Re: [pinhole-discussion] F-stop question
F-stop questionCalculate the area of your aperture (pi x radius squared). Calculate the area of an f22 aperture at 50mm (50mm divided by 22 =diameter. Area =(1/2diameter)(1/2diameter) x pi. Divide the area of your aperture into the area of f22. The result equals 40. Multiply f22 metered exposure by 40 to get metered exposure, and then apply appropriate reciprocity failure multiplier. It's easier than it sounds. The basic notion is that the amount of light delivered is equal to the area of the aperture times the time. You calculate how may times the area of your aperture goes into the area of f22. This is your multiplier. I was puzzled by how hard this seems to be to explain until I once asked for a show of hands how many people could calulate the area of a circle. Three out of fifteen raised their hands. - Original Message - From: Jason Edleman To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 11:34 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] F-stop question All, I have a 50mm 4x5 pinhole camera with an f-stop of f/138 (perfect for focal length of 25mm). The appropriate f/stop for 50mm is f/176. Does anyone have a calculation for figuring out the exposure compensation? Thanks in advance - Jason :...: Jason :...:
Re: [pinhole-discussion] D'Arcy Power article on-line
Thanks. I remembered that once you mentioned it. Worked fine. - Original Message - From: John Yeo jonn...@thegrid.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 7:45 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] D'Arcy Power article on-line Try going to http://idea.uwosh.edu/nick/pinholephoto.htm and finding the link there. Then right click on it, and click on save target as. That will save it to your hard drive, and you should be able to open it with acrobat reader from there. John - Original Message - From: Bill Erickson erick...@hickorytech.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 11:59 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] D'Arcy Power article on-line I can't get the document to open. - Original Message - From: Nick Dvoracek dvora...@vaxa.cis.uwosh.edu To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 4:45 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] D'Arcy Power article on-line A while ago there was a thread about an article by H. D'Arcy Power: Advanced Pinhole Photography from The Photo Miniature from July 1905. I got a photocopy through interlibrary loan and created an Adobe Acrobat document which I've posted on my website http://idea.uwosh.edu/nick/pinholephoto.htm I looked into the copyright issue and anything published before 1923 is in the public domain (http://www.unc.edu/~unclng/public-d.htm) so I'm pretty sure I'm not infringing anyone's copyright. I'm afraid it's kind of big, 3.6 MB, but that's not bad for a 46 page article scanned at high resolution (text and line art at 300 dpi, images, grey scale at 150 dpi). I've turned my interlibrary loan wizard loose on the citations he gives to other works and maybe will get those posted also. -- Nick Dvoracek dvora...@uwosh.edu Director of Media Services Voice: 920-424-7363 University of Wisconsin OshkoshFax: 920-424-7324 http://idea.uwosh.edu/media_services/home.html http://idea.uwosh.edu/nick/handouts.htm ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] D'Arcy Power article on-line
I can't get the document to open. - Original Message - From: Nick Dvoracek dvora...@vaxa.cis.uwosh.edu To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 4:45 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] D'Arcy Power article on-line A while ago there was a thread about an article by H. D'Arcy Power: Advanced Pinhole Photography from The Photo Miniature from July 1905. I got a photocopy through interlibrary loan and created an Adobe Acrobat document which I've posted on my website http://idea.uwosh.edu/nick/pinholephoto.htm I looked into the copyright issue and anything published before 1923 is in the public domain (http://www.unc.edu/~unclng/public-d.htm) so I'm pretty sure I'm not infringing anyone's copyright. I'm afraid it's kind of big, 3.6 MB, but that's not bad for a 46 page article scanned at high resolution (text and line art at 300 dpi, images, grey scale at 150 dpi). I've turned my interlibrary loan wizard loose on the citations he gives to other works and maybe will get those posted also. -- Nick Dvoracek dvora...@uwosh.edu Director of Media Services Voice: 920-424-7363 University of Wisconsin OshkoshFax: 920-424-7324 http://idea.uwosh.edu/media_services/home.html http://idea.uwosh.edu/nick/handouts.htm ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] New photo show
You're biting off a very big chunk. Taking on a new method, thirty day time limit and very large prints. I've tried most of them, and I think that the easiest and most foolproof is cyanotype. you will need large format contact negs for any of these anyway. Cyanotype exposure can be maddening in northen climes in winter. - Original Message - From: Catherine Just blue_medic...@yahoo.com To: Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 3:43 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] New photo show Hi Everyone, I've bene getting the BEST mail lately - Thank you to everyone who is sending images! I hope you enjoy mine as well. I just spoke with a gallery owner and showed her my new series of pinholes I shot while in England. My boyfriend shot images with a digital camera and we are trying to have a show that has both our work. It's actually very interesting to see digital versus pinhole. The oldest technique and the newest, of the same place. He is going to print them in the most recent developing practice - like Iris printing, and I want to do an old process like platinum palladium, or something along those lines and I'm thinking I want to print BIG. I want 30x40. But may go 20x24. I think he is printing small. Curious if you know of any workshops in alternative printing practices that you recommend. I've seen some - there is one in Yosemite on Platinum.palladium that looks amazing. I LOVE the collodion look but that's done on the glass plate before exposure. ( Can you do collodion with a pinhole?? ) Any workshop experiences or advice will be great. I would like to start printing in a month. I just need to decide which process would look the best for this type of imagery. Since I was holding the camers for 45 second exposures - the images are pretty soft. and have motion to them. Sincerely, Catherine = Catherine Just Photography Weddings~Portraits~Fine Art http://www.catherinejust.com 619.294.3195 Don't just state your intent, Live it. ~Jerry Seiner Jr. __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] off topic: photoshop tutorial book?
I've never found a book that I thought told me very much. A friend likes Photoshop Restoration and Retouching. It's really pretty intuitive, once you grasp the parallels with the wet darkroom. - Original Message - From: Peter Wiklund peter.wikl...@journalistgruppen.se To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, January 20, 2003 2:55 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] off topic: photoshop tutorial book? Sorry off topic, but since there are so many with great knowledge on the list I want to start doing darkroom work in the computer, and want a tutorial book with information on photographic ways of usiung Photoshop. What I mean is that I'm _not_ interested in Photoshop-filter-effects, nor collageing. I like the look that you get from normal darkroom work, but want to do my dodging, burning, cropping, contrast adjustments etc in the computer. I will mostly work in black-and-white to start with. There are plenty of Photoshop-books on the market, but most of them seem to be crappy. Is there any good book? Or perhaps a good magazine? Some of my (color) work can be seen here: http://hem.passagen.se/pinhole /peter ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole cibachrome
I found that with incandescent light and no filtration I was quite happy with the color balance, with a speed of about 2.5 I used an 85A outdoors at speed of 1.75 but I didn't like the color balance. I developed in JOBO, which worked fine. A friend did a lot of these at or near sunset, i.e., natural color shift filtration. I didn't see the results. Mark Dungan, if you are still on board, could you comment? - Original Message - From: TIM MIDKIFF ku...@vci.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, January 18, 2003 8:16 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole cibachrome hello everyone, I'm looking for information to research ULF pinhole cibachromes. Is anyone aware of any printed material or web-source about this other than all the W.A.Wright images posted on the web. I'm really interested in the color correction needed and processing requirements. I'm currently using a 16x20 maple wood camera that I built. many thanks, tim TIMOTHY S. MIDKIFF ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole vision
Well put. I'll briefly share a similar experience.I had wondered what sort of images I might get with spontaneous pinholes, naturally occuring small apertures. I took a cardboard box 20 long, taped 8x10 paper inside one end, cut an opening in the other and attached a Ritz soda cracker over the hole with peanut butter, light proofed it by putting the whole apparatus in a black plastic garbage bag with only the tiny hole in the cracker showing, and made my exposure. Wonderfully sharp and clear view of the houses across the street. I then proceeded to do a series of images of various vegetables and fruits with the same setup, photographing food with food. The last image was of leeks, which I then cooked in a soup and ate. My dog licked the cracker off the end of the camera. True story. I posted a few of the images here a year or so ago. - Original Message - From: Michael Healy mjhe...@kcnet.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 10:41 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole vision I've been meaning to post some thoughts in reply to Andy's email of a couple weeks ago, but in the new year I've been dragging my rear end. Sorry. Andy, you posted your 12/30 suggestion in reply to my bemused wonderings about how one goes about getting 25mm of bellows out of 4x5. Your suggestion intrigued me. So last week I made a pinhole camera out of an empty 25-sheet box of 4x5. I felt pretty excited at the prospects. It turned out to be an adventure, though not along lines I'd **planned** it to be. I went out into the desert here, armed w/ my camera, plus a clamp so I could attach it to my tripod, and a #29 filter, and a changing bag, and some additional film. But that was all. No bag of goodies. No Polaroid back. Nothing. Strangely, I immediately felt naked, having no authentic EQUIPMENT in hand, not even an actual camera. I felt child-like, too, having a FAKE camera in hand. No, not a fake camera but a toy, something as much like a true camera as a child's invisible teddy bear is like a real friend. Very strange. It also made me appreciate that bona fide equipment pushes the spectators aside, quiets them, impresses them or at least chases them away. Suddenly all I was doing was playing Mr. McGoo: only I knew that what I was doing was genuine. Or rather, only I hoped it was. Everyone else would have thought I was a lunatic. The changing bag was practically a disaster. Squatting on the desert floor, in the dust, fumbling for pieces of tape inside the bag, so I could make the film hold to the camera back, failing to get the lens cap taped on precisely -- all of it made me feel like a kid again. A stupid one. And I didn't go there to feel like a kid, I went there to take great photos. I went there to express my vision. G. After fixing them, I eagerly pulled the sheets out of the developing tank -- and discovered that I could see straight through all four of them! They were perfectly clear. I nearly threw them all away. Turned out that at 18mm, the image circle is only about 50mm, which is not very much on a 4x5 sheet of film. But they did turn out, all of them. And they are so very magical, too. Two landscapes, an interior, and even a tabletop! Maybe good, maybe bad, I don't know. Who cares. They were only an experiment. But I will say this: the eye that recorded those images was not my eye. I have no idea whose eye that was, or who could ever see like that. If today we lived in the Middle Ages, perhaps I would believe that an angel (devil?) guided my unknowing hand. Then something happened that was like an episode from a Jorges Luis Borges story. For it was two days later that I received M. Jean Dabaus' delightful and profoundly timely email about the eye, in which he quoted Evgen Bacvar's question. I am not a blind photographer, and I am not going to try to sound as though I comprehend the concept. Of course I do not, I cannot. Yet -- yet, I myself did stand out there naked to the world with this silly little cardboard box of a camera. I had an idea, yes, but I had no idea what that clumsy camera would see, what it even was capable of seeing. Truly shots in the dark, to borrow a phrase. So when I read Jean's words, I thought to myself, how did he know?! Why, I recognize this problem. In a way (respectfully), in a way I realized that when I was out there that day, I was indeed a blind photographer. I had no idea what I was seeing. I had no idea what image I would achieve, or even whether I would achieve any image at all. All I was armed with was a vision (a cloudy one...), and a hope -- or not even really a hope, but a wish -- that we (my silly camera and I) would reach a kind of agreement. If not, then perhaps at least we would produce a picture I could live with. But what would happen? I had no idea, absolutely none. For me, after all these years of seeing the image follow so closely on the heels of conceived idea, this
Re: [pinhole-discussion] duplicate messages
Thanks. This reply will be a test. - Original Message - From: James Kellar ja...@kellar.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2003 1:34 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] duplicate messages The address has been deleted from the database. This should stop any duplicate messages. James On Saturday, January 11, 2003, at 05:17 AM, erick...@hickorytech.net wrote: Every message I get or send appears in duplicate. I suspect this is due to my having changed e-mail addresses. Please eliminate the erick...@ic.mankato.mn.us one. Thank you. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ James Kellar Co-manager of the Pinhole Discussion List http://www.???/discussion/ pinh...@jameskellar.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] duplicate messages
Can't do it. Both come back with the current e-mail address. - Original Message - From: George L Smyth glsm...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2003 8:14 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] duplicate messages I would think that you should unsubscribe the one you do not wish to use. Cheers - george --- erick...@hickorytech.net wrote: Every message I get or send appears in duplicate. I suspect this is due to my having changed e-mail addresses. Please eliminate the erick...@ic.mankato.mn.us one. Thank you. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ = Handmade Photographic Images - http://GLSmyth.com DRiP Investing - http://DRiPInvesting.org __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Human eye
Another thing occurs to me. The camera analogy is also limited by the fact that camera shutters open and close, while light streams into the human eye continuously. The operative 'shutter speed would have to be the duration of exposure to the rod or cone required to trigger nerve conduction. I don't know whether there is a trasmission period followed by a refractory period, which would equate to shutter speed, or not. - Original Message - From: erick...@hickorytech.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2003 11:30 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Human eye Here is some information I have. How it applies I'm not sure. The eye is only the aperture, lens and sensing apparatus. Because the eye is attached to the brain it would make more sense to use a digital camera as a model rather than film camera. The mind can read an image and give a response in as little as 0.04 seconds- a professional pingpong players response time, for instance. Nerve transmission time mind to brain can be measured by measuring cortical evoked potential responses to visual stimuli. I might have once know the limiting values but I don't recall them. A big name in research in this area is Meichenbaum, if you want to look it up. As for aperture, the lens to retina distance is roughly 25 mm. Maximum pupil size, i.e. aperture diameter, is maybe 8 mm in an adult, so the maximum F stop would be 25/8= 3.1. Minimum aperture would be about 25/2 for 'pinpoint pupils, an F stop of 12.5. I think that the eye processes light sensation somewhat differently at low light levels, so film speed would be a guess. Remember too that the eye and brain cannot distinguish as separate images any sequence more rapid than about 14/second. That is the basis for movies and television, sequences of still images projected faster than the eye can distinguish, thus blending them into apparent continuous motion. I- Original Message - From: George L Smyth glsm...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2003 10:53 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Human eye On 22 Jul 2002, at 11:16, eco...@aol.com wrote: I know this is not strictly pinhole, but I wondered if anyone had access to the average human eye values for the camera variables. ie Respective - film speed, shutter speed, aperture, focus range, depth of field etc. Thanks Ellis When I looked into shutter speed many years ago, I came upon the conclusion that the eye's shutter speed is approximately 1/100 second. You can verify this by taking successive pictures of a waterfall. We all know that slowing down the shutter speed to a second or more will make for silky water, which is not what we see. From there, take pictures with faster and faster speeds (don't forget to take notes). When you get the results, compare the pictures with what you see and make the decision for yourself. Cheers - george = Handmade Photographic Images - http://GLSmyth.com DRiP Investing - http://DRiPInvesting.org __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Human eye
Here is some information I have. How it applies I'm not sure. The eye is only the aperture, lens and sensing apparatus. Because the eye is attached to the brain it would make more sense to use a digital camera as a model rather than film camera. The mind can read an image and give a response in as little as 0.04 seconds- a professional pingpong players response time, for instance. Nerve transmission time mind to brain can be measured by measuring cortical evoked potential responses to visual stimuli. I might have once know the limiting values but I don't recall them. A big name in research in this area is Meichenbaum, if you want to look it up. As for aperture, the lens to retina distance is roughly 25 mm. Maximum pupil size, i.e. aperture diameter, is maybe 8 mm in an adult, so the maximum F stop would be 25/8= 3.1. Minimum aperture would be about 25/2 for 'pinpoint pupils, an F stop of 12.5. I think that the eye processes light sensation somewhat differently at low light levels, so film speed would be a guess. Remember too that the eye and brain cannot distinguish as separate images any sequence more rapid than about 14/second. That is the basis for movies and television, sequences of still images projected faster than the eye can distinguish, thus blending them into apparent continuous motion. I- Original Message - From: George L Smyth glsm...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2003 10:53 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Human eye On 22 Jul 2002, at 11:16, eco...@aol.com wrote: I know this is not strictly pinhole, but I wondered if anyone had access to the average human eye values for the camera variables. ie Respective - film speed, shutter speed, aperture, focus range, depth of field etc. Thanks Ellis When I looked into shutter speed many years ago, I came upon the conclusion that the eye's shutter speed is approximately 1/100 second. You can verify this by taking successive pictures of a waterfall. We all know that slowing down the shutter speed to a second or more will make for silky water, which is not what we see. From there, take pictures with faster and faster speeds (don't forget to take notes). When you get the results, compare the pictures with what you see and make the decision for yourself. Cheers - george = Handmade Photographic Images - http://GLSmyth.com DRiP Investing - http://DRiPInvesting.org __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Still Life Compositions
I'll defend a 1 Fl on 4x5. The first camera I ever built had 0.75 Fl and I've had great fun with it. It has a wonderfully wide acceptance angle and makes a nice round image on 4x5 film. Placed 0.75 inches away from the object it gives a life size image. - Original Message - From: Michael Healy mjhe...@kcnet.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, December 28, 2002 10:23 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Still Life Compositions I need to ask you a dumb question. You are able to get 25 mm of focal length on 4x5? What equipment are you employing, that you can do this? That's a separation of 1 lousy inch from pinhole to film plane, isn't it? I'd love to try that myself. My monorail and bag bellows **AND** recessed lens board allow me a fat, gross, long-length 50 mm. What is your trick? Okay, another dumb question. With that kind of coverage on tabletop, it kind of seems like you're going to get the doorway behind you in the image, plus six miles down the length of the hallway, to say nothing of your own entire carcass. So I'm kind of wondering, why are you working with 25 mm? That it distorts, would be one good reason. But you'll get distortion with 40-60 mm, won't you? Do you have to stick to 25 mm? If I didn't like it that I was getting so much into the frame, that probably would be my first point of reassessment. Give yourself some bellows. I mean, unless you can position your camera so it's a quarter of an inch from your subject matter. I tried that recently w/ table top myself. The camera actually cast a shadow onto my subject. Impossible. Mike Healy - Original Message - From: Mark Andrews mandr...@dragonbones.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, December 28, 2002 6:47 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Still Life Compositions I am novice pinhole photographer looking for some advice regarding shooting still life compositions with my 4X5 Pinhole Camera (25mm focal length). My issue is that I am trying to limit the elements in my composition, but tend to pick up a significant amount of the surrounding area no mater how close I am to the still life composition. Is it possible to limit the surrounding area? I've seen other pinhole still lifes with a limited composition--perhaps this was accomplished in the darkroom? Many thanks in advance for any advice you can offer. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Still Life Compositions
You can either get closer to your composition, or choose a neutral background, or selectively light your composition and leave the background darker. Or you can burn in the background during printing. - Original Message - From: Mark Andrews mandr...@dragonbones.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, December 28, 2002 7:47 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Still Life Compositions I am novice pinhole photographer looking for some advice regarding shooting still life compositions with my 4X5 Pinhole Camera (25mm focal length). My issue is that I am trying to limit the elements in my composition, but tend to pick up a significant amount of the surrounding area no mater how close I am to the still life composition. Is it possible to limit the surrounding area? I've seen other pinhole still lifes with a limited composition--perhaps this was accomplished in the darkroom? Many thanks in advance for any advice you can offer. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
[pinhole-discussion] digital pinhole.
Here is another interpretation of digital pinhole. I made this image using a tiny hole in a cracker served at the artist's reception for a digital photography show I'm in. Had to keep my priorities straight. www.???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?pic=digital_copy.jp g Cracker attached over hole in cardboard lensboard of view camera, 12 inch extension. Polaroid 53, no manipulation of image.
Re: [pinhole-discussion] What is Diffraction?
Thanks for the information. Eric Renner calls people like us techno-nerds. But I know for a fact that he knows all this stuff too but won't admit it. - Original Message - From: Guillermo pen...@rogers.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 9:43 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] What is Diffraction? - Original Message - From: erick...@hickorytech.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 9:27 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] What is Diffraction? Here's a question that has troubled me for a long time, since we've gained the attention of the physicists among us. If the optimal image occurs when all light waves are 'in phase, which the Young article says occurs at the junction between the nearfield and farfield diffraction patterns (whatever that is), is there another point further on where the various waves again come into simultaneous phase sync, and thus optimal sharpness? Theoretically there should be, but how far? Physicists analyze diffraction using either near or far field methods. Far-field means the source of light is far relative to the aperture size, the wave front arriving at the aperture is assumed to be flat. Near-field is the apposite, wave front is assumed to arrive curve shaped. This, I believe, also affects or determines how far from the aperture the near-field diffraction reaches and how far from the aperture the far field diffraction starts. There is a gray area in between, this area can be assumed to separate near and far field diffractions voiding any juncture of them, and as Young's article says: here, the image is not amenable to description by simple arguments. When you talk about in phase you may be thinking about how a zoneplate works, where the aim is carefully position the edges of the clear rings so the diffractions caused by all of those edges positively interfere at the focal point and therefore add up their intensity. Pinhole does not work like that. For my view of how zoneplates work, pls read: http://members.rogers.com/penate/zoneplate.html It talks a bit about the near and far field diffraction, also. Don't quote me on all this pls, this is just a layman's view of the topic. Guillermo ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] wondering
It occurs to me that lack of sharpness in pinhole images is not inherent to the nature of diffraction photography. It is caused by lack of precision in matching the diameter of the pinhole to the distance to the film, or in less than perfect pinholes. Thus it could be said to be a lovable blemish attributable to the operator rather than an essential characteristic of the process to be defended against heresy. Or something like that. - Original Message - From: Mike Vande Bunt mike.vandeb...@mixcom.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 1:04 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] wondering I understand the sentiment expressed here, but the short answer is because you can't. There is no practical way to manipulate a lens photo to make it look like one shot with a pinhole. You can make it fizzy, but that's not the same thing. (If you stop a lens down to f/125 you can get a pinhol- like shot, but you can get the same shot by stopping the lens down to f/125 and removing all the glass elements from it...) I would say that 95% of the time, sharpening added added to a scanned pinhole shot is to correct for problems caused by the scanning process. The sharpening is not (usually) being added to make the pinhile shot look better, but to make it look more like the original. Mike Vande Bunt Jean Hanson wrote: About the message two days ago; a member took a pinhole image, sharpened it in Adobe or a digital method, and printed it out. I wonder why we don't just take traditional lens photographs and smear them a little and print them out to look like pinhole work. What is it that we are doing? I love pinhole photography and am retired from traditional photo studio work. So my sister asked me recently, why are you and your friends intent on taking bad pictures? I have always felt we had a kind of philosophy...we were trying to see the world, or time, or light another way. And I am not down on digitalbut it is hard to explain to non- participants that we really are doing something, and something important. If we sharpen the images to look like better conventional photos, is something being lost? The mystery? The understanding of an almost occult medium? An atempt to see what light is really doing as it hits and wraps around an object? What can I tell my sister? Jean ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] digital pinhole?
I used a pinhole bodycap on my nikon D1X. You can calibrate the exposures by just looking at the LCD and trying again. All in all I didn't like the process or the results. It seemed like too much horsing around with machinery, and the acceptance angle is pretty narrow. - Original Message - From: Fox, Robert r...@aarp.org To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2002 8:36 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] digital pinhole? Good discussion on this topic. Has anyone tried to convert a digital camera to pinhole? I'm guessing that the results would be poor since digital ccds do not handle long exposures well at all, resulting in a lot of digital noise and artifacts. But who knows, it might look interesting.. I would enjoy tearing open a few of those consumer digital cameras though and installing a pinhole! Surely someone out there has already done this?? R.J. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] wondering
I had some of the same thoughts. But one can't be a Luddite about it. The Luddites invented sabotage, throwing their wooden shoes (sabots) into the newly invented machinery which they believed would destroy work as they knew it. The digital darkroom gives much to the process of creativity. It gives the possibility of printing to those without real darkrooms. The essence of pinhole will have the strength to stand on its own, and need not be defended against the advance of science. - Original Message - From: Jean Hanson jhan...@pon.net To: pinhole-discussion-request@p at ??? pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 6:53 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] wondering About the message two days ago; a member took a pinhole image, sharpened it in Adobe or a digital method, and printed it out. I wonder why we don't just take traditional lens photographs and smear them a little and print them out to look like pinhole work. What is it that we are doing? I love pinhole photography and am retired from traditional photo studio work. So my sister asked me recently, why are you and your friends intent on taking bad pictures? I have always felt we had a kind of philosophy...we were trying to see the world, or time, or light another way. And I am not down on digitalbut it is hard to explain to non- participants that we really are doing something, and something important. If we sharpen the images to look like better conventional photos, is something being lost? The mystery? The understanding of an almost occult medium? An atempt to see what light is really doing as it hits and wraps around an object? What can I tell my sister? Jean ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] ballpark pinhole exposures for a gift pinhole camera?
Just an intuitive guess, but the times sound a little on the short side. For night exposures, I expose from a half hour after sunset until a half hour before sunrise. Gives decent shadow detail without washing evrything out. - Original Message - From: Philip willarney pwillar...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 4:30 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] ballpark pinhole exposures for a gift pinhole camera? I'm converting several cheapie 35mm cameras to pinhole cameras as gifts for my nieces and nephews (remove shutter lens, poke sand pinhole in bit of aluminum pop can). I want to put an exposure guide (a variant on the old sunny-16 rule) on a sticker on the back to get them started, and wondered of this sounded about right to folks (I'm basing this on my own dabbling, but my records aren't great (my exposure notebook got washed!)(the focal length is about 40 mm, and I haven't figured out an exact f-stop for the pinholes yet). pwillar...@yahoo.com Use ASA 100 film Bright sun: 2-4 seconds Partly shaded on sunny day: 4-10 seconds Full shade: 10-20 seconds Cloudy day: 10-20 seconds Night: try 15 minutes, 1 hour, 2 hours, 4 hours, (guess, and try a couple of different exposures) Inside, lit by bright window: 1-4 minutes Inside, lit by light bulbs: 2-10 minutes Inside, dim: try 15 minutes, 1 hour, 2 hours, 4 hours __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] cyano on canvas
yes, the primer is your problem. There's nothing for the chemical to soak into. Anybody know of something he can put on it? - Original Message - From: dennis vinciguerra vinciguer...@compuserve.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 8:05 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] cyano on canvas Recently picked up a few cheap acrylic primed canvas panels for experimentation with cyanotypes. I brushed the chemicals on in the normal manner, allowed sufficient time to dry and then proper exposure . Immediately after placing the panels in cool water, the entire image washed off. Is the acrylic primer my problem ? Any suggestions ? Thanks in advance, Dennis ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
[pinhole-discussion] digital contact negatives.
There's been quite a bit of talk about digitally produced contact negatives lately. so I thought I would share a strategy that seems to work well. Start with a grey scale positive. There are two ways to increase contrast and promote adequate density in the negative. One is to raise the middle portion of the grey scales curve (image/adjustments/curves). This is a very powerful method with which it is easy to over shoot. Tweak the curve maybe a little less than you want as an endpoint. then fine tune with image/adjustments/brightness-contrast. Then invert the image to a negative (image/adjustments/invert) and repeat the same steps. Then print on Pictorico brand overhead transparency material. Of course, you also need to develop an eye for those images which will translate well to alternative processes. In my hands, at least, not all do.
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Dan Burkholders Book
Burkholters book recommends, and I heartily agree, using Pictorico brand overhead transparency sheets. They are a good deal more expensive than ordinary ones, but they seem to be the only ones that hold the ink well enough to build density. Search for Pictrico on the web and you'll find it. They ship very promptly. I'm having a harder time with it getting adequate density for cyanotype han for platinum. - Original Message - From: Mike Vande Bunt mike.vandeb...@mixcom.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 9:47 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Dan Burkholders Book Perhaps this is oversimplifying it, but what about inkjet transparency paper? I have never had occasion to use it (I have used the laser printer equivalent for non-photo printing), but I am pretty sure that I have seen that ink jet transparency sheets are available. That should eliminate the neet to wax or oil the paper. Mike Vande Bunt Andy Schmitt wrote: 1. Dan's book is great, everybody I've talked to has used it well.. 2. a .psd is a Photoshop native type file. You'll need a program capable of reading it... Not sure who else does but there may be something a2 their site: www.adobe.com have a great day andy -Original Message- From: pinhole-discussion-admin@p at ??? [mailto:pinhole-discussion-admin@p at ???]On Behalf Of bendur...@aol.com Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 8:16 AM To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Dan Burkholders Book Hello Has anyone tried making inkjet negatives using directions from Dan Burkholders book? And if so were they succesfull? Also Does anyone know how to convert images scanned and/or manipulated in photoshop on a mac, so they can be view and manipulated in photoshop on a pc, does typing psd on the end of the file work? Cheers ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] new polaroid question
I bet it will be Ok. I've used really 'shallow digital negs for platinum, with good results, requiring very short exposure times. - Original Message - From: D. Hill zopp...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, November 18, 2002 10:08 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] new polaroid question Hi all, Due to the cost difference of type 55, I am considering the use of polaroid type 665 for a project. Has anyone tried the polaroid neg's with printing platinum? This will be my first attempt with the medium and any information will be appreciated. My worry is that the neg will not have a strong enough density to print acceptable images. Thanks, Don __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site http://webhosting.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Experiments with pinhole diameter
There's a set of llustrations somewhere around page 120 in Eric renner's book that illustrates the effevct of different pinhole size at the same distance from the image. Very few people so far as I know have deliberately ventured toward the too small size. - Original Message - From: John Brownlow li...@johnbrownlow.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, November 17, 2002 8:20 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Experiments with pinhole diameter The standard formula for optimum pinhole diameter is quoted everywhere, but has anyone actually done some experiments to see if photographic results confirm it? I saw a quote by Larry Bullis somewhere to the effect that he had not observed any diminishing returns in going smaller. Here it is: http://www.???/resources/articles/makingholes.php Looking at the derivation of the standard formula it seems to make some assumptions that might not reflect the way we actually perceive photographic sharpness. In particular the notion that the outer diffraction rings are strong enough to be perceived as lack of sharpness at all pinhole diameters beyond the 'optimum' bears scrutiny. Just wondering. -- John Brownlow http://www.pinkheadedbug.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] ciba/ilfochrome speed ratings
I settled on 2.5 indoors an 1.5 outdoors, which turned out to be fairly satisfactory. The outdoors with 85a filter did,t result in colors I liked. Mark Dungan has done a lot of this and likes shooting outdoors just before sunset, which probably improves the color balance. - Original Message - From: drew d...@15munroe.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 9:19 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] ciba/ilfochrome speed ratings I plan on making a simple 8x10 single sheet ciba camera this week. I've searched high and low (including the archives) and have found almost nothing that states the EI of ilfochrome... It seems a popular enough pinhole medium to shoot on so im puzzled by the lack of info. I have seen some references to EI 1 through about EI 100. I don't fear the experimentation but even with home processing @ about 5 minutes a pop it is time consuming and I of course want to spend as much time in the light as possible. Anyone with ballparks based in actual pinhole exposures? Thanks in advance -drew ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Question on image circle and medium format pinhole camera design
You should get full coverage of a 6x6 negative with the focal length you mentioned. I'd agree that the problem is most likely physical obstruction.- Original Message - From: Fox, Robert r...@aarp.org To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 2:04 PM Subject: RE: [pinhole-discussion] Question on image circle and medium format pinhole camera design Thanks Phil! It's clearly the first scenario -- the corners are perfectly clean and black. I suppose I will need to modify the camera some more to get rid of that slight edge that sticks up. Much appreciated, R.J. -Original Message- From: Philip willarney [mailto:pwillar...@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:00 PM To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Question on image circle and medium format pinhole camera design --- Fox, Robert r...@aarp.org wrote: ..snip.. Question: my images are all circular, cutting off the corners cleanly of the square print. Is this because the image circle is too small for the film? I'm wondering if the circular edge of the front plate is being picked up on film, since the edge sticks up about 1/4 inch. If the edges of the photos are sharp, hard edges, it's probably vignetting -- something in the light path from the outside world to the film is blocking the light. So you're getting a nice clean photo of the edges of the lens holder, for instance. If the edge is a slow fade from picture to dim picture to black, then it's falloff. Pinholes as such don't have an image coverage circle -- the edges just get dimmer and dimmer as they get farther from the pinhole and get less less light. I think. Any quibbles, anyone? -- pwillar...@yahoo.com __ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Paper negative questions
Thanks for the comment. I thought it was good too. Most folks like Ilford paper. No, the kodak printing doesn't always come through, but you never can tell. most folks use an ISo of 5 for starters. I've always used RC. - Original Message - From: Andrew Amundsen a...@tcinternet.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2002 1:16 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Paper negative questions Hi everyone, I am freshly inspired after this weekends pinhole forum, hosted by Tom Miller and Bill Erikson, at the pARTs gallery in Minneapolis. Very nice job, hope to see more like it. I'm interested in trying paper negative work with pinhole. So I have a couple quick questions for those with paper negative experience: 1) What brand of single weight photo paper has NO labeling on it's back? 2) Does the Kodak name, from the back, show through on the final print when you print with that brand? or is it faint enough not to? 3) Which is best to use RC or fiber? 4) Any good starting exposures for brands of paper you might be familiar with? Well that will give me a good start, thanks for any help you can pass on! Sincerly, Andrew Amundsen ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Silver prints from digital files?
Procolor in Minneapol;is will do this for color, I don't know about BW. it's www.procolor.com - Original Message - From: Nick Dvoracek dvora...@vaxa.cis.uwosh.edu To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 9:07 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Silver prints from digital files? Does anyone know if a vendor exists who outputs digital files to real silver prints. Fiber would be great but I could live with RC. My local camera store didn't know of any. I can't imagine there's a lot of market, but you never know what someone might specialize in. I know there's been a lot of discussion of inkjet and other computer output. We have a Xerox/Tektronix Phaser 7700 color laser printer that puts out really good black and white print quality and can do it on a wide variety of papers. Are people exhibiting these inkjet and laser print images? Do juried shows accept them? Nick -- -- Nick Dvoracek dvora...@uwosh.edu Director of Media Services Voice: 920-424-7363 University of Wisconsin OshkoshFax: 920-424-7324 http://idea.uwosh.edu/media_services/home.html http://idea.uwosh.edu/nick/handouts.htm ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] authentic space
It seems to me that what you are describing is spaces with a history, and a funky history at that. The remembrance of things past, to steal a phrase. - Original Message - From: Steve Bell veracity...@earthlink.net To: Pinhole List pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 12:00 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] authentic space So far i've done a lot of shooting in diners and also in thrift stores. i look at thrift stores as a kind of attempt for some people to reclaim this idea of the past. friends of mine go to them looking for vintage type clothing. i go there to buy every old camera in sight (it's really ridiculous, even the broken ones, gotta have those instamatics). i've also done some industrial/urban landscapes. i think i've stopped defining authentic space by other people's standards, and started defining it by my own, which i'm happy about. that was this series of photos becomes documentary, but also very personal. the one thing i'm really struggling with is the process i'm using. you see i'm doing this all for my color photography class, but i think in the end it would be better if the prints were something like pt/pd or maybe even salt prints or something like that. something that is more on the alternative process tip, simply because i think the subject matter would lend itself well to such a look. whatever are everyone elses thoughts on authentic space? steve [Original Message] From: Gregg Kemp gregg@p at ??? To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Date: 10/27/2002 7:26:02 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] authentic space On Sunday, October 27, 2002, at 06:43 PM, Steve Bell wrote: Hmm, well let's see. i originally began with the idea of places where people go to reclaim the past. for example, diners. i go to diners all the time, and a friend of mine started talking to me about the idea of authentic space. like, in the 50's diners were kind of this ideal for the future. all stream lined and chrome and neon. now diners are this ideal of the past. this space where people feel like they are part of something authentic. we also talked about how yuppie artist types get apartments in more urban areas, and nouveau bourgoise people buy industrial type buildings and turn them into living spaces so they can feel more conntected to the working class that they've left behind. this is all architectural theory that she had been reading. it got me very interested. so i've been shooting authentic space. i started off just doing diners and thrift stores, but i've now started relying more on my instincts, shooting whatever feels like authentic space, rather than defining it by these specific criteria. I find this very interesting Steve - the idea of how the perspective of a place changes over time. What places, or types of places have your instincts taken you to (if you don't mind my asking)? And thank you Rosanne, for asking about the meaning of authentic places. I just assumed I had simply missed out on something else. - Gregg ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ --- Steve Bell --- veracity...@earthlink.net --- http://www.unbeknownst.org/~insurrective / http://www.angelfire.com/zine2/insurrection --- In fact, rock, rather than being an example of how freedom can be achieved within the capitalist structure, is an example of how capitalism can, almost without a conscious effort, deceive those whom it oppresses...So effective has the rock industry been in encouraging the spirit of optimistic youth take-over that rock's truly hard political edge, it's constant exploration of the varieties of youthful frustration, has been ignored and softened. --Michael Lydon ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] testing
My message went through. Here is my reply. If it goes through, the HTML clearly comes from someone else. - Original Message - From: erick...@hickorytech.net To: ppinhole discussion pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, October 23, 2002 7:36 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] testing My replies to messages has been blocked lately because it contains HTML code. I send in plain text only. If this original message ges blocked I need to know about it. If my replies to others is all that gets blocked, someone else is supplying the HTML code. please advise. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] 4x5 film
Readyloads. See at www.calumetphoto.com - Original Message - From: Catherine Just blue_medic...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 11:56 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] 4x5 film hi, after using 4x5 film holders with my pinhole while traveling, I am very interested in the film that is already in a holder. I can't remember the name of it. does anyone have information about what I am trying to describe??? So instead of having to load the film into a holder you can buy a pack of film in its own holder. I am interested in black and white film, 100 speed. curious where to buy it, and how many come in a pack. Some people where talking about it a while back, but I have deleted the information. also: I'm looking through my first pinhole images, and most of them were handheld 45 second eposure, so they look hazey/ slightly blurred which I love. I am considering printing sizes as I am planning on having a show of these images. But I am curious about how much more blurred it will be if I blow them up really large. I will most likely lose alot of the detail, and they may look really blown out But because they are images with castles in them, they just scream at me to be bigger. Does anyone have experience printing this type of image large? Did you lose the image quality so much that it wasn't worth the enlargement??? Curious before i get started. also: has anyone used alternative methods of printing such as kallitype? Or salt printing? Interested in creating more depth / and using an old method of printing for these castles. thank you ! Catherine = Catherine Just Photography http://www.catherinejust.com Don't just state your intent, Live it. ~Jerry Seiner Jr. __ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos More http://faith.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] 1: Is This Nuts? 2: A Plug
I think I remember that the general technical term for the phenomenon we're talking about is piezoelectric. - Original Message - From: Tom Miller twmil...@mr.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] 1: Is This Nuts? 2: A Plug Dear All, Thank you for the reassuring psychiatric evaluation, for a new word and the desire for a new experience with wintergreen lifesavers. If the lifesavers came in little tins, this email thread could come full circle. Tom - Original Message - From: Achal Pashine Tuesday, October 15, 2002 5:09 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] 1: Is This Nuts? 2: A Plug Do you mean, triboluminescence of Lifesaver?? achal. --- Tom Miller twmil...@mr.net wrote: Dear List Members, 1: I've noticed that when pulling electrician's tape off the roll in complete darkness there is a small greenish light at the spot where the tape is pulling off the roll. Recently, I made ..snip.. Oh, I see that too. I forget the technical name for it, but I remember doing an experiment in high school where you cracked a wintergreen lifesaver in the dark and it created a similar brief light -- imagine 30 high school students breaking lifesavers in the dark. Brave teacher, no? I think it's the same physics/chemistry involved. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] 1: Is This Nuts? 2: A Plug
I suspect that this is the same sort of green light one sees when pulling the tape that holds 120 film to the roll off. For some reason, it never seems to affect the film. There's a technical name for it, but I don't know it. Maybe it's something like the green light you can get when biting down on wintergreen lifesavers. - Original Message - From: Tom Miller twmil...@mr.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 11:36 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] 1: Is This Nuts? 2: A Plug Dear List Members, 1: I've noticed that when pulling electrician's tape off the roll in complete darkness there is a small greenish light at the spot where the tape is pulling off the roll. Recently, I made a number of small cameras out of Whitman Sampler tins, which are only slightly bigger than Altoids and hold 2.25 x 3.25 sheet film nicely. I sealed them with black tape to make them light-tight. When taking the tape off of the tin, I saw the same green light. Has anyone else seen this? Am I nuts (not a bad option, really)? Do you think that this small amount of light could fog film if it were within 1/4 inch of the film? I noticed slight fogging on a couple of sheets of film where the last bit of black tape pulls off the tin. 2: Having tried and been frustrated by all of Kodak's Portra films, I decided to try Fuji Reala (based on a recommendation from Dieter Bublitz). I like the Reala 100. For color pinhole photography, it sure has vivid, yet natural, color compared to Portra. The local camera stores told me it is not available in the U.S. in 120, so I've been ordering it from Canada. Tom ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Laser drilled pinholes from Calumet?
They're fine. See also the ones sold by pinhole resource www.pinholeresource.com. Also fine. - Original Message - From: Fox, Robert r...@aarp.org To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, October 14, 2002 8:08 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Laser drilled pinholes from Calumet? Anyone ever bought/used the set of 12 pre-drilled laser pinholes offered by Calumet Photo? http://www.calumetphoto.com/syrinx/ctl?PAGE=Controllerac.ui.pn=cat.CatItemD etailac.item.itemNo=PY3005 Seems like a really reasonable price for a set of 12. I know laser drilled pinholes are not necessary, but I'm one of those types who likes some precision :-) I'm in the process of converting a 1953 German Dacora Digna 6x6 into a pinhole camera (focal length approximately 36mm), and have been looking for some quality pinholes to use. R.J. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] 35 mm pinhole camera
Yes, there is a pinhole diameter that will give best sharpness for each distance from pinhole to film. The simplest version of the formula is (distance to film in inches)(55) equals the square of the optimal diameter in thousandths of an inch. In your case (1.12 inches)(55) equals 68.99, the square root of which is 7.84 thousandths, or 0.00784 inches.- Original Message - From: Zami Schwartzman zami...@netvision.net.il To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 2:28 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] 35 mm pinhole camera Anyone has tried converting a 35 mm camera to pinhole ? I have modified an old Pentax Spotmatics Reflex camera , the idea was that using a 35 mm format will make it easier to experiment with various types of films . film drive , sutter timing , tripod attachement and release cable are already there and any local photo shop will process the films for me . I turned a lens boby on my lath that allows the metal foil be located 28 mm from the film . I discovered that with this camera I can flip the mirror up permanently without disabling other camera functions ( except for the viewfinder that obviously is shut off ) I use 0.02 mm copper foil .The pinhole was made under a x70 stereo microscope by using a very sharp pin ( honed under the microscope ) on hard back surface . the buurs on the oposit side had to be very carefuly treated with no. 400 sandpaper to get a perfect hole . Although not a sraight forward job , I can get perfect holes as small as 0.05 mm diameter ( I have scale on the microscope ) . there is no chance to get any smaller with manual pin puncturing tecniques . I experimented with a 0.1 mm hole , got some good close up pictures well exposed with Kodak gold 400 ASA( using f: 120 on the light meter ) but the results are quite out of focus on 10x15 prints . I wander if going further to a 0.05 hole will worth the panelty in the f number . Is there an optimun hole size for best sharpness ? or is it the smaller the better . I hear that some people are converting plastic 35 mm cameras , I wander what holes they use and how sharp is the resultant image they get . Zami -Original Message- From: pinhole-discussion-admin@p at ??? [mailto:pinhole-discussion-admin@p at ???]On Behalf Of DAVID WALTERS Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 11:29 AM To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Re: New to the list and saying hello Evening, I apologize for the lag time on answering but I had a brief episode of file overload while trying to upload some pics (Sorry and thanks, Gregg). I have a pinhole from my last roll posted at http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/wal...@prodigy.net/lst?.dir=/Photo+art.src=ph;. order=.view=t.done=http%3a//photos.yahoo.com/ (badge), along with some other pieces of mine. The body cap is on my Canon EOS, I measured the distance at 49 mm and I'm using a laser drilled opening of .0102, this gives an f/stop of 163, I reckon. Using the bulb setting has given me fairly good results with Kodak film, although it seems to be able to meter through the pinhole. The Polaroid pinholes are from a Polaroid 210 with a hand drilled pinhole, I had such a bad rolloff because of reciprocity that I have stuck with B/W since. I might go back to color with the 210 and stick to extreme sun in the future, we'll see. Thanks for the welcome, David Walters ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole enlarging
The issue is the degree of enlargement. Enlarging 35mm to 4x6 increases the image area 16 times. Increasing a 4x5 to 16x20 increases the area only 4 times. You still get best results by contact printing, which is also true with lens images. - Original Message - From: Uptown Gallery mur...@uptowngallery.org To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 10:45 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole enlarging Hello: If one did MF (4x5 or 5x7) or LF (8x10) sheet film pinhole (and had an enlarger large enough), what are the prospects for enlarging? I was very unhappy with 4x6 prints from 35mm pinhole. Thanks Murray ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Paper or Film?
The big advantage of paper is that it can be handled under a safelight. Don't fret about it's tonal range etc, it's a great learning tool. I'd guess that the biggest argument in favor of 4x5 ids the greater fariety of films, film holders, varieties of cameras that can be adapted, etc. Also, not many folks have access to a 5x7 enlarger. Good luck. you'll do fine and everybody will have great fun being more creative than they knew they could be. - Original Message - From: David Weiss gkar...@yahoo.com To: Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 6:04 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Paper or Film? Hi everyone, I have been lurking for about a month now, and thought I would start to get involved. I am a rank amateur compared to the rest of you, so pardon my ignorance with pinholing. I am a high school science teacher, all female catholic school. Some students know my interest in photography and have used their feminine powers to persuade me to head a photo club. I though making a pinhole camera would be a nice start. I have seen plans and other details on the web meant for 5th graders, but thought that they would enjoy it too. My question: What is the main advantages/disadvantages of using film vs paper negatives? I know that paper would normally have a much longer exposure time, but is that the only disadvantage of the paper negative? I am wondering if the tonal range is too compressed or something else I am not aware of? ( I am also familiar with the relative difficulties in developing paper and film). Also, why is 4x5 the preferred size? I would have thought 5x7 would be popular, but it does not seem that way from my preliminary investigations. Especially with the paper negatives--the paper is very common in this size. I have a darkroom at home and am aware of basic techniques so share your opinions with confidence! BTW, I bought a ROUND Altoid tin the other day (curiously sour lemon candy) and am about to try a round paper negative for my first crack at this genre. Seemed like a natural. I am thinking of taking some pinhole photos of things with arches, that are basically round, and with the round negative, well, it appeals to me. I have really enjoyed all of the photos I have seen that everyone has taken so far. Thanks for your time, folks Dave __ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Pintoids revisited
Since you are an adventurer re pinholes, I'll pass on an idea I've been playing with. Spontaneous pinholes. Small apertures like the little holes in soda crackers, or arrays as in the tops of salt shakers make for wonderfully rewarding experiments. - Original Message - From: Marcy Merrill ma...@merrillphoto.com To: Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 12:19 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Pintoids revisited Hi all: A while back there was a thread about pinhole cameras made from Altoid containers. I meant to comment. Later, there was a thread about multiple-holed pinhole cameras. I meant to comment. I just finished an exhibit of some of my pinhole images. I meant to post about it. Anyway, I've spent my afternoon posting Pintoid images to my Pintoid page ( www.merrillphoto.com/pintoids.htm ). I've been using acupuncture needles to make pinholes and they work well. I'm going to try porcupine quills next. Anyone tried it? Just curious. I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks to everyone for such an informative list! -MM Marcy Merrill Photographer www.merrillphoto.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Heading to England
The blue haze is what you clear. try it. - Original Message - From: Catherine Just blue_medic...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 12:14 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Heading to England thank you. I actually have some 4x5 film here that I opened up (type 55) and left to dry. It's got a blue haze over it. I wasn't sure if I could save them or not. --- erick...@hickorytech.net wrote: I never had any trouble just letting the negative dry out in the field and then clearing it when I got home. Also, one can, if desperate, clear the negative just with water. It leaves the negative a good deal more vulnerable to scratching, though. - Original Message - From: b2myo...@aol.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2002 9:48 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Heading to England Hi Catherine, To clear Type 55 film you can use a regular dilution of PermaWash instead of Sodium Sulfite which is difficult to dilute. Just keep the film wet until you return home for clearing and washing...use Photoflo at the end. For the dreamy effect, you may want to try a zone plate pinhole. Good Luck...keep us informed. leezy ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ = Don't just state your intent, Live it. ~Jerry Seiner Jr. __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines http://news.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Heading to England
I never had any trouble just letting the negative dry out in the field and then clearing it when I got home. Also, one can, if desperate, clear the negative just with water. It leaves the negative a good deal more vulnerable to scratching, though. - Original Message - From: b2myo...@aol.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2002 9:48 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Heading to England Hi Catherine, To clear Type 55 film you can use a regular dilution of PermaWash instead of Sodium Sulfite which is difficult to dilute. Just keep the film wet until you return home for clearing and washing...use Photoflo at the end. For the dreamy effect, you may want to try a zone plate pinhole. Good Luck...keep us informed. leezy ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Does anyone use a Jobo for processing
No experience with the duolab, but I can sure endorse Jobo. - Original Message - From: D. Hill To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, August 31, 2002 9:34 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Does anyone use a Jobo for processing Hi everyone, After all this time in the darkroom, I have found it to be a good time to simplifly and condense some space with a Jobo Duolab. Do any of you use this? I have a specific question about it's agitation for the film tube, and whether it continuously spins in one direction, or if it spins for a revolution in one direction then spins back the other way. The unit seems to be portable enough for small darkroom work, and you get the developing slots for paper as well. Any stories of darkroom bliss with the Duolab will be appreciated... thanks, Don -- Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
Re: [pinhole-discussion] cyanotypes using paper negatives
These are great negs, especially with the pictorico film. Dan Burkholders book Making Digital negatives for contact printing will tell you how to do it. - Original Message - From: Christian Harkness christianharkn...@hotmail.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2002 7:20 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] cyanotypes using paper negatives Hi Ben, another 'work-around' would be to make digital negatives on OHP from these folks: http://www.pictorico.com. For me, the sun exposure for these on cyanotype is about 3 - 4 minutes. Best - chris _ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] 4 questions from a beginner
1. The optimal distance for a .013 pinhole is about three inches, and the f stop would be about 230. You should be able to figure your exposure out with that, by comparing with a metered f stop. A black cat brand guide will help enormously. see it at www.pinholeresource.com 2. Technical answer is that the falloff of light intensity off axis is equal to the original intensity times the fourth power of the cosine of the angle off axis. The simple answer is yes. You need a better match between the distance to the film and the size of the pinhole. Bigger is better. 3. Sounds like old dried up fiberbased paper. Yes a hot press will help. One used to be able to get print flattener solution, which was basically glycerine. Don't know if it's available any more. 4. I don't know the ethical answer, but in reality large city sewage systems can handle the occasional amateur dump. - Original Message - From: Bre Pettis pett...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, August 20, 2002 7:51 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] 4 questions from a beginner Hi, I've become obsessed with pinhole photography and I've got a bunch of questions that I need help with. I'm sorry for so many questions at the same time. Question 1 I've turned an old autographic camera into a pinhole camera. I've got a .013 needle hole and 1#34; from the hole to the film. I've got it loaded with 400 speed bamp;w film. So my question is where should I start? In my paper as film pinhole cameras I start at about a minute in sunlight. How long should I try for an exposure on a sunny day? Am I right in gauging the f stop at f/77? I've got a light meter, should I use it and should I make any adjustment for using a pinhole? Question 2 I've made a 250 sheet photo paper box pinhole camera with a .013 hole. I'm not getting nearly as much light around the edges as in the middle. I thought it might be the pinhole, so I made another with the same problem. Is lack of light on the edges normal? Question 3 A friend gave me a box of ilford ilfobrom 4.1P paper. It works fine except that the edges are curled up. Any way to fix that? Would putting it in a hot press thing help? Also, does anybody know what the qualities of this paper are in relation to other papers? Question 4 I'm sure this is a repeat question, but do I take developing chemicals to the haz waste pickup place or is Seattle's waste division capable of handling the chemicals down the sink? Thanks, Bre Pettis __ Do You Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs http://www.hotjobs.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole mounted in bodycap on EOS cameras
And the optimal pinhole diamter will be 0.010 inches. - Original Message - From: Rune Tallaksen tall...@alfanett.no To: Pinhole-Discussion-Admin pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, August 16, 2002 1:23 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole mounted in bodycap on EOS cameras I am wondering if any of you more experienced people on the list can help me with this minor challenge. I will like to mount a pinhole on a bodycap and put it on one of my EOS bodies. I have been searching the net and have found a lot of information for my other pinholeprojects (4x5, 6x7) but not on this particular subject. My questions are: How do I measure the distance from the filmplane til the pinhole? What will the optimal pinholediameter be? Will my built in exposure be able to measure the light and set a correct exposure? What else should I think of? Regards Rune Norway ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] exposure problems
You must have obstructed the pinhole somehow, or else you are loading your film backside forward and are exposing through the film. One time I taped the pinhole inside the camera and only then sprayed the inside with black paint. - Original Message - From: callum moffat callum...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, August 16, 2002 1:56 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] exposure problems im having problems with exposure on a pinhole camera that im using.it's made from a round sweet tin and has a pinhole of approx 0.35-0.4 mm. Distance from pihole to film is 95mm at its furthest point. with fast film (iso 400 ilford xp2) my suggested exposure times should be reasonably short(in pinhole terms) but i find that im having to give massive exposures to gat a decent exposure even in bright light ant ideas callum moffat,edinburgh,scotland __ Do You Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs http://www.hotjobs.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Strange Problem and I need some help.
One way to test for unperceived leaks is to cover the whole camera with a black plastic garbage bag, leaving only the pinhole showing. the repeat the exposure situation. - Original Message - From: ROBERTSON,TRAVIS J is-...@womans.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 9:50 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Strange Problem and I need some help. My photos are having problems and I posted some example hoping that I can find out what is the problem. Please note that this is my first camera and I have been doing this for about a week. I'm just trying to work out the kinks in my camera design. This photo was a 2-min exposure on a very overcast sky about 20 min before sunset. I just wanted to see how a long exposure would turn out. Can you see the two vertical lines down the middle of the photo? What could cause that? http://www.???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?cmd=maxstar t=pic=trfarm_lines.jpg The photo below was the same shot but was a 1 min and 30 second exposure and now I have a strange light source coming from the bottom. Could it be cause by a problem with my pinhole? I sure I don't have any light leaks. I'm using an oatmeal pinhole camera. http://www.???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?cmd=maxstar t=pic=trfarm_lightproblem.jpg ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Newbie Intro. and a few questions
I just spent a week helping a friend load his new multiformat zero etc. What a pain! As for 4x5 vs 8x10, 4x5 gives you a lot more choices. 8x10 satisfies the purist. Look at choices at www.pinholeresource.com. - Original Message - From: Fox, Robert r...@aarp.org To: Pinhole List (E-mail) pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 8:20 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Newbie Intro. and a few questions Short introduction: I'm an amateur photographer in the Washington DC area shooting mostly medium format on-location portraits and architectural stuff. I shoot mostly BW print, but also use transparencies (usually Fuji Provia 100). I am fascinated by the potential of pinhole photography and am looking to buy a pre-made camera after seeing the beautiful examples on the resource page. I use mostly all-manual cameras, so getting into pinhole feels pretty natural. I hate the way modern electronics can get in the way of the image making process. Are there any practical reasons to shoot at 4x5 rather than 8x10? I suppose it would be easy enough to do both, but I'm wondering about people's preferences for architectural and portrait work. The multi-format Zero2000 looks like a good starter as well given the choice of formats for standard roll film. I must say I am blown away by the quality and creativeness of the images I have seen on the April 28 pinhole day gallery -- really inspiring! One of the best photographic events I've ever seen -- simple and powerful. Anyway, I'm here to learn and am glad to participate. R.J.
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Camera Size?
And you can make the camera narrower than the paper, curving the paper to fit and thus greatly increasing your angle of view. - Original Message - From: George L Smyth glsm...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 3:18 PM Subject: RE: [pinhole-discussion] Camera Size? --- ROBERTSON,TRAVIS J is-...@womans.com wrote: I would like to make 16X20 prints (That is I want to put the paper in the camera) and I'm trying to figure out how large of a pinhole camera I would need. Any suggestions on how to figure this out? Travis - I made a 16X20 camera a while back, and it realy depends upon how wide an angle you want. You can make it pretty much as shallow or as deep as you want. Cheers - george = Handmade Photographic Images - http://GLSmyth.com DRiP Investing - http://DRiPInvesting.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] hello.....
If you look on page 120 in Eric Renner's first edition or 128 in the second edition you will see an array of progressively more blurred images of the same object along with the f stop of the pinhole. The pinhole in the lower right corner seems optimal. The pinhole directly above it is more than four times wider, and the blurriest one is nearly ten times wider. To get the precise size relationships among the several pinholes used, pick an arbitrary focal length and divide each f stop into it. I just spent a week at Eric Renner's place, where he referred to people like me who try to solve problems like this as techno-twits. He would just try something and see what it looks like. Maybe he's right. - Original Message - From: Mark Interrante m...@interwalk.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, August 05, 2002 7:21 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] hello. Ok, I've a question. I recently saw Martha Casanave's Lenin photos (http://marthacasanave.com/lenin.html) and I think they are beautiful. She uses a non-optimial pinhole, and I'd like to know if people have any idea how much larger I would need to make a pinhole to achieve this effect? Mark -- Original Message -- Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] hello. From: gleh...@mac.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Reply-To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Date: Mon, 5 Aug 2002 22:52:58 +0100 hello anyone there I guess everyone's too busy pinholing to post... I have to say this is the friendliest and least antagonistic mailing list I've been on... Cheers. Gordon Lehany ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] I have a question.
Go gett'em! Go buy Eric Renner's book Pinhole Photography, second edition. It'll get you started and then some. - Original Message - From: ROBERTSON,TRAVIS J is-...@womans.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 4:30 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] I have a question. I have a passion for photography, but the cost of large format cameras and enlargers prevent me from doing the work I want to. Today I found your web site and I have that excited feeling about pinhole photography. You see I want to create very large photos, but I have a question. Can you create a very large pinhole camera and just use photo-paper instead of film? Are their limitations to this? I have a dark room and I can make the prints. Thanks. Travis. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole and strobe?
You can, but most strobes don't put out enough light to give adequate exposure with just one shot. Using a flash meter, find the distance from the object that gives you an F22 reading, then find the multiple of f22 your pinhole needs and give that many shots with the strobe. - Original Message - From: Margaret Crowe winr...@hotmail.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 8:30 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole and strobe? Hi all, I hope I'm posting this in the right place!! Just wondering if anyone can explain to me why it's not possible to take photos with my pinhole using flashes (strobe)? MARGARET _ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole size
One simple way is to photograph the pinhole over a light box with a ruler beside it, then enlarge the negative as big as you can and compare the diamter of.the aperture with distance on the ruler. Comparators for threads are said to work fairly well. I bought a set of pre-drilled pinholes and use them for eyeball comparison. - Original Message - From: Jean Hanson jhan...@pon.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, July 21, 2002 5:53 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole size I have the math on how to figure the ideal size of the pinholes but how do you actually measure them. Does everyone but me have a microscope, a micrometer? what? Jean ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] HP5, Delta films and reciprocity
I use the same formula as I do for TMAX. The other forgiving factor is that when you correct for reciprocity failure, the failure itself buffers overexposure risk. Don't try to hit a mark too closely. Overexposure may be a wrong, but it's only a misdemeanor. Underexposure is a felony. - Original Message - From: bwphoto4...@aol.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 10:26 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] HP5, Delta films and reciprocity OK, This has probably been discussed recently, but can anyone out there recommend a good formula/rule of thumb for adjusting exposure for reciprocity in Ilford films? The technical data on their webpage is merely a chart, and I am hoping to get more specific information, based on the experience of the other pinhole photographers on the list. I normally use Delta 400, but occasionally use HP5 and Delta 100. I process in Ilfotec DDX (although I also occasionally use Ilfosol). Anyone out there with experience with these films? My camera is the Zero Image multiformat (which is at f235). Thanks! M Billingslea
Re: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole size
Measure the distance from the pinhole to the back. Multiply the distance (in inches) by 55. The result is the square of the optimal diameter, in thousandths of an inch. If an altoid can is 3/4 of an inch deep, the optimal diamter is .0064 inches. - Original Message - From: Steve Shapiro sgsh...@redshift.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole size I never got a definitive answer to my questioon about the best advisable pinhole size for the sharp image with an Altoid can pinhole camera. S - Original Message - From: William Erickson erick...@hickorytech.net To: ppinhole discussion pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 1:52 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole size I misspoke this morning when i sent a comment about the relationship between pinhole size and sharpness. I indicted that exposure doubles with every 40% increase in diamter. It should have been the area of the aperture doubles, and thus time halves. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
[pinhole-discussion] pinhole size
I misspoke this morning when i sent a comment about the relationship between pinhole size and sharpness. I indicted that exposure doubles with every 40% increase in diamter. It should have been the area of the aperture doubles, and thus time halves.
[pinhole-discussion] pinhole size and sharpness.
I am attempting to recover from a deep seated addiction to commercially drilled pinholes. My research yields the following, which I will share because I have never seen it written anywhere before. Exposure time for any given pinhole doubles with each 40% increase in diameter, but sharpness of image with changes in pinhole diameter degrades much more slowly, and requires quite drastic increases in pinhole diameter to give significant changes in sharpness. I've done some testing to confirm this, but the best example of this is on page 128 of Eric Renner's book. You can see some increased softness of the image with a pinhole twice as wide as optimal, but you really don't begin to lose detail until the pinhole is between three and four times as wide as optimal. Even a pinhole ten times as wide as optimal will yiled a very readable image. In Eric's example pick an arbitrary focal length and divide the various fstops shown in the illustration into it. You will see the ratios of aperture diameter associated with different degrees of sharpness. Thus the error associated with using one size needle or another, over a wide range of focal lengths, is negligable (sp?). One will get surprisingly uniform sharpness and clarity of the image with any pinhole, because the difference in pin diameters for different numbers of needle is far less than 100%. Many of you have taken this for granted but here is a way for the precision technonerds to see a way to loose their chains.
Re: [pinhole-discussion] (OT) Scanning Slides
I have a Nikon Coolscan and could scan them for you and put the files on a CD. You'ld have to trust me with the slides. erick...@hickorytech.net - Original Message - From: Chris Peregoy pere...@umbc.edu To: pinhole-discussion pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2002 5:49 PM Subject: RE: [pinhole-discussion] (OT) Scanning Slides = Original Message From Steve Bell veracity...@earthlink.net = Going digital is a great idea, unfortunately i've not got $5000 to spare to pick up a nice camera. I've already purchased the slide film, though i do have a bunch of negative film too. hopefully i will be able to persuade the security people to hand check my bag. i do plan on using the slide film, so the question remains, where can i get it scanned? I can help you out. When you get back and have developed and sorted your slides, email me off list and I'll let you use the slide scanner I have at our school. Chris Peregoy pere...@umbc.edu http://userpages.umbc.edu/~peregoy ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Why is paper contrasty?
Thanks. I'll try it. - Original Message - From: Steve Shapiro sgsh...@redshift.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2002 2:02 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Why is paper contrasty? To improve local contrast, extend range; you might try a half tsp of Shap's Bal. Bitzper liter of working developer. It's now available through the Photographers' Formulary. S - Original Message - From: William Erickson erick...@hickorytech.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 7:29 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Why is paper contrasty? I understand the behavior of VC paper, but my comments intended to deal with the fact that the tonal range of brightly lit scenes exceeded the tonal range of any paper. Ratcheting down the exposure time in such situations would bring the highlights more into the tonal range of the paper, at the cost of shadow detail, advantage being that you at least don't lose both highlights and shadow. Thanks for your thoughts. - Original Message - From: Guy Glorieux guy.glori...@sympatico.ca To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 8:05 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Why is paper contrasty? William, If you go to the Ilford web site, on the BW products page, http://www.ilford.com/html/us_english/bw.html you will find hiding somewhere towards the center of the page an Acrobat document called CONTRAST CONTROL that deals with your question. Basically, contrast on BW variable-contrast paper is determined by the amount of blue that hits the paper. Under the enlarger, low contrast is achieved by reducing the amount of blue from the enlarger lamp with a yellow filter. VC paper is calibrated for tungsten, which is yellow in color, compared to daylight which is much more blue. So, it's only natural that paper exposed to blue daylight will be more contrasty. To reduce contrast, use a yellow filter similar to the 00 that you would use under the enlarger for minimum contrast: it works very well. It will block some light, compared to not using a filter. But, if you use Ilford paper, its speed is higher at lower contrast grades than at higher contrast. As for me, I use ISO 4 when I shoot paper negatives and it works well for me. Hope this helps, Guy - Original Message - From: William Erickson erick...@hickorytech.net To: ppinhole discussion pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 8:45 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Why is paper contrasty? I've thought this through but haven't completely verified it yet, but I wanted to see what others reaction is. BW paper used as a negative is said to be contrasty. What does this mean? BW paper has a sensitivity range of a little more than four stops for any given exposure. Burning and dodging increase tonal range by shortening or lengthening the exposure. If you meter a scene that has an eight stop tonal range and give the average exposure for the scene using a paper negative, you risk having the highlights blown out because they are more than two stops above average, and shadows go black because they are more than two stops below average. If the scene has a tonal range of only four or five stops, your negative won't be contrasty because all the tones lie within the range of the paper. What, then, to do in sunshiney scenes, for instance, where the tonal range might be eight or nine stops? If you place the highlight tones of the main object of your composition about two stops above average, you will get good tonality in important spots, no blown out highlights, even though you may get lots of black shadows. The implication is, much shorter exposure times (read higher ISO) in bright scenes than in shadowiy scenes (effctively lower ISO), using the same paper. My first tests suggest that a good ISO for Ilford multigrade in bright sunlight might be as high as 15, while 5 works well in shaded scenes. Any comments? ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Why is paper contrasty?
I understand the behavior of VC paper, but my comments intended to deal with the fact that the tonal range of brightly lit scenes exceeded the tonal range of any paper. Ratcheting down the exposure time in such situations would bring the highlights more into the tonal range of the paper, at the cost of shadow detail, advantage being that you at least don't lose both highlights and shadow. Thanks for your thoughts. - Original Message - From: Guy Glorieux guy.glori...@sympatico.ca To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, July 12, 2002 8:05 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Why is paper contrasty? William, If you go to the Ilford web site, on the BW products page, http://www.ilford.com/html/us_english/bw.html you will find hiding somewhere towards the center of the page an Acrobat document called CONTRAST CONTROL that deals with your question. Basically, contrast on BW variable-contrast paper is determined by the amount of blue that hits the paper. Under the enlarger, low contrast is achieved by reducing the amount of blue from the enlarger lamp with a yellow filter. VC paper is calibrated for tungsten, which is yellow in color, compared to daylight which is much more blue. So, it's only natural that paper exposed to blue daylight will be more contrasty. To reduce contrast, use a yellow filter similar to the 00 that you would use under the enlarger for minimum contrast: it works very well. It will block some light, compared to not using a filter. But, if you use Ilford paper, its speed is higher at lower contrast grades than at higher contrast. As for me, I use ISO 4 when I shoot paper negatives and it works well for me. Hope this helps, Guy - Original Message - From: William Erickson erick...@hickorytech.net To: ppinhole discussion pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 8:45 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Why is paper contrasty? I've thought this through but haven't completely verified it yet, but I wanted to see what others reaction is. BW paper used as a negative is said to be contrasty. What does this mean? BW paper has a sensitivity range of a little more than four stops for any given exposure. Burning and dodging increase tonal range by shortening or lengthening the exposure. If you meter a scene that has an eight stop tonal range and give the average exposure for the scene using a paper negative, you risk having the highlights blown out because they are more than two stops above average, and shadows go black because they are more than two stops below average. If the scene has a tonal range of only four or five stops, your negative won't be contrasty because all the tones lie within the range of the paper. What, then, to do in sunshiney scenes, for instance, where the tonal range might be eight or nine stops? If you place the highlight tones of the main object of your composition about two stops above average, you will get good tonality in important spots, no blown out highlights, even though you may get lots of black shadows. The implication is, much shorter exposure times (read higher ISO) in bright scenes than in shadowiy scenes (effctively lower ISO), using the same paper. My first tests suggest that a good ISO for Ilford multigrade in bright sunlight might be as high as 15, while 5 works well in shaded scenes. Any comments? ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
[pinhole-discussion] Why is paper contrasty?
I've thought this through but haven't completely verified it yet, but I wanted to see what others reaction is. BW paper used as a negative is said to be contrasty. What does this mean? BW paper has a sensitivity range of a little more than four stops for any given exposure. Burning and dodging increase tonal range by shortening or lengthening the exposure. If you meter a scene that has an eight stop tonal range and give the average exposure for the scene using a paper negative, you risk having the highlights blown out because they are more than two stops above average, and shadows go black because they are more than two stops below average. If the scene has a tonal range of only four or five stops, your negative won't be contrasty because all the tones lie within the range of the paper. What, then, to do in sunshiney scenes, for instance, where the tonal range might be eight or nine stops? If you place the highlight tones of the main object of your composition about two stops above average, you will get good tonality in important spots, no blown out highlights, even though you may get lots of black shadows. The implication is, much shorter exposure times (read higher ISO) in bright scenes than in shadowiy scenes (effctively lower ISO), using the same paper. My first tests suggest that a good ISO for Ilford multigrade in bright sunlight might be as high as 15, while 5 works well in shaded scenes. Any comments?
Re: [pinhole-discussion] fogging in half-cylinder cameras.
Thanks. - Original Message - From: Andy Schmitt aschm...@warwick.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 12:08 PM Subject: RE: [pinhole-discussion] fogging in half-cylinder cameras. The regular matte paper should solve it. Also make sure the back of the metal that you made the PH out of is covered. Glossy paper is a nightmare in cylindrical cameras andy -Original Message- From: pinhole-discussion-admin@p at ??? [mailto:pinhole-discussion-admin@p at ???]On Behalf Of William Erickson Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 7:47 AM To: ppinhole discussion Subject: [pinhole-discussion] fogging in half-cylinder cameras. I have made a half cylinder camera for 8x10 negatives. I find that I have far more trouble with fogging due to interior reflection than I have ever seen with cylindrical cameras where the negative takes up only the back half of the cylinder. In this camera, the angle of view approaches 180 degrees, with the edges of the neg butted right up against the front of the camera. I haven't had fully matte paper to use, and haven't tried film yet, but I will. Has anyone used the polymax fine art paper that is double matte? I sent for some. has anyone tried some sort of a baffle system that might quench some of the random bouncing around of light? ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] close up flower shots
Mysterious! - Original Message - From: Tim Rawling pin_...@hotmail.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 6:56 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] close up flower shots Hi all, I just uploaded some close up pinhole images from a series that I have been working on for a little while now. If you are interested plese check them out at: http://www.???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?pic=timr_pin tryp.jpg (paste the two lines together if they have wrapped) Cheers, Tim R _ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] rings on photos. What could be the cause?
I see these sometimes, but not always. They usually seem to be related to a light source, so i'd guess it's diffraction. try a shot away from any light source and see if they're still there. - Original Message - From: Justin Bell j.b...@paradise.net.nz To: Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, July 04, 2002 12:36 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] rings on photos. What could be the cause? Hi. I've been playing around with pinhole photography, and I'm still in the mode of figuring it all out. Recently, I decided to change the focal length from 110mm to about 35mm. I have an old Agfa Bily, and just removed the entire front end except for the 'accordian' part, the pinhole lines up with the front of the camera. In doing so, I made another pinhole. But now I have tried 2 pinholes with the new modified focal length, and I'm getting 'rings' on the photo (http://soupisgoodfood.net/temp/pinhole.jpg, sorry for the poor photo, I had to take a digi of it using my monitor as a lightbox :). I'm guessing I didn't see the rings before I changed the focal length because it fell outside the frame. What do you think is causing it? Pinhole too small/refaction of light? The fact that I made it from heavy aluminium foil (one of those pie trays that comes with frozen pies to be exact). The drill method? Thanks for any input. Justin. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Paper Negative Questions
Ilford multigrade is best. If you are going to use paper flat, then the surface doesn't matter. if you are going to curve the paper, as around the inside of a can, use the flattest surface you can get. I think peal is as dull as Iolford gets. The usual rule of thumb for any paper is ISo of 5 or 6. the other thing about paper negatives is that the results tend to be very contrasty. If you don't like that, use a yellow filter and double the exposure time. Is the new e-mail address the ofical one? - Original Message - From: David To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, June 21, 2002 11:44 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Paper Negative Questions Hi, I have a couple of questions concerning paper negatives: 1.What brand and type of paper makes the best paper negatives? I have heard that the Kodak logo on the back will show up in prints made from paper negatives. 2.What is the ISO rating of various papers? Any other comments or recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, David d...@ix.netcom.com
[pinhole-discussion] digital pinhole
Here is an image from a pinhole bodycap on a Nikon D1X digital camera. www://???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?pic=digital_pinho le.jpg The camera allows exposure times up to 30 seconds. Compose and meter for F22 (you can pre-set ISO and just use what you were otherwise using). Multiply exposure time at F22 by 40, take the lens off, put on pinhole, change mode setting to manual, set the calulated exposure time and shoot. Other than the stunt of doing digital pinhole, it's kind of a nothing experience. Because the CCP is smaller than a 35mm negative, you compound the effective focal length by 50%, in effect you are shooting with a 75mm lens on 35 mm format. On the other hand the D1X is an absolutely wonderful tool.
Re: [pinhole-discussion] new but not a newbie , kinda but not really
Try the Black Cat thing. I can't remember the rest of the name. You can find it under Black cat at pinhole resource and other camera places. It's not a meter but it will translate from f22 to the higher Fstops. It's a $20 carboard dial with a long list of exposure by condition suggestions too. - Original Message - From: chad white chadwh...@mac.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2002 1:05 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] new but not a newbie , kinda but not really what is a good light meter for pinhole f-stops ? i am lurking e-bay ,i what to buy a light meter that can be used practically for pinhole. i don't want to use the math. i just want a simple light meter so i can spend my energy taking pinhole images. i noticed that most light-meters stop about f-16. f-225 or higher is better for me. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Covering Power of Pinholes
Covering Power of PinholesSimple answer is that covering power generally is 1 1/2 times the focal length either side of the axis. Erics book has both complex and simple formulae. The simple formula is the diameter of the aperture in thosandths of an inch (for example 0.010= 10) divided by 55 equals the optimal focal length in inches. On the other hand, the whole thing is very forgiving. You have to be off on the diamerter by 40% to get one stop exposure change. Sharpness is even more forgiving. there's a series of pictures somewher in erics book that illustrates this. Take it from a semi-reformed critical standards guy. You don't need critical standards. - Original Message - From: Joe Tait To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 10:49 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Covering Power of Pinholes Hello! New to the list and this is my first post. A little background. I have been doing photography for 6 years, and currently shoot 4x5 w/ a Cambo Legend monorail and 6x7 with a Koni Rapid 200. Most of my experience has been with conventional silver printing, but I have tried cyanotype gum bichromate in the last 6 months, and am going to plunge forward into various alt processes as I can. I really want to try pinhole next, and want larger negatives for contact printing. I've found some interesting info on the web and will build my own camera pinhole very soon. One thing that I am confused about is determining how much covering power a given pinhole has. Is it just relative to the distance of the pinhole to film/pinhole dia., which then determines the focal length? Forgive me, I struggle with comprehending even the most basic concepts of optics generally, and am no better with pinhole. I'd like to try say an 11x14 format, or perhaps a panoramic 8x16. The wide-angle possibilities (both the really wide moderate) are in my sights first and I like distortion, but not to the point of monotony. I am looking to use sheet Lith film developed in dilute developer, or pyro; and will be making my own film holders and back to be able to do multiple exposures. Could someone enlighten me how to figure out the proper pinhole size lens-to-film distance for the aforementioned formats? I understand that a curved film plane is employed to compensate for light fall-off. Is the optimum curve determined by experience, or are there known combinations? I haven't found any books that focus on specifics. Eric Renner's book apparently focuses on the history more than construction, which is the opposite of what I want to learn first. Perhaps someone could recommend more literature because the web only seems to offer an overview of pinhole. Lastly, Larry Bullis' excellent article on pinhole construction mentioned using silver sheeting a microscope to make pinholes. I'd actually like to try both of these methods. Does anyone work in this way? Where do you get the silver sheeting and what kind of microscope do you use? Precision pinholes seem to really effect the resolution, quite appropriate for certain shots (although the softness is perfect for others). Thanks. -Joe
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Cutting oatmeal box
Any power tool will shred the cardboard. I'd use either an xacto knife or a single edger razor blade. - Original Message - From: Chris Harris cpharrisph...@hotmail.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 7:58 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Cutting oatmeal box I'll be teaching a pinhole class, constructing cameras from Quaker oatmeal canisters. I'd like to avoid using knives to cut the opening for the pinhole. I've seen suggestions for using a Dremel drill, which I don't own. A trip to my local hardware store wasn't helpful; the tool guy said a Dremel wouldn't cut a clean hole in cardboard and pointed out the cost of the drill. Is a Dremel the best alternative to a knife? If so, what Dremel bit should I buy for this job? Thanks, Chris _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
[pinhole-discussion] how to say It's just a camera in Italian.
I'm about to leave for two weeks of pinholing in Italy. I feel rather self conscious about digging in a changing bag and putting out suspicious looking cannisters on the Ponte Veccio. Can some one tell me how to say It's just an home made camera, or I am harmless, though eccentric in Italian?
Re: Thanks Re: [pinhole-discussion] best viewfinders for close-up work
If the essence of a child is movement, then a pinhole is the ideal method to desribe it. My experience is that you can captue quiet movement easily enough in bright sun. Anything moving throughout an exposure of more than ten seconds will simply disappear. I enjoy playing with overnight exposures, which might capture the still environment and the child moving in her sleep. - Original Message - From: dalf...@aol.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2002 12:12 AM Subject: Re: Thanks Re: [pinhole-discussion] best viewfinders for close-up work In a message dated 4/19/02 11:50:35 PM Central Daylight Time, heidtsa...@hotmail.com writes: The other night I tried to do an exposure of my older child while she was sleeping. She stayed in exactly the same position for such a long time. I'm wondering if it will turn out... I hate to admit how difficult it is for me to find what I consider to be suitable subject-matter for a photograph. My children are significant to me in a way that a tree or a building can never be. But I love the long exposures with the pinhole camera because I feel I am capturing more time. I love standing around counting to myself and taking a picture while not looking through a viewfinder. This is a challenge that I am enjoying very much, and I appreciate the help. Sarah Sarah, before your very eyes , lies a wealth waiting to be goldmined , your daughters that is . They are always available, although maybe not always willing subjects before your camera(s) Worry not , that there is movement during the pinhole exposure, some really nice images come out of people moving within the frame , Serendipity plays here :-) I forget ( I do that a lot :-) but it seems to me someone on this list photographs their kids/daughters, as I have seen their work online , one was a longg exposure , something like several hours, focused upon a child/daughter as she slept in her bed, and another image, am not sure if by the same person who made images of their daughter(s) while on a picnic, perhaps during the World Wide Pinhole Day last year , I am thinking ? Some one else on the list kindly chime in here , about this please ? Sarah, aside from pinhole images and a bit off topic .. Sally Mann who is a well known photographer has photographed her family with large 8X10 format cameras, with glass lenses of course, and the images she produces seem to emote a warmth that subject (family ) knew the photographer well. Bottom line, Sarah, play or give yourself permission to play, your kids will see this, and have fun too, and should you produce images out of this play, I can bet they will be powerful ones . Good Luck, you are on your way . Dennis Alfrey dalf...@aol.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] getting somewhere (and a new question)
I find that if you leave the dark slide in, it tends to wobble or catch the breeze and move the camera. I pull it out and then throw my jacket or a black plastic bag over the back of the camera. that's what dark cloths are for in large format lens photography. - Original Message - From: Matti Koskinen mjkos...@koti.soon.fi To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, April 16, 2002 6:21 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] getting somewhere (and a new question) First, a warm thank to everybody. With your help I'm getting somewhere with this pinhole business, and getting results that are more and more better. Last evening I shot a picture from a rapid and as I was under a bridge and light conditions were not the best, approximating the effect of #0 filter, I came up to one hour exposure (which turned out to be bit too long). But as the exposure was so long, there's a light leak from the filmholder. Now the question is: is it better to remove the slider totally or leave it in the open position in the filmholder? The leak has come from the opening, it's not too bad (clone tools are invented), but the white edge of the negative has two dark dots from which two dark, but narrower stripes go diagonally over the entire negative. As I have never actually used large-size films, there are many things I need to ask or explore. Using low-contrast filter is now more than enough, so I don't have that hurry to move to use film. I even got some clouds visible :-) Main thing I'm pleased with using filter is, that the sky doesn't look totally burnt. Eg. trees seen against the sky have a distinct contour, not like without the filter when smaller branches just disappeared. And yesterday pinhole-camera showed it's superiority. I had a SLR and a digital camera too with me, but both run out of batteries, but with pinhole-cam, no problem :-) thanks -matti mjkos...@koti.soon.fi ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole coverage issue
A 0.44 mm aperture placed 145mm from the film will cover about 500 mm. The formulas is that the coverage equals about 1 1/2 times the focal length either side of center. Focal length is just the distance from the pinhole to the film. It's really a misnomer because nothing focusses, it's just the distance at which the light waves mesh best, for the optimally sharp image. - Original Message - From: Achal Pashine ac...@stanford.edu To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, April 15, 2002 6:31 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] pinhole coverage issue Hello all, I am working with 4X5 film format (at 145mm length) with 0.44mm pinhole (~f/300). How do I find out what is the coverage of the 'lens' (is it equivalent to 50mm, 100mm 35mm camera lens?). How to make pinholes which will give wider angle coverage? I have seen shots taken with extreme wide angle pinholes. How does one do that? Does formula Pinhole diameter = 0.0073 * SQR(focal length) give some known coverage? thanks, Achal - Original Message - From: Ray Esposito brassr...@brassring.org To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, April 15, 2002 7:58 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] developing tanks/pinhole cam [was paper negative tricks] Jim - there is no pricing on the XD. Ray - Original Message - From: Jim Kosinski mer...@paintcancamera.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, April 15, 2002 8:12 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] developing tanks/pinhole cam [was paper negative tricks] The Merlin-XD pinhole camera is made from a film developing tank. Check the website for details, www.paintcancamera.com Jim K ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Source for 8x10 film holders
I've seen a number of wooden ones on Ebay. - Original Message - From: Greg Newberry grnewbe...@qwest.net To: Pinhole-Discussion pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, April 08, 2002 8:10 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Source for 8x10 film holders Hi, I want to buy a few used (but good) 8x10 film holders for my pinhole photos. Is there a good source you know of? Thanks Greg ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
[pinhole-discussion] scanners
This seems like an opportune time for a variation on the scaner topic. I have negative scanners but my flatbed scanner is older and not too adequate. Any advice on choice of flatbed scanner for prints, not negs?
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Epson Perfection 1250 Photo Flatbed Scanner
Are these good scanners for opaque material or are they just attractive because they offer the opportunity to scan negatives? - Original Message - From: dalf...@aol.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2002 12:08 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Epson Perfection 1250 Photo Flatbed Scanner In a message dated 3/20/02 11:35:35 PM Central Standard Time, pinholeren...@netscape.net writes: the epson 2450 is a great scanner costing around $375.00 . It has 35mm ,120mm 4x5 capabilities . several photo magazines have given it rave revues . If you can save up for it you will not be disappointed . I feel it is a very good value for your money . chip renner Following this thread, I have seen the Canon1240 U advertised in several photo mags, and supposedly , I say with some degree of caution, you can scan ANY neg sizes up to 4X5, plus whatever flat print work you would like , price is about $299.00, saw it in BH photo catlogue I think, just FWIW ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole Calculations
Well, actually, the angle of view depends on there being a flat film plane interposed on the hemispheric optimal image distance. The average 'angle of view' is 1.5FL either side of the axis. Light falloff is a function of the different distance from the pinhole at different points on the flat film plane, plus the changing apparent shape of the pinhole as you move off-axis. Film configurations that approximate the chape of the optimal image,. i.e. half cylinder cameras, have only the light fall off due to the change in apparent shape of the pinhole, but no falloff due to change in pinhole-film distance since theat is the same for the full 180 degrees. They give good exposure through all 180 degrees. - Original Message - From: Richard M. Koolish kool...@bbn.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 9:30 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole Calculations photo...@earthlink.net writes: Query to Larry Bullis: I have experimented with a set of 12 pinholes obtained fromCalumet, ranging from 0.0059 to 0.032 inches in diameter, on a 4x5 view camera. It quickly became apparent that angle of view is dependent only only on lens to film plane distance. Any of the 12 varying pinhole sizes give the same angle of view at a given bellows extension. The difference is in the amount of light admitted by the pinhole aperture. Thus it makes sense that, as the pinhole aperture becomes smaller , admitting less light, the bellows extension must decrease, to maintain the same amount of light, which means the focal length gets smaller. You've given a formula to calculate the optimum pinhole size for a given focal length to give the sharpest image. The formula is pinhole(in) = square root FL x 0.0073 or pinhole(mm)= square root FL x 0.03679. My question is; does this formula really give the sharpest image? First, you've said that depth of field is essentially uniform from near to far and somewhat soft because of diffraction. Since, for a given focal length, aperture(pinhole) varies inversly with f-stop, the formula must be designed to balance pinhole against f-stop, one admitting more light and the other admitting less light. The constant (.oo73 or .03679) is what determines the answer. So, now the question is; How is the constant determined? Does it give the sharpest image or is it just a trade off between exposure time and pinhole size? Do smaller pinholes give more diffraction and thus less sharp images? Using a different constant will gives different answers; what is unique about the given constants? 1. You are right in observing that the angle of view depends only on the distance from pinhole to film, and has nothing to do with the size of the pinhole. The easiest way to visualize what is happening is to make a scale drawing of the camera, showing the film plane and the pinhole at the desired distance from the film. Straight lines drawn from the edge of the film through the pinhole show you the angle of view. Note that the intensity of light from the pinhole does fall off as you move from the center of the film toward the edge of the film, both because the film get farther from the pinhole, and because when viewed from an angle, the circular pinhole looks more and more elliptical and has a smaller effective area. 2. The calculation for 'optimal' pinhole usually starts with some assumption about the physics of light going through a small hole. Since every aperture, hole or lens, produces a diffraction pattern, one 'rule' is: The size of the optimal pinhole for a given focal length is the size of the diffraction disk it produces. The theory behind this rule is that a larger hole would produce a larger geometrical beam of light coming through, and therefore a less sharp image, while a smaller hole would produce a larger diffraction spot, and therefore also produces a less sharp image. Note that the size of the diffraction disk depends on the wavelength (color) of light. One common assumption is to assume a wavelength of 500 or 550 nanometers (nm). This is a green color. If you use panchromatic film, red light coming through the pinhole will make a slightly larger diffraction spot. But nothing is is very critical here. Nothing in this rule takes into account the f number of the pinhole. The f number is just something that results from computing the optimal pinhole for a desired focal distance. Because the optimal pinhole size increases only as the square root of the focal distance, the f number gets larger and larger as the focal distance increases. 3. Since you have a number of pinholes, you can try some of them at a fixed focal distance and what happens. Please report on your findings. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Zero 6x9 pinhole
There are at least two different formulas for the pinhole to film plane distance question. There are lots of different tables already calculated that have been referred to before. See Eric Renner's book for a long detailed description. Also, since you can be off from the right distance by a factor of 10 and still get usable images, just try something and see what you get. - Original Message - From: cfowler cfowl...@tampabay.rr.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, March 09, 2002 7:49 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Zero 6x9 pinhole Hi all, How about different subject than photoflo ! I am getting ready to order the zero 6x9 multiformat pinhole camera, has anybody used this camera's ? is it worth 200 Bucks ? I have mostly used large format camera's, I have a big 5x7 view camera, I dont think it be hard to convert to pinhole but how do select the distance of the bellows ( pinhole to film plane ) ? is there certain rule ? C.H. Fowler ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Photo-flo
Don't know about the photo-flo, but I have dried film in all sorts of configurations. One time I left a roll of film hanging for ayear to see how much dust it accumulated (surprisingly little, probaby because it was vertical and in a protected corner with no airflow.). If the film is in an area where there is little airflow it will dry without dust. I made a drying cabinet, just a vertical box with no fan, which works well also. I'd worry about dust if you just used a fan. - Original Message - From: Tim Midkiff ku...@vci.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2002 10:56 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Photo-flo Hi all, This may be a bit off topic but, is there a readily available subsitute for kodak photo-flo? I happen to be at home today and need to develop some images, both pinhole and otherwise, and i'm being plagued with spots and such. please send and ideas!!! Also what do you folks with darkrooms at home do about drying film? Has anyone build a small film drying cabinet? Or seen plans or worthy ideas? since I do both 120 and 35roll at home some, I would like something small and cheap(!) would it be feasible to construct something to dry a few rolls (2-4) of 120? maybe use muffin fans? maybe this is just wishful thinking and not practical. could 35mm film be held by both ends up in a U shape to conserve space? there I go dreaming again. Most importantly, the photo-flo. thanks, tim Timothy S. Midkiff Photographers get a Click out of life! ku...@vci.net psycho_...@excite.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Favorite Cameras?
The first rule of pinhole is Play!. Try what you said and see if you like it. My impression is that a lot of the pinholers here use converted lens cameras or the Zero series. Next favorite is the curved film plane ones, with the oatmeal carton being the prototype. Figuring out what you yourself like is half the fun. - Original Message - From: Steve Bell veracity...@earthlink.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 9:20 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Favorite Cameras? Hey Everyone, I haven't yet begun to construct my first pinhole camera. I'm so busy with school work and everything. I have a question for you all. What is your favorite type of pinhole camera? i know that there are tons of ways to construct one, so i'm interested in hearing what you all use. I've got an old Minolta XG-1 and i've been thinking about maybe converting it into a little pinhole camera, any tips? Sorry for the relatively general questions. thanks, Steve ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] New photo: Rome double exposure
Very nice. I have played around with double exposures, pinhole and otherwise. I find that including sky in the first exposure tends to eliminate the second exposure appearing there. - Original Message - From: Mark Interrante m...@interwalk.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 9:02 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] New photo: Rome double exposure Here is a recent double exposure: http://www.???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?pic=mark_int errante_rome.jpg Mark Ps. technical details: Zeroimage 6x9 pinhole Photo1 - Santa Maria Degli Angeli Church (remodeled by Michelangelo) originally the Baths of Diocletian with myself standing in the church Photo2 - View overlooking Rome from the Castle Saint Angelo in rome. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Hand made darkslides
I changed it to plain text the last time this went around. I looked at it in Outlook Express again. It says it's sending in plain text, but the settings for sending mail and sending news were different. I made themthe same. the format options thing on this message says it's plain text. let me know what you get. - Original Message - From: Guy Glorieux guy.glori...@sympatico.ca To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 9:01 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Hand made darkslides Hi Bill, May I also kindly ask that you turn your HTML (Rich-text) email to Plain text. I you are using Outlook Express, go to Format on the options on the top and then down the column, click on Plain Text. You can also go to your address book and mark the pinhole list address as always send in Plain text when you go to the name tab. Thnaks for your attention, Guy Glorieux - Original Message - From: Bill Erickson erick...@hickorytech.net To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 8:55 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Hand made darkslides I've tried it, can't say with much success. I was making a film holder for a daguerreotype plate by laminating succesive layers of model airplane plywood, using one of the thinner pieces for the dark slide. it worked OK for the dag because the plate is so slow', but for film or photographic paper I think you'd need to add felt or something to make the slot more light tight. You'll also need to pay close attention to light tightness around the film holder and at the closed end. - Original Message - From: Myisp To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 4:02 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Hand made darkslides Has anyone tried making their own darkslides? I am thinking of making a 10x8 camera and would like to be able to take more than one photo before returning to the darkroom. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Hand made darkslides
I've tried it, can't say with much success. I was making a film holder for a daguerreotype plate by laminating succesive layers of model airplane plywood, using one of the thinner pieces for the dark slide. it worked OK for the dag because the plate is so slow', but for film or photographic paper I think you'd need to add felt or something to make the slot more light tight. You'll also need to pay close attention to light tightness around the film holder and at the closed end. - Original Message - From: Myisp To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 4:02 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Hand made darkslides Has anyone tried making their own darkslides? I am thinking of making a 10x8 camera and would like to be able to take more than one photo before returning to the darkroom.
Re: [pinhole-discussion] question and website
That's some sort of diffraction pattern, I assume from internal reflections. if you figure it out let me know. i made one camera that did the same thing and i could never isolate the source. - Original Message - From: Daniel Donnelly danieldonne...@yahoo.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, March 01, 2002 11:09 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] question and website hello, have recently taken a load of photos (about 40) out in Egypt. The problem is though is that there seems to be a mark in the centre of the print. It was a home made pinhole camera. The photos can be viewed at http://www.picturetrail.com/danieldonnelly if you click on random stuff. They r called me and water. Hope u can tell em what it is from, Daniel __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] New Pictures uploaded!
Very nice. I like the kalotype best. I think it's neat to have the whole process be handmade. - Original Message - From: Ingo Guenther ingoguent...@web.de To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Friday, January 25, 2002 6:02 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] New Pictures uploaded! Hi all! I added two images to the upload gallery at http://www.???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?pic=ingo_gue nther_cyanotypie_1.jpg http://www.???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?pic=ingo_gue nther_kalotypie_1.jpg The cyanotypie was made in a home-made wooden camera on 4x5 inch sheet film at a cloister near Hude, Germany printed on self-coated aquarell paper in a cyanotypie process. The kalotypie was made in a home-made Coffee Canister in the center of my home town Oldenburg, Germany on a sheet film printed on self coated aquarell paper in a kalotypie process. Thanks for looking, Ingo ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] New image saloon uploaded on behalf of Pete Eckert
Thanks for the response. I was looking at the picture and realizing that one could sense the space by feel, heat, noise and the warmth from sunlight. - Original Message - From: pete eckert peteeck...@mindspring.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, February 25, 2002 1:54 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] New image saloon uploaded on behalf of Pete Eckert You are correct. I have only been totally blind for a few years. I still dream in full vision. I've been learning how to take pictures for about a year. I was a sculptor. I lost my vision slowly. I adapted and got an MBA. Four years ago I left my job as a business consultant. I spent a while considering what to do next. First I was a martial arts instructor. Martial arts have been one of my methods of adaptation. That job made me realize that the senses could be pushed much further than I assumed. Now I am returning to art to apply what I learned from the last job. Vision takes up an enormous amount of nerve bundles in the brain. It is possible to rewire all of that to be of use to the other senses, as long as you have a understanding of the data coming in. Like a baby learning to see, sight is meaningless until the mind can grasp the information. I am working on learning how to translate the other senses to a minds eye view. enough background info, on to responding to your post. I would still have some interest in light if I was blind from birth: like a astronomer viewing objects in space using radio waves. I use sighted folks descriptions of my finished photos to confirm or disprove what I envisioned in my minds eye. The process of taking photos is an event for me not a product. Once the product has been manufactured I involve sighted people in the art process. Their descriptions of my finished photos help me sharpen my senses to go out and apply what I have learned. I avoid asking for any help in taking the actual picture because that would alter the photos by making them from a sighted perspective. I have learned to question my own assumptions and those of others. I focus on exploring the range of my senses. this makes what I am up to more conceptual art rather than photography. While trying to teach sighted fighters to spar blind folded I learned that sight masks the other senses. It is as if there is only a set amount of attention available. When sight is removed the other senses don't become stronger. The brain just has that area once used by sight available. actively attempting to rewire that area results in a better ability to translate the other senses to minds eye sight. I suspect the areas in my brain once used by sight would still show up as active if studied with medical devices: (as if sight was stimulated in a dream. Conceiving this particular photo involved stepping in from the warm sun into a cool bar. Sound gave a clear impression of the dimensions of the room. I could hear the people at the bar. So they were easy to track. I can track about 6-8peoples movements at once before I become a little overwhelmed. I like a complete range of black to white in most of my images so I went to the coolest area knowing that would be the darkest. There was no air conditioning running. Once in the back of the bar I listened for all of the window openings and doors to the out side. Knowing where the openings are allows me to know about the lighting. getting a drink was a good excuse to investigate the bar area by touch. I returned to my seat by a different rout to explore the area further. I moved to a lower seat to listen for the reflected sound bouncing off lower objects. the people were coming and going a little to quickly for what I thought was a pin hole shot. I am still blushing the borrowed camera was zone plate. I waited for some heavy drinkers to settle in at the bar. I setup slowly taking in as much information as I could. as I was told by a wise old Grandfather anything worth doing is worth doing slow. using slow speed film gives me a wider range of reciprocity failure. It is more forgiving to errors in light estimation. Hopefully the above was of interest and answered your questions.. Pete P.S. In response to Andy's post-- If I drink to much I tend to forget to advance the film ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] New image saloon uploaded on behalf of Pete Eckert
As ithink about your image, i have a question which I think pertains to our art and is not just ersonal poking around. I have had experience with hearing impaired people, and I have the impression that those who have been deaf since birth and do not experience sound except as a sense of vibration are not much interested in subtleties of sound. I wonder if the same applies to visual impariment, and, if so, from your image I would predict that at one time you had useful vision. If not, could you talk a bit about how you conceived the composition? - Original Message - From: pete eckert peteeck...@mindspring.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2002 8:41 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] New image saloon uploaded on behalf of Pete Eckert Guy, sorry for the silly question. But can't a camera be both pin hole and zone plate? The shot I sent in was from a zero 2000Pin hole camera I was testing out. the shop told me it had a zone plate in it. as I understand it the image is formed on the plate after coming through the pin hole. I don't know much about zone plates and view them something like filters. Pete ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] New image saloon uploaded on behalf of Pete Eckert
Amazing! - Original Message - From: Steve Wilson steve.wil...@eyeconcur.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Cc: peteeck...@mindspring.com Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2002 9:26 AM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] New image saloon uploaded on behalf of Pete Eckert A new image, Saloon, has been uploaded in the 2002 gallery. The image was taken by Pete Eckert. I am posting for him since scanners photos editing software tend to play havoc with his speech recognition software. Pete is the contributor to the group who is blind. Here are Pete's words describing the image capture process. It is of a dive bar in San Francisco called the Saloon. It was shot by sound,heat, and touch. There was also a single dry Manhattan involved as I recall which approximated the exposure time. www.???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?cmd=maxstart= pic=saloon.jpg *** Steve Wilson Bainbridge Island, WA Email: steve.wil...@eyeconcur.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Type 55 reciprocity adjustments
All suggestions will work, but just letting it dry and then re-wetting it when you want to clear it worked OK for me. - Original Message - From: dalf...@aol.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2002 12:09 AM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Type 55 reciprocity adjustments While the focus is on discussion of Typ55 Polaroid films, I have a question. Once I press the process lever on my 4X5 film holder and pull and wait the amount of time needed to develop correctly , I then peel apart the 'pod(?) and seperate the negative from the positive print , and wash in Hypo Clearing Agent , then hang to dry, and print from there , once the neg is dry .This is easily done at home , but My question to those of you who use Type 55 in the field is this, How do you keep the negative moist until you get home and can process the neg with HCA ? A holding tank of some sort, a bucket of water, zip lock baggie filled with water, ? Any suggestions . ? Thanks dalf...@aol.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] umm (ortho-litho development)
If you use lith developer, you will get only blacks and whites. If you use dektol1:2 you will get some shades of grey. It's easy to try other film or paper developers since you can develop by inspection, just deelop until it stops changing. I think you'll get more pleasing results using Dektol. More poster-like with kodalith developer. - Original Message - From: R Duarte ra...@rahji.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 8:26 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] umm (ortho-litho development) ummm, sorry.. i also wanted to ask if anyone has sort of a summary of developing techniques for that ortho-litho stuff (eg which chemicals in which dilutions). i wish there was an easier way to search the archives. :-/ thanks again, rob ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] ASA for ortho-litho film (again)
Try 5 or 10. Instead of under or over exposure what you get is more or less black areas. it's alsmost a matter of personal taste. - Original Message - From: ra...@rahji.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Cc: ra...@rahji.com Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 2:44 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] ASA for ortho-litho film (again) Hey everyone, I'm sorry, but I've searched the archives all morning - I even downloaded the 18MB file and searched it that way - and I can't find the answers to the question that I asked last year about the ASA of the ortho-litho film that I got from photo warehouse (i think) last spring. They're 35mm rolls and I remember being surprised at the low ASA number someone suggested. Thanks again if anyone remembers what it was. Rob. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Type 55 reciprocity adjustments
My memory of my work with type 55 is that the reciprocity corrections used for other film worked fine with type 55. I exposed for negative, not positive, ASA 25. - Original Message - From: Markus Birsfelder b...@freesurf.ch To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 11:12 AM Subject: AW: [pinhole-discussion] Type 55 reciprocity adjustments I am not sure you refer to this post, but here is what I have saved: == Guy, Back in the 1974 Jim Shull published The Hole Thing, a pinhole photography book which includes a table of reciprocity corrections for enlarging paper used in pinhole cameras. (Apparently he was using Luminos Industrial F which he rated at an ASA of 10.) Using Shull as a starting point and gathering a few other data points from web sites such as those of George Smyth, Airtime, and Penate and adding in my own experience, I have constructed a reciprocity table that works for orthochromatic BW paper in pinhole cameras in sunlight: Indicated Exposure Corrected exposure 32 secs 1 min 15 secs 45 secs 1 min 50 secs 64 secs 3 mins 91 secs 4 mins 40 secs 128 secs 7 mins 181 secs10 mins 50 secs 256 secs16 mins 40 secs 362 secs25 mins 512 secs40 mins 724 secs64 mins 1024 secs 104 mins Using this table, I can consistently get good shadow detail (an indication of proper exposure) with Agfa Multicontrast Premium and Ilford Multigrade IV RC papers. Although these papers have different published paper speeds, I have found that assigning them the same daylight ASA of 6 works in practice. In the darkroom under enlarger light, BW paper does not seem to exhibit much reciprocity departure up to times around two minutes. Possibly the fact that in sunshine the light meter is measuring a good deal of light to which the paper is not sensitive may account for some of the variation from indicated time. My pinhole cameras have had f/stops ranging from about 180 to about 360, so most of my work has been in the 4 to 40 minutes range. Bob p.s. I have also found that using a yellow filter on the camera with these papers lowers the contrast and yields a paper negative that is much easier to print, but of course still results in that orthochromatic look. The filter blocks UV and allows you to optimize the camera for the wave lengths to which the paper responds, i.e., about 500nm. == -Ursprungliche Nachricht- Von: pinhole-discussion-admin@p at ??? [mailto:pinhole-discussion-admin@p at ???]Im Auftrag von Howard Wells Gesendet: Mittwoch, 20. Februar 2002 16:44 An: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Betreff: [pinhole-discussion] Type 55 reciprocity adjustments Late last year a list member published a chart of reciprocity adjustments with Type 55 Polaroid. I printed it out, lost it, and now can't find it in the archives. Some interior work has taken me into uncharted (to me) realms with this wonderful material. Help and thanks. Howard Wells ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] 120 slide film?
No. They're bigger and you will need a different, and much more expensive, slide projector. Sorry. - Original Message - From: R Duarte ra...@rahji.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2002 7:18 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] 120 slide film? Hi. Stupid question.. if I buy and shoot 120 slide film in my Zero2000, are the slides the same size as the ones I get from 35mm film? ie: can I use them in an ordinary slide projector or viewer? Thanks for any info, Rob ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole Planet new cameras
I've seen the prototype and talked to the fellow, but i haven't seen any pictures. It seems to be well thought out. - Original Message - From: Tom Harvey harv...@aracnet.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2002 8:41 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Pinhole Planet new cameras http://www.pinholeplanet.com/Home/home.html I just ran across a new pinhole camera listed on eBay. The manufacturer's website is listed above. It is under construction, so not much to learn yet. You can actually see the camera on the eBay listing at: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=1333483183 This wonderful thing is a hand made pinhole camera produced by pinhole planet. It's a 4x5 dual focal length pinhole. This camera has both wide and super wide modes, 12mm and 24mm. The body is hand crafted in solid oak. Designed around a laser-drilled pinhole lens and integrated shutter slide for maximum exposure control. The camera accepts all 4x5 backs but can be used without one with a little more hassle. That is all I know. I am not affiliated in any way with the maker or the seller. It does look interesting. Tom ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] new AOL tins; limits on wide-angle pinhole?
If the focal distance is 1/3 inch, you could expect a visible image cone of about 1 inch. The rule of thumb is one and a half focal lengths either side of the axis. - Original Message - From: J.E. Patterson pinh...@lightjunkie.org To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2002 8:41 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] new AOL tins; limits on wide-angle pinhole? The ubiquitous AOL trial CDs have begun appearing in a different packaging in our neighborhood; a metal tin slightly larger than a CD and about 1/3 inch in height. From this sprang several questions: if this was made into a pinhole, how wide angle of a pinhole would it be (I can do the calculation if given the formula, I think) and is it going to cover the whole area of the back? I guess what I mean to ask is what are the limits of the image cone? Cheers, Jane -- J.E. Patterson www.lightjunkie.org | www.luxumbradei.com ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] contast
You might be getting some flare from shooting toward the sun. this flattens out contrast. Also maybe some fogging? It is said to be very difficult to boost contrast with Ilford film. try tmax. - Original Message - From: Liav Koren yu257...@yorku.ca To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 8:39 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] contast I've been working with a small pinhole that I made from a disposable camera. I've been using 35mm delta100, developed in D76, per ilford's recommendations, and I've been finding the negatives to be very flat - I've been pretty much using #3 and higher filters. Anyone have any recommendations for better contrast, other then push development? -Liav Koren. ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Angle of ligh
Since you brought this up, there are two factors influencing the intensity of light at the film plane, the distance from the pinhole and the angle off axis. As you move off axis of a flat film plane, the distance from the pinhole to the film grows, and the apparent shape of the pinhole changes from round to narrower and narrower. The so called fourth power of the cosine law governs. The intensity at any point on a flat film plane equals the intensity at the axis point times the cosine, to the fourth power, of the angle off axis. When you curve the film around the pinhole you counteract half of it because the film is always the same distance, and the only darkening you get at the edges is due to the change in the apparent shape of the pinhole. - Original Message - From: ragowaring ragowar...@btinternet.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 2:33 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] Angle of ligh Dear Joao I'm no mathematician but I think you will find that the parts of the film nearest the pinhole will receive a greater amount of light for a given area than parts of the film further away This is because of the inverse square law, which states simply that the radiation falling on a surface from a point source will decrease inversely proportinally with distance by 1/xsquared where x is the distance. This means that for every doubling of the distance from the source, the amount of radiation reaching a given area is quartered (that is because the same radiation has to cover four times the area covered at half the distance). Imagine the area covered by a cone (of radiation if you like) - it is actually easier to imagine this as a four sided pyramid, so I shall continue with this visualisation. The square at the base of the pyramid is 1 square unit. The point of the pyramid is the source. Radiation will reach the base at a given rate, say one unit of radiation per second. If you double the height of the pyramid, which is equivalent to doubling the distance from the source of radiation, you will find that the base of the pyramid is now four times the area of the first pyramid - four squares of one unit each or one big square four times the area. Now come the fun part. The radiation reaching this larger square in a given time is the same as that reaching the 1 unit square at half the distance. That is to say, one unit of radiation per second. But this time that one unit has to cover four times the area as the radiation spreads out. Therefore each square unit at double the distance recieves a quarter of the radiation per second. Therefore a doubling in the distance from a point source of radiation results in one quarter of the radiation falling on one unit area! This explains why on wide angle pinhole photographs, the sides of the negative come out less dense - because they are further away from the pinhole and therefore less light reaches them per given time. It is this per given time that is all important when calculating exposures with focal lengths etc. Now, when the film is parallel to the plane of the pinhole, i.e. at the back of the camera, normally the inverse square law has a small effect, particularly if the angle of acceptance or vision is small. However, if you put the film on the camera side walls, the effect becomes very significant indeed. The parts nearer the pinhole will need a considerably shorter exposure that those further away. This however, can be compensated for if the side wall of the camera are short, that is to say, the camera has a short focal length. Enough of theory, the thing is to EXPERIMEMT! It is so much easier with pictures By the way, the above explanation is an approximation because in real life the base of the pyramid would be curved and not flat, but it is close enought to get the picture - sorry no pun intended Alexis on 12/2/02 5:40 pm, Joao Ribeiro at jribe...@greco.com.br wrote: Thanks Bill and Guillermo for your answers. But ... Geometrically/mathematically speaking, the angle changes when the pinhole diameter changes, the change is so small tho, that in practice you can dismiss it. Since you want to calculate the cone angle, otherwise known as angle of view, here is a formula I just derived that takes the pinhole diameter into consideration: Cone angle = ArcTan [ (D+P) / (2 * B) ] Where D = Diagonal of your film format P = Pinhole diameter B = Bellows extension (or focal length) As you can see, the effect of adding P to D is very small, i.e., for 8x10, D would be equal to about 325mm if you add to that a P of 0.5mm, you get 325.5mm, again, not a big change. The same happens if you change the pinhole diameter. I'm not sure this is the answer to my question. If I could send a drawing attached to the list it would be easier, but this is what I want: I imagine a light entering the box/camera and
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Angle of ligh
When you increase the focal length but leave the negative size the same all you do is decrease the angle of acceptance of the light beam. You sample a smaller portion of the potential image. I can't see how the size of the pinhole would make a difference, except that it casts an optimal potential image that is greater in radius. I figure out these things by drawing them out. I suspect Trigonometry would work but to me that's a dark science, one to which I have not been admitted. - Original Message - From: Joao Ribeiro jribe...@greco.com.br To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Monday, February 11, 2002 6:51 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Angle of ligh Hi folks, I have a question, but I'm not sure I'll be able to put it properly. Here it goes: When the light enters the camera, it enters in an angle the depends on the pinhole diameter or this angle is constant? Imagine I have a pinhole of 0.5 mm. If I make a bellows camera and set it to say 50 mm focal distance using an 8x10 film I'll have a very wide angle image. But if I enlarge the bellows distance to 500 mm I'll then have a telephoto image. Well, actually the image cone will be the same, I'm just choosing a section of the cone farther away from the pinhole or origin, and I am also selecting part of this cone to be recorded. How can I calculate the cone angle? Will changes in the pinhole diameter make any difference in this angle or it will always be constant? I hope I could make myself clear! Thanks in advance for any info, Joao ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] Lull in the conversation
Great image. I'm reminded of some postings here a while ago of trafic and people in times square. I don't care much for zone plate still lifes, but it gives an interesting sort of surrealism to people. - Original Message - From: Mark Interrante m...@interwalk.com To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 9:19 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] Lull in the conversation Hi, Here is something to toss into the lull in our conversation Last year I came across some portraits at the Fraenkel Gallery in SF and was quite moved by them. In the same vein I recently took some Zone Plate photos: http://www.???/discussion/upload/gallery2002.php?cmd=maxstar t=pic=markinterranteclown.jpg Here are the Portraits from the Gallery along with some discussion: http://www.culturevulture.net/ArtandArch/Sugimoto.htm Mark http://www.interwalk.com/pinhole.htm ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
Re: [pinhole-discussion] list is fine (?)
I noticed the lapse also. I think it's happened before on weekends. I thought maybe I'd done something wrong and was being shunned. Nice to know it's not so. - Original Message - From: Ricardo Wildberger Lisboa wildber...@svn.com.br To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 7:00 PM Subject: Re: [pinhole-discussion] list is fine (?) Gregg, As you see I got your message, but nobody else's. Isn't that strange ? God, where's the others ? On 08/02/02 I got no messages. Never saw this happens. Did you receive any ? If the whole list took a nap you shouldn't have received any either; if you had, so the problem maybe was in my provider or a momentary comunication gap between only us, since I received messages from other folks. The feeling now is that the whole cyberspace is only ours ! So, as the night is beautiful here, think I go outside a take some very long exposure shots in old colonial narrow stone paved streets. Ricardo. - Original Message - From: Gregg Kemp gregg.kemp@??? To: pinhole-discussion@p at ??? Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 7:38 PM Subject: [pinhole-discussion] list is fine (?) Hi Ricardo, The list is fine, as far as I know. Sometimes everyone takes a nap around here. :) Maybe you can wake things up? - Gregg At 07:14 PM 2/9/02 -0200, you wrote: Gregg, I don't receive new messages for two days, what's very unusual. Could you please tell me if there's something wrong going on and why ? Indeed I can't live without the list news anymore ! Thanks for your help, Ricardo. _ Pinhole Visions at http://www.??? Worldwide Pinhole Photograhy Day at http://www.pinholeday.org ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/ ___ Post to the list as PLAIN TEXT only - no HTML Pinhole-Discussion mailing list Pinhole-Discussion@p at ??? unsubscribe or change your account at http://www.???/discussion/
[pinhole-discussion] ilfochrome speed etc.
The addresses I wrote only take you to the gallery page. the images are in the 2002 gallery.
