Re: [RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Alex K]

Oh yeah. I'd go with option 3.  Be happy with what you have!
You can put the $800-1000 you save on new parts and switching out all those 
pieces toward your next Rivendell bike.  Because you can't just have one, 
right? 

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 9:06:32 PM UTC-7 Alex K wrote:

> Such an interesting topic.  I think about switching out the wheel set on 
> my 52 Clem L quite often.  It is not a light or zippy bike by any stretch 
> of the imagination.  I, too, have the stock Riv wheels with the rainbow 
> nipples.  I find it absolutely necessary to have a 5-rail Pass & Stow rack 
> with a Wald 139 basket to hold my Sackville SaddleSack, which adds quite a 
> bit more weight.  The GravelKing Slick 650/48 tires aren't meant for 
> racing, but are pretty flat-proof in the city, and definitely faster than 
> the stock Kendas that the bike came with. I consider myself lucky to have 
> such an aesthetically pleasing, extremely comfortable, superbly handling, 
> heavy-load bearing 2-wheeled Cadillac as my get to work bike and 
> grocery-getter.  I absolutely love this bike, and the overall ride quality. 
>  But there are days when I wonder if there is anything I could do to add a 
> little zip.  Thing is, I also have a 52 Clem H with no rack, a 1X11 setup, 
> White Industries rear hub and Shimano front Dyno hub (both on Atlas rims 
> and built by Mr. Lesnik).  My Clem H, on which I'm running Ultradynamico 
> JFF tires, Rosé up front, Cava rear, absolutely FLIES.  One of the zippiest 
> bikes I have ever ridden.  Sometimes I feel like I'm floating up the hills 
> in the Marin Headlands.   The difference between the two bikes is extreme. 
>  I'd love to try a new wheel set on the L, but I am pretty sure I would be 
> disappointed.  Perhaps step-through bikes aren't as zippy because of the 
> geometry?  I'd also love to see what it would be like to ride my L with the 
> exact setup that I have on my H, and I'd love to ride my H with a rack and 
> basket, and a stock wheel set, but I doubt I will go to the trouble just to 
> satisfy my curiosity. I've definitely seen L's out there that have been 
> loaded up with camping gear, and it might be a wonderful bike packing rig, 
> or maybe the perfect S24O bike.  For me it's the perfect city bike. I'm 
> okay with chipped paint and I don't worry about my stock wheels getting 
> pinched.  It may not be super fast, but it's comfy and reliable and I'm 
> good with that.
> This probably wasn't very helpful, but that's my experience.  
>
> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 7:01:52 PM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> And speaking of better tires: I don't know if Schwalbe ever made their 
>> Big One (pre-G One) in 27.5 X 60 in the lightest weight model, but if they 
>> did and you find some, buy them. I can tell you that the 700C X 60 Big One 
>> in the lightest model weighs quite a bit less even than Rene Herse extra 
>> lights: mine are 61 mm on 27 mm ID rims and just shy of 30" tall, but 
>> weigh only* 450 grams repeated on digital scale for several tires -- *and 
>> they wear very, very well. In fact, they roll as fast (judging by ease of 
>> turning the crank in given gears in given conditions) as the ultra extra 
>> light 175 gram 26" X 28 mm RH Elk Passes, otherwise the fastest "feeling" 
>> tires I've ever ridden.
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 7:54 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>>> I expect that Rene Herse 42 or 48 or 52 mm tires will give you low 
>>> rolling resistance, lighter weight, and plenty of cushioning -- even my 28 
>>> mm extra light Rene Herse Elk Passes at 55/60 f/r are surprisingly smooth 
>>> over small bumps, and the 42 mm Naches Passes ELs ditto at 40/45 psi, 
>>>
>>> Back to multiple wheels: IME, a pound or 2 or 3 really makes little 
>>> difference to the feeling of speed, even uphill. Some of my fastest 
>>> "feeling" bikes were rather heavy, and with rather heavy wheels. Tire 
>>> quality makes more difference than wheel weight, IME. 
>>>
>>> Also, bike setup and position makes a bigger difference in ease of 
>>> pedaling than a few lbs of weight, particularly saddle position with 
>>> respect to crank, IOW, torso angle at hips, which depends on proper saddle 
>>> setback. A saddle too far forward, or a hip angle too small, can make your 
>>> pedaling "weak" and awkward -- ie, you can't produce torque and it feels 
>>> unnatural; I learned this 27 years ago from Grant -- long story often 
>>> repeated. Moreover, a too-far-forward saddle will put *more* of your 
>>> torso's weight on your shoulders, arms, and hands, and make your neck 
>>> uncomfortable too, 
>>>
>>> As for multiple wheels: the idea is not at all strange. I use to have 
>>> bikes with 2 and even 3 wheelsets. For a while I would have one "main" bike
>>>  with 3 wheelsets (plus a beater or two): offroad knobbies with wide 
>>> range gearing, 38 mm road tires for commuting with close ratio road 
>>> gearing, and "gofast" with 200 gram skinnies and very close ratio gearing. 
>>> More recently 

Re: [RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Alex K]

Such an interesting topic.  I think about switching out the wheel set on my 
52 Clem L quite often.  It is not a light or zippy bike by any stretch of 
the imagination.  I, too, have the stock Riv wheels with the rainbow 
nipples.  I find it absolutely necessary to have a 5-rail Pass & Stow rack 
with a Wald 139 basket to hold my Sackville SaddleSack, which adds quite a 
bit more weight.  The GravelKing Slick 650/48 tires aren't meant for 
racing, but are pretty flat-proof in the city, and definitely faster than 
the stock Kendas that the bike came with. I consider myself lucky to have 
such an aesthetically pleasing, extremely comfortable, superbly handling, 
heavy-load bearing 2-wheeled Cadillac as my get to work bike and 
grocery-getter.  I absolutely love this bike, and the overall ride quality. 
 But there are days when I wonder if there is anything I could do to add a 
little zip.  Thing is, I also have a 52 Clem H with no rack, a 1X11 setup, 
White Industries rear hub and Shimano front Dyno hub (both on Atlas rims 
and built by Mr. Lesnik).  My Clem H, on which I'm running Ultradynamico 
JFF tires, Rosé up front, Cava rear, absolutely FLIES.  One of the zippiest 
bikes I have ever ridden.  Sometimes I feel like I'm floating up the hills 
in the Marin Headlands.   The difference between the two bikes is extreme. 
 I'd love to try a new wheel set on the L, but I am pretty sure I would be 
disappointed.  Perhaps step-through bikes aren't as zippy because of the 
geometry?  I'd also love to see what it would be like to ride my L with the 
exact setup that I have on my H, and I'd love to ride my H with a rack and 
basket, and a stock wheel set, but I doubt I will go to the trouble just to 
satisfy my curiosity. I've definitely seen L's out there that have been 
loaded up with camping gear, and it might be a wonderful bike packing rig, 
or maybe the perfect S24O bike.  For me it's the perfect city bike. I'm 
okay with chipped paint and I don't worry about my stock wheels getting 
pinched.  It may not be super fast, but it's comfy and reliable and I'm 
good with that.
This probably wasn't very helpful, but that's my experience.  

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 7:01:52 PM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:

> And speaking of better tires: I don't know if Schwalbe ever made their Big 
> One (pre-G One) in 27.5 X 60 in the lightest weight model, but if they did 
> and you find some, buy them. I can tell you that the 700C X 60 Big One in 
> the lightest model weighs quite a bit less even than Rene Herse extra 
> lights: mine are 61 mm on 27 mm ID rims and just shy of 30" tall, but 
> weigh only* 450 grams repeated on digital scale for several tires -- *and 
> they wear very, very well. In fact, they roll as fast (judging by ease of 
> turning the crank in given gears in given conditions) as the ultra extra 
> light 175 gram 26" X 28 mm RH Elk Passes, otherwise the fastest "feeling" 
> tires I've ever ridden.
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 7:54 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>
>> I expect that Rene Herse 42 or 48 or 52 mm tires will give you low 
>> rolling resistance, lighter weight, and plenty of cushioning -- even my 28 
>> mm extra light Rene Herse Elk Passes at 55/60 f/r are surprisingly smooth 
>> over small bumps, and the 42 mm Naches Passes ELs ditto at 40/45 psi, 
>>
>> Back to multiple wheels: IME, a pound or 2 or 3 really makes little 
>> difference to the feeling of speed, even uphill. Some of my fastest 
>> "feeling" bikes were rather heavy, and with rather heavy wheels. Tire 
>> quality makes more difference than wheel weight, IME. 
>>
>> Also, bike setup and position makes a bigger difference in ease of 
>> pedaling than a few lbs of weight, particularly saddle position with 
>> respect to crank, IOW, torso angle at hips, which depends on proper saddle 
>> setback. A saddle too far forward, or a hip angle too small, can make your 
>> pedaling "weak" and awkward -- ie, you can't produce torque and it feels 
>> unnatural; I learned this 27 years ago from Grant -- long story often 
>> repeated. Moreover, a too-far-forward saddle will put *more* of your 
>> torso's weight on your shoulders, arms, and hands, and make your neck 
>> uncomfortable too, 
>>
>> As for multiple wheels: the idea is not at all strange. I use to have 
>> bikes with 2 and even 3 wheelsets. For a while I would have one "main" bike
>>  with 3 wheelsets (plus a beater or two): offroad knobbies with wide 
>> range gearing, 38 mm road tires for commuting with close ratio road 
>> gearing, and "gofast" with 200 gram skinnies and very close ratio gearing. 
>> More recently my Fargo had a 700C X 60 mm wheelset and a 700C X 35 mm 
>> wheelset, with disc rotors adjusted so that I could just slide each wheel 
>> into place without fiddling with caliper adjustment, And my 1999 Riv Road 
>> custom gofast will, God willing (hubs and rims with builder), shortly have 
>> 3 *rear *wheels, the "main" one with a flip/flop 15/17 t fixed hub, one 
>> for longer ride

[RBW] Re: WTB: Nitto M1 Mark's rack or similar

[Alex K]

I might have mini 32F rack for sale, interested?  pretty similar

On Saturday, March 19, 2022 at 5:10:01 PM UTC-7 J wrote:

> howdy folks,
>
> I'm interested in a Nitto M1 Mark's or similar rack, e.g. Rawland Rando 
> rack. Anybody have something collecting dust?
>
> thanks
> J
>

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Re: [RBW] Front Range Riv Riders? Atlantis curious in Boulder

[Christian B-H]

Thanks RM Rose, Johnny and Ben!

Johnny- you hit the nail on the head. I could just barely make the 59 work, 
and especially after reading Clark Fitzgeralds wonderful first impressions, 
one year review, and brief but joyous Atlantis break-up email to move onto 
the Platypus (Posted in this group "Atlantis one year review - the 
consummate All-Rounder"- Thanks, Clark!)He's 6´1" and found the 59 
slightly large. I'm 6' with an 89PBH so, I think I'm leaning towards the 55.

Ben- thanks for the Omaha invite! It's a slightly cheaper, similar flight 
to Oakland, then BART to Walnut Creek, so unless I'm in Omaha I don't think 
we'll have the pleasure! 

I also got a nice response from Andrew in the Denver area, and am hoping to 
meet up to ride  and try some Colorado Riv Cyclists soon!

Best, Christian

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 10:39:33 AM UTC-6 bjmi...@gmail.com wrote:

> Good morning!
> I don't know how you'd define "a few hours," but I'm in Omaha, NE and have 
> a 59cm. If for some strange reason you found yourself in town, you'd be 
> more than welcome to give it a spin. I'm confident, though, that you'll 
> encounter one a little closer to home.
>
> Ben in Omaha. 
>
> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 11:10:31 AM UTC-5 Johnny Alien wrote:
>
>> Rivendell likes to put people in the MAX size possible. With the expanded 
>> geometry I am almost always at the top of one size and the very bottom of 
>> another.  Rivendell has suggested the larger sizes but time has shown me 
>> that I prefer to be at the top of a size vs the bottom contrary to what 
>> they would push for me.  It looks like you might be exactly the same with 
>> the Atlantis frame. A PBH of 89.5 is the minimum size that that they would 
>> recommend for the 59 which would put you at the very bottom for that size 
>> and at the top for the 55.  That makes it tricky and a lot will come down 
>> to personal preference. I hope you can find a good source for a try out!! 
>>
>> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 9:48:13 AM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I am still new here but I suspect you will get a lot of folks suggesting 
>>> you depend on & trust the advice on fit that is available just from talking 
>>> to the folks at Riv. They will not steer you wrong. Of course there is 
>>> nothing wrong with riding first if the opportunity presents itself.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Mar 21, 2022, at 1:32 AM, Christian B-H a wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi All-
>>>
>>> A Riv admirer from afar since 2019 thanks to my Rivspirational Uncle 
>>> Andy in SF. Grant's Bluhgs and Riv-stuff kept me mostly sane from 2019 till 
>>> now and influenced my decision to get a steel "gravel" bike with bigger 
>>> tires over carbon.  I had a chance in July 2021 to  go to Walnut Creek, and 
>>> my wife and friends who joined will attest I was like a kid in a candy 
>>> shop. I remember glancing over at Grant who was practicing laps on the 
>>> long-stemmed, mini cycle with James, and then looking back at Antonio, who 
>>> had Grant's Appaloosa in hand and saying, "Really? I can *ride HIS 
>>> bike?*" (photo below- Me with Friend in Hat clarifying with Antonio. My 
>>> wife in the background experiencing the Riv magic). 
>>>
>>> [image: 1866700f-dbed-4501-9ad3-abec74f90665.JPG]
>>>
>>> That day however I left with one thought in mind: Jame's Atlantis was 
>>> the smoothest, best feeling bike I've ever ridden. Even if it was a size or 
>>> so too small. 
>>>
>>> So, looking to determine what *size* Atlantis I'd be ahead of this next 
>>> order, my question for this group is: *Is there anyone within a a few 
>>> hours of Boulder, CO with a 55-60cm Atlantis who'd be willing to let me 
>>> test ride? *
>>>
>>> I *think *I've seen at least one Atlantis in the wild here, and I *know 
>>> *I've seen a few other Riv's around here...I'd love the opportunity to 
>>> ride an Atlantis again before buying to help figure out sizing (I know PBH 
>>> (89), calling to discuss, email etc. I've done it. I just want to see if I 
>>> should go 55 or 59  based on feel, and experience the ride one more time to 
>>> see which bike I may have to get rid of to help the purchase along). 
>>>
>>> Thanks for any help!
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Christian Beitel-Horton in Boulder, CO
>>>
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB 59cm Atlantis

[Coco Menk]

Hi Andrew! Your suspicions were correct - they went to spam. How's it going?

Coco

On Thu, Mar 10, 2022 at 3:22 PM Andrew S  wrote:

> Hi Coco,
>
> I've sent along a couple of direct emails about a possible option, in
> response to your original and subsequent post. Worried they might be going
> to your junk folder, so just thought I'd respond here too. Feel free to
> email me directly. Or if you have received them and aren't interested
> that's completely cool too, just wanted to make sure the message made its
> way successfully to you!
>
> Thanks!
>
> andrew
>
> On Wed, Mar 9, 2022 at 2:42 PM Coco Menk  wrote:
>
>> Look here... An eagle soars through the sky. A wind, harsh as its
>> surroundings, blows.
>> Look here... A beaver perched upon the ice, long awaited the newly
>> emerged skunk cabbage in the swamps.
>> Look there... Two intrepid travelers setting out for an adventure
>> Oh no! It seems one of them is missing a 59cm Atlantis! Lo! perhaps one
>> of you can help!
>>
>> We're headed out for an extended distanced tour fairly soon and hoping to
>> have a long tail Atlantis 59 to go with us. Please spare us the humiliation
>> of being upright on conventional geometry!
>>
>> Sending love out in these trying times <3!
>> Coco
>> On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 3:09:38 PM UTC-4 Coco Menk wrote:
>>
>>> Almost had one but owner backed out at the last minute - was originally
>>> thinking 62 cm for my bf because he is quite tall, but he's now saying he
>>> would prefer the 59. Looking for the newer geo please! :)
>>>
>>> Coco
>>>
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>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Patrick Moore]

And speaking of better tires: I don't know if Schwalbe ever made their Big
One (pre-G One) in 27.5 X 60 in the lightest weight model, but if they did
and you find some, buy them. I can tell you that the 700C X 60 Big One in
the lightest model weighs quite a bit less even than Rene Herse extra
lights: mine are 61 mm on 27 mm ID rims and just shy of 30" tall, but
weigh only* 450 grams repeated on digital scale for several tires -- *and
they wear very, very well. In fact, they roll as fast (judging by ease of
turning the crank in given gears in given conditions) as the ultra extra
light 175 gram 26" X 28 mm RH Elk Passes, otherwise the fastest "feeling"
tires I've ever ridden.

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 7:54 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> I expect that Rene Herse 42 or 48 or 52 mm tires will give you low rolling
> resistance, lighter weight, and plenty of cushioning -- even my 28 mm extra
> light Rene Herse Elk Passes at 55/60 f/r are surprisingly smooth over small
> bumps, and the 42 mm Naches Passes ELs ditto at 40/45 psi,
>
> Back to multiple wheels: IME, a pound or 2 or 3 really makes little
> difference to the feeling of speed, even uphill. Some of my fastest
> "feeling" bikes were rather heavy, and with rather heavy wheels. Tire
> quality makes more difference than wheel weight, IME.
>
> Also, bike setup and position makes a bigger difference in ease of
> pedaling than a few lbs of weight, particularly saddle position with
> respect to crank, IOW, torso angle at hips, which depends on proper saddle
> setback. A saddle too far forward, or a hip angle too small, can make your
> pedaling "weak" and awkward -- ie, you can't produce torque and it feels
> unnatural; I learned this 27 years ago from Grant -- long story often
> repeated. Moreover, a too-far-forward saddle will put *more* of your
> torso's weight on your shoulders, arms, and hands, and make your neck
> uncomfortable too,
>
> As for multiple wheels: the idea is not at all strange. I use to have
> bikes with 2 and even 3 wheelsets. For a while I would have one "main" bike
>  with 3 wheelsets (plus a beater or two): offroad knobbies with wide
> range gearing, 38 mm road tires for commuting with close ratio road
> gearing, and "gofast" with 200 gram skinnies and very close ratio gearing.
> More recently my Fargo had a 700C X 60 mm wheelset and a 700C X 35 mm
> wheelset, with disc rotors adjusted so that I could just slide each wheel
> into place without fiddling with caliper adjustment, And my 1999 Riv Road
> custom gofast will, God willing (hubs and rims with builder), shortly have
> 3 *rear *wheels, the "main" one with a flip/flop 15/17 t fixed hub, one
> for longer rides in rolling or windy conditions with a medium ratio 2-speed
> internal gear Sturmey Archer fixed hub, and one for steeper hills with a
> wide ratio 2-speed internal gear Sturmey Archer fixed hub.
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 5:03 PM Sofie C  wrote:
>
>> ... Patrick: I've considered trying some new tires, and have been eyeing
>> some from RH. I currently have Schwalbe G-One Evolution tires, and they're
>> 57mm, so perhaps I should try some lighter tires. I love the cush of the
>> G-Ones, but they are probably more robust than I need.
>>
> .
>>
> Does anyone keep more than one set of wheels for one bike or is that
>> utterly ridiculous?
>>
>

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Patrick Moore]

I expect that Rene Herse 42 or 48 or 52 mm tires will give you low rolling
resistance, lighter weight, and plenty of cushioning -- even my 28 mm extra
light Rene Herse Elk Passes at 55/60 f/r are surprisingly smooth over small
bumps, and the 42 mm Naches Passes ELs ditto at 40/45 psi,

Back to multiple wheels: IME, a pound or 2 or 3 really makes little
difference to the feeling of speed, even uphill. Some of my fastest
"feeling" bikes were rather heavy, and with rather heavy wheels. Tire
quality makes more difference than wheel weight, IME.

Also, bike setup and position makes a bigger difference in ease of pedaling
than a few lbs of weight, particularly saddle position with respect to
crank, IOW, torso angle at hips, which depends on proper saddle setback. A
saddle too far forward, or a hip angle too small, can make your pedaling
"weak" and awkward -- ie, you can't produce torque and it feels unnatural;
I learned this 27 years ago from Grant -- long story often repeated.
Moreover, a too-far-forward saddle will put *more* of your torso's weight
on your shoulders, arms, and hands, and make your neck uncomfortable too,

As for multiple wheels: the idea is not at all strange. I use to have bikes
with 2 and even 3 wheelsets. For a while I would have one "main" bike with
3 wheelsets (plus a beater or two): offroad knobbies with wide range
gearing, 38 mm road tires for commuting with close ratio road gearing, and
"gofast" with 200 gram skinnies and very close ratio gearing. More recently
my Fargo had a 700C X 60 mm wheelset and a 700C X 35 mm wheelset, with disc
rotors adjusted so that I could just slide each wheel into place without
fiddling with caliper adjustment, And my 1999 Riv Road custom gofast will,
God willing (hubs and rims with builder), shortly have 3 *rear *wheels, the
"main" one with a flip/flop 15/17 t fixed hub, one for longer rides in
rolling or windy conditions with a medium ratio 2-speed internal gear
Sturmey Archer fixed hub, and one for steeper hills with a wide ratio
2-speed internal gear Sturmey Archer fixed hub.

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 5:03 PM Sofie C  wrote:

> ... Patrick: I've considered trying some new tires, and have been eyeing
> some from RH. I currently have Schwalbe G-One Evolution tires, and they're
> 57mm, so perhaps I should try some lighter tires. I love the cush of the
> G-Ones, but they are probably more robust than I need.
>
.
>
Does anyone keep more than one set of wheels for one bike or is that
> utterly ridiculous?
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Richard Rose]

Not ridiculous at all in my opinion. Before I got the Clem I got a second set 
of identical wheels for my Jones. Both were set up tubeless, one with plus size 
MTB tires, the other with tires more suited for road / gravel duties. Key to 
this working was that they were identical including the disk brake rotors. This 
meant it was true plug & play - with no need for adjusting the brakes. That is 
the primary reason I will not be getting an alternate set of wheels for the 
Clem. I do not want to have to adjust those brake pads for different rims every 
time I swap wheels. I too have the G1 tires on my Clem. They have the less 
expensive “performance” casings however. Though I am enjoying the ride quality 
of these 2.25” (57mm?) tires they are 725 grams each! The Rene Herse Juniper 
Ridge (48mm) are I think 480 grams in the standard casing, and like 415 in the 
extra light. That’s where I plan to start - just getting significantly lighter 
tires for the wheels I have. Going tubeless of course could save a bit more 
weight. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 21, 2022, at 7:03 PM, Sofie C  wrote:
> 
> Wow, thank you Joe, Joe B, Collin, Patrick, and Richard for such helpful 
> responses. 
> 
> Joe: Touche! I've also thought about spending more of my energy on 
> strengthening my legs - maybe then the hills won't feel so cumbersome!
> 
> Joe B: That's an interesting option 4! Good point about the weight of the 
> dyno hub being substantial.
> 
> Collin: It's funny you mention your partner's AHH... I have no faith in my 
> ability to learn wheel building at this point in my life, but I did nearly 
> use this conundrum to rationalize acquiring a Rivendell frame for my husband 
> to make use of the current wheels. Did you end up keeping a dynamo hub on the 
> front wheel of your clem?
> 
> Patrick: I've considered trying some new tires, and have been eyeing some 
> from RH. I currently have Schwalbe G-One Evolution tires, and they're 57mm, 
> so perhaps I should try some lighter tires. I love the cush of the G-Ones, 
> but they are probably more robust than I need.
> 
> Richard: It's nice to hear I'm not alone in practicing "mental gymnastics" 
> around my Clem! I will check out the Quills too, though they are likely out 
> of my budget... I was thinking about an option like Cliffhanger rims with a 
> decent, non-dyno hub and lighter tires, which would set me back by more like 
> $600... 
>  
> Does anyone keep more than one set of wheels for one bike or is that utterly 
> ridiculous?
> 
> 
>> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 6:40:55 PM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>> I go through these mental gymnastics all of the time. First, I was just 
>> recently looking at the Cliffhanger vs. Atlas thing. I was surprised that 
>> Velocity shows the Cliffhanger is actually heavier than the Atlas? My Clem 
>> came with the Cliffhanger wheels. They are sturdy & I like them. But they 
>> are heavy - as is the Clem. That said, if I wanted to ride this bike 
>> exclusively on pavement & not loaded I would be in the market for lighter 
>> wheels & tires. I think one could save easily 2 pounds of rotational weight 
>> which would be noticeable. Might be the only way to remove meaningful weight 
>> from a Clem? One scenario might be a set of Velocity wheels utilizing their 
>> Quill rim. Those wheels combined with perhaps a 38mm - 42mm tire would, I 
>> think, save at least two pounds though I have not confirmed the numbers. But 
>> it is a significant cost. Nearly $1k for the wheelset alone.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
 On Mar 21, 2022, at 5:44 PM, Collin A  wrote:
 
>>> Sofie,
>> 
>>> 
>>> I went through literally this exact conundrum not too long after I got my 
>>> 52 clem in 2017. It sounds like the speed of climbing (and therefore gear 
>>> choice) is not an issue, more of how it feels. Also, once you go dyanmo 
>>> (especially a nice one like the SON, its hard to go back).
>>> I chose Option #2 in your case (cliffhanger plus a new rear hub), and ended 
>>> up re-lacing the existing clem hubs and spokes with some lighter rims 
>>> (pacenti brevets) and used them for my partner's AHH. It also gave me an 
>>> excuse to pickup the skills of wheelbuilding, which is not as intimidating 
>>> it seems.
>>> The new setup made a big difference in how the bike felt, but I also used 
>>> the new tubeless compatible rims to setup the clem tubeless, so that also 
>>> had an affect on the ride feel (i.e. lower pressures and less rotating 
>>> weight, tubes are heavy!). Did it make me quicker riding up hills? Strava 
>>> says maybe, but regardless it did make the bike feel much zippier when 
>>> climbing which helped me enjoy riding the clem on bigger days with bigger 
>>> hills.
>>> 
>>> If I were to do it again, I'd setup the clem with even lighter duty rims, 
>>> something like the Pacenti Brevet or Velocity Quills. When built up by a 
>>> good wheelbuilder, they can make an excellent set of wheels that can handle 
>>> hillibike styl

Re: [RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Collin A]

Fair enough on the unwillingness to learn wheelbuilding. I kept a dynamo on 
the front of my clem, as it served double duty as my commuter and its just 
so convenient for a commuter bike. My wife loves her lighter dynamo'd AHH 
as well!

I do have a second set of wheels for my Ritchey Outback Breakaway, but they 
are my travel wheels which are smaller and easier to pack (650b vs 700 for 
normal use) and a bit more durable (alu vs. carbon) and not something I 
shed a tear over if they get dinged or damaged in the case.

Cheers,
Collin in Sacramento

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 4:03:06 PM UTC-7 sof...@gmail.com wrote:

> Wow, thank you Joe, Joe B, Collin, Patrick, and Richard for such helpful 
> responses. 
>
> Joe: Touche! I've also thought about spending more of my energy on 
> strengthening my legs - maybe then the hills won't feel so cumbersome!
>
> Joe B: That's an interesting option 4! Good point about the weight of the 
> dyno hub being substantial.
>
> Collin: It's funny you mention your partner's AHH... I have no faith in my 
> ability to learn wheel building at this point in my life, but I did nearly 
> use this conundrum to rationalize acquiring a Rivendell frame for my 
> husband to make use of the current wheels. Did you end up keeping a dynamo 
> hub on the front wheel of your clem?
>
> Patrick: I've considered trying some new tires, and have been eyeing some 
> from RH. I currently have Schwalbe G-One Evolution tires, and they're 57mm, 
> so perhaps I should try some lighter tires. I love the cush of the G-Ones, 
> but they are probably more robust than I need.
>
> Richard: It's nice to hear I'm not alone in practicing "mental gymnastics" 
> around my Clem! I will check out the Quills too, though they are likely out 
> of my budget... I was thinking about an option like Cliffhanger rims with a 
> decent, non-dyno hub and lighter tires, which would set me back by more 
> like $600... 
>  
> Does anyone keep more than one set of wheels for one bike or is that 
> utterly ridiculous?
>
>
> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 6:40:55 PM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I go through these mental gymnastics all of the time. First, I was just 
>> recently looking at the Cliffhanger vs. Atlas thing. I was surprised that 
>> Velocity shows the Cliffhanger is actually heavier than the Atlas? My Clem 
>> came with the Cliffhanger wheels. They are sturdy & I like them. But they 
>> are heavy - as is the Clem. That said, if I wanted to ride this bike 
>> exclusively on pavement & not loaded I would be in the market for lighter 
>> wheels & tires. I think one could save easily 2 pounds of rotational weight 
>> which would be noticeable. Might be the only way to remove meaningful 
>> weight from a Clem? One scenario might be a set of Velocity wheels 
>> utilizing their Quill rim. Those wheels combined with perhaps a 38mm - 42mm 
>> tire would, I think, save at least two pounds though I have not confirmed 
>> the numbers. But it is a significant cost. Nearly $1k for the wheelset 
>> alone.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Mar 21, 2022, at 5:44 PM, Collin A  wrote:
>>
>> Sofie,
>>
>>
>> I went through literally this exact conundrum not too long after I got my 
>> 52 clem in 2017. It sounds like the speed of climbing (and therefore gear 
>> choice) is not an issue, more of how it feels. Also, once you go dyanmo 
>> (especially a nice one like the SON, its hard to go back).
>>
>>- I chose Option #2 in your case (cliffhanger plus a new rear hub), 
>>and ended up re-lacing the existing clem hubs and spokes with some 
>> lighter 
>>rims (pacenti brevets) and used them for my partner's AHH. It also gave 
>> me 
>>an excuse to pickup the skills of wheelbuilding, which is not as 
>>intimidating it seems.
>>
>> The new setup made a big difference in how the bike felt, but I also used 
>> the new tubeless compatible rims to setup the clem tubeless, so that also 
>> had an affect on the ride feel (i.e. lower pressures and less rotating 
>> weight, tubes are heavy!). Did it make me quicker riding up hills? Strava 
>> says maybe, but regardless it did make the bike feel much zippier when 
>> climbing which helped me enjoy riding the clem on bigger days with bigger 
>> hills.
>>
>> If I were to do it again, I'd setup the clem with even lighter duty rims, 
>> something like the Pacenti Brevet or Velocity Quills. When built up by a 
>> good wheelbuilder, they can make an excellent set of wheels that can handle 
>> hillibike style (but not reckless!) riding with abandon. The tradeoff here 
>> is the narrow brake track, something to keep an eye on as the pads wear 
>> down.
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>> Collin in Pancake Sacramento
>>
>> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 1:49:09 PM UTC-7 sof...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Help! I'm stuck in analysis paralysis... I have a size 45 Clem complete 
>>> that I adore, purchased in the last Riv lottery. I wanted dynamo lighting 
>>> so I had my local bike shop rebuild the stock f

[RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Garth]

As long gravity(the grave) remains a foe . gravity will have it's way. 
It doesn't matter if you lighten the load . only want your little 
morsel .that there is still a load at all in the first place 
anything to contend with . a foe that's what's called "gravity". A 
force, presence or power that can't be contended with . like drive-by 
sarcasm always reminding you of what's "to come" just when you think you're 
making "progress. 

HaH !   Well that's the story .. made up on the instant.. and so it 
goes with bike riding and all of "human" living. All those stories we 
tell ourselves . do this, no don't do that  can't you read that 
darn sign  "do not enter"  "you don't belong  you're too slow 
 too heavy  too weak  too old .. too poor .you're not 
enough this that and the other .".   If you buy into it .. you 
actually believe you can "improve" the situation . "if only" . I do 
this and that and the other. If only I pay .. monetarily or in thoughts 
and acts. It's a game that offers no escape  only prison  ... all 
played out int he snap of a finger  the blink of the eye(I). 

All nonsense !  Tee hee . 

All is Wonderful  all-ways. Anything contrary is "like a dream".a 
"runaway train-of-thoughts" dashing to and fro no-where. 

   (   (   (  smile  )   )   ) 

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 5:43:59 PM UTC-4 Collin A wrote:

> Sofie,
>
> I went through literally this exact conundrum not too long after I got my 
> 52 clem in 2017. It sounds like the speed of climbing (and therefore gear 
> choice) is not an issue, more of how it feels. Also, once you go dyanmo 
> (especially a nice one like the SON, its hard to go back).
>
>- I chose Option #2 in your case (cliffhanger plus a new rear hub), 
>and ended up re-lacing the existing clem hubs and spokes with some lighter 
>rims (pacenti brevets) and used them for my partner's AHH. It also gave me 
>an excuse to pickup the skills of wheelbuilding, which is not as 
>intimidating it seems.
>
> The new setup made a big difference in how the bike felt, but I also used 
> the new tubeless compatible rims to setup the clem tubeless, so that also 
> had an affect on the ride feel (i.e. lower pressures and less rotating 
> weight, tubes are heavy!). Did it make me quicker riding up hills? Strava 
> says maybe, but regardless it did make the bike feel much zippier when 
> climbing which helped me enjoy riding the clem on bigger days with bigger 
> hills.
>
> If I were to do it again, I'd setup the clem with even lighter duty rims, 
> something like the Pacenti Brevet or Velocity Quills. When built up by a 
> good wheelbuilder, they can make an excellent set of wheels that can handle 
> hillibike style (but not reckless!) riding with abandon. The tradeoff here 
> is the narrow brake track, something to keep an eye on as the pads wear 
> down.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Collin in Pancake Sacramento
>
> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 1:49:09 PM UTC-7 sof...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Help! I'm stuck in analysis paralysis... I have a size 45 Clem complete 
>> that I adore, purchased in the last Riv lottery. I wanted dynamo lighting 
>> so I had my local bike shop rebuild the stock front wheel with a SON hub. 
>> My clem feels quick enough for me - I'm a slow rider, and the weight 
>> doesn't bother me, except for when I'm riding uphill, and there are a lot 
>> of hills where I live. Still, I have wheel fomo, and I can't stop thinking 
>> about how good the Clem could be if I were to put on different wheels than 
>> the stock wheels.
>>
>> I'm considering a bunch of options, with the top ones being:
>>
>> 1. Get a set of new, relatively lightweight wheels without Dyno for 
>> daytime riding (which is what I mostly do anyway). Keep Clem stock wheels 
>> for when I really need the Dyno. I'd have two sets of wheels. 
>>
>> 2. Get new rims (Velocity Cliffhangers?) and salvage the SON hub - Rich 
>> can use the hub in rebuilding the front wheel. This leaves me with an extra 
>> Clem stock rear wheel. 
>>
>> 3. Be happy with what I have.
>>
>> What would you do?
>>
>> Sofie
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Sofie C]

Wow, thank you Joe, Joe B, Collin, Patrick, and Richard for such helpful 
responses. 

Joe: Touche! I've also thought about spending more of my energy on 
strengthening my legs - maybe then the hills won't feel so cumbersome!

Joe B: That's an interesting option 4! Good point about the weight of the 
dyno hub being substantial.

Collin: It's funny you mention your partner's AHH... I have no faith in my 
ability to learn wheel building at this point in my life, but I did nearly 
use this conundrum to rationalize acquiring a Rivendell frame for my 
husband to make use of the current wheels. Did you end up keeping a dynamo 
hub on the front wheel of your clem?

Patrick: I've considered trying some new tires, and have been eyeing some 
from RH. I currently have Schwalbe G-One Evolution tires, and they're 57mm, 
so perhaps I should try some lighter tires. I love the cush of the G-Ones, 
but they are probably more robust than I need.

Richard: It's nice to hear I'm not alone in practicing "mental gymnastics" 
around my Clem! I will check out the Quills too, though they are likely out 
of my budget... I was thinking about an option like Cliffhanger rims with a 
decent, non-dyno hub and lighter tires, which would set me back by more 
like $600... 
 
Does anyone keep more than one set of wheels for one bike or is that 
utterly ridiculous?


On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 6:40:55 PM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:

> I go through these mental gymnastics all of the time. First, I was just 
> recently looking at the Cliffhanger vs. Atlas thing. I was surprised that 
> Velocity shows the Cliffhanger is actually heavier than the Atlas? My Clem 
> came with the Cliffhanger wheels. They are sturdy & I like them. But they 
> are heavy - as is the Clem. That said, if I wanted to ride this bike 
> exclusively on pavement & not loaded I would be in the market for lighter 
> wheels & tires. I think one could save easily 2 pounds of rotational weight 
> which would be noticeable. Might be the only way to remove meaningful 
> weight from a Clem? One scenario might be a set of Velocity wheels 
> utilizing their Quill rim. Those wheels combined with perhaps a 38mm - 42mm 
> tire would, I think, save at least two pounds though I have not confirmed 
> the numbers. But it is a significant cost. Nearly $1k for the wheelset 
> alone.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 21, 2022, at 5:44 PM, Collin A  wrote:
>
> Sofie,
>
>
> I went through literally this exact conundrum not too long after I got my 
> 52 clem in 2017. It sounds like the speed of climbing (and therefore gear 
> choice) is not an issue, more of how it feels. Also, once you go dyanmo 
> (especially a nice one like the SON, its hard to go back).
>
>- I chose Option #2 in your case (cliffhanger plus a new rear hub), 
>and ended up re-lacing the existing clem hubs and spokes with some lighter 
>rims (pacenti brevets) and used them for my partner's AHH. It also gave me 
>an excuse to pickup the skills of wheelbuilding, which is not as 
>intimidating it seems.
>
> The new setup made a big difference in how the bike felt, but I also used 
> the new tubeless compatible rims to setup the clem tubeless, so that also 
> had an affect on the ride feel (i.e. lower pressures and less rotating 
> weight, tubes are heavy!). Did it make me quicker riding up hills? Strava 
> says maybe, but regardless it did make the bike feel much zippier when 
> climbing which helped me enjoy riding the clem on bigger days with bigger 
> hills.
>
> If I were to do it again, I'd setup the clem with even lighter duty rims, 
> something like the Pacenti Brevet or Velocity Quills. When built up by a 
> good wheelbuilder, they can make an excellent set of wheels that can handle 
> hillibike style (but not reckless!) riding with abandon. The tradeoff here 
> is the narrow brake track, something to keep an eye on as the pads wear 
> down.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Collin in Pancake Sacramento
>
> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 1:49:09 PM UTC-7 sof...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Help! I'm stuck in analysis paralysis... I have a size 45 Clem complete 
>> that I adore, purchased in the last Riv lottery. I wanted dynamo lighting 
>> so I had my local bike shop rebuild the stock front wheel with a SON hub. 
>> My clem feels quick enough for me - I'm a slow rider, and the weight 
>> doesn't bother me, except for when I'm riding uphill, and there are a lot 
>> of hills where I live. Still, I have wheel fomo, and I can't stop thinking 
>> about how good the Clem could be if I were to put on different wheels than 
>> the stock wheels.
>>
>> I'm considering a bunch of options, with the top ones being:
>>
>> 1. Get a set of new, relatively lightweight wheels without Dyno for 
>> daytime riding (which is what I mostly do anyway). Keep Clem stock wheels 
>> for when I really need the Dyno. I'd have two sets of wheels. 
>>
>> 2. Get new rims (Velocity Cliffhangers?) and salvage the SON hub - Rich 
>> can use the hub in 

[RBW] Re: Brooks B67 on a Clem or other upright bike

[Roberta]

I've had B17 and Flyer on my Joe Appaloosa.  I had the same on my AHH.  
They felt Ok, but not quite right (I liked the Flyer on the Joe very 
much).  Then I tried B67 and B68s on my Platy and AHH--so much better for 
my sits bones.  Instead of the saddle being between my sits bones, it was 
now under my sits bones.  

I like both B68 and B67 equally well and have the B67 on a bike I'm more 
likely to lock up (and possibly get stolen).  I can replace the B67.  Platy 
and AHH have the B68.

If I ever decide to go on a long ride on Platy  or AHH (like multiple days 
or >50 or 100 miles in one day), I might change the saddle to the B67 
springed version for the more shock absorbing quality.  My flyers squeaked 
but didn't bother me.  My B67 does not squeak.

Roberta

On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 12:19:32 PM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:

> This may or may not be a question aimed specifically at Clem owners. 
> Rivendell suggest the B67 for very upright positions. But, most Riv bikes 
> (Clem or other) I see have either B17, Flyer or other brand leather saddles 
> (Rivet, RH, SAA...). Even when I take a look at the Riv "staff bikes" I 
> rarely see a B67, though most of the bikes look pretty upright.
> FWIW, I tried a secondhand B67 on my Jones bike when I was struggling to 
> get comfortable on it after converting it from my mountain bike to my 
> everything else bike. In that effort I swapped the Jones loop bar for a 
> more swept back bar (Soma Oxford) and jacked the bars up using a VO Cigne 
> stem. I was pretty comfortable but just could not get the B67 in a place 
> where I was not sliding forward so I (foolishly?) sold it. But the 
> experiment led me to my interest in and eventual purchase of my Clem (Lucky 
> day!). To date I have only ridden the Clem with my trusty SQ Labs saddle 
> and it has been great for most of the nearly 600 miles I have put on the 
> bike. Most of those rides have been between 1 - 2.5 hours in length. The 
> other day I went almost three hours and my sit bones were getting 
> uncomfortable. My thinking is that the SQ is just too narrow for the very 
> upright position. The B67 seems the natural choice. Thus my question - why 
> do I not see more B67's on Riv bikes and on Clem's in particular?
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Brooks B67 on a Clem or other upright bike

[Richard Rose]

I have a S83 on the way. I did not realize it has more setback than the stock 
Kalloy?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 21, 2022, at 4:13 PM, 'John Phillips' via RBW Owners Bunch 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> You might also need a seat post with more setback, like Nitto S83 or S84. I 
> like the lugged Nitto S84, but everyone's different.
> 
> John
> 
>> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 12:35:08 PM UTC-7 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>> Very good to hear. I can deal with that.:)
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
 On Mar 21, 2022, at 2:08 PM, 'John Phillips' via RBW Owners Bunch 
  wrote:
 
>>> 
>> 
>>> If you were sliding off the front of the B67, next time angle the nose up 
>>> till the back is about level. Test ride and adjust until you no longer 
>>> slide forward or back. The nose might look like it's pointing up in a 
>>> dangerous direction, but I've never seen a well used B67 on a bike where 
>>> the nose wasn't pointed upward. It's not how your saddle looks when you're 
>>> not riding, it's how your saddle feels when you are.
>>> 
>>> It's more than just your riding position, the width of your sit bones 
>>> matters too as to whether the B67 will be comfortable. If you have wider 
>>> sit bones like me, a wider saddle like the B67 or the Berthoud Aubisque or 
>>> Berthoud Vars is a must.
>>> 
>>> John
>>> 
> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 9:19:32 AM UTC-7 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
> This may or may not be a question aimed specifically at Clem owners. 
> Rivendell suggest the B67 for very upright positions. But, most Riv bikes 
> (Clem or other) I see have either B17, Flyer or other brand leather 
> saddles (Rivet, RH, SAA...). Even when I take a look at the Riv "staff 
> bikes" I rarely see a B67, though most of the bikes look pretty upright.
> FWIW, I tried a secondhand B67 on my Jones bike when I was struggling to 
> get comfortable on it after converting it from my mountain bike to my 
> everything else bike. In that effort I swapped the Jones loop bar for a 
> more swept back bar (Soma Oxford) and jacked the bars up using a VO Cigne 
> stem. I was pretty comfortable but just could not get the B67 in a place 
> where I was not sliding forward so I (foolishly?) sold it. But the 
> experiment led me to my interest in and eventual purchase of my Clem 
> (Lucky day!). To date I have only ridden the Clem with my trusty SQ Labs 
> saddle and it has been great for most of the nearly 600 miles I have put 
> on the bike. Most of those rides have been between 1 - 2.5 hours in 
> length. The other day I went almost three hours and my sit bones were 
> getting uncomfortable. My thinking is that the SQ is just too narrow for 
> the very upright position. The B67 seems the natural choice. Thus my 
> question - why do I not see more B67's on Riv bikes and on Clem's in 
> particular?
 
>>> -- 
>> 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> 
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/2c1f99c5-a1e7-4ccf-8f0e-a010b8cd154dn%40googlegroups.com.
> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Richard Rose]

I go through these mental gymnastics all of the time. First, I was just 
recently looking at the Cliffhanger vs. Atlas thing. I was surprised that 
Velocity shows the Cliffhanger is actually heavier than the Atlas? My Clem came 
with the Cliffhanger wheels. They are sturdy & I like them. But they are heavy 
- as is the Clem. That said, if I wanted to ride this bike exclusively on 
pavement & not loaded I would be in the market for lighter wheels & tires. I 
think one could save easily 2 pounds of rotational weight which would be 
noticeable. Might be the only way to remove meaningful weight from a Clem? One 
scenario might be a set of Velocity wheels utilizing their Quill rim. Those 
wheels combined with perhaps a 38mm - 42mm tire would, I think, save at least 
two pounds though I have not confirmed the numbers. But it is a significant 
cost. Nearly $1k for the wheelset alone.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 21, 2022, at 5:44 PM, Collin A  wrote:
> 
> Sofie,
> 
> I went through literally this exact conundrum not too long after I got my 52 
> clem in 2017. It sounds like the speed of climbing (and therefore gear 
> choice) is not an issue, more of how it feels. Also, once you go dyanmo 
> (especially a nice one like the SON, its hard to go back).
> I chose Option #2 in your case (cliffhanger plus a new rear hub), and ended 
> up re-lacing the existing clem hubs and spokes with some lighter rims 
> (pacenti brevets) and used them for my partner's AHH. It also gave me an 
> excuse to pickup the skills of wheelbuilding, which is not as intimidating it 
> seems.
> The new setup made a big difference in how the bike felt, but I also used the 
> new tubeless compatible rims to setup the clem tubeless, so that also had an 
> affect on the ride feel (i.e. lower pressures and less rotating weight, tubes 
> are heavy!). Did it make me quicker riding up hills? Strava says maybe, but 
> regardless it did make the bike feel much zippier when climbing which helped 
> me enjoy riding the clem on bigger days with bigger hills.
> 
> If I were to do it again, I'd setup the clem with even lighter duty rims, 
> something like the Pacenti Brevet or Velocity Quills. When built up by a good 
> wheelbuilder, they can make an excellent set of wheels that can handle 
> hillibike style (but not reckless!) riding with abandon. The tradeoff here is 
> the narrow brake track, something to keep an eye on as the pads wear down.
> 
> Hope this helps,
> Collin in Pancake Sacramento
> 
>> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 1:49:09 PM UTC-7 sof...@gmail.com wrote:
>> Help! I'm stuck in analysis paralysis... I have a size 45 Clem complete that 
>> I adore, purchased in the last Riv lottery. I wanted dynamo lighting so I 
>> had my local bike shop rebuild the stock front wheel with a SON hub. My clem 
>> feels quick enough for me - I'm a slow rider, and the weight doesn't bother 
>> me, except for when I'm riding uphill, and there are a lot of hills where I 
>> live. Still, I have wheel fomo, and I can't stop thinking about how good the 
>> Clem could be if I were to put on different wheels than the stock wheels.
>> 
>> I'm considering a bunch of options, with the top ones being:
>> 
>> 1. Get a set of new, relatively lightweight wheels without Dyno for daytime 
>> riding (which is what I mostly do anyway). Keep Clem stock wheels for when I 
>> really need the Dyno. I'd have two sets of wheels. 
>> 
>> 2. Get new rims (Velocity Cliffhangers?) and salvage the SON hub - Rich can 
>> use the hub in rebuilding the front wheel. This leaves me with an extra Clem 
>> stock rear wheel. 
>> 
>> 3. Be happy with what I have.
>> 
>> What would you do?
>> 
>> Sofie
>> 
> 
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Re: [RBW] Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Patrick Moore]

Perhaps upgrading to really top quality tires might give you the
performance boost without quite as much cost as a new set of wheels? Rene
Herse tires can cost almost $100 each, but $200 is still cheaper than a new
wheelset and -- if your present tires are mediocre -- might make more
difference than a new wheelset.

https://www.renehersecycles.com/shop/components/tires/650b/650bx48-switchback-hill/

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 2:49 PM Sofie C  wrote:

> Help! I'm stuck in analysis paralysis... I have a size 45 Clem complete
> that I adore, purchased in the last Riv lottery. I wanted dynamo lighting
> so I had my local bike shop rebuild the stock front wheel with a SON hub.
> My clem feels quick enough for me - I'm a slow rider, and the weight
> doesn't bother me, except for when I'm riding uphill, and there are a lot
> of hills where I live. Still, I have wheel fomo, and I can't stop thinking
> about how good the Clem could be if I were to put on different wheels than
> the stock wheels.
>
> I'm considering a bunch of options, with the top ones being:
>
> 1. Get a set of new, relatively lightweight wheels without Dyno for
> daytime riding (which is what I mostly do anyway). Keep Clem stock wheels
> for when I really need the Dyno. I'd have two sets of wheels.
>
> 2. Get new rims (Velocity Cliffhangers?) and salvage the SON hub - Rich
> can use the hub in rebuilding the front wheel. This leaves me with an extra
> Clem stock rear wheel.
>
> 3. Be happy with what I have.
>
> What would you do?
>
> Sofie
>
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> 
> .
>


-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Collin A]

Sofie,

I went through literally this exact conundrum not too long after I got my 
52 clem in 2017. It sounds like the speed of climbing (and therefore gear 
choice) is not an issue, more of how it feels. Also, once you go dyanmo 
(especially a nice one like the SON, its hard to go back).

   - I chose Option #2 in your case (cliffhanger plus a new rear hub), and 
   ended up re-lacing the existing clem hubs and spokes with some lighter rims 
   (pacenti brevets) and used them for my partner's AHH. It also gave me an 
   excuse to pickup the skills of wheelbuilding, which is not as intimidating 
   it seems.

The new setup made a big difference in how the bike felt, but I also used 
the new tubeless compatible rims to setup the clem tubeless, so that also 
had an affect on the ride feel (i.e. lower pressures and less rotating 
weight, tubes are heavy!). Did it make me quicker riding up hills? Strava 
says maybe, but regardless it did make the bike feel much zippier when 
climbing which helped me enjoy riding the clem on bigger days with bigger 
hills.

If I were to do it again, I'd setup the clem with even lighter duty rims, 
something like the Pacenti Brevet or Velocity Quills. When built up by a 
good wheelbuilder, they can make an excellent set of wheels that can handle 
hillibike style (but not reckless!) riding with abandon. The tradeoff here 
is the narrow brake track, something to keep an eye on as the pads wear 
down.

Hope this helps,
Collin in Pancake Sacramento

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 1:49:09 PM UTC-7 sof...@gmail.com wrote:

> Help! I'm stuck in analysis paralysis... I have a size 45 Clem complete 
> that I adore, purchased in the last Riv lottery. I wanted dynamo lighting 
> so I had my local bike shop rebuild the stock front wheel with a SON hub. 
> My clem feels quick enough for me - I'm a slow rider, and the weight 
> doesn't bother me, except for when I'm riding uphill, and there are a lot 
> of hills where I live. Still, I have wheel fomo, and I can't stop thinking 
> about how good the Clem could be if I were to put on different wheels than 
> the stock wheels.
>
> I'm considering a bunch of options, with the top ones being:
>
> 1. Get a set of new, relatively lightweight wheels without Dyno for 
> daytime riding (which is what I mostly do anyway). Keep Clem stock wheels 
> for when I really need the Dyno. I'd have two sets of wheels. 
>
> 2. Get new rims (Velocity Cliffhangers?) and salvage the SON hub - Rich 
> can use the hub in rebuilding the front wheel. This leaves me with an extra 
> Clem stock rear wheel. 
>
> 3. Be happy with what I have.
>
> What would you do?
>
> Sofie
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Joe Bernard]

4. Have your shop return the front wheel to a non-dyno hub. I think the 
main reason to try to drop significant weight from a Clem wheelset is to 
counteract the gain in a SON and headlamp, if you're pulling those 
weight-gainers out then it's probably enough to give your bike the 
sprightliness you need. At the end of the day a Clem is never going to be a 
superlight, you just need a little weight reduction boost on the hills. In 
my opinion. 

Joe Bernard

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 1:49:09 PM UTC-7 sof...@gmail.com wrote:

> Help! I'm stuck in analysis paralysis... I have a size 45 Clem complete 
> that I adore, purchased in the last Riv lottery. I wanted dynamo lighting 
> so I had my local bike shop rebuild the stock front wheel with a SON hub. 
> My clem feels quick enough for me - I'm a slow rider, and the weight 
> doesn't bother me, except for when I'm riding uphill, and there are a lot 
> of hills where I live. Still, I have wheel fomo, and I can't stop thinking 
> about how good the Clem could be if I were to put on different wheels than 
> the stock wheels.
>
> I'm considering a bunch of options, with the top ones being:
>
> 1. Get a set of new, relatively lightweight wheels without Dyno for 
> daytime riding (which is what I mostly do anyway). Keep Clem stock wheels 
> for when I really need the Dyno. I'd have two sets of wheels. 
>
> 2. Get new rims (Velocity Cliffhangers?) and salvage the SON hub - Rich 
> can use the hub in rebuilding the front wheel. This leaves me with an extra 
> Clem stock rear wheel. 
>
> 3. Be happy with what I have.
>
> What would you do?
>
> Sofie
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Joe Mullins]

Keep the wheels and change your gearing to make it climb easier!

Joe in Los Angeles

> On Mar 21, 2022, at 1:49 PM, Sofie C  wrote:
> 
> 
> Help! I'm stuck in analysis paralysis... I have a size 45 Clem complete that 
> I adore, purchased in the last Riv lottery. I wanted dynamo lighting so I had 
> my local bike shop rebuild the stock front wheel with a SON hub. My clem 
> feels quick enough for me - I'm a slow rider, and the weight doesn't bother 
> me, except for when I'm riding uphill, and there are a lot of hills where I 
> live. Still, I have wheel fomo, and I can't stop thinking about how good the 
> Clem could be if I were to put on different wheels than the stock wheels.
> 
> I'm considering a bunch of options, with the top ones being:
> 
> 1. Get a set of new, relatively lightweight wheels without Dyno for daytime 
> riding (which is what I mostly do anyway). Keep Clem stock wheels for when I 
> really need the Dyno. I'd have two sets of wheels. 
> 
> 2. Get new rims (Velocity Cliffhangers?) and salvage the SON hub - Rich can 
> use the hub in rebuilding the front wheel. This leaves me with an extra Clem 
> stock rear wheel. 
> 
> 3. Be happy with what I have.
> 
> What would you do?
> 
> Sofie
> 
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[RBW] Clem wheel woes: To rebuild or not to build...

[Sofie C]

Help! I'm stuck in analysis paralysis... I have a size 45 Clem complete 
that I adore, purchased in the last Riv lottery. I wanted dynamo lighting 
so I had my local bike shop rebuild the stock front wheel with a SON hub. 
My clem feels quick enough for me - I'm a slow rider, and the weight 
doesn't bother me, except for when I'm riding uphill, and there are a lot 
of hills where I live. Still, I have wheel fomo, and I can't stop thinking 
about how good the Clem could be if I were to put on different wheels than 
the stock wheels.

I'm considering a bunch of options, with the top ones being:

1. Get a set of new, relatively lightweight wheels without Dyno for daytime 
riding (which is what I mostly do anyway). Keep Clem stock wheels for when 
I really need the Dyno. I'd have two sets of wheels. 

2. Get new rims (Velocity Cliffhangers?) and salvage the SON hub - Rich can 
use the hub in rebuilding the front wheel. This leaves me with an extra 
Clem stock rear wheel. 

3. Be happy with what I have.

What would you do?

Sofie

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Re: [RBW] Re: Brooks B67 on a Clem or other upright bike

['John Phillips' via RBW Owners Bunch]

You might also need a seat post with more setback, like Nitto S83 or S84. I 
like the lugged Nitto S84, but everyone's different.

John

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 12:35:08 PM UTC-7 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:

> Very good to hear. I can deal with that.:)
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 21, 2022, at 2:08 PM, 'John Phillips' via RBW Owners Bunch <
> rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
> 
>
> If you were sliding off the front of the B67, next time angle the nose up 
> till the back is about level. Test ride and adjust until you no longer 
> slide forward or back. The nose might look like it's pointing up in a 
> dangerous direction, but I've never seen a well used B67 on a bike where 
> the nose wasn't pointed upward. It's not how your saddle looks when you're 
> not riding, it's how your saddle feels when you are.
>
> It's more than just your riding position, the width of your sit bones 
> matters too as to whether the B67 will be comfortable. If you have wider 
> sit bones like me, a wider saddle like the B67 or the Berthoud Aubisque or 
> Berthoud Vars is a must.
>
> John
>
> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 9:19:32 AM UTC-7 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> This may or may not be a question aimed specifically at Clem owners. 
>> Rivendell suggest the B67 for very upright positions. But, most Riv bikes 
>> (Clem or other) I see have either B17, Flyer or other brand leather saddles 
>> (Rivet, RH, SAA...). Even when I take a look at the Riv "staff bikes" I 
>> rarely see a B67, though most of the bikes look pretty upright.
>> FWIW, I tried a secondhand B67 on my Jones bike when I was struggling to 
>> get comfortable on it after converting it from my mountain bike to my 
>> everything else bike. In that effort I swapped the Jones loop bar for a 
>> more swept back bar (Soma Oxford) and jacked the bars up using a VO Cigne 
>> stem. I was pretty comfortable but just could not get the B67 in a place 
>> where I was not sliding forward so I (foolishly?) sold it. But the 
>> experiment led me to my interest in and eventual purchase of my Clem (Lucky 
>> day!). To date I have only ridden the Clem with my trusty SQ Labs saddle 
>> and it has been great for most of the nearly 600 miles I have put on the 
>> bike. Most of those rides have been between 1 - 2.5 hours in length. The 
>> other day I went almost three hours and my sit bones were getting 
>> uncomfortable. My thinking is that the SQ is just too narrow for the very 
>> upright position. The B67 seems the natural choice. Thus my question - why 
>> do I not see more B67's on Riv bikes and on Clem's in particular?
>>
> -- 
>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Parts

[Matthew Williams]

Brooks B17 saddle: sold!

Still available:

Wheelset: $400 obo

Cassette & derailleur (sold as a set): $60 obo



On Mar 20, 2022, at 9:10 PM, Matthew Williams  
wrote:

> Albatross bars, bar-end shifter mounts, levers, and grips: Sold!
> 
> Still available:
> 
> Wheelset: $400 obo
> 
> Cassette & derailleur (sold as a set): $60 obo
> 
> 
> 
> On Mar 17, 2022, at 4:08 PM, Matthew Williams 
>  wrote:
> 
>> More photos.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Brooks B67 on a Clem or other upright bike

[Richard Rose]

Very good to hear. I can deal with that.:)

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 21, 2022, at 2:08 PM, 'John Phillips' via RBW Owners Bunch 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> If you were sliding off the front of the B67, next time angle the nose up 
> till the back is about level. Test ride and adjust until you no longer slide 
> forward or back. The nose might look like it's pointing up in a dangerous 
> direction, but I've never seen a well used B67 on a bike where the nose 
> wasn't pointed upward. It's not how your saddle looks when you're not riding, 
> it's how your saddle feels when you are.
> 
> It's more than just your riding position, the width of your sit bones matters 
> too as to whether the B67 will be comfortable. If you have wider sit bones 
> like me, a wider saddle like the B67 or the Berthoud Aubisque or Berthoud 
> Vars is a must.
> 
> John
> 
>> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 9:19:32 AM UTC-7 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>> This may or may not be a question aimed specifically at Clem owners. 
>> Rivendell suggest the B67 for very upright positions. But, most Riv bikes 
>> (Clem or other) I see have either B17, Flyer or other brand leather saddles 
>> (Rivet, RH, SAA...). Even when I take a look at the Riv "staff bikes" I 
>> rarely see a B67, though most of the bikes look pretty upright.
>> FWIW, I tried a secondhand B67 on my Jones bike when I was struggling to get 
>> comfortable on it after converting it from my mountain bike to my everything 
>> else bike. In that effort I swapped the Jones loop bar for a more swept back 
>> bar (Soma Oxford) and jacked the bars up using a VO Cigne stem. I was pretty 
>> comfortable but just could not get the B67 in a place where I was not 
>> sliding forward so I (foolishly?) sold it. But the experiment led me to my 
>> interest in and eventual purchase of my Clem (Lucky day!). To date I have 
>> only ridden the Clem with my trusty SQ Labs saddle and it has been great for 
>> most of the nearly 600 miles I have put on the bike. Most of those rides 
>> have been between 1 - 2.5 hours in length. The other day I went almost three 
>> hours and my sit bones were getting uncomfortable. My thinking is that the 
>> SQ is just too narrow for the very upright position. The B67 seems the 
>> natural choice. Thus my question - why do I not see more B67's on Riv bikes 
>> and on Clem's in particular?
> 
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[RBW] Re: FS: 52cm Clem L complete

[Marc R]

Sold

On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 10:33:42 PM UTC-7 Marc R wrote:

> SPF,  thanks for the interest and inquiries
>
> On Friday, March 18, 2022 at 2:29:29 PM UTC-7 Friend wrote:
>
>> Got any more pictures?
>>
>> On Friday, March 18, 2022 at 4:03:53 PM UTC-4 zac.te...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> pm sent
>>>
>>> On Thursday, March 17, 2022 at 4:07:11 PM UTC-7 Marc R wrote:
>>>
 Purchased new (2016) from RBW, ridden around town only.
 I bought a larger size so am selling this one.

 Standard Riv build, mustard color, with:
 Rene Hearse Switchback Hill tires
 SKS fenders
 Wald Clem Bosco Basket
 $1600

 prefer local (NorCal) sale

 Cheers,
 Marc
 Davis, CA

 [image: IMG_0253.jpeg]

>>>

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[RBW] Re: Brooks B67 on a Clem or other upright bike

['John Phillips' via RBW Owners Bunch]

If you were sliding off the front of the B67, next time angle the nose up 
till the back is about level. Test ride and adjust until you no longer 
slide forward or back. The nose might look like it's pointing up in a 
dangerous direction, but I've never seen a well used B67 on a bike where 
the nose wasn't pointed upward. It's not how your saddle looks when you're 
not riding, it's how your saddle feels when you are.

It's more than just your riding position, the width of your sit bones 
matters too as to whether the B67 will be comfortable. If you have wider 
sit bones like me, a wider saddle like the B67 or the Berthoud Aubisque or 
Berthoud Vars is a must.

John

On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 9:19:32 AM UTC-7 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:

> This may or may not be a question aimed specifically at Clem owners. 
> Rivendell suggest the B67 for very upright positions. But, most Riv bikes 
> (Clem or other) I see have either B17, Flyer or other brand leather saddles 
> (Rivet, RH, SAA...). Even when I take a look at the Riv "staff bikes" I 
> rarely see a B67, though most of the bikes look pretty upright.
> FWIW, I tried a secondhand B67 on my Jones bike when I was struggling to 
> get comfortable on it after converting it from my mountain bike to my 
> everything else bike. In that effort I swapped the Jones loop bar for a 
> more swept back bar (Soma Oxford) and jacked the bars up using a VO Cigne 
> stem. I was pretty comfortable but just could not get the B67 in a place 
> where I was not sliding forward so I (foolishly?) sold it. But the 
> experiment led me to my interest in and eventual purchase of my Clem (Lucky 
> day!). To date I have only ridden the Clem with my trusty SQ Labs saddle 
> and it has been great for most of the nearly 600 miles I have put on the 
> bike. Most of those rides have been between 1 - 2.5 hours in length. The 
> other day I went almost three hours and my sit bones were getting 
> uncomfortable. My thinking is that the SQ is just too narrow for the very 
> upright position. The B67 seems the natural choice. Thus my question - why 
> do I not see more B67's on Riv bikes and on Clem's in particular?
>

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Re: [RBW] Front Range Riv Riders? Atlantis curious in Boulder

[Ben Mihovk]

Good morning!
I don't know how you'd define "a few hours," but I'm in Omaha, NE and have 
a 59cm. If for some strange reason you found yourself in town, you'd be 
more than welcome to give it a spin. I'm confident, though, that you'll 
encounter one a little closer to home.

Ben in Omaha. 

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 11:10:31 AM UTC-5 Johnny Alien wrote:

> Rivendell likes to put people in the MAX size possible. With the expanded 
> geometry I am almost always at the top of one size and the very bottom of 
> another.  Rivendell has suggested the larger sizes but time has shown me 
> that I prefer to be at the top of a size vs the bottom contrary to what 
> they would push for me.  It looks like you might be exactly the same with 
> the Atlantis frame. A PBH of 89.5 is the minimum size that that they would 
> recommend for the 59 which would put you at the very bottom for that size 
> and at the top for the 55.  That makes it tricky and a lot will come down 
> to personal preference. I hope you can find a good source for a try out!! 
>
> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 9:48:13 AM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I am still new here but I suspect you will get a lot of folks suggesting 
>> you depend on & trust the advice on fit that is available just from talking 
>> to the folks at Riv. They will not steer you wrong. Of course there is 
>> nothing wrong with riding first if the opportunity presents itself.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Mar 21, 2022, at 1:32 AM, Christian B-H a wrote:
>>
>> Hi All-
>>
>> A Riv admirer from afar since 2019 thanks to my Rivspirational Uncle Andy 
>> in SF. Grant's Bluhgs and Riv-stuff kept me mostly sane from 2019 till now 
>> and influenced my decision to get a steel "gravel" bike with bigger tires 
>> over carbon.  I had a chance in July 2021 to  go to Walnut Creek, and my 
>> wife and friends who joined will attest I was like a kid in a candy shop. I 
>> remember glancing over at Grant who was practicing laps on the 
>> long-stemmed, mini cycle with James, and then looking back at Antonio, who 
>> had Grant's Appaloosa in hand and saying, "Really? I can *ride HIS bike?*" 
>> (photo below- Me with Friend in Hat clarifying with Antonio. My wife in the 
>> background experiencing the Riv magic). 
>>
>> [image: 1866700f-dbed-4501-9ad3-abec74f90665.JPG]
>>
>> That day however I left with one thought in mind: Jame's Atlantis was the 
>> smoothest, best feeling bike I've ever ridden. Even if it was a size or so 
>> too small. 
>>
>> So, looking to determine what *size* Atlantis I'd be ahead of this next 
>> order, my question for this group is: *Is there anyone within a a few 
>> hours of Boulder, CO with a 55-60cm Atlantis who'd be willing to let me 
>> test ride? *
>>
>> I *think *I've seen at least one Atlantis in the wild here, and I *know 
>> *I've 
>> seen a few other Riv's around here...I'd love the opportunity to ride an 
>> Atlantis again before buying to help figure out sizing (I know PBH (89), 
>> calling to discuss, email etc. I've done it. I just want to see if I should 
>> go 55 or 59  based on feel, and experience the ride one more time to see 
>> which bike I may have to get rid of to help the purchase along). 
>>
>> Thanks for any help!
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Christian Beitel-Horton in Boulder, CO
>>
>> -- 
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Front Range Riv Riders? Atlantis curious in Boulder

[Johnny Alien]

Rivendell likes to put people in the MAX size possible. With the expanded 
geometry I am almost always at the top of one size and the very bottom of 
another.  Rivendell has suggested the larger sizes but time has shown me 
that I prefer to be at the top of a size vs the bottom contrary to what 
they would push for me.  It looks like you might be exactly the same with 
the Atlantis frame. A PBH of 89.5 is the minimum size that that they would 
recommend for the 59 which would put you at the very bottom for that size 
and at the top for the 55.  That makes it tricky and a lot will come down 
to personal preference. I hope you can find a good source for a try out!! 

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 9:48:13 AM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:

> I am still new here but I suspect you will get a lot of folks suggesting 
> you depend on & trust the advice on fit that is available just from talking 
> to the folks at Riv. They will not steer you wrong. Of course there is 
> nothing wrong with riding first if the opportunity presents itself.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 21, 2022, at 1:32 AM, Christian B-H a wrote:
>
> Hi All-
>
> A Riv admirer from afar since 2019 thanks to my Rivspirational Uncle Andy 
> in SF. Grant's Bluhgs and Riv-stuff kept me mostly sane from 2019 till now 
> and influenced my decision to get a steel "gravel" bike with bigger tires 
> over carbon.  I had a chance in July 2021 to  go to Walnut Creek, and my 
> wife and friends who joined will attest I was like a kid in a candy shop. I 
> remember glancing over at Grant who was practicing laps on the 
> long-stemmed, mini cycle with James, and then looking back at Antonio, who 
> had Grant's Appaloosa in hand and saying, "Really? I can *ride HIS bike?*" 
> (photo below- Me with Friend in Hat clarifying with Antonio. My wife in the 
> background experiencing the Riv magic). 
>
> [image: 1866700f-dbed-4501-9ad3-abec74f90665.JPG]
>
> That day however I left with one thought in mind: Jame's Atlantis was the 
> smoothest, best feeling bike I've ever ridden. Even if it was a size or so 
> too small. 
>
> So, looking to determine what *size* Atlantis I'd be ahead of this next 
> order, my question for this group is: *Is there anyone within a a few 
> hours of Boulder, CO with a 55-60cm Atlantis who'd be willing to let me 
> test ride? *
>
> I *think *I've seen at least one Atlantis in the wild here, and I *know *I've 
> seen a few other Riv's around here...I'd love the opportunity to ride an 
> Atlantis again before buying to help figure out sizing (I know PBH (89), 
> calling to discuss, email etc. I've done it. I just want to see if I should 
> go 55 or 59  based on feel, and experience the ride one more time to see 
> which bike I may have to get rid of to help the purchase along). 
>
> Thanks for any help!
>
> Best,
>
> Christian Beitel-Horton in Boulder, CO
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/654303a1-365a-4e30-9b6a-848e021223edn%40googlegroups.com
>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: FS - Bags: Sackville TrunkSack & Makeshifter Outback Saddlebag

[Huston]

Listed specs on Outback saddlebag: 13" wide, 7" deep, 8" tall.

Thanks,
Huston

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 11:50:20 AM UTC-4 Friend wrote:

> How big is the Makeshifter bag?  Do you happen to have a product-page link?
>
> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 9:55:26 AM UTC-4 Huston wrote:
>
>> Greetings,
>>
>> Both of these bags are technically used but remain in like new condition:
>>
>> 1. Rivendell Sackville TrunkSack - Small, olive.  I bought this bag from 
>> a fellow list-member with the intention to change a Wald/bag setup for the 
>> smaller TrunkSack, but I've decided to stick with the basket bag.  $80 
>> (shipping included to lower 48).
>>
>> 2. Makeshifter Outback Saddlebag.  It's hard to let this go, but this bag 
>> has simply not been used enough.  It's beautiful.  Includes Voile straps 
>> and carrying strap.  I think the Outbacks have been retired.  Tan canvas 
>> with olive webbing and pink interior.  You won't lose anything in this 
>> bag.  $255 (shipping included to lower 48).
>>
>> Pics are available here 
>> .
>>   
>> Please send a PM if interested.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Huston
>> Lexington, KY
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Brooks B67 on a Clem or other upright bike

[Friend]

Only complaint I have with my B67 on a very upright Joe App is that is 
squeaks.  I imagine some oil would fix that though.

On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 8:28:36 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:

> I've used a couple of B 67s and B 68s and they are very definitely made 
> for the old-fashioned sit-up-and-beg riding position; bend forward much and 
> you'll wish for something narrower. But for sitting bolt upright they were 
> fine, tho' I'm just as happy upright on a b 17-width saddle, which I find 
> too wide for drop bars 1" lower than saddle (the original Flite is perfect 
> for that, for me).
>
> But saddles are so personal that others' choices may well be very 
> different from what is comfortable for you.
>
> On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 10:19 AM Richard Rose  wrote:
>
>> This may or may not be a question aimed specifically at Clem owners. 
>> Rivendell suggest the B67 for very upright positions. But, most Riv bikes 
>> (Clem or other) I see have either B17, Flyer or other brand leather saddles 
>> (Rivet, RH, SAA...). Even when I take a look at the Riv "staff bikes" I 
>> rarely see a B67, though most of the bikes look pretty upright.
>> FWIW, I tried a secondhand B67 on my Jones bike when I was struggling to 
>> get comfortable on it after converting it from my mountain bike to my 
>> everything else bike. In that effort I swapped the Jones loop bar for a 
>> more swept back bar (Soma Oxford) and jacked the bars up using a VO Cigne 
>> stem. I was pretty comfortable but just could not get the B67 in a place 
>> where I was not sliding forward so I (foolishly?) sold it. But the 
>> experiment led me to my interest in and eventual purchase of my Clem (Lucky 
>> day!). To date I have only ridden the Clem with my trusty SQ Labs saddle 
>> and it has been great for most of the nearly 600 miles I have put on the 
>> bike. Most of those rides have been between 1 - 2.5 hours in length. The 
>> other day I went almost three hours and my sit bones were getting 
>> uncomfortable. My thinking is that the SQ is just too narrow for the very 
>> upright position. The B67 seems the natural choice. Thus my question - why 
>> do I not see more B67's on Riv bikes and on Clem's in particular?
>>
>> -- 
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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[RBW] Re: FS - Bags: Sackville TrunkSack & Makeshifter Outback Saddlebag

[Friend]

How big is the Makeshifter bag?  Do you happen to have a product-page link?

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 9:55:26 AM UTC-4 Huston wrote:

> Greetings,
>
> Both of these bags are technically used but remain in like new condition:
>
> 1. Rivendell Sackville TrunkSack - Small, olive.  I bought this bag from a 
> fellow list-member with the intention to change a Wald/bag setup for the 
> smaller TrunkSack, but I've decided to stick with the basket bag.  $80 
> (shipping included to lower 48).
>
> 2. Makeshifter Outback Saddlebag.  It's hard to let this go, but this bag 
> has simply not been used enough.  It's beautiful.  Includes Voile straps 
> and carrying strap.  I think the Outbacks have been retired.  Tan canvas 
> with olive webbing and pink interior.  You won't lose anything in this 
> bag.  $255 (shipping included to lower 48).
>
> Pics are available here 
> .
>   
> Please send a PM if interested.
>
> Thanks,
> Huston
> Lexington, KY
>

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[RBW] Re: FS: Nitto S83 post, Soma kickstand, Dynaplug

[Sofie C]

Seatpost sold. Kickstand and dynaplug still available. Feel free to make a 
reasonable offer! 

On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 7:41:37 PM UTC-4 Sofie C wrote:

> [image: image1.jpeg]Photos of scratches on seatpost
> [image: image2.jpeg]
> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 5:37:59 PM UTC-4 Sofie C wrote:
>
>> Clearing out a few parts to save up for some new ones on my wishlist!
>>
>>- Nitto S83 seatpost (26.8 x 300) - purchased from Riv, barely used, 
>>but has scratches - $95
>>- Soma kickstand (silver clamp-on) - purchased from Riv, mounted on 
>>my platypus and trimmed by local bike shop (message me for exact 
>>measurements). $28
>>- Dynaplug Racer (olive color) - brand new, purchased from Analog - 
>>$38
>>
>> Will ship at cost, or pickup in Cambridge, Mass. 
>>
>> Pictures here:
>> https://www.icloud.com/photos/#0edl37azVMityOZwUshTAwwtw
>>
>> Thanks for looking!
>>
>>

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[RBW] FS - Bags: Sackville TrunkSack & Makeshifter Outback Saddlebag

[Huston]

Greetings,

Both of these bags are technically used but remain in like new condition:

1. Rivendell Sackville TrunkSack - Small, olive.  I bought this bag from a 
fellow list-member with the intention to change a Wald/bag setup for the 
smaller TrunkSack, but I've decided to stick with the basket bag.  $80 
(shipping included to lower 48).

2. Makeshifter Outback Saddlebag.  It's hard to let this go, but this bag 
has simply not been used enough.  It's beautiful.  Includes Voile straps 
and carrying strap.  I think the Outbacks have been retired.  Tan canvas 
with olive webbing and pink interior.  You won't lose anything in this 
bag.  $255 (shipping included to lower 48).

Pics are available here 
.
  
Please send a PM if interested.

Thanks,
Huston
Lexington, KY

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[RBW] Re: New ride video.

[brendonoid]

I would certainly like to see footage of your Bombadil bombing it!

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