RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Hi Alan, That's great now all I need to do is work out how to use it! I've managed to browse the net and download a later version of Audacity so it's hopeful! John Weller 01380 723235 07976 393631 John, get yourself the free VMWare Player (http://www.vmware.com/products/player/), then go to here (http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/directory/cat/45) and look at the bottom of the page for a free, prebuilt Ubuntu 6.06 Virtual Machine. Play the latter using the former and don't worry about how to install it for the time being. If you bust something, elect not to save changes when closing the virtual machine. Easy. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On 2/5/07, Rick Schummer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You stated in a previous post that you have a Linux box (for most software) and a Windows box (for Fox and Quickbooks), as did Whil, to run your business. I was using your example. Am I remembering wrong? Yeah, or I'm not communicating as well as I should. My blog's subtitle says Mission: Interoperable and while I use (several) Linux and Windows laptops, I also run a desktop Mac. While my goal is to get away from packages that tie me to a single vendor, your suggestion that One Distro To Bind Them All was my solution isn't correct: diversity is a necessary part of a healthy computing industry. Interesting, when I look up monopoly on Dictionary.com, I see your picture in the definition bg I think you misread. It's more likely monotony. ;) . It has been 20-something years since I got my minor in Econ, but I doubt the definition of monopoly really applies to the other computer guy in Contoocook, NH. Hard as it is to believe, there's actually two other Fox development shops in town. My assertion is most normal businesses are not going to put 2 machines on every employees desk in their business so they can do their jobs. I hadn't heard that before. I agree. Yes there are exceptions like meteorologist at NOAA (each has three if I recall correctly). And trading desks. Those folks seem to think five or six screens are some sign of rank! You have two desktops just to run your business (and several others for supporting clients, which is very normal in our business). I have one laptop to develop, keep my books, correspond with clients and associates, do research on the Web, watch movies to relax, and everything else. I have several other machines to support my clients, but my business is run on one machine, and one OS, and this is the norm for general business. I guess I am not following what running your business means to you. I have many machines I operate on. You have many machines you operate on. If you're making the point that my accounting system runs on a different OS than everything else, I'll conceed that's unusual, but not unheard of. Most business users have only one machine on their desktops. However, especially in large businesses, there can be a lot of variation across the business in what that machine is, what it is running and how it is configured. My doctor has a locked-down Windows machine that runs nothing but their practice management app. My dental tech has nothing but her dental scheduling app. The dental receptionist has a DOS-based greenscreen practice management and accounting app (I suspect it might be FoxBase.). Some clients run dedicated 3270 terminal emulation. For all practical purposes, these people are not even running an OS. Most of my clients these days run a machine with a browser, an email client, a word processor, a spreadsheet and a dedicated database application, either rich-client or browser-based. People I know who work with Linux every day. I am sure if you are just using office apps and browsing the web the compatibility is there. But I have friends who have scientific type apps running and they need specific configs (hardware and software). Then we're not talking general-purpose business applications. My friends who run AutoCAD have some pretty funky hardware and software requirements too. But that's not mainstream. Every package has dependencies (like FoxPro's XML functionality needs MS's XML libraries), and some are easier to configure than others. But that's a problem we see bundling up 3rd party ActiveX controls with Windows, too. Actually I only had the SCT-deleting script file run by an employee hours after we told him not to. I think I know him ;) Never with a client. With the SCTs or even deleting the EXE the users are destroying something where I can send them a new copy. If they change the OS under the hood (whether it is an in-house IT department or hired out) I don't get to fix this. I think there is a big difference. I'm sorry, I'm really being dense here. Could you explain again the two cases and the difference you're pointing out. I'm afraid I missed the point. Reminder to self: my point is confusion in the marketplace. This is not a technical issue, it is a business issue. I'd be interested in hearing about your experiences in the marketplace where you run into this confusion and how you address it. I have clients complain well, it's just Windows, why doesn't your software just work on it? when they want a FoxPro app to run on their cell phone. There's confusion! My experience with clients is that their level of cluefulness with Linux is all over the place. Some are not aware their backroom is running it; with some, it is a corporate mission. Some are willing to try a Linux desktop is the office; others reject the idea out of hand. (Many the same ones we've talked about here who had a bad dBASE experience in 1987 and still forbid
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Hohn Weller wrote: Is there a similar sort of book for Linux - a 'Linux for Windows Users' perhaps? I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use; perhaps as a MySQL data server then - who knows? Dabo perhaps? John, get yourself the free VMWare Player (http://www.vmware.com/products/player/), then go to here (http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/directory/cat/45) and look at the bottom of the page for a free, prebuilt Ubuntu 6.06 Virtual Machine. Play the latter using the former and don't worry about how to install it for the time being. If you bust something, elect not to save changes when closing the virtual machine. Easy. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Clever - I'll do that later! Thanks Alan. John Weller 01380 723235 07976 393631 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Alan Bourke Sent: 05 February 2007 09:12 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade Hohn Weller wrote: Is there a similar sort of book for Linux - a 'Linux for Windows Users' perhaps? I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use; perhaps as a MySQL data server then - who knows? Dabo perhaps? John, get yourself the free VMWare Player (http://www.vmware.com/products/player/), then go to here (http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/directory/cat/45) and look at the bottom of the page for a free, prebuilt Ubuntu 6.06 Virtual Machine. Play the latter using the former and don't worry about how to install it for the time being. If you bust something, elect not to save changes when closing the virtual machine. Easy. [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
OK, I got Ubuntu installed, got on my network and the internet, performed 119 updates g, installed Thunderbird, and subscribed to ProLinux. Easy as pie, so far. On to more. Before I move over to ProLinux with this stuff, any interesting, useful, or cool stuff I should try or install? Ken ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
If you are going to be doing HTML stuff, I really like the Quanta+ editor. It's my favorite HTML editor by far! You can get that installed via Synaptic. Kenneth Kixmoeller/fh wrote: OK, I got Ubuntu installed, got on my network and the internet, performed 119 updates g, installed Thunderbird, and subscribed to ProLinux. Easy as pie, so far. On to more. Before I move over to ProLinux with this stuff, any interesting, useful, or cool stuff I should try or install? Ken [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On 2/5/07, Kenneth Kixmoeller/fh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On to more. Before I move over to ProLinux with this stuff, any interesting, useful, or cool stuff I should try or install? It's full of stars. -- Keir Dullea There's too many choices, Ken, I've got to warn you. There are cool tools for everything. Just this morning I installed GIMP to fix up the text on my LUG's logo, Inkscape for some structured drawing work, and pdftk (PDF Tool Kit) to merge a couple of PDFs. Try looking at the question from the other side: what is it you want to do with your computer? The Answers Are Out There. -- Ted Roche Ted Roche Associates, LLC http://www.tedroche.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 5, 2007, at 9:33 AM, Kevin Cully wrote: I really like the Quanta+ editor get that installed via Synaptic. I'll check it out (just as soon as I figure out what Synaptic is.) Thanks Ken ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Kenneth Kixmoeller/fh wrote: OK, I got Ubuntu installed, got on my network and the internet, performed 119 updates g, installed Thunderbird, and subscribed to ProLinux. Easy as pie, so far. On to more. Before I move over to ProLinux with this stuff, any interesting, useful, or cool stuff I should try or install? Point Thunderbird's mail folder to a place on your server so that you can access your mail from your Linux box or your non-Linux box. I wrote up a long dissertation on setting up FC as a dev workstation. The thing needs work, but the back half of the article may be interesting in terms of how I set up my desktop. No icons on the desktop except when I plug a USB thingee in. The panel has icons for... - lock workstation - logout workstation - Show Desktop - Konqueror (file mgr) - Terminal - Firefox - Thunderbird - gFTP (the only gnome thing I run, cuz kde's ftp tools are awful) - OOo - Quanta - Gimp - KIconEdit - Music Player (XMMS) - Kate (God's own editor, along with Whil's own icon, available at www.datamuscle.com.) And on the far right, icons for volume control, a calculator, battery monitor, and the clock. Whil ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Kenneth Kixmoeller/fh wrote: OK, I got Ubuntu installed, got on my network and the internet, performed 119 updates g, installed Thunderbird, and subscribed to ProLinux. Easy as pie, so far. /snicker/ (stage whisper) Hey, guys, we hooked another one! Whil ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
And once you've installed KDE PLEASE install Basket 0.6.0, you won't regret it. Are you trying to help with my point? bg Rick White Light Computing, Inc. www.whitelightcomputing.com www.rickschummer.com 586.254.2530 - office 586.254.2539 - fax ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
This concept of having a choice is definitely bad. Too many choices! Stop! Make them stop! Just tell me what to do. I don't want to have to decide!! gdrfRS I am not saying choice is bad and you know that. What I am saying is it is confusing the marketplace. I don't want to return to the days of TI99/4a vs. Atari vs. Commadore vs. TRS80 vs. every other mom and pop computer manufacturer. You had to make a choice on the OS and the machine. You always had to compromise and not get all the software you wanted to run because certain software only ran on certain platforms. This is what is so good with the two standards (WinTel and Apple) that emerged. I have no problem with Linux existing and competing. I have problem with too many Linuxes to pick from. I just visited the Detroit Auto Show a couple of weeks ago. I am in the market to replace my car when my lease expires in July. I have simple requirements, but the same manufacturer (GM) has the same vehicle under Chevy, Buick, Saturn, and GMC. Confusion in the marketplace, which means I have to hunt down a solution that should be simple. The prices for these vehicles are nearly the same so this is not an economic benefit to the consumer. The vehicles are identical except for a little difference in the grills and nameplate. Not that choosing a car is anything like choosing an operating system, but I am sure you recognize the similarities of the situation. Users should not have to hunt down the an OS from literally dozens of choices. Most are not qualified to make this choice. It costs money and is simply a mine field waiting for you to make the wrong choice. The issue is compatibility. I need software to run my business. Lets look at your case and Ted's case as it has been documented on this list. You literally need two operating systems and two machines to run your businesses. In my opinion, that is nuts. I know *why* you are doing it, and I know you would like to be down to one. It is not costly in your case because you are one person. Even in Ted's case where there are two people it is not so bad. But most (95% is a safe guess) businesses are not going to do this for all their employees. Not cost effective. So now the company firmly chooses Linux over the Windows platform. Great. Which one do they choose? I can ask a dozen different consultants and get 20 different answers. Software package A runs great on Fedora and not on others. Package B needs Ubuntu or any other distro, but is not supported by Fedora. Or worse, GUI 1 vs. GUI 2 from a compatibility point of view breaks different vertical market apps. Are users going to deal with this? No. Do I want to deal with this? Not in a million years. Worse yet, I try to deploy my Linux solution at a large company and I find out because the source is open and their IT department decided to tweak it, my app is broken. Slim possibility, but it can happen. The same thing can be said with Windows 2000/XP/Vista - I know, I am living it. PITA - period. Billions of dollars will be wasted. This is why I predict we will literally see a freeze in the marketplace. IT departments will choose to stay exactly where they are. This could be both good and bad. Good because today's software works on today's OS and I have the tools to solve the pain they are feeling. Bad because it will stifle innovation in their business, and is a short term fix to a long term problem because hardware will breakdown and OS patches will be cut off at some point (another problem I think is out of control). Worse yet, vertical market product creators have to start to decide who they will abandon and this is just not good for any business who counts on their software. I prefer a solid standard I can recommend to my clients so everyone wins. With Windows I have fewer choices with decent compatibility, and documented differences so the mine field is easier to navigate. I believe the world of Linux can benefit from fewer choices if it is hoping for greater mindshare in the business world and home markets. I am not saying choice is bad. Rick White Light Computing, Inc. www.whitelightcomputing.com www.rickschummer.com 586.254.2530 - office 586.254.2539 - fax ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 5, 2007, at 10:26 AM, Whil Hentzen (Pro*) wrote: (stage whisper) Hey, guys, we hooked another one! Yeah -- I'm already trying to figure out when I can take the time to move it from over there (where I stuck my old computer) when I built the new one, to over here where I can pl, er, work with it more. Involves crawling behind my desk to get my old W98 machine and move *it* over there first. I hope the L box won't have any problem with my KVM switch... KEn ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 5, 2007, at 11:31 AM, Rick Schummer wrote: And once you've installed KDE PLEASE install Basket 0.6.0, you won't regret it. Are you trying to help with my point? bg Was your point that there are a whole lot of really cool tools available for Linux that can make you as productive as in any other OS? If so, point taken. http://basket.kde.org/ -- Ed Leafe -- http://leafe.com -- http://dabodev.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 5, 2007, at 10:05 AM, Ted Roche wrote: Try looking at the question from the other side: what is it you want to do with your computer? The Answers Are Out There. Just work, which is 90% PHP/MySQL and HTML right now. The only play stuff involves family photos movies. I suppose newsgroups, too. There must be other stuff I do... Ken ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On 2/5/07, Rick Schummer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not that choosing a car is anything like choosing an operating system, but I am sure you recognize the similarities of the situation. All the cars run the same gasoline. All the Linuxes run the same kernel. Most cars have a similar UI: dashboard, steering wheel, etc. All the same software runs on all of the Linux distros, and much of it runs on Windows and OSX, too. It's a choice of what kind of trim you like, what your brand affiliation is, and which dealer has the best service. Users should not have to hunt down the an OS from literally dozens of choices. Drivers should not have to pick from literally dozens of car brands. Most are not qualified to make this choice. Most are not qualified to make the choice of cars. They refer to experts, reviews, Consumer Reports, what their friends recommend. It costs money and is simply a mine field waiting for you to make the wrong choice. Welcome to the free market. The issue is compatibility. I need software to run my business. Lets look at your case and Ted's case as it has been documented on this list. You literally need two operating systems and two machines to run your businesses. In my opinion, that is nuts. I know *why* you are doing it, and I know you would like to be down to one. Please don't speak for me.I don't want to be down to one. That would be a monopoly and a monotony. I have nine machines running in the office. I support clients running WIndows 2000, XP, 2003, Ubuntu, CentOS, OS X, Fedora and RedHat. Diversity is *NOT* a bad thing. I drive a Subaru. She drives a Toyota. The kid has a Nissan. We can all still get along. But most (95% is a safe guess) businesses are not going to do this for all their employees. Not cost effective. That's a false assertion. Most businesses have several OSes running in house. Many businesses are supporting Windows 2000 and XP and 2003 and PocketPC (every one's different!) and Blackberries and incompatible laptops from a couple manufacturers. Some run OS X and Linux, too. So now the company firmly chooses Linux over the Windows platform. Few do this. Most choose to recognize there is a benefit in running a heterogenous environment. That doesn't mean some extreme anyone-can-do-anything situation, but a more realistic view that different people can run the OS they prefer and the apps they prefer without bringing the enterprise crashing down. I can ask a dozen different consultants and get 20 different answers. Software package A runs great on Fedora and not on others. Package B needs Ubuntu or any other distro, but is not supported by Fedora. This really isn't the case. Very, very few apps run differently on one than another. Apps written to use the KDE environment run on a GNOME desktop and vice versa. Who's feeding you this FUD? Some (very few) vendors specify platforms on which they will support their apps. Many standardize on RedHat or SuSE. One on Unbreakable Linux (ha!). A skilled technician should be able to support a customer's need to run any app on whichever OS they need. Same could be said for an MCSE and Windows. Worse yet, I try to deploy my Linux solution at a large company and I find out because the source is open and their IT department decided to tweak it, my app is broken. Slim possibility, but it can happen. You've never had a client delete all the .SCT files because those were virus-carrying VB Script scrap files, eh? All of my clients get FoxPro source, but run EXEs. Why would you think this would be different in Linux? Billions of dollars will be wasted. So, in other words, nothing changes. If you don't think that *BILLIONS* of dollars will be wasted rolling out Vista to customers who have absolutely no need for 99% of the features, you're not living in the same world I am. This is why I predict we will literally see a freeze in the marketplace. Yeah, Whil says it's pretty cold on his side of Lake Michigan... IT departments will choose to stay exactly where they are. And since MS isn't going to be selling or supporting their legacy OSes any more, how are they going to do that? Bad because it will stifle innovation in their business, and is a short term fix to a long term problem because hardware will breakdown and OS patches will be cut off at some point (another problem I think is out of control). Worse yet, vertical market product creators have to start to decide who they will abandon and this is just not good for any business who counts on their software. Sounds like SNAFU to me. So, while your IT is freezing on what they have, what happens with the smart little companies that are pushing ahead with innovative Ruby-on-Rails, LAMP-based, SOA, buzzterm-of-the-day applications that eat your customer's lunches? I prefer a solid standard I can recommend to my clients so everyone wins. Sounds like you ought to become an RHCE! With Windows I have fewer choices Like
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Please don't speak for me.I don't want to be down to one. That would be a monopoly and a monotony. I was not speaking *for* you Ted. You stated in a previous post that you have a Linux box (for most software) and a Windows box (for Fox and Quickbooks), as did Whil, to run your business. I was using your example. Am I remembering wrong? Interesting, when I look up monopoly on Dictionary.com, I see your picture in the definition bg. It has been 20-something years since I got my minor in Econ, but I doubt the definition of monopoly really applies to the other computer guy in Contoocook, NH. That's a false assertion. Most businesses have several OSes running in house. Many businesses are supporting Windows 2000 and XP and 2003 and PocketPC (every one's different!) and Blackberries and incompatible laptops from a couple manufacturers. Some run OS X and Linux, too. My assertion is not false. Your example is way different than mine. My assertion is most normal businesses are not going to put 2 machines on every employees desk in their business so they can do their jobs. Yes there are exceptions like meteorologist at NOAA (each has three if I recall correctly). It has nothing to do with scenarios like Windows desktops and Linux servers (or vice-versa) performing different functions in the business environment. You have two desktops just to run your business (and several others for supporting clients, which is very normal in our business). I have one laptop to develop, keep my books, correspond with clients and associates, do research on the Web, watch movies to relax, and everything else. I have several other machines to support my clients, but my business is run on one machine, and one OS, and this is the norm for general business. This really isn't the case. Very, very few apps run differently on one than another. Apps written to use the KDE environment run on a GNOME desktop and vice versa. Who's feeding you this FUD? People I know who work with Linux every day. I am sure if you are just using office apps and browsing the web the compatibility is there. But I have friends who have scientific type apps running and they need specific configs (hardware and software). I don't consider it FUD, I consider it fact and experience. I have other friends who have a different line of business and they would never think of mixing different distros into their environment because they work differently. So I can listen to you and them and know my experience could be one or the other or both. I doubt any are spreading FUD. You've never had a client delete all the .SCT files because those were virus-carrying VB Script scrap files, eh? All of my clients get FoxPro source, but run EXEs. Why would you think this would be different in Linux? Actually I only had the SCT-deleting script file run by an employee hours after we told him not to. Never with a client. With the SCTs or even deleting the EXE the users are destroying something where I can send them a new copy. If they change the OS under the hood (whether it is an in-house IT department or hired out) I don't get to fix this. I think there is a big difference. Same case exists in Windows with errant drivers being loaded. Again, I am not picking on Windows or Linux. Reminder to self: my point is confusion in the marketplace. This is not a technical issue, it is a business issue. If you don't think that *BILLIONS* of dollars will be wasted rolling out Vista to customers who have absolutely no need for 99% of the features, you're not living in the same world I am. Don't worry Ted, we live in the same world. I have already stated Vista is going to be a pain in the support neck too. I have also stated that Windows and the different platforms create headaches. I am not bashing Linux. Rick White Light Computing, Inc. www.whitelightcomputing.com www.rickschummer.com 586.254.2530 - office 586.254.2539 - fax ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Which version? http://joyoftech.com/joyoftech/joyarchives/915.html mrgmhale wrote: Too many choices! Stop! Make them stop! Just tell me what to do. I don't want to have to decide!! Use Windows Vista in a new PC. No Brainer g... Gil ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Someone is reprogramming the matrix! ;) PabloSr --- Value, above all, persons, not things! Peace. Sobre todo, valora personas, no cosas! Paz. --- * -Original Message- * [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chet Gardiner * Subject: Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade * * Which version? * * http://joyoftech.com/joyoftech/joyarchives/915.html * * mrgmhale wrote: * * Too many choices! Stop! Make them stop! Just tell me what to do. I * don't want to have to decide!! * * * Use Windows Vista in a new PC. No Brainer g... * * Gil ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
I found Whil's book on using MySQL with VFP excellent. Is there a similar sort of book for Linux - a 'Linux for Windows Users' perhaps? I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use; perhaps as a MySQL data server then - who knows? Dabo perhaps? John Weller 01380 723235 07976 393631 Let me know if I can help. October/November last year was (finally!) switchover time and (other than QuickBooks and FoxPro support) I've been 100% Linux and Mac since then. It's not so hard once you take the plunge, but support from your friends certainly helps. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
John, I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use... This is absolutely the primary roadblock for large scale adoption of Linux in my opinion. Installing and configuring the operating system needs to be easy before the average user is going to change their machine. I have talked to many really smart and technical people over the last five years who have struggled and even failed to get Linux installed. I watched at Whilfest one night when there was the Linux install party, and the experts struggled and even failed on several boxes. Back in the day (less than five years ago) the average distro was too complicated, and it was intentional. Yes, I believe the Linux distro folks wanted it to be hard so it would not have a massive adoption. Kind of like a secret club kids create with only their friends. It is getting much better today. I watched as my son set me up a Linux box and it was really not all that difficult. If the distros get easier to install then it will be adopted faster. The new problem is actually a byproduct of the freedom we all hear with respect to Linux. There are too many choices which is confusing to the marketplace in my opinion. Rick White Light Computing, Inc. www.whitelightcomputing.com www.rickschummer.com 586.254.2530 - office 586.254.2539 - fax ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Hi Rick, I have been playing with Kubuntu and Ubuntu and found them very easy to install - but I didn't seem to have any control over where everything went. I assume that they were placed in the 'correct' places but then some of the comments here about where to locate apps and data made me wonder g. I have very fixed ideas of how I want a Windows machine laid out based on 15 years experience (or however long since Windows 3 came out) but don't know if they translate to Linux. I've no doubt I'll learn more as soon as I get the toy I'm promising myself to play with Linux on and can get my son to help me set it up - that really makes me feel old! It doesn't seem 5 minutes since I was helping him set his train set up (although it's probably nearly 30 years). John Weller 01380 723235 07976 393631 This is absolutely the primary roadblock for large scale adoption of Linux in my opinion. Installing and configuring the operating system needs to be easy before the average user is going to change their machine. I have talked to many really smart and technical people over the last five years who have struggled and even failed to get Linux installed. I watched at Whilfest one night when there was the Linux install party, and the experts struggled and even failed on several boxes. Back in the day (less than five years ago) the average distro was too complicated, and it was intentional. Yes, I believe the Linux distro folks wanted it to be hard so it would not have a massive adoption. Kind of like a secret club kids create with only their friends. It is getting much better today. I watched as my son set me up a Linux box and it was really not all that difficult. If the distros get easier to install then it will be adopted faster. The new problem is actually a byproduct of the freedom we all hear with respect to Linux. There are too many choices which is confusing to the marketplace in my opinion. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 4, 2007, at 6:47 AM, John Weller wrote: I found Whil's book on using MySQL with VFP excellent. Is there a similar sort of book for Linux - a 'Linux for Windows Users' perhaps? I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use; perhaps as a MySQL data server 1) Go to ubuntu.com 2) Click the Download link, and download the latest version. 3) Burn it to a CD. 4) Boot the computer you want to install it on from the CD. It will bring you to the Ubuntu desktop. Assuming that you have DHCP available, your connection should already be set. 5) Click on the 'Applications' menu, and go to Internet/Firefox. Try out Firefox - not all that different than the Windows version, eh? 6) From the same menu you can try out Evolution mail. Personally, I prefer Thunderbird, but Evolution might be better for someone used to Outlook. 7) Now that you understand that Linux apps aren't so different, double-click the 'Install' icon on the desktop. 6) Follow the installation steps. If you've ever successfully installed Windows, this will be much, much easier, and should not take very long. 7) Boot from the HD. Log in. 8) From the 'System' menu, select 'Administration/Synaptic Package Manager'. This is how you add/remove software from your system. 9) Let's say you want to install Thunderbird. Click 'Search', and type in 'Thunderbird'. One of the entries you'll get is 'mozilla- thunderbird'. Right-click on it, and select 'Mark for Installation'. If it asks about dependencies, just click 'OK'. 10) Click 'Apply'. In a short while you will have Thunderbird installed. That's it! then - who knows? Dabo perhaps? No need to wait for Linux to start with Dabo. Dabo runs equally well on Windows, Mac or Linux. -- Ed Leafe -- http://leafe.com -- http://dabodev.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Rick Schummer wrote: John, I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use... This is absolutely the primary roadblock for large scale adoption of Linux in my opinion. Installing and configuring the operating system needs to be easy before the average user is going to change their machine. I have talked to many really smart and technical people over the last five years who have struggled and even failed to get Linux installed. I watched at Whilfest one night when there was the Linux install party, and the experts struggled and even failed on several boxes. Back in the day (less than five years ago) the average distro was too complicated, and it was intentional. Yes, I believe the Linux distro folks wanted it to be hard so it would not have a massive adoption. Kind of like a secret club kids create with only their friends. I still see the only way it will happen is via the workplace. Now getting a trained staff that is M$ certified to jump ship over to Linux is not that easy. How do you secure the mail across the company/enterprise. Getting replacement software for Exchange and how it does so much for an organization. Notes is in the same boat but being it's IBM maybe they have the Linux version and I'm not aware of it. I hade a long conversation with a vp / network admin and he went into detail on what the holes were and how he couldn't feel comfortable with what was available at the time, 2004. Stephen Russell DBA / .Net Developer Memphis TN 38115 901.246-0159 A good way to judge people is by observing how they treat those who can do them absolutely no good. ---Unknown http://spaces.msn.com/members/srussell/ -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.24/668 - Release Date: 2/4/2007 1:30 AM ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Hi Ed, Thanks for that. I've already done steps 1 to 5 on an old laptop but gave up as the laptop was a P2 and just not man enough for the job. I hope to acquire another, more powerful machine, in a few weeks and try again. I was very impressed with the ease of use of Kubuntu. The problem is - what is the significance of the svr, bin, etc folders. When I write an OO document where do I save it? If I want to edit it where do I find it again? I have no doubt that once I make a start a lot of this will become clear - it would just be nice if I could find a suitable book written for Windows users that will explain it all in terms that I am familiar with ( and, yes, I know Linux is not Windows g). Can anyone recommend one? John Weller 01380 723235 07976 393631 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ed Leafe Sent: 04 February 2007 14:24 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade On Feb 4, 2007, at 6:47 AM, John Weller wrote: I found Whil's book on using MySQL with VFP excellent. Is there a similar sort of book for Linux - a 'Linux for Windows Users' perhaps? I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use; perhaps as a MySQL data server 1) Go to ubuntu.com 2) Click the Download link, and download the latest version. 3) Burn it to a CD. 4) Boot the computer you want to install it on from the CD. It will bring you to the Ubuntu desktop. Assuming that you have DHCP available, your connection should already be set. 5) Click on the 'Applications' menu, and go to Internet/Firefox. Try out Firefox - not all that different than the Windows version, eh? 6) From the same menu you can try out Evolution mail. Personally, I prefer Thunderbird, but Evolution might be better for someone used to Outlook. 7) Now that you understand that Linux apps aren't so different, double-click the 'Install' icon on the desktop. 6) Follow the installation steps. If you've ever successfully installed Windows, this will be much, much easier, and should not take very long. 7) Boot from the HD. Log in. 8) From the 'System' menu, select 'Administration/Synaptic Package Manager'. This is how you add/remove software from your system. 9) Let's say you want to install Thunderbird. Click 'Search', and type in 'Thunderbird'. One of the entries you'll get is 'mozilla- thunderbird'. Right-click on it, and select 'Mark for Installation'. If it asks about dependencies, just click 'OK'. 10) Click 'Apply'. In a short while you will have Thunderbird installed. That's it! then - who knows? Dabo perhaps? No need to wait for Linux to start with Dabo. Dabo runs equally well on Windows, Mac or Linux. -- Ed Leafe -- http://leafe.com -- http://dabodev.com [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Treason! g -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ted Roche Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 7:32 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade On 2/3/07, Kenneth Kixmoeller/fh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fabulous! (I gotta get there, too.) Let me know if I can help. October/November last year was (finally!) switchover time and (other than QuickBooks and FoxPro support) I've been 100% Linux and Mac since then. It's not so hard once you take the plunge, but support from your friends certainly helps. -- Ted Roche Ted Roche Associates, LLC http://www.tedroche.com [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Another treasonist g!!! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Whil Hentzen (Pro*) Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 8:25 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade Ted Roche wrote: On 2/3/07, Kenneth Kixmoeller/fh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fabulous! (I gotta get there, too.) Let me know if I can help. October/November last year was (finally!) switchover time and (other than QuickBooks and FoxPro support) I've been 100% Linux and Mac since then. It's not so hard once you take the plunge, but support from your friends certainly helps. I've taken the step of turning my Windows machine off when I'm not using it. It stays off for days when I'm not doing Fox or, like Ted, end of the month finances. Whil [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 4, 2007, at 9:45 AM, John Weller wrote: Thanks for that. I've already done steps 1 to 5 on an old laptop but gave up as the laptop was a P2 and just not man enough for the job. I hope to acquire another, more powerful machine, in a few weeks and try again. Without a GUI, Linux can indeed run on some weak hardware, but the GUI requirements of any OS put the same load on a machine. If the machine would run XP slowly, it will probably run Ubuntu slowly, too. I was very impressed with the ease of use of Kubuntu. The problem is - what is the significance of the svr, bin, etc folders. I have no idea about 'srv'. 'bin' is usually used for the binary files used by the OS; 'etc' is where the configuration files are kept. BTW, I've always wondered: what is the significance of the WINNT folder in my Windows 2000 machine? What is the difference between its System and System32 folders? What registry keys go in HKEY_CURRENT_CONFIG? You might actually know all of the above, but I'll guarantee you that 99% of people who use Windows everyday wouldn't even understand the question. My point is that you don't need to know all that stuff to get started. When I write an OO document where do I save it? If I want to edit it where do I find it again? All users have a home directory, located in /home/username. That's yours to organize however you like. I typically have a 'documents' directory for stuff like OOo files; I have a 'dls' folder where I have Firefox place downloaded files (I *hate* crap on my desktop!); I have a 'projects' directory where I keep my Dabo projects, etc. IOW, all of 'your' stuff belongs in your home directory. I have no doubt that once I make a start a lot of this will become clear - it would just be nice if I could find a suitable book written for Windows users that will explain it all in terms that I am familiar with ( and, yes, I know Linux is not Windows g). Can anyone recommend one? I personally never used one; instead I just started playing around and reading stuff on the web. But I see that Hentzenwerke has a couple of books: _ Linux Transfer for Windows Power Users_ http://www.hentzenwerke.com/catalog/ltpu.htm _Linux Transfer for Network Admins_ http://www.hentzenwerke.com/catalog/ltnet.htm I haven't read either, so I can't recommend them beyond the usual excellent quality of Hentzenwerke publications. -- Ed Leafe -- http://leafe.com -- http://dabodev.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 4, 2007, at 10:03 AM, mrgmhale wrote: Another treasonist g!!! That's 'traitor'. ;-) Interesting how your posts are just a few words instead of your usual paragraph upon paragraph. Maybe that injury is a good thing!! gdrvvvf! -- Ed Leafe -- http://leafe.com -- http://dabodev.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Another treasonist g!!! That's 'traitor'. ;-) Still better than being branded a Terrorist Sympathizer by the current administration and the lemmings that follow in its wake in the interest of job or career preservation. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ed Leafe Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 10:05 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade On Feb 4, 2007, at 10:03 AM, mrgmhale wrote: Another treasonist g!!! That's 'traitor'. ;-) Interesting how your posts are just a few words instead of your usual paragraph upon paragraph. Maybe that injury is a good thing!! gdrvvvf! -- Ed Leafe -- http://leafe.com -- http://dabodev.com [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
John Weller wrote: I found Whil's book on using MySQL with VFP excellent. Is there a similar sort of book for Linux - a 'Linux for Windows Users' perhaps? I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use; perhaps as a MySQL data server then - who knows? Dabo perhaps? We've got a couple of books on setting up Linux as well (Linux Transfer for Windows Power Users) - but even before that, check out the 'whitepapers' under resources that will give you a jump start. They're a bit dated; perhaps two years old, but installation and config have only improved since then. Whil ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
John Weller wrote: Hi Ed, Thanks for that. I've already done steps 1 to 5 on an old laptop but gave up as the laptop was a P2 and just not man enough for the job. I hope to acquire another, more powerful machine, in a few weeks and try again. I was very impressed with the ease of use of Kubuntu. The problem is - what is the significance of the svr, bin, etc folders. When I write an OO document where do I save it? If I want to edit it where do I find it again? /home/username/whateverDirectoryYouCreate/Document.doc Where '/' is your main directory (your HD) and 'home' is the directory where all the users have their private directories in which every application will create a dir of it's own for that user's preferences and other stuff (these dirs will usually start with a '.' which makes them 'invisible' dirs). I have no doubt that once I make a start a lot of this will become clear - it would just be nice if I could find a suitable book written for Windows users that will explain it all in terms that I am familiar with ( and, yes, I know Linux is not Windows g). Can anyone recommend one? John Weller 01380 723235 07976 393631 ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Rick Schummer wrote: John, I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use... This is absolutely the primary roadblock for large scale adoption of Linux in my opinion. Installing and configuring the operating system needs to be easy before the average user is going to change their machine. I have talked to many really smart and technical people over the last five years who have struggled and even failed to get Linux installed. I watched at Whilfest one night when there was the Linux install party, and the experts struggled and even failed on several boxes. Back in the day (less than five years ago) the average distro was too complicated, and it was intentional. Yes, But four years ago is a long, long time. Heck, you could even produce a whole new operating system in that amount of time. Oh, wait, cancel that last remark. You have to remember that at installfest, people were bringing machines that (1) were really old or off the beaten track in one way or another, or (2) machines that they'd already had problems with. I'd argue that we could have a similar 'virusfest' in which even the experts would say, nope, can't uninstall norton on this one - you're going to have to reformat. In fact, isn't that the battle cry of many Windows admins when a machine gets hosed even now? Much less four years ago? I believe the Linux distro folks wanted it to be hard so it would not have a massive adoption. Kind of like a secret club kids create with only their friends. Totally agree. And even now, many mailing lists have their share of arrogant snots. We in the Fox world who grew up on FoxForum are rather spoiled. s It is getting much better today. I watched as my son set me up a Linux box and it was really not all that difficult. If the distros get easier to install then it will be adopted faster. The new problem is actually a byproduct of the freedom we all hear with respect to Linux. There are too many choices which is confusing to the marketplace in my opinion. Yes, I go into a grocery store, or a car dealership, or a shoe store, or a toy store, and I am really pissed off at all the choices. If there was only one brand of soda, and one make of car, and one type of shoe, it would make my life so much better, so much less confusing. I wouldn't have to suffer through all the needless advertising I see everywhere, and prices would be so much lower because companies wouldn't have to spend money on marketing. You know, the same thing goes for religion. If there was just one religion that we all had to practice, then think of all of the needless killing and problems that could be averted This concept of having a choice is definitely bad. Whil ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On 2/4/07, John Weller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I found Whil's book on using MySQL with VFP excellent. Is there a similar sort of book for Linux - a 'Linux for Windows Users' perhaps? I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use; perhaps as a MySQL data server then - who knows? Dabo perhaps? First, welcome to the bright side. I've been mulling writing a FLOSSPro [1] book the essential guide for Windows programmers learning Linux for years, but I can't make a viable business case for it. Not because there isn't interest - there's tremendous demand - but because of the changing nature of the computer trade book industry. That, and the subject is infinitely broad and deep. There are already dozens of books out there, too, and I want to avoid a superficial treatment of the material. As others have indicated, installation is just like Windows. If your hardware is compatible, hitting Enter a dozen times results in a successful installation. If your hardware is not compatible, stop now. Just like Windows. Hardware compatibility is much better than it was a year ago, and the geometric progression is only getting better. It's worth Googling around a bit to ensure the hardware you'd like to use will be easy to install. A local LUG or a good LUG mailing list is enormously helpful. My local group just was discussing recommendations for motherboards, for example. Start with any of the more popular distros (Ubuntu, Fedora Core or OpenSuSE) and installation is usually easy and support readily available. Read the help files. Ask questions on mailing lists (ProLinux is good and the folks there quite friendly). Google questions and error message. The Answers Are Out There. Enjoy. Ask questions. Good luck. [1] http://radio.weblogs.com/0117767/stories/2005/03/28/flossproTheEssentialGuideF.html -- Ted Roche Ted Roche Associates, LLC http://www.tedroche.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Thanks to all - I've just ordered Linux Transfer for Windows Power Users from Amazon here in UK. I notice that the cover and ISBN are the same but the author is Martin Brown whereas on Whil's site he is shown as the author - is this a plot to confuse the Brits? John Weller 01380 723235 07976 393631 We've got a couple of books on setting up Linux as well (Linux Transfer for Windows Power Users) - but even before that, check out the 'whitepapers' under resources that will give you a jump start. They're a bit dated; perhaps two years old, but installation and config have only improved since then. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
I would recommend any book by Marcel Gagne on Linux - 'Moving to Linux' is a goody, and there are several others, from beginners to system administrators. See Amazon ... Marcel writes a column in Linux Journal magazine - I've subscribed for years ... He lives in Mississauga, and has a unique writing style ! D/L burn a CD - better still, the DVD (lots more software) - of Knoppix. http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/index-en.html It's a live DVD that you can boot into, run Knoppix without touching your hard drive ! If you want to install it on the disk, it's a one line command as root .. # knoppix-installer enter follow the sequence of questions - automatic ! Been using Knoppix for years - seems to be the best of a bunch of live versions. -- ..bobp http://www.prosumers.ca http://bpatterson.qhealthbeauty.com http://apatterson2.qhealthzone.com ---orig.- On Sunday 04 February 2007 11:47, John Weller wrote: I found Whil's book on using MySQL with VFP excellent. Is there a similar sort of book for Linux - a 'Linux for Windows Users' perhaps? I need something which will advise me on how to set a machine from scratch for basic email and word processing use; perhaps as a MySQL data server then - who knows? Dabo perhaps? John Weller 01380 723235 07976 393631 Let me know if I can help. October/November last year was (finally!) switchover time and (other than QuickBooks and FoxPro support) I've been 100% Linux and Mac since then. It's not so hard once you take the plunge, but support from your friends certainly helps. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
John Weller wrote: Thanks to all - I've just ordered Linux Transfer for Windows Power Users from Amazon here in UK. I notice that the cover and ISBN are the same but the author is Martin Brown whereas on Whil's site he is shown as the author - is this a plot to confuse the Brits? Amazon sometimes has issues with updating their info. Yes, I wrote it, after Martin kinda bailed on me. Whil John Weller 01380 723235 07976 393631 We've got a couple of books on setting up Linux as well (Linux Transfer for Windows Power Users) - but even before that, check out the 'whitepapers' under resources that will give you a jump start. They're a bit dated; perhaps two years old, but installation and config have only improved since then. [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 3, 2007, at 6:31 PM, Ted Roche wrote: Let me know if I can help Thank you so much. I have been promising myself to do it for a good long while. I am downloading Ubuntu as we speak and following this conversation. Ken ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 4, 2007, at 9:19 AM, Whil Hentzen (Pro*) wrote: If there was just one religion that we all had to practice... Well, according to some in here ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
...Burning the Ubuntu CD The machine I'm going to install it on is my prior development machine. (Straining to remember RAM, Processor, etc.) I know that the hard disk that is in there has some old crap on it. Can I run a utility from the Ubuntu CD to reformat it, or should I do it some other way first? (Does Knoppix have a utility for that?) Ken ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 4, 2007, at 3:18 PM, Kenneth Kixmoeller/fh wrote: I know that the hard disk that is in there has some old crap on it. Can I run a utility from the Ubuntu CD to reformat it, or should I do it some other way first? (Does Knoppix have a utility for that?) IIRC, you get the option of installing to the free space on the disk (if any), or reformatting. -- Ed Leafe -- http://leafe.com -- http://dabodev.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 4, 2007, at 2:18 PM, Ed Leafe wrote: IIRC, you get the option of installing to the free space on the disk (if any), or reformatting. You did RC. It is reformatting at this moment. Ah, it is done... Installing... (Amazing what stuff you can get done at home on a -7℉ day.) Ken ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Linux offers some additional options for weak hardware as well. Ubuntu has a nice smaller cousin named Xubuntu that runs nicely on PIIIs. For PIIs, you might want to try out Damn Small Linux (aka DSL) or Peanut Linux. I haven't tried Peanut Linux in a while, but DSL makes old hardware just sing. -Kevin Ed Leafe wrote: Without a GUI, Linux can indeed run on some weak hardware, but the GUI requirements of any OS put the same load on a machine. If the machine would run XP slowly, it will probably run Ubuntu slowly, too. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Kevin Cully wrote: Linux offers some additional options for weak hardware as well. Ubuntu has a nice smaller cousin named Xubuntu that runs nicely on PIIIs. For PIIs, you might want to try out Damn Small Linux (aka DSL) or Peanut Linux. I haven't tried Peanut Linux in a while, but DSL makes old hardware just sing. Too many choices! Stop! Make them stop! Just tell me what to do. I don't want to have to decide!! gdrfRS Whil ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Whil Hentzen (Pro*) wrote: Kevin Cully wrote: Linux offers some additional options for weak hardware as well. Ubuntu has a nice smaller cousin named Xubuntu that runs nicely on PIIIs. For PIIs, you might want to try out Damn Small Linux (aka DSL) or Peanut Linux. I haven't tried Peanut Linux in a while, but DSL makes old hardware just sing. Too many choices! Stop! Make them stop! Just tell me what to do. I don't want to have to decide!! gdrfRS Whil And once you've installed KDE PLEASE install Basket 0.6.0, you won't regret it. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On 2/4/07, Whil Hentzen (Pro*) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Too many choices! Stop! Make them stop! Just tell me what to do. I don't want to have to decide!! I'm sorry, Whil, there's no turning back now. Windows, in an attempt to be more like Open Source, has added one feature to Vista: choice. All the other features, WinFS, an improved security model, a better printer driver model, all had to be cut. But MS tenaciously hung on to the one last feature: choice. Well, there's the home version, the Pro version, the Mediocre version, the Ultimate Limited Version, the Corporate Ultimate Unlimited versions, the MSDN version, the version we show to the feds, the version we offer to the EU, and the special version just for Whil Hentzen. Too many choices. Sorry, Whil. -- Ted Roche Ted Roche Associates, LLC http://www.tedroche.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Too many choices! Stop! Make them stop! Just tell me what to do. I don't want to have to decide!! Use Windows Vista in a new PC. No Brainer g... Gil -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Whil Hentzen (Pro*) Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 7:41 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade Kevin Cully wrote: Linux offers some additional options for weak hardware as well. Ubuntu has a nice smaller cousin named Xubuntu that runs nicely on PIIIs. For PIIs, you might want to try out Damn Small Linux (aka DSL) or Peanut Linux. I haven't tried Peanut Linux in a while, but DSL makes old hardware just sing. Too many choices! Stop! Make them stop! Just tell me what to do. I don't want to have to decide!! gdrfRS Whil [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
[NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
http://www.degredo.net/ -- Ted Roche Ted Roche Associates, LLC http://www.tedroche.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On Feb 3, 2007, at 9:01 AM, Ted Roche wrote: http://www.degredo.net/ Fabulous! (I gotta get there, too.) Ken ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Excellent! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ted Roche Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 10:02 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade http://www.degredo.net/ -- Ted Roche Ted Roche Associates, LLC http://www.tedroche.com [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On 2/3/07, Kenneth Kixmoeller/fh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fabulous! (I gotta get there, too.) Let me know if I can help. October/November last year was (finally!) switchover time and (other than QuickBooks and FoxPro support) I've been 100% Linux and Mac since then. It's not so hard once you take the plunge, but support from your friends certainly helps. -- Ted Roche Ted Roche Associates, LLC http://www.tedroche.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
Ted Roche wrote: On 2/3/07, Kenneth Kixmoeller/fh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fabulous! (I gotta get there, too.) Let me know if I can help. October/November last year was (finally!) switchover time and (other than QuickBooks and FoxPro support) I've been 100% Linux and Mac since then. It's not so hard once you take the plunge, but support from your friends certainly helps. I've taken the step of turning my Windows machine off when I'm not using it. It stays off for days when I'm not doing Fox or, like Ted, end of the month finances. Whil ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] The Ultimate Vista Upgrade
On 2/3/07, Whil Hentzen (Pro*) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've taken the step of turning my Windows machine off when I'm not using it. It stays off for days when I'm not doing Fox or, like Ted, end of the month finances. It's really quite... liberating. -- Ted Roche Ted Roche Associates, LLC http://www.tedroche.com ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
