subject:"\[NSP\] Re\: tune"

[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Anthony Robb


   --- On Thu, 30/6/11, Francis Wood  wrote:

   Hello again, Anthony,
   One question arises over the issue of absorbing a regional musical
   accent: which side of the hill are we talking about? If the hill is big
   enough, the style will be pretty different. Northumberland is a huge
   county, where travelling in the old days would not have been that easy.
   Aren't we talking about a variety of musical accents here?
   Hello Francis
   Absolutely.
   Indeed we are, but the nub of the issue for me is that it is the only
   unbroken/surviving one and the most distinctive when it comes to
   dance music.
   As you rightly pointed out, a strong lilt means that even moderately
   good players can make musically pleasing attempts at traditional tunes.
   Modern day players taking on that style of playing can fall back on a
   couple of hundred years of experience and refinement to show them how
   to make real music with fairly plain tunes and they'll also be doing
   their bit to keep the style alive and therefore add to the tradition.
   As I have said before, it's not everyone's cup of tea but it is very
   special and is as distinctive as the instrument with which we all do
   regular battle.
   Sermon definitely over - promise.
   Warmest & best
   Anthony


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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread GibbonsSoinne

   A good point - but if a musical style has any merit, it's worth
   studying for musical reasons alone.

   That's why, in Ireland, so many non-Kerrymen play slides and polkas



   John







   In a message dated 30/06/2011 20:51:14 GMT Daylight Time,
   oatenp...@googlemail.com writes:

 Hello again, Anthony,
 One question arises over the issue of absorbing a regional musical
 accent: which side of the hill are we talking about? If the hill is
 big enough, the style will be pretty different. Northumberland is a
 huge county, where travelling in the old days would not have been
 that easy. Aren't we talking about a variety of musical accents
 here?
 Francis
 >
 On 30 Jun 2011, at 20:09, Anthony Robb wrote:
 >
 >   --- On Thu, 30/6/11, Francis Wood 
 wrote:
 >
 >   Hello Anthony,
 >   I don't think we disagree. At Stuart Hardy's musical altitude,
 I'm sure
 >   you're right.
 >   That's a level I can only admire but never approach. On a more
 basic
 >   level, playing the tune with a dotted rhythm will get you
 through in a
 >   far less exposed manner than playing straight, which would seem
 to be
 >   an ability to acquire before refining the playing to a more
 regionally
 >   idiomatic expertise.
 >
 >   Hello Francis
 >   I'm still not sure I can agree completely.
 >   I've taught lots now myself (more or less regularly since 1976
 and
 >   mostly beginners/youngsters) - probably in the region of 3500
 >   pupil-hours and found that (hornpipes aside - which are slowish
 anyway)
 >   people get get away with jigs and reels played steady and
 straight but
 >   as soon as we try and dot/lilt them they fall away after a bar
 or
 >   two.This is especially true of (even) slowish jigs. I used to
 take the
 >   approach you outline; get them playing evenly and steadily and
 then put
 >   the regional (some would say the all important) accent in
 afterwards
 >   but getting people to feel a good lilt and use it consistently
 after
 >   having spent months mastering the straight version has proved
 very
 >   difficult indeed.
 >   In recent years I've tried to get the lilt in from the off so
 that even
 >   if fingers aren't responding the brain would be taking something
 in and
 >   it seems to work better. Of course the old guys would never hear
 the
 >   straight version in the first place and they have the steadiest
 pace
 >   and control I've ever heard.
 >   Scottish and Irish bands were popular in Northumberland but when
 the
 >   old guys swiped their tunes they used their own accent to play
 them.
 >   Sadly that distinctive accent is all too rare these days and it
 would
 >   be great to see more pipers from this area taking it on. The
 problem is
 >   how best to achieve it - which ever way we tackle it results are
 a long
 >   time coming.
 >   As aye
 >   Anthony
 >
 >   --
 >
 >
 > To get on or off this list see list information at
 > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Francis Wood

Hello again, Anthony,

One question arises over the issue of absorbing a regional musical accent: 
which side of the hill are we talking about? If the hill is big enough, the 
style will be pretty different. Northumberland is a huge county, where 
travelling in the old days would not have been that easy. Aren't we talking 
about a variety of musical accents here?

Francis


> 
On 30 Jun 2011, at 20:09, Anthony Robb wrote:

> 
>   --- On Thu, 30/6/11, Francis Wood  wrote:
> 
>   Hello Anthony,
>   I don't think we disagree. At Stuart Hardy's musical altitude, I'm sure
>   you're right.
>   That's a level I can only admire but never approach. On a more basic
>   level, playing the tune with a dotted rhythm will get you through in a
>   far less exposed manner than playing straight, which would seem to be
>   an ability to acquire before refining the playing to a more regionally
>   idiomatic expertise.
> 
>   Hello Francis
>   I'm still not sure I can agree completely.
>   I've taught lots now myself (more or less regularly since 1976 and
>   mostly beginners/youngsters) - probably in the region of 3500
>   pupil-hours and found that (hornpipes aside - which are slowish anyway)
>   people get get away with jigs and reels played steady and straight but
>   as soon as we try and dot/lilt them they fall away after a bar or
>   two.This is especially true of (even) slowish jigs. I used to take the
>   approach you outline; get them playing evenly and steadily and then put
>   the regional (some would say the all important) accent in afterwards
>   but getting people to feel a good lilt and use it consistently after
>   having spent months mastering the straight version has proved very
>   difficult indeed.
>   In recent years I've tried to get the lilt in from the off so that even
>   if fingers aren't responding the brain would be taking something in and
>   it seems to work better. Of course the old guys would never hear the
>   straight version in the first place and they have the steadiest pace
>   and control I've ever heard.
>   Scottish and Irish bands were popular in Northumberland but when the
>   old guys swiped their tunes they used their own accent to play them.
>   Sadly that distinctive accent is all too rare these days and it would
>   be great to see more pipers from this area taking it on. The problem is
>   how best to achieve it - which ever way we tackle it results are a long
>   time coming.
>   As aye
>   Anthony
> 
>   --
> 
> 
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Gibbons, John

Playing hornpipes in Irish sessions - the Telegraph at the top of Brixton Hill 
particularly-
was good speed practice. But you don't have to worry about closed fingering on 
a flute!
The main difficulty there was finding a beat long enough to snatch a breath

Still panting, 20 years later.

John 

-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
Anthony Robb
Sent: 30 June 2011 11:51
To: NSP group
Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"


   -- On Thu, 30/6/11, Francis Wood  wrote:

It's a lot easier to play Roxborough Castle in dotted rhythm, as is
   done here. I prefer it played absolutely straight, which is really very
   challenging. A commonly played tune which is rarely played well.  I
   quite like this rendition here . . . seems to have been videoed during
   a casual session by a bystander.
   Hello Francis
   I think that might be an oversimpification. Stewart Hardy with his
   years of top notch tuition experience would say that all things
   (especially speed) being equal dotted rhythms are harder. What we have
   here is a reduction of speed from the typical rant speed of 96 bpm to a
   hornpipe at 76 bpm. As you say it is OK but even at that speed he loses
   his rhythm when it comes to the top As which should be dotted quavers
   but come out as quick flicks.
   My first realisation that rants were almost as dotted as hornpipes but
   25% faster came at Archie Bertram's when they all played Roxburgh and
   Hesleyside with almost hornpipe lilt but at a speed which left me
   floundering. It wasn't the normal straight reel speed of 106 bpm which
   isn't easy but for me certainly a bit easier that the rant rhythm at 96
   bpm.
   I wondering if other players on the list find the rant speed & rhythm a
   challenge?
   As for other comments I think you are spot on.
   Warmest & best
   Anthony

   --


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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread cwhill

I'll tell you what worries me.
Don't they listen/watch what they are posting for the public?
If they don't, why not?
If they do, why don't they notice that things are wrong?
This guy can obviously "play" the thing - including the regulators which
are tricky at the best of times.
I'm guessing it's the "X factor syndrome". (The total inability to hear
how rubbish YOU are but able to hear exactly how bad everyone else is).
I can understand someone learning an instrument in isolation and so not
knowing how it should sound but there's plenty of stuff available to
compare with these days.
Why don't people hear "oh, mine doesn't sound like that" - especially on
a recording.
More importantly, why don't they just admit "I'm not good enough to go
public".

Mind you,it's nice to know that there are others as bad as you around :)

Colin Hill

On 30/06/2011 10:25, Richard York wrote:

True 'nuff! :)

On 30/06/2011 10:20, christopher.bi...@ec.europa.eu wrote:

<... >
Could have done another take?
C

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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Francis Wood

Hello Anthony,

I don't think we disagree. At Stuart Hardy's musical altitude, I'm sure you're 
right.

That's a level I can only admire but never approach. On a more basic level, 
playing the tune with a dotted rhythm will get you through in a far less 
exposed manner than playing straight, which would seem to be an ability to 
acquire before refining the playing to a more regionally idiomatic expertise.

I was fairly OK with the present example because it was reasonably musical and 
enjoyable . . . and goodness knows, anyway, how long he'd been playing at that 
booth and under what circumstances. I was harsher on the second YouTube example 
which was a staged affair as well as being a musical assault. 

>> I wondering if other players on the list find the rant speed & rhythm a
>>   challenge?

Well, yes, it is. Good examples are always welcome!

All the best,

Francis

On 30 Jun 2011, at 11:50, Anthony Robb wrote:

> 
>   -- On Thu, 30/6/11, Francis Wood  wrote:
> 
>It's a lot easier to play Roxborough Castle in dotted rhythm, as is
>   done here. I prefer it played absolutely straight, which is really very
>   challenging. A commonly played tune which is rarely played well.  I
>   quite like this rendition here . . . seems to have been videoed during
>   a casual session by a bystander.
>   Hello Francis
>   I think that might be an oversimpification. Stewart Hardy with his
>   years of top notch tuition experience would say that all things
>   (especially speed) being equal dotted rhythms are harder. What we have
>   here is a reduction of speed from the typical rant speed of 96 bpm to a
>   hornpipe at 76 bpm. As you say it is OK but even at that speed he loses
>   his rhythm when it comes to the top As which should be dotted quavers
>   but come out as quick flicks.
>   My first realisation that rants were almost as dotted as hornpipes but
>   25% faster came at Archie Bertram's when they all played Roxburgh and
>   Hesleyside with almost hornpipe lilt but at a speed which left me
>   floundering. It wasn't the normal straight reel speed of 106 bpm which
>   isn't easy but for me certainly a bit easier that the rant rhythm at 96
>   bpm.
>   I wondering if other players on the list find the rant speed & rhythm a
>   challenge?
>   As for other comments I think you are spot on.
>   Warmest & best
>   Anthony
> 
>   --
> 
> 
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Anthony Robb


   -- On Thu, 30/6/11, Francis Wood  wrote:

It's a lot easier to play Roxborough Castle in dotted rhythm, as is
   done here. I prefer it played absolutely straight, which is really very
   challenging. A commonly played tune which is rarely played well.  I
   quite like this rendition here . . . seems to have been videoed during
   a casual session by a bystander.
   Hello Francis
   I think that might be an oversimpification. Stewart Hardy with his
   years of top notch tuition experience would say that all things
   (especially speed) being equal dotted rhythms are harder. What we have
   here is a reduction of speed from the typical rant speed of 96 bpm to a
   hornpipe at 76 bpm. As you say it is OK but even at that speed he loses
   his rhythm when it comes to the top As which should be dotted quavers
   but come out as quick flicks.
   My first realisation that rants were almost as dotted as hornpipes but
   25% faster came at Archie Bertram's when they all played Roxburgh and
   Hesleyside with almost hornpipe lilt but at a speed which left me
   floundering. It wasn't the normal straight reel speed of 106 bpm which
   isn't easy but for me certainly a bit easier that the rant rhythm at 96
   bpm.
   I wondering if other players on the list find the rant speed & rhythm a
   challenge?
   As for other comments I think you are spot on.
   Warmest & best
   Anthony

   --


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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Richard York



True 'nuff!   :)

On 30/06/2011 10:20, christopher.bi...@ec.europa.eu wrote:

<... >
Could have done another take?
C

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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Christopher.Birch

>And a curious choice of drone, which on my headset seemed to be the 
>subdominant.

Yes

>  I admire anyone, though, who can honestly say they've never 
>played too 
>fast when confronted with a recording device, and mangled good 
>intentions, when nervous adrenalin cripples technique though.
>Or am I being too kind to him - is he just a man of tin ears indeed?
>Richard.
>

Could have done another take?
C



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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Richard York


Yes to both, and the acoustic doesn't help at all.
And a curious choice of drone, which on my headset seemed to be the 
subdominant.


 I admire anyone, though, who can honestly say they've never played too 
fast when confronted with a recording device, and mangled good 
intentions, when nervous adrenalin cripples technique though.

Or am I being too kind to him - is he just a man of tin ears indeed?
Richard.

On 30/06/2011 09:22, christopher.bi...@ec.europa.eu wrote:

Might be quite good if he played it at half the speed.

And got his chanter remotely in tune.


Otherwise agree with
Francis.


Me too.



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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Tim Rolls

Or there's this version on "Celtic Pipes"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOIuVzlHFEA

Tim
On 30 Jun 2011, at 09:22,  wrote:

>> Might be quite good if he played it at half the speed. 
> 
> And got his chanter remotely in tune.
> 
>> Otherwise agree with 
>> Francis.
> 
> 
> Me too.
> 
> 
> 
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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Christopher.Birch

>Might be quite good if he played it at half the speed. 

And got his chanter remotely in tune.

>Otherwise agree with 
>Francis.


Me too.



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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Julia Say

On 30 Jun 2011, Francis Wood wrote: 

> >   [1]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHBO8CGAIeQ&feature=related

Open fingering in places
 
> >   [2]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKC0ZoVqfzU&NR=1

> [2] Awful, awful, awful! 

Might be quite good if he played it at half the speed. Otherwise agree with 
Francis.

Julia



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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"

2011-06-30 Thread Francis Wood

On 30 Jun 2011, at 08:15, John Dally wrote:

>   Here are a couple of youtube items that already fit the bill for July.
> 
>   [1]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHBO8CGAIeQ&feature=related
> 
>   [2]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKC0ZoVqfzU&NR=1
> 
>   What's your take on the tune?

Hi John,

Two very contrasting renditions.

[1]  It's a lot easier to play Roxborough Castle in dotted rhythm, as is done 
here. I prefer it played absolutely straight, which is really very challenging. 
A commonly played tune which is rarely played well.  I quite like this 
rendition here . . . seems to have been videoed during a casual session by a 
bystander.

[2] Awful, awful, awful! This version has the tune played in a manner way 
beyond the performers ability or understanding of the tune, and apparently on a 
poorly set-up instrument.

Francis

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[NSP] Re: Tune books with arrangements for other instruments

2011-06-19 Thread Matt Seattle

   These are now published by [1]www.mally.com

   I should think the majority of the tunes and many of the harmonies
   would fit NSP
   On Sun, Jun 19, 2011 at 8:04 AM, Chris Harris
   <[2]ch...@harris405.plus.com> wrote:

 And Matt Seattle has published 3 books called 'Airs for Pairs',
 'Airs for
 Pairs 2', and 'Scottish Airs for Pairs'.
 I thought they might be out of print, but a quick google suggests
 they are
 still available - though maybe not with the original delightful
 cover art.
 Chris

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   --

References

   1. http://www.mally.com/
   2. mailto:ch...@harris405.plus.com
   3. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[NSP] Re: Tune books with arrangements for other instruments

2011-06-19 Thread Chris Harris



And Matt Seattle has published 3 books called 'Airs for Pairs', 'Airs for
Pairs 2', and 'Scottish Airs for Pairs'.

I thought they might be out of print, but a quick google suggests they are
still available - though maybe not with the original delightful cover art.

Chris



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[NSP] Re: Tune books with arrangements for other instruments

2011-06-18 Thread Julia Say

On 18 Jun 2011, Ian Lawther wrote: 
 
> tune arrangements for Northumbrian pipes and other instruments 

http://www.rossleighmusic.co.uk/

Those who use them seem to think highly of them.

Aren't there a couple of LBPS books of such duets etc as well?

Hope this helps
Julia



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[NSP] Re: Tune books with arrangements for other instruments

2011-06-18 Thread Dave S


Hi Ian -- I think there are some books by Derek Hobbs on the NSP site

cheers

Dave S

On 6/18/2011 6:59 PM, Ian Lawther wrote:
I know there have been some books published in the past that include 
tune arrangements for Northumbrian pipes and other instruments though 
as someone who is normally a solo player I haven't taken much 
notice..until now.


I need to encourage an 11 year old flautist and 12 year old cellist to 
practice during the school summer holiday (which starts next week here 
in the US) and thought trying some group playing might be better than 
getting each to do solo practice. Are there any books that would cover 
such instruments and if so anyone know sources? Beyond NSP there are 
other instruments I play that could join in with them so general 
British folk music arranged for assorted instruments would also be good.


Thanks,

Ian



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[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month: Felton Lonnen

2011-05-24 Thread Gibbons, John

John's idea of comparing performances of the same piece on NSP and BP is an 
interesting one;
I find that apparently identical settings, suitably transposed, 
will have a very different musical feel on the 2 instruments, 
even though they look similar on the page, and feel similar beneath the fingers.

The wholly staccato (wooly staccato in my case) or wholly legato versions of 
the same melody have a very different sound.

John



-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
John Dally
Sent: 24 May 2011 16:51
To: NSP group
Subject: [NSP] Tune of the Month: Felton Lonnen

   As suggested, why don't those of us who want to participate in the TOTM
   put a video of "Felton Lonnen" up on [1]www.youtube.com during the
   month of June.  Be sure to post a link here so that we all know about
   it.  You might also want to post a link on your favorite Face Book NSP
   group page.



   I would respectfully suggest that there be no restrictions as to how
   many parts, the setting, the key of the tune or the key of the
   instrument, or style.  The idea here is to be as inclusive as possible,
   to share a good tune, to encourage pipers at all levels of skill, to
   give us all a better sense of community, and for those of us not living
   somewhere near Morpeth to get a few positive and helpful comments on
   our playing.



   Perhaps someone who knows all about these things could give us a
   history of the tune, explain the name, list recordings, ms sources,
   even technical advice, anything that might be interesting or helpful
   for those of us participating.



   Because this tune can be played on the Northumbrian half-long pipes, if
   anyone decides to make a video of the tune played on them, I would
   encourage them to let us know by posting a link here.



   All the best,

   John Dally





   --

References

   1. http://www.youtube.com/


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[NSP] re-Tune of the Month

2011-05-24 Thread Richard York

 The only competitive element in some melodeon circles is to be the one 
who can play louder, which thankfully is not normally an issue in nsp's! 
Hence the expression "Wall to wall melodeons".
But there are more and more superb box players out there, including some 
quiet ones.


Love and piece indeed... did you have any particular piece in mind this 
month, Francis?


Richard.

On 24/05/2011 10:23, Francis Wood wrote:
Since I've never felt the urge to compete, perhaps I shouldn't really 
comment. But from what I've observed, the competition element in the NSP 
world is nothing like that in GHB piping.


It seems to me that NSP competition is far more about participation in 
traditional events and receiving some personal endorsement of 
achievement, rather than defeating the opposition.


I've no idea what melodeon culture and tradition is like, but evidently 
it cannot be ancient, as piping traditions are. If there are strong 
feelings about how things should be done (preferably expressed in a 
friendly way, but I won't lose sleep if they are not), I'm interested 
and glad to read them in this forum. This is essentially a pretty 
friendly place, though with the occasional angry outburst. Rather like 
any average marriage, I guess.


Love n' Peace to all,

Francis


On 24 May 2011, at 09:33, 
  wrote:



  Perhaps one of the reasons the melodeon group is so friendly is that
  they don't have competition built into their culture the way pipers
  do.  (For a diatribe on the subject see my editorial at
  [2]www.theotherpipers.org).


Excellent article!
Csírz



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[NSP] Re: tune of the month

2011-05-24 Thread Francis Wood


On 24 May 2011, at 11:04, Gibbons, John wrote:

> Free-reed instruments in Europe are only a half-century or less younger than 
> keyed NSP, mind

Well OK . .  a good point.

But concertinas were infants at a time when smallpipes had an ancient lineage!

Francis




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[NSP] Re: tune of the month

2011-05-24 Thread Gibbons, John

Free-reed instruments in Europe are only a half-century or less younger than 
keyed NSP, mind

John

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
Francis Wood [oatenp...@googlemail.com]
Sent: 24 May 2011 10:23
To: 
Cc: dir...@gmail.com; nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [NSP] Re: tune of the month

Since I've never felt the urge to compete, perhaps I shouldn't really comment. 
But from what I've observed, the competition element in the NSP world is 
nothing like that in GHB piping.

It seems to me that NSP competition is far more about participation in 
traditional events and receiving some personal endorsement of achievement, 
rather than defeating the opposition.

I've no idea what melodeon culture and tradition is like, but evidently it 
cannot be ancient, as piping traditions are. If there are strong feelings about 
how things should be done (preferably expressed in a friendly way, but I won't 
lose sleep if they are not), I'm interested and glad to read them in this 
forum. This is essentially a pretty friendly place, though with the occasional 
angry outburst. Rather like any average marriage, I guess.

Love n' Peace to all,

Francis

On 24 May 2011, at 09:33,  
 wrote:

>>  Perhaps one of the reasons the melodeon group is so friendly is that
>>  they don't have competition built into their culture the way pipers
>>  do.  (For a diatribe on the subject see my editorial at
>>  [2]www.theotherpipers.org).
>>
>
> Excellent article!
> Csírz
>
>
>
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[NSP] Re: tune of the month

2011-05-24 Thread Christopher.Birch

Nice one Francis.
Happy daze. 

>-Original Message-
>From: Francis Wood [mailto:oatenp...@googlemail.com] 
>Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 11:23 AM
>To: BIRCH Christopher (DGT)
>Cc: dir...@gmail.com; nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu
>Subject: Re: [NSP] Re: tune of the month
>
>Since I've never felt the urge to compete, perhaps I shouldn't 
>really comment. But from what I've observed, the competition 
>element in the NSP world is nothing like that in GHB piping.
>
>It seems to me that NSP competition is far more about 
>participation in traditional events and receiving some 
>personal endorsement of achievement, rather than defeating the 
>opposition.
>
>I've no idea what melodeon culture and tradition is like, but 
>evidently it cannot be ancient, as piping traditions are. If 
>there are strong feelings about how things should be done 
>(preferably expressed in a friendly way, but I won't lose 
>sleep if they are not), I'm interested and glad to read them 
>in this forum. This is essentially a pretty friendly place, 
>though with the occasional angry outburst. Rather like any 
>average marriage, I guess.
>
>Love n' Peace to all,
>
>Francis
>
>
>On 24 May 2011, at 09:33,  
> wrote:
>
>>>  Perhaps one of the reasons the melodeon group is so 
>friendly is that
>>>  they don't have competition built into their culture the way pipers
>>>  do.  (For a diatribe on the subject see my editorial at
>>>  [2]www.theotherpipers.org).
>>> 
>> 
>> Excellent article!
>> Csírz
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>
>

[NSP] Re: tune of the month

2011-05-24 Thread Francis Wood

Since I've never felt the urge to compete, perhaps I shouldn't really comment. 
But from what I've observed, the competition element in the NSP world is 
nothing like that in GHB piping.

It seems to me that NSP competition is far more about participation in 
traditional events and receiving some personal endorsement of achievement, 
rather than defeating the opposition.

I've no idea what melodeon culture and tradition is like, but evidently it 
cannot be ancient, as piping traditions are. If there are strong feelings about 
how things should be done (preferably expressed in a friendly way, but I won't 
lose sleep if they are not), I'm interested and glad to read them in this 
forum. This is essentially a pretty friendly place, though with the occasional 
angry outburst. Rather like any average marriage, I guess.

Love n' Peace to all,

Francis

On 24 May 2011, at 09:33,  
 wrote:

>>  Perhaps one of the reasons the melodeon group is so friendly is that
>>  they don't have competition built into their culture the way pipers
>>  do.  (For a diatribe on the subject see my editorial at
>>  [2]www.theotherpipers.org).
>> 
> 
> Excellent article!
> Csírz
> 
> 
> 
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[NSP] Re: tune of the month

2011-05-24 Thread Christopher.Birch

>   Perhaps one of the reasons the melodeon group is so friendly is that
>   they don't have competition built into their culture the way pipers
>   do.  (For a diatribe on the subject see my editorial at
>   [2]www.theotherpipers.org).
>

Excellent article!
Csírz



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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-04 Thread Gibbons, John

Dear All,

Here's a collage of the Reavely and Crawhall versions of 'Where have you 
been?', 
which we were discussing, with 5 strains  - 
using Reavely's first 3 strains 
and continuing using patterns from Crawhall's 4th and 5th, 
which were inconsistent with Reavely as they stand.
A more experienced editor & composer might do better?

It doesn't want to go much faster than 'Noble Squire Dacre' -
think the words 'Randal my son?' in bar 2 of each strain
Strain 5 works if you play the d's short. 
I would probably play strain 1 over again at the end.

The tune certainly needs to be played more widely.

John


X:1
T:Where hast thou been all the night?
M:6/8
R: Air
K:G
e|d/c/B/A/B/G/ B>cd|dgB c2e|d/c/B/A/B/G/ B>cd|dgf d2:|
e|dgf dgB|dgB c2e|dgf dgB|dgf d2
e|dgf dgB|dgB c2e|d/c/B/A/B/G/ B>cd|dgf d2||
e|dB/c/d/B/ gB/c/d/B/|dB/c/d/B/ c2e|dB/c/d/B/ gB/c/d/B/|dgB c2
e|dB/c/d/B/ gB/c/d/B/|dB/c/d/B/ c2e|d/c/B/A/B/G/ B>cd|dgf d2||
e|d/c/B/c/d/e/ d/c/B/c/d/B/|d/c/B/c/d/B/ c2
e|d/c/B/c/d/e/ d/c/B/c/d/B/|dgf d2
e|d/c/B/c/d/e/ d/c/B/c/d/B/|d/c/B/c/d/B/ c2
e|d/c/B/A/B/G/ B>cd|dgf d2||
e|dcB dcB|dGB c2e|dcB dcB|Ggf d2
e|dcB dcB|dGB c2e|d/c/B/A/B/G/ B>cd|dgf d2||




From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Paul 
Gretton [i...@gretton-willems.com]
Sent: 02 November 2010 10:25
To: 'Matt Seattle'
Cc: 'NSP group'
Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

I haven't really been following this discussion but perhaps it's worth
pointing out that "parody" can have the formal musical sense of
incorporating music from one genre into another, or basing a piece on
another piece. Used in that way, it doesn’t have to imply guying or spoofing
the original.

The clearest examples are the polyphonic parody masses of the Renaissance
that are based on folk songs. The most popular tune was "L'homme armé",
which generated literally dozens of glorious parody masses in the 15th and
16th centuries by major composers like Dufay, Ockeghem and Josquin.

Cheers,

Paul Gretton

-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf
Of Matt Seattle
Sent: 02 November 2010 10:58
To: Gibbons, John
Cc: Richard York; NSP group
Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

 I see why you prefer the 3-strain Reavely version as more
 consistent,
 but the Crawhall strain 4 is worth having - perhaps better if
 tweaked to fit the others from Reavely.

   I should have another look in that case, thanks.

 I have been thinking about this, and Lord Randal, since the
 discussion started.
 The tune is obviously a good fit to the metre, but if this is right,
 then the tune is to be played andante, not as a jig.

   Yes, I think that thee 6/8 variation sets (in Peacock et al) are not
   (dance) jigs, though often based on them - e.g. Felton Lonnen, which
   exists in both forms.

 The idea of Billy Boy as a parody of Lord Randal had never occurred
 to me,
 but the worried mum and the emphasis on the girlfriend's culinary
 abilities are common to both.

   I think it was Bronson's (Trad Tunes of the Child Ballads) book which
   alerted me to this. I had it on loan so I can't check it now, but IIRC
   he said that the two songs (or versions of them) were of comparable
   age, and I got more the feeling of 'counterpart' than 'parody' from
   what he was saying.

   --


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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-02 Thread Paul Gretton

I haven't really been following this discussion but perhaps it's worth
pointing out that "parody" can have the formal musical sense of
incorporating music from one genre into another, or basing a piece on
another piece. Used in that way, it doesnt have to imply guying or spoofing
the original.

The clearest examples are the polyphonic parody masses of the Renaissance
that are based on folk songs. The most popular tune was "L'homme armé",
which generated literally dozens of glorious parody masses in the 15th and
16th centuries by major composers like Dufay, Ockeghem and Josquin.

Cheers,

Paul Gretton 

-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf
Of Matt Seattle
Sent: 02 November 2010 10:58
To: Gibbons, John
Cc: Richard York; NSP group
Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

 I see why you prefer the 3-strain Reavely version as more
 consistent,
 but the Crawhall strain 4 is worth having - perhaps better if
 tweaked to fit the others from Reavely.

   I should have another look in that case, thanks.

 I have been thinking about this, and Lord Randal, since the
 discussion started.
 The tune is obviously a good fit to the metre, but if this is right,
 then the tune is to be played andante, not as a jig.

   Yes, I think that thee 6/8 variation sets (in Peacock et al) are not
   (dance) jigs, though often based on them - e.g. Felton Lonnen, which
   exists in both forms.

 The idea of Billy Boy as a parody of Lord Randal had never occurred
 to me,
 but the worried mum and the emphasis on the girlfriend's culinary
 abilities are common to both.

   I think it was Bronson's (Trad Tunes of the Child Ballads) book which
   alerted me to this. I had it on loan so I can't check it now, but IIRC
   he said that the two songs (or versions of them) were of comparable
   age, and I got more the feeling of 'counterpart' than 'parody' from
   what he was saying.

   --


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http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-02 Thread Matt Seattle

 I see why you prefer the 3-strain Reavely version as more
 consistent,
 but the Crawhall strain 4 is worth having - perhaps better if
 tweaked to fit the others from Reavely.

   I should have another look in that case, thanks.

 I have been thinking about this, and Lord Randal, since the
 discussion started.
 The tune is obviously a good fit to the metre, but if this is right,
 then the tune is to be played andante, not as a jig.

   Yes, I think that thee 6/8 variation sets (in Peacock et al) are not
   (dance) jigs, though often based on them - e.g. Felton Lonnen, which
   exists in both forms.

 The idea of Billy Boy as a parody of Lord Randal had never occurred
 to me,
 but the worried mum and the emphasis on the girlfriend's culinary
 abilities are common to both.

   I think it was Bronson's (Trad Tunes of the Child Ballads) book which
   alerted me to this. I had it on loan so I can't check it now, but IIRC
   he said that the two songs (or versions of them) were of comparable
   age, and I got more the feeling of 'counterpart' than 'parody' from
   what he was saying.

   --


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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-01 Thread Gibbons, John

Matt,
Going back to Bewick (98) which I didn't have in the office,
I see why you prefer the 3-strain Reavely version as more consistent,
but the Crawhall strain 4 is worth having - perhaps better if tweaked to fit 
the others from Reavely.

I have been thinking about this, and Lord Randal, since the discussion started.
The tune is obviously a good fit to the metre, but if this is right, then the 
tune is to be played andante, not as a jig.

The idea of Billy Boy as a parody of Lord Randal had never occurred to me, 
but the worried mum and the emphasis on the girlfriend's culinary abilities are 
common to both.

John

From: Matt Seattle [theborderpi...@googlemail.com]
Sent: 01 November 2010 12:35
To: Gibbons, John
Cc: Richard York; NSP group
Subject: Re: [NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

Same tune, different version. The one I give is from Reavely, as the title but 
not the tune is given by Bewick, and Reavely is the one I found for the 1998 
edition; it's also structurally more consistent than Crawhall's. It's not in 
the 1986 edition.

The 2010 edition is an update of the 1998 edition which was a quantum leap from 
the 1986 edition. If you only have the 1986 edition you owe it to yourself to 
get the new one.

On Mon, Nov 1, 2010 at 12:19 PM, Gibbons, John 
mailto:j.gibb...@imperial.ac.uk>> wrote:
Is that the same/similar tune to the one in Crawhall on FARNE?
I should get the new edition too...



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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-01 Thread Matt Seattle

   Same tune, different version. The one I give is from Reavely, as the
   title but not the tune is given by Bewick, and Reavely is the one I
   found for the 1998 edition; it's also structurally more consistent than
   Crawhall's. It's not in the 1986 edition.

   The 2010 edition is an update of the 1998 edition which was a quantum
   leap from the 1986 edition. If you only have the 1986 edition you owe
   it to yourself to get the new one.
   On Mon, Nov 1, 2010 at 12:19 PM, Gibbons, John
   <[1]j.gibb...@imperial.ac.uk> wrote:

 Is that the same/similar tune to the one in Crawhall on FARNE?
 I should get the new edition too...

   --

References

   1. mailto:j.gibb...@imperial.ac.uk


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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-01 Thread Julia Say

On 1 Nov 2010, Francis Wood wrote: 
> 
> On 1 Nov 2010, at 12:19, Gibbons, John wrote:
> > I should get the new edition too... 
> 
> You should. And so should everyone else. Absolutely excellent!

Well, if we're into blatant advertising:

Price 4 UKP to NPS members, 7 UKP to others.
Carriage is 1.50 UKP in UK, 2.50 in Europe and 4.00 elsewhere.

Cheques payable to the NPS, and sent to me please, or Paypal to 
secret...@northumbrianpipers.org.uk

(For orders including other items as well, please ask for a carriage quote 
before 
sending money)

Hope this is of interest to someone

Julia



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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-01 Thread Francis Wood


On 1 Nov 2010, at 12:19, Gibbons, John wrote:

> I should get the new edition too... 

You should. And so should everyone else. Absolutely excellent!

Francis



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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-01 Thread Gibbons, John

Is that the same/similar tune to the one in Crawhall on FARNE?
I should get the new edition too...

John

-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
Matt Seattle
Sent: 01 November 2010 12:08
To: Richard York
Cc: NSP group
Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

   I've no idea whether it's got anything to do with Lord Randal.

   I was made aware, from my reading, of the idea that 'Billy Boy' and
   'Lord Randal' are sort-of counterparts to each other, humorous and
   tragic, and both have relatively old antecedents.

   The Note in Bewick merely hints at this muddy area, it doesn't have
   answers. But there is a good tune included, and it fits the Randal
   words rather better than the Billy words.

   It's all a big muddy soup, and what does it all mean, I ask you, eh?

   --

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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-01 Thread Matt Seattle

   I've no idea whether it's got anything to do with Lord Randal.

   I was made aware, from my reading, of the idea that 'Billy Boy' and
   'Lord Randal' are sort-of counterparts to each other, humorous and
   tragic, and both have relatively old antecedents.

   The Note in Bewick merely hints at this muddy area, it doesn't have
   answers. But there is a good tune included, and it fits the Randal
   words rather better than the Billy words.

   It's all a big muddy soup, and what does it all mean, I ask you, eh?

   --


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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-01 Thread Richard York

 .. that's a cunning way of reminding me that while I still have your 
original yellow Bewick book, I ought to buy the new one too, Matt   :-)
I will order one anyway, but do you mean by this you think it's not Lord 
Randall either? (Sorry, being thick here - it'll probably be clearer 
once I own the book!)


And yes, consensus evidence points firmly at "Jolly Good Fellow" for 
Moll Brook > Marlborough.


Best wishes,
Richard.

On 01/11/2010 11:28, Matt Seattle wrote:

   "Where have you been all the night?" she describes as a "Scotch
  Tune".
It's tempting to think she's mis-remembered the line in "Billy
  Boy",

See the Note in the recently published NPS edition of Bewicks Pipe
Tunes, which has a tune of the title which is *not* Billy Boy
Might also possibly apply to Lord Randal

   Then there's "Moll Brook"

I presume that the other responses relate to the "For he's a jolly good
fellow" tune - ?

--


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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-11-01 Thread Matt Seattle

  "Where have you been all the night?" she describes as a "Scotch
 Tune".
   It's tempting to think she's mis-remembered the line in "Billy
 Boy",

   See the Note in the recently published NPS edition of Bewicks Pipe
   Tunes, which has a tune of the title which is *not* Billy Boy
   Might also possibly apply to Lord Randal

  Then there's "Moll Brook"

   I presume that the other responses relate to the "For he's a jolly good
   fellow" tune - ?

   --


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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-10-31 Thread Richard York

   It's difficult to know.
   I don't want to hijack too much time from the pipes here, and am asking
   the hurdy gurdy group to share any views on this.
   There are arguments for and against both dulcimer & gurdy as we know
   it, in the text.
   Thanks for the help, though!
   Best wishes,
   Richard.
   On 31/10/2010 18:28, Francis Wood wrote:

On 31 Oct 2010, at 16:13, Richard York wrote:


Henry Mayhew in the 1850's interviewed "Old Sarah" a blind Londonstreet
  hurdy gurdy player who was taught in the very early years of the 1800's
  to play what she called the "cymbal".

"Hurdy gurdy" has been used variously in the past to describe a number of very d
ifferent instruments.
I wonder whether "cymbal" is related to "cimbalom" (various spellings), the East
ern European  dulcimer?

Francis



   --


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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-10-31 Thread Francis Wood

On 31 Oct 2010, at 16:13, Richard York wrote:

> Henry Mayhew in the 1850's interviewed "Old Sarah" a blind Londonstreet
>   hurdy gurdy player who was taught in the very early years of the 1800's
>   to play what she called the "cymbal".

"Hurdy gurdy" has been used variously in the past to describe a number of very 
different instruments.
I wonder whether "cymbal" is related to "cimbalom" (various spellings), the 
Eastern European  dulcimer?

Francis

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[NSP] Re: Tune hunt: OT but I hope interesting!

2010-10-31 Thread Richard York

   John,
I am both in your debt, and hugely impressed at the speed and
   thoroughness of your series of replies... you obviously got the
   proverbial bit between the teeth!
   Fantastic - I like ending up with Marlborough! And what's more it's a
   tune I can play on the gurdy when talking about Old Sarah, assuming the
   hurdy gurdy Mayhew talks of is indeed a hurdy gurdy and not a dulcimer,
   of course.
   (More about that to Anthony in a moment.)
   Again my very many thanks, John.
Best wishes,
   Richard.
   (I'd love to know what the rest of the words were! )
   On 31/10/2010 17:41, Gibbons, John wrote:

To go with the anglicised title, there's a first  line -
"Moll Brook she went to be shaved,"



From: [1]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [[2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of R
ichard York [[3]rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk]
Sent: 31 October 2010 16:13
To: NSP group
Subject: [NSP] Tune hunt: OT but I  hope interesting!

   I'm hunting tunes. Nowt to do specifically with smallpipes, but at
   least one is Scots. And I know there are some mighty experienced tune
   historians among you
   And I have looked in Farne, Matt!:-)
   Henry Mayhew in the 1850's interviewed "Old Sarah" a blind Londonstreet
   hurdy gurdy player who was taught in the very early years of the 1800's
   to play what she called the "cymbal".
He lists tune names she gives. Some, like "The Turnpike Gate" and "At
   Patrick's Day in the Morning" are on "The sessions" listing, though I
   can't know how much or little they've changed.
   Some others I can find, or know already, but I'm drawing a blank on
   three, and will be very grateful for any pointers.
   "Where have you been all the night?" she describes as a "Scotch Tune".
   It's tempting to think she's mis-remembered the line in "Billy Boy",
   but if there's a title out there it would be good to know.
   Then there's "Moll Brook", and "Harlequin Hamlet".
   Some others she mentions are trad. tunes like "Haste[n] to the Wedding"
   and "The Gal I left behind me" so while these may be stage tunes, it's
   apparent she was playing traditional dance tunes. She also says that
   she played Polkas, but doesn't name any.
   Thanks for looking - thanks for any info.
   Best wishes,
   Richard.
   --


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   --

References

   1. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
   2. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
   3. mailto:rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk
   4. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[NSP] Re: Tune Information

2010-09-28 Thread Matt Seattle

   On Tue, Sep 28, 2010 at 5:58 PM, Gibbons, John
   <[1]j.gibb...@imperial.ac.uk> wrote:

 'The Golden Eagle' looks 19th century.

   As far as I know, USA, anon, 19th century, and in G, using fiddle's low
   G and 4th finger extended c'  (range of 2 octaves and a 4th), so not a
   pipe tune without altering the pipes to fit the tune or vice versa.

   --

References

   1. mailto:j.gibb...@imperial.ac.uk


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[NSP] Re: Tune Information

2010-09-28 Thread Julia Say

On 28 Sep 2010, Ann Sessoms wrote: 

>Hazlewood was written by Roy Hartnell and published in The Jack
>Armstrong Tune Book in 1995 by Rossleigh Music, Newbiggin-by-the-Sea.

It was also in the 1982 book published by Jenny Armstrong., but as Hazelwood.

Holmes Fancy first appears in Peacock's Tunes, published 1801, as Holme's 
Fancy, 
but is a keyless tune so could be much older.

"My Home" comes from our kilted brethren: typing it into google in inverted 
commas 
followed by Highland pipe tune gave me more links than I could be bothered to 
follow.

Julia

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[NSP] Re: Tune Information

2010-09-28 Thread Ann Sessoms

   Hazlewood was written by Roy Hartnell and published in The Jack
   Armstrong Tune Book in 1995 by Rossleigh Music, Newbiggin-by-the-Sea.

   > Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2010 15:53:36 +0100
   > To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu
   > From: g.e.green...@aston.ac.uk
   > Subject: [NSP] Tune Information
   >
   > Does anyone have any information on the origins of the following
   tunes?
   >
   > * Because he was a bonny lad
   > * Golden eagle
   > * Gentle maiden
   > * Kettle drum
   > * Holmes' fancy
   > * Hazlewood
   > * My home
   >
   > Many thanks
   >
   >
   >
   > Gordon Greenley
   >
   > --
   >
   >
   > To get on or off this list see list information at
   > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
   --

[NSP] Re: Tune Information

2010-09-28 Thread Richard York

   Fair point - I just leapt to the one I know best!
   Richard.
   On 28/09/2010 17:22, Gibbons, John wrote:

Was the 'Kettle Drum' in the query referring to the D dorian  Playford tune, or
the G major Scottish polka - in one of Matt's Piper's Pocket Books?

John

-Original Message-
From: [1]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [[2]mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Beha
lf Of Richard York
Sent: 28 September 2010 16:19
To: Greenley, Gordon; NSP group
Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune Information

   Kettle Drum  is in the 1650 Playford's Dancing Master, for one.
Dunno about its actual origins, but that's a collected and published
source for it.
  Best wishes,
Richard.

On 28/09/2010 15:53, Greenley, Gordon wrote:

Does anyone have any information on the origins of the following tunes?

  * Because he was a bonny lad
  * Golden eagle
  * Gentle maiden
  * Kettle drum
  * Holmes' fancy
  * Hazlewood
  * My home

Many thanks



Gordon Greenley

--


To get on or off this list see list information at
[3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html





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References

   1. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
   2. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
   3. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[NSP] Re: Tune Information

2010-09-28 Thread Marianne Hall

   Gentle Maiden is, I believe, an Irish tune.  "Maureen (or Mavourneen)
   is the flower of Killarney, and fairest of all to me. The flowers that
   bloom in Killarney are never as fair as she" et cetera.
   Marianne.
   From: g.e.green...@aston.ac.uk
   Subject: [NSP] Tune Information
   To: allerwa...@hotmail.com
   Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2010 16:54:21 +0200
  -  The attached message is an automatically
  -  generated copy of mail delivered to marianne.h...@tinyworld.co.uk


   --Forwarded Message Attachment--
   Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2010 15:53:36 +0100
   To: nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu
   From: g.e.green...@aston.ac.uk
   Subject: [NSP] Tune Information
   Does anyone have any information on the origins of the following tunes?

 * Because he was a bonny lad
 * Golden eagle
 * Gentle maiden
 * Kettle drum
 * Holmes' fancy
 * Hazlewood
 * My home

   Many thanks



   Gordon Greenley

   --


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[1]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

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References

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[NSP] Re: Tune Information

2010-09-28 Thread Gibbons, John

'The Golden Eagle' looks 19th century. 
It has been attributed without evidence (like many others he didn't write)to 
James Hill.
I would guess that like The High Level and President Garfield's, it started 
life in B flat.
I haven't seen it in any old printed source, but names change so I might have 
missed it.

Matt?

John

-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
Richard York
Sent: 28 September 2010 16:19
To: Greenley, Gordon; NSP group
Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune Information

   Kettle Drum  is in the 1650 Playford's Dancing Master, for one.
Dunno about its actual origins, but that's a collected and published 
source for it.
  Best wishes,
Richard.

On 28/09/2010 15:53, Greenley, Gordon wrote:
> Does anyone have any information on the origins of the following tunes?
>
>   * Because he was a bonny lad
>   * Golden eagle
>   * Gentle maiden
>   * Kettle drum
>   * Holmes' fancy
>   * Hazlewood
>   * My home
>
> Many thanks
>
>
>
> Gordon Greenley
>
> --
>
>
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>

[NSP] Re: Tune Information

2010-09-28 Thread Gibbons, John

Was the 'Kettle Drum' in the query referring to the D dorian  Playford tune, or 
the G major Scottish polka - in one of Matt's Piper's Pocket Books? 

John 

-Original Message-
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
Richard York
Sent: 28 September 2010 16:19
To: Greenley, Gordon; NSP group
Subject: [NSP] Re: Tune Information

   Kettle Drum  is in the 1650 Playford's Dancing Master, for one.
Dunno about its actual origins, but that's a collected and published 
source for it.
  Best wishes,
Richard.

On 28/09/2010 15:53, Greenley, Gordon wrote:
> Does anyone have any information on the origins of the following tunes?
>
>   * Because he was a bonny lad
>   * Golden eagle
>   * Gentle maiden
>   * Kettle drum
>   * Holmes' fancy
>   * Hazlewood
>   * My home
>
> Many thanks
>
>
>
> Gordon Greenley
>
> --
>
>
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>

[NSP] Re: Tune Information

2010-09-28 Thread Richard York


  Kettle Drum  is in the 1650 Playford's Dancing Master, for one.
Dunno about its actual origins, but that's a collected and published 
source for it.

 Best wishes,
Richard.

On 28/09/2010 15:53, Greenley, Gordon wrote:

Does anyone have any information on the origins of the following tunes?

  * Because he was a bonny lad
  * Golden eagle
  * Gentle maiden
  * Kettle drum
  * Holmes' fancy
  * Hazlewood
  * My home

Many thanks



Gordon Greenley

--


To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

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