid of bacteria or whatever (black goo) in diesel and snail mail it to you. It's supposed to be possible and even not too idfficult - you just have to do it right. Best regards Robert Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:45:39 -0600 From: Lee Einer l...@dosmanosjewelry.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] black goo in fuel My wife's 1980 300CD has been getting black goo in the fuel system. Recently, we had to replace the in line fuel filter twice on a 120 mile trip. What to do? I just called our local diesel repair shop. The helpful mechanic said that there was no way to clean the tank and that we would have to have a replacement fuel tank installed. LOL, I think not. How do y'all deal with algae or bad diesel crapping up your filters? Any helpful advice? ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Engine 102 oil filter draining down (Yes indeed it does).
Hello Wilton It drains down. My filter housing is on the driver's side of the block. It has a lid on top held on with a long bolt, remove bolt, take off cap, lift old cartridge out to the top. All done from above. Drain is in the bottom and seems to go directly into oil gallery and back through the pump into the sump. I sent you a way to see an image of the parts on a MB factory EPC earlier. Thanks for your interest. Robert Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 13:51:53 -0400 From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? Car Identification So, from what I'm seeing on oil filters on similar engines of that time, oil can't drain DOWN from your filter with engine off, can it? Wilton ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 44, Issue 81
Hello Loren Make me an deal on chain and tensioner. I have a new piston, spring, and wire clip for the tensioner up top on the side of the head, but might not be able to find them. I understand there might be any of several curved rail tensioners inside the timing case - at least one has a replaceable plastic shoe - but I won't know which I have until I open the beast up. I use Castrol 20W-50 most of the time with a quart of Rislone (to make my son happy; he says the General recommends it) and 1/3 bottle of GM Assembly Lube to make sure there's plenty of whatever a rubbing tappet needs. I have a box (lifetime supply) of filters bought on the cheap on ebay - Hengst, Mann, Knecht. The cartridges are indeed small. Horrible confession: I sometimes don't change oil as often as I should. Once I let it go 10,000 miles, and whatever makes 20W-50 act like 50 must have worn out. My oil pressure dropped a lot and I was really worried. Fresh oil change restored oil pressure then. I promise to be good in the future. Thanks for your interest Robert Message: 1 Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:53:25 -0500 From: Loren Faeth lfa...@leadingchange.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] 102 engine oiling, time lag, filters, noises, whatever M102 has a single row chain. You should measure chain stretch, at least roughly. It may or may not need to be replaced. If you nee a chain, I have a new chain and tensioner that I will make you a deal on. Ended up selling the car before I got the new chain in. Are you using dino oil or M1? M1 might quiet things down some. As was cited before, be sure to use Knecht or Hengst filters. An inferior filter could allow oil to drain out, where the OE filter might not. Your filter is not much bigger than the oil filter on a BMW /5 motorcycle engine, so it does not hold a lot of oil. At 11:36 AM 7/17/2009, you wrote: Hello Wilton, Curt, Tyler, and any lurkers Thank all of you for your interest. Wilton, your time lag seems like mine. You don't apparently have noises, and I do. The noises are not big except after a real road trip - it seems as if things really drain dry after a stop when the oil is as hot as it gets on the highway. My oil filter has a long bolt through the middle with no pipe, no hole, no spear, and no o-rings. Bolt has threads on the bottom and accepts a sealing washer on the top. The filter housing drains essentially dry when filter removed. Curt - the noises go away when the oil pressure comes up, for which Gott sie Dank. Tyler - I hope to avoid an experience like yours. I'm sure you understand why. But I do have a spare engine that's supposed to be good with 106K miles on it. I have read that one ought to replace the timing components somewhere between 150,000 miles and 200,000 miles. I suppose I ought to overhaul the timing components with my 156,000 miles and strange noises. As best I can tell, if the timing chain lets go, I'm likely to need that spare engine. Best regards to all Robert ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 102 engine oiling, time lag, filters, noises, whatever
Hello Wilton, Curt, Tyler, and any lurkers Thank all of you for your interest. Wilton, your time lag seems like mine. You don't apparently have noises, and I do. The noises are not big except after a real road trip - it seems as if things really drain dry after a stop when the oil is as hot as it gets on the highway. My oil filter has a long bolt through the middle with no pipe, no hole, no spear, and no o-rings. Bolt has threads on the bottom and accepts a sealing washer on the top. The filter housing drains essentially dry when filter removed. Curt - the noises go away when the oil pressure comes up, for which Gott sie Dank. Tyler - I hope to avoid an experience like yours. I'm sure you understand why. But I do have a spare engine that's supposed to be good with 106K miles on it. I have read that one ought to replace the timing components somewhere between 150,000 miles and 200,000 miles. I suppose I ought to overhaul the timing components with my 156,000 miles and strange noises. As best I can tell, if the timing chain lets go, I'm likely to need that spare engine. Best regards to all Robert Message: 6 Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 16:46:16 -0400 From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? Time lag Just started my '87 300D for first time today; 28 hours since I shut it down yesterday; 'best I could tell, it took about 4 seconds for oil pressure to go to 3 bar after start and at idle. I'll try that and the '91 350SDL again tomorrow. 'Think this has been mentioned before - if your oil filter canister is the type with the small pipe down through the middle of the filter, next time you change oil and filter, be sure to put new little O-rings (2 on mine) on that center pipe and make sure the little hole in the side of the pipe near the top of the pipe is clear and air/oil can flow freely through the little hole and down the pipe. Wilton From: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? Time lag Do the noises go away as soon as the pressure comes up? When you first described the problem I figured it was just normal, my 240D seems slow but on my car its more like 2-3 seconds with no real scary noises, 5 seconds with noises is wrong. I don't have any 102 engine experience per-say and apparently the oil filter arrangement is different than the OM6xx since on those the filter cap has a big spear down through the filter. The spear has 2 rubber o-rings and when they get old and hard the pressure is slow to rise. If you didn't absolutely know the o-rings weren't there I'd still give a check for them, wipe down the spear thing (assuming your car has one) and look for grooves near the last 1/4 of the spear, there should be o rings on them. The o rings do not come with the oil filter, you have to order them separately. -Curt Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 13:52:36 -0700 From: tyler casi...@usermail.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? Time lag I had an M110 powered car that made noises like that once. I got my stethoscope out to see where the noise was coming from, and revved it a little bit to make the noise louder. Suddenly the motor stopped dead from 2,000 rpm and a few pounds of aluminum chunks fell onto the ground under the engine. I sold the car for $200 (twice what I paid) and never found out what it was... That was my first and last gasoline powered Mercedes. Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? Car Identification
Hello Frederick and Wilton Frederick, you may have identified the real problem. The tensioner is tensioned by oil pressure and restrained from total relaxation by a ratchet mechanism. I have read to overhaul timing components, probably replace chain, between 150,000 miles and 200,000 miles. I have 156,000 miles. cThanks. Wilton, The car is 1983 230E, a 123 Chassis with Engine 102.980. It's a rest of world model not imported to or sold in the States by Daimler-Benz. An individual imported this one after taking delivery in Stuttgart and driving around Europe for a couple of years. Anything you can tell me or suggest is helpful. Best regards to all Robert From: Frederick W Moir fred.s...@verizon.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? Time lag Hi, All. When I picked up my '85 190E, there was the distinct possibility that the very worn chain would fly off the worn sprocket with unhappy results. The oil pressure took almost 20 secs. to peg the gauge. Newchain and sprocket, cleaned out the Tensioner. and it ran very well, with 2-3 second oil pressure rise, until the trans. died, twice. Check your chain? Also used a Rusty approved filter, many after-market filters are sh, um er poor. (Dare I say M1?) YMMV Fred Moir Lynn MA Diesel preferred. Hello Wilton; I'm back ! It seems that from a stone cold overnight wait, it's about 5 seconds from the time the engine starts until oil pressure is shown on the dash gauge. During that time the engine makes little metallic tapping and clicking noises. Message: 2 Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 17:34:28 -0400 From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? Time lag BTW, remind me what car this is. I'll try to look up some stuff. Oh, BTW, again, I'm NOT an OIL system EXPERT. Wilton ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] problem while driving 190E2.3
Hello all I had a similar-sounding problem with my 1983 230E car with 102.980 engine. Would be running fine, then just stop. After a wait it would start up and go on like nothing ever happened. Problem was finally (after several months) traced to the connector at the distributor end of the green wire. It was breaking up and would break the circuit at odd times. Repaired connector with Devcon 5 and so far so good. Fuel had nothing to do with my problem. Good luck Robert Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 17:35:52 -0400 From: Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] problem while driving 190E2.3 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 4a5f9d38.6060...@voyager.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Hursley wrote: Hi all, I am trying to seek your wisdom on my '93 190E2.3 car. The battery is good as it register 12.8V before starting and 14.4V while running. I just replace the tension pulley about a month ago and belt about a year ago. The problem is while driving, the engine mysteriously shut off by itself. On my 1986 2.3-16, the fuel pump relay decides the engine isn't running and shuts the fuel off. Since it's a manual trans, the engine keeps spinning and the alternator keeps charging, but the car slows down. I shut off the ignition for five seconds, turn it back on and proceed along my merry way (until it happens again). If that's the trouble, a pump relay for your car is about half the price of a pump relay for my car, but still around $100. (Make that $137) http://buymbparts.com/item.wws?sku=W0133-1611020itempk=77553mfr=Kaehlerweight=0.27 Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? Time lag
Hello Wilton; I'm back ! It seems that from a stone cold overnight wait, it's about 5 seconds from the time the engine starts until oil pressure is shown on the dash gauge. During that time the engine makes little metallic tapping and clicking noises. From a 1 hr rest period and a semi-warm restart, it's more like 1 second from the time the engine starts until oil pressure is shown on the dash gauge. I haven't had an opportunity to restart after a real road trip and a rest, but I can tell you it's slow, and the engine makes larger metallic tapping and clicking noises, which some have dismissed as timing chain rattle, or something like that, until the dash gauge indicates oil pressure. These noises are big enough that my son the race engine builder was impressed by the noises. I'm sure there can't be a whole lot wrong, because I can cruise at 80 mph all day (I don't like to drive a whole lot faster than that). I have almost no noticeable oil consumption. I have driven the car at indicated 105 mph and it had some left. Total indicated mileage 155, 7xx miles. Mileage driven by me 31,000 so far. Thanks for your interest. I'll be interested to see what you think. From: Robert Bigham edward_baldh...@earthlink.net Subject: Re: Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? Hello Wilton Good question, I suppose. Right now all I can say is Long enough that I think it shouldn't take that long. I will try to time it the next several times I start up and will furnish a number as best I can. Thanks for your interest. Robert 2. Re: Will athe real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? (WILTON) Message: 2 Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 12:51:48 -0400 From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will athe real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 590e1688d9c946c8ba7407a4eaf48...@wiltonpc Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original So how long DOES it take to go 3 bar from cold start? Wilton ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up?
Hello Wilton Good question, I suppose. Right now all I can say is Long enough that I think it shouldn't take that long. I will try to time it the next several times I start up and will furnish a number as best I can. Thanks for your interest. Robert 2. Re: Will athe real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? (WILTON) Message: 2 Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 12:51:48 -0400 From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will athe real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: 590e1688d9c946c8ba7407a4eaf48...@wiltonpc Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original So how long DOES it take to go 3 bar from cold start? Wilton ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up ?
Hello Peter I don't remember seeing any hard black things on the center bolt when changing filter. Bolt comes out slick through cap. You can bet I will inspect carefully in the canister and on the bolt and wherever else at the upcoming filter change. There are some small parts packed with the filters I have; I haven't seen where they should go, and obviously need to be more diligent. My engine is 102.980. Best regards Robert 2. Re: Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? (Peter Frederick) Message: 2 From: Peter Frederick psf...@earthlink.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up? To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com The o-rings will look like two hard black rings on the bolt instead of o-rings. Rock hard and brittle by now. I believe all 60x engines have them. They are not supplied with a new oil filter. I replace the ones on my car every other oil change or so to prevent exactly your problem. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will athe real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up?
Hello Peter and thank you I believe you're telling me to check in the filter housing - O ring seals on center bolt. Filter changing time comes very soon - I'll check the situation. IIRC, the bolt comes out clean and has no grooves for O ring. Are you telling me the filter cartridge has a full flow part at bottom and bypass part above? I'll cut a filter cartridge to see this. I don't seem to have low oil pressure, I seem to have a lag between start up and oil pressure being shown on dash gauge. Most of time oil pressure is 3 bar. Ususally 1.2 bar at idle, maybe drops down to 1 bar at hot idle. Hot idle we have plenty of here about now. Been 105 F one day most days 102-103. Supposed to continue for at least another week. If I owned Hell and Texas, I would rent out Texas and live in Hell. - attributed to Gen'l William Tecumseh Sherman Message: 3 Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2009 15:17:00 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: Peter Frederick psf...@earthlink.net Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up ? To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Inspect the center bolt -- likely the two rubber o-rings near the bottom are petrified and worn out, allowing the oil to drain back into the sump. Also, next time you replace a filter, be careful not to dislodge the interal seal between the full-flow portion at the bottom and the bypass filter above, as this will both allow the filter housing to drain back AND result in low oil pressure. Replacing the o-rings often cures noisy tappets as well. If that is not the case, suspect the pressure control valve that opens when oil pressure exceeds 3 bar or so. If it is leaking, oil will drain back and you will have low oil pressure at idle. Peter -Original Message- From: Robert Bigham edward_baldh...@earthlink.net Sent: Jul 8, 2009 1:15 PM To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up ? Hello all: One of you is bound to know. Give it up. Why is it that my Engine 102 oil pump and main oil gallery seems to lose prime every time I stop the engine, and it takes a noticeable time to attain oil pressure on the dash gauge after startup? Makes no difference if cold start or hot restart. I know or think I know it's really oil pressure transmitted through a capillary or very small line. It seems to my simple mind the oil pump and main gallery ought to stay primed, or at least ought not drain dry every time the engine stops. Is there something wrong, some unknown check valve missing/inoperative? Something else? Inquiring minds want to know. I'm pretty sure the oil filter housing is supposed to drain back when I uncap it and pull the old cartridge out, or at least I think I remember reading that in FSM. But every time I stop the engine ? Mercy. OTOH, it doesn't seem to have done any harm. Just bugs me. Is it just a lag caused by air somewhere in the oil pressure gauge line? Is it something else. Thanks for your help. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Will the real expert on oiling system of Engine 102 please stand up ?
Hello all: One of you is bound to know. Give it up. Why is it that my Engine 102 oil pump and main oil gallery seems to lose prime every time I stop the engine, and it takes a noticeable time to attain oil pressure on the dash gauge after startup? Makes no difference if cold start or hot restart. I know or think I know it's really oil pressure transmitted through a capillary or very small line. It seems to my simple mind the oil pump and main gallery ought to stay primed, or at least ought not drain dry every time the engine stops. Is there something wrong, some unknown check valve missing/inoperative? Something else? Inquiring minds want to know. I'm pretty sure the oil filter housing is supposed to drain back when I uncap it and pull the old cartridge out, or at least I think I remember reading that in FSM. But every time I stop the engine ? Mercy. OTOH, it doesn't seem to have done any harm. Just bugs me. Is it just a lag caused by air somewhere in the oil pressure gauge line? Is it something else. Thanks for your help. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Letter from a Dodge Dealer; unsubscribe
Sadly, Gary has his the nail on the head. Anyone who entered an exchange with Tom quickly learned that Tom is one of those people who knows everything about everything. and more to the point, admits it. The list will not lose much technical knowledge by Tom's departure. There are others who can run circles around him. From: Gary Hurst jabbahur...@gmail.com wrote tom strikes me as a blowhard bully type who hangs around with simple people he can easily push around with his wisdom. dealing with a little smarter and somewhat less compliant group enrages him. i get the feeling that closed minded snob means anyone who disagrees in tomspeak. On Mon, May 25, 2009 at 1:29 AM, Ed Booher edboo...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, May 23, 2009 at 12:42 PM, Tom Hargrave tharg...@hiwaay.net wrote: I just realized that I belong to a group of closed minded snobs who believe that the American Auto industry should die. These same people have no interest in alternate opinions and will not take the time to look at the impact on our economy or the people who work for them and I officially quit. And, by the way, this group just lost a technical resource - me. By Thanks, Tom Hargrave ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20090525/bf4d43ea/attachment.html -- ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com End of Mercedes Digest, Vol 42, Issue 130 * ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes 123 sedan four wheel alignment
Hello All A while back I asked for advice concerning the need for four wheel alignment on my 123 regular length sedan before buying an expensive set of tires. One asked about tire wear, one asked about road conditions, and one just said do it, IIRC. My alignment shop, who is pretty good or seems to be, says the car has no adjustments on the back. Yes it has IRS, but no adjustments. Fixed alignment by manufacture. Anybody want to comment? Thanks ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 560SEL radiator
Well, why not piggyback on this? I have a good used Behr radiator for a 280E (123 Chassis) that I bought on the mistaken representation it was for a 230E. It's too wide. Interferes with air cleaner on 230E. I had to run it with pantyhose on the air intake for a month or two while while Rusty got me a new Behr radiator for the 230E. It's a hell of a good radiator and I have a hell of a good crate to ship it in. For sale cheap. How bout $50 plus shipping? Anyone for this one? Thanks. 1. Anyone need a 560SEL radiator? (1986) (Brian Smyla) From: Brian Smyla bsm...@gmail.com Subject: [MBZ] Anyone need a 560SEL radiator? (1986) I was cleaning out my storage area, and I found a radiator that I'd removed from a 1986 560SEL that I'd parted out. If anyone needs one, feel free to email with an offer. Not sure which other cars this might fit. -brian ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] W123 regular sedan four wheel alignment?
Hello folks Does anyone care to opine on W123 regular length sedan four wheel alignment? Some say she do, and some say she don't. Is it something that should be part of maintenance or precede an expensive set of tires? Thanks to all. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] How to carry a refrigerator home in a Smart
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 18:48:49 -0400 From: Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu Subject: Re: [MBZ] How to carry a refrigerator home in a Smart To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com It's just like putting a giraffe in a refrigerator: Open the door, put the giraffe in, close the door. Message: 16 I suspect that was photoshopped. I've seen a Smart, it looks like it could fit INSIDE a refrigerator. Allan andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com writes: That's a great pictorial definition of metastable. On Mon, Mar 9, 2009 at 12:57 PM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: cargosmart.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 61368 bytes Desc: not available URL: http://okiebenz.com/pipermail/mercedes_okiebenz.com/attachments/20090309/4e9e3d69/attachment.jpg ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] It is a Mercedes, so it must be worth a lot, right?
At one time it was worth a lot. Denial is not just a river in Egypt. It is no more trouble to wish for a grocery store than a loaf of bread. I have a book somewhere that tells of a scheme to trade two $500 cats for a $1000 dog. Same kind of thing. Message: 10 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 15:38:40 -0600 From: R A Bennell b...@mts.net Subject: [MBZ] It is a Mercedes, so it must be worth a lot, right? This car is absolutely mint,been in family for 17 yrs,unfortunetly the engine has seized due to a leaky oil ring and negligence to repair motor had run dry of oil,only has 240 000km,s which is nothing on a diesel.The car is flawless ,mint body blue in color,with a mint blue leather int,all options work stored indoors sacrifice price asking $3600 O.B.O This ad has run here locally for months. It is for a 1985 300SD. I cannot imagine anyone being willing to pay that price for a car with a seized engine. Also cannot understand why it is relevant that it has been in the family for years and stored inside etc when it doesn't even run. Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] 123 turbo diesel engine in rural Texas salvage yard
FWIW, more than a year ago, I stopped at this salvage yard just to see if they had any Benz stuff. They had a 123 300D that says Turbo Diesel on the right side of the trunk lid; it was supposed to have an automatic transmission that worked part of the time; otherwise OK. Supposed to have good engine. Supposed to have been trade to some local guy for and Oldsmobile or something like that. Today I stopped back in, and the same Benz was back. They said the guy got a new project. Now this is supposed to be a good engine - if anyone is interested, Maldonado's Salvage Yard located on Texas Highway 6 a mile or so north of the Navasota River in Brazos County Texas. Has a Navasota phone number. I'll bet the engine could be got wuite cheaply, and it may be quite good. The first time I saw the car, it was definitely being driven up until very soon before I saw it. Body is a rust bucket. Some interior (beige) looks pretty much OK. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Gas gauge and temperature gauge jump up, fall back: Comments?
Hello all I had to replace the steering lock on my 1983 123.223. 230E gasoline engine 102.980 in 123 Chassis, which required removing the instrument cluster. Now with everything back in, while driving, the gas gauge and temperature gauge will occasionally jump up and then fall back and maybe jump up again or jump up and down half a dozen times: Gas goes from maybe the mark below full to full, temperature goes from maybe 100C to 11OC. Car is not overheating and that is for sure. Gas tank is not being topped up and then the top up removed, again for sure. It seems as it the incidents are becoming fewer and farther between. Does anyone have a comment or something to share on this? Why's it happening? If I ignore it, is it likely to go away? Is it evidence of something wrong that I ought to correct? Thanks for all your expertise; you have many more Mercedes miles than I. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] 124 series 300D Ujoint, 1990 model I think
Does anyone know how to beat the requirement (I understand) to replace the entire dirveshaft at something like $700 for parts when all that is needed is to replace the Ujoint in the middle of it? I'm asking for a friend, and really know nothing except what he told me. He says BMW does a similar thing, but he beat it on his race car. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] W123 trim on C pillar
Hello Hendrik You tried to help me a little when I had a trim removal question. Thank you. No one else tried. I suppose they didn't/don't know. I think you are talking about the short piece of trim, maybe 30 cm long and 3 cm wide, mounted where the roof meets the rest of the body behind the back door. Has a painted center section. If so, I have one off and one on that needs to come off. In a week or so I'll know how to get it off undamaged, and if that's the piece you are asking about, I'll share with you. I can tell you now that it is merely a matter of knowing what one is doing, and does not require any magic or cutting. Robert Bigham, enabler of ed_baldhead Message: 15 Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 11:28:43 +0930 From: Hendrik Fay [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] W123 trim on C pillar To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Hi folks, gotta remove the trim that sits on the bottom of the C pillar, anyone got a clue on how to do this without the use of angle grinders or gas axe? Hendrik with a 123 that needs some loving ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] W201 190D Transmission vacuum diagram/advice needed
Hello Tyler If you don't have it figured out by now, maybe this will help: MBZ published a separate manual on the automatic transmission, ora at least they did on the 123. Transmission models are 722.2, 722.4, and like that. There's a boss on the case with the model number stamped on it. Failing the Mercedes Manual, try Automatic Transmission Service Group (ATSG), who publish overhaul manuals which surely must contain the information you are seeking. Cost is reasonable, like maye $15 plus mailing cost. Good luck. 6. W201 190D Transmission vacuum diagram/advice needed (Tyler Backman) Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2008 13:08:17 -0700 From: Tyler Backman [EMAIL PROTECTED] WROTE Subject: [MBZ] W201 190D Transmission vacuum diagram/advice needed To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes I have a 1987 190D Turbo, and the previous owners mechanic brilliantly solved a transmission control vacuum leak by hooking the transmission modulator directly to the vacuum pump, so it flared/ slipped like crazy but didn't shift harshly. I'm trying to reconnect everything properly, but can't seem to find a diagram that shows me what each port is on the vacuum amplifier, injector pump leak valve, etc. I have the Mercedes W201 manual CD, but it appears to make no mention of the transmission or vacuum system at all (which I find rather weird). Does anyone know where I could get this info? Even a W124 manual would be helpful! By guess and check I was able to get it working somewhat, but pressure at the transmission modulator still doesn't drop to 0psi at WOT, and I'm a bit worried that I'm going to fry my transmission if I drive it with too much vacuum at the modulator. I have to drive over 300 miles tomorrow, so I'm hoping to sort this out tonight :( Tyler ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Help!!! (again). Anyone know how to get stainless trim off 123 roof?
Help!!! I need to get the little spear or scimitar-shaped piece of stainless trim off the roof of my 123 sedan right where the roof joins the belt line just behind the back door. Reason? To fix rust hole right under tip of scimitar. Part of getting ready for paint. I have the FSM buried somewhere under tons of junk. Anyone know how in twenty-five words or less? Anyone know if it's in FSM? Tnak all of you. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] 82 300CD wiring diagram
I think I do, in a Mercedes book of wiring diagrams. If you don't already have one, let me know and I'll check. Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2008 12:24:58 -0700 (PDT) From: B Dike [EMAIL PROTECTED] WROTE Subject: [MBZ] 82 300CD wiring diagram? To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Hi, ? Does anyone have a wiring diagram for a 82 300CD?? I am trying to debug my starter troubles and the diagram in the Haynes manual is almost useless. ? Thanks, ? Bruce ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT:Obooma. again; the coming of (you fill in the blank)
Here is the real story, for anyone who hasn't seen it. Subject: Report on Obama's trip by NBC (with apologies to NIV) From The Times July 25, 2008 He ventured forth to bring light to the world The anointed one's pilgrimage to the Holy Land is a miracle in action - and a blessing to all his faithful followers Gerard Baker And it came to pass, in the eighth year of the reign of the evil Bush the Younger (The Ignorant), when the whole land from the Arabian desert to the shores of the Great Lakes had been laid barren, that a Child appeared in the wilderness. The Child was blessed in looks and intellect. Scion of a simple family, offspring of a miraculous union, grandson of a typical white person and an African peasant. And yea, as he grew, the Child walked in the path of righteousness, with only the occasional detour into the odd weed and a little blow. When he was twelve years old, they found him in the temple in the City of Chicago, arguing the finer points of community organization with the Prophet Jeremiah and the Elders. And the Elders were astonished at what they heard and said among themselves: Verily, who is this Child that he opens our hearts and minds to the audacity of hope? In the great Battles of Caucus and Primary he smote the conniving Hillary, wife of the deposed King Bill the Priapic and their barbarian hordes of Working Class Whites. And so it was, in the fullness of time, before the harvest month of the appointed year, the Child ventured forth - for the first time - to bring the light unto all the world. He travelled fleet of foot and light of camel, with a small retinue that consisted only of his loyal disciples from the tribe of the Media. He ventured first to the land of the Hindu Kush, where the Taleban had harboured the viper of al-Qaeda in their bosom, raining terror on all the world. And the Child spake and the tribes of Nato immediately loosed the Caveats that had previously bound them. And in the great battle that ensued the forces of the light were triumphant. For as long as the Child stood with his arms raised aloft, the enemy suffered great blows and the threat of terror was no more. From there he went forth to Mesopotamia where he was received by the great ruler al-Maliki, and al-Maliki spake unto him and blessed his Sixteen Month Troop Withdrawal Plan even as the imperial warrior Petraeus tried to destroy it. And lo, in Mesopotamia, a miracle occurred. Even though the Great Surge of Armour that the evil Bush had ordered had been a terrible mistake, a waste of vital military resources and doomed to end in disaster, the Child's very presence suddenly brought forth a great victory for the forces of the light. And the Persians, who saw all this and were greatly fearful, longed to speak with the Child and saw that the Child was the bringer of peace. At the mention of his name they quickly laid aside their intrigues and beat their uranium swords into civil nuclear energy ploughshares. From there the Child went up to the city of Jerusalem, and entered through the gate seated on an ass. The crowds of network anchors who had followed him from afar cheered Hosanna and waved great palm fronds and strewed them at his feet. In Jerusalem and in surrounding Palestine, the Child spake to the Hebrews and the Arabs, as the Scripture had foretold. And in an instant, the lion lay down with the lamb, and the Israelites and Ishmaelites ended their long enmity and lived for ever after in peace. As word spread throughout the land about the Child's wondrous works, peoples from all over flocked to hear him; Hittites and Abbasids; Obamacons and McCainiacs; Cameroonians and Blairites. And they told of strange and wondrous things that greeted the news of the Child's journey. Around the world, global temperatures began to decline, and the ocean levels fell and the great warming was over. The Great Prophet Algore of Nobel and Oscar, who many had believed was the anointed one, smiled and told his followers that the Child was the one generations had been waiting for. And there were other wonderful signs. In the city of the Street at the Wall, spreads on interbank interest rates dropped like manna from Heaven and rates on credit default swaps fell to the ground as dead birds from the almond tree, and the people who had lived in foreclosure were able to borrow again. Black gold gushed from the ground at prices well below $140 per barrel. In hospitals across the land the sick were cured even though they were uninsured. And all because the Child had pronounced it. And this is the testimony of one who speaks the truth and bears witness to the truth so that you might believe. And he knows it is the truth for he saw it all on CNN and the BBC and in the pages of The New York Times. Then the Child ventured forth from Israel and Palestine and stepped onto the shores of the Old Continent. In the land of Queen Angela of Merkel, vast multitudes gathered to hear his voice, and
Re: [MBZ] Warped rotor question
Long ago, in a past life, I had a new VW Rabbit. My first set of disk brakes. On a 500 mile trip to South Louisiana, a brake application resulted in shimmy and shudder like a front wheel and rotor (held on with 4 hub bolts and one tiny screw) might be about to come off, although none did. Trip finished, returned to dealer with complaint about brakes. Dealer put goo (Plastilube) on backs of pads. No more problem ever in 100,000+ miles after that. I believe that in cases of rotors mounted to hub like a Benz or some Benzes, some will advise truing a newly installed rotor. It cannot be wrong to check for TIR, possibly .005 max. Benz may have a specification on TIR. It is also true that if rotors are stocked in the auto parts store/warehouse on edge instead of lying flat, they may warp. No guarantee on that actually happening. From: Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote to To: 'John Robbins' [EMAIL PROTECTED], Warped rotors can be caused by corrosion on the face of the hubs. The unevenness will translate into inevenness in the rotor. From: John Robbins [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Warped rotor question with bonus I'm an idiot story I decided to replace the pads and rotors on the 2.5T today... The old rotors were pretty thin and there was an occasional shuddering when coming to a stop. Thinking it was a warped rotor and since they were thin I just decided to throw parts at it and see what happened. Anyway, I'm putting one of the rotors on, and it is noticeably warped when you spin it on the car. I tried to mount it again, but still had the same problem. What gives? I doubt it came warped from Rusty. There was still a slight bit of shudder while driving, but I don't know for sure because of my idiot story. Any ideas? Idiot story: While on the test drive the brakes started making a horrible metal on metal sound... Turns out I put one of the pads in backwards (pad side to piston, backing side to rotor). So I'm going to find out the hard way if the rotor from Rusty was warped seeing as there are some nice chunks missing out of the one on there now!! :( John ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Removing lower door trim 123 sedan - Help!
You may get this twice, once fromthisaddress and once from another. My apologies for any problems this may cause. I need help from some of you smart people. I’m trying to remove the plastic trim piece on the bottom outside of the driver’s door on my 1983 230E on 123 chassis for body repair and painting. I found a plastic nut on the back end of the trim piece under a plug, and can see plastic pins pushed through four prong expanding spiders in holes in the door skin all along the door (viewed from inside with door panel off). I can’t seem to push the posts back through or loosen the trim piece to amount to anything except near the plastic nut. How does one get the plastic trim off? Does it survive removal, or does it perish? Inquiring minds want to know. Thanks in advance for any light shed on this. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Brain picking: Moving switches off lower part of 123 console
The idea of keeping the car until my son takes it away from me isn't to preserve it for him - he's a hot rodder and drag racer, and is into thunder motors - it's that I'm a cheapskate on cars - no new one is worth (to me) what it costs. I intend to keep it forever and never buy another replacement car. I like the Benz. If he takes it away from me, it will probably be because he's decided I'm a menace on the road and it's time for him to step in. If/when that happens, he will probably be correct. OTOH, his tastes may change as he gets older. [Original Message] From: OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: 12/30/2007 5:17:38 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Brain picking: Moving switches off lower part of 123 console BTDT = Been There, Done That. Good to hear that you're thinking ahead and maintaining the car for your son. My son is driving the '81 240D that his great grandfather bought new. It's been though four generations now. Unfortunately, I got it when my father decided that it needed work, and he didn't want to mess with it! On Dec 30, 2007 4:26 PM, Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Someone asked me if I intended to keep/drive the Benz until my son takes it away from me, and I said yes. That's how I'm thinking. I have a head gasket set, a starter, and alternator, a radiator, and many small parts ratholed. Fourway switch will fit right in. -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics. -Benjamin Disraeli and/or Mark Twain '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Brain picking: Moving switches off lower part of 123 console
Hello folks I'm about to replace my fourway flasher switch in order to pass state inspection. That's if cleaning attempts fail. It's had too many cups of coffee and water and who knows what else spilled on it. Works when it wants to - maybe works OK a dozen times in a row and then doesn't work for the next dozen times. Does disable the turn signal switch when it doesn't work. It costs $26 for a Hella switch locally, so that's not too bad. Still not good. I keep looking at the five blank locations up high on the console and thinking why not put it there instead of down low where everything that gets spilled runs into it? Why not put the speaker balance switch there too? . Has anyone else thought of this or tried it? Is ther something I can learn from you instead of learning everything the hard way? Thanks. Robert ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Brain picking: Moving switches off lower part of 123 console
Thanks for sharing your experience, Jim. It gives me confidence. The new switch is ordered, and it can go on the shelf with some other stuff I have ratholed against possible future need. Someone asked me if I intended to keep/drive the Benz until my son takes it away from me, and I said yes. That's how I'm thinking. I have a head gasket set, a starter, and alternator, a radiator, and many small parts ratholed. Fourway switch will fit right in. I actually have a pretty intense electrical day planned for January 1 - when I intend to buff all the contacts in the fuse box and buff and install new fuses. According to some of what I've read, that ought to fix some electrical problems, maybe inclucing some I don't even know I have. Bought a new Dremel in a box with a flex shaft and two cup brushes for this project. As an indication of how important I think it is, my usual stle wouild be to try to buy one really cheap at a pawnshop. I just marched into the tool place and bought this one. BTDT (?) Goes past me. Please interpret. Thanks again for your experience.Robert - Sun, 30 Dec 2007 11:13:23 -0800 From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] WROTE Subject: Re: [MBZ] Brain picking: Moving switches off lower part of 123 console I'm about to replace my fourway flasher switch in order to pass state inspection. That's if cleaning attempts fail. Take it apart and clean it with a Dremel wire brush. Re-grease it and reassemble, and it will be good as new. BTDT. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 1987 300SDL; No good deed ever goes unpunished
And how! Years ago I went on a road trip to rescue of a young relative who owned a VW bug: Valve clearances had closed up and the thing overheated and stopped on the road about 100 miles from here and 80 miles from her home. I drove the 100 miles, loosened up the valves, and BTW gave her a used tire that I had ratholed, because she had no spare. She'd ruined a tire on the way. Told her I didn't know if it was good or not, but since it held air it was a lot better than no spare. She drove on home and the bug ran OK. I drove 100 miles back, and thougt how I had done something good for once. Months later she let me know the free tire had come apart after short use. Seemed to think I had made her a victim by giving her a tire that proved to be a POS. No good deed ever goes unpunished. Mark Twain said that if you take a stray dog, feed it and make it prosperous, it will not bite you, and that is the principal difference between dogs and humans. But I do not learn from all my mistakes, and continue to try to help people out when I can. DUH! Robert -- Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] WROTE To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 9:32 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] 1987 300SDL A car deal gone south can hurt a friendship in a hurry. I sold a 1978 Olds Cutlass to my Sister In-law 3 months later, I got a call. She litterally screamed at me through the phone. The car was at a local garage with 2 blow head gaskets she accused me of selling her a lemon. I asked what happen and she stated that the red Hot light came on. I asked what she did next and she stated that she drove it (17 miles) to a friends house. And why? Because her friend had a phone she could use - this was pre-cell phone. As it turns out, the radiator spring a leak the coolent ran low. This was 100% her fault but if you ask her today, 20 years later, she will still tell you that I sold her a lemon. At least I didn't finance the car. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 25, Issue 190
Copper crush washers. Intriguing. No savvy. Please educate me. I have seen wave washers, which are sometimes called metric lock washers, althought split lock washers in metric sizes are available. I have seen copper and aluminum sealing washers, used at bolted joints that need to hold water or oil, on oil drain plugs, and at sensors that screw into water or oil. I have seen representations of double Bellville spring washers (facing each other) in the Benzes literature, but never seen the actual washers. Presumably there are also single Bellville spring washers. But a crush washer. What's that? I can only think of a crush sleeve as used in some pinion bearing setups. I'd like to know. Also, why not save a ton of time and buy it from the dealer who sells that kind of car? Can the time spent on a search that may not pan out possibly be balanced by the presumed cost saving associated with avoiding the dealer's parts bins? Or is this abou the satisfaction of being able to say I did it myself. much like the little red hen? Just curious on that. --- Thu, 27 Dec 2007 10:07:57 -0500 Allan Streib [EMAIL PROTECTED], wrote Subject: [MBZ] seeking source for copper crush washers Not directly MB related, but I am looking for a source to buy M14 and M16 sized copper crush washers. These are specifically for reconnecting power steering fittings on another vehicle. I found one site that list them, but they do not take web orders for less than $25. http://www.xs-engineering.com/xsstore/pc/viewCat_m.asp?idCategory=192 Tried a few local auto parts stores with no luck. Have not tried NAPA yet or the dealer but if those fail anyone else know of anyplace I can source these? Allan -- 1983 300D 1966 230 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 25, Issue 190
Planting tongue firmly in cheek, and speaking as a graduate of the Columbia School of Washer Identification, not affiliated with CBS, (removes tongue from cheek), I think it's properly called a sealing washer. I have seen assortments of copper sealing washers in auto parts stores, mainly sold as drain plug washers. Good luck. Benzes use them in lots of places. Be careful you don't lose them. They can be beastly hard to find when you need one or two. [Original Message] From: Allan Streib [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: 12/27/2007 1:16:07 PM Subject: Re: Mercedes Digest, Vol 25, Issue 190 Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have seen copper and aluminum sealing washers, used at bolted joints that need to hold water or oil, on oil drain plugs, and at sensors that screw into water or oil. That's what I'm talking about. A soft metal (copper or aluminum) washer that crushes when the fastener is tightened, deforming to create a seal. Perhaps this is not the correct term? In this case I need them for the adapter fittings on a (non-MB) power steering rack. I think I have found acceptable items at Pep-Boys of all places. I'll have to check tonight how close the fit is compared to the original. Allan -- 1983 300D 1966 230 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Rustproofing [was: Re: Chrysler Lifetime Warranty]
Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 01:00:16 -0600 From: Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] Rustproofing [was: Re: Chrysler Lifetime Warranty] The problem with steel is that a sheet will have areas with positive and negative ions. Add a conductive solution, like salt water, and you have instant galvanic corrosion (a shorted battery). This is what causes steel car bodies to rust. No other metal or metal alloy has this trait. - Tom, you're correct insofar as all corrosion is electrolytic. Corrosion requires an anodic site, a cathodic site, a hard connection between them and a connection made through an electrolyte. It is an electrolytic cell not different in principle than a battery. Flow of electrons and all that. Parts of the same piece of metal may be anodic or cathodic with respect to other parts. This follows from the crystalline nature of metals. Happens all the time in pipelines, for example. That is why all serious corrosion involves pitting. You're wrong insofar as saying that No other metal or metal alloy has this trait. Many alloys do. I would have to believe that other pure or near pure metals do also, since they are all crystalline. For example, brass faucet seats, particularly on hot water service, will corrode in a pattern that resembles a tortuous path carved out across the sealing surface. This is caused by what is called dezincification, which is removal of the zinc part of the brass alloy; the zinc being anodic with respect to the copper, by an electrolytic cell brought about by the heat in the water and the change in t emperature of the water across a tiny leak. Anyone who has fixed a seriously leaky hot water faucet has seen it. Similar happens when brass and copper radiators get too many miles and years on them: The white stuff that may form on the header where the tubes enter is a corrosion product of the lead in the solder that joined the tubes to the header. It is the bloom of death for the radiator. You can't fix it. There are doubtless other examples. But all corrosion is electrolytic - that's a fact. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] FW: Re: Cleaning enigine inside with synthetic oil
Hello Curt The injectors are Bosch CIS inectors original equipment on the Benz. Engine 102.980. It would seem to make sense to pull a sample for oil analysis after a long road trip and compare to one from before the trip. I suppose I could use one of the oil suckers that were discussed for it seemed like weeks a while back. My son's wife commutes 20+ miles one way and he swears by the cleanliness inside her engine. - Original Message - From: Curt Raymond To: [EMAIL PROTECTED];Diesel List Sent: 11/28/2007 12:13:58 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Cleaning enigine inside with synthetic oil Whoops, sorry didn't realize you were talking about a gasser. You'd mentioned something about injectors, was that a replacement? I'd wonder if after a good road trip of a couple hundred miles say you take a sample and see if it still shows the fuel contamination. 6 mile trips are going to be all hell on oil, the engine never really warms up in that short a period... If fuel contamination forces you to change oil at less than 8,000 miles I'd say theres no point at all in using synthetic oil. My wife was driving my pickup all the time, her commute was about 6 miles round trip. We moved and now she's up to 20 miles round trip. I should do some more analysis and see if the problems have dissipated. Even with the fuel contamination 8,000 mile oil changes weren't a problem and since it was keeping the rear main leak at bay I kept with it. -Curt Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Curt, I am one of the Benz gasser gang. I do have a diesel VW. The Benz is the one I asked about cleaning inside the engine. I do a lot of 6 mile trips, some longer, and some real road trips. No futzing around for a few blocks at a time. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 24, Issue 155
27 Nov 2007 11:37:01 -0800 (PST) From: Curt Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] Cleaning enigine inside with synthetic oil Ideally you want to use an oil with lots of detergents thats good at suspending crud and depositing it in the filter. Synthetic oil is great at that. However that said I'm sure good diesel oils are also quite good. My 190D was badly gunked up. Early oil analysis indicated very high iron levels. However after a couple changes and hard driving the iron levels started to come down and now (nearly 2 years later) are normal at 10,000 mile intervals. If I had another badly gunked up engine I'd probably run conventional oil in it and change at 3,000 miles. If that sample showed high levels of any bad stuff I'd run conventional again until the gunk levels (iron and such) came under control, then I'd switch to synthetic and work up to a longer interval. -Curt 27 Nov 2007 12:39:27 -0600 From: Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] Cleaning enigine inside with synthetic oil In recent issues, some have remarked that Mobil 1 or (maybe) similar synthetic oils will clean out interior engine nasties, or words to that effect. Is that for real? I'm talking about the black almost crusty crap that may accumulate on interior engine surfaces. I'd like to hear from someone who claims to have actually done it. Assuming it is for real, how does one use it for this purpose? Change oil and filter, obviously. Then run for how long? How many miles/change oil and filter cycles are thought needful? Thanks all. -- Maybe I don't have a problem, and just don't like the looks of what I see. My oil analysis is normal or so the NAPA testing company says, except I (10 or 15 thousand miles back) had excessive fuel, check fuel system. I've been doing that and will finally get the injectors tested after January 1. Car starts and runs very well and now is getting a solid 25 mpg on the road at 70+ mph steady. Top speed well exceeds indicated 105 mph - a friend claims to have driven it at indicated 120 mph. Not me, at least not yet. No ignition problems. There may be an injector leaking down to put the excessive fuel in the oil, or so I have been told. I use Castrol 10W-40 or 20W-50, depending on the temperature when I change oil. Have changed oil and filter at about 7,000 miles, which I have determined is too long, it ought ot be 5,000 miles max. Oil stays pretty clean until 4,000 miles or so, with no noticeable oil consumption until after 5,000 miles. Then it will get rid of a quart in another 1,000 miles or so. But there is lots of black crusty crap on interior engine surfaces. It's the sort of stuff that gets removed in a hot vat at overhaul. Should I just put on my big boy breeches and not even think about it? I think I am hearing change to Mobil 1 and change the filter frequently, like maybe 1,000 miles for a while. I have a whole box of filters and can change them when I choose. Keep on talking. I'm listening. Robert . ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Cleaning enigine inside with synthetic oil
Curt, I am one of the Benz gasser gang. I do have a diesel VW. The Benz is the one I asked about cleaning inside the engine. I do a lot of 6 mile trips, some longer, and some real road trips. No futzing around for a few blocks at a time. Wed, 28 Nov 2007 07:09:47 -0800 (PST) From: Curt Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED], who wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] Cleaning enigine inside with synthetic oil To: Diesel List mercedes@okiebenz.com My gasser pickup periodically has trouble with fuel in the oil but thats usually after a period of mostly short trips. I thought diesels were largely immune to the problem since they tend to be lean burn anyway. Do you take mostly short trips? If so I probably wouldn't bother with synthetic, short trips stack the deck against any oil... -Curt Wed, 28 Nov 2007 05:41:48 -0600 From: Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] Cleaning enigine inside with synthetic oil In recent issues, some have remarked that Mobil 1 or (maybe) similar synthetic oils will clean out interior engine nasties, or words to that effect. Is that for real? I'm talking about the black almost crusty crap that may accumulate on interior engine surfaces. I'd like to hear from someone who claims to have actually done it. Assuming it is for real, how does one use it for this purpose? Change oil and filter, obviously. Then run for how long? How many miles/change oil and filter cycles are thought needful? Thanks all. -- Maybe I don't have a problem, and just don't like the looks of what I see. My oil analysis is normal or so the NAPA testing company says, except I (10 or 15 thousand miles back) had excessive fuel, check fuel system. I've been doing that and will finally get the injectors tested after January 1. Car starts and runs very well and now is getting a solid 25 mpg on the road at 70+ mph steady. Top speed well exceeds indicated 105 mph - a friend claims to have driven it at indicated 120 mph. Not me, at least not yet. No ignition problems. There may be an injector leaking down to put the excessive fuel in the oil, or so I have been told. I use Castrol 10W-40 or 20W-50, depending on the temperature when I change oil. Have changed oil and filter at about 7,000 miles, which I have determined is too long, it ought ot be 5,000 miles max. Oil stays pretty clean until 4,000 miles or so, with no noticeable oil consumption until after 5,000 miles. Then it will get rid of a quart in another 1,000 miles or so. But there is lots of black crusty crap on interior engine surfaces. It's the sort of stuff that gets removed in a hot vat at overhaul. Should I just put on my big boy breeches and not even think about it? I think I am hearing change to Mobil 1 and change the filter frequently, like maybe 1,000 miles for a while. I have a whole box of filters and can change them when I choose. Keep on talking. I'm listening. Robert ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Cleaning enigine inside with synthetic oil
In recent issues, some have remarked that Mobil 1 or (maybe) similar synthetic oils will clean out interior engine nasties, or words to that effect. Is that for real? I'm talking about the black almost crusty crap that may accumulate on interior engine surfaces. I'd like to hear from someone who claims to have actually done it. Assuming it is for real, how does one use it for this purpose? Change oil and filter, obviously. Then run for how long? How many miles/change oil and filter cycles are thought needful? In a past life I knew a fellow who would pour the same gallon of diesel through an engine repeatedly for this purpose with engine initially warm but not running. He would change the diesel when he thought it was nasty enough and quit when he stopped getting black nasties dissolved or suspended in fresh diesel.d Does anyone have any comment on that? Does anyone have a recommended other procedure for the same purpose? Thanks all. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 1985 380SE if anyone is interested
Thu, 22 Nov 2007 14:18:34 -0500 Ed Booher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] 1985 380SE if anyone is interested To: [EMAIL PROTECTED],Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com On Nov 21, 2007 5:53 AM, Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has had $1995 CASH on the windshield for months. I'll bet it would go for a lot less to a real cash buyer. Walk in, slam a single Benny down on the counter and ask Where's the title Ed -- I'm a Night Elf Mohawk! - Mr. T. Thu, 22 Nov 2007 15:06:19 -0700 Craig McCluskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote $100? Craig Craig:: I think probably that's what he means. --I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man. - Robert Duvall in the character of Lucky Ned Pepper in True Grit Ciao. Robert ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Parking car in gear
I'll tell you: I don't know. - Tevye the milkman in Fiddler on the Roof. When one cylinder leaks down and the crankshaft turns, another comes up on the compression stroke. Or so it seems to me. The attempt to move the car with the transmission in any gear requires turning the engine faster than it might crank manually. In a lower gear, it really turns faster. This I think reduces the tendency of the car to move and self rotate the engine. Sometimes an old engine with weak compression will actually allow a car to move a bit, a herky jerky bit, especially in top gear. Robert [Original Message] From: Peter Merle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: 11/26/2007 5:24:57 AM Subject: Parking car in gear I have always been puzzelled how a car can continiously by held in position by the compression of 1 cylinder by leaving it in gear ( manual tranny ) . One would think that eventually ( after a few seconds/minutes ) the rings will leak air and the car would then lurch fwd and then start a runway. This does not seem to happen though. Any thoughts on the physics involved? PEter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] How I really feel about Hylomar (was Losing cooland, somewhere)
Actually, I think it's pretty good stuff. -- From: LarryT [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: 11/19/2007 3:16:56 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Losing cooland, somewhere Come on Robert - tell us how you *really* feel about Hylomar!! Don't be so shy! ;-) Larry T (67 MGB, 74 911, 78 240D, 91 300D) www.youroil.net for Oil Analysis and Weber Parts Test Results http://members.rennlist.com/oil PORSCHE POSTERS! youroil.net Weber Carb Info http://members.rennlist.com/webercarbs . - Original Message - From: Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:27 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Losing cooland, somewhere I get Hylomar HPF in a small tube marketed by Permatex for some ungodly price like $14 at auto parts stores here. Blue stuff. Consistency of grease. A thin coating works great for any water or oil holding paper or cork gasket. Don't know about head gaskets. I understand the Brits invented it during WW II the big one to allow them to turn fighter aircraft around sooner by reducing maintenance time. It makes gaskets turn loose of flanges instead of turning to stone requiring hours of scraping. My son the drag racer has used Permatex No. 2 on the pan side and Hylomar HPF on the block side to allow pan drops at the track and replacement using the same gasket without damage. It's great stuff. Everyone should use it instead of that nasty stinking silicone. Plus it washes off your hands with with water. Let's hear it for Hylomar!! HYLOMAR, HYLOMAR, RAH, RAH, RAH ! TIGER ! BEAT THE HELL OUT OF SILICONE !! You all did fine. Thank you. --- Sun, 18 Nov 2007 21:30:21 -0500 From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Losing coolant, somewhere Scott Ritchey wrote: What about Hylomar? I've had good results with it. Does permatex still sell it in FLAPS for $5 or so? I found some on the net for something like $20 a tube. Mitch. -- ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1137 - Release Date: 11/18/2007 5:15 PM ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] 1985 380SE if anyone is interested
WDB CA32C9FA170135 Showing 259,373 miles. Seems to have been sold in Dallas. Appears to have had engine replaced with used 1983 engine (paint marks like wrecking yards use on engine). Tan seats pretty worn front and back Body looks straight - has dings. Looks rust free. I didn't look too hard for rust. Original paint has clear coat perishing like they do in Texas. Some kind of metallic metal color gold or silver like. Has spent a lot of time parked in the sun. Seats show it. Location Megahertz Motors (low end used car lot) Bryan Texas 979 822 3800. Starts/runs - he moves it around the lot. I have no idea how it drives out. Has had $1995 CASH on the windshield for months. I'll bet it would go for a lot less to a real cash buyer. You folks know. Is this a real POS or maybe a deal for someone? Not for me. I don't need no Daimler Benz V8. I got enough problems already. . Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] EarthLink Revolves Around You. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Losing cooland, somewhere
I get Hylomar HPF in a small tube marketed by Permatex for some ungodly price like $14 at auto parts stores here. Blue stuff. Consistency of grease. A thin coating works great for any water or oil holding paper or cork gasket. Don't know about head gaskets. I understand the Brits invented it during WW II the big one to allow them to turn fighter aircraft around sooner by reducing maintenance time. It makes gaskets turn loose of flanges instead of turning to stone requiring hours of scraping. My son the drag racer has used Permatex No. 2 on the pan side and Hylomar HPF on the block side to allow pan drops at the track and replacement using the same gasket without damage. It's great stuff. Everyone should use it instead of that nasty stinking silicone. Plus it washes off your hands with with water. Let's hear it for Hylomar!! HYLOMAR, HYLOMAR, RAH, RAH, RAH ! TIGER ! BEAT THE HELL OUT OF SILICONE !! You all did fine. Thank you. --- Sun, 18 Nov 2007 21:30:21 -0500 From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Losing coolant, somewhere Scott Ritchey wrote: What about Hylomar? I've had good results with it. Does permatex still sell it in FLAPS for $5 or so? I found some on the net for something like $20 a tube. Mitch. -- ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] euro car question
Tue, 13 Nov 2007 10:57:12 -0600 Kaleb C. Striplin \(CAT\) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: [MBZ] euro car question Is there a way to tell what country a euro car was originally sold in, or produced for? Will the VIN number or something reveal that - Sometimes, but not always AFAIK, a particular model is associated with a particular country, or there is a version of a particular model associated with a particular country. For example, 123.223 is a rest of the world Mercededs model not sold by Daimler Benz in the US. There is a Japanese version of 123.223, a German version, a Swedish version, a Swiss version, I think an Austrian version, and maybe others. They differ in detail from each other, most outstandingly in the engine compression ratio, Which is 9:1 in the German version and 8:1 in some others, particularly the Japanese version. Engine power is 100 KW on 9:1 engines and IIRC 86 KW on 8:1 engines. There are versions of 123.223 with 14 in. wheels and versions with 15 in. wheels for countries with bad roads. Similar with hard and standard suspensions. There are air cleaners for desert use. The list of relatively minor variations that are dispositive of the intended sale point of a car goes on and on. This kind of information is in little almost pocket size books published by Daimler Benz called Technical Data, Passenger Cars. I have a January 1983 edition, which is on point for my car, an August 1983 manufactured 123.223 German version. It was deliveed at Stuttgart to a US citizen who drove it around Europe for a couple of years and then imported it tothe US. It was federalized by some outfit in North Carolina. If companies that federalize euro cars still exist, they should know where a car came from. The information is also buried in the Electronic Parts Catalog, which US dealers have access to, but in my experience generally pull a Sergeant Schultz (I know nothing!! Nothing at all !!) when asked about euro parts. I think that if you have the book or access to the EPC, you can most likely identify what kind of euro car you have. At least you can get close. You can also email Mercedes Benz USA who can send you the datat card that identifies the original equipment on the car and the key codes. They clearly know more, and may be able to tell where it was delivered originally.. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] euro car question
Without having tested it, I'd say this is the truth coming out. And from the list curmudgeon, no less. Thank you Hendrik. I don't care what everybody says, you're OK at bottom. Cheers. -- Wed, 14 Nov 2007 08:05:22 +1030 Hendrik Fay [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] euro car question I believe that the VIN for a MB destined for use outside of the US is different. As such I don't know what the US type VIN will tell but I know the normal VIN will tell what country the car was sold in originally. This is handy to determine if a car is grey market or not. This site will work for most VIN numbers http://www.mbclub.ru/mb/vin/?lng=eng or http://www.benzworld.org/modelguide.html? Kaleb C. Striplin (CAT) wrote: Is there a way to tell what country a euro car was originally sold in, or produced for? Will the VIN number or something reveal that? ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Free flat fixing
Wow. I'd like that.. Discount Tire has it seems like dozens of guys working about six bays, and they are fast. But it takes a long time to be served at the counter. Like I said, bring a book. [Original Message] From: Loren Faeth [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: 11/5/2007 5:21:10 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 24, Issue 20 Lex Brodies In Honolulu was all that and SPEED! Lex would have someone at your car before you stopped rolling and got it parked. They had a time guarantee, I think it was 30 Min. or free. If you got a set of tire, they'd have 3-5 guys working on your job. It was an amazing place. After Lex Died, it was sold, And I had already moved off the Island by then. Don't know what it is like now, but it was good entertainment back about 1990 or so. Often by the time you got the work paid for the car was ready to go. At 01:27 PM 11/4/2007, you wrote: Sun, 4 Nov 2007 00:32:26 -0700 From: Zoltan Finks [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Honda use of dramatically unequal treads - Opinionswanted Thanks, all. I decided to put a plug in the flat tire since I have a kit. We don't plan any long trips in the near future, so I thought I'd save the money and try the repair myself. We used to charge $6 for a tire plug and $7 for a patch when I worked at a service station; I know it costs a lot more than that now. If I recall, Firestone charged me to rebalance the tire after patching it when I took one to them a while back. Surprised they didn't charge me to dispose of the nail. Thanks again for the info. Brian --- - --- Hello Brian In Texas and I think most of the southwest we have Discount Tire Company (may also be called America's Tire Company), who changes/fixes flats free including rebalancing even on tires they didn't sell. They will charge you to mount a tire they didn't sell: cost me $5 recently. Maybe you have them convenient to you. They want you to remember them and maybe buy tires from them. I can testify they are a tire company that does what they say they will do - which is directly opposite my experience with almost all others. I won't buy tires anywhere else, or haven't for a while. They are a few dollars lower priced than Sam's or WalMart compared on an equal basis. The downside is you have to go there and wait to be served at the counter. Then you have to wait for the work to be done. It can take a while. Bring a book. Alternatively, change the flat and leave the tire and wheel for repair. Then you have to go there and wait to be served again. But they do what they say they will. That is refreshing to me. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Free flat fixing
Oh, but they are expanding. Wait a few hundred years and they may be in your town too. - Original Message - From: andrew strasfogel To: [EMAIL PROTECTED];Mercedes Discussion List Sent: 11/5/2007 10:00:55 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 24, Issue 20 Another downside is that they are in TX! On 11/4/07, Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sun, 4 Nov 2007 00:32:26 -0700 From: Zoltan Finks [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Honda use of dramatically unequal treads - Opinionswanted Thanks, all. I decided to put a plug in the flat tire since I have a kit. We don't plan any long trips in the near future, so I thought I'd save the money and try the repair myself. We used to charge $6 for a tire plug and $7 for a patch when I worked at a service station; I know it costs a lot more than that now. If I recall, Firestone charged me to rebalance the tire after patching it when I took one to them a while back. Surprised they didn't charge me to dispose of the nail. Thanks again for the info. Brian --- Hello Brian In Texas and I think most of the southwest we have Discount Tire Company (may also be called America's Tire Company), who changes/fixes flats free including rebalancing even on tires they didn't sell. They will charge you to mount a tire they didn't sell: cost me $5 recently. Maybe you have them convenient to you. They want you to remember them and maybe buy tires from them. I can testify they are a tire company that does what they say they will do - which is directly opposite my experience with almost all others. I won't buy tires anywhere else, or haven't for a while. They are a few dollars lower priced than Sam's or WalMart compared on an equal basis. The downside is you have to go there and wait to be served at the counter. Then you have to wait for the work to be done. It can take a while. Bring a book. Alternatively, change the flat and leave the tire and wheel for repair. Then you have to go there and wait to be served again. But they do what they say they will. That is refreshing to me. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 24, Issue 20
Sun, 4 Nov 2007 00:32:26 -0700 From: Zoltan Finks [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Honda use of dramatically unequal treads - Opinionswanted Thanks, all. I decided to put a plug in the flat tire since I have a kit. We don't plan any long trips in the near future, so I thought I'd save the money and try the repair myself. We used to charge $6 for a tire plug and $7 for a patch when I worked at a service station; I know it costs a lot more than that now. If I recall, Firestone charged me to rebalance the tire after patching it when I took one to them a while back. Surprised they didn't charge me to dispose of the nail. Thanks again for the info. Brian --- Hello Brian In Texas and I think most of the southwest we have Discount Tire Company (may also be called America's Tire Company), who changes/fixes flats free including rebalancing even on tires they didn't sell. They will charge you to mount a tire they didn't sell: cost me $5 recently. Maybe you have them convenient to you. They want you to remember them and maybe buy tires from them. I can testify they are a tire company that does what they say they will do - which is directly opposite my experience with almost all others. I won't buy tires anywhere else, or haven't for a while. They are a few dollars lower priced than Sam's or WalMart compared on an equal basis. The downside is you have to go there and wait to be served at the counter. Then you have to wait for the work to be done. It can take a while. Bring a book. Alternatively, change the flat and leave the tire and wheel for repair. Then you have to go there and wait to be served again. But they do what they say they will. That is refreshing to me. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] More brain picking - Anti-lock brakes this time
Hello all Who knows something about anti-lock brakes? My situation is the book says that my 1983 123.223 230E may have been originally equipped with anti-lock brakes but it's not possible to add them later. I've found some wiring that is anti-lock brake parts on the front wheels. It's not the brake lining wear indicator wiring, it's a wiring part 126 540 25 17 and 26 17 called Sender unit. Searching for the right brake lining wear indicator wiring is what caused this. The wear indicator wiring is 126 540 82 07 and 81 07. Not the same part. Has different syle mpc connectors than Sender unit. I have a big impressive looking Bosch brake somethingorother on the driver's fender shield - always thought it was just the proportioning valve or something like that. Now I notice it has wiring going in the end opposite the brake lines. The car stops well with no indication of trouble. I intend to do a pretty good brake job before too much longer. Anyone's input will be welcome. If you know anything about anti-lock brakes you are ahead of me. Thanks. Robert ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OM603 prechamber cross-threaded: Tool image. Free rambling advice.
Sun, 21 Oct 2007 21:21:35 -0500 Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] OM603 prechamber cross-threaded Here is the tool. http://www.samstagsales.com/SirTool/stm0046.jpg One end is fine thread (for the OM61x) and the other is a course thread (OM 60x). My end is the course end, maybe a 0.75 thread? -- Luther KB5QHUAlma, Ark Hello Luther Nice looking tool. It seems to have a thread protector on each end in the samstagsales cut, and a nice round part between the two ends. I presume each end threads into the appropriate size prechamber, and gets the prechamber out by the miracle of opposite hand threading. At least I hope that is close to how it works. If I'm really wrong please correct me. It seems there's way more round part between the two business ends than the bare minimum necessary to hold it for lathe work if that's appropriate. I really doubt that lathe work is going to prove possible or appropriate. For one thing, the threads are obviously quite short. For another, they are surely metric, and no or almost no American lathes need apply. Perhaps not. Maybe you can get really lucky. After all, you got the cross threaded prechamber out. Do not miss the opportunity to get a proper metric die, assuming you have access to a good nut and bolt store. Size x mm x 0.75 pitch. You can measure it without too much of a problem, and it you can't the nut and bolt store can. Failing that, call Wholesale Tool in Houston, TX. Failing Wholesale Tool, call McMaster Carr Supply Company in Chicago. They (McM-C) are relatively expensive but they have the stuff or access to it when others don't.. If the threading is such that there is a regular metric die available, that's part of the way to go. Realize that any thread rehab program can only be successful if the threads are still there and merely boogered up. If the thread metal has been torn badly or is gone, you are out of luck trying to rehab the threads. It wouldn't be wrong to ask samstag sales about this. They are a good organization, (good guy, I think) and you are probably not the first to have the experience you are having. There may be an easy way,a nd they may know it. If they do, they'll tell. This kind of work (thread rehab) is hand work done on bench, and you can do it as well as anyone, and a lot cheaper than most. Small hammers/chisels are good tools to carefully, gently, but firmly push boogered threads back where they ought to be. Needle files (Wholesale Tool) or a metric thread file (also Wholesale Tool) or both are good tools to reestablish the thread profile and get nasties and irregularities off the threads. Gauge the effectiveness of your thread rehab program by testing whether the rehabbed threads will screw into a prechamber the way they should. I presume you can hold a prechamber in your hands outside of a head. Take it easy. File, fit, and file some more. If threads are destroyed on the end you need, they are destroyed. I offer you this regarding cutoff of damaged hreads and the utility of a cut off tool, FWIW. Several years back I was involved in a program of load testing anchor bolts epoxy set in drilled holes in concrete. We had some hellish problems with threads that were slightly oversize on the bolts whereas the threads in our tooling were standard. We finally solved the problems with .005 in. oversize taps (Wholesale Tool) which we used to work over the threads in our tooling. But along the way we learned that two threads engagement is not enough, and three is. I have always been told that, but never saw it demonstrated until the awful summer of the bolt load tests. With two thread engagement, we would regularly pull the threads out of our load test tooling, specifically Grade 5 alloy coupling nuts. Ordinary coupling nuts are Grade 3 mild steel, and the Grade 5 alloy nuts were expensive and hard to get. With three thread engagement, we never pulled any threads out, but we did pull out some set bolts. . And there were hundreds of bolts on many old bridges being retrofitted with guard rails because there was not enough money available to widen them. That was the problem: The bolts were at first not set correctly so that they could resist the required pull, and we oulled themn out in buckets full. After that problem was solved, the bolts proved to be too weak to hold the required pull. We would sometimes snap the bolts on the next to last step of load. Sometimes they would work. When I got to the bottom of it, the Texas Department of Transportation specification was faulty, and would allow Grade 3 mild steel bolts to be furnished, (which the cheap supplier furnished, and another good one did not), whereas the pull specified for set bolts needed a Grade 5 alloy (called B-3 or something similar) bolt to hold it. If you think it
Re: [MBZ] OM603 prechamber cross-threaded: Tool image. Free rambling advice.
Hello Alex I suspect without knowing that the prechamber tool threads are something like 15 to 20 to 25 mm in diameter, rather large compared to most capscrews, machine screws, and tap and die sets, but it could not hurt to inquire of set vendors. The worst that can happen is to be told no. I have to wonder if the cost to rehab the tool makes economic sense on any basis, and why not just say it's a good tool that got the cross threaded part out, Hooray, Hooray, Hooray, and saved a head at the cost of its own life, and buy a replacement tool. Frame the old one or put it in a shadow box as a trophy of experience, or in honor of old times, or to remember to not crossthread any more prechambers, or something like that. Earlier this year I learned the hard way there are times when what you should do is sacrifice a cheap part (a $45 tool) to save an expensive one (a cylinder head, OMG what would even a bare casting cost?). My auto machine shop owner son already knows. Learned it from his machine work mentors, not from me. In my own case, if I had been smart instead of so damn hard headed and single minded, I would have taken a die grinder and a whiz wheel and sacrificed two transmission cooler soft lines (actually, the union nuts) at about $8 each instead of damaging a transmission cooler hard line (nearly two whole days consumed to repair and still not as good as original; seeps a little. New one will cost something like $75 estimated and may have have to come from Germany) and effectively destroying a radiator (the replacement for which did actually cost $383 (Or was it $283? Seems like I ought to know.), delivered from Germany via Rusty, and is absolutely positvely not available except from the Fatherland) after consuming more than one whole day trying to shop repairs. I mean talk about learning the hard way. Ow! I haven't done anything quite so dumb in years except maybe argue in print with Tom Hargrave, whether I was right then or not. But at least the dearly learned knowledge is fresh for the time being. Find a cheap part to sacrifice. Find a cheap part to sacrifice. Find a cheap part to sacrifice. Experience is a hard school, but a fool will learn in no other. Robert --- -- Alex Chamberlain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Date: 10/22/2007 1:18:39 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OM603 prechamber cross-threaded: Tool image. Free rambling advice. I am very happy with a metric tap die set I bought from www.thetoolwarehouse.net a while back for $60 or so. I haven't had the pleasure (?) of using it for anything Mercedes-related yet, but so far it has had everything I've needed to clean up old threads in half a dozen different sizes on my other furrin cars. Alex Chamberlain '87 300D Turbo et al. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes transmission oil, was King pin grease
Mon, 15 Oct 2007 23:00:25 -0700 From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] King pin Grease Robert Bigham [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote (problem with using 80/90 EP gear oil in Mercedes manual transmissions is) Not well known to me. There are many things I have never heard of, and that is just one of them. Please tell me more, as I would like to know about this situation. Jim Cathey wrote As some on these mailing lists have found out the hard way, the syncro metal in the manual transmissions is susceptible to being attacked by one of the additives in regular gear oil that helps heavy steel gears hold up under extreme loading. Phosphorus? Anyway, lots of cars use gear oil in the tranny, but not these. They want ATF, and not just because of the lighter weight. I have not personally had the problem, nor do I want to! -- Jim Hello Jim Friday I took the time to look in my owner's manual. I found that manual transmissions need automatic transmission fluid for manual transmissions and that my automatic transmission needs automatic transmission fluid for automatic transmissions. In either case, any Mercedes dealer can advise on the proper fluid, or words to that effect. Clearly, 80/90 EP gear oil is not the right stuff for Mercedes manual transmissions. It's still not clear to me what is the right stuff. Fortunately, I don't really need to know. I don't know if I would expect to see a warning on a bottle of 80/90 saying don't use this in Mercedes manual transmissions. I have seen bottles of power steering fluid that say OK for all but Honda power steeering, and other bottles saying for use in Honda power steering. I bought a bottle of some kind of oil for my power steering that is supposedly the right stuff for Mercedes. Has a label in German and cost $9/liter IIRC. . When we changed the fluid and filter in my automatic transmission, we used Dexron/Mercon fluid, which my independent mechanic (who sold the power steeering fluid) said was the right stuff. I certainly hope so. And I use S grade oil in my M102 engine, and don't change it as often as I think I should. Some manual issued by Daimler-Benz says every 7,500 miles. Oil gets pretty dark by then, and starts to be consumed noticeably after maybe 5,000 miles. Oil and filter change are on today's list of things to do. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OM603 prechamber cross-threaded
Sun, 21 Oct 2007 02:09:21 -0500 From: Luther - laptop [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] OM603 prechamber cross-threaded I'm looking to call local machine shops and see if they can help. I'd like to sound like I know what I'm looking for before I start calling.. Luthe On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 20:28:16 -0500, Barry Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Luther - I'm guessing the die for that would be more than a new tool. If you have a friend with a lathe that knows how to single point threads that may be a way to go, but to pay a machinist to do that would be way more than the tool. How about using a metric thread file? Barry Hello Luther It's always good to sound like you know what you're looking for. Metric threads are gauged by pitch, that is, the length in millimeters per thread. American threads are gauged by the number of threads per inch. I'm not going to say there's no such animal, but I suspect that lathes having the gears and lead screws needed to cut American threads do not also have the gears and lead screws needed to cut metric threads. I believe you would need a lathe manufactured to metric standards, which might be hard to find. To rehabilitate the threads on a lathe, there would have to be some way to chuck or hold the tool without masking the threads. I have no idea what the tool looks like, and no way to know how it might be held. Also, it is a bit of a trick in lathe operation to get on to old threads, although it can be done. Try the metric thread file or just a new three cornered file of about the right size. Alternatively, say to yourself the tool was sacrificed to save the much greater value of a head. Experience varies directly with equipment ruined. -- A Nony Mouse ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OM603 prechamber cross-threaded
Hello Jim You wrote . . . gear ratios. If there's enough of them you can put on just about any thread pitch you'd want. True enough, but there are only few American thread numbers or pitches.They are all whole numbers of threads per inch except for some old pipe threads, IIRC. None of them work out to be a multiple or an aliquot part of 25.4 threads/inch, so we can't do 1 mm thread pitch or 0.75, 0.5, etc mm on a lathe made to American thread standards. No lathe is purposely equipped to do non standard threads e. g. 4.25 threads/inch, although it would be technically simple to do so. It would merely require suitable gears and a suitable lead screw. No American lathe that I have seen will cut thirty threads per inch, which is a common threading on British bicycle parts. I have tried on that and failed. I think I have heard of a set of gears and a lead screw for some American lathe that make metric thread pitches doable on that lathe, but that was an odd conversion and not a general condition. So it is not a problem of enough monkey and typewriters or of simply being ornery enough to do it. It is not a problem of enough gears, because there are only so many gears, and all of them have a particular purpose. They are not just out there on the off chance that someone will want some non standard thread. To cut a particular thread, you need the right gears, and there are only so many of them. Lathes will only do what they can do. Look on any change gear box to see the possible threadings. If you need metric threads, you need a lathe that does metric threads. You can't just mess with an American lathe enough until all of a sudden it does metrics, however convenient it might be if you could. ___. Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] OM603 prechamber cross-threaded edward_baldhead wrote I'm not going to say there's no such animal, but I suspect that lathes having the gears and lead screws needed to cut American threads do not also have the gears and lead screws needed to cut metric threads. Jim wrote On a lathe it's all about gear ratios. If there's enough of them you can put on just about any thread pitch you'd want. -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Salvage door desiderata (MY 300 SD got hit)
Fri, 19 Oct 2007 18:33:08 -0700 From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] MY 1985 300SD got hit ... They are recommending finding a salvage door. Out side of inspecting the door before it is 'messed with' (to be sure it is cancer free), any suggestions? ___ Get one the same color as original, that'll minimize repaint problems. ___ -- Jim ___ Hello Jim I agree. It sounds like the most reasonable of notions. I also offer that when I tried for several months to find a 123 sedan driver's door painted Astral Silver Poly, a color that was used for many years (And it seems like I meet a different 123 painted that color on the road maybe twice weekly.), the persons with whom I corresponded (and a Want it Now on ebay) produced nothing but doors painted blue, white, and other colors. And they were all shells only, no hardware or glass. Clearly, some of the people thought I must be crazy to want a used door already painted my color. Color change would have cost maybe $150 at my favorite body shop. I gave up and repaired minor rust on the old door. I hope George has better luck than I. Robert ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Salvage door desiderata MY 1985 300SD got hit
Sat, 20 Oct 2007 09:57:32 -0500 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] MY 1985 300SD got hit ... Then there is Okiebenz, who has plenty of doors available. ___ I'm do not doubt that okiebenz has plenty of good used doors. Okiebenz was my ace in the hole in my search for a used 123 sedan driver's door painted Astral Silver Poly. Alas, okiebenz didn't have the door I wanted. I almost cried big tears to have my childlike faith shaken and my parade rained on by that. Then I said, Oh well, what the hell? and got on with my life. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] FW: RE: Salvage door desiderata (MY 300 SD got hit)
to create a custom color matching whatever or a color for which there is no factory formula available. We have all seen custom colors, some attractive and some bizarre. Their owners like them, and that ought to be good enough for the rest of us. For example of colors for which there are no factory formlae available, Model A Fords (actually, I think up to immediately prewar Ford bodies, and certainly 1928-1934 Fords) were all painted with what Ford called pyroxylin lacquer which I believe is called nitrocellulose lacquer today. It is generally unavailable in the USA now because of Clean Air Act requirements. Until about 1935, Ford painted fenders by dipping in black enamel. There are no Model A to whenever Ford factory formulas available for today's auto paints, except that some, most, or all of the colors have been matched, and there are some majority vote formulas for colors, and except that black is black. The idea that all factory paint codes are nothing more than ancient history, and all paint in the real world has to be matched, is hooey at worst and nothing but an advertising creation at best. It's not true in the real world I live in. Others may live in a different real world, but I doubt it.. Robert Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Date: 10/20/2007 9:20:36 AM Subject: RE: [MBZ] Salvage door desiderata (MY 300 SD got hit) The other issue with a door painted the same color is it really is not the same color. Two things drive this: 1. Color mixing varies from batch to batch, within accepted tolerances. A color painted this week will be slightly different from a color painted last week. There is no problem with cars coming off the assembly line but you can't mix and match body panels without doing a color comparison first. 2. Paints age and fade differently due to different exposure to UV (garage kept, not garage kept, northern car, southern car, etc). This is why your local body shop has to have every car matched for paint why they can't just order paint part number XXX from the Stealership. Even factory replacement parts are painted after they are installed on your car. Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert Bigham Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2007 8:39 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Salvage door desiderata (MY 300 SD got hit) Fri, 19 Oct 2007 18:33:08 -0700 From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote Subject: Re: [MBZ] MY 1985 300SD got hit ... They are recommending finding a salvage door. Out side of inspecting the door before it is 'messed with' (to be sure it is cancer free), any suggestions? ___ Get one the same color as original, that'll minimize repaint problems. ___ -- Jim ___ Hello Jim I agree. It sounds like the most reasonable of notions. I also offer that when I tried for several months to find a 123 sedan driver's door painted Astral Silver Poly, a color that was used for many years (And it seems like I meet a different 123 painted that color on the road maybe twice weekly.). The persons with whom I corresponded (and a Want it Now on ebay) produced nothing but doors painted blue, white, and other colors. And they were all shells only, no hardware or glass. Clearly, some of the people thought I must be crazy to want a used door already painted my color. Color change would have cost maybe $150 at my favorite body shop. I gave up and repaired minor rust on the old door. I hope George has better luck than I. Robert ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] King pin installation
Hello Tom Just when you thougth it was safe. -- I have studied the pictures and have I think two basic questions: 1. I see a lower grease fitting in the steeering nuckle carrier in Fig. 33-3/3 and in Fig 33 - 3/7, but I don't see an upper grease fitting. Is there one? If so, where? 2. I am unsure how the kingpin-steering nuckle assembly is secured to the upper control arm. It is very clear it fits in a tapered hold in the lower control arm. OMG what a strong assembly. Fig 33 3/3 seems to show the head of the king pin does not engage the upper control arm on top of the pin. Fig 33 3/7 may show the assembly is on one side, perhaps behind, the upper control arm. There are two bolts up there, a threaded bolt (2) and a cam bolt (3), which makes me wonder just how the bolt and upper control arm are connected. Thanks Robert, enabler of ed Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; mercedes@okiebenz.com Date: 10/13/2007 8:27:20 PM Subject: RE: RE: King pin installation OK, then look at the following three pictures. Picture1 is of the page that includes the specs. Also included on the page is a drawing of the top bottom bolt with required play for receiving lubricant. http://www.kegkits.com/Mercedes/Picture1.jpg Picture2 is of the page that shows the entire assembly, including the 2 bolts (item 2 in drawing on right) with required play for receiving lubricant. Picture2 also contains the procedure for reaming the kingpin bushings to size. http://www.kegkits.com/Mercedes/Picture2.jpg Picture3 shows the threaded bolt with required play for receiving lubricant in greater detail (item 8). The groove that's cut in the center is used to distribute the grease from the grease fitting all the way around the threaded bolt with required play for receiving lubricant so that the grease can easily penetrate the threads. http://www.kegkits.com/Mercedes/Picture3.jpg Any other questions? I have one of these assemblies, new, in my garage. .Do you want me to disassemble it, measure it confirm that it really does have some free play? Thanks, Tom Hargrave www.kegkits.com 256-656-1924 -Original Message- From: Robert Bigham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2007 6:03 PM To: Tom Hargrave; mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: RE: RE: King pin installation I continue to reject the idea that bolts holding a front suspension together, like holding a steering arm to a spindle, have slop and actually work back and forth in use, and this is normal or expected. Come on. I could be convinced by a drawing showning the parts and the clearance specified for the bolts to work back and forth. It is not necessary that there be slop and movement between the male and female parts of threads where a bolt is tight for grease to travel down threads. Each part of the threads, that is, the male part and female part, is a helix, and grease will travel down the part of the larger female helix in the that contains the clearance between the two helices. Or is that helixes ? All that is mechanically necessary for grease to travel down threads is that the male and female parts be dimensioned such that they do not add up to a solid body. Ordinary 60 degree treads, acme, and square threads are dimensioned to not add up to a solid body. Sensitive measurements will show threaded bolts will move forward and backward (or up and down, if one prefers) in threaded holes when not tightened or otherwise bottomed. A common situation which all have seen that illustrates that grease can travel along threads that contain a tightly made up bolt down is the ability of penetrating oil to eventually reach the bottom of threads in a hole which contains a bolt that does not want out, and is encouraged to release itself by application of penetrating oil, with or without added heat. Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Subject: RE: RE: King pin installation The bottom bolt is a conventional bolt but the top bolt is actually an assembly that's also used in one of the front end adjustments. And that same top bolt has enough clearance in the threads to accept lubrication (grease) and consequently, has a small amount of free play. Thanks, Tom www.kegkits.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] King pin Grease
Hello Mitch Kingpin bushings are almost always bronze, which has much greater allowable bearing loading than brass or babbitt. Some are bronze with plastic liners or inserts, if you can believe that. I believe it because I saw the bushings. I might not believe it if I hadn't seen them. Whatever you do is OK. Why are you under the impression that molybdenum disulphide damaged copper alloy (brass, bronze, babbit) bearing surfaces? I do not doubt your good faith belief. I just do not believe it is correct or founded on the facts. FWIW, babbitt contains only a very small percentage or perhaps only traces of copper, IIRC. True Babbitt (named for its inventor) is a largely tin alloy. There are several white metal bearing alloys. The cheaper ones (all are high priced) contain lots of lead and are unsuitable for heavy or pounding loads. The good stuff is largely tin. So called Nickel Babbitt is I think actually an old brand that contains traces of nickel. I believe you will find the grease manufacturers recommending their moly grease for general use including just about everything. I can tell you that I use it for everything except white grease applications, and plenty of others do the same. So far it has worked fine for me. Here is what a tube of moly grease that I bought at Wal~Mart, home of low prices, says on the tube: Provides protection with molybdenum disulfide to establish a superior film strength on working surfaces and withstands heavy loads, water attack and shock loads. Contains rust and oxidation inhibitors and extreme pressure additives for long lubrication life. Use for automotive, industrial, mining and construction ball and roller bearings, bushings, slides, chassis points, ball joints, U-joints, backing plates, wheel bearings and more. Especially suited for the most severe multi-purpose service in construction, manufacturing, farming and fleet industries. Also will not turn to gold or silver or draw flies. Wait - I confess! I just made up that last. It may turn to gold or silver or draw flies if used on Mercedes kingpins. Darn! If you go to Chevron, Mystik, or any of the other grease and oil manufacturers, I am quite sure you will find the same sort of language, and you will not find language to the effect that molybdenum disulfide damages copper and/or tin alloys. I put it to you that if the above language were not true, and in truth and fact molybdenum disulfide damaged copper and/or tin alloys, Wal~Mart would become the happy hunting ground for the class action lawsuit gang on those grounds alone. So would all the other grease and oil manufacturers. Who in his right mind would concoct such a situation? I suppose you can put me down as being in favor of molybdenum disulfide grease. I think the facts are on that side. Others may believe as they wish. Robert, enabler of ed Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote Date: 10/14/2007 4:07:48 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] King pin Grease I was under the impression that molybdenum disulphide damaged copper alloy (brass, bronze, babbit) bearing surfaces. What are the kingpin bushings made of? Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
