[pygame] pygame website - the non-Django team.
*___** _ _ __ ___ _ _ || \ \\ // \ //\ ||\/| /|\ || | \\ /|| // \|| \ / | || |--/ \\_/ ||==//\ || \/ | ||| **|**| || |||| // \ || | || **|**| || \/ //\ || | \=/ *. *o* *r* *g* - taking the C++ out of game development. - the web isn't just text and databases. - taking the framework out of webs. there is already another team working on a 'django' based remake of the pygame website. As mentioned here: http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/34a561e3ac7ebc26/ed32b7f3d1f20688 and here: http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/872f0751729c8176/208a966e5470d891 we are also working on a new pygame.org website! This email describes the non-django teams effort. A little competition is never bad, and each code base should be still useful for other projects even if it doesn't get used for pygame.org May the best website win! *=** = **The Plan.** **= * *=** * *~ Stage one(1)*: - rewrite current site in python using existing templates. - Using python, *pygame*, mysql, cherrypy, ffmpeg, sqlalchemy, pygments, feedparser, lxml, and likely formencode/formalchemy/nicks formlib. - incorporate small features from long standing todo list into the rewrite. - start design of new website as we go. Using moch ups, and design by Daniel Jones http://daniel.poweredbybees.com/ (portfolio link http://daniel.poweredbybees.com/ http://f0o.com/%7Edaniel/), (illume) Rene, (pymike), (akalias) Nicholas, and - getting feedback from community. - Daniel will send moch-ups to mailing list for review and crits. - use knowledge from redoing existing website in the design of the new website. Development is just starting in svn: http://code.google.com/p/pygame/source/browse/#svn/branches/w A code layout something like this... run_game.py run_tests.py lib/db.py lib/cherrypy lib/sqlalchemy lib/ public_html/ public_html/skins/ public_html/shots/ Will include the database (with all personal details removed) as sql. sqllite for development, and mysql on the real server. Since python comes with sqllite, people won't need to set up mysql to make changes. Including cherrypy, and sqlalchemy so people don't need to install them separately. It's the same layout used by many pygames especially skellington based pyweek games. *~ Stage two(2):* - implement new features and design. - open up to other developers. Current todo list (as collected from pygame.org/wiki/todo): - feed(rss, atom) for wiki recent changes. - Menu to use alternating background colours - to make it easier to read. - Optional email notification on project change, including release and comment. A per user, per project option. - Nicer urls for projects. eg projects/512/zanthor/ - detect tabs in code blocks, and convert to spaces. Either ask to convert to 4 or 8 spaces, or do some magic to figure out how many spaces. - Browsing projects in more ways. By ranking, by date. - Spotlight projects changeable from management area. - Fix website for looking ok in 800x600 resolution - the header does not scale down well. ** *= Stage X: Making an API usable from the cmd line. = * The idea is to include this inside of pygame. So that people can interact with the community from inside their programs - using the pygame library. pygame.org.news.latest() pygame.org.docs.comment(pygame.transform.scale) pygame.org.projects.latest() pygame.org.projects.comment(project_id) pygame.org.projects.new() pygame.org.projects.release(my_project_info) pygame.org.coolstuff() Other ideas include: - easy uploading/including of screencasts (eg, youtube videos of game play, rather than static screenshots). - making distributing games easier... provide tools to allow uploading releases to other websites. *___ _ _ __ ___ _ _ || \ \\ // \ //\ ||\/| /|\ || | \\ /|| // \|| \ / | || |--/ \\_/ ||==//\ || \/ | ||| || || |||| // \ || | || || || \/ //\ || | \=/ * - now with colorful ascii art. -- | We love♥ the real Django... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Django_Reinhardt |
Re: [pygame] pygame website - the non-Django team.
Is it because just you want to do it or you didn't liked current goings on of the django-based development. if you didn't liked development of django site you should point it out so it stops if general discussion is at same opinion. i think this is what behaviour should be. i never say it's a bad thing and you shouldn't do it because it's nice you want pygame.org become better and i'm not the one to decide on that but you. but there are points i didn't liked. people will give efforts on this projects and there is one goal at the end for the both teams. i don't join the idea *each code base should be still useful for other projects even if it doesn't get used for pygame.org*. it's not like developing a game. team that loses won't reach into anything and all efforts they do will be ruined. i want to highlight again that i don't mean you shouldn't do it and i don't feel like we will win or lose. i'm just worried about one of the teams(not only us) efforts will be wasted and nobody said us we will compete when it was starting. excuse me but i also felt like some django hate on that message. 2009/5/25 René Dudfield ren...@gmail.com *___** _ _ __ ___ _ _ || \ \\ // \ //\ ||\/| /|\ || | \\ /|| // \|| \ / | || |--/ \\_/ ||==//\ || \/ | ||| **|**| || |||| // \ || | || **|**| || \/ //\ || | \=/ *. *o* *r* *g* - taking the C++ out of game development. - the web isn't just text and databases. - taking the framework out of webs. there is already another team working on a 'django' based remake of the pygame website. As mentioned here: http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/34a561e3ac7ebc26/ed32b7f3d1f20688 and here: http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/872f0751729c8176/208a966e5470d891 we are also working on a new pygame.org website! This email describes the non-django teams effort. A little competition is never bad, and each code base should be still useful for other projects even if it doesn't get used for pygame.org May the best website win! *=** = **The Plan.** **= * *=** * *~ Stage one(1)*: - rewrite current site in python using existing templates. - Using python, *pygame*, mysql, cherrypy, ffmpeg, sqlalchemy, pygments, feedparser, lxml, and likely formencode/formalchemy/nicks formlib. - incorporate small features from long standing todo list into the rewrite. - start design of new website as we go. Using moch ups, and design by Daniel Jones http://daniel.poweredbybees.com/ (portfolio link http://daniel.poweredbybees.com/ http://f0o.com/%7Edaniel/), (illume) Rene, (pymike), (akalias) Nicholas, and - getting feedback from community. - Daniel will send moch-ups to mailing list for review and crits. - use knowledge from redoing existing website in the design of the new website. Development is just starting in svn: http://code.google.com/p/pygame/source/browse/#svn/branches/w A code layout something like this... run_game.py run_tests.py lib/db.py lib/cherrypy lib/sqlalchemy lib/ public_html/ public_html/skins/ public_html/shots/ Will include the database (with all personal details removed) as sql. sqllite for development, and mysql on the real server. Since python comes with sqllite, people won't need to set up mysql to make changes. Including cherrypy, and sqlalchemy so people don't need to install them separately. It's the same layout used by many pygames especially skellington based pyweek games. *~ Stage two(2):* - implement new features and design. - open up to other developers. Current todo list (as collected from pygame.org/wiki/todo): - feed(rss, atom) for wiki recent changes. - Menu to use alternating background colours - to make it easier to read. - Optional email notification on project change, including release and comment. A per user, per project option. - Nicer urls for projects. eg projects/512/zanthor/ - detect tabs in code blocks, and convert to spaces. Either ask to convert to 4 or 8 spaces, or do some magic to figure out how many spaces. - Browsing projects in more ways. By ranking, by date. - Spotlight projects changeable from management area. - Fix website for looking ok in 800x600 resolution - the header does not scale down well. ** *= Stage X: Making an API usable
Re: [pygame] pygame website - the non-Django team.
On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 3:43 AM, orcun avsar orc@gmail.com wrote: Is it because just you want to do it or you didn't liked current goings on of the django-based development. if you didn't liked development of django site you should point it out so it stops if general discussion is at same opinion. i think this is what behaviour should be. i never say it's a bad thing and you shouldn't do it because it's nice you want pygame.org become better and i'm not the one to decide on that but you. but there are points i didn't liked. people will give efforts on this projects and there is one goal at the end for the both teams. i don't join the idea *each code base should be still useful for other projects even if it doesn't get used for pygame.org*. it's not like developing a game. team that loses won't reach into anything and all efforts they do will be ruined. i want to highlight again that i don't mean you shouldn't do it and i don't feel like we will win or lose. i'm just worried about one of the teams(not only us) efforts will be wasted and nobody said us we will compete when it was starting. excuse me but i also felt like some django hate on that message. hello, I never got a response from you, or jug when I talked about it a couple of weeks ago here: http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/872f0751729c8176/208a966e5470d891?pli=1 The coding on the django based website started without discussion finishing. There was a discussion with some different view points, and you just didn't seem to care and began the website, ignoring them anyway. Then I didn't have any option but to start a website myself. I told you in other threads I was making one, and that there had been a plan to make one since January. Again, neither you or jug responded. http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/fedcce866a7725fc/e4dfb2854a5013a1?lnk=gstq=website#e4dfb2854a5013a1
Re: [pygame] pygame website - the non-Django team.
Hi, The coding on the django based website started without discussion finishing. There was a discussion with some different view points, and you just didn't seem to care and began the website, ignoring them anyway. Then I didn't have any option but to start a website myself. Well, there was no progress in discussion any more. And why do you have to start an own project when we start? Do you think Django is rubbish or why can't you just let us (keen students) do our project even if its not part of GSoC? Do you have to give proof of sth.? Do you have nothing better to do (like me :))? I think, we've got to a pretty nice intermediate, so why do you have to start a competitive project instead of helping us with testing, design, Trac etc. so we get one perfect website that all back and not 2 good ones and so. has to decide who's work will be appreciated and who's not. I told you in other threads I was making one, and that there had been a plan to make one since January. Again, neither you or jug responded. http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/fedcce866a7725fc/e4dfb2854a5013a1?lnk=gstq=website#e4dfb2854a5013a1 http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/fedcce866a7725fc/e4dfb2854a5013a1?lnk=gstq=website#e4dfb2854a5013a1 If it was so clear that you will write the website since January, why was it a point on GSoC list and why don't you have already started? (Would you write your own page even if it was a GSoC project? What's the difference now?) And since we used the pygame svn repo at google and the at the beginning introduced webiste/Trac everyone could always notice what we were doing and we don't come back from nowhere surprisingly. We telled your our plans and did that thus far whereas it's a bit curious to me that you check in your competitive product just a few hours after our fist preview release. Julian
Re: [pygame] pygame website - the non-Django team.
there was too many messages on that topic, i was following yours and marcus's messages on that topic because you were mentors for the GSoC. i don't think everybody would ever come together at the same thought because it's a matter of choice that chosing which framework to use. i lastly red marcus's message which he was saying that he trusts us and i thought it and stop following that thread because so many messages were comparing django and cherrypy. i didn't like it. i missed your last message sorry for that. If it was so clear that you will write the website since January, why was it a point on GSoC list and why don't you have already started? (Would you write your own page even if it was a GSoC project? What's the difference now?) i think jug touched a good point. i first red marcus's or your message saying we can start our gsoc projects even if we didn't selected than when jug mailed to list. i decided to join. we never forced to do it. i wasn't thinking you will start to do it because it was on GSoC list and you were mentor and reviewed our proposals for that project.when i sent my proposal you seemed like you liked it. if you plan to do it, you shouldn't have let us spread our times for our gsoc proposals. sorry for little nervy behaviours. 2009/5/26 René Dudfield ren...@gmail.com On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 3:43 AM, orcun avsar orc@gmail.com wrote: Is it because just you want to do it or you didn't liked current goings on of the django-based development. if you didn't liked development of django site you should point it out so it stops if general discussion is at same opinion. i think this is what behaviour should be. i never say it's a bad thing and you shouldn't do it because it's nice you want pygame.orgbecome better and i'm not the one to decide on that but you. but there are points i didn't liked. people will give efforts on this projects and there is one goal at the end for the both teams. i don't join the idea *each code base should be still useful for other projects even if it doesn't get used for pygame.org*. it's not like developing a game. team that loses won't reach into anything and all efforts they do will be ruined. i want to highlight again that i don't mean you shouldn't do it and i don't feel like we will win or lose. i'm just worried about one of the teams(not only us) efforts will be wasted and nobody said us we will compete when it was starting. excuse me but i also felt like some django hate on that message. hello, I never got a response from you, or jug when I talked about it a couple of weeks ago here: http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/872f0751729c8176/208a966e5470d891?pli=1 The coding on the django based website started without discussion finishing. There was a discussion with some different view points, and you just didn't seem to care and began the website, ignoring them anyway. Then I didn't have any option but to start a website myself. I told you in other threads I was making one, and that there had been a plan to make one since January. Again, neither you or jug responded. http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/fedcce866a7725fc/e4dfb2854a5013a1?lnk=gstq=website#e4dfb2854a5013a1
Re: [pygame] pygame website - the non-Django team.
hello, On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 9:18 AM, jug j...@fantasymail.de wrote: Hi, The coding on the django based website started without discussion finishing. There was a discussion with some different view points, and you just didn't seem to care and began the website, ignoring them anyway. Then I didn't have any option but to start a website myself. Well, there was no progress in discussion any more. And why do you have to start an own project when we start? Do you think Django is rubbish or why can't you just let us (keen students) do our project even if its not part of GSoC? Do you have to give proof of sth.? Do you have nothing better to do (like me :))? I tried to talk with you, but you didn't listen, and went ahead on your own. You didn't respond to my email letting you know I'll be working on an alternative project either. Again, there were efforts on a new website before you started. Phil prepared the existing website source code to be released, and I have been working on design and planning. I think, we've got to a pretty nice intermediate, so why do you have to start a competitive project instead of helping us with testing, design, Trac etc. so we get one perfect website that all back and not 2 good ones and so. has to decide who's work will be appreciated and who's not. It's great that you've got your website going, however it's not the direction I'm interested in. It seems you've done a good job at it, and it looks like it's going to turn into a very good website. You just started working on your code, and didn't respond to my concerns. That's not the way to try and work together from my perspective. Perhaps if you'd waited, and we came to some sort of agreement we could have worked together. I told you in other threads I was making one, and that there had been a plan to make one since January. Again, neither you or jug responded. http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/fedcce866a7725fc/e4dfb2854a5013a1?lnk=gstq=website#e4dfb2854a5013a1 http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/fedcce866a7725fc/e4dfb2854a5013a1?lnk=gstq=website#e4dfb2854a5013a1 If it was so clear that you will write the website since January, why was it a point on GSoC list and why don't you have already started? (Would you write your own page even if it was a GSoC project? What's the difference now?) The website projects were not selected for GSOC. I don't control what goes on that list, and I didn't put it there. Anyone can place things on that gsoc ideas list. There was a start, as mentioned in the other emails I sent to you. http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/34a561e3ac7ebc26/ed32b7f3d1f20688 And since we used the pygame svn repo at google and the at the beginning introduced webiste/Trac everyone could always notice what we were doing and we don't come back from nowhere surprisingly. We telled your our plans and did that thus far whereas it's a bit curious to me that you check in your competitive product just a few hours after our fist preview release. Julian yes, and I told you a couple of times I'd be working on one too... weeks ago. http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/fedcce866a7725fc/e4dfb2854a5013a1?lnk=gstq=website#e4dfb2854a5013a1 I also released the current website source to the mailing list weeks ago... http://groups.google.com/group/pygame-mirror-on-google-groups/browse_thread/thread/58ecbc11953f5c6/56ff133bf7378ccc Anyone can work on whatever they want. You do whatever you like, and I'll work on a separate website project. Each project can of course be used by other websites other than pygame... there's thousands of open source projects out there who'd like a good website. There's also a lot of work which can be shared between the two... like the mapping of the existing database that we've done... for migrating old data over - and many other things. Our website is likely to be licenced LGPL like pygame... to keep it simple. Using the licences of the various other components we use. Another reason to work on it is to learn - so as we make these websites, we can learn about them. So I'm not at all worried if our (the non-django teams) website isn't used as the pygame website. So far your website looks, and works better... our website-game just returns 'lalala'. I wish you well in your efforts.
Re: [pygame] pygame website - the non-Django team.
On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 10:45 AM, orcun avsar orc@gmail.com wrote: i think jug touched a good point. i first red marcus's or your message saying we can start our gsoc projects even if we didn't selected than when jug mailed to list. i decided to join. we never forced to do it. i wasn't thinking you will start to do it because it was on GSoC list and you were mentor and reviewed our proposals for that project.when i sent my proposal you seemed like you liked it. if you plan to do it, you shouldn't have let us spread our times for our gsoc proposals. Hello, You did have a good proposal, however I suggested you submit a different proposal. I made that point repeatedly on the mailing list. We had many projects to select from - around 30 different proposals. I'm sorry that you spent time on your proposal, or if the message wasn't clear enough. Different people were interested in different projects, and proposals. We tried our hardest to get as many of the pygame proposals accepted as possible - and got the most out of any python projects under the PSF. Most other projects only got 1 accepted. Unfortunately the whole proposal process wastes a lot of peoples time... but not completely... as proposal writing is a good skill to practice. I didn't make the point that you can work on projects even if not selected, and wasn't really comfortable with that point being made. However, of course people can work on whatever they like. You of course, are free to do whatever you like - including continuing to work on your website. Just because I'm working on one, doesn't mean you can't too. sorry for little nervy behaviours.
