Re: [Repeater-Builder] Duty Cycle
On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 23:18:54 -, dy3lmk143_13mhz wrote: Transmitter and amplifier manufacturers usually specifies a duty cycle (i.e. 50W 100% duty cycle) on their product. then how do you prove what they specified is correct? Install a real big dummy load on the output, key the radio, and walk away for a couple days. If it's still running when you come back, I guess they were right :) Just curious WHY you want to prove it? I'm assuming you are talking about a Ham radio installation? The BUSIEST repeater around here *might* get 10% use during an average day, and that estimation is probably high (2.4 hours a day?). Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Lazer Audio and Electronics Baden, Ontario, Canada Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Duty Cycle
At 11:18 PM 4/19/2004 -, you wrote: Transmitter and amplifier manufacturers usually specifies a duty cycle (i.e. 50W 100% duty cycle) on their product. then how do you prove what they specified is correct? ---Doesn't it suck they don't give you the complete picture? Duty cycle is generally related to transistor junction temperature rise over a given period of time. I guess you could always look up the transistor spec's and see what they spec as a safe junction temperature. Of course you could always ask the manufacturer if they guarantee that duty cycle.. Ken -- President and CTO - Arcom Communications Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories. http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html Be sure to see our products at this year's Dayton Hamvention! Repeater Builders spaces 707 through 710 AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000 http://www.irlp.net Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Duty Cycle
Place the device in the mfgrs specified operation and monitor the active parameters over a lenght of time. Heat, current draw power output are good indicators. Amplifiers are all about heat reduction/removal. cheers skipp www.radiowrench.com dy3lmk143_13mhz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Transmitter and amplifier manufacturers usually specifies a duty cycle (i.e. 50W 100% duty cycle) on their product. then how do you prove what they specified is correct? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Duty Cycle
- Original Message - From: dy3lmk143_13mhz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 7:18 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Duty Cycle Transmitter and amplifier manufacturers usually specifies a duty cycle (i.e. 50W 100% duty cycle) on their product. then how do you prove what they specified is correct? For 100 % it should run forever keyed down. You may be about to key the transmitter and see how much the temperature rises in an hour or so. If it reaches a stable temp and that is below the meltdown of the devices it should be ok. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Sensitivity
Only one part of the equation. If receiver B has better front end protection/preformance, it's going to be a better choice. Many of the newer commercial and older low dollar repeater receivers crap-out on busy mountain tops and repeater sites, especially when you park a gasfet mixer (preamp) in front. I'd rather have a trusty numb old .75 uV micor, than a new whiz bang .25 uV repeater receiver with 4 toy helicals in the front end. Cheers Skipp www.radiowrench.com dy3lmk143_13mhz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If I have two receivers A and B. Receiver A has a sensitivity of 0.25uV for a 12dB SINAD and Receiver B has a 0.35uV, which has a better sensitivity? is it Receiver A? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Sensitivity
At 11:41 PM 4/19/2004 -, you wrote: Many of the newer commercial and older low dollar repeater receivers crap-out on busy mountain tops and repeater sites, especially when you park a gasfet mixer (preamp) in front. ---Now you know why I insist on using only Chip's stuff :-) Ken -- President and CTO - Arcom Communications Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories. http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html Be sure to see our products at this year's Dayton Hamvention! Repeater Builders spaces 707 through 710 AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000 http://www.irlp.net Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Duty Cycle
Just curious WHY you want to prove it? Because I'll be doing lots of justifications for the purchase of these brand. I'm choosing betwen two brands and the difference is duty cycle. I don't wanna be blame in the future for choosing these brand over the other. I'm assuming you are talking about a Ham radio installation? The BUSIEST repeater around here *might* get 10% use during an average day, and that estimation is probably high (2.4 hours a day?). So the repeater doesn't have to be 100% duty cycle? --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Tedd Doda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 23:18:54 -, dy3lmk143_13mhz wrote: Transmitter and amplifier manufacturers usually specifies a duty cycle (i.e. 50W 100% duty cycle) on their product. then how do you prove what they specified is correct? Install a real big dummy load on the output, key the radio, and walk away for a couple days. If it's still running when you come back, I guess they were right :) Just curious WHY you want to prove it? I'm assuming you are talking about a Ham radio installation? The BUSIEST repeater around here *might* get 10% use during an average day, and that estimation is probably high (2.4 hours a day?). Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Lazer Audio and Electronics Baden, Ontario, Canada Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Duty Cycle
On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 23:52:02 -, dy3lmk143_13mhz wrote: Because I'll be doing lots of justifications for the purchase of these brand. I'm choosing betwen two brands and the difference is duty cycle. I don't wanna be blame in the future for choosing these brand over the other. Ok...fill us in. What are the claims of the two brands? It doesn't hurt to mention the brands as well, because over the years, the chances are pretty good that someone here has used them. So the repeater doesn't have to be 100% duty cycle? Not necessarily. Take two types commercial repeaters we have here. a) Mastr II UHF/VHF: 100% duty cycle claimed. Would I trust them at 100% duty cycle? Sure. b) Kenwood TKR-820 (UHF): 50% duty cycle at 20 watts and 100% at 5 watts. Would I trust them for 100% duty cycle at 20 watts...nope (the manufacturer states that). But for Ham use, I wouldn't think twice about using them at 20 watts. They would and do work fine. Sometimes you have to look at what the application is before making up your mind. Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Lazer Audio and Electronics Baden, Ontario, Canada Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Duty Cycle
Sorry I forgot to mention its for commercial use. I'm deciding between Icom FR-3000 and Kenwood TKR-720. Both Repeaters has built-in power supply. here's a simple comparison SensitivityTX output power FR-3000 0.25uV 50W 100% Duty cycle TKR-720 0.35uV 15W 100% Duty cycle base on the specs, I think FR-3000 is better. I think supplier has to guarantee what was said on the specs are correct. --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Tedd Doda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 23:52:02 -, dy3lmk143_13mhz wrote: Because I'll be doing lots of justifications for the purchase of these brand. I'm choosing betwen two brands and the difference is duty cycle. I don't wanna be blame in the future for choosing these brand over the other. Ok...fill us in. What are the claims of the two brands? It doesn't hurt to mention the brands as well, because over the years, the chances are pretty good that someone here has used them. So the repeater doesn't have to be 100% duty cycle? Not necessarily. Take two types commercial repeaters we have here. a) Mastr II UHF/VHF: 100% duty cycle claimed. Would I trust them at 100% duty cycle? Sure. b) Kenwood TKR-820 (UHF): 50% duty cycle at 20 watts and 100% at 5 watts. Would I trust them for 100% duty cycle at 20 watts...nope (the manufacturer states that). But for Ham use, I wouldn't think twice about using them at 20 watts. They would and do work fine. Sometimes you have to look at what the application is before making up your mind. Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Lazer Audio and Electronics Baden, Ontario, Canada Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] old pageboy tone elements
Does anyone have any use for the tone elements like the old Motorola Pageboy used before I toss about 100 or so of them ? They are part number TLN 67098. They are from about 300 to 500 hz in frequency. I think the suffix behind the TLN is 4 digits... 6709or 6708 You are correct. The last number was really a B ... They have already been spoken for. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Duty Cycle
I'm assuming you are talking about a Ham radio installation? The BUSIEST repeater around here *might* get 10% use during an average day, and that estimation is probably high (2.4 hours a day?). So the repeater doesn't have to be 100% duty cycle? It all depends on how long the transmitter is keyed up at one time. If it is keyed for a period of 2.4 hours at one time out of 24 hours that is only 10 % duty streached out over the larger time frame. That repeater will melt down if it is not 100% duty. Most transmitters with less than 100% duty will specify a transmitt time and a cooling off time. Maybe something like transmitt for 5 minuits at one time and cool off for 10 to 20 minuits. Look here : http://www.qsl.net/ab4oj/quadra/icas.html Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Sensitivity
At 4/19/2004 04:48 PM, you wrote: At 07:35 PM 4/19/2004 -0400, you wrote: .35 uv sensitivity is kinda iffy in my book. 0.35uV is the rated sensitivity of most Mastr II repeaters (UHF anyway) WITHOUT a preamp. 0.20 with the preamp (info from the manual). ---Granted. And it STILL sucks :-) State of the art being what it is and with duplexer loses figured in, that should be considered a totally unacceptable spec for anything other than perhaps a temporary or portable repeater. Ken ...or perhaps a 2 meter repeater in SoCal. Here in the Los Angeles basin, I've measured antenna noise levels at around -123 dBm in a 16 kHz bandwidth, or 2270° K. A 0.30 µV for 12 dB SINAD receiver's equivalent input noise temperature is going to be somewhere near that value. I typically do not recommend preamps on receivers that make 0.30 µV or less on 2 meters. Usually the best G.E. Mastr II/Exec II/MVP receivers make it down to that. Bob NO6B Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Duty Cycle
On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 00:50:06 -, dy3lmk143_13mhz wrote: base on the specs, I think FR-3000 is better. I think supplier has to guarantee what was said on the specs are correct. Based on the specs, I would agree. Have you done a case study on what is needed for your particular situation (power, HAAT, gain and type of antenna)? I know up here in Canada, Industry Canada (your FCC) wants to know all this, and usually they are very helpful in determining what type of equipment you would need (for a commercial repeater). I would presume the FCC would be your best friend at times like this. What type of use (public safety, business, GMRS-I think that's what you call it!, etc) is the main tenant? Any type of public safety would mandate a 100% duty cycle I would think. Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Lazer Audio and Electronics Baden, Ontario, Canada Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Min FREQ Separtation, VHF rep, No Duplexers
I'll rephrase the question, what is the min frequency separtation for a 10W repeater with two ants, no vertical separation, horizontal sep of about 100'. I'm guessing it would have to be 2 MHz or more, but that is what I'm asking. Please don't answer .600 and 200' vertical because that is not the question. I'm referring to an emergency or garage repeater with odd split. Thanks! Tom N5OFF Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: FCC considers Auxiliary Operation on 2M!
I must make a comment here...people that think that repeaters should be there and not used is asking for the band to be removed by the FCC, that will fix all of your peoblemsThen you can keep all of the repeaters for EMERGENCIESExcept for one thing there will be no one there to help you when you need HELP. HOW ever I think that a repeater that is not used is a waste of frequency pairs and should be de coordinated and taken off the air and the pair should be given to someone who will use it. I will stop short of having the owner tared and feathered. I have seen this thinking destroy a club. If I need help, I will look for the busiest machine that I can find and make my call there. 73 Coy --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Joe Montierth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Jim B. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Doesn't matter-in fact a repeater that's tied up all day with chatter isn't available for emergency communications. Plus the more time it spends keyed up, the less time till something fails. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL Fred Flowers wrote: Yeah, but does anybody talk on all of them? From: Jim B. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] FCC considers Auxiliary Operation on 2M! Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 16:01:15 -0400 Joe Montierth wrote: In many parts of the US the 2M band is under-utilized, so I am not opposed to the idea, per-se. If everyone used good common sense, there shouldn't be many problems, but I can see how people feel about this based on their local conditions. Joe Joe I'd sure like to know where you're gettin the idea that 2M is 'underutilized'! Everywhere I've been (in the US), there's plenty of repeaters. Most areas there's too many! -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL A couple of comments: 1. If I had an emergency, I would go to the channel with the chatter on it, because that's where the people are, and thats where you'll get a response. It does no good to yell your brains out for help on a quiet channel, if no one's there to answer you. Also, as far as an unused repeater being less subject to failure, this is just not true. A well designed repeater will not wear out do to heavy use, ask anyone on this board who runs a well designed system. They're not afraid of people using it, or seeing it keyed for hours at a time. If you had to have a message hand delivered to someone two miles away, would you give it to the couch potato or the marathon runner? The couch potato should be all rested and ready to run that 2 miles, and the marathon man should be too worn out from his miles of practice in the last few weeks. But reality tells us it's no sweat for one of them, and a major challenge for the other. 2. One area where 2M is underutilized is here where I live. I can hit 3 2M repeaters with a handheld, and maybe 10 more with a good base. This is typical throughout our county and neighboring counties. Our county is the size of Connecticut. This is very typical of the rural western states. 3. Repeaters aren't all there are on 2M. With the normal bandplans being used today, there are at least 45 channels available for simplex use, exclusive of any repeater input or output. Even if half these channels were being used in any given area, that would still mean over 20 vacant channels for new usage. In most areas, over 90% of the simplex channels are vacant 90% of the time. 4. In reality, the 2M repeater output channels that were out of range from a certain location could be used by aux type systems, with no interference caused or received. The use of PL and/or DTMF or other codes could further reduce this. Joe __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Is there a relationship between 147.225 and 146.925?
Yes, there is: 3 X 146.925 - 2 X 147.225 = 146.325 (the input frequency of one of the repeaters) 3 X 147.225 - 2 X 146.925 = 147.828 (The input frequency of the other repeater) Because the PL tone of both repeaters rides on the intermod products, it will keep both repeaters keyed up. These 2 repeaters cannot co-exist without some serious filtering. Even then, the close physical spacing of the antennas may still be a problem for filters. The best fix would be to change the frequency of one of the repeaters. 73, Joe, K1ike At 03:50 PM 4/18/2004, you wrote: Message: 6 Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 18:04:23 - From: Michael Singewald N1PLH [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Is there a relationship between 147.225 and 146.925? There are two machines on the same tower on these frequencies with one antenna about 20 feet directly over the other. Each machine is putting out about 30 - 50 watts. Each machine plays fine by itself, but as soon as the other tranmitter comes up the problems begin. Each machine has a different PL required to key up (67 and 77). If someone unkeys on 146.925 while 147.225 is keyed, the 925 which encodes a pl seems to get into itself and the 225. The 925 transmitter also causes the same problem on the 225 receiver. These two are fine as long as the other is not keyed at the same time. Someone in the group has said that there is a harmonic causing this and those two repeaters just cannot be co located. I admit I don't know much about this, but how can a harmonic be causing this if they are both on VHF? I would think that mixing might possibly be responsible for this. The BpBr duplexers were just tuned so I don't think they are the problem. The SWR is flat on both machines as well. Also, both repeaters are new (1 Hamtronics, 1 Kendecom). How can I determine if the problem is mixing? If it is mixing, how can we fix it? Would a crystal filter on the receiver help? Neither of these machines are mine, so I am trying to gather info for the two affected groups, so thank you for any advice! All outgoing email scanned with Norton AntiVirus2004. Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Receiver Sensitivity
It is receiver A Thank you Joe I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set, I go into the other room and read a book. -- Groucho Marx, 1890-1977 -Original Message- From: dy3lmk143_13mhz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 8:05 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Receiver Sensitivity If I have two receivers A and B. Receiver A has a sensitivity of 0.25uV for a 12dB SINAD and Receiver B has a 0.35uV, which has a better sensitivity? is it Receiver A? Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Motorola SLN 6413A SERVICE MANUAL
I am in need of a Service manual, copy would be ok for the Motorola DPL Test Set SLN 6413A. Willing to pay a fair price for your time. I need to fix my test set as i am working on my repeater tone panel. Any help will do. thanks Ron WA6UNM Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Duty Cycle
They smoke a few out of every hundred built and rate them accordingly. dy3lmk143_13mhz wrote: Transmitter and amplifier manufacturers usually specifies a duty cycle (i.e. 50W 100% duty cycle) on their product. then how do you prove what they specified is correct? -- 73...Clark Beckman N8PZD Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] UHF MSR2000 tuned down to 440 MHz
We moved a bunch of 100-watt 460/465 MHz MSR-2000 repeaters down to the ham band. By just following the alignment procedure in the service manual, they tuned right up with excellent performance in the ham band - the receivers had better than spec sensitivity, the transmitters put out 100+ watts. No modifications of any kind were necessary. I have one that I tuned up on 440 and kept for myself as a garage repeater, but I have more repeaters than hilltops to put them on (and users to use them), so it will probably be going to the 'bay one of these days, along with a spare receiver and exciter. Larry K7LJ Original Message: - From: n9wys [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 23:41:48 - To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] UHF MSR2000 tuned down to 440 MHz Our repeater is an MSR2000 UHF model, Model # C74GBS3106BT. It was originally at 460 MHz, and we tuned it down to 444.550 / 449.550. Our problem is - we are only getting about .6 µv to .7 µv sensitivity in the receiver, and this is when feeding signal DIRECTLY into the receiver (no duplexer). If I remember, the manual says that nominal sensitivity should be about .2 µv... The tuning coils are bottomed out, so we have no more tuning available with which to improve the receiver. So, my question is: Does anyone know if there is any different receive boards available, other than the TRNE6262A ? If so, can you advise what the part number would be? I would think that Motorola MUST have made UHF repeaters lower than 450 MHZ, but I can't seem to locate any part numbers for receiver boards for any of those machines. (We called Motorola parts, and this is the part number for the receiver board they say belongs on our machine - of course, it's for 450-470 MHz range, which is what is specified by our model number. They were no help with whether there is any other receiver board available for any other frequency spread. Plus, the TRNE6262A is no longer available, anyway.) Also, my manual is not complete... We have all the sections for the transmitter, but the receiver stuff is all VHF. :-( Otherwise, I guess a modification is in order, and I'm not sure where to look for that. Can anyone point me in the right direction?? I'd be much obliged! Thanks! Mark - N9WYS Yahoo! Groups Links mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] UHF MSR2000 tuned down to 440 MHz
Our repeater is an MSR2000 UHF model, Model # C74GBS3106BT. It was originally at 460 MHz, and we tuned it down to 444.550 / 449.550. Our problem is - we are only getting about .6 µv to .7 µv sensitivity in the receiver, and this is when feeding signal DIRECTLY into the receiver (no duplexer). If I remember, the manual says that nominal sensitivity should be about .2 µv... The tuning coils are bottomed out, so we have no more tuning available with which to improve the receiver. So, my question is: Does anyone know if there is any different receive boards available, other than the TRNE6262A ? If so, can you advise what the part number would be? I would think that Motorola MUST have made UHF repeaters lower than 450 MHZ, but I can't seem to locate any part numbers for receiver boards for any of those machines. (We called Motorola parts, and this is the part number for the receiver board they say belongs on our machine - of course, it's for 450-470 MHz range, which is what is specified by our model number. They were no help with whether there is any other receiver board available for any other frequency spread. Plus, the TRNE6262A is no longer available, anyway.) Also, my manual is not complete... We have all the sections for the transmitter, but the receiver stuff is all VHF. :-( Otherwise, I guess a modification is in order, and I'm not sure where to look for that. Can anyone point me in the right direction?? I'd be much obliged! Thanks! Mark - N9WYS Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Min FREQ Separtation, VHF rep, No Duplexers
The answer lies along the diagonal lines; http://www.repeater-builder.com/pix/vertsep.jpg and http://www.repeater-builder.com/pix/horizsep.jpg - using the horizontal method you will need so much bandwidth you will be into the next radio band, like 222 and 440 or 146 and 222. This is just one of those things that doesn't work in the same band, period. You need isolation for the rx to hear without being desensed by the adjascent tx, you can get this using bandpass/notch cavity filters to keep one from the other, you could try some notch only filters and check the results but it will be tedious and you may find the loss is more than the gain but if all you have is time build them and give it a try. courir26 wrote: I'll rephrase the question, what is the min frequency separtation for a 10W repeater with two ants, no vertical separation, horizontal sep of about 100'. I'm guessing it would have to be 2 MHz or more, but that is what I'm asking. Please don't answer .600 and 200' vertical because that is not the question. I'm referring to an emergency or garage repeater with odd split. Thanks! Tom N5OFF -- 73...Clark Beckman N8PZD Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Question
Hello All: Questions: Does some problem exist if I share oneself RX antenna for two repeaters with a "Tee?" I thank any information in this respect. Regards UcaimaDo You Yahoo!? Todo lo que quieres saber de Estados Unidos, América Latina y el resto del Mundo. Visíta Yahoo! Noticias. Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Min FREQ Separtation, VHF rep, No Duplexers
I think you are expecting a miracle here and I doubt anyone on this list is going to be able to give you an exact answer. My suggestion is that you take two synthesized rigs and try different frequency separations. If you can accomplish the task with ham rigs, then you should be able to substitute a commercial transmitter and receiver and just, if you're lucky, have enough extra headroom to make it work reliably. My gut feeling is that you won't be able to accomplish what you are setting out to do at that small distance and stay within the ham band without the aid of a can or two. Chuck Kelsey WB2EDV courir26 wrote: I'll rephrase the question, what is the min frequency separtation for a 10W repeater with two ants, no vertical separation, horizontal sep of about 100'. I'm guessing it would have to be 2 MHz or more, but that is what I'm asking. Please don't answer .600 and 200' vertical because that is not the question. I'm referring to an emergency or garage repeater with odd split. Thanks! Tom N5OFF Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Min FREQ Separtation, VHF rep, No Duplexer s
Title: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Min FREQ Separtation, VHF rep, No Duplexers 100' separation between antennas and all users between the antennas Why not just use tin cans and string LOL ;) Seriously, ever think about using a simplex repeater ??? One radio, one antenna, no duplexer, can run off of batteries, can run on 1 frequency or 2 if you choose, no retuning or rearranging anything if you need to change frequencies. Ken KE4AWY -Original Message- From: Virden Clark Beckman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 8:53 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Min FREQ Separtation, VHF rep, No Duplexers Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Sensitivity
Chip makes repeater receivers? Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 11:41 PM 4/19/2004 -, you wrote: Many of the newer commercial and older low dollar repeater receivers crap-out on busy mountain tops and repeater sites, especially when you park a gasfet mixer (preamp) in front. ---Now you know why I insist on using only Chip's stuff :-) Ken Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: UHF MSR2000 tuned down to 440 MHz
Sure, I can help... Look up the receiver coil preset charts in the service manual and reset every coil to the factory preset. Then align the receiver using the manual steps in the proper order. Most people will only retouch the front end helicals. You need to do the entire realignment from scratch (out of adjustment) to properly align the injection levels. There is one or or two very small peak/dip adjustments, which can be missed. One must stare at the MSR alignment box after a cup of good coffee (not evil empire starbucks) to not miss one of the small peaks. Aligning the receiver with all the coils out of adjustment (presets) is quite different than a touch up, where the coils are somewhat near their final values. The injection change levels are different and that makes a difference. The MSR / Mitrek Receiver taught me not to fudge the complete alignment. cheers skipp www.radiowrench.com n9wys [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Our repeater is an MSR2000 UHF model, Model # C74GBS3106BT. It was originally at 460 MHz, and we tuned it down to 444.550 / 449.550. Our problem is - we are only getting about .6 µv to .7 µv sensitivity in the receiver, and this is when feeding signal DIRECTLY into the receiver (no duplexer). If I remember, the manual says that nominal sensitivity should be about .2 µv... The tuning coils are bottomed out, so we have no more tuning available with which to improve the receiver. So, my question is: Does anyone know if there is any different receive boards available, other than the TRNE6262A ? If so, can you advise what the part number would be? I would think that Motorola MUST have made UHF repeaters lower than 450 MHZ, but I can't seem to locate any part numbers for receiver boards for any of those machines. (We called Motorola parts, and this is the part number for the receiver board they say belongs on our machine - of course, it's for 450-470 MHz range, which is what is specified by our model number. They were no help with whether there is any other receiver board available for any other frequency spread. Plus, the TRNE6262A is no longer available, anyway.) Also, my manual is not complete... We have all the sections for the transmitter, but the receiver stuff is all VHF. :-( Otherwise, I guess a modification is in order, and I'm not sure where to look for that. Can anyone point me in the right direction?? I'd be much obliged! Thanks! Mark - N9WYS Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: UHF MSR2000 tuned down to 440 MHz
Skip - can you advise the part numbers for the manual sections for the UHF receiver? My manual has the transmitter stuff, but the receiver stuff is all for the VHF unit. I'm going to try to get them from Motorola... If I'm not successful, do you - or anyone else here - have the UHF receiver manual sections available for copy? Of course, I'll reimburse for any copying fees and postage Thanks, Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: skipp025 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 10:54 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: UHF MSR2000 tuned down to 440 MHz Sure, I can help... Look up the receiver coil preset charts in the service manual and reset every coil to the factory preset. Then align the receiver using the manual steps in the proper order. Most people will only retouch the front end helicals. You need to do the entire realignment from scratch (out of adjustment) to properly align the injection levels. There is one or or two very small peak/dip adjustments, which can be missed. One must stare at the MSR alignment box after a cup of good coffee (not evil empire starbucks) to not miss one of the small peaks. Aligning the receiver with all the coils out of adjustment (presets) is quite different than a touch up, where the coils are somewhat near their final values. The injection change levels are different and that makes a difference. The MSR / Mitrek Receiver taught me not to fudge the complete alignment. cheers skipp www.radiowrench.com Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] GE Mastr Exec II Base radios For Sale
Hello, I still have some of these UHF Mastr Exec II radios for sale, my problem is shipping. These things are heavy! I have no shipping material, if you guys want one of these radios I am going to have them professionally packed for shipment. I think I can get a pretty good deal through a local store here on multiple shipments, let me know. I am asking $100.00 each or $75.00 for two or more, Less in larger quantities. Also, I am going to be at Dayton, I will be in spaces 1121 and 1122. If you want one and you or a friend can pick it up there that will be fine, save some shipping cost that way. I will take cash, check with ID or cashiers check. I will be traveling from Fort Worth, Texas up to Meadville PA. on the 11th and 12th to deliver some other equipment, if you are along that route I can drop a radio or two or three or four (the more the better) off that way also! There you have it! Several ways to get one or more of these radios, just let me know. Laid off, just trying to make a living, Paul WB5IDM Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] MSR2000 Manuals
Hi Mark, There are three basic manuals for the MSR Series of repeater/base stations. First is the control and operation manual, which has the back-plane board and control module information. The VHF Manual has a green strip on the cover and contains the Transmitter/Receiver information. The power supply information is also in the VHF Manual. The UHF Manual has a blue strip on the cover and has the RF information for the UHF strips and the internal duplexer. I have at least two other non standard MSR Manuals, which are from as-built projects. What I call Canadian MSR's are lower rf power out and contain a consolette base type power supply, vs the power hungry high power US dc supplies. Part numbers are probably on the repeater builder web site. The special as-built manuals are probably not available. cheers skipp www.radiowrench.com Mark Tomany [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Skipp - can you advise the part numbers for the manual sections for the UHF receiver? My manual has the transmitter stuff, but the receiver stuff is all for the VHF unit. I'm going to try to get them from Motorola... If I'm not successful, do you - or anyone else here - have the UHF receiver manual sections available for copy? Of course, I'll reimburse for any copying fees and postage Thanks, Mark - N9WYS Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: PA Duty Cycle broadcasting
With the advent of IRLP, Echolink, VOIP and other linking schemes... some repeaters broadcast crap all day long. Does a good job of chasing the regular locals, who like to monitor a quiet repeater off the machine. PA duty cycle in excess of 80%, content worth listening to 2%. Ego of the repeater owner /control op, in excess of 115%. cheers, skipp I'm assuming you are talking about a Ham radio installation? The BUSIEST repeater around here *might* get 10% use during an average day, and that estimation is probably high (2.4 hours a day?). Tedd Doda, VE3TJD Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Sensitivity
Chip who? Receivers for which bands? - Original Message - From: skipp025 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 11:43 am Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Sensitivity Chip makes repeater receivers? Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 11:41 PM 4/19/2004 -, you wrote: Many of the newer commercial and older low dollar repeater receivers crap-out on busy mountain tops and repeater sites, especially when you park a gasfet mixer (preamp) in front. ---Now you know why I insist on using only Chip's stuff :-) Ken Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Sensitivity
Chip Angle of Angle Linear Preamp fame. His preamps are well made and well known throughout the Amateur and Commerical Radio World. His latest generation of P-hempt type devices are very low noise. The better news is the third order intercept is much better than a generic gasfet, very good news to us mountain top repeater people. I started building phempt preamps myself after seeing them in Dubus Magazine some 3 or 4 years back. There are a number of mfgrs and kit builders making /offering these newer generation preamps, although Chip claimed to me on the phone that he was the only one. Not actually the case based on my experience. His stuff is first rate preformers and very high quality, but I don't believe he's making receivers. What he does make, works very, very well. cheers skipp [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Chip who? Receivers for which bands? - Original Message - From: skipp025 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 11:43 am Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Sensitivity Chip makes repeater receivers? Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 11:41 PM 4/19/2004 -, you wrote: Many of the newer commercial and older low dollar repeater receivers crap-out on busy mountain tops and repeater sites, especially when you park a gasfet mixer (preamp) in front. ---Now you know why I insist on using only Chip's stuff :-) Ken Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] 2 repeaters - 1 Antenna
Hi everyone. I'm looking for input and information on the following project I am exploring. I may have to oppertunity to multicouple a UHF 440 repeater with our countys highway dept UHF repeater antenna. I have found some information on the Rx multicoupler but still looking for information on how to couple the 2 Tx. If anyone has experience and info please feel free to email me. Thank you for your time... Dan, KC0CAP Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re:Audio problems revisited
Robert W Burton wrote: Thanks Mike for your reply, The cool thing about the MCC converted stuff is that the controller is on the inside of the GE. The only openings are holes that are drilled above the pa section for a fan. There is a harness but it is for the remote base which plugs into the db-15 on the front of the thing. Of course you have the power cablesbut that is it. I am afraid I will have to borrow a trunking scanner to find this problem...or the lack there of if it is not overload. Thanks, Robert fwiw-you don't actually need a trunk tracker to handle what you want, since you're not interested in the flow of the conversation. Just program the freq's into a regular scanner that covers 800, and let it scan just those. You'll know MOST of the time when it's up, although it's possible for more than one channel to be up at the same time. Even if it's digital, if you keep the squelch on edge, it should still open, it'll just sound like white noise. A spectrum analyzer would, of course, be better, since you can see all the freqs at the same time. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] VHF Syntor X
Richard Velez wrote: Can this unit be programmed to the ham band without modifications. I would like to use one as a Transmitter on 2 meters only??? I didn't see another response to this. Yes, they *usually* go down to the ham band with no transmit mods, and just a little tweak on the front end preselector, which I can send a chart which shows how many turns to tweak each slug. *Once in a while*, one shows up that the VCO doesn't lock, usually just on transmit. There is a stripline capacitor in the VCO that normally needs a section or two added to trim it. I saw instructions to do that somewhere, but I don't remember where offhand. Not too bad to do, but you need a decent size soldering iron. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] 2 repeaters - 1 Antenna
Your going to have to give us more information RE: all the TX and RX frequencies involved, how much power is everyone running, is the highway dept. willing to accept some degradation in their TX power (there is no free lunch on combining). How you couple two transmitters will be driven by freq. spread and power outputs, what make/model of antenna are they using, will it make the freq spread and handle the power? Does the highway department have a two-way shop doing their radio work or do they have their own radio communications group ? If your going to be tapping into a commercial radio system your likely going to have to have somebody doing the work that has all the tools and experience needed to make the highway department comfortable with the whole process and outcome. Rob K7EI -Original Message- From: Dan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 10:39 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] 2 repeaters - 1 Antenna Hi everyone. I'm looking for input and information on the following project I am exploring. I may have to oppertunity to multicouple a UHF 440 repeater with our countys highway dept UHF repeater antenna. I have found some information on the Rx multicoupler but still looking for information on how to couple the 2 Tx. If anyone has experience and info please feel free to email me. Thank you for your time... Dan, KC0CAP Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] STANDARD tone Baords... CTN34 and TN21S
I have several ctcss enc/dec boards like the CTN34 and the TN21S all have the same color coding the CTN 34 I want to PUT back in use on the RP70U repeater but the connector on the repeater is cut most all radios I have seen from standard have the same color code White gray violet blue yellow orange red brown Im trying to find out what the function is of the above colors coded wires.. Standard is has no data on these since they are aged Brent --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses at TNWEB LLC] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Min FREQ Separtation, VHF rep, No Duplexers
--- courir26 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll rephrase the question, what is the min frequency separtation for a 10W repeater with two ants, no vertical separation, horizontal sep of about 100'. I'm guessing it would have to be 2 MHz or more, but that is what I'm asking. Please don't answer .600 and 200' vertical because that is not the question. I'm referring to an emergency or garage repeater with odd split. Thanks! Tom N5OFF OK, let's just look at theoretical numbers here. 100 ft of horizontal separation between 2 dipoles at 2M would give you 41 dB of isolation. If you have a 10 watt TX, that is putting out +40 dBm, which would put a -1 dBm into your RX (at the TX freq). The further in freq you get from the TX, the more your sideband (or phase) noise will be reduced. Since your RX can probably hear down to -120 dBm, you will need that much TX phase noise suppression at your RX frequency. Most good quality (non-ham) transmitters may acheive this at a 2 to 3 meg separation, some ham models may also do this. Now, your RX front end needs to suppress the TX freq by a certain amount, to avoid overload. Most radios will overload at about a -30 dBm, so your helicals need to suppress the TX freq by at least 30 dB, reference the RX freq. A Micor or MII, or other good RX will probably do OK in that field, since they have tight preselectors. Most ham grade radios will not work, since everything in band comes right through. You might be able to put on an external preselector and make a ham RX work. Bottom line, 2 megs might be too close, 3 megs might be where things start to work OK, and further the better. Most of the figures you would need to test this aren't published, and you would have to experiment to find out what did and didn't work. Like I said previously, we had a commercial 161MHz Micor on a 150 KHz split that worked without cavities, and only about 60 ft vert between antennas. If I hadn't seen it working, I would never have beleived it. But 60 ft vertical is 28 dB better than 100 ft horizontal. Joe __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25¢ http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Min FREQ Separtation, VHF rep, No Duplexers
--- Steve Bosshard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Once upon a time I asked Lloyd Alcorn up at Wacom that question. Best I recall 60 ft is the maximum distance on a tower that you can seperate antennas. Further seperation will not yield additional isolation because of the coupling within the tower itself. Number wise memory tells me that the isolation at 146 Mhz and 60 ft. was around 60 db - just enough maybe with a clean tube transmitter and very selective receiver to get by, and maybe not. Horizontal seperation was not nearly as effective. Seems like 85 db of isolation was the magic number at 600 kc. Regards, Steve Isolation wise, vertical is much superior to horizontal. For the example we're working on, 100 ft horizontal would be the same as about 14 ft vertical. To me, it would be easier to get 14 ft vertical, than 100 ft horizontal. Joe __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25¢ http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Min FREQ Separtation, VHF rep, No Duplexers
Tom I think if you took two Mitrek units and set one up as a receiver and the other as a transmitter, using two antennas and two feed lines with 600Khz separation and kept the transmitter power at 20 watts or less this would work like you want. In my past memory I once saw this done. I think if you study the specs on the Mitreks you will see this should work. The selectivity of the receivers would allow this if the power was less than 20 watts. 73's de Tom Manning, AF4UG Virden Clark Beckman wrote: You know I was thinking of any possible way this might work and I remembered something after a club meeting last night, if both antennas were covered with a globe of shielding foil except for 10 degrees facing opposite directions, 10 watts of output with a 100 ft. long rg-58 feedline extension, if all the users were in between the antennas it would work within one 2.0 meg of split and this would work for a family picnic or a hamfest flea market as long as there was no co-ordinated repeaters using the same freqs. There was a young ham from our club who tryed something like this at his farm, it was almost useless but we who saw and used it learned that many walkytalkies had one memory for the uncommon split - like cap or mars uses. courir26 wrote: I'll rephrase the question, what is the min frequency separtation for a 10W repeater with two ants, no vertical separation, horizontal sep of about 100'. I'm guessing it would have to be 2 MHz or more, but that is what I'm asking. Please don't answer .600 and 200' vertical because that is not the question. I'm referring to an emergency or garage repeater with odd split. Thanks! Tom N5OFF -- 73...Clark Beckman N8PZD Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Question
At 4/20/2004 04:31 AM, you wrote: As long as you don't experience mixing troubles it will work, Using a coax T to connect 2 RXs to 1 ant. is not a good idea, particularly if the RXs used have good front-end filtering (helical resonators). The reason for this is that unless the frequencies of the 2 RXs are nearly the same, the front-end impedance of one RX will be mostly reactive at the other RX's frequency. This reactive impedance will reflect back in an unpredictable way to the T. If you're unlucky (as one unknowing system owner was out here, running a deaf system this way for many years), you'll reflect a short back to the T effectively short out the RF at the other freq. before it ever reaches the RX for that freq. OTOH, if you can measure the input impedance of front-end A at freq. B, you could use that to make the RF cable connecting RX A to the T such that at freq. B the T would be an open at that port. Probably more trouble than it's worth considering how cheap RX power dividers are. the method more durable is building a mutli-coupler for the bandwidth you need - could be done with 7/8 hardline using taps at the electrical 1/4 wavelength for each rx port, the cavity filter will be next in line - must be kept straight. You will have to experiment if you are trying to mix 145 and 15x as losses begin to show on the wider bandwidth that are never recovered, Using a commercially-designed power dividers with broad-band port-to-port isolation is the usual method of splitting off a RX antenna to multiple RXs. I can't quite follow the method described above. Bob NO6B adding some form of pre-amp here also carries in noise from other signals that can easily overload the rx of all ports. INECA wrote: Hello All: Questions: Does some problem exist if I share oneself RX antenna for two repeaters with a Tee? I thank any information in this respect. Regards Ucaima -- 73...Clark Beckman N8PZD Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
