[opensource-dev] Fun time on friday (not so OT)

[Francesco "Sythos" Rabbi]

https://twitter.com/hennesph/status/575965202803507200/photo/1
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[opensource-dev] Scripted attachment inspection

[Francesco "Sythos" Rabbi]

I've seen on internet some screenshot of an avy inspection with listed all
scripted attachments (name and creator), but cannot find this feature in
any viewer I've tried from TPV list...

This feature is quite usefull for roleplay/combat sims to catch cheater and
griwfier, is a option hidden is some debug settings?

Altair "Sythos" Memo

-- 
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Re: [opensource-dev] Review Request: OPEN-125 Open source mesh upload using hacd.

[Sythos]

On Sat, 19 Nov 2011 20:26:16 -
"Nicky Perian"  wrote:

> 
> ---
> This is an automatically generated e-mail. To reply, visit:
> http://codereview.secondlife.com/r/519/
> ---

any news from other OS devs?
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Re: [opensource-dev] Viewer Policy Changes

[Sythos]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 22:11:19 +0100
Tillie Ariantho  wrote:

> On 25.02.2012 19:24, Adeon Writer wrote:
> 
> > It wouldn't disallow derendering, since others on TPV's and others
> > on official see it the same way (ie, they both see nothing happen
> > at all and it doesn't violate privacy)
> 
> 
> Derendering is essential for photographers, if there is thise newbie
> blocking the sight onto something important during a show. It helps a
> lot to do my work.

i think this LL's update mean not this kind of things but the ability
of other to enjoy SL, if you derender somebody don't affect else than
you, like other feature to increase the usability.

About portable device and else is the same: if the software render the
avy fine inworld (without give 3D on display, like pocket metaverse can
rez and rebake too the avy inworld without offer 3D graphic) there are
no problem (but this mean all textual client must include code to don't
annoy others with clouds or ruth avy for other). Same RLV, affect YOUR
way to "live" on SL, but others aren't affected.

imho this update mean the "added" feature to TPV viewers like old
emerald's extra attachment points (usable by who own the viewer but
annoying for other bc see floating attachment around) or... maybe, for
full 3D viewer mean not anymore no-mesh viewers (no-mesh viewers show a
distorted and broken enviroment to who is around the affected user).

alla bove under a giant "imho" umbrella, all we must wait office hour
for clarification and explanation :)
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Re: [opensource-dev] webkit for linux builds too old?

[Sythos]

On Sat, 18 Feb 2012 10:49:37 +0100
Henri Beauchamp  wrote:

> On Sat, 18 Feb 2012 09:30:24 +0100, Lance Corrimal wrote:
> 
> > Hi,
> > 
> > I get "webkit too old" log file entries on linux a lot...
> > 
> > Is there a special reason why the linux builds use webkit 4.6 while
> > mac and windows use 4.7.1?
> 
> Probably because LL didn't figure out the changes to how the new
> qtwebkit must be packaged and linked now (with jscore that has
> to be added)...

i got another kind of problems, autobuild wrongly detect flags from
host OS, i've added by hand ni makefile "--no-avx --no-sse4.1
--no-sse4.2" and forced the cpu/arch, for a reason not clear (to me)
autobuild create binaries with SSE4 and AVX registry optimization
(probed CPU but not arch/OS)

compiling on linux as is from hg don't produce a usable package on my
system
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Re: [opensource-dev] Question about speed of name cache query

[Francesco "Sythos" Rabbi]

Il giorno 25/ott/2011, alle ore 16:00, Lance Corrimal <
lance.corri...@eregion.de> ha scritto:

All I know about name caching is this:

clear your cache the hard way, by removing everything in the cache
folder, then open the info tab of a group with a really high number of
members, and your framerate will go to hell until all display names
have been fetched.


Am Dienstag 25 Oktober 2011 schrieb Jonathan Welch:

For my solution to Storm-1653 (Group notices sent by muted

residents are still displayed) I have to call

gCacheName->buildLegacyName to get the AgentID associated with a

legacy name.


It looks like this code may operate asynchronously if there is a

cache miss.  In my testing I was always able to get an AgentID

back, even with a cache miss, but my tests were not being done in

a lagged out region.


Would someone with knowledge of the name cache tell me if it is

possible for this routine to not return an AgentID; I'd like to

comment my code change properly.


During my experience in KV team i've tried lots of way to increase
performances, pthread (actually used) have the "bad side" to hold the parent
thread till the job is executed if the next token of parent thread, APR
solve a bit deploying some loads on separate threads, but for intrinsic
nature of pthread (APR is just a wrapper like boost::thread) the child have
a lot of constraints from parent thread. This mean some code token can slow
down (till hand for short time) the main thread.
I've stepped in my test in 2 directions: OpenCL and OpenMP (not for
"release" of KV, just few test with very few tester).

OpenCL require a lot of code rewrite, i've tried just to spread main threads
(cloning the main thread incipit like in macosx code, on Mac OCL is native),
the performance are higher, but not so much as the pain of rewrite the code
(and is a lot driver dependent, nVidia implementation and AMD/ATI one don't
match fully at 100%). OCL load GPU too if main CPUs are full, this mean
after a TP a overrall hang for 1-2 seconds while GPU move back to main
memory their threads and begin to work as graphic unit (at least... on my
system... not so high-end one)

OpenMP isn't so widely appliable, is pretty nice on thread startup code
(i've seen *ALL* my 4 cores loaded at 100%, just moving principal threads
like whole decoding and fetching thread on other cores via OMP), but is lot
interesting in "for" code, like inventory or name fecthing, OMP is very low
as invasive level and need few include and few pragma around the code. OMP
is native too on MacOSX, is a default installed lib on quite all linux
distros, is just a DLL on windows (another 3p libs and all should work). In
a child process hang or overload the core others PU can continue to work
without too many slows.

hoping this comment can be usefull, if more detail needed i can write more
(during european evenings, now "theorically" i'm working in RL ;) )

-- 
Sent by iPhone
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Re: [opensource-dev] debian lenny build environment?

[Francesco "Sythos" Rabbi]

If you install metapackages you hit all:

Build-essential
Bison
Flex
Libgtk2.0-dev
Libglib2.0-dev

I think is all

-- 
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Il giorno 06/ott/2011, alle ore 15:33, Lance Corrimal
 ha scritto:

> Hi,
>
> does anyone have a list of packages that I need to install on a debian
> lenny to be able to build a 3.x viewer and the 3p libs?
>
>
> thanks,
> LC
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Re: [opensource-dev] SL voice issues with pulseaudio combined sink:

[Sythos]

On Mon, 22 Aug 2011 13:27:05 -0500
"Ron Rogers Jr."  wrote:

> Yes, another one:
> 
> https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-26730
> 
> CronoCloud
> 

this is a pulseaudio mis-use

duplex audio isn't suitable for voice+audio (capture+output) on same
channel (this happen on SL, like OpenArena VoiceChat or all other
software where you select same device for in+out without setup a
virtual device each application), you must use composite (input on a
virtuald evice and output on another virtual device, maybe same
physical device).

This isn't a SL related problem IMHO
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Re: [opensource-dev] Very Frequent Crashes in Snowstorm 3.0.2 builds 238538 and 238719 on Linux.

[Sythos]

On Thu, 18 Aug 2011 11:01:51 -0500
"Ron Rogers Jr."  wrote:


> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z WARNING: LLPluginProcessParent::poll:
> apr_pollset_poll failed with status 4
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: unix_post_minidump_callback: generated
> minidump: 
> /home/CronoCloud/.secondlife/logs/0cca02f2-f319-e83f-0fcec2c7-6bf8fabc.dmp
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: handleViewerCrash: Handle viewer crash
> entry.
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: handleViewerCrash: Last render pool type: 0
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: print:  * PRINT OUT LL CALL
> STACKS *
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: print: mainLoop line 1120 Available
> virtual mem(KB): 4294967295
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: print: mainLoop line 1119 Available
> physical mem(KB): 4294967295
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: print:  *** END OF LL CALL
> STACKS ***
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: handleViewerCrash: Creating crash marker
> file /home/CronoCloud/.secondlife/logs/SecondLife.error_marker
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: handleViewerCrash: Created crash marker
> file /home/CronoCloud/.secondlife/logs/SecondLife.error_marker
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: handleViewerCrash: Handle viewer crash
> generating stats log.
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: writeDebugInfo: Opening debug
> file /home/CronoCloud/.secondlife/logs/debug_info.log
> 2011-08-18T15:54:19Z INFO: fork: Forked child process 2821
> *** Bad shutdown. ***

same crash, the only way to start is delete all .secondlife/* settings
(first run, second one don't work again), i've tried both on a x86_64
and on a i686, same behaviour
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Re: [opensource-dev] OS X Lion

[Francesco "Sythos" Rabbi]

> On 2011-08-15, at 17:57, Lee ponzu wrote:
>
>> How much attention is being paid to Lion?   I think the natives are starting 
>> to get restless.
>
> If you only wish to build on Mac OS X Lion with Xcode 4 you could look at 
> 
>  which "works for me".
>
> We also try to figure out some backward compatibility issues with this patch 
> at .
>
> The viewer seems to build fine with Mac OS X 10.6 SDK but not with 10.7 
> because it is using some very old library calls.
>
> It would be very nice to make a nice Cocoa window especially with Lion's new 
> "full screen" option.
>
> What other attention do you have in mind?
>

Well, lion use OpenGL 3.3, may be nice update all shader to use the
more advanced feagments and features for shaders (actually on version
120, mean OpenGL 2.1). But this mean drop snowleopard and previous...



-- 
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Re: [opensource-dev] Python broken on Lion - autobuild doesn't work

[Sythos]

On Sun, 24 Jul 2011 15:13:14 +0200
Laurent Bechir  wrote:

> 
> Hello,
> 
> I've just upgraded to Lion and python seems to be broken. I can't use
> either autobuild and git. :
> 
> autobuild
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "/usr/local/bin/autobuild", line 5, in 
> from pkg_resources import load_entry_point
>   File
> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.7/Extras/lib/python/pkg_resources.py",
> line 2603, in  working_set.require(__requires__) File
> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.7/Extras/lib/python/pkg_resources.py",
> line 666, in require needed = self.resolve(parse_requirements
> (requirements)) File
> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.7/Extras/lib/python/pkg_resources.py",
> line 565, in resolve raise DistributionNotFound(req)  # XXX put more
> info here pkg_resources.DistributionNotFound: autobuild==0.8.5
> 
> And Xcode is suddenly half english, half eastern language...
> 
> 
> Perhaps installing the new version of Xcode would solve the problem ?
> But I don't know if I can still build Second Life viewer with Xcode
> 4.1.

Lion is shipped with Pythn2.7, you need to install "by hand" from
python homepage 2.6 package for macosx and modify your autobuild script
(text editor) changing first line from trailing "python" to "python-2.6"
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Re: [opensource-dev] Shader typo

[Sythos]

On Fri, 01 Jul 2011 14:14:08 +0200
Boroondas Gupte  wrote:

> On 06/28/2011 08:45 PM, Altair Sythos Memo wrote:
> > SecondLife-i686-2.7.6.233972/app_settings/shaders/class2/deferred/sunlightSSAOMSF.glsl
> >
> > should be sunLightSSAOMSF.glsl
> >
> > renaming turn ON again shadows
> Looks like that's already been fixed in b3e5a757f275
> <https://bitbucket.org/lindenlab/viewer-development/changeset/b3e5a757f275>
> a week ago. Can you try whether it's working correctly in recent
> viewer-development test builds?

i'll check asap, btw last night i've seen [COUNT] in prim cpunt edit
floater... maybe my version is too old
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[opensource-dev] Shader typo

[Sythos]

SecondLife-i686-2.7.6.233972/app_settings/shaders/class2/deferred/sunlightSSAOMSF.glsl

should be sunLightSSAOMSF.glsl

renaming turn ON again shadows
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Re: [opensource-dev] Review Request: OPEN-67: make LLDirIterator implementation compatible to boost::filesystem v3 (as found in Boost 1.44 and newer)

[Francesco "Sythos"]

Well... I'm sorry but for me is quite hard remember what i've done
yesterday... Got focus about what i've done 1 month ago is impissible...

If i recall correctly i've already used this patch in KV, i can check deeper
asap @ home this evening

-- 
Sent by iPhone

Il giorno 21/giu/2011, alle ore 12:14, "Boroondas Gupte" <
slli...@boroon.dasgupta.ch> ha scritto:

  This is an automatically generated e-mail. To reply, visit:
http://codereview.secondlife.com/r/313/

On May 25th, 2011, 2:55 p.m., *Altair Memo* wrote:

work fine with both 1.45 from 3p-libs both custom 1.46 prebuilt libs
(non-standalone)

 Have you actually reviewed the code change or just tested the result?


- Boroondas

On May 25th, 2011, 1:25 p.m., Boroondas Gupte wrote:
  Review request for Viewer.
By Boroondas Gupte.

*Updated May 25, 2011, 1:25 p.m.*
Description

Context: We are currently using Boost 1.45, which already comes with
the new Boost Filesystem Library API (Version 3) but still defaults to
the old one (Version 2). From Boost 1.46 on, V3 will be the default
and Boost 1.47 will be the last one to come with V2. The Boost
Filesystem Library documentation recommends "Existing code should be
moved to Version 3 as soon as convenient. New code should be written
for Version 3. Version 2 is deprecated, and will not be included in
Boost releases 1.48 and later."

This change overrides the default, so that the V3 API is used, and
makes the necessary code changes. (So we can stick to Boost 1.45 and
upgrade whenever we feel like it.)

Note: I only changed stuff that the compiler complained about. If the
new API also changes semantic of still-compiling library usage, more
changes might be necessary.

  Testing

* Compiled Viewer (standalone) with Boost 1.45
* Started Viewer
* Logged in

* Compiled Viewer (standalone) with Boost 1.46
* Started Viewer
* Logged in

Not tested:
* non-standalone

  *Bugs: * OPEN-67 
Diffs

   - doc/contributions.txt (959f9340da92)
   - indra/llvfs/lldiriterator.cpp (959f9340da92)

View Diff 
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Re: [opensource-dev] new subtasks added to STORM-312 (was: 3D connexion devices on linux)

[Sythos]

On Sat, 04 Jun 2011 13:00:38 +0200
Boroondas Gupte  wrote:


> @Oz: Can you please investigate (or get someone to investigate)
> whether a 3p-* repo for the linux libNDOFdev already exists
> internally at LL and can be published? If none exists, yet, and we
> thus have to create one for Jan's sources from scratch, I'd like
> someone to walk me through the process of doing so. (Yes, I know
> there are guides about that on the wiki, but I don't even know which
> of the apparently several ones to follow.)

no news?
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Re: [opensource-dev] new subtasks added to STORM-312 (was: 3D connexion devices on linux)

[Sythos]

On Sat, 04 Jun 2011 13:00:38 +0200
Boroondas Gupte  wrote:


> @Oz: Can you please investigate (or get someone to investigate)
> whether a 3p-* repo for the linux libNDOFdev already exists
> internally at LL and can be published? If none exists, yet, and we
> thus have to create one for Jan's sources from scratch, I'd like
> someone to walk me through the process of doing so. (Yes, I know
> there are guides about that on the wiki, but I don't even know which
> of the apparently several ones to follow.)

agree a lot, i've already a 3p-ndof (used by me for KV purposes)m i
should just clean around replacing KV with LL :)
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Re: [opensource-dev] 3D connexion devices on linux

[Francesco "Sythos"]

We cannot ask to the world to patch the kernel for SL, not all have enough
skills, and all other device and programs work fine. Imho the right way to
work is fix the SL side, without introduce risk and collateral effect
putting hands on kernel

-- 
Sent by iPhone

Il giorno 04/giu/2011, alle ore 08:59, "L. Christopher Bird" <
zenmo...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

I have a friend that uses a space navigator for SL and explains that it was
broken in the past and SL had a workaround, and by actually fixing the
kernel broke SL.  Here is the patch she wrote. In short just adding a
"return" in the right place.

diff -ru linux-2.6.36-gentoo-r5/drivers/hid/hid-lg.c
linux-2.6.36-gentoo-r5-new/drivers/hid/hid-lg.c
--- linux-2.6.36-gentoo-r5/drivers/hid/hid-lg.c 2010-10-20
16:30:22.0 -0400
+++ linux-2.6.36-gentoo-r5-new/drivers/hid/hid-lg.c 2011-03-09
20:44:53.0 -0500
@@ -53,6 +53,7 @@
rdesc[84] = rdesc[89] = 0x4d;
rdesc[85] = rdesc[90] = 0x10;
}
+   return; // A cheap hack to make SL work.
if ((quirks & LG_RDESC_REL_ABS) && rsize >= 50 &&
rdesc[32] == 0x81 && rdesc[33] == 0x06 &&
rdesc[49] == 0x81 && rdesc[50] == 0x06) {

-- Zen

On Fri, Jun 3, 2011 at 6:03 PM, Altair Sythos  wrote:

> linux resident with kernel 2.6.35 (or more) cannot use 3d mouse bc
> NDOF0.2 don't support new "evdev" interface, NDOF 0.3 (released by same
> author of previous one) support fine both old and new kernels, how can
> somebody submit via HG or else the new code?
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[opensource-dev] 3D connexion devices on linux

[Sythos]

linux resident with kernel 2.6.35 (or more) cannot use 3d mouse bc
NDOF0.2 don't support new "evdev" interface, NDOF 0.3 (released by same
author of previous one) support fine both old and new kernels, how can
somebody submit via HG or else the new code?
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Re: [opensource-dev] Review Request: OPEN-67: make LLDirIterator implementation compatible to boost::filesystem v3 (as found in Boost 1.44 and newer)

[Sythos]

On Wed, 18 May 2011 20:13:39 -
"Boroondas Gupte"  wrote:


> Diffs (updated)
> -
> 
>   doc/contributions.txt 959f9340da92 
>   indra/llvfs/lldiriterator.cpp 959f9340da92 
> 
> Diff: http://codereview.secondlife.com/r/307/diff
> 
> 
> Testing
> ---
> 
> * Compiled Viewer (standalone) with Boost 1.46
> * Started Viewer
> * Logged in
> 
> Not tested:
> * non-standalone

not work... fail on compile

> * other boost versions (At least one version <= 1.43 should be
> tested! Preferably the one LL currently uses.)

using boost-1.45 from 3p repo don't work
i've fixed it upgrading the 3p libs to 1.46 locally, maybe a global
wide boost upgrade should be fine for everybody...
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[opensource-dev] about VWR-10710

[Sythos]

i've spent last weekend testing and investigating about the jira in
subject (i think is a bug more annoying than a lot other why corrupt a
lot of creations). I've seen mistexturized textures on sculpt and
profile pics, and increasing monitor resolution and playing with
screenshot i've noticed the textures aren't "really" broken, are just
the wrong resolution. (btw:
https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-10710 )

As uploaded here: https://picasaweb.google.com/sythos/RainbowTextures
i've seen profile pics became more or less 25% or widht/height, spare
place are filled with fuzzy/random pixels. 
Same happen on sculpt textures, the "broken" textures is rescaled on
upper left corner of object (i mean mapping direction).

opening texture console (hoping no UI bug) i've noticed too a random
miscaled progressive bar: every time a progressive bar go over 100%
(supposing right limit is 100%) the texture appear broken, this happen
both for profile pics and both for sculpts.

I've noticed this happen on both profile pics uplodaed via web profiles
both old ones from inventory, without any relations with image format.
On sculpts same, misresizing happen both png, jpg or tga...

Sincerely cannot repro on planar or other kind of obj but sculpt.

i've snorked into the code, looking for a typo, bug or something
suspicious into images lenght routines, without any success :-\


Somebody can hint where check to understand what/where the bug born?
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Re: [opensource-dev] ATI vs NV vs OSX

[Francesco "Sythos"]

Oh, my fault, i mean full HW support, tweaking via software there are some
way, but the performance loss is sensible...

-- 
Sent by iPhone

Il giorno 11/mag/2011, alle ore 11:38, "Francesco \"Sythos\"" <
syt...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

On snow Leopard no

-- 
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Il giorno 11/mag/2011, alle ore 10:13, Marc Adored
 ha scritto:

So does that mean no shadows no matter the card in osx?


On Wed, May 11, 2011 at 3:57 AM, Francesco "Sythos" 
wrote:

Lion (next macosx release) have OpenGL upgraded from 2.1 to 3.1 and

Apple have enabled GL_ARB_shadow &C. (already in 2.1 but disabled for

Apple decision), this mean by *theory* all OpenGL glsl can work on Mac

too (imho, never checked deeply inside glsl of the viewer)


--

Sent by iPhone


Il giorno 11/mag/2011, alle ore 09:20, Marc Adored

 ha scritto:


So I am building a machine we shall call it a haxintosh... It will be

running OSX I was just wondering if ATI or Nvidia was better supported

for SecondLife on OSX? I know OSX chose ATI for there machines but

does SL support it or would I be better off to get Nvidia anyways? I

really want everything shadows lighting all that. Ive seen issues on

OSX for some people but I dont know if its ATI or SL's problems with

the os directly. I know this is the opensource dev list but I figured

you guys would know this stuff better then anyone being in the

trenches and all :P

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Re: [opensource-dev] ATI vs NV vs OSX

[Francesco "Sythos"]

On snow Leopard no

-- 
Sent by iPhone

Il giorno 11/mag/2011, alle ore 10:13, Marc Adored
 ha scritto:

> So does that mean no shadows no matter the card in osx?
>
> On Wed, May 11, 2011 at 3:57 AM, Francesco "Sythos"  wrote:
>> Lion (next macosx release) have OpenGL upgraded from 2.1 to 3.1 and
>> Apple have enabled GL_ARB_shadow &C. (already in 2.1 but disabled for
>> Apple decision), this mean by *theory* all OpenGL glsl can work on Mac
>> too (imho, never checked deeply inside glsl of the viewer)
>>
>> --
>> Sent by iPhone
>>
>> Il giorno 11/mag/2011, alle ore 09:20, Marc Adored
>>  ha scritto:
>>
>>> So I am building a machine we shall call it a haxintosh... It will be
>>> running OSX I was just wondering if ATI or Nvidia was better supported
>>> for SecondLife on OSX? I know OSX chose ATI for there machines but
>>> does SL support it or would I be better off to get Nvidia anyways? I
>>> really want everything shadows lighting all that. Ive seen issues on
>>> OSX for some people but I dont know if its ATI or SL's problems with
>>> the os directly. I know this is the opensource dev list but I figured
>>> you guys would know this stuff better then anyone being in the
>>> trenches and all :P
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Re: [opensource-dev] streaming media on 64bit?

[Sythos]

On Sat, 5 Feb 2011 10:15:35 -0500
Marc Adored  wrote:

> I have copied the gstreamer-0.10 from my wifes 32bit ubuntu to

very bad idea

> /usr/lib32/gstreamer-0.10 but it still cant find the file
> /usr/lib32/gstreamer-0.10/libgstspc.so. I have verified it is there so
> I am not sure why it can't find it. I also put all the gstreamer libs

you need to install ia32libs, this bundle a ot of 32bit libraries to
handle this kind of problems, install the package "linux32" too, may be
nice and usefull run the viewer within it
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Re: [opensource-dev] Slightly off topic but need ideas how to fix

[Sythos]

On Thu, 13 Jan 2011 11:17:27 -0500
Erin Mallory  wrote:

> 
> This is slightly off topic but as the ramifications of what will
> happen when the old profiles are taken down is starting to get out
> there, merchants and content creators are starting to panic about
> what these new profiles mean for them. There is a a ton of content
> that is going to be broken by this, much of it content that
> businesses rely on heavily. a more full list can be found in web-3509
> but a number of rewards systems, venders, and security devices found
> within hundreds if not thousands of SL stores are built heavily
> around the old profile pages and cannot be easily updated or replaced
> before the old profiles will likely be taken down... Even if
> businesses begin to switch over, that involves changing out sometimes
> hundreds of venders, everything associated with the venders (like
> gift cards etc), and during all of that the ability to make new
> content is affected. Many SL businesses are teetering on the edge of
> bankrupcy already, including many where this is the SOLE or largest
> percentage of income to those that simply are incapable of getting an
> income any other way. So I'm pleading with the lindens and devs on
> this list to PLEASE start putting some thought to how to mitigate
> this... 

i'm sorry but don't understand how web interface to show profile data
can involve business. scripts still work in both directions
(groups, key2name, the new istr about display names), and web interface
is just a re-design of the "old" profile in sidebar (upper piece
SL-photo +SL desc, just under RL photo +info, on a sie groups and
picks), is just a interface design... you can stil ask for friendship,
open an IM, offer a teleport, invite to a group (and bot can still
invite to groups), so how shops, security systems and other can be
involded by web profiles?
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Re: [opensource-dev] Linux 64bit and gstreamer

[Sythos]

On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 15:54:36 -0500
Mike Chase  wrote:

> Yes, but that doesn't address the gstreamer issue. As far as I know 
> unless something has changed.  I suppose I could bite the bullet and
> get used to building form source.  But I was hopeful with the
> excellent work being done in sprints by the team that a 64bit Linux
> client might have been addressed.

here work fine (on pulseaudio, but dunno if this can change something)
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Re: [opensource-dev] Linux 64bit and gstreamer

[Sythos]

On Fri, 10 Dec 2010 12:51:54 -0500
Mike Chase  wrote:

> Hi all, I have a new machine coming and given the amount of memory it 
> has I'd really like to run it 64bit linux (probably ubuntu).  I'd
> really like to stay with the ability to run SnowStorm (and the Mesh
> viewer builds).  Can someone point me to a summary of 64bit support
> for Linux for that series of viewers?  I know in the past I was able
> to run a 32bit version but with no streaming media.  Thats a non
> starter for me as I own a club in SL and its kinda nice to be able to
> hear what's being played in the club.

sudo apt-get install ia32-libs ia32-libs-gtk ia32-libs-kde ia32-libs-sdl
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Re: [opensource-dev] Dynamic shadows and ATI

[Sythos]

On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 22:48:21 +0100
Laurent Bechir  wrote:


> Perhaps Linden should put something like "You will have a better 
> experience with Second Life if you choose NVidia graphic card". I
> know it's quite stupid, but from what I've read there is not a chance
> that we get good support for ATI cards and dynamic shadows which is
> quite disapointing.

not at all, last MAC Lion beta have fixed a lot for ATI/AMD cards of
R6xx and R7xx family, linux have a module to support all missing
GLX extensions (fglrx-glx  as alternative to radeon module full
opensource, emulatign via software all missed by hardware
acceleration), windows ATI/AMD driver emulate OpenGL via DirectX (not
in a smart way, imho, as on MSDN DD374297 the emulation is a
translation 1:1 from GLX extension to windows DX functions, skipping
where DX have a missing implementation)

i've no windows, but installing MESA drivers drom www.mesa3d.org should
extend GL functions (never tested, but on support page say "Direct3D"
and on oct/04 release show a initial support for R6xx and R7xx ATI/AMD
chipsets), extending DX with a full OpenGL2.1 set. (there is too a
confortablem word like "very experimental"... but if somebody is so
brave to test it...)

all above should be readen under a giant "imho" umbrella, as said i've
no windows machine, cannot test if work...


PS: next hardware upgrade take a look on nvidia ;)
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Re: [opensource-dev] Infinite loop in viewer-development?

[Sythos]

On Wed, 10 Nov 2010 09:29:16 -0600
Sheet Spotter  wrote:

> The code enters an infinite loop when two methods are repeatedly
> calling each other. LLVOAvatarSelf::removeMissingBakedTextures calls
> LLVOAvatar::updateMeshTextures, which in turn calls
> LLVOAvatarSelf::removeMissingBakedTextures.

GCC4.4?
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Re: [opensource-dev] LGPL violation

[Sythos]

On Wed, 27 Oct 2010 23:38:55 +0200
Altair "Sythos" Memo  wrote:


> yu can put in a DLL all the code, LGPL allow you to do, bu you shoudl
> release the LGPL part of code (not the piece yours or under other
> license), you must release the LGPL code of DLL, not all

please... turn on your typonese translator before read my last email XD
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Re: [opensource-dev] LGPL violation

[Sythos]

On Wed, 27 Oct 2010 10:38:32 -0400
Malachi  wrote:

> does this mean that if i move all of my own code over to a dll file
> that is loaded at runtime that i do not have to release the source
> for it?

uhm... both no and yes

yu can put in a DLL all the code, LGPL allow you to do, bu you shoudl
release the LGPL part of code (not the piece yours or under other
license), you must release the LGPL code of DLL, not all
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Re: [opensource-dev] (CTS-315) march choice for 64bit builds

[Sythos]

On Sat, 23 Oct 2010 03:19:24 -0700
leliel  wrote:


> 
> > the other (imho better) way to select right march/mtune is use
> > "generic" and declare *all* parameters, sort of:
> 
> This is the proper fix imho.
> 
> > for 32bit:
> > gcc -march=generic -mtune=generic -m32 -mmmx -msse -msse2
> > -mfpmath=both 
> >
> > for 64bit:
> > gcc -march=generic -mtune=generic -m64 -mmmx -msse -msse2
> > -mfpmath=both 
> 
> Should use -mfpmath=sse, gcc isn't very good at doing both x87 and sse
> fp math at the same time.

let GCC to choose the faster way to assembly machine code... (done
under GCC4.5 a lot of test in KV enviroment, but on intel up)

is time for a libs update too, especially on multimedia (opeonal,
pulse, SSL0.9.7 is buged, etc.etc.), as change compilefarm upgrading
GCC (mainly now, mesh need high performance compilated code)
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Re: [opensource-dev] (CTS-315) march choice for 64bit builds

[Sythos]

On Sat, 23 Oct 2010 03:08:26 +0200
Boroondas Gupte  wrote:

>  Because SSE2 is now required anyway, -march=pentium4 is now passed
> for building lindenlab/mesh-development. Of course, this doesn't work
> for 64bit builds. (See CTS-315
> .) What should march be
> set to for 64bit buids, if anything?

pentium4 don't support 64bit, but "nocona" yes

the other (imho better) way to select right march/mtune is use
"generic" and declare *all* parameters, sort of:

for 32bit:
gcc -march=generic -mtune=generic -m32 -mmmx -msse -msse2
-mfpmath=both 

for 64bit:
gcc -march=generic -mtune=generic -m64 -mmmx -msse -msse2
-mfpmath=both 

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Re: [opensource-dev] USER STORY for not so far future

[Sythos]

On Thu, 21 Oct 2010 11:57:28 -0400
"Oz Linden (Scott Lawrence)"  wrote:

>   On 2010-10-21 10:10, Francesco Rabbi wrote:
> > Not understand sorry...
> >
> > This isn't a LL problem. You can already use iMouse to use your
> > iPad, iPhone or iPod as a multi-touch trackpad and via control
> > panel you can bind multi-touch gesture to keyboard shortcut...
> 
> 
> Now that would be a great thing to document on the wiki - think you
> can write it up, Francesco?

/me wistle whispering "next time i'll look my shoes"

XD

ok, asap i'll have a bit of spare time i'll begin, is more a list of
links to howto...
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Re: [opensource-dev] Enhanced Script Editor Request

[Sythos]

On Wed, 20 Oct 2010 16:07:31 -0700
Ricky  wrote:

> lol... That comment reminds me of this (tongue-in-cheek,) graphic
> representing the learning curves for a variety of common editors:
> http://blogs.msdn.com/b/steverowe/archive/2004/11/17/code-editor-learning-curves.aspx

damn awaked my wife laughing... XD
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Re: [opensource-dev] O.O Display name code DROP!

[Sythos]

On Fri, 15 Oct 2010 16:23:27 -0700
Leyla Linden  wrote:

> Hi All,
> 
> The chat log format change wasinitially done so we could easily add
> more information in the chat logs.  Now that the display name can
> change it's nice to have more data like an agent_id that can be hooked
> up to inspectors.
> 
> But seeing as how many people rely on easily readable text chat logs,
> we're going to revert them back to text files.  The only difference
> is that they'll include both display names and usernames, much like
> Rob Nelson suggested.

a nice way is use "realname.txt" as file format, and inside use
"displayed name" (if there is one), so inside logs there is a track of
displayed name too (about how KV work now)
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Re: [opensource-dev] Unity 3D as possible base for future (maybe even official) SL Viewers

[Sythos]

On Sun, 3 Oct 2010 18:03:40 -0500
Argent Stonecutter  wrote:

> On 2010-10-03, at 17:39, Reed Steamroller wrote:
> > Run Unity in a VM.  Works for me.
> 
> Run a 3d graphical application in a VM?

Xen have a nice and working abstraction layer (tryed on nvidia) and
allow guest OS to use full 3D hardware from guest to host 

this don't mean performance are like use from native os...
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Re: [opensource-dev] User Story: Improved Cache

[Sythos]

On Sun, 19 Sep 2010 13:16:25 -0700
Kelly Linden  wrote:


> * Rezed objects are given a new UUID (though they will still
> reference the 'original asset id' for some internal tracking server
> side)

yes but cache was hinted for etxtures, what happen to same textures
copied or shared to others?

I have a tex, have its UUID, i give a copy to another, both rezz
something and use this textures

textures is the same, but 2 UUID...

in this way a cache is less usefull (topic started from cache idea)
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Re: [opensource-dev] User Story: Improved Cache

[Sythos]

On Sat, 18 Sep 2010 20:53:21 -0500
Argent Stonecutter  wrote:

> On 2010-09-17, at 12:51, Altair Sythos Memo wrote:
> > There aren't tools to assure to an agent him cached texture is still
> > one cached the teleport before...
> 
> Not needed. Textures are static. UUIDs are never re-used.

prims change... you're assuming nobody modify the whole sim...
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Re: [opensource-dev] User Story: Improved Cache

[Sythos]

On Sat, 18 Sep 2010 20:51:22 -0500
Argent Stonecutter  wrote:

> I honestly think that going to a straight squid-style cache for
> textures would so improve the user experience that worrying about
> extra features like "preferred places" would become irrelevant.

in fact... now "HTTP" textures allow a banal local caching proxy (squid
is a lil big, but fine, just a bit oversized for a "personal" use)

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Re: [opensource-dev] Externally controllable viewers?

[Sythos]

On Sat, 18 Sep 2010 19:17:03 -0400
Vex Streeter  wrote:

>   Who's currently working on doing external control of viewer
> functions, especially avatar control?  I know of a few people doing
> AR sorts of things that would qualify and some of the viewer-plugin
> and modularity work would certainly help.  I'm going to be doing some
> viewer hacking to allow some additional input devices and would like
> to be as general as possible (and not reinvent the wheel).

sorry... do you mean sort of bot for group invite and similar when you
say "eexternal control"?
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Re: [opensource-dev] Side topic related to cache (was Re: User Story: Improved Cache

[Sythos]

On Fri, 17 Sep 2010 17:14:01 -0400
Ponzu  wrote:

> I have also thought a bit about the situation where two or more users
> are on the same subnet.  Think of a dozens of people in the same LAN
> in a meeting, for example.
> 
> Current system has each user building an almost identical cache
> locally.
> 
> Instead, what if all the users went through a proxy, and the proxy did
> the caching?  Wouldn't that be a big win?

by the way viewer support proxy you can use a local caching proxy
(oops, squid, sort off) and already extend *ALL* you want (HTTP get
textures cached in a standard HTTP cached server)
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Re: [opensource-dev] User Story: Improved Cache

[Sythos]

On Thu, 16 Sep 2010 18:36:50 -0500
Dale Mahalko  wrote:

> * Decode all JPEG2000's once, to all levels of mipmap scale, and write
> the raw RGB mipmaps to disk as individual files (UUID+mipscale.bmp),
> discarding the source JP2's.

high load, and next time u see same object the viewer should download
again the texture, re-decode it, match checksums, store decoded data if
checksum don't match or skip if match (job of cache is store the know
data), you don't save a bit, waste more bandwith.
It may work with non-decoded data, but if not decoded is *actual* cache
system...

> * Decode all OGGs to WAV once, and write the raw WAV to disk,
> discarding the OGGs.

nice way to store music on stream

> * Oh, and don't ever delete any assets until your dedicated 2 terabyte
> cache drive is 99.99% full.

every cached file can be touched everytime used, and only oldest file
deleted if cache close to be full

> * Let the local operating system deal with the file caching. If you
> have 4+ gig of system memory, let the OS manage it for caching
> frequently accessed world data.

if i have 4+GB i use a ramdisk as cache... XD

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Re: [opensource-dev] User Story: Improved Cache

[Sythos]

On Fri, 17 Sep 2010 10:17:27 -0700
Daniel Smith  wrote:


> A passive means of ranking a cache would be:
> 
> 1) did the user already have an LM here?
> 2) did an object just give a user an LM to this place?
> 3) did the user just proactively create an LM?
> 
> These are 3 distinct cases.  #1 and #3 imply that the user has an
> interest in coming back, and is likely to want an ongoing cache.  #2
> implies that a store / venue etc may have given the user an LM they
> didn't want.

Ram is a lot faster than cache-on-disk, caching on disk may cause more
lag while you force a re-check everytime you see it, and each file
should be CRCsummed and matched with one on asset (sims aren't static,
textures from avatar too).
There aren't tools to assure to an agent him cached texture is still
one cached the teleport before...
I think ins't so easy

> Another case is:  if a user deletes an LM, it implies they may want
> to free up the cache for that location as well.

don't understand, cache should store all textures for a whole sims just
why i've bookmarkd a LM? O_o
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Re: [opensource-dev] where is the source

[Sythos]

On Mon, 13 Sep 2010 16:47:28 +0200
"Garmin Kawaguichi"  wrote:

> Is it the last last source code?
> 
> I say that after reading : 
> https://bitbucket.org/lindenlab/viewer-development/src/tip/indra/lscript/lscript_library/lscript_library.cpp
> where llClearPrimMedia is the last function. Where are :
> llSetLinkPrimitiveParamsFast, llGetLinkPrimitiveParams,
> llLinkParticleSystem, llSetLinkTextureAnim, llGetLinkNumberOfSides

mono script are server side compiled, i think all these are inside
internal LL branch
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Re: [opensource-dev] [POLICY] Banning TPV not on the TPV list

[Sythos]

On Fri, 10 Sep 2010 10:50:01 -0400
"Oz Linden (Scott Lawrence)"  wrote:


> >> >  You said "imho*ALL*  non TPV listed viewers should be
> >> > blacklisted"
> 
> All viewers must comply with the Third Party Viewer Policy.
> 
> Viewers in the directory are ones that have certified that they are 
> compliant - viewers not in the directory may or may not be compliant, 
> but it's up to the user to determine that.
> 
> Using a non-compliant viewer or distributing one are both ToS
> violations.
> 
> None of this is really an opensource-dev topic, however.


i think is related to opensource too, a lot of "developers" don't know
the differences between an opensource viewer and a businness ToS, by
the way some "Linden" are here a lot of people believe server's
services provided by LL are "open" too. A missing information (or
missing people skill to RTFM and read ToS) can cause only damage to
OpenSource project like this.

People *MUST* understand this is an opensource project, sponsored by LL
but LLìs services (like the grid) are another pair of shoes.

A lot of developers here (or outside here) don't understand tossing a
patch here isn't "gift code to LL" but is "gift code to
community" (real meaning of opensource). 

My experiences in opensource projects sponsored by company with a own
businness is quite low, i've only worked on Familiar Linux 11-12years
ago (sponsored by COMPAQ, before COMPAQ sold handhelds division to HP).
Developement model and flow was simple but it work (not so far from
this one used here, just a bit more documented). I wish share it here,
maybe may be usefull to tuneup.

Is like a pyramid, on lower slice everybody with rights enabled 
can throw patches, rules to accept patches in this step are easy:
- no warning neither error
- other code don't be broken by a patch (if add feature A, and A work
but broke feature B isn't good)
- base guidelines matching (no features with negative behaviour, viewer
example may be copybot features)

Step after some skilled/old developers review each patch, and fit them
in a controlled way to check aftermath on global code, this step
generate a daily build for a initial check or compiled cource, where
few tester can diagnose what don't work and why) only after a
opensource QA check the patch if match sponsor/hoster requirements
[alpha stage]

If it compile, if no bad aftermath, if no other code reason, the patch
is checked by sponsor/hoster QA, if ok the patch will be slided on "beta
stage", where a wider spread of tester (less skilled, just to detect if
something don't work, with the requirement to diagnose why not work) to
let release run on a wider kind of operating system and hardware


last step before "Release" is like a "release candidate", where all
people, developers, tester and other test the code on a broad-spectrum
variety of OS, hardware, entwork conditions, field applications (busy
sim, lag).

if to last step all work patch drop in release code, witha  very low
requirement of handwork requirement by sponsor/hoster (in THIS case, LL
businness is provide grid and services, not do babysitting to
opensource viewer ;) )

and, obviously... a bug will be discovered after 2 minth of running
code as "release"

if now the workflow already is this ia sk excuse... but maybe better if
somebody add mroe details on wiki/else why not so clear and i believe a
lot of coder/developers/other_viewer_teams don't know/understand how
use all these tools provided with this project to create a better
viewer... especially top steps aren't clear...


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Re: [opensource-dev] Retaining Newbies (Was: The Plan for Snowglobe)

[Sythos]

On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 11:26:27 -0500
Bunny Halberd  wrote:


> 1.) My computer can't handle it. (This is, by far, the #1 reason
> people leave SL after trying it, I'm convinced. Maybe as high as 90%!)

this point have no viewer side solutions :)

> I think a lot of headway could be made if the open source community
> and LL worked together to do two things:
> 
>  - Give newbies a fighting chance with a viewer that degrades
> gracefully.
>  - Provide an easy pathway for newbies to find groups like ours as
> soon as they're first rezzed in. Give them something to do as soon as
> they rezz in. Show them how wonderful the SL *PEOPLE* are, not some
> cold, sterile orientation program.

i wish add an old "solution": menthors

now all viewer can detect language used by resident before he/she
login, in place of a unique help-island may be more interesting create
one each language and ask to old menthors to hangout here

all this isn't related to code, maybe elsewhere will be a better place
where discuss deeper about this topic
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Re: [opensource-dev] Severe water flicker in recent development build

[Sythos]

On Sun, 12 Sep 2010 16:24:17 +0200
Tillie Ariantho  wrote:

> > I think that might be a bad idea... as already discussed here, 90%
> > of new residents leave right away because their hardware is just
> > not up to it. Forcing athmospheric shaders would raise the bar even
> > higher.
> 
> Are there any statistics out there about what kind of hardware people
> have?

if i'm right latest viewers by LL have some data collector (KDU sure,
seen on changelogs, dunno if other), may be interesting if some other
data collection (anonymous) can be collected (and ask to other viewers
teams to do same, always anonymous), checking to be unique (using uP
serial number as ID for database?)
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Re: [opensource-dev] Severe water flicker in recent development build

[Sythos]

On Sun, 12 Sep 2010 09:03:35 -0500
Bunny Halberd  wrote:

> On Sun, Sep 12, 2010 at 8:22 AM, Oz Linden (Scott Lawrence)
>  wrote:
> 
> > It's very irritating.   I think we need to do something about it
> > (might we be able to force Atmospheric Shaders to 'on'?  That
> > appears to suppress the problem).
> 
> Horrible idea -- turning those off is one of your first lines of
> defense when "SL is so laggy I can't type".

i think there is somethng to fix in "system requirements" on
secondlife.com, actual viewer run on a pc matched on minimal
requirement with 4-6fps with "low" graphic detail and no other tweaks
on advanced menu neither debug settings...
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Re: [opensource-dev] Severe water flicker in recent development build

[Sythos]

On Sun, 12 Sep 2010 09:22:22 -0400
"Oz Linden (Scott Lawrence)"  wrote:

>   I'm seeing what I believe is the same problem described in SNOW-745

SNOW-745 is about timestamp/chat log... are you sure about numbers? (or
maybe is new jira too weird for me)
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Re: [opensource-dev] 1-bit alpha textures

[Sythos]

On Sun, 12 Sep 2010 02:07:25 -0700
leliel  wrote:

> On Sun, Sep 12, 2010 at 1:13 AM, Stickman  wrote:
> > I was referring to what's mentioned in this Jira, actually:
> > http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-6713
> 
> That issue is unresolved.
> 
> > I'm not seeing any promises in the comments, but I could have sworn
> > it was supposed to be in viewer 2 somewhere. Anyone have information
> > about what was planned for it that isn't in the Jira?
> 
> The viewer has had an option for many years now to force all alpha
> channels down to 1 bit. This fixes most all the alpha sorting problems
> but it also breaks content (mostly hair and particles).
> 
> Viewer 1 Advanced -> Render -> Fast Alpha
> Viewer 2-2.1 Develop -> Render -> Fast Alpha
> Snowglobe 2.1 & viewer-development -> Develop -> Render -> Automatic
> Alpha Masking (with separate options for deferred and non deferred)

it work fine, enabling both alpha masking i cannot find others issue
with tree, hair or glasses. Dunno how viewer enable it (enabling both i
loss 3-4% of FPS), i usually use "high" and sometime "ultra" (for take
photos), *imho* this issue may be marked fixed since alpha masking (def
and no-def) avaiable
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Re: [opensource-dev] This cannot be right...

[Sythos]

On Thu, 09 Sep 2010 16:45:51 -0400
Monty Brandenberg  wrote:


>2.  Bump the limit up in a process (ulimit -n 1024) and
>then use 'open' to start the viewer in that process and
>see if that works around the limit.

damm... was mine the jira opened for this i raised limit to 4096
system wide... (default 1024 per user)
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Re: [opensource-dev] This cannot be right...

[Sythos]

On Thu, 9 Sep 2010 16:59:42 -0400
Ponzu  wrote:

> >
> > ehm... in advanced/develop menu do you have enabled debug for GL and
> > pipeline? :)
> >
> 
> I don't think so.  Never heard of them.  What would the exact name or
> xml be?

crtl+apple+D and appear (or +alt too)

open it and select last line "show dev menu"

in dev menu select "rendering" and turn off the "debug..," lines
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Re: [opensource-dev] This cannot be right...

[Sythos]

On Thu, 9 Sep 2010 15:47:22 -0400
Ponzu  wrote:

> Tried the later build, 209229.  Same line in syslog.log
> 
> Sep  9 14:02:52 iMac
> [0x0-0x3df3df].com.secondlife.indra.viewer[12783]: libndofdev:
[cut]


ehm... in advanced/develop menu do you have enabled debug for GL and
pipeline? :)
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Re: [opensource-dev] Compiler optimizations on Viewer and LLKDU

[Sythos]

On Thu, 09 Sep 2010 13:48:23 +0100
Tofu Linden  wrote:

> Sheet Spotter wrote:
> > 1. Are there any plans to enable higher levels of compiler
> > optimizations for the viewer?
> Yup!  There are a wad of changes like this in the dev pipeline, but we
> want to prove the heck out of them (they are still considered
> experimental and somewhat intertwined with some other,
> even-more-experimental changes).

maybe is the right time to check libs versions... GTK are old enough
and already both no cygwin, *nix and macosX newer ones (with more
performances on mixed thread, where mixed thread appliable like dual
core processor +HT than report to OS 4 cores, a real core have a
different cache code managing of a virtual core like on a HT), GCC4 is
s old, more and big improvement made since 4.1, more again on 4.2
(and maybe setup makefile to create target as i686, not anymore i386,
to allow GCC enable advanced features, no less than i686 is required to
run a viewer)
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Re: [opensource-dev] Blocking viewers.

[Sythos]

On Wed, 08 Sep 2010 23:21:26 +0100
Tom Grimshaw  wrote:

> The lab DO NOT have any right to determine what software they will
> allow to connect to their SERVICE.  

are you joking? is THEIR service, on THEIR servers, done with THEIR
software.

> Linden Lab have blocked Emerald due to a POLITICAL DISAGREEMENT with 
> their dev team.  They haven't blocked it because of any fault with
> the software itself,  they're not protecting anyone - they're taking 
> pre-emptive action against a project because of some percieved danger 
> that might evolve.

not only with team, but with code of emerald viewer too, way to copybot
others creations, private data "statistically collected" and some
licenses violations...
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Re: [opensource-dev] Blocking viewers.

[Sythos]

On Wed, 08 Sep 2010 23:03:15 +0100
Tom Grimshaw  wrote:

> My issue is that none of these reasons involve the way the viewer 
> interacts with the LL Servers in any way. They made the decision
> based on the conduct of a few idiots (and there are always idiots in
> open source projects) - and not because of any real issue with the
> viewer itself.
> If the viewer was causing server issues or was enabling content
> theft, I would agree with this decision.

partially right... discovered the "no good" side a team can choose if
fix it or not, if somebody believe to be a god why him viewer is the
most used is HIM fault... not LL one

job of LL is provide a grid and hold businness safe, if works from
residents/creators can be stolen with few clicks is a viewer problem
and i PRETEND Linden do something to safe my businness... (and LL did
it)
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Re: [opensource-dev] Blocking viewers.

[Sythos]

On Wed, 8 Sep 2010 17:59:41 -0400
Marc Adored  wrote:

> Emerald is a perfect example of that. Everyone is upset and mad at
> linden for banning Emerald but no body cared what the developers of
> Emerald were doing before it effected them directly. I wont go into a
> flame war over one of my favorite viewers but I just wanted to make
> that point.

Emerald have good reason to be blacklisted, there is the "next step"
called phoenix, cleaned by "bad code" and "bad elements", all other is
only a lil actors show...
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Re: [opensource-dev] Blocking viewers.

[Sythos]

On Wed, 08 Sep 2010 22:39:00 +0100
Tom Grimshaw  wrote:

> It's absolutely none of your business what software I choose to run
> on my PC.
> Blocking emerald is a step of pure arrogance - and ignorance - on
> Linden Lab's behalf - it's not having an adverse effect on your
> servers, in fact THE ONLY WAY you can tell i'm runing Emerald is by
> the channel and version provided in login, and this has been proven
> by the number of clones that have popped up with their channel
> renamed (and the ID texture changed of course). You cannot censor
> Open Source software, and the fact that you're trying to makes you a
> despicable organisation.

it isn't a censorship, is a protection for residents
anyway there are a dozen of non-linden viewers

> Stop policing my computer. I will decide what viewer I use, thank you.

imho *ALL* non TPV listed viewers should be blacklisted
is safer, for both resident and developers
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[opensource-dev] tpv list

[Sythos]

ehm is there a plan to list SnowStorm too? on list or Linden
Viewers paragraph (where SL2 and SnowGlobe already named)
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Re: [opensource-dev] Somewhat stable developer viewer

[Sythos]

On Mon, 6 Sep 2010 11:16:18 -0400
Ponzu  wrote:

> The problem is there is no hint about the Snap Shot?  Even just a
> build number would be OK.  Oz has suggested 208707 works for him, but
> it is not on the page with all the latest builds.  209029 and 209046
> *don't* work for me.  They partially start, and then freeze.  (Do

i've a 6years old iMac 24", it work "fine" (12fps...), with snow
leopard (ATI video)
it work... but:

if
UseAppleMultiGL=TRUE ==> crash

or if
RenderTriangle (memory leak, maybe other name, is the debug options to
render using triangles)=TRUE ==> crash

try to delete it (so delete settings too) and reinstall again (and
don't touch 2 parameters above)
i'm using:
http://automated-builds-secondlife-com.s3.amazonaws.com/hg/repo/snowstorm_viewer-development/rev/209046/arch/Darwin/installer/SecondLife_2_1_2_209046_DEVELOPMENT.dmg
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Re: [opensource-dev] Plugins/Modular architecture

[Sythos]

On Fri, 03 Sep 2010 12:40:05 -0400
Glen Canaday  wrote:

> 
> Like I said... 50 times, never got further than the first sentence.
> Too much work and not enough single geek. I had even named it "GROND"
> after Sauron's battering ram.

this is why now all code is public and following few step you can
contribute all code you want... a optional switchable theme/UI/XUI can
be merged giving to all residents the freedom to choose the aspect on
monitor (viewer 1.x style too).

Is hard take LL base code, patch it, merge a LL-next-version to fit
newfeatures and patch again everything, i think this way to work is
great why all can fit a features (a single click in setup panel
enable/disable it maybe...) without care to merge everytime a new
features will be implemented by LL
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Re: [opensource-dev] Own attachments visible in mouselook (was: jira? avatar_lad.xml)

[Sythos]

On Thu, 02 Sep 2010 00:36:04 +0200
Boroondas Gupte  wrote:

>  On 09/02/2010 12:14 AM, Altair Sythos Memo wrote:
> > just checked... ALL attachments are visible in mouselook, shoes
> > rings and belt too
> Sounds like VWR-22022 <http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-22022>.

yes sound like... but why i've received 5 copies of your email? O_o
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Re: [opensource-dev] jira? avatar_lad.xml

[Sythos]

On Thu, 2 Sep 2010 00:06:25 +0200
Altair "Sythos" Memo  wrote:

> in last 2.1.2 build in mouselook all items are rezzed, i've hair worn
> on Skull, in avatar_lad.xml i see:
> 
>   id="2"
>  group="2"
>  pie_slice="2"
>  name="Skull"
>  joint="mHead"
>  position="0 0 0.15"
>  rotation="0 0 90"
>  visible_in_first_person="false" />
> 
> but in mouselook i see my hair
> 
> how/where can i check if file correctly readed and parsed or the
> trouble is elsewhere?


just checked... ALL attachments are visible in mouselook, shoes rings
and belt too
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[opensource-dev] jira? avatar_lad.xml

[Sythos]

in last 2.1.2 build in mouselook all items are rezzed, i've hair worn
on Skull, in avatar_lad.xml i see:



but in mouselook i see my hair

how/where can i check if file correctly readed and parsed or the
trouble is elsewhere?
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Re: [opensource-dev] Removal of the "MultipleAttachments" debug settings ?

[Sythos]

On Wed, 01 Sep 2010 13:46:10 -0700
Kadah  wrote:


> I prefer WASD movement, but the current method has a lot of focus
> control issues where enter doesn't always bring focus to the chat bar.
> I'm having to use the mouse all the time to do this.

I htink is better give as option to residents, a lot of ppl got crazy
without a fixed focus on chatbar...
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Re: [opensource-dev] before opena Jira, APR

[Sythos]

On Wed, 01 Sep 2010 11:28:42 +0100
Tofu Linden  wrote:

> Altair Sythos Memo wrote:
> ...
> > 2010-08-31T21:02:02Z WARNING: ll_apr_warn_status: APR: Too many open
> > files 
> > 
> > 2010-08-31T21:02:02Z WARNING: open:  Attempting to open
> > filename: /home/user/.secondlife/cache/texturecache/texture.entries
> ...
> > not so sure anyway is a viewer problem of something specific to my
> > linuxbox... is why i'm asking here if somebody else match this kind
> > of crash with latest build
> 
> This is a genuine problem.  Please file it in jira.  Any eyes on this
> would be welcome.
> It seems to have popped up recently - it may be related to the latest
> HTTP textures changes, not sure (perhaps leaking file handles, though
> lsof says we're still somewhat under the default limits).

http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-22757

added info, but i thyink "lsof" isn't right tools, if on an empty sim
(1 texture: the gorund) of if i'm in a city fullfit of textures lsof
report about same numbers.

is there a debug info to activate to read files opened by HTTP handler?
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[opensource-dev] before opena Jira, APR

[Sythos]

got a lot of crashes on a linux 32 system


[cut]
2010-08-31T21:02:02Z INFO: purgeAllTextures: Deleting files in
directory: /home/user/.secondlife/cache/texturecache/f

2010-08-31T21:02:02Z WARNING: ll_apr_warn_status: APR: Too many open
files 

2010-08-31T21:02:02Z WARNING: open:  Attempting to open
filename: /home/user/.secondlife/cache/texturecache/texture.entries

2010-08-31T21:02:02Z INFO: purgeAllTextures: The entire texture cache
is cleared. 

2010-08-31T21:02:02Z WARNING: ll_apr_warn_status: APR: Too
many open files 

2010-08-31T21:02:02Z WARNING: open:  Attempting to open
filename: /home/user/.secondlife/cache/texturecache/texture.entries

2010-08-31T21:02:02Z WARNING: write: apr mFile is removed by somebody
else. Can not write. 

2010-08-31T21:02:02Z WARNING: clearCorruptedCache:
the texture cache is corrupted, need to be cleared.

2010-08-31T21:02:02Z INFO: purgeAllTextures: Deleting files in
directory: /home/user/.secondlife/cache/texturecache/0
[/cut]

all this repeated some times, then viewer crash badly

double checked limits on my user, none reasonable related to number of
files opened or sort off... build Second Life 2.1.2 (208719) Aug 30
2010 09:18:15 (Second Life Development)

not so sure anyway is a viewer problem of something specific to my
linuxbox... is why i'm asking here if somebody else match this kind of
crash with latest build
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Re: [opensource-dev] Removal of the "MultipleAttachments" debug settings ?

[Sythos]

On Mon, 30 Aug 2010 23:15:17 +0200
"Alexandrea Fride"  wrote:

> The way emerald works and others is no good solution couse as you
> sayd you can only see it with those viewers AND it dosent even work
> for hud objects,
> 
> how viewer 2 works now is it do works accross all viewers AND it
> works for hud objects
> 
> and as for the radar thing, Kristens viewer already added sort of
> that to (and thats on viewer 2)
> and couse allot of people saying viewer 2 sucks couse they miss the
> things in emerald
> YET emerald refuses to work on viewer 2 (WHY) if evreyone dont
> like it start working on it! and make it bether thats what opensource
> should be, and not refuse to work on couse you dont like it.
> 
> annyway sorry for hijacking this treath but get 100 of mails so one
> more dont mather -.-

i think is only "proudness" while somebody say "is the MY viewer", till
few time ago there are few solutions, but now in snowstorm project
things are quite different, now all this can be a real opensource
community, in place to create dozens of *SAME* viewer (same core, same
main features) with few addons all people can throw patches in same
pot (i know i'm a dreamer) so maybe a day we can have a amazing rocking
viewer, with the solid core from LL, a friendly interface with
granular parameters setup like emerald, with floatings and dockable tabs
and sidebar like kirsten, with a clean code like in imprudence and a
cross platform know-how addicted by a lot of developers with specific
skills in each OS
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Re: [opensource-dev] Removal of the "MultipleAttachments" debug settings ?

[Sythos]

On Mon, 30 Aug 2010 13:44:04 -0700
Kadah  wrote:

> > If the point of this is to make people *want* 2.x a lot of 
> > nice tags that say 'to see me properly, use viewer 2.x... I have
> > more attachments than you do' might be a good way to go.
> 
> It worked for Emerald.

Emerald use a "tweaked" code+xml, only an emerald see correctly another
emerald user... now there is a "standard", already used by a lot of
non-linden viewers (is why i'm staring EM blog waiting for the right
release than stop to see fuzzy attachments fly around sims XD)

and "no", attachments are a bit feature of emerald, the most is the
radar, a lot of ppl can save lag using builtin radar in place of a
laggy hud...

for sl2 cannot work, why if somebody say you "use [only_one_viewer]"
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Re: [opensource-dev] This is how Linden Lab treats it's customers...

[Sythos]

On Sun, 29 Aug 2010 20:32:22 +0200
Laurent Bechir  wrote:

> 
> 
> Argent Stonecutter a écrit :
> > On 2010-08-29, at 09:37, Laurent Bechir wrote:
> >
> >> >  I used to have a premium account once upon a while. Not using
> >> > it really (no land associated to the account) and being short of
> >> > money, I didn't renew. The only thing that happened is that I'm
> >> > back as a basic member now. So I don't see where is the problem:)
> >>  
> >
> > Are you sure you didn't at any point select "downgrade to basic" on
> > the web page?
> >
> > If that's the case, and I'd like LL confirmation of that, then
> > there is no problem.
> 
> Now that you tell me that, effectively, I must have asked do
> downgrade to basic at the end of my subscription

there is already the feature on web page "change membership plan"
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Re: [opensource-dev] This is how Linden Lab treats it's customers...

[Sythos]

On Sat, 28 Aug 2010 13:12:17 -0700
Rob Nelson  wrote:

>   And what venues can we use?  The forums are almost as heavily 
> moderated as the mailing list, half of the time the blogs don't even 
> allow you to comment.  I'd like to see a site moderated by a third
> party that won't delete your account or add a moderation flag to your
> account just for talking negatively about Linden Lab.

if elsewhere is too mdoerated to don't allow so not corret things be
written isn't a good reason to fill a opensource list of this kind of
junk if somebody don't pay is natural the account gone if you
don't pay your DSL nobody told you anything?
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Re: [opensource-dev] This is how Linden Lab treats it's customers...

[Sythos]

On Sat, 28 Aug 2010 12:56:56 -0700
Dahlia Trimble  wrote:

> After reading this thread, somehow all my past bad memories from
> being a mainland resident no longer seem quite so bad.

if you don't pay your fee mainland too your account will be
suspended anyway, and deleted ripping away the land if not fixed
balance :)

can we talk again about code and viewer?
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Re: [opensource-dev] This is how Linden Lab treats it's customers...

[Sythos]

On Sat, 28 Aug 2010 18:19:57 +0100
Gareth Nelson  wrote:

> That's a serious bug in LL's business model - your account is safer as
> a basic, since a premium account that quits paying means the account
> is deleted (rather than merely downgraded).

nobody is deleted why skip a payment, happened to me some time ago,
account is just "suspended" and login inworld locked, as soon as you
fill the debt all is restored. I use a revolving credit card, this mean
i can use it after charged with money (ui use always this on all
internet shopping activities, so if somebody steal the number cannot
take my money, every time i charge only the cash needed). 

if somebody skip payments to LL, hold payments from customers and let
suspension expire losing account and sims owned isn't a victim, is
a thief... and i don't think is a fault of LL business model
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Re: [opensource-dev] Removal of the "MultipleAttachments" debug settings ?

[Sythos]

On Fri, 27 Aug 2010 17:39:38 -0400
Nyx Linden  wrote:

> Its a bug. We're going to fix it. This isn't the final behavior.

dunno if related or not, just asking before open a JIRA now in
mouselook i see hair and other face attachments (piercing, cigarette,
hair), is this right?
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Re: [opensource-dev] Removal of the "MultipleAttachments" debug settings ?

[Sythos]

On Thu, 26 Aug 2010 16:24:08 -0400
Nyx Linden  wrote:


> Let me know if this clarifies things.

yeah
i'm on Second Life 2.1.2 (208569) Aug 26 2010 05:22:24 (Second Life
Development) now, it work as you said, just noticed something weird and
tryiong to reproduce:
if i crash when relog all attachments are weared double time, like the
dirty logoff don't detach items.

I dunno how logoff/login work, i *SUPPOSE* debug warn during logoff
"acvatar destructor" take "current outfit" and store somewhere on
asset, during login last saved "current outfit" is worn.

maybe is better if saved "current outfit" replace what worn during
login, so if crashed nothing boudle is worn...

somebody who know better and deeper the code can hint me about?
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Re: [opensource-dev] Removal of the "MultipleAttachments" debug settings ?

[Sythos]

On Thu, 26 Aug 2010 21:06:53 +0100
Aidan Thornton  wrote:


> >> I for one would very much like to see the MultipleAttachments debug
> >> setting come back and stay !
> >
> > i use multiple attachments, quite all users (but not emerald neither
> > imprudence) see them correctly, all kirsten viewers (on kirsten is
> > enabled by default on last 2 builds) rezz them fine, both SL2 users
> > (if they don't turn TRUE the debug options too, they say...)
> 
> So in other words, exactly what Marine Kelley said - they only show up
> properly for users of Viewer 2 or a third-party viewer based on it.
> That's quite a lot of Second Life users who won't be able to see some
> attachments you're wearing in an unpredictable fashion.

with my bad eng i was trying to confirm... XD
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Re: [opensource-dev] Removal of the "MultipleAttachments" debug settings ?

[Sythos]

On Thu, 26 Aug 2010 21:45:14 +0200
Marine Kelley  wrote:


> I for one would very much like to see the MultipleAttachments debug
> setting come back and stay !

i use multiple attachments, quite all users (but not emerald neither
imprudence) see them correctly, all kirsten viewers (on kirsten is
enabled by default on last 2 builds) rezz them fine, both SL2 users (if
they don't turn TRUE the debug options too, they say...)

I think is nice hold it as options in preferences, without hide it in
debug setting or turn it always on/off
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Re: [opensource-dev] J2C fast decoder

[Sythos]

On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 22:06:00 +0100
Robin Cornelius  wrote:


> I'm not aware of anyone publishing results for such a test, but if you
> have the time it would be interesting reading. Some things to keep in
> mind. OpenJpeg has patches floating around on its ML against 1.3 that
> reports have claimed up to 40% speed increase in places due to
> unrolling the inner loops so finding them and testing would be good.

i've few data, only related to x-ray medical images... (400-500MB per
images), and i'm the hw&systems monkey, not the coding one

to today i can supply only decoding time on a *nix platform

jasper based decoder/viewer from uncached (not previously opened, no
memory cache) to video render time:

basing code snippet (a timer + a reading routine from disk + decoder)
processor q6...@1,6GHz
memory DDR3 4GB (4x1GB)
graphics: GTX270 on PCI-x 2.0 4x (single, no SLI)
disk on fast SATA2
gcc 4.4.5
LibC6 2.11.2
debian "stable" with GCC and development files and libs backported from
SID, kernel 2.6.32-5-amd64 compiled for 32bit (this cause the bug SL
viewer and snowglobe one detect a 64bit system why use wrongly uname,
but is a 32bit system with extended register enabled)

JASPER 1.900 (from site, not from debian repos)
compiled w/o optimization: 19,31msec 
compiled w SSE2: 11,60msec 
compiled w SSSE3: 9,11msec 
compiled w SSE2+OpenCL (195.36.31 libs from nvidia (multithread):
4,45msec [1]

OpenJPEG1.3 (from google code)
compiled w/o optimization: 26,12msec
compiled w SSE2: 15,33msec
compiled w SSSE3: 13,41msec
compiled w SSE2+OpenCL (195.36.31 libs from nvidia (multithread):
6,56msec [1]

OpenJPEG2.0_alpha (from google code)
compiled w/o optimization: 22,09msec
compiled w SSE2: crashed (maybe our fault, still debugging)
compiled w SSSE3: crashed (maybe our fault, still debugging)
compiled w SSE2+OpenCL (195.36.31 libs from nvidia (multithread):
crashed (maybe our fault, still debugging)

cannot supply neither code snippet neither image (is a knee of a
customer)

too few numbers, just to give a hint

[1] OpenCL, in our "poor" code, create some trouble in OS cache and
made system unstable after 4h of cyclic run of snippet, beginning a
crazy dance of IRQ27 on whole cores of machine and overloading
disks transfers why too swap)

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[opensource-dev] J2C fast decoder

[Sythos]

i'm testing in RL office (not or a viewer) JasPer decoder for JPG2000
images, after a short test with openjpeg2000 from EPFL we have tested
last 3 days JasPer (only a POC apps to do some bench), we must do a lot
of work too, but this is a lil question... anybody here around never
tried it as alternative to OpenJPEG/KDU in a viewer?

ref: 
http://www.ece.uvic.ca/~mdadams/jasper/
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Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything?

[Sythos]

On Sun, 22 Aug 2010 22:40:26 +0200
Henri Beauchamp  wrote:

> > > > There isn't anything in the policy itself which says you must be
> > > > listed, there is however a note on the directory page warning
> > > > users to be wary of unlisted viewers.
> > > 
> > > Which is a non-sence.
> > 
> > sorry cannot see the no-sense,
> 
> The non-sense is about LL saying "be wary of viewers not listed in
> this directory" (while the TPV policy clealy states that to be
> compliant, a viewer does NOT need to be listed in the directory) and
> then "we can't give you any guarantee for the viewer listed in this
> directory".

again... is a self-certification, you may be listen submitting your
data, but linden cannot guarantee you say the true :)

if else isn't a "self-certification"
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Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything?

[Sythos]

On Sun, 22 Aug 2010 22:30:20 +0200
Henri Beauchamp  wrote:

> On Sun, 22 Aug 2010 21:10:00 +0100, Gareth Nelson wrote:
> 
> > There isn't anything in the policy itself which says you must be
> > listed, there is however a note on the directory page warning users
> > to be wary of unlisted viewers.
> 
> Which is a non-sence.

sorry cannot see the no-sense, terms are both for developers and
resident

a developer CAN listen a viewer in TPV (and succesfully listed if
viewer is TPV compliant)

a resident MUST use a TPV viewer to use Linden services
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Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything?

[Sythos]

On Sun, 22 Aug 2010 15:30:55 -0500
Brandon Husbands  wrote:

> As a X-emerald Dev (I am Dimentox) Most of the stuff people are
> saying that is going on or has gone on.. Most of the other devs had
> no idea. We just did our parts to make the viewer better. I left due
> to the fact that i did not have time to continue to work on the
> project.  Unfortunately a few bad seeds ruin the apple.

emerald *is* a TPV compliant viewer, but isn't listed

this is a grey zone in ToS and TPV policy... not an dev-emerald fault
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Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything?

[Sythos]

On Sun, 22 Aug 2010 21:10:00 +0100
Gareth Nelson  wrote:

> There isn't anything in the policy itself which says you must be
> listed, there is however a note on the directory page warning users to
> be wary of unlisted viewers.

wait... TPV listing is based on volunteer action, somebody can develop
a viewer (maybe TPV compliant) and don't ask to be listed in the
directory 

but in term of service at point 7 all resident accept to use only
approved viewer to connect to Linden Grid (and if they login a time
they must approve it)

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Re: [opensource-dev] Open Viewer Development Announcement

[Sythos]

On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 23:50:49 +
"Dickson, Mike (ISS Software)"  wrote:

> As another poster has already pointed out, there is no *us* in a
> argument like this. Stop trying to attribute your personal feelings
> as the will of everyone else.  I'm sure there are people that don't
> like the current viewer. Personally *I DO*.  There is room for
> improvement (I host at clubs for instance and sending notices in
> viewer2 is many more mouse clicks) but overall I like the new
> interface and features.  So if you *don't* then please find a
> constructive way to suggest improvements or work on a 3rd party
> viewer with the old interface.  But don't attribute your opinions to
> some global "us" as that doesn't exist.
> 
> Mike

+1

not only, sl2 interface (and derived like snowglobe2 or kirsten) are a
lot more usefull and speedy for outfit composing and cleariness on
display (maybe just fit chat in a tab like IMs)

i admit after some years with 1.x interface is a bit hard understand
how 2.x interface work, and maybe something should be still fixed, but
if you talk with a new user now is mroe happy than "new users" of 1.x
style interface.

it is only lazyness about learning something new... :)
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[opensource-dev] GStream disabled on linux 32bit with a 64bit kernel

[Sythos]

I've a 32-bit linux distro (debian sid), with kernel compiled with
32bytecode but amd64 instruction set, uname report "x86_64" so GStream
is disable by lunching script (wrongly)

i've patched the script http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-20340
hoping may be usefull to other else

Regards
Altair
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Re: [opensource-dev] SL on ARM platform

[Sythos]

On Wed, 14 Jul 2010 12:35:01 + (GMT)
DEEPAK JAIN  wrote:

compile on ARM is possible, depending on which operating system you
want to do. ARM since V4 is basically a 32bit little endian processor
(latest version big endian 64bit too), a GCC since V2.95 can compile
ELF binaries.

Using ARM linux you can follow a generic "standalone build" how-to
(preconf libraries aren't compiled for ARM), but the problem is only
shifted on performance side. I've worked on Familiar Project to
 5years ago (ex-compaq linux project on ARM devices) and about all
application written in a good ANSI C/C++ can be compiled without too
much pain, the step after is who do all the rendering job. A lot of
nowadays portable devices (handhelds, smartphone, pdaphone, tablet pc)
have a "sort of" GPU or graphic co-processor, but very few of them have
full OpenGL support (I think OpenGL2.1 is the minimum for latest
viewers), some have only software OpenGL API (ridicolous performance).

some detail more can be usefulkl to answer to your wuestion ;)
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