date:20200102

These doohickeys. 

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 9:44:47 PM UTC-8, Joe Bernard wrote:
> Nope, it's a base that sits on top of the Paul base, then the Silver shifter 
> sits on that.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Still deciding whether you folks are a good influence or a bad influence...

2020-01-02 Thread Ed Fausto

Thanks for the "Tacx T4415 Cartridge Tool" tip.
Will definitely get one for my tool kit.
It's definitely a bugger to remove specially if the threads of the bottom
bracket were not chased before installation.

On Fri, Jan 3, 2020 at 1:28 PM Benz, Sunnyvale, CA 
wrote:

> On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 5:41:04 PM UTC-8, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>> Two notes about your frame.
>>
>> 1. Those BBs are (I believe, I don't think Mark would do that) installed
>> in Taiwan and they are indeed a BUGGER to remove.
>>
>>
> If your square taper Shimano-splined BB is hard to remove, try this
> . It
> holds the splines together firmly and doesn't allow them to slip.
>
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> 
> .
>

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[RBW] Re: Silver2 shifters on downtube?

Nope, it's a base that sits on top of the Paul base, then the Silver shifter 
sits on that. 

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[RBW] Re: Triple Threat Goop

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 5:35:15 PM UTC-8, Mark Roland wrote:
>
> If anybody bought more than one and would like to share the love and start 
> the new year in the positive karma column, please send one my way (off 
> line). You will be handsomely rewarded. Happy New Year!
>

I can't believe the new goop sold out already! The description 

 
alludes to "future batches", so there's some hope still for those of us who 
missed out! 

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[RBW] Re: 1/1/20 Blahg

I don't think he's right about the return of dt shifters. I would also contest 
his contention that manual shift is making a comeback in sports cars; there's a 
stalwart few who never abandoned them, but I'm not seeing a mad rush back in 
that area. Dual-clutch semi-autos with paddle shifters are not the car 
equivalent of downtubers. 

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[RBW] Re: Silver2 shifters on downtube?

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 4:26:14 PM UTC-8, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Will told me it needs the adapter, same as for the long Silvers.


Isn't the adaptor for transforming the original Silver shifters from 
bar-end to downtube this part 
?
 
I did the switch for a friend (long Silvers kept poking her thigh or 
something) and that was the only extra I bought.

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[RBW] Re: Still deciding whether you folks are a good influence or a bad influence...

The bummer is the seatpost Riv sources in Taiwan. I'll bet money that sucker is 
actually 26.7, they all require being cranked down hard and I've had several 
that still slipped anyway. The Nitto 26.8 in both types Riv sells are 
physically bigger posts. 

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[RBW] Re: Still deciding whether you folks are a good influence or a bad influence...

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 5:41:04 PM UTC-8, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Two notes about your frame. 
>
> 1. Those BBs are (I believe, I don't think Mark would do that) installed 
> in Taiwan and they are indeed a BUGGER to remove. 
>
>
If your square taper Shimano-splined BB is hard to remove, try this 
. It 
holds the splines together firmly and doesn't allow them to slip.

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[RBW] Rack choice for Wald basket on a Hillborne

2020-01-02 Thread Jeffrey B

If it’s a canti-Sam the nitto 32f is a perfect fit, just bolt on and go. If 
sidepull, a marks rack is the way to go. I have a lightly used 32f if you are 
interested.

Jeff

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[RBW] Rack choice for Wald basket on a Hillborne

2020-01-02 Thread Randall Rupp


I've got a Sam Hillborne and a Wald basket (medium) that I had rigged up 
with a Racktime front rack.  That combo proved problematic so I ditched the 
Racktime rack.  What are the better front rack alternatives for the Wald 
basket?  Is the Mark's rack good for the Wald baskets?

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[RBW] Re: Still deciding whether you folks are a good influence or a bad influence...

2020-01-02 Thread Timothy Hurley

+1 on the soda can shim. That’s a bummer about the seat tube.

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[RBW] Re: 1/1/20 Blahg

2020-01-02 Thread Mark Roland

Interesting. While it would still be necessary to market friction shifting 
and long chainstays and rim brakes in contrast to what is on most other 
bicycles, you would really focus on the skills and the connection between 
the rider and the bicycle and the environment. I've long been interested in 
technology and energy, and how these forces affect economic and social 
structures. In the past, over on IBob,  I've referred to Ivan Illich's *Tools 
For Conviviality*. to make a few different points about bicycles. In 
relation to the most recent Blagh post, the first chapter, Two Watersheds, 
is relevant.

The institution of health care/medicine is used as an example (and has only 
gained in its prescience and accuracy, unfortunately!), but the example of 
the development of the slant parallelogram in the early 70s (watershed 1, 
solving a real issue and greatly improving the performance of the bicycle 
drive train) and the onslaught of indexing systems in the early-mid 80s 
(watershed 2, where the "improvements" are minimal, and the benefit mainly 
goes to the purveyor of the more complex, more interdependent system, not 
the user) By the mid nineties, with the advent of suspension systems, disc 
brakes, carbon fiber, increasing specialization of equipment, clothing, 
etc., watershed 2 for bicycle design was definitely reached. Anyone 
interested in reading this chapter, or the whole book, can find it here: 
https://arl.human.cornell.edu/linked%20docs/Illich_Tools_for_Conviviality.pdf

A quote from *Tools For Conviviality* that seems apropos to Grant's current 
blog:

"Tools are intrinsic to social relationships. An individual relates himself 
in action to his society through the use of tools that he actively masters, or 
by which he is passively acted upon. To the degree that he masters his tools, 
he can invest the world with his meaning; to the degree that he is mastered by 
his tools, the shape of the tool determines his own self-image.Convivial 
tools are those which give each person who uses them the greatest opportunity 
to enrich the environment with the fruits of his or her vision. Industrial 
tools deny this possibility to those who use them and they allow their 
designers 
to determine the meaning and expectations of others. Most tools today 
cannot be used in a convivial fashion."

While I'm hogging bandwidth with lengthy quotes and little original 
thought, here is another take on the matter, from another big thinker:

"Our souls as well as our bodies are composed of individual elements which 
were all already present in the ranks of our ancestors. The “newness” in 
the individual psyche is an endlessly varied recombination of age-old 
components. Body and soul therefore have an intensely historical character 
and find no proper place in what is new , in things that have just come 
into being. That is to say, our ancestral components are only partly at 
home in such things. We are very far from having finished completely with 
the Middle Ages, classical antiquity, and primitivity, as our modern 
psyches pretend.


Nevertheless, we have plunged down a cataract of progress, which sweeps us 
on into the future with ever wilder violence the farther it takes us from 
our roots. Once the past has been breached, it is usually annihilated, and 
there is no stopping the forward motion. But it is precisely the loss of 
connection with the past, our uprootedness, which has given rise to the 
“discontents” of civilisation and to such a flurry and haste that we live 
more in the future and its chimerical promises of a golden age than in the 
present, with which our whole evolutionary background has not yet caught up.






* We rush impetuously into novelty, driven by a mounting sense of 
insufficiency, dissatisfaction, and restlessness. We no longer live on what 
we have, but on promises, no longer in the light of the present day, but in 
the darkness of the future, which, we expect, will at last bring the proper 
sunrise. We refuse to recognise that everything better is purchased at the 
price of something worse; that, for example, the hope of greater freedom is 
cancelled out by increased enslavement to the state, not to speak of the 
terrible perils to which the most brilliant discoveries of science expose 
us. The less we understand of what our fathers and forefathers sought, the 
less we understand ourselves, and thus we help with all our might to rob 
the individual of his roots and his guiding instincts, so that he becomes a 
particle in the mass, ruled only by what Nietzsche called the spirit of 
gravity. Reforms by advances, that is, by new methods or gadgets, are of 
course impressive at first, but in the long run they are dubious and in any 
case dearly paid for. They by no means increase the contentment or 
happiness of people on the whole. Mostly, they are deceptive sweetenings of 
existence, like speedier communications, which unpleasantly accelerate the 
tempo of life and leave us with less

[RBW] Re: Silver2 shifters on downtube?

Unfortunately not anymore. Paul Components used to make one but they 
discontinued it, right now there's no way to get Silvers on Pauls unless you 
can find used adapters. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Saddle Position Question

2020-01-02 Thread Andrew Nussbaum

I had never read Peter's article. Very helpful. Thanks for sharing!

And I have some homework from Deacon Patrick!

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[RBW] Re: Still deciding whether you folks are a good influence or a bad influence...

2020-01-02 Thread Jim M.

I have a slipping post on my new Clem too. Vince told me a 27 won't fit. He 
said they could knurl the post to fix the problem. Luckily they're just 
down the street from me so I'm going to stop by and let them knurl away. 
Give them a call. They'll help.

jim m
wc, ca

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[RBW] Re: Silver2 shifters on downtube?

2020-01-02 Thread lambbo

Joe I’m behind on all this - is there an adapter? I looked around and can’t 
find it. Thanks!

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[RBW] Re: Still deciding whether you folks are a good influence or a bad influence...

2020-01-02 Thread Ed Carolipio

Grats on the bikes. On the seatpost, you can try using an aluminum soda can 
as a shim to fill the gap without having to get a new seat post. (Others 
may have ideas on thin shimming materials as well.) Also, "carbon assembly 
paste" can help get stiction between the tube/shim/seatpost to help with 
slippage. They're available in trial (one shot) sizes from bike shops that 
sell CF bikes.

--Ed C.

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Re: [RBW] 1/1/20 Blahg

2020-01-02 Thread Eric Daume

They’re hard to wheelie?

Grant belittles a “playful” mountain bike in this post, but getting the
front end up to get over an obstacle, or just to have fun, is part of
mountain biking.

My Jones LWB is a very capable mountain bike, but it’s noticeably harder to
loft the front than a shorter stayed bike. I can’t recall even trying to
wheelie my Clem.

Oh, and they take two chains.

Eric

On Thursday, January 2, 2020, Benz, Sunnyvale, CA 
wrote:

> On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 1:55:08 PM UTC-8, masmojo wrote:
>>
>> Second, I think this whole long wheelbase thing is getting completely out
>> of hand. I agree that a super short wheelbase is sort of overkill, but
>> there's no reason a Clem should have the wheelbase it does. In fact all
>> sorts of reasons it shouldn't. I can say that, not as someone whose never
>> ridden a long wheelbase Rivendell, but as someone who owns two! (Formerly
>> three!)…
>>
>
> I've only scant experience with the LWB bikes, having built a couple or
> three for a friend (so have to do shakedown rides), and riding the MIT
> Atlantis one time at RBWHQ. I didn't really find anything objectable with
> them at all, and the only remarkable challenge I saw was fitting a LWB into
> a car. They rode similar to other Rivendell bikes (of which I have four) –
> stable and predictable. So what didn't you like about your LWB bikes? Given
> that handling is more than the sum of its parts, how did you come to
> attribute any difference solely to the LWB?
>
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> 
> .
>

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Re: [RBW] Triple Threat Goop

2020-01-02 Thread David Bivins

I'd like to think I have some positive karma because I ONLY bought one :)

On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 8:35 PM Mark Roland  wrote:

> If anybody bought more than one and would like to share the love and start
> the new year in the positive karma column, please send one my way (off
> line). You will be handsomely rewarded. Happy New Year!
>
> --
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> 
> .
>

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[RBW] Still deciding whether you folks are a good influence or a bad influence...

Two notes about your frame. 

1. Those BBs are (I believe, I don't think Mark would do that) installed in 
Taiwan and they are indeed a BUGGER to remove. 

2. Your seattube isn't too big, your post is too small. I've had a few of those 
MIT frames with the slipping post problem and each was solved by a 26.8 Nitto. 
At this point I consider those frames to come with a temporary post. You need 
Nitto!

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[RBW] Triple Threat Goop

2020-01-02 Thread Mark Roland

If anybody bought more than one and would like to share the love and start 
the new year in the positive karma column, please send one my way (off 
line). You will be handsomely rewarded. Happy New Year!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Saddle Position Question

2020-01-02 Thread Curtis McKenzie

The best words of 2020:

Holy Grail, baby..if you aren't thinking about how the saddle feels, it
works!
   •Joe Bearnard

Thanks Joe,

Curtis


On Thu, Jan 2, 2020, 4:40 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Yes, I would agree with Patrick the Deacon. I discovered my way-up tilt by
> accident after it slipped on a ride and I decided to just put up with it
> until I got home. By the time I got there I realized it felt weird at
> first, then I completely forgotten about my saddle. That's the Holy Grail,
> baby..if you aren't thinking about how the saddle feels, it works!
>
> --
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> .
>

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[RBW] Re: Saddle Position Question

Yes, I would agree with Patrick the Deacon. I discovered my way-up tilt by 
accident after it slipped on a ride and I decided to just put up with it until 
I got home. By the time I got there I realized it felt weird at first, then I 
completely forgotten about my saddle. That's the Holy Grail, baby..if you 
aren't thinking about how the saddle feels, it works! 

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[RBW] Re: 1/1/20 Blahg

2020-01-02 Thread Ron Mc

As Grant well pointed out, SunTour lives on in every derailleur made 
today.  




In 1988, even Campy bit the bullet and copied SunTour






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[RBW] Re: Saddle Position Question

2020-01-02 Thread 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch

A quick way to test the concept of nose up/down is to set it to an extreme 
up position, ride it and get as used to it as you can for a few blocks, 
then half the angle down and see if that's better or worse. Keep halving as 
desired, so the incrimental change is less and less, riding them a bit 
longer as it gets more dialed in. Only change one aspect at a time (so do 
the same thing with fore/aft adjustment, but only after you have the angle 
at least close to where you want it and ride it for a while.). 

I find this approach to comfort adjustments better than the death by wee 
changes approach, where I can 't tell if it's improved or not. 

With abandon,
Patrick

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 9:41:29 AM UTC-7, Andrew Nussbaum wrote:
>
> I'm in the process of dialing in the fit on my Toyo Atlantis 
>  and am in need of the 
> group's advice on saddle positioning. I'm using albatross bars for a more 
> upright position--a choice which I've come to love.  But when I sit more 
> upright, I'm noticing that I slide "down" on my B17 saddle. I have 
> positioned the saddle to be parallel to the ground, with perhaps a slight 
> upward tilt.  I'd like my sit bones to be resting on the rear of the 
> saddle.  Should I simply give the saddle a more upward tilt?  Any thoughts 
> are welcome.  
>

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[RBW] Re: 1/1/20 Blahg

Now - since Benz mentioned it - transporting long Rivs in/on cars is a whole 
'nother matter. My quite long Chevy Impala with big trunk and fold-down rear 
seats swallows a 45cm Clem L with the front wheel off easily. My recent 52 Clem 
H, not so much. That bike was big! 

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[RBW] Re: Silver2 shifters on downtube?

Will told me it needs the adapter, same as for the long Silvers. 

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[RBW] Re: Silver2 shifters on downtube?

2020-01-02 Thread lambbo

Has anyone tried to mount the new Silver shifters on a Paul bar 
thumb-shifter mount?  

On Friday, December 6, 2019 at 8:08:52 PM UTC-5, Wyatt wrote:
>
> Has anyone mounted the Silver2 shifters on a downtube yet? Curious to see 
> how that looks and works.

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[RBW] Re: 1/1/20 Blahg

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 1:55:08 PM UTC-8, masmojo wrote:
>
> Second, I think this whole long wheelbase thing is getting completely out 
> of hand. I agree that a super short wheelbase is sort of overkill, but 
> there's no reason a Clem should have the wheelbase it does. In fact all 
> sorts of reasons it shouldn't. I can say that, not as someone whose never 
> ridden a long wheelbase Rivendell, but as someone who owns two! (Formerly 
> three!)…
>

I've only scant experience with the LWB bikes, having built a couple or 
three for a friend (so have to do shakedown rides), and riding the MIT 
Atlantis one time at RBWHQ. I didn't really find anything objectable with 
them at all, and the only remarkable challenge I saw was fitting a LWB into 
a car. They rode similar to other Rivendell bikes (of which I have four) – 
stable and predictable. So what didn't you like about your LWB bikes? Given 
that handling is more than the sum of its parts, how did you come to 
attribute any difference solely to the LWB?

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[RBW] Re: 1/1/20 Blahg

It is my understanding that Riv frames are the one product they sell as many of 
as they can make. The Roadini was an exception and it had shorter stays than 
the other stuff, I don't think Grant's longbikes are a marketing issue. 

I love Silver Power Ratchet shifters but they do indeed belong in the 
simple/fixie category of bikes you don't shift much..a thing Grant has promoted 
since way back in the Bstone days. When I use them I tend to stay in a 
particular gear longer and just grind it or coast down because hunting for 
gears with friction can be more bother than it's worth. This works great for me 
- especially on my eClem which hardly needs to be shifted - but as masmojo says 
wouldn't be great on hilly dirt rides. If I bought a Gus/Susie it would get a 
1x indexed drivetrain, my custom will have one Silver shifting two rings up 
front. 

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[RBW] Re: 1/1/20 Blahg

2020-01-02 Thread Bill Lindsay

masmojo said index shifting is indispensable for mountain biking, but said 
he doesn't like trigger shifters. 

What do you use on your mountain bike(s) if you don't use trigger 
shifters?  Grip shift?  

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 1:55:08 PM UTC-8, masmojo wrote:
>
> Well, I love Grant and he's right a lot of the time about a lot of things, 
> but it's my personal belief is index shifting ain't one of them.
> I really don't think index shifting was intended for "lazy" people. I 
> never really appreciated index shifting until I started riding mountain 
> bikes; and honestly in that context especially, it's indispensable. When 
> you drop down into a gully or a roller and you need  a lower gear to get 
> out then what you used to get in, you've got to RAPIDLY  move through the 
> gears to get to the one you need! There's no time to feel it through. 
> Additionally,  if you can have index shifting, then why wouldn't you? I 
> have plenty of bikes with friction shifting and in a general sense it's 
> fine, but it's a tool to shift gears; very simple that. Index or not why is 
> it even a talking point? Last night I changed the Dia Compe friction 
> shifter off my Atlantis & installed a new MicroShift bar con. So now I have 
> index; yeah!
> This wasn't so much to get index as it was to get a bar con, because the 
> old shifter was down tube mounted which I find to be a pain most of the 
> time.
> OK, that said where does one draw the line. Problem is shifting quickly 
> went from 7 speed thumb shifters to the push-push trigger monstrosities. 
> Those I absolutely don't dig very much! Why, because they don't really 
> bring anything to the game, they don't improve anything, in fact they 
> create problems, because they are fragile, wear quickly & break! But, maybe 
> that's the idea? Planned obsolescence.
>
> Second, I think this whole long wheelbase thing is getting completely out 
> of hand. I agree that a super short wheelbase is sort of overkill, but 
> there's no reason a Clem should have the wheelbase it does. In fact all 
> sorts of reasons it shouldn't. I can say that, not as someone whose never 
> ridden a long wheelbase Rivendell, but as someone who owns two! (Formerly 
> three!) Unfortunately, I have no way to make a head to head comparison, 
>  but I feel pretty safe postulating that I'd love my Medium Clementine more 
> if the chainstays were 3/4 shorter. Which I should add; would still be 
> considered long.
> I am sorry if I come off contrarian; I am not in favor of change for 
> changes sake and there's loads of "technical Improvements" in the bike 
> industry that make me ask why? But in the last 10 years I've probably 
> bought 10 bikes; the Only ones that didn't have threadless 
> stearers/headsets, Disc Brakes, etc. Have been Rivendells; I didn't buy the 
> Rivendells because they didn't have those things, but in spite of them not 
> having those things. As a former bike mechanic and person who wrenches my 
> own bikes, I recognize an improvement over pointless gadgetry. I've 
> recently bought not one, but two bikes with thru-axles and I can honestly 
> say I dig'em a lot! Prior to that a good vertical drop out was my favorite, 
> but these thru-axles are undoubtedly an improvement. 
> Anywayz, I realize I'm tilting at windmills here, but there's a certain 
> amount of catharsis.
>

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Re: [RBW] Appreciation for my 1998 LongLow

Thanks, Andrew. Perhaps there's more difference between a Riv Road standard
and a LongLow than I had thought. Again, thanks for the ride post.

On Wed, Jan 1, 2020 at 11:39 AM BSWP  wrote:

> Patrick,
>
> I am guessing less than 10,000 miles on the oldest parts. I do lots of
> short rides, and a few long rides. The hubs feel smooth and solid, as does
> the Phil bottom bracket. Headset with rollers on the bottom is smooth,, no
> notchiness. The rides are very different, QuickBeam is... quick to turn,
> and less forgiving on bumps. The LongLow has round forks, not ovalized, and
> they flex more. It's a very forgiving ride, made all the more so with the
> 35mm Compass tires.
>
> - Andrew
>
> On Wednesday, January 1, 2020 at 7:09:04 AM UTC-8, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>> Kudos on the trip and the photos. Curious: how many miles on the Phil
>> hubs, and have you had to replace the bearings? I have Phils on my '99 Riv
>> Road (replaced the bearings proactively at about 14K miles because the Phil
>> bb was getting new bearings.
>>
>> How does the LongLow ride compare to that of the Quickbeam? Also, does
>> anyone know how the LL's ride compares to that of the Rambouillet?
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 31, 2019 at 7:25 PM BSWP  wrote:
>>
>>> I'm just back from a 215 mile loop out of Berkeley on my first
>>> Rivendell, a 65cm LongLow. We went to Point Reyes (over the RSR bridge!)
>>> then on to Tomales, where it's freezing cold at night but the saloon is
>>> hopping. Then a grunt out to Bodega Bay and second breakfast in Jenner,
>>> before meandering up the Russian River to Rio Nido for beer, and family
>>> hospitality in Heraldsburg. The rain came early, but relented enough to
>>> give us dry road into Calistoga, before hammering us the entire length of
>>> Silverado Trail, to an overpriced motel in Napa. Final day was like
>>> autopilot back through Vallejo and on down into Berkeley.
>>>
>>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclemoss/albums/72157712451755936
>>>
>>> and
>>>
>>> https://ridewithgps.com/routes/31483686
>>>
>>> The LongLow has its original Phil hubs, and six-speed freewheel,
>>> half-step + granny triple, simple Shimano 105 shifters, and nitto stem. It
>>> started with M'bars, but I've been riding on Noodles for five years now,
>>> and prefer them for long tours. The brakes are now "mini" Vees, and I very
>>> much like the Tektro interruptor levers. My luggage system is a basic Wald
>>> basket up front, with Sackville ShopSack, and a new-ish Banana bag under
>>> the saddle. For true camping, I have a stout Nitto rack and Ortliebs, this
>>> ride, I left the lightweight Nitto on, to carry beer or wine in case we
>>> needed extra capacity. Tires are now 35mm Compass something-something
>>> pass... very soft and forgiving, but still quite fast.
>>>
>>> I love the ride, so smooth and stable, and I can just pedal all day in
>>> comfort (except or my neck, it gets tired looking up, so I often go a few
>>> hundred feet looking down at the white shoulder line). There's a QuickBeam
>>> in my stable, and a new Riv-ish frame still to be painted and assembled
>>> (Rohloff meets MAFAC Racer), but I always enjoy this ride. Many thanks to
>>> Grant & crew for getting the frame sized right, and keeping me going.
>>>
>>> - Andrew, Berkeley
>>>
>>> --
>>
>> --
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[RBW] Re: 1/1/20 Blahg

2020-01-02 Thread Matt Dreher

Agreed on both counts but especially LWB. There's a lot of things he's 
right about and it doesn't take a stretch to get on his side regarding, 
like steel, rim brakes, threaded steerers, leather saddles, and so on. 
Asking the average cyclist with Rivendell money to take a chance on a bike 
with way-long stays is a lot, though, and it drives away people who would 
otherwise be on board with the aesthetic and philosophy of Rivendell. How 
many people out there have Surlies with $1000+ of Paul and Phil and White 
onboard? More than you think, at least in Japan if Blue Lug's flickr is 
anything to go by. Why not give your average Crosscheck owner a nicer frame 
to aspire to as well without asking them to give up the quick handling?

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 3:55:08 PM UTC-6, masmojo wrote:
>
> Well, I love Grant and he's right a lot of the time about a lot of things, 
> but it's my personal belief is index shifting ain't one of them.
> I really don't think index shifting was intended for "lazy" people. I 
> never really appreciated index shifting until I started riding mountain 
> bikes; and honestly in that context especially, it's indispensable. When 
> you drop down into a gully or a roller and you need  a lower gear to get 
> out then what you used to get in, you've got to RAPIDLY  move through the 
> gears to get to the one you need! There's no time to feel it through. 
> Additionally,  if you can have index shifting, then why wouldn't you? I 
> have plenty of bikes with friction shifting and in a general sense it's 
> fine, but it's a tool to shift gears; very simple that. Index or not why is 
> it even a talking point? Last night I changed the Dia Compe friction 
> shifter off my Atlantis & installed a new MicroShift bar con. So now I have 
> index; yeah!
> This wasn't so much to get index as it was to get a bar con, because the 
> old shifter was down tube mounted which I find to be a pain most of the 
> time.
> OK, that said where does one draw the line. Problem is shifting quickly 
> went from 7 speed thumb shifters to the push-push trigger monstrosities. 
> Those I absolutely don't dig very much! Why, because they don't really 
> bring anything to the game, they don't improve anything, in fact they 
> create problems, because they are fragile, wear quickly & break! But, maybe 
> that's the idea? Planned obsolescence.
>
> Second, I think this whole long wheelbase thing is getting completely out 
> of hand. I agree that a super short wheelbase is sort of overkill, but 
> there's no reason a Clem should have the wheelbase it does. In fact all 
> sorts of reasons it shouldn't. I can say that, not as someone whose never 
> ridden a long wheelbase Rivendell, but as someone who owns two! (Formerly 
> three!) Unfortunately, I have no way to make a head to head comparison, 
>  but I feel pretty safe postulating that I'd love my Medium Clementine more 
> if the chainstays were 3/4 shorter. Which I should add; would still be 
> considered long.
> I am sorry if I come off contrarian; I am not in favor of change for 
> changes sake and there's loads of "technical Improvements" in the bike 
> industry that make me ask why? But in the last 10 years I've probably 
> bought 10 bikes; the Only ones that didn't have threadless 
> stearers/headsets, Disc Brakes, etc. Have been Rivendells; I didn't buy the 
> Rivendells because they didn't have those things, but in spite of them not 
> having those things. As a former bike mechanic and person who wrenches my 
> own bikes, I recognize an improvement over pointless gadgetry. I've 
> recently bought not one, but two bikes with thru-axles and I can honestly 
> say I dig'em a lot! Prior to that a good vertical drop out was my favorite, 
> but these thru-axles are undoubtedly an improvement. 
> Anywayz, I realize I'm tilting at windmills here, but there's a certain 
> amount of catharsis.
>

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Re: [RBW] 1/1/20 Blahg

2020-01-02 Thread 'Eric Norris' via RBW Owners Bunch

Gotta agree with you. I have both friction- and index-shifting bikes, including 
one bike with Campagnolo Ergo levers that I haven’t been on in a couple of 
years. I enjoy them both, but when you’re getting tired at the end of a long 
ride it is such a convenience not to have to hunt around for a lower gear when 
the road tilts up. 

I’ve had the experience far too many times of not shifting far enough into a 
lower gear and then being plunged back to a higher gear when the chain seeks a 
lower place. That never happens with index shifting.

Yes, even down-tube indexed levers can fail in ways that friction levers can’t. 
Small parts with close tolerances can do that. However, in 30+ years of indexed 
shifting I have never had a downtube shifter fail on me. I *have* had to 
repair/refurbish Ergo levers (not that hard, really), but even then it was to 
correct poor shifting, not because they failed.

--Eric N

> On Jan 2, 2020, at 1:55 PM, masmojo  wrote:
> 
> Well, I love Grant and he's right a lot of the time about a lot of things, 
> but it's my personal belief is index shifting ain't one of them.
> I really don't think index shifting was intended for "lazy" people. I never 
> really appreciated index shifting until I started riding mountain bikes; and 
> honestly in that context especially, it's indispensable.

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Re: [RBW] 1/1/20 Blahg

I'll let Grant defend himself on indexing. I will only add that I am
personally very glad that refined friction shifting systems he marketare
still being developed and put on the market.

On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 2:55 PM masmojo  wrote:

> Well, I love Grant and he's right a lot of the time about a lot of things,
> but it's my personal belief is index shifting ain't one of them.
> I really don't think index shifting was intended for "lazy" people. I
> never really appreciated index shifting until I started riding mountain
> bikes; and honestly in that context especially, it's indispensable. When
> you drop down into a gully or a roller and you need  a lower gear to get
> out then what you used to get in, you've got to RAPIDLY  move through the
> gears to get to the one you need! There's no time to feel it through.
> Additionally,  if you can have index shifting, then why wouldn't you? I
> have plenty of bikes with friction shifting and in a general sense it's
> fine, but it's a tool to shift gears; very simple that. Index or not why is
> it even a talking point? Last night I changed the Dia Compe friction
> shifter off my Atlantis & installed a new MicroShift bar con. So now I have
> index; yeah!
> This wasn't so much to get index as it was to get a bar con, because the
> old shifter was down tube mounted which I find to be a pain most of the
> time.
> OK, that said where does one draw the line. Problem is shifting quickly
> went from 7 speed thumb shifters to the push-push trigger monstrosities.
> Those I absolutely don't dig very much! Why, because they don't really
> bring anything to the game, they don't improve anything, in fact they
> create problems, because they are fragile, wear quickly & break! But, maybe
> that's the idea? Planned obsolescence.
>
> Second, I think this whole long wheelbase thing is getting completely out
> of hand. I agree that a super short wheelbase is sort of overkill, but
> there's no reason a Clem should have the wheelbase it does. In fact all
> sorts of reasons it shouldn't. I can say that, not as someone whose never
> ridden a long wheelbase Rivendell, but as someone who owns two! (Formerly
> three!) Unfortunately, I have no way to make a head to head comparison,
> but I feel pretty safe postulating that I'd love my Medium Clementine more
> if the chainstays were 3/4 shorter. Which I should add; would still be
> considered long.
> I am sorry if I come off contrarian; I am not in favor of change for
> changes sake and there's loads of "technical Improvements" in the bike
> industry that make me ask why? But in the last 10 years I've probably
> bought 10 bikes; the Only ones that didn't have threadless
> stearers/headsets, Disc Brakes, etc. Have been Rivendells; I didn't buy the
> Rivendells because they didn't have those things, but in spite of them not
> having those things. As a former bike mechanic and person who wrenches my
> own bikes, I recognize an improvement over pointless gadgetry. I've
> recently bought not one, but two bikes with thru-axles and I can honestly
> say I dig'em a lot! Prior to that a good vertical drop out was my favorite,
> but these thru-axles are undoubtedly an improvement.
> Anywayz, I realize I'm tilting at windmills here, but there's a certain
> amount of catharsis.
>
> --
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> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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> .
>


-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] 1/1/20 Blahg

To explain: It seems only polite that people should give sufficient context
for their replies; social courtesy, so to speak.

To plop a brief sentence into the middle of a thread without any context to
make it intelligible seems to me to be not only rude but self defeating.

On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 3:28 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> What does this reply refer to?
>
> On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 3:02 PM Daniel D.  wrote:
>
>> Honorable?  Lol.  Bike geeks aren't Jedis.
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>> .
>>
>
>
> --
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>
>
>

-- 

---
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Re: [RBW] 1/1/20 Blahg

What does this reply refer to?

On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 3:02 PM Daniel D.  wrote:

> Honorable?  Lol.  Bike geeks aren't Jedis.
>
> --
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> .
>


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Re: [RBW] 2019 stats? Post'em if ya got'em

2020-01-02 Thread R Shannon

Kai, I'm so sorry about your injury. May you have a speedy recovery without
any complications or long term negative effects!

My daughter lives in Brooklyn so I'm familiar with your riding environment.
Almost five thousand miles in 2019 primarily on the streets of NYC is
definitely well earned! Enviable? Yes. Kudos to you!!!

Best wishes,
- Rich in ATL

On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 7:02 AM Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY <
kaiviers...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Strava, which I try to use most of the time says 4638 miles for the year,
> so around 5 g's with some nondigitized rolls. Unfortunately cut short due
> to a majorly mashed right clavicle on November 27th, necessitating 8 screws
> and a titanium collarbone lug/splint. Minus a long day with the 25th
> anniversary Riv ride crew and some Northern Bronx routes, my miles were
> accrued on the streets of NYC, so maybe not always enviable but well earned
> miles nonetheless...
>
> Not enjoying my subway commute/looking forward to the go ahead from my
> bone doctor (February maybe?)
> -Kai
>
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Re: [RBW] Saddle Position Question

2020-01-02 Thread Tom Norton

My B17 tilt,in the words of Doug Fattic,is an aberation!! But it has to be 
there or I slide forward.

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[RBW] 1/1/20 Blahg

2020-01-02 Thread Daniel D.

Honorable?  Lol.  Bike geeks aren't Jedis. 

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Well, I love Grant and he's right a lot of the time about a lot of things, but
it's my personal belief is index shifting ain't one of them.
I really don't think index shifting was intended for "lazy" people. I never
really appreciated index shifting until I started riding mountain bikes; and
honestly in that context especially, it's indispensable. When you drop down
into a gully or a roller and you need a lower gear to get out then what you
used to get in, you've got to RAPIDLY move through the gears to get to the one
you need! There's no time to feel it through. Additionally, if you can have
index shifting, then why wouldn't you? I have plenty of bikes with friction
shifting and in a general sense it's fine, but it's a tool to shift gears; very
simple that. Index or not why is it even a talking point? Last night I changed
the Dia Compe friction shifter off my Atlantis & installed a new MicroShift bar
con. So now I have index; yeah!
This wasn't so much to get index as it was to get a bar con, because the old
shifter was down tube mounted which I find to be a pain most of the time.
OK, that said where does one draw the line. Problem is shifting quickly went
from 7 speed thumb shifters to the push-push trigger monstrosities. Those I
absolutely don't dig very much! Why, because they don't really bring anything
to the game, they don't improve anything, in fact they create problems, because
they are fragile, wear quickly & break! But, maybe that's the idea? Planned
obsolescence.

Second, I think this whole long wheelbase thing is getting completely out of
hand. I agree that a super short wheelbase is sort of overkill, but there's no
reason a Clem should have the wheelbase it does. In fact all sorts of reasons
it shouldn't. I can say that, not as someone whose never ridden a long
wheelbase Rivendell, but as someone who owns two! (Formerly three!)
Unfortunately, I have no way to make a head to head comparison, but I feel
pretty safe postulating that I'd love my Medium Clementine more if the
chainstays were 3/4 shorter. Which I should add; would still be considered long.
I am sorry if I come off contrarian; I am not in favor of change for changes
sake and there's loads of "technical Improvements" in the bike industry that
make me ask why? But in the last 10 years I've probably bought 10 bikes; the
Only ones that didn't have threadless stearers/headsets, Disc Brakes, etc. Have
been Rivendells; I didn't buy the Rivendells because they didn't have those
things, but in spite of them not having those things. As a former bike mechanic
and person who wrenches my own bikes, I recognize an improvement over pointless
gadgetry. I've recently bought not one, but two bikes with thru-axles and I can
honestly say I dig'em a lot! Prior to that a good vertical drop out was my
favorite, but these thru-axles are undoubtedly an improvement.
Anywayz, I realize I'm tilting at windmills here, but there's a certain amount
of catharsis.

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[RBW] Re: WTB: Ram or Hilsen fork, 260mm steerer (for resurrection)

2020-01-02 Thread Teague Scott

Thanks for the responses. It has been a busy few weeks and I haven't had 
the chance to think about this again.

I’m now rethinking what might work on the Sequoia… I’m a rookie in the 
world of caliper brakes and didn’t consider the drastic effect that tire 
clearance might have on suitability. Oops.

So, a number of the forks that I mentioned are probably too tall. *I would 
want to be able to fit a medium reach caliper.* I'm assuming that the QB 
fork probably won't work?

It might be that I have to send it off for tweaking and cross my fingers 
that it straightens out nicely.


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[RBW] Re: 2019 stats? Post'em if ya got'em

2020-01-02 Thread Bill Rhea

2019 was a good riding year for me. I enjoy riding at least as much at this 
juncture as I ever have.

   - 4100 total miles (3200 miles in 2018), mostly commuting on the 
   Hunqapillar. I also explored more of the country roads in Napa on my 
   Romulus (the only bike I have without fenders or racks).
   - Lost 30 lbs and feel like I'm in my 20's again!
   - Eroica CA was a blast last last April. It's great meeting up with 
   crusty oldsters (like me!) from the Peninsula I've known since "back in the 
   day"
   - Met a bunch of like-minded folks during the Riv XXV campout in Sam 
   Taylor Park.  Lamentably, this was my only bike camping trip of 2019.  I 
   need to spend more time in Marin County in 2020
   - Went to Spain on vacation in May and re-connected with friends from 
   the venerable shop where I worked in 1991, Bicicletas Otero. Heading back 
   there in September 2020 to help as a volunteer with their annual ride, La 
   Clásica Otero.

Happy 2020, everybody!

-br

On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 8:34:48 AM UTC-8, masmojo wrote:
>
> I realize there a few hours left,  but I am unlikely to move the needle 
> any before the end of the day so I'll go first. 
>
> First 2018 was a highwater mark for me so I was unlikely to match the 
> 2,700+ miles I did last year. 
>
> I had some challenges at the beginning of the year which likely killed my 
> totals, but overall I feel positive going into the next decade. 
>
> Total 2,400 miles 
> 1,045 of that was on my Radwagon E-bike. I am hesitant to include those 
> miles at all, except that those are miles that I would have had to 
> otherwise use my car. So you can put an Asterisk next to them if you like, 
> but I'll call it a win.  
>
> That still leaves a fairly respectable 1,355 miles. Split amongst a dozen 
> or so different bikes. 
>
> Next to my e-bike the next highest mileage total was on the Eastern 
> Growler, 26" BMX Cruiser I call Big Baby, because she's pink. 226 miles 
> 3rd surprisingly is my Clementine @ 223 miles! I say surprisingly, 
>  because I just don't feel like I ride it that much and less than I 
>  otherwise would because it's too awkwardly big to take on the train. 
> 4th. Crust Bombora, well honestly when you consider I've only been riding 
> this a few months this year it really should be like #2 I ride it ALL THE 
> TIME! I ride it so much that I make a concerted effort to ride other bikes, 
> just so they get ridden. 
>
> Of note the next in mileage is my stainless steel SOMA Triple Cross. 
> Notable, because even though I don't ride it as often as I'd like when I do 
> ride it, it's typically on the more epic range. 20+ miles per trip. 
>
> The down side of having quite a few bikes, is that some don't get ridden 
> more. My Atlantis would probably be up near the top, except it spent a 
> considerable time with a rear flat thats resisted fixing. 
>
> Oddly my mileage has dropped for reasons that seem somewhat contradictory; 
> I got laid off from my job that was 13.4 miles from my house and the new 
> job is 16.3 miles from the house. The rub is that this additional 3 miles 
> each way adds considerable time & effort to a commute that was already 
> challenging. This was one reason I got the E-bike and why it's chocked up 
> so many miles. I  just couldn't spend the time to ride to work as much. 
>
> Anywayz, what's your story?

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[RBW] Re: FS-Tires: Compass/RH 700x35 and Simworks Volummy

2020-01-02 Thread Collin A

Quick update, this is for only ONE tire of each, I may not have been clear 
on that, whoops.

Collin A

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 12:22:12 PM UTC-8, Collin A wrote:
>
> Heyo,
>
> The supple fairy visited me last week and I am no longer in need of these 
> tires.
>
> *$70 shipped*: 700x35 Rene Hearse/Compass Bon Jon extralights, tan. Maybe 
> 50 miles on them on the front. No slashes or cuts and pretty much new 
> except for road grime and some orange seal boogers. They measured out to 
> about 36 mm on 19mm ID rims at 40-ish PSI. It still has the compass logo on 
> it, so you can get your hipster points.
>
> *$50 shipped*: 700x32 Simworks Volummy. Probably about 100-ish miles and 
> only mounted on the front. Wear-indicator shows full life left, and in 
> overall excellent condition. They measured to about 34.5mm on 21mm ID rims 
> at about 40-ish PI. They worked well on Bald ridge and Burma road on the 
> North side of Mt. DIablo, so they are pretty capable off-road tires when 
> the path is dry.
>
> See the photos below:
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/W5XjU4VPwu1cg94G8
>
> If you would like both, I'll take $10 off the total price.
>
> Happy New Year,
> Collin in Oakland
>
>
>

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[RBW] FS-Tires: Compass/RH 700x35 and Simworks Volummy

2020-01-02 Thread Collin A

Heyo,

The supple fairy visited me last week and I am no longer in need of these 
tires.

*$70 shipped*: 700x35 Rene Hearse/Compass Bon Jon extralights, tan. Maybe 
50 miles on them on the front. No slashes or cuts and pretty much new 
except for road grime and some orange seal boogers. They measured out to 
about 36 mm on 19mm ID rims at 40-ish PSI. It still has the compass logo on 
it, so you can get your hipster points.

*$50 shipped*: 700x32 Simworks Volummy. Probably about 100-ish miles and 
only mounted on the front. Wear-indicator shows full life left, and in 
overall excellent condition. They measured to about 34.5mm on 21mm ID rims 
at about 40-ish PI. They worked well on Bald ridge and Burma road on the 
North side of Mt. DIablo, so they are pretty capable off-road tires when 
the path is dry.

See the photos below:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/W5XjU4VPwu1cg94G8

If you would like both, I'll take $10 off the total price.

Happy New Year,
Collin in Oakland


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[RBW] 1/1/20 Blahg

As usual, fun, miscellaneous, non-organized content. Much on slant
parallels and indexing and the power of Shimano and the smallness of
SunTour. But, perhaps this is worth a breath: sure, everyone nowadays wants
13 in back and trouble-free electric, indexed shifting. BUT! I would not be
surprised if there is a market "out there" for honorable consumers who
*like* to develop the skills required to do things for themselves. After
all, there was the fixie craze during the 10 speed indexing period, and --
I am no expert on current culture, but is there not a trend toward
self-reliance, authenticity (not sure how to define this, but at least,
don't buy what you can't do), simplicity, and durability? The sorts of
people who use knives instead of processors, and knead bread dough instead
of using bread makers? (Both for me, tho' I'm no gourmet chef.)

The same from another angle: every time you gain with a machine that makes
it easier for you to do something, and for neophytes to get into the
action, you also *pari passu* lose skill and expertise, which itself is
very often a large part of the pleasure and self-affirmation of practicing
some craft, be it only shifting a derailleur system.

Now, if you perfect -- as Rivendell's Silvers do --"do-it-yourself manual
shifting, might there not be a small but sustainable market for
well-meaning, earnest, honest people who'd like to aquire these minimal
self-sufficient skills with tools perfected for the purpose?

It seems to me that Rivendell ought to actively market to this audience;
not the theme, "We're diehard holdouts for old-fashioned skills," but "You
want the pleasure and self respect of learning how to do things for
yourself; we can equip you with tools perfected for this" -- whether
shifters, axes, bags, clothing, what have you. IOW, not "we're holdouts"
but "you don't want to be subordinate to the machine; we are on your side
with the right stuff."

Those new Silver shifters might well be a design that entices me away from
beloved SunTour barcons.I didn't like the older, long-levered Silver bar
end shifters, but the new ones may make me change my mind.

Casting back to the last blahg, with Archie Bunker: I never watched All in
the Family until just a week or so ago when I looked it up. I have to say
that, from the very few episodes I fast forwarded through, it was well
done, and I usually hate TV. That is, it portrayed a bigot well as a bigot
in a humorous way.

What I have watched what may be BBC's antecedent to the show which, as an
Anglophile, I like quite a bit. As usual, as with anything literary or
dramatic, the Brits just do it better.

Grant, this one's for you:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0-leRNxhmg

*Today when you're picking out baby and toddler toys, the groovy thing to
look for is a toy that requires the human to do 90+ percent of the work. A
book versus an audio book or video game, Tinker Toys versus online building
things or whatever. Adult toys used to be that way, but bicycles, more than
most, have eliminated the need to make mechanisms perform. All riders have
to do it push to the click, or share the task with a motor. It's no skin
off anybody's nose, who even cares?, except that I think everybody should
have at least one bike that is more manual than automatic. It's not a
matter of trying to make simple things harder; it's more like not seeking
out the easiest, most brainless way to perform a function that formerly
required a little skill, and then feeling puffed up for your "smart
shopping."*

*SILVER shifters and any modern slant parallelogram rear derailer (Shimano
makes good ones) is a good way to go. A little practice and you'll be fine
in a week!*

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Re: Rivelo closing in January

I can't even imagine how hard it is to support a physical store in The Age Of 
Amazon. I'm thinking..SUPER hard. 

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Re: [RBW] Saddle Position Question

2020-01-02 Thread Peter White

https://www.peterwhitecycles.com/fitting.php

On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 11:41 AM Andrew Nussbaum  wrote:

> I'm in the process of dialing in the fit on my Toyo Atlantis
>  and am in need of the
> group's advice on saddle positioning. I'm using albatross bars for a more
> upright position--a choice which I've come to love.  But when I sit more
> upright, I'm noticing that I slide "down" on my B17 saddle. I have
> positioned the saddle to be parallel to the ground, with perhaps a slight
> upward tilt.  I'd like my sit bones to be resting on the rear of the
> saddle.  Should I simply give the saddle a more upward tilt?  Any thoughts
> are welcome.
>
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> .
>


-- 
Peter White

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Re: [RBW] Re: Saddle Position Question

I and others I've talked to have found that, sometimes, sliding your saddle
back alleviates weight on your hands. Once again, see Peter Jon White's
essay on bike fit.

Contrary to popular belief, sitting upright and close to a high bar is not
always as comfortable as having the saddle shoved back, and having the bar
sufficiently distant and sufficiently low relative to your saddle position.
Read the PJW essay.

Patrick "butt-back/low-bar comfortable, high-and-close uncomfortable" Moore

On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 11:00 AM Andrew Nussbaum  wrote:

> Any thoughts on the lateral position of the saddle?  Should I move it
> forward or back?
>
> On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 10:42:43 AM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>> What Tom said, plus you may find that what looks and feels almost
>> comically up-tilted at first becomes the thing you like. I find the rear
>> portion of a broken-in B17 to be as comfy as a couch, and with the saddle
>> tilted way back so there isn't even a hint of sliding forward/down towards
>> the bars. Rich @ Riv uses this position, and you can get a look at mine on
>> my "eClem again" thread.
>
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> .
>


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---
Patrick Moore
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[RBW] Re: Rivelo closing in January

2020-01-02 Thread Philip Williamson

And Breadwinner is closing their cafe. They are still going with frames and 
Sugar Wheels, but it seems from the outside that the Portland bike scene has 
contracted dramatically, 

I hope John keeps on as a focus of the “Ride Bikes Shoot Film” movement. I just 
replaced the bellows on an old Agfa/Ansco 6x9 folder and shot some pictures on 
my commute this morning.

Philip
Santa Rosa, CA

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[RBW] Re: Saddle Position Question

2020-01-02 Thread Andrew Nussbaum

Any thoughts on the lateral position of the saddle?  Should I move it 
forward or back?

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 10:42:43 AM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> What Tom said, plus you may find that what looks and feels almost 
> comically up-tilted at first becomes the thing you like. I find the rear 
> portion of a broken-in B17 to be as comfy as a couch, and with the saddle 
> tilted way back so there isn't even a hint of sliding forward/down towards 
> the bars. Rich @ Riv uses this position, and you can get a look at mine on 
> my "eClem again" thread. 

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[RBW] Re: Saddle Position Question

2020-01-02 Thread John Rinker

'Comically up-tilted' is where it's at. Several years ago I remember 
reading about mimicking the saddle on a horse, and I've never been more 
comfortable on my well-loved B17.

Cheers. 

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 11:27:43 PM UTC+5:45, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> What Tom said, plus you may find that what looks and feels almost 
> comically up-tilted at first becomes the thing you like. I find the rear 
> portion of a broken-in B17 to be as comfy as a couch, and with the saddle 
> tilted way back so there isn't even a hint of sliding forward/down towards 
> the bars. Rich @ Riv uses this position, and you can get a look at mine on 
> my "eClem again" thread. 

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Re: [RBW] Saddle Position Question

Saddle choice and setup is as personal as love, so I offer this FWIW. But
my experience is that tilt is as crucial to comfort as height and sit bones
and fore/aft position, and that a bad position will have to sliding forward
to put excessive weight on shoulders, arms, and hands.

I've tried the following Brooks saddles, at least one of each, with some,
multiple iterations.
B 17
B 17 N
Pro
Flyer
B 67
The situp-and-beg model like the B 67 but without the springs

Also:

Sugino Belt
Ideal of some sort, at least 1 if not 2 of these.

For all of them, I found that tilt was crucial to comfort (and I'm not
using "crucial" in any sly secret way), far more so than with any other of
the many other makes and models I've used.

I found that, on road bikes, the Pro was the most comfortable; the B 17 and
even B 17 N chafed. But while the Pro was comfortable in butt and thighs, I
could never get the tilt right, and this was even after I invested in an
infinitely-adjustable-tile post -- forget name -- that had an easily
rotated tilt separate from the fore/aft adjustment. The Pro was as
comfortable, tilt apart, as the original issue Flites I now use, but I
could never get it adjusted just right to avoid sliding forward and getting
goosed.

On Thu, Jan 2, 2020 at 9:41 AM Andrew Nussbaum  wrote:

> I'm in the process of dialing in the fit on my Toyo Atlantis
>  and am in need of the
> group's advice on saddle positioning. I'm using albatross bars for a more
> upright position--a choice which I've come to love.  But when I sit more
> upright, I'm noticing that I slide "down" on my B17 saddle. I have
> positioned the saddle to be parallel to the ground, with perhaps a slight
> upward tilt.  I'd like my sit bones to be resting on the rear of the
> saddle.  Should I simply give the saddle a more upward tilt?  Any thoughts
> are welcome.
>
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> 
> .
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---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Saddle Position Question

What Tom said, plus you may find that what looks and feels almost comically 
up-tilted at first becomes the thing you like. I find the rear portion of a 
broken-in B17 to be as comfy as a couch, and with the saddle tilted way back so 
there isn't even a hint of sliding forward/down towards the bars. Rich @ Riv 
uses this position, and you can get a look at mine on my "eClem again" thread. 

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[RBW] Re: FS: Swift Industries Sugarloaf Wald Basket Bag


Sent you a PM yesterday. 


On Tuesday, December 31, 2019 at 11:51:28 AM UTC-6, timcla...@gmail.com wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> 
> Its that time of year to make room for another bike project:
> 
> 
> For sale is a Swift Sugarloaf Basket Bag. Designed to attach securely and fit 
> perfectly into a Wald 137 basket. It does, and it's a great bag.
> 
> 
> 
> Photos here.
> 
> 
> Excellent, lightly used condition. — $100 shipped
> 
> 
> 
> Please send email directly if interested. Paypal friends and family. Thank 
> you!
> 
> 
> 
> Tim
> Petaluma, CA

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[RBW] Re: Clem L set up

2020-01-02 Thread 'Keith Swanson' via RBW Owners Bunch

Thanks for all the responses.  I think I'm going to get a Mark's rack to go 
with the medium basket I got for Christmas.  This bike is just so much fun 
to ride I can't wait to get everything dialed in.  

On Sunday, December 29, 2019 at 7:55:44 AM UTC-8, Keith Swanson wrote:
>
> I finally made my first grocery ride to Trader Joe's and notice a lot of 
> flop under a load.  I'm wondering if my set up is off.  I had this rack on 
> a Kogswell and never had any issues, but the Kogswell was designed for a 
> front load. I've attached a picture for inspection. Any advice would be 
> appreciated.  
>

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[RBW] Saddle Position Question

2020-01-02 Thread tc

Yep, continue tilting the nose up no more than 1/8” at a time till it feels 
right. I know that doesn’t sound like much, but you need to do this in small 
increments. You’ll know it when you’ve reached the right tilt for you. 
Everyone’s different...

Tom

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[RBW] Saddle Position Question

2020-01-02 Thread Andrew Nussbaum

I'm in the process of dialing in the fit on my Toyo Atlantis 
 and am in need of the group's 
advice on saddle positioning. I'm using albatross bars for a more upright 
position--a choice which I've come to love.  But when I sit more upright, 
I'm noticing that I slide "down" on my B17 saddle. I have positioned the 
saddle to be parallel to the ground, with perhaps a slight upward tilt.  
I'd like my sit bones to be resting on the rear of the saddle.  Should I 
simply give the saddle a more upward tilt?  Any thoughts are welcome.  

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Re: [RBW] Re: My Clem Build

Here’s the one I got:
https://crustbikes.com/products/nitto-31-8-30-60mm-stem/

It’s about an 1/8” wider and uses larger M6 screws. 125mm of rise too!

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[RBW] Re: My Clem Build

Yep, 52cm.

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[RBW] Re: My Clem Build