Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Robert Kulagowski]

I've thought about doing this also.  I'm wondering why you wouldn't want to go diskless.  Why not boot of the net?
Not all of my frontends can PXE, so that's why I just wanted to boot off 
the 6GB drive and go on from there.
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Lee Lists]

I boot /root from an USB key and then mount /usr via nfs so I have no 
drive on my frontend.

Robert Kulagowski a écrit :
I have a number of frontends, each with local storage.  I have a 
master backend which is already serving as a DHCP / TFTP / NFS server 
to a MediaMVP and my frontends.

What I'd like to do is take my existing frontends (one a Debian 
unstable, one a FC2) and set them up as semi-diskless; boot off the 
local storage, then switch to using NFS for everything else, at which 
point I can spin-down the local hard drive, reducing noise.

I'm not really interested in a complete diskless system, and the 
various HOWTO's that I've seen pretty much revolve around netbooting / 
PXE.

Has anyone already done something similar?
Thanks.
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Brad Templeton]

On Fri, Jan 07, 2005 at 08:10:16AM -0700, Adam Felson wrote:
> 
> Why would you have to worry so about security on your LAN?
> Are you worries somebody is going to break into your house, connect
> physically to lan, and spoof a mythbox and watch tv? :-p
> 

Some attacks I can imagine:

a) Somebody, just to be an asshole, breaks into lots of systems
   and erases all their TV.

b) A piece of windows spyware/malware (the majority of windows
   machines have malware on them!) connects to your insecure
   backend to insert ads for certain indigo coloured medicines (I dare
   not mention their name for fear this message will be blocked
   by many users)

c) A cable network pays a sytem cracker to distribute a virus that
   makes everybody record their new show they are trying to promote.


Imagine turning on your TV to see spam videos.   If you can advertise
through illegal hacking, the hard truth is it _will_ happen.  I
wish that weren't so.

What were the figures out there?   Apparently there are tens of
millions of windows boxes out there which are zombies, thralls to
attackers who use them to do DDOS, send spam and so on.  And many of
these machines are behind "firewalls" (or more commonly just NAT)
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Brad Templeton]

On Fri, Jan 07, 2005 at 06:52:18AM -0500, stan wrote:
> While you are certainly correct about at least one of the "insied" machines
> being comprimised, security is best done as a "defence iin depth" aproach,
> and a firewall is a significant part of such a desing.

Actually, almost all the security experts I know would disagree with that.
There's nothing wrong with having a firewall as a backup line of defense,
particularly against mistakes by the operators of individual machines
behind the firewall -- as they will make mistakes, and install insecure
server apps and so on  -- but it should not be a significant part of
your strategy.   Under the modern philosophy of a secured network,
the design goal is that every machine should be capable of being exposed
to the open internet safely. That's because, at one point or another,
your firewall will be compromised, and so all your machines will be
as they were on the open internet to that attacker.  It's a question of
when, not if.

(Firewalls are something that security consultants and companies sold
because they had to do _something_ about how blatantly insecure most
systems were, particularly windows boxes.)

That's the goal.  We don't always attain our goals, and ordinary users
and even experienced sysadmins are always making errors, so a firewall
is the backup defence against those errors.

But you would never want to design a security protocol which depends on
the firewall for its security. 

Well, almost never.  You might do it if what you were protecting was not
ever going to be important, and the UI gains you made from this approach
were powerful enough to justify it.   For example, I have been considering
a protocol for IP based speakers.   I could see IP speakers being configured
to accept sound streams from anybody on their subnet.   This is acceptable
because the worst that could happen is that intruders could play rude
sounds on your speakers and wake you up in the middle of the night.
Annoying, but no damage done to data.   The gain in convenience of
not having to do anything to configure this mode is worth it.

And so this philosphy might apply as well to IP video components.
However, with Myth, the attacker can:
a) Erase or change all your videos, preferences and schedules -- all data
b) Get complete logs of all your viewing habits
c) Possibly corrupt or destroy other databases if your sql server is
   not well secured.

This is more serious, and worthy of some minor UI inconvenience.  As noted,
done properly, this can amount to no more than entering a password once
when configuring a new device.   This is not a big whoop, it's much harder
when you have to consider devices that have no keyboards or screens in
order to let you enter passwords or have UIs!

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Adam Felson]

Why would you have to worry so about security on your LAN?
Are you worries somebody is going to break into your house, connect
physically to lan, and spoof a mythbox and watch tv? :-p


On Fri, 2005-01-07 at 01:00 -0800, Brad Templeton wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 07, 2005 at 08:36:43AM -, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > Better than that why not do it by MAC address recognition, first time a
> > machine
> > pops up the backend asks if you want to allow it, if you say yes that
> > MAC/IP
> > is stored. Next time it pops up it will go oh yes I grant access to that
> > one.
> 
> Unfortunately the MAC address is totally insecure.  You really want
> the remote computer to have some way of remembering something to
> authenticate itself.   It would be nice, actually, if there were an
> official way to make use of some of the unusued flash space the bios
> sits in, for example.
> 
> There are some tricks you can play, which are not super secure but
> much better than the MAC.   For example, you can calculate a signature
> of sorts for the hardware of the machine in some fashion (pulling out
> non-public things like identifiers of all the non-removable PNP hardware,
> anything with serial numbers etc.)  It doesn't have to be portable, as
> long as you can get something non-guessable that will remain the same
> boot to boot.  (If it changes you have to re-auth.)
> 
> Then you have a secret number you can use to prove you're the same
> machine that authenticated last time.
> 
> Short of all this, the user can type in a password of course.  And that's
> actually not that dreadful really.   Client boots, user enters password,
> and you're up.   No IP addresses or any of that stuff.   This is
> easy to implement and modestly secure against random attempts to
> screw up your systems.
> 
> ___
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users@mythtv.org
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
-- 
Adam Felson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Matt Mossholder]

Now, as a security consultant, I don't know if I would go that far. Firewalls still serve the same purpose they always have: To prevent the bulk of attacks originating on the "outside" of the firewall, by limiting what traffic is permitted to pass between networks. However, a good security policy includes many layers, and so includes things like patching, hardening, monitoring and otherwise securing the other devices in the network, as well a policy to govern the way people interact with them. 

What went out with the nineties is assuming that the firewall is going to do it all for you


    --Matt

On Fri, 2005-01-07 at 00:52 -0800, Brad Templeton wrote:


On Thu, Jan 06, 2005 at 08:28:34PM -0600, Kevin Kuphal wrote:
> Brad Templeton wrote:
> On my home network, behind firewalls, I have none of these security 
> concerns.  If it is just the address of the DB server, it shouldn't be 
> hard to do Zeroconf or even a simple broadcast as you suggest.  I'll 
> have to put this on my list of things to do...

Just about any security consultant today will admit, either in confidence
or in public, that firewalls are a really, really bad idea about how to do
security.It's a very rare network (though not nonexistent) that
doesn't have at least one machine subject to compromise through any
number of channels (for example, it's a laptop and it goes outside
the firewall from time to time, or it runs Windows) and that means the
whole network is vulnerable.

Firewalls are a 1990s design.   You put them up if you have no other choice,
or (like many of us, including me) because you're lazy and not that worried,
but when you design a new system today, one for other people to use, you
should not design it based on the idea of a firewalled network.  It would
not be responsible to the users you are coding for.
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users





-- 
Matt Mossholder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>





___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[stan]

On Fri, Jan 07, 2005 at 12:52:59AM -0800, Brad Templeton wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 06, 2005 at 08:28:34PM -0600, Kevin Kuphal wrote:
> > Brad Templeton wrote:
> > On my home network, behind firewalls, I have none of these security 
> > concerns.  If it is just the address of the DB server, it shouldn't be 
> > hard to do Zeroconf or even a simple broadcast as you suggest.  I'll 
> > have to put this on my list of things to do...
> 
> Just about any security consultant today will admit, either in confidence
> or in public, that firewalls are a really, really bad idea about how to do
> security.It's a very rare network (though not nonexistent) that
> doesn't have at least one machine subject to compromise through any
> number of channels (for example, it's a laptop and it goes outside
> the firewall from time to time, or it runs Windows) and that means the
> whole network is vulnerable.
> 
> Firewalls are a 1990s design.   You put them up if you have no other choice,
> or (like many of us, including me) because you're lazy and not that worried,
> but when you design a new system today, one for other people to use, you
> should not design it based on the idea of a firewalled network.  It would
> not be responsible to the users you are coding for.

While you are certainly correct about at least one of the "insied" machines
being comprimised, security is best done as a "defense iin depth" aproach,
and a firewall is a significant part of such a desing.

-- 
"They that would give up essential liberty for temporary safety deserve
neither liberty nor safety."
-- Benjamin Franklin
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Brad Templeton]

On Fri, Jan 07, 2005 at 08:36:43AM -, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Better than that why not do it by MAC address recognition, first time a
> machine
> pops up the backend asks if you want to allow it, if you say yes that
> MAC/IP
> is stored. Next time it pops up it will go oh yes I grant access to that
> one.

Unfortunately the MAC address is totally insecure.  You really want
the remote computer to have some way of remembering something to
authenticate itself.   It would be nice, actually, if there were an
official way to make use of some of the unusued flash space the bios
sits in, for example.

There are some tricks you can play, which are not super secure but
much better than the MAC.   For example, you can calculate a signature
of sorts for the hardware of the machine in some fashion (pulling out
non-public things like identifiers of all the non-removable PNP hardware,
anything with serial numbers etc.)  It doesn't have to be portable, as
long as you can get something non-guessable that will remain the same
boot to boot.  (If it changes you have to re-auth.)

Then you have a secret number you can use to prove you're the same
machine that authenticated last time.

Short of all this, the user can type in a password of course.  And that's
actually not that dreadful really.   Client boots, user enters password,
and you're up.   No IP addresses or any of that stuff.   This is
easy to implement and modestly secure against random attempts to
screw up your systems.

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Brad Templeton]

On Thu, Jan 06, 2005 at 08:28:34PM -0600, Kevin Kuphal wrote:
> Brad Templeton wrote:
> On my home network, behind firewalls, I have none of these security 
> concerns.  If it is just the address of the DB server, it shouldn't be 
> hard to do Zeroconf or even a simple broadcast as you suggest.  I'll 
> have to put this on my list of things to do...

Just about any security consultant today will admit, either in confidence
or in public, that firewalls are a really, really bad idea about how to do
security.It's a very rare network (though not nonexistent) that
doesn't have at least one machine subject to compromise through any
number of channels (for example, it's a laptop and it goes outside
the firewall from time to time, or it runs Windows) and that means the
whole network is vulnerable.

Firewalls are a 1990s design.   You put them up if you have no other choice,
or (like many of us, including me) because you're lazy and not that worried,
but when you design a new system today, one for other people to use, you
should not design it based on the idea of a firewalled network.  It would
not be responsible to the users you are coding for.
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

RE: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[mythtv-users]

Brad wrote:
> 
> On Thu, Jan 06, 2005 at 06:11:22PM -0600, Kevin Kuphal wrote:
> > It'd sure be nice if there was a way for a mythfrontend to discover 
> > all
> > the settings needed on a network.  Something like 
> > Rendevous/ZeroConf/UPnP.  Does anyone who runs KnoppMyth in 
> this way 
> > know what all the settings are that are asked for on boot?  
> Is it just 
> > the address of the master backend or are there more?
> 
> Strictly, it's the address of the database server, which then 
> reveals the address of the master backend and other backends.
> 
> Indeed, discovery and plug and play are very useful ideas, 
> and no doubt are on the feature list somewhere.
> 
> You can't really discover SQL servers without opening up 
> their security
> more than people like.   So what would make sense would be for the
> master backend to listen for broadcast packets on a port, and 
> respond to them with config info for frontends and other backends.

>From a 'proper' security point of view you don't want your
database to be findable, however from a 'I'm running this on a private
network with a decent firewall/no internet connection and no important 
information saved' point of view it would be nice to have the option.


> 
> The most secure way to do it and still be close to ZUI is as follows.
> 
> a) Client boots up.
> 
> b) Master backend prompts somebody (a trusted client, or a user on the
> backend) saying, "1 and exactly 1 new clients have asked for 
> access. Grant it?"
> 
> c) You say yes, and you can be (generally) sure you're only 
> giving access to the machine you just brought up.
> 
> Ideally the front end machine is able to store something 
> somewhere (or have its own password as a key to data in the 
> database) so it doesn't have to follow this procedure every 
> time in boots.

Better than that why not do it by MAC address recognition, first time a
machine
pops up the backend asks if you want to allow it, if you say yes that
MAC/IP
is stored. Next time it pops up it will go oh yes I grant access to that
one.

If it fails it could *then* ask for the username/password/backend IP,
that would
then work for dual boot machines[1]/windows machines.

Regards

David

[1]Or any other risky machines you might not want to automatically pass
the DB password to.














___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Kevin Kuphal]

Brad Templeton wrote:
On Thu, Jan 06, 2005 at 06:11:22PM -0600, Kevin Kuphal wrote:
 

It'd sure be nice if there was a way for a mythfrontend to discover all 
the settings needed on a network.  Something like 
Rendevous/ZeroConf/UPnP.  Does anyone who runs KnoppMyth in this way 
know what all the settings are that are asked for on boot?  Is it just 
the address of the master backend or are there more?
   

Strictly, it's the address of the database server, which then reveals
the address of the master backend and other backends.
Indeed, discovery and plug and play are very useful ideas, and no doubt
are on the feature list somewhere.
You can't really discover SQL servers without opening up their security
more than people like.   So what would make sense would be for the
master backend to listen for broadcast packets on a port, and respond
to them with config info for frontends and other backends.
 

On my home network, behind firewalls, I have none of these security 
concerns.  If it is just the address of the DB server, it shouldn't be 
hard to do Zeroconf or even a simple broadcast as you suggest.  I'll 
have to put this on my list of things to do...

Kevin
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Brad Templeton]

On Thu, Jan 06, 2005 at 06:11:22PM -0600, Kevin Kuphal wrote:
> It'd sure be nice if there was a way for a mythfrontend to discover all 
> the settings needed on a network.  Something like 
> Rendevous/ZeroConf/UPnP.  Does anyone who runs KnoppMyth in this way 
> know what all the settings are that are asked for on boot?  Is it just 
> the address of the master backend or are there more?

Strictly, it's the address of the database server, which then reveals
the address of the master backend and other backends.

Indeed, discovery and plug and play are very useful ideas, and no doubt
are on the feature list somewhere.

You can't really discover SQL servers without opening up their security
more than people like.   So what would make sense would be for the
master backend to listen for broadcast packets on a port, and respond
to them with config info for frontends and other backends.

Still, this is hard to keep secure.  For example, it means anybody
into your network would be able to ask the master back end for
the database password, where they could screw with it.  And they
could do just about anything to your myth system.   That includes
any malware downloaded by some windows user on your network.

Likewise, people could pretend to be myth servers but that is less
dangerous (unless you now type in the password and give it to them in
which case they can do the same things as above.)
But this, at least, can be spotted since 2 servers are responding.

The most secure way to do it and still be close to ZUI is as follows.

a) Client boots up.

b) Master backend prompts somebody (a trusted client, or a user on the
backend) saying, "1 and exactly 1 new clients have asked for access.
Grant it?"

c) You say yes, and you can be (generally) sure you're only giving access
to the machine you just brought up.


Ideally the front end machine is able to store something somewhere
(or have its own password as a key to data in the database) so it doesn't
have to follow this procedure every time in boots.
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Kevin Kuphal]

stan wrote:
On Thu, Jan 06, 2005 at 01:28:14PM -0600, Ryan A. Carris wrote:
 

On Tue, 04 Jan 2005 15:57:41 -0600, Robert Kulagowski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
   

I have a number of frontends, each with local storage.  I have a master
backend which is already serving as a DHCP / TFTP / NFS server to a
MediaMVP and my frontends.
What I'd like to do is take my existing frontends (one a Debian
unstable, one a FC2) and set them up as semi-diskless; boot off the
local storage, then switch to using NFS for everything else, at which
point I can spin-down the local hard drive, reducing noise.
I'm not really interested in a complete diskless system, and the various
HOWTO's that I've seen pretty much revolve around netbooting / PXE.
Has anyone already done something similar?
 

I must misunderstand your question, it seems to easy.
Knoppmyth will boot a frontend setup off of the CD, and then connect
to your backend.   http://www.mysettopbox.tv/doc.html#frontend
I experimented with Knoppymyth recently.  I was really impressed with
it.  It worked out of the box, and had just about everything that my
system needed.
   


But KnoppMyth won't autoboot off the CD, it requires that you put
in some paramters. Also a true diskless system will not require a
CD drive at all, and using a CD to run your system will use up the CD
drive pretty quickly.
 

It'd sure be nice if there was a way for a mythfrontend to discover all 
the settings needed on a network.  Something like 
Rendevous/ZeroConf/UPnP.  Does anyone who runs KnoppMyth in this way 
know what all the settings are that are asked for on boot?  Is it just 
the address of the master backend or are there more?

Kevin
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[stan]

On Thu, Jan 06, 2005 at 01:28:14PM -0600, Ryan A. Carris wrote:
> On Tue, 04 Jan 2005 15:57:41 -0600, Robert Kulagowski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
> > I have a number of frontends, each with local storage.  I have a master
> > backend which is already serving as a DHCP / TFTP / NFS server to a
> > MediaMVP and my frontends.
> > 
> > What I'd like to do is take my existing frontends (one a Debian
> > unstable, one a FC2) and set them up as semi-diskless; boot off the
> > local storage, then switch to using NFS for everything else, at which
> > point I can spin-down the local hard drive, reducing noise.
> > 
> > I'm not really interested in a complete diskless system, and the various
> > HOWTO's that I've seen pretty much revolve around netbooting / PXE.
> > 
> > Has anyone already done something similar?
> > 
> 
> I must misunderstand your question, it seems to easy.
> Knoppmyth will boot a frontend setup off of the CD, and then connect
> to your backend.   http://www.mysettopbox.tv/doc.html#frontend
> 
> I experimented with Knoppymyth recently.  I was really impressed with
> it.  It worked out of the box, and had just about everything that my
> system needed.


But KnoppMyth won't autoboot off the CD, it requires that you put
in some paramters. Also a true diskless system will not require a
CD drive at all, and using a CD to run your system will use up the CD
drive pretty quickly.

-- 
"They that would give up essential liberty for temporary safety deserve
neither liberty nor safety."
-- Benjamin Franklin
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Ryan A. Carris]

On Tue, 04 Jan 2005 15:57:41 -0600, Robert Kulagowski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have a number of frontends, each with local storage.  I have a master
> backend which is already serving as a DHCP / TFTP / NFS server to a
> MediaMVP and my frontends.
> 
> What I'd like to do is take my existing frontends (one a Debian
> unstable, one a FC2) and set them up as semi-diskless; boot off the
> local storage, then switch to using NFS for everything else, at which
> point I can spin-down the local hard drive, reducing noise.
> 
> I'm not really interested in a complete diskless system, and the various
> HOWTO's that I've seen pretty much revolve around netbooting / PXE.
> 
> Has anyone already done something similar?
> 

I must misunderstand your question, it seems to easy.
Knoppmyth will boot a frontend setup off of the CD, and then connect
to your backend.   http://www.mysettopbox.tv/doc.html#frontend

I experimented with Knoppymyth recently.  I was really impressed with
it.  It worked out of the box, and had just about everything that my
system needed.
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[William Lott]

Robert Rozman wrote:
>
> How are you satisfied with me6000 performance. I'm deciding whether to
> purchase it for frontend only.
>
I'd give it a thumbs down.  Took me a week of playing around to get the 
thing running at all (compile your own kernel with patches from random 
places, compile your own X with patches from other places, compile your 
own mplayer with yet more patches, compile your own mythtv with even 
more patches from even more places, plus whatever else I forgot).  And 
now that I have it (mostly) running, it is way freakin slow.  My AMD XP 
 2000+ frontend/backend machine is snappy, but the me6000 takes forever 
to respond to anything.

>
> Also, I'd love to see Mythphone on this machine. Do you have any
> experience with Mythphone ?
>
Sorry, haven't tried it.
-William Lott

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Paul Bender]

On Wed, 2005-01-05 at 21:41 +0100, Robert Rozman wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Paul Bender" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> > Originally, I booted the MiniMyth image from . However,
> > since I wanted to upgrade some of the software, I decided to roll my own
> > build system based on GAR
> > . Like
> > MiniMyth, my build system is targeted for the Via EPIA M series
> > motherboards, because I am using the Via EPIA ME6000 for my front ends.
> >
> How are you satisfied with me6000 performance. I'm deciding whether to
> purchase it for frontend only.
>
> Some time ago there were stutters - so I wonder if things are better now ?

I have been satisfied. It cannot do channel guide + tv without
stuttering, but I do not use that, so I do not care. It cannot do the
OSD fadeaway effect without stuttering, so I disable the fadeaway effect
in the XML description for each of the OSD themes.

> Also, I'd love to see Mythphone on this machine. Do you have any experience
> with Mythphone ?
> 
> Will it run on me6000 ? Any chance to add it to GAR-minimyth ?

I have never used MythPhone (in general, I hate phones) I have no idea
whether or not it runs on the ME6000. I will take a look at it.

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Robert Rozman]

Hi,

- Original Message - 
From: "Paul Bender" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Discussion about mythtv" 
Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 12:26 AM
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless
frontend?


> On Tue, 2005-01-04 at 17:58 -0500, stan wrote:
> > On Tue, Jan 04, 2005 at 05:35:21PM -0500, john roberts wrote:
> > >
> > > I've thought about doing this also.  I'm wondering why you wouldn't
want to go diskless.  Why not boot of the net?
> > >
> > > Is it the boot-up time you're concerned about?
> > >
> > Have you made a diksless frontend work? If os, have you any pointers to
a
> > good HOWTO?
>
> I have a working diskless frontend. You can find pointers for diskless
> boot in general and for the Via EPIA M series motherboards in particular
> at <http://www.viaarena.com/Default.aspx?PageID=5&ArticleID=52>.
>
> Originally, I booted the MiniMyth image from . However,
> since I wanted to upgrade some of the software, I decided to roll my own
> build system based on GAR
> <http://home.san.rr.com/benderfamily/software/gar-minimyth/>. Like
> MiniMyth, my build system is targeted for the Via EPIA M series
> motherboards, because I am using the Via EPIA ME6000 for my front ends.
>
How are you satisfied with me6000 performance. I'm deciding whether to
purchase it for frontend only.

Some time ago there were stutters - so I wonder if things are better now ?

Also, I'd love to see Mythphone on this machine. Do you have any experience
with Mythphone ?

Will it run on me6000 ? Any chance to add it to GAR-minimyth ?

Thanks in advance,

regards,

Rob.









>






___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Robert Rozman]

Hi,

how about this one ?

http://www.myltsptv.org/de/


HTH,

Regards,

Rob.

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Nate Carlson]

On Tue, 4 Jan 2005, Robert Kulagowski wrote:
I'm not really interested in a complete diskless system, and the various 
HOWTO's that I've seen pretty much revolve around netbooting / PXE.
Why not? You can get cheap Intel or 3com NIC's with bootrom's for $10 or 
so, and do a PXE boot. That way, no disk in the frontend at all - nothing 
to die.  :)

If you really don't want to go that route, you can always use one of the 
netboot floppy creators, and just copy that floppy image to an image on 
the hard drive, and use grub to boot that..


| nate carlson | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.natecarlson.com |
|   depriving some poor village of its idiot since 1981|

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Brad Templeton]

On Tue, Jan 04, 2005 at 07:44:03PM -0400, Mark J. Small wrote:
> On January 4, 2005 06:58 pm, stan wrote:
> > On Tue, Jan 04, 2005 at 05:35:21PM -0500, john roberts wrote:
> > > I've thought about doing this also.  I'm wondering why you wouldn't want
> > > to go diskless.  Why not boot of the net?
> > >
> > > Is it the boot-up time you're concerned about?
> >
> > Have you made a diksless frontend work? If os, have you any pointers to a
> > good HOWTO?
> 
> My diskless frontend is working very nicely.  I boot using PXE, I found this 
> in my bookmarks, though I can't remember how useful it was:
> 
> http://www.kegel.com/linux/pxe.html
> 
> I did have to update the firmware on my Intel Pro 100 before it would work 
> properly.
> 
> My biggest boot-up time problem is that the motherboard spends a long time 
> wondering why there is no keyboard.  It eventually gives me the no keyboard 
> error and continues on its merry way, but it takes a while.  


Another option you can consider, if you have a bios that is new enough
to boot from a USB device, is you could put together a basic Myth system
on one of those tiny USB flash drives.   Certainly doable on a 1gb
drive -- in which case you could not use NFS at all because you could
stream the Myth protocol if you use the CVS version without the remote
frontend file handle bug, but you could probably fit easily enough in
smaller ones.  You might want to put some things like /tmp and parts of
/var into a ramdisk to avoid constant writing to the flash, which you
want to avoid.

You could also do boot and root from a much smaller flash card or drive
(for $16 you can get an IDE flash adapter that in theory means you don't
even need a new bios) and then mount the rest of your filesystems over
NFS, including your video spool.

What that gets you is something fast, silent and local with no seek times
when it comes to running the local programs.  No seek times can mean a
pretty fast boot and other operations.   Considering how cheap a 256mb flash
card is today...   Though you want one with a good read speed, or on USB
one that is usb 2.0.   You have an extra "spindle" so that read/writes
to your main programs don't take the seek arm away from your video stream.

But I haven't tried this to see what you really get.   Unlike the noisy
boot hard drive, you don't need to spin it down.  

There is also CD boot, but then you have to swap the boot CD in the drive
when you want to put DVDs and CDs in there.

You may find it easier to get pxe boot operating and just be all network.
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Rudy Zijlstra]

stan wrote:
On Tue, Jan 04, 2005 at 05:35:21PM -0500, john roberts wrote:
 

I've thought about doing this also.  I'm wondering why you wouldn't want to go 
diskless.  Why not boot of the net?
Is it the boot-up time you're concerned about?
   

Have you made a diksless frontend work? If os, have you any pointers to a
good HOWTO?
 

I have a diskless frontend based on slackware. Made netbooting work at 
least half a year ago based on the PXE documentation. Slackware is 
pretty easy to make netbooting working. Once you have the setup to get a 
kernel booted from the network its easy. You make a basic installation 
on a HD and then copy that onto the file server. Once there you can 
extend using the netbooted kernel.

Cheers,
Rudy
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Mark J. Small]

On January 4, 2005 06:58 pm, stan wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 04, 2005 at 05:35:21PM -0500, john roberts wrote:
> > I've thought about doing this also.  I'm wondering why you wouldn't want
> > to go diskless.  Why not boot of the net?
> >
> > Is it the boot-up time you're concerned about?
>
> Have you made a diksless frontend work? If os, have you any pointers to a
> good HOWTO?

My diskless frontend is working very nicely.  I boot using PXE, I found this 
in my bookmarks, though I can't remember how useful it was:

http://www.kegel.com/linux/pxe.html

I did have to update the firmware on my Intel Pro 100 before it would work 
properly.

My biggest boot-up time problem is that the motherboard spends a long time 
wondering why there is no keyboard.  It eventually gives me the no keyboard 
error and continues on its merry way, but it takes a while.  

Mark
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Brad Templeton]

On Tue, Jan 04, 2005 at 03:57:41PM -0600, Robert Kulagowski wrote:
> I have a number of frontends, each with local storage.  I have a master 
> backend which is already serving as a DHCP / TFTP / NFS server to a 
> MediaMVP and my frontends.
> 
> What I'd like to do is take my existing frontends (one a Debian 
> unstable, one a FC2) and set them up as semi-diskless; boot off the 
> local storage, then switch to using NFS for everything else, at which 
> point I can spin-down the local hard drive, reducing noise.
> 
> I'm not really interested in a complete diskless system, and the various 
> HOWTO's that I've seen pretty much revolve around netbooting / PXE.
> 
> Has anyone already done something similar?

I almost got this working but bailed out when I had troubles getting
X to start.  May be a small thing, may be more work, but I had other
stuff to do.

This is actually a good idea if, like me you have spare old disks lying
about, too noisy to leave running all the time.  Put them to two
uses -- 1 to boot your system, and 2 as a place to store backups for
long term.   You can either spin up the disks to get at the backup, or
even do nightly backups to them by spinning it up at a time nobody will
care about the noise.  Not good for bedroom.

The advantage is you don't have to make netboot work.  And it's faster.

However, you probably want to only load the kernel from the disk.  Have
it mount the root FS over NFS.  This requires you to get a kernel with
nfs, nfsroot, your ethernet card etc. pre-compiled in, or use initrd to
have a ramdisk with the modules.It is not too hard to make one, I did
not find a suitable one floating around though there are such kernels
people have. 

1) Get your system working on the disk you have, with special kernel

2) Mirror it to the NFS partition.

3) Modify grub with a new entry to boot to include all the nfs root options

4) Try it out.
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Paul Bender]

On Tue, 2005-01-04 at 17:58 -0500, stan wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 04, 2005 at 05:35:21PM -0500, john roberts wrote:
> > 
> > I've thought about doing this also.  I'm wondering why you wouldn't want to 
> > go diskless.  Why not boot of the net?
> > 
> > Is it the boot-up time you're concerned about?
> > 
> Have you made a diksless frontend work? If os, have you any pointers to a
> good HOWTO?

I have a working diskless frontend. You can find pointers for diskless
boot in general and for the Via EPIA M series motherboards in particular
at .

Originally, I booted the MiniMyth image from . However,
since I wanted to upgrade some of the software, I decided to roll my own
build system based on GAR
. Like
MiniMyth, my build system is targeted for the Via EPIA M series
motherboards, because I am using the Via EPIA ME6000 for my front ends.

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Rusty McEacharn]

here is a howto that decribes what you want.  it's a little dated, but
the concepts should still apply.  i thought about doing this myself
before i discovered the mediamvp.  now i will not bother with anything
else.  anyway, here is the link.
http://www.seanm.ca/eden/ramdisk.html
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[stan]

On Tue, Jan 04, 2005 at 05:35:21PM -0500, john roberts wrote:
> 
> I've thought about doing this also.  I'm wondering why you wouldn't want to 
> go diskless.  Why not boot of the net?
> 
> Is it the boot-up time you're concerned about?
> 
Have you made a diksless frontend work? If os, have you any pointers to a
good HOWTO?

-- 
"They that would give up essential liberty for temporary safety deserve
neither liberty nor safety."
-- Benjamin Franklin
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[john roberts]

I've thought about doing this also.  I'm wondering why you wouldn't want to go 
diskless.  Why not boot of the net?

Is it the boot-up time you're concerned about?

-John
-- 
___
Find what you are looking for with the Lycos Yellow Pages
http://r.lycos.com/r/yp_emailfooter/http://yellowpages.lycos.com/default.asp?SRC=lycos10

___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Re: [mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Kevin Kuphal]

Robert Kulagowski wrote:
I have a number of frontends, each with local storage.  I have a 
master backend which is already serving as a DHCP / TFTP / NFS server 
to a MediaMVP and my frontends.

What I'd like to do is take my existing frontends (one a Debian 
unstable, one a FC2) and set them up as semi-diskless; boot off the 
local storage, then switch to using NFS for everything else, at which 
point I can spin-down the local hard drive, reducing noise.

I'm not really interested in a complete diskless system, and the 
various HOWTO's that I've seen pretty much revolve around netbooting / 
PXE.

Has anyone already done something similar?
I haven't done it but I'm getting ready to.  I am looking at doing a 
CD-ROM netboot image (basically the floppy netboot image written to a 
CD) and getting everything from NFS from that point.  I had tracked down 
a couple links in my research to date.

http://howtos.linux.com/howtos/Network-boot-HOWTO/index.shtml
This seemed promising and talked a bit about the bootable CD-ROM
The netboot site has the basic HOWTO for making the floppy.  I believe 
that the same process holds true for the CD-ROM.

Kevin
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

[mythtv-users] Has anyone configured a "semi"-diskless frontend?

[Robert Kulagowski]

I have a number of frontends, each with local storage.  I have a master 
backend which is already serving as a DHCP / TFTP / NFS server to a 
MediaMVP and my frontends.

What I'd like to do is take my existing frontends (one a Debian 
unstable, one a FC2) and set them up as semi-diskless; boot off the 
local storage, then switch to using NFS for everything else, at which 
point I can spin-down the local hard drive, reducing noise.

I'm not really interested in a complete diskless system, and the various 
HOWTO's that I've seen pretty much revolve around netbooting / PXE.

Has anyone already done something similar?
Thanks.
___
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users@mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users