Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Yep. When Spike began airing the series, I tried to sit down and watch them. *Really*, I did. But the urge to run was just too strong... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:05:57 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com I agree. I thought Jennifer Lien as Kes was great. Kes had a calmness, a solidity to her, that I found appealing. I only hated the way she was paired with Neelix, but fortunately the were broken up. Kes's relationship with Tuvok was good, especially as it allowed us to learn more about both Kes's burgeoning powers, as well as Tuvok's own Vulcan mental powers and disciplines. It was a great potential storyline: a master teaching a student who was basically already surpassing him, but with none of his control and discipline. I read that Lien herself wanted to leave Voyager, not that she was fired. Too bad, cause the way they wrote her out was horrible,and then when they brought her back in another time travel story, the fact that she was murderous just didn't work. So, Martin, does that mean there are whole seasons of Voyager you still haven't seen? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter Dax, I have to disagree about Shark-of-Nine being better than Kes. Both characters had potential to be strong female role models, but the Killer Bees underused Kes and made Shark-of-Nine Eye Candy First Class. The show lost me because of her final introduction. They could've put her in a neo-Starfleet uni and left some of her implants intact, to demonstrate that she was symbolically beginning the journey from dronedom to humanity. Instead, they do a lingering shot of her in a catsuit and three-inch heels. That told me that they weren't after my brain, but the head I keep in my boxers. I stopped watching the show that night, picked it up only at the final episode (that *only* because I'd had an Internet rumor that Paramount was planning to shift their big-screen franchise from TNG to V_r). -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 4 Jan 2009 16:44:55 -0500 From : Dax To : I always thought that they focused too much on Seven. However you have to admit she was better then Kess. Which to me caused many of the stores to drag. Another good episode was The Year of Hell. It was the only one that made the point very clear that they were really alone, no Starfleet, no help at all. The only one that would or you could say that Janeway was Rambo to the bitter end. As far as Captain Janeway knowing about the crewmen that were just getting by--I don't recall any shows in Star Trek that had the captain spending time with crewmen that were not part of the Senior Staff. I have always thought it was up to the First Officer or the respective department heads that then would tell the First Officer. Which then like Barkley would just simply been traded out or go to Troi for a quick fix. Well if you want you can count Kirk who was with a different female every week. My only regret or the only thing that bothered me was the fact that the Borg was not really a threat to them as it was to the TNG series. In the TNG series you mention the Borg and you have the whole Alpha Quadrant up in arms trying to figure out what to do. I mean if you compare the two ships Voyager does not have any special weapons. Even though it is stated as being a powerful ship in the fleet. Lets not forget the folding nacelle. Also to make matters worse, they did not have a full complement of photon torpedoes. However somehow with the help of Seven, they always managed to outwit the Queen. Either she is getting too old or really don't want them as bad as she always claim she does. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. -- From: Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 2:32 AM To: Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down. Between her and Delenn, I was set :D ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.comwrote: The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven's overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Oh, yeah, Adrianne. To give you Delenn's best line, as she was facing down an EarthAlliance commander, The only man ever to destroy a Minbari ship is behind me. *You* are in *front* of me. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 08:57:26 -0500 From : Adrianne Brennan adrianne.bren...@gmail.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down. Between her and Delenn, I was set :D ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Martin Baxter wrote: The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven's overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Dax, I have to disagree about Shark-of-Nine being better than Kes. Both characters had potential to be strong female role models, but the Killer Bees underused Kes and made Shark-of-Nine Eye Candy First Class. The show lost me because of her final introduction. They could've put her in a neo-Starfleet uni and left some of her implants intact, to demonstrate that she was symbolically beginning the journey from dronedom to humanity. Instead, they do a lingering shot of her in a catsuit and three-inch heels. That told me that they weren't after my brain, but the head I keep in my boxers. I stopped watching the show that night, picked it up only at the final episode (that *only* because I'd had an Internet rumor that Paramount was planning to shift their big-screen franchise from TNG to V_r). -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 4 Jan 2009 16:44:55 -0500 From : Dax nx_31...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com I always thought that they focused too much on Seven. However you have to admit she was better then Kess. Which to me caused many of the stores to drag. Another good episode was The Year of Hell. It was the only one that made the point very clear that they were really alone, no Starfleet, no help at all. The only one that would or you could say that Janeway was Rambo to the bitter end. As far as Captain Janeway knowing about the crewmen that were just getting by--I don't recall any shows in Star Trek that had the captain spending time with crewmen that were not part of the Senior Staff. I have always thought it was up to the First Officer or the respective department heads that then would tell the First Officer. Which then like Barkley would just simply been traded out or go to Troi for a quick fix. Well if you want you can count Kirk who was with a different female every week. My only regret or the only thing that bothered me was the fact that the Borg was not really a threat to them as it was to the TNG series. In the TNG series you mention the Borg and you have the whole Alpha Quadrant up in arms trying to figure out what to do. I mean if you compare the two ships Voyager does not have any special weapons. Even though it is stated as being a powerful ship in the fleet. Lets not forget the folding nacelle. Also to make matters worse, they did not have a full complement of photon torpedoes. However somehow with the help of Seven, they always managed to outwit the Queen. Either she is getting too old or really don't want them as bad as she always claim she does. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. -- From: Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 2:32 AM To: Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly frustrated at Troi's rather vacuous portrayal, especially, the much joked about Someone is planning something Captain, but I can't say who or what usage of her empathic powers. Usually, Troi's empathy was no more helpful than the common sense and ability to read others we humans possess. It became a joke that even my casual fan wife was in on. As for that show where Troi was an undercover Romulan, Sirtis herself talked about that. Remember the later ep when the Enterprise and a Romulan ship were locked together in a temporal bubble? While exploring the cause of the problem, Troi's character tells Picard about how Romulan ships use a micro singularity as the power source for their engines. Sirtis was thrilled to get that line, because it showed she'd gained knowledge about Romulans from that undercover ep, and it finally allowed her character to show some intelligence and utility aside from distracting--er, helping--cr ew members as Ship's Counselor. Seven of Nine always bothered me. Jeri Ryan did okay, but she was no better an actor than other characters on the show that ultimately got short shrift, such as Garrett Wang (Kim), Tim Russ (Tuvok), and Robert Beltran (Chakotay). All suffered in the ridiculous focus on Seven. And while I'm a straight guy who doesn't mind seeing the female form, i hate being
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
You *would* think that, especially inside the Beltway. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 05:42:26 -0800 (PST) From : Augustus Augustus jazzynupe_...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com actually, i liked both SG-1 and SG-A, but what was funny 2 me was that, every planet they went 2 on either show were kool with seeing them. SG-1 all the people knew about the G'ould and in almost every ep of SG-A they knew about the Wraith. the only people who did not know about aliens were the people of EARTH! with the DoD and the IOA both runnig stuff, someone had 2 know and leak SOMETHING! --- On Mon, 1/5/09, Martin Baxter wrote: From: Martin Baxter Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 7:45 AM LMNAO Reminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug of root beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy top that sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip, you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it down immediately afterward, frowning, saying, That the worst-tasting stuff I've ever had! I'm never trying that again! And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the same result. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you just can't get enough of it... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 06:34:23 -0500 From : Justin Mohareb To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy.livejournal.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
YES! I was thinking of that EXACT line when I mentioned her, lol. ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.comwrote: Oh, yeah, Adrianne. To give you Delenn's best line, as she was facing down an EarthAlliance commander, The only man ever to destroy a Minbari ship is behind me. *You* are in *front* of me. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 08:57:26 -0500 From : Adrianne Brennan adrianne.bren...@gmail.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down. Between her and Delenn, I was set :D ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Martin Baxter wrote: The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven's overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Had the feeling that I had the quote wrong, so I looked it up. This is it, precisely. With the prompt, Negative. We have authority here. Do not force us to engage your ship., Delenn replies, Why not? Only one Human captain has ever survived battle with a Minbari fleet. He is behind me. You are in front of me. If you value your lives, be somewhere else! Much better effect, eh? -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 08:57:26 -0500 From : Adrianne Brennan adrianne.bren...@gmail.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down. Between her and Delenn, I was set :D ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Martin Baxter wrote: The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven's overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Glad to make you laugh. Apologies for mucking it, though. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 12:34:54 -0500 From : Adrianne Brennan adrianne.bren...@gmail.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com YES! I was thinking of that EXACT line when I mentioned her, lol. ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: Oh, yeah, Adrianne. To give you Delenn's best line, as she was facing down an EarthAlliance commander, The only man ever to destroy a Minbari ship is behind me. *You* are in *front* of me. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 08:57:26 -0500 From : Adrianne Brennan To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down. Between her and Delenn, I was set :D ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Martin Baxter wrote: The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven's overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
I'm choking up just thinking about that moment... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:13:23 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Great characters on that show. I really liked Lando, G'Kar, Garibaldi, and the Ranger Marcus. Marcus was one of my favs, with his blend of seriousness that was overlaying a fundamentally humorous view of the world. Remember the ep when he fought a Minbari guy to protect D'lenn and the guy beat him up badly? Later the dude realizes that Marcus was actually adhering to the mores of Minbari culture more than he was, and visits Marcus in the hospital, thanking him for teaching him a lesson. Marcus gasps, The next time you feel the need to learn a lesson, could you try to make it not so painful? at which point dude burst into laughter. Classic Marcus. Or there's the time when Marcus needs information from a roomful of guys, and starts telling them how many of them will be conscious after so many minutes if they don't cooperate. Later, he's taken out the *whole* room, then exclaims Oh bollocks! Now I have to wait for someone to wake up! His sacrifice for Ivanova was one of the best scenes in the series... -- Original message -- From: Adrianne Brennan Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down. Between her and Delenn, I was set :D ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Martin Baxter wrote: The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven's overbearing story on the show. Sigh� .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
That's great! That was another reason I didn't watch SG-1 all that much. The need for self-contained stories each week meant they went to planet after planet, blundering into all kinds of situations. They'd handle it as they saw fit, and often I was thinking WTF? They just gave that planet advance weapons tech, now what will they do if they blow themselves up? They would make treaties with whomever was convenient, fell governments when needed, radically shake up a culture as required, and often seemed oblivious to the potential consequences to a whole civilization. I guess that given Earth's own history of colonialism and imperialism in places like Africa, I can see how they'd start out being cluelessly self-serving. But after time they should have matured more to take the long view of their actions. Atlantis tried to address it with a show recently in which Mitchell was put on trial for his peoples' actions in the Pegasus galaxy. I hear the show was in response to years' worth of fan complaint about this very lack of responsibility by the SG teams. But of course the one show is too little too late, and it was a clip show, which I despise, so lost opportunity there -- Original message -- From: Justin Mohareb justinmoha...@gmail.com I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, keithbjohn...@comcast.net wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy.livejournal.com ---BeginMessage--- I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, KeithBJohnson@comcast.net wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy.livejournal.com ---End Message---
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
My problem was the sameness of everything. Since the SG shows are all shot in the same place (British Columbia?) all the planets looked exactly the same. They all had trees that came straight from the Pacific Northwest, all had the same terrain. The aliens on all the planets were the same too: mostly West and Northern European, always living in the same cliched villages, with Central Casting elders, and primitive costumes right off the racks. They tried to explain this by saying the G'ould had seeded the galaxy with humans, but the sameness was just irritating. -- Original message -- From: Augustus Augustus jazzynupe_...@yahoo.com actually, i liked both SG-1 and SG-A, but what was funny 2 me was that, every planet they went 2 on either show were kool with seeing them. SG-1 all the people knew about the G'ould and in almost every ep of SG-A they knew about the Wraith. the only people who did not know about aliens were the people of EARTH! with the DoD and the IOA both runnig stuff, someone had 2 know and leak SOMETHING! --- On Mon, 1/5/09, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com wrote: From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 7:45 AM LMNAO Reminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug of root beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy top that sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip, you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it down immediately afterward, frowning, saying, That the worst-tasting stuff I've ever had! I'm never trying that again! And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the same result. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you just can't get enough of it... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 06:34:23 -0500 From : Justin Mohareb justinmoha...@gmail.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy.livejournal.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---BeginMessage--- actually, i liked both SG-1 and SG-A, but what was funny 2 me was that, every planet they went 2 on either show were kool with seeing them. SG-1 all the people knew about the G'ould and in almost every ep of SG-A they knew about the Wraith. the only people who did not know about aliens were the people of EARTH! with the DoD and the IOA both runnig stuff, someone had 2 know and leak SOMETHING! --- On Mon, 1/5/09, Martin Baxter truthseeker013@lycos.com wrote:From: Martin Baxter truthseeker013@lycos.comSubject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, diesTo: scifino...@yahoogroups.comDate: Monday, January 5, 2009, 7:45 AMLMNAOReminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug ofroot beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy topthat sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip,you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it downimmediately afterward, frowning, saying, "That the worst-tasting stuffI've ever had! I'm never trying that again!" And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the sameresult. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you justcan't get enough of it...-[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel R
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
I hear you! -- Original message -- From: Augustus Augustus jazzynupe_...@yahoo.com Keith, that's why my DVR records them all! 2AM --- On Mon, 1/5/09, keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net wrote: From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 11:02 AM Great one. I believe he was talking to Garak, the tailor. That ep just aired a few days ago. Since Spike TV unfortunately sees fit to rerun DS9 at 2 am, I was half asleep, but I clearly remember that scene. -- Original message - - From: Martin Baxter truthseeker013@ lycos.com LMNAO!!! ! Reminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug of root beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy top that sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip, you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it down immediately afterward, frowning, saying, That the worst-tasting stuff I've ever had! I'm never trying that again! And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the same result. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you just can't get enough of it... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 06:34:23 -0500 From : Justin Mohareb justinmohareb@ gmail.com To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy .livejournal. com http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds ---BeginMessage--- Keith,that's why my DVR records them all! 2AM--- On Mon, 1/5/09, KeithBJohnson@comcast.net KeithBJohnson@comcast.net wrote:From: KeithBJohnson@comcast.net KeithBJohnson@comcast.netSubject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, diesTo: scifino...@yahoogroups.comDate: Monday, January 5, 2009, 11:02 AM Great one. I believe he was talking to Garak, the "tailor". That ep just aired a few days ago. Since Spike TV unfortunately sees fit to rerun DS9 at 2 am, I was half asleep, but I clearly remember that scene. -- Original message - - From: "Martin Baxter" truthseeker013@ lycos.com LMNAO!!! ! Reminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug of root beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy top that sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip, you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it down immediately afterward, frowning, saying, "That the worst-tasting stuff I've ever had! I'm never trying that again!" And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the same result. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you just can't get enough of it... -[ Received Mail Content ]------ Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 06:34:23 -0500 From : "Justin Mohareb" j
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
actually, i liked both SG-1 and SG-A, but what was funny 2 me was that, every planet they went 2 on either show were kool with seeing them. SG-1 all the people knew about the G'ould and in almost every ep of SG-A they knew about the Wraith. the only people who did not know about aliens were the people of EARTH! with the DoD and the IOA both runnig stuff, someone had 2 know and leak SOMETHING! --- On Mon, 1/5/09, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com wrote: From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 7:45 AM LMNAO Reminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug of root beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy top that sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip, you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it down immediately afterward, frowning, saying, That the worst-tasting stuff I've ever had! I'm never trying that again! And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the same result. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you just can't get enough of it... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 06:34:23 -0500 From : Justin Mohareb justinmoha...@gmail.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy.livejournal.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Great characters on that show. I really liked Lando, G'Kar, Garibaldi, and the Ranger Marcus. Marcus was one of my favs, with his blend of seriousness that was overlaying a fundamentally humorous view of the world. Remember the ep when he fought a Minbari guy to protect D'lenn and the guy beat him up badly? Later the dude realizes that Marcus was actually adhering to the mores of Minbari culture more than he was, and visits Marcus in the hospital, thanking him for teaching him a lesson. Marcus gasps, The next time you feel the need to learn a lesson, could you try to make it not so painful? at which point dude burst into laughter. Classic Marcus. Or there's the time when Marcus needs information from a roomful of guys, and starts telling them how many of them will be conscious after so many minutes if they don't cooperate. Later, he's taken out the *whole* room, then exclaims Oh bollocks! Now I have to wait for someone to wake up! His sacrifice for Ivanova was one of the best scenes in the series... -- Original message -- From: Adrianne Brennan adrianne.bren...@gmail.com Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down. Between her and Delenn, I was set :D ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.comwrote: The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven's overbearing story on the show. Sigh .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---BeginMessage--- Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down.Between her and Delenn, I was set :D~ Where love and magic meet ~http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.htmlTake a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
LMNAO Reminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug of root beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy top that sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip, you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it down immediately afterward, frowning, saying, That the worst-tasting stuff I've ever had! I'm never trying that again! And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the same result. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you just can't get enough of it... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 06:34:23 -0500 From : Justin Mohareb justinmoha...@gmail.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy.livejournal.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Great one. I believe he was talking to Garak, the tailor. That ep just aired a few days ago. Since Spike TV unfortunately sees fit to rerun DS9 at 2 am, I was half asleep, but I clearly remember that scene. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com LMNAO Reminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug of root beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy top that sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip, you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it down immediately afterward, frowning, saying, That the worst-tasting stuff I've ever had! I'm never trying that again! And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the same result. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you just can't get enough of it... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 06:34:23 -0500 From : Justin Mohareb justinmoha...@gmail.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy.livejournal.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---BeginMessage--- LMNAOReminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug of root beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy top that sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip, you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it down immediately afterward, frowning, saying, "That the worst-tasting stuff I've ever had! I'm never trying that again!" And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the same result. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you just can't get enough of it... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 06:34:23 -0500 From : "Justin Mohareb" justinmohareb@gmail.com To : scifino...@yahoogroups.com I knew a guy who described Stargate as "Red State Star Trek". The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled "How does Stargate Stay on the Air?" , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy.livejournal.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---End Message---
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, keithbjohn...@comcast.net wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy.livejournal.com
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
I agree. I thought Jennifer Lien as Kes was great. Kes had a calmness, a solidity to her, that I found appealing. I only hated the way she was paired with Neelix, but fortunately the were broken up. Kes's relationship with Tuvok was good, especially as it allowed us to learn more about both Kes's burgeoning powers, as well as Tuvok's own Vulcan mental powers and disciplines. It was a great potential storyline: a master teaching a student who was basically already surpassing him, but with none of his control and discipline. I read that Lien herself wanted to leave Voyager, not that she was fired. Too bad, cause the way they wrote her out was horrible,and then when they brought her back in another time travel story, the fact that she was murderous just didn't work. So, Martin, does that mean there are whole seasons of Voyager you still haven't seen? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com Dax, I have to disagree about Shark-of-Nine being better than Kes. Both characters had potential to be strong female role models, but the Killer Bees underused Kes and made Shark-of-Nine Eye Candy First Class. The show lost me because of her final introduction. They could've put her in a neo-Starfleet uni and left some of her implants intact, to demonstrate that she was symbolically beginning the journey from dronedom to humanity. Instead, they do a lingering shot of her in a catsuit and three-inch heels. That told me that they weren't after my brain, but the head I keep in my boxers. I stopped watching the show that night, picked it up only at the final episode (that *only* because I'd had an Internet rumor that Paramount was planning to shift their big-screen franchise from TNG to V_r). -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 4 Jan 2009 16:44:55 -0500 From : Dax nx_31...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com I always thought that they focused too much on Seven. However you have to admit she was better then Kess. Which to me caused many of the stores to drag. Another good episode was The Year of Hell. It was the only one that made the point very clear that they were really alone, no Starfleet, no help at all. The only one that would or you could say that Janeway was Rambo to the bitter end. As far as Captain Janeway knowing about the crewmen that were just getting by--I don't recall any shows in Star Trek that had the captain spending time with crewmen that were not part of the Senior Staff. I have always thought it was up to the First Officer or the respective department heads that then would tell the First Officer. Which then like Barkley would just simply been traded out or go to Troi for a quick fix. Well if you want you can count Kirk who was with a different female every week. My only regret or the only thing that bothered me was the fact that the Borg was not really a threat to them as it was to the TNG series. In the TNG series you mention the Borg and you have the whole Alpha Quadrant up in arms trying to figure out what to do. I mean if you compare the two ships Voyager does not have any special weapons. Even though it is stated as being a powerful ship in the fleet. Lets not forget the folding nacelle. Also to make matters worse, they did not have a full complement of photon torpedoes. However somehow with the help of Seven, they always managed to outwit the Queen. Either she is getting too old or really don't want them as bad as she always claim she does. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. -- From: Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 2:32 AM To: Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly frustrated at Troi's rather vacuous portrayal, especially, the much joked about Someone is planning something Captain, but I can't say who or what usage of her empathic powers. Usually, Troi's empathy was no more helpful than the common sense and ability to read others we humans possess. It became
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Keith, that's why my DVR records them all! 2AM --- On Mon, 1/5/09, keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net wrote: From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 11:02 AM Great one. I believe he was talking to Garak, the tailor. That ep just aired a few days ago. Since Spike TV unfortunately sees fit to rerun DS9 at 2 am, I was half asleep, but I clearly remember that scene. -- Original message - - From: Martin Baxter truthseeker013@ lycos.com LMNAO!!! ! Reminds me of DS9, the ep in which Quark analogizes the Federation to a mug of root beer, being this tall, cold glass of dark stuff with a white, fuzzy top that sprays bubbles up your nose when you move to drink it. At the first sip, you realize how cloyingly, sickeningly sweet it is, and you put it down immediately afterward, frowning, saying, That the worst-tasting stuff I've ever had! I'm never trying that again! And, a minute or so later, you find yourself sipping at it again, with the same result. You realize that those it is cloying and sickeningly sweet, you just can't get enough of it... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 06:34:23 -0500 From : Justin Mohareb justinmohareb@ gmail.com To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com I knew a guy who described Stargate as Red State Star Trek. The US goes into various planets and overthrows the local governing bodies, and leaves, and we never see what happens in their wake, but we're told it's for the best. Justin On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 PM, wrote: I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. -- Read the Bitter Guide to the Bitter Guy. http://thebitterguy .livejournal. com http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
AMEN
--- On Mon, 1/5/09, keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net wrote:
From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net
Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 11:13 AM
Great characters on that show. I really liked Lando, G'Kar,
Garibaldi, and the Ranger Marcus. Marcus was one of my favs, with his blend of
seriousness that was overlaying a fundamentally humorous view of the world.
Remember the ep when he fought a Minbari guy to protect D'lenn and the guy beat
him up badly? Later the dude realizes that Marcus was actually adhering to the
mores of Minbari culture more than he was, and visits Marcus in the hospital,
thanking him for teaching him a lesson. Marcus gasps, The next time you feel
the need to learn a lesson, could you try to make it not so painful? at which
point dude burst into laughter. Classic Marcus. Or there's the time when Marcus
needs information from a roomful of guys, and starts telling them how many of
them will be conscious after so many minutes if they don't cooperate. Later,
he's taken out the *whole* room, then exclaims Oh bollocks! Now I have to wait
for someone to wake up!
His sacrifice for Ivanova was one of the best scenes in the series...
-- Original message - -
From: Adrianne Brennan adrianne.brennan@ gmail.com
Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down.
Between her and Delenn, I was set :D
~ Where love and magic meet ~
http://www.adrianne brennan.com
Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon:
http://www.adrianne brennan.com/ botdm.html
Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates:
http://www.adrianne brennan.com/ bamc.html
Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound:
http://www.adrianne brennan.com/ theoath_bound. html
On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Martin Baxter truthseeker013@
lycos.comwrote:
The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam
Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary
speech in B5.
Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am
the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry
a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living
thing you are ever going to see. God sent me.
As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman...
-[ Received Mail Content ]--
Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator,
dies
Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 +
From : KeithBJohnson@ comcast.net
To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com
And the other two times?
-- Original message - -
From: Martin Baxter
A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science
fiction.
Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television.
-[ Received Mail Content ]--
Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator,
dies
Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800
From : Tracey de Morsella
To :
Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it
to
hell with the way they handled Seven's overbearing story on the show.
Sigh…
.. I know. Sex sells
From: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogro ups.com] On
Behalf
Of Martin Baxter
Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM
To: scifino...@yahoogro ups.com
Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator,
dies
IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark.
-[ Received Mail Content ]--
Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator,
dies
Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 -
From : Meta
To : scifino...@yahoogro ups.com
--- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, Tracey de Morsella
wrote:
I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on
Next Gen
with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders.
Too bad
they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much
unexplored potential
Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for
the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of
their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do
women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few
glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a
female following they have.
Meta
http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=JQdwk8Yntds
http://www.youtube. com/watch
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Martin, i remember that ep. earth force ships came out of hyperspace by B5 and the Minbari cruisers were there. the earth force commander told her 2 leave and she said no. This is Ambassador Delenn of the Minbari. Babylon 5 is under our protection. Withdraw or be destroyed. Negative. We have authority here. Do not force us to engage your ship. Why not? Only one Human captain has ever survived battle with the Minbari fleet. He is behind me. You are in front of me. If you value your lives, be somewhere else! Fate. --- On Mon, 1/5/09, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com wrote: From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 12:39 PM Glad to make you laugh. Apologies for mucking it, though. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 12:34:54 -0500 From : Adrianne Brennan adrianne.bren...@gmail.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com YES! I was thinking of that EXACT line when I mentioned her, lol. ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: Oh, yeah, Adrianne. To give you Delenn's best line, as she was facing down an EarthAlliance commander, The only man ever to destroy a Minbari ship is behind me. *You* are in *front* of me. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Mon, 5 Jan 2009 08:57:26 -0500 From : Adrianne Brennan To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Oh gods, one of my fav B5 characters, hands down. Between her and Delenn, I was set :D ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Martin Baxter wrote: The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven's overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Well, there *is* that nagging old-age thing... ;-) -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sat, 3 Jan 2009 18:22:39 -0800 (PST) From : Augustus Augustus jazzynupe_...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com how indeedy? --- On Sat, 1/3/09, Martin Baxter wrote: From: Martin Baxter Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 3:14 PM How could I forget Susan Ivanova? -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sat, 03 Jan 2009 19:56:43 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Augustus Augustus wrote: Keith, u are so right about them being under used. the exceptions for the trek series were Dax and Kira. i even liked Dax's character when she was in the alternate universe. the thing between her and Sisko was too kool! always knew he wanted 2 hit just a little bit. as 4 B5, Claudia Christian as Susan Ivanova was kick ass. smart, sexy, and tough. she was good. Farscape was good too with Claudia Black as Aeryn Sun. but then again, always had a little crush on claudia black (so u know she was my fav when they brought her onto SG-1. Dr. Fate I liked all the women in Farscape but Claudia was fantastic. The show was just the best, period. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Didn't know that about Quantum Leap. That would have gotten to me too. So Sam continued to bounce around time forever? That calls for a TV movie to finish that plot out, in my opinion. Refresh my memory: to whom was Ivanova speaking? I should remember. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Sevenâs overbearing story on the show. Sigh⦠.. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---BeginMessage--- The last ep of "Quantum Leap", when the final screen shot said, "Dr Sam Beckett never made it home." and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5."Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me."As I whispered "Damn", I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]------ Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 From : KeithBJohnson@comcast.net To : scifino...@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: "Martin Baxter" A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : "Tracey de Morsella" To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven’s overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifino...@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifino...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenb
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
:) -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com As always, Keith, well-spoken and thought-out. And I forgive you for your numerous references to the V-Word Series and Shark-of-Nine... ;-) -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:32:29 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly frustrated at Troi's rather vacuous portrayal, especially, the much joked about Someone is planning something Captain, but I can't say who or what usage of her empathic powers. Usually, Troi's empathy was no more helpful than the common sense and ability to read others we humans possess. It became a joke that even my casual fan wife was in on. As for that show where Troi was an undercover Romulan, Sirtis herself talked about that. Remember the later ep when the Enterprise and a Romulan ship were locked together in a temporal bubble? While exploring the cause of the problem, Troi's character tells Picard about how Romulan ships use a micro singularity as the power source for their engines. Sirtis was thrilled to get that line, because it showed she'd gained knowledge about Romulans from that undercover ep, and it finally allowed her character to show some intelligence and utility aside from distracting--er, helpi! ng--cr ew members as Ship's Counselor. Seven of Nine always bothered me. Jeri Ryan did okay, but she was no better an actor than other characters on the show that ultimately got short shrift, such as Garrett Wang (Kim), Tim Russ (Tuvok), and Robert Beltran (Chakotay). All suffered in the ridiculous focus on Seven. And while I'm a straight guy who doesn't mind seeing the female form, i hate being manipulated, and the Seven catsuits and high heels were just too ridiculous for me to feel anything but manipulated. The sexiest women in recent Trek all had on more clothing and got my attention way more: Dax, Kira, Cassidy Yates. Having watched Voyager reruns for a while now, I'm amazed at how overt this was. There are at least two shows I can think of, for example, where the crew had to fight to survive. I believe both dealt with that race of hunters, the Hirogin (sp?) In both cases, Tuvok--a century-old Vulcan who is supposed to be a superbly skilled martial artist--was injured, punked, and sat on the sidelines while Seven saved the day. She frankly got on my nerves, and the dynamic between her and Janeway became boring. One of the the most puzzling shows of Voyager is an ep where Janeway takes a personal interest in several crew members who simply aren't fitting in on the ship. They all just do what's needed to get by, but after six or seven years, they're just little known misfits. The show was shocking to me because after that long on a small ship with a crew of around 150, how the hell can the Captain not know everyone intimately? How the hell can all those missions and duties only go to that s! mall co re of people Janeway seems to have hung out with? I thought the writing and the premise was awful, and then seeing how much time was wasted on Janeway developing Seven, it made me even more irritated that she's somehow avoided her duty to take an interest in people who'd been on Voyager since day one. -- Original message -- From: Meta --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, keithbjohn...@... wrote: That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? Trek has always had an extremely strong female following. Had it not been for females the whole franchise might have never rearose. Females started the very first drive to bring Trek back when it was in danger of being canceled after season two of TOS as well as keeping the drive going for making the move to film. We also had a strong hand in starting the original fan cons. I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Thanks. I've been meaning to write a piece on the dreaded V-word series, both the things I like about it and Janeway--are there are many, as Tracey's pointed out--and the things that kept the show's quality down, as you say. Seven's a big part of that simply because of her overuse. Like I said, watching *two* eps where Seven fought in single combat while Tuvok sat on the sidelines? Unbelievable. And Seven aside, I never did understand how they could have such a small crew and yet we rarely see anyone past the core group. One of the things the original Trek series did well was to give us guest crew members. Sure, some of them were the doomed red-shirts, but there were many, many memorable appearances: Helen Noel (the doctor in Dagger of the Mind), Caroline (Apollo's temp love interest), the Brother who argued with Spock on that planet of cavemen, etc. The OS is lousy with archaelogists, geologists, meteorologists--specialists from all over the ship who gave us variety and expanded our knowledge of the crew. I expected Voyager's nature of being insulated from Earth to give us more opportunity for that exploration of the crew, but alas, they stuck with the small core group. I've lost count of how many times I've laughed at a dire situation such as a commando raid, because it's Harry, Tom, Tuvok, Janeway herself, and even freakin' Neelix running around with guns! What the hell do the other 150 crew members do if the same folk run the ship, do first contacts, and go on all the away missions? A really silly example was Tom Paris being the Doctor's assistant and backup doctor in times of emergency. This guy is the number one pilot of the ship, and in emergency situations, he'd be most useful doing that. Yet he then has to run to Sickbay to work on the wounded? Why couldn't some of those unseen, unused, and evidently unfulfilled crew be brought into the medical training? A show like this, with a ship lost, is the perfect scenario to explore human relations more fully, but BB elected to all but ignore the fact there were other crew members, and then the addition of Seven just killed the whole thing. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com As always, Keith, well-spoken and thought-out. And I forgive you for your numerous references to the V-Word Series and Shark-of-Nine... ;-) -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:32:29 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly frustrated at Troi's rather vacuous portrayal, especially, the much joked about Someone is planning something Captain, but I can't say who or what usage of her empathic powers. Usually, Troi's empathy was no more helpful than the common sense and ability to read others we humans possess. It became a joke that even my casual fan wife was in on. As for that show where Troi was an undercover Romulan, Sirtis herself talked about that. Remember the later ep when the Enterprise and a Romulan ship were locked together in a temporal bubble? While exploring the cause of the problem, Troi's character tells Picard about how Romulan ships use a micro singularity as the power source for their engines. Sirtis was thrilled to get that line, because it showed she'd gained knowledge about Romulans from that undercover ep, and it finally allowed her character to show some intelligence and utility aside from distracting--er, helpi! ng--cr ew members as Ship's Counselor. Seven of Nine always bothered me. Jeri Ryan did okay, but she was no better an actor than other characters on the show that ultimately got short shrift, such as Garrett Wang (Kim), Tim Russ (Tuvok), and Robert Beltran (Chakotay). All suffered in the ridiculous focus on Seven. And while I'm a straight guy who doesn't mind seeing the female form, i hate being manipulated, and the Seven catsuits and high heels were just too ridiculous for me to feel anything but manipulated. The sexiest women in recent Trek all had on more clothing and got my attention way more
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
In Leeta's case, I'll say yes. I never thought of Shark-of-Nine that way. In fact, I thought very little of her... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:09:54 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com I thought of her, but wondered if, like Seven, she'd be thrown in the ultra-fem category because of her appearance, job, and initial characterization. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter May I venture to throw in Leeta, also from DS9? She started out as eye candy, being a Dabo girl, but eventually became a strong character. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sat, 03 Jan 2009 06:19:15 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. Beverly Crusher was a fav of mine, but she was woefully underused. I guess you'd put Janeway in the ultra butch category, and Seven of Nine and T'Pol in the ultra fem category? What about the women of Deep Space Nine? They seemed to be fairly well-rounded to me. Dax was sexy and attractive, but also smart and tough and serious when needed. She was never too far one way or the other. Same for Kira, who was tough as nails, but allowed to be a woman who could have tender feelings for a man. -- Original message -- From: Meta --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
More than welcome, and prithee, write away! I'll pick up some anti-seizure medication beforehand. Those two eps you mentioned, in which Shark did all of the fighting, had me scratching my head. Same with Paris being back-up medic. And don't get me started on the notion of Janeway, Chakotay et al being on away missions. As I've said before, That's why Deity made ensigns and lieutenants (jg). -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 15:43:17 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Thanks. I've been meaning to write a piece on the dreaded V-word series, both the things I like about it and Janeway--are there are many, as Tracey's pointed out--and the things that kept the show's quality down, as you say. Seven's a big part of that simply because of her overuse. Like I said, watching *two* eps where Seven fought in single combat while Tuvok sat on the sidelines? Unbelievable. And Seven aside, I never did understand how they could have such a small crew and yet we rarely see anyone past the core group. One of the things the original Trek series did well was to give us guest crew members. Sure, some of them were the doomed red-shirts, but there were many, many memorable appearances: Helen Noel (the doctor in Dagger of the Mind), Caroline (Apollo's temp love interest), the Brother who argued with Spock on that planet of cavemen, etc. The OS is lousy with archaelogists, geologists, meteorologists--specialists from all over the ship who gave us variety and expanded our knowledge of the crew. I expected Voyager's nature of being insulated from Earth to give us more opportunity for that exploration of the crew, but alas, they stuck with the small core group. I've lost count of how many times I've laughed at a dire situation such as a commando raid, because it's Harry, Tom, Tuvok, Janeway herself, and even freakin' Neelix running around with guns! What the hell do the other 150 crew members do if the same folk run the ship, do first contacts, and go on all the away missions? A really silly example was Tom Paris being the Doctor's assistant and backup doctor in times of emergency. This guy is the number one pilot of the ship, and in emergency situations, he'd be most useful doing that. Yet he then has to run to Sickbay to work on the wounded? Why couldn't some of those unseen, unused, and evidently unfulfilled crew be brought into the medical training? A show like this, with a ship lost, is the perfect scenario to explore human relations more fully, but Bamp;B elec! ted to all but ignore the fact there were other crew members, and then the addition of Seven just killed the whole thing. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter As always, Keith, well-spoken and thought-out. And I forgive you for your numerous references to the V-Word Series and Shark-of-Nine... ;-) -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:32:29 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly frustrated at Troi's rather vacuous portrayal, especially, the much joked about Someone is planning something Captain, but I can't say who or what usage of her empathic powers. Usually, Troi's empathy was no more helpful than the common sense and ability to read others we humans possess. It became a joke that even my casual fan wife was in on. As for that show where Troi was an undercover Romulan, Sirtis herself talked about that. Remember the later ep when the Enterprise and a Romulan ship were locked together in a temporal bubble? While exploring the cause of the problem, Troi's character tells Picard about how Romulan ships use a micro singularity as the power source for their engines. Sirtis was thrilled to get that line, because it showed she'd gained knowledge about Romulans from that undercover ep, and it finally allowed her character to show some intelligence and utility aside from distracting--er, helpi! ng--cr ew
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Ivanova was speaking to the commander of an Earth Alliance task force of specially-made ships using Shadow tech as it was on its way to retake B5. Can't remember the name of the ep. And I heard brief rumors that Scott Bakula had been approached to do a TV movie to try to sum up the series. I remember, in the last ep of the show, that Sam's mission had been to reunite Al and Beth, the ex-wife Al lost when he was a POW in 'Nam. During that ep, Sam's brother, whose life he'd saved during an earlier leap, and the daughter he sired during one really freaky three-part ep (Sam started out as one person trying to save a woman's life, then leapt into another several ears later, a lawyer defending the same woman on murder charges. During the second leap, Sam briefly became *himself*, just long enought o do the Dirty Deed with the woman, then went back to being the lawyer) both came onto the project, his brother replacing Al as military liason and the daughter as senior scientist, both! vowing to bring him home. Made that ending all the harder to take for me. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 15:29:06 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Didn't know that about Quantum Leap. That would have gotten to me too. So Sam continued to bounce around time forever? That calls for a TV movie to finish that plot out, in my opinion. Refresh my memory: to whom was Ivanova speaking? I should remember. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven’s overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Martin, i do remember that speech from Ivanova. I loved her b4 then, but that speech did sum up her strength. As 4 Leap, it was something that i watched every now and again. never really got n2 it. basically because i was young, active duty, and too busy chasing women (sorry ladies, but it's something we do when we are in our 20's and traveling all around the world). but when they released B5 on DVD, i had 2 ad it 2 my collection. i have the first 2 seasons now and working on getting number 3. --- On Sun, 1/4/09, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com wrote: From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, January 4, 2009, 12:47 PM Ivanova was speaking to the commander of an Earth Alliance task force of specially-made ships using Shadow tech as it was on its way to retake B5. Can't remember the name of the ep. And I heard brief rumors that Scott Bakula had been approached to do a TV movie to try to sum up the series. I remember, in the last ep of the show, that Sam's mission had been to reunite Al and Beth, the ex-wife Al lost when he was a POW in 'Nam. During that ep, Sam's brother, whose life he'd saved during an earlier leap, and the daughter he sired during one really freaky three-part ep (Sam started out as one person trying to save a woman's life, then leapt into another several ears later, a lawyer defending the same woman on murder charges. During the second leap, Sam briefly became *himself*, just long enought o do the Dirty Deed with the woman, then went back to being the lawyer) both came onto the project, his brother replacing Al as military liason and the daughter as senior scientist, both! vowing to bring him home. Made that ending all the harder to take for me. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 15:29:06 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Didn't know that about Quantum Leap. That would have gotten to me too. So Sam continued to bounce around time forever? That calls for a TV movie to finish that plot out, in my opinion. Refresh my memory: to whom was Ivanova speaking? I should remember. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven’s overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
As always, Keith, well-spoken and thought-out. And I forgive you for your numerous references to the V-Word Series and Shark-of-Nine... ;-) -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:32:29 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly frustrated at Troi's rather vacuous portrayal, especially, the much joked about Someone is planning something Captain, but I can't say who or what usage of her empathic powers. Usually, Troi's empathy was no more helpful than the common sense and ability to read others we humans possess. It became a joke that even my casual fan wife was in on. As for that show where Troi was an undercover Romulan, Sirtis herself talked about that. Remember the later ep when the Enterprise and a Romulan ship were locked together in a temporal bubble? While exploring the cause of the problem, Troi's character tells Picard about how Romulan ships use a micro singularity as the power source for their engines. Sirtis was thrilled to get that line, because it showed she'd gained knowledge about Romulans from that undercover ep, and it finally allowed her character to show some intelligence and utility aside from distracting--er, helpi! ng--cr ew members as Ship's Counselor. Seven of Nine always bothered me. Jeri Ryan did okay, but she was no better an actor than other characters on the show that ultimately got short shrift, such as Garrett Wang (Kim), Tim Russ (Tuvok), and Robert Beltran (Chakotay). All suffered in the ridiculous focus on Seven. And while I'm a straight guy who doesn't mind seeing the female form, i hate being manipulated, and the Seven catsuits and high heels were just too ridiculous for me to feel anything but manipulated. The sexiest women in recent Trek all had on more clothing and got my attention way more: Dax, Kira, Cassidy Yates. Having watched Voyager reruns for a while now, I'm amazed at how overt this was. There are at least two shows I can think of, for example, where the crew had to fight to survive. I believe both dealt with that race of hunters, the Hirogin (sp?) In both cases, Tuvok--a century-old Vulcan who is supposed to be a superbly skilled martial artist--was injured, punked, and sat on the sidelines while Seven saved the day. She frankly got on my nerves, and the dynamic between her and Janeway became boring. One of the the most puzzling shows of Voyager is an ep where Janeway takes a personal interest in several crew members who simply aren't fitting in on the ship. They all just do what's needed to get by, but after six or seven years, they're just little known misfits. The show was shocking to me because after that long on a small ship with a crew of around 150, how the hell can the Captain not know everyone intimately? How the hell can all those missions and duties only go to that s! mall co re of people Janeway seems to have hung out with? I thought the writing and the premise was awful, and then seeing how much time was wasted on Janeway developing Seven, it made me even more irritated that she's somehow avoided her duty to take an interest in people who'd been on Voyager since day one. -- Original message -- From: Meta --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, keithbjohn...@... wrote: That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? Trek has always had an extremely strong female following. Had it not been for females the whole franchise might have never rearose. Females started the very first drive to bring Trek back when it was in danger of being canceled after season two of TOS as well as keeping the drive going for making the move to film. We also had a strong hand in starting the original fan cons. I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven’s overbearing story on the show. Sigh… .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
I always thought that they focused too much on Seven. However you have to admit she was better then Kess. Which to me caused many of the stores to drag. Another good episode was The Year of Hell. It was the only one that made the point very clear that they were really alone, no Starfleet, no help at all. The only one that would or you could say that Janeway was Rambo to the bitter end. As far as Captain Janeway knowing about the crewmen that were just getting by--I don't recall any shows in Star Trek that had the captain spending time with crewmen that were not part of the Senior Staff. I have always thought it was up to the First Officer or the respective department heads that then would tell the First Officer. Which then like Barkley would just simply been traded out or go to Troi for a quick fix. Well if you want you can count Kirk who was with a different female every week. My only regret or the only thing that bothered me was the fact that the Borg was not really a threat to them as it was to the TNG series. In the TNG series you mention the Borg and you have the whole Alpha Quadrant up in arms trying to figure out what to do. I mean if you compare the two ships Voyager does not have any special weapons. Even though it is stated as being a powerful ship in the fleet. Lets not forget the folding nacelle. Also to make matters worse, they did not have a full complement of photon torpedoes. However somehow with the help of Seven, they always managed to outwit the Queen. Either she is getting too old or really don't want them as bad as she always claim she does. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. -- From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 2:32 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly frustrated at Troi's rather vacuous portrayal, especially, the much joked about Someone is planning something Captain, but I can't say who or what usage of her empathic powers. Usually, Troi's empathy was no more helpful than the common sense and ability to read others we humans possess. It became a joke that even my casual fan wife was in on. As for that show where Troi was an undercover Romulan, Sirtis herself talked about that. Remember the later ep when the Enterprise and a Romulan ship were locked together in a temporal bubble? While exploring the cause of the problem, Troi's character tells Picard about how Romulan ships use a micro singularity as the power source for their engines. Sirtis was thrilled to get that line, because it showed she'd gained knowledge about Romulans from that undercover ep, and it finally allowed her character to show some intelligence and utility aside from distracting--er, helping--cr ew members as Ship's Counselor. Seven of Nine always bothered me. Jeri Ryan did okay, but she was no better an actor than other characters on the show that ultimately got short shrift, such as Garrett Wang (Kim), Tim Russ (Tuvok), and Robert Beltran (Chakotay). All suffered in the ridiculous focus on Seven. And while I'm a straight guy who doesn't mind seeing the female form, i hate being manipulated, and the Seven catsuits and high heels were just too ridiculous for me to feel anything but manipulated. The sexiest women in recent Trek all had on more clothing and got my attention way more: Dax, Kira, Cassidy Yates. Having watched Voyager reruns for a while now, I'm amazed at how overt this was. There are at least two shows I can think of, for example, where the crew had to fight to survive. I believe both dealt with that race of hunters, the Hirogin (sp?) In both cases, Tuvok--a century-old Vulcan who is supposed to be a superbly skilled martial artist--was injured, punked, and sat on the sidelines while Seven saved the day. She frankly got on my nerves, and the dynamic between her and Janeway became boring. One of the the most puzzling shows of Voyager is an ep where Janeway takes a personal interest in several crew members who simply aren't fitting in on the ship. They all just do what's needed to get by, but after six or seven years, they're
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Do indeed watch the whole B5 series! It really heats up in season 3 as the Shadow War goes full tilt, the Psi Corp's machinations grow, and Sheridan starts bucking Earth Force. Not to mention the journeys of Lando and G'Kar. I envy you the voyage of discovery you have ahead of you! -- Original message -- From: Augustus Augustus jazzynupe_...@yahoo.com Martin, i do remember that speech from Ivanova. I loved her b4 then, but that speech did sum up her strength. As 4 Leap, it was something that i watched every now and again. never really got n2 it. basically because i was young, active duty, and too busy chasing women (sorry ladies, but it's something we do when we are in our 20's and traveling all around the world). but when they released B5 on DVD, i had 2 ad it 2 my collection. i have the first 2 seasons now and working on getting number 3. --- On Sun, 1/4/09, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com wrote: From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, January 4, 2009, 12:47 PM Ivanova was speaking to the commander of an Earth Alliance task force of specially-made ships using Shadow tech as it was on its way to retake B5. Can't remember the name of the ep. And I heard brief rumors that Scott Bakula had been approached to do a TV movie to try to sum up the series. I remember, in the last ep of the show, that Sam's mission had been to reunite Al and Beth, the ex-wife Al lost when he was a POW in 'Nam. During that ep, Sam's brother, whose life he'd saved during an earlier leap, and the daughter he sired during one really freaky three-part ep (Sam started out as one person trying to save a woman's life, then leapt into another several ears later, a lawyer defending the same woman on murder charges. During the second leap, Sam briefly became *himself*, just long enought o do the Dirty Deed with the woman, then went back to being the lawyer) both came onto the project, his brother replacing Al as military liason and the daughter as senior scientist, both! vowing to bring him home. Made that ending all the harder to take for me. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 15:29:06 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Didn't know that about Quantum Leap. That would have gotten to me too. So Sam continued to bounce around time forever? That calls for a TV movie to finish that plot out, in my opinion. Refresh my memory: to whom was Ivanova speaking? I should remember. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter The last ep of Quantum Leap, when the final screen shot said, Dr Sam Beckett never made it home. and, in a good way, Susan Ivanova's legendary speech in B5. Who am I? I am Susan Ivanova, daughter of Andrei and Sophie Ivanov. I am the right hand of vengeance, and the boot that is going to kick your sorry a$$ all the way back to Earth. I am Death Incarnate, and the last living thing you are ever going to see. God sent me. As I whispered Damn, I fell in love with that woman... -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sun, 04 Jan 2009 07:10:20 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com And the other two times? -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella To : Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Sevens overbearing story on the show. Sigh .. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Actually, I liked Kess. I thought her powers and maturity were intriguing. I hated the way her character was written out, then back in for one lame appearance in yet another overused time-travel segment. I can't say that I liked Seven better. What I liked was a *balance* of women ,and Seven tipped the balance like crazy. As for Janeway not knowing her crew, on a regular ship, perhaps that'd be the norm. But remember, this is a crew that was together in another part of the galaxy for *seven* years. A crew that had to fight and die together, a crew that was always worried, even despairing at times. A crew whose resolve and commitment to remaining true to their Federation code was held together mostly by Janeway's strength of will. I find it stretching credulity to believe that this unique situation would allow Janeway to go seven years and not know every crew member very well. Even with Chakotay doing his duties as XO, the dynamics almost demanded that take place. I know if I were a ship's captain stranded in space, facing what I thought was a seventy year journey back home, I'd make it a point to know each and every person in my command. And I think janeway would too. -- Original message -- From: Dax nx_31...@yahoo.com I always thought that they focused too much on Seven. However you have to admit she was better then Kess. Which to me caused many of the stores to drag. Another good episode was The Year of Hell. It was the only one that made the point very clear that they were really alone, no Starfleet, no help at all. The only one that would or you could say that Janeway was Rambo to the bitter end. As far as Captain Janeway knowing about the crewmen that were just getting by--I don't recall any shows in Star Trek that had the captain spending time with crewmen that were not part of the Senior Staff. I have always thought it was up to the First Officer or the respective department heads that then would tell the First Officer. Which then like Barkley would just simply been traded out or go to Troi for a quick fix. Well if you want you can count Kirk who was with a different female every week. My only regret or the only thing that bothered me was the fact that the Borg was not really a threat to them as it was to the TNG series. In the TNG series you mention the Borg and you have the whole Alpha Quadrant up in arms trying to figure out what to do. I mean if you compare the two ships Voyager does not have any special weapons. Even though it is stated as being a powerful ship in the fleet. Lets not forget the folding nacelle. Also to make matters worse, they did not have a full complement of photon torpedoes. However somehow with the help of Seven, they always managed to outwit the Queen. Either she is getting too old or really don't want them as bad as she always claim she does. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. -- From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 2:32 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly frustrated at Troi's rather vacuous portrayal, especially, the much joked about Someone is planning something Captain, but I can't say who or what usage of her empathic powers. Usually, Troi's empathy was no more helpful than the common sense and ability to read others we humans possess. It became a joke that even my casual fan wife was in on. As for that show where Troi was an undercover Romulan, Sirtis herself talked about that. Remember the later ep when the Enterprise and a Romulan ship were locked together in a temporal bubble? While exploring the cause of the problem, Troi's character tells Picard about how Romulan ships use a micro singularity as the power source for their engines. Sirtis was thrilled to get that line, because it showed she'd gained knowledge about Romulans from that undercover ep, and it finally allowed her character to show some intelligence and utility aside from distracting--er, helping--cr ew members as Ship's Counselor. Seven of Nine
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Couldn't answer for the stats, but I was raised on both Star Trek and Star Wars. My dad and I are also both fans of Babylon 5, Doctor Who, Stargate SG1, et cetera. I haven't been able to watch Stargate in a LONG time and have yet to truly get into Farscape, but I think that Babylon 5 is one of the best scifi shows ever made. ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 2:41 PM, Meta hett...@yahoo.com wrote: --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, keithbjohn...@... wrote: That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? Trek has always had an extremely strong female following. Had it not been for females the whole franchise might have never rearose. Females started the very first drive to bring Trek back when it was in danger of being canceled after season two of TOS as well as keeping the drive going for making the move to film. We also had a strong hand in starting the original fan cons.
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
I used to periodically drop a post titled How does Stargate Stay on the Air? , so I get your feelings. For years I thought SG-1 was weak scifi where all the planets and villages looked alike, and the SG-1 team stomped around the galaxy wrecking havoc with nothing approaching a framework like the Prime Directive to guide them. I used to lament how it keep going while better scifi and spec fiction shows were canceled. I think what got me watching SG-1 was the introduction of Ben Browder and Claudia Black, the Farscape vets, and the final resolution of the G'ould storyline. That pulled me in, and the interplay among the new members of the team kept me watching--that, and the demise of so many scifi shows made me desperate for a fix on Friday nights! :) The last couple of seasons are worth watching, but honestly most of what came before is not must-see TV. As for B5, absolutely agree with you. I put it in my triumvirate of iconic TV scifi, which includes Trek and Farscape. I like Star Wars, but either my age or my love for more serious, topic-focused scifi keep me from being a rabid fan of the franchise. -- Original message -- From: Adrianne Brennan adrianne.bren...@gmail.com Couldn't answer for the stats, but I was raised on both Star Trek and Star Wars. My dad and I are also both fans of Babylon 5, Doctor Who, Stargate SG1, et cetera. I haven't been able to watch Stargate in a LONG time and have yet to truly get into Farscape, but I think that Babylon 5 is one of the best scifi shows ever made. ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Dare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 2:41 PM, Meta hett...@yahoo.com wrote: --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, keithbjohn...@... wrote: That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? Trek has always had an extremely strong female following. Had it not been for females the whole franchise might have never rearose. Females started the very first drive to bring Trek back when it was in danger of being canceled after season two of TOS as well as keeping the drive going for making the move to film. We also had a strong hand in starting the original fan cons. ---BeginMessage--- Couldnt answer for the stats, but I was raised on both Star Trek and Star Wars. My dad and I are also both fans of Babylon 5, Doctor Who, Stargate SG1, et cetera.I havent been able to watch Stargate in a LONG time and have yet to truly get into Farscape, but I think that Babylon 5 is one of the best scifi shows ever made. ~ Where love and magic meet ~http://www.adriannebrennan.comExperience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.htmlDare to undertake The Oath in Book 1 Bound: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/theoath_bound.html On Sat, Jan 3, 2009 at 2:41 PM, Meta hett...@yahoo.com wrote: --- In scifino...@yahoogroups.com, KeithBJohnson@... wrote: Thats an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? Trek has always had an extremely strong female following. Had it not been for females the whole franchise might have never rearose. Females started the very first drive to bring Trek back when it was in danger of being canceled after season two of TOS as well as keeping the drive going for making the move to film. We also had a strong hand in starting the original fan cons. ---End Message---
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
May I venture to throw in Leeta, also from DS9? She started out as eye candy, being a Dabo girl, but eventually became a strong character. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sat, 03 Jan 2009 06:19:15 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. Beverly Crusher was a fav of mine, but she was woefully underused. I guess you'd put Janeway in the ultra butch category, and Seven of Nine and T'Pol in the ultra fem category? What about the women of Deep Space Nine? They seemed to be fairly well-rounded to me. Dax was sexy and attractive, but also smart and tough and serious when needed. She was never too far one way or the other. Same for Kira, who was tough as nails, but allowed to be a woman who could have tender feelings for a man. -- Original message -- From: Meta --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
A... I fondly remember Seven's debut into the world of science fiction. Marked the second of only three times I ever cursed at my television. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 2 Jan 2009 15:45:55 -0800 From : Tracey de Morsella tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven’s overbearing story on the show. Sigh….. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Keith, u are so right about them being under used. the exceptions for the trek series were Dax and Kira. i even liked Dax's character when she was in the alternate universe. the thing between her and Sisko was too kool! always knew he wanted 2 hit just a little bit. as 4 B5, Claudia Christian as Susan Ivanova was kick ass. smart, sexy, and tough. she was good. Farscape was good too with Claudia Black as Aeryn Sun. but then again, always had a little crush on claudia black (so u know she was my fav when they brought her onto SG-1. Dr. Fate --- On Sat, 1/3/09, keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net wrote: From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 1:19 AM That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. Beverly Crusher was a fav of mine, but she was woefully underused. I guess you'd put Janeway in the ultra butch category, and Seven of Nine and T'Pol in the ultra fem category? What about the women of Deep Space Nine? They seemed to be fairly well-rounded to me. Dax was sexy and attractive, but also smart and tough and serious when needed. She was never too far one way or the other. Same for Kira, who was tough as nails, but allowed to be a woman who could have tender feelings for a man. -- Original message - - From: Meta hett...@yahoo. com --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, Tracey de Morsella tdli...@... wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
--- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, keithbjohn...@... wrote: That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? Trek has always had an extremely strong female following. Had it not been for females the whole franchise might have never rearose. Females started the very first drive to bring Trek back when it was in danger of being canceled after season two of TOS as well as keeping the drive going for making the move to film. We also had a strong hand in starting the original fan cons. I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. I didn't start liking Deanna until she started dressing in uniform and I really became a fan after she played the undercover Romulan. Beverly Crusher was a fav of mine, but she was woefully underused. She was a fav of mine as well and they really had not a clue what to do with her, besides kill patients.:) I guess you'd put Janeway in the ultra butch category, and Seven of Nine and T'Pol in the ultra fem category? I liked Janeway at first, until they turned her into a bad rendition of a female Capt. Ahab with earth as the whale. For some reason I liked Seven, okay the costume was a bit much, but I actually thought Jerry did an okay job. I never meshed with Enterprise so I can't really say much about T'pol. I do plan to watch the show from beginning to end one day. I have to, I'm a Trekkie.:) What about the women of Deep Space Nine? They seemed to be fairly well-rounded to me. Dax was sexy and attractive, but also smart and tough and serious when needed. She was never too far one way or the other. Same for Kira, who was tough as nails, but allowed to be a woman who could have tender feelings for a man. The DS9 ladies were as close to real women as Trek ever came, although here and there they strayed a bit. My fav was Kassidy and they sort of half-heartedly used her. Still DS9 is my favorite 'realistic' Trek. TNG's my fav 'fantasy' Trek. As for the others, Star War only had Leia and in the first movie she was just the 'bone' the heroes wanted. I do like her. One can't expect much more from Lucas, after all. I never saw all of Babylon 5, but I liked what I did see a great deal. As for Farscape, I'm still in shock that they took it off. I absolutely loved this show from beginning to end. They got it right. I'm still hoping for a movie or something. Meta
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
--- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@... wrote: May I venture to throw in Leeta, also from DS9? She started out as eye candy, being a Dabo girl, but eventually became a strong character. Now it took a very long time and much patients before I could bring myself to like her, but at least she didn't go for the obvious hunky human guys. She turned out to be a good character. Meta
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
--- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Augustus Augustus jazzynupe_...@... wrote: Keith, u are so right about them being under used. the exceptions for the trek series were Dax and Kira. i even liked Dax's character when she was in the alternate universe. the thing between her and Sisko was too kool! always knew he wanted 2 hit just a little bit. as 4 B5, Claudia Christian as Susan Ivanova was kick ass. smart, sexy, and tough. she was good. Farscape was good too with Claudia Black as Aeryn Sun. but then again, always had a little crush on claudia black (so u know she was my fav when they brought her onto SG-1. Dr. Fate I liked all the women in Farscape but Claudia was fantastic. The show was just the best, period. Meta
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
The same with me, Meta. In her first few appearances on-air, I ahd to use the mute button, because her voice really rode me the wrong way. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sat, 03 Jan 2009 19:48:18 - From : Meta hett...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Martin Baxter wrote: May I venture to throw in Leeta, also from DS9? She started out as eye candy, being a Dabo girl, but eventually became a strong character. Now it took a very long time and much patients before I could bring myself to like her, but at least she didn't go for the obvious hunky human guys. She turned out to be a good character. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
How could I forget Susan Ivanova? -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sat, 03 Jan 2009 19:56:43 - From : Meta hett...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Augustus Augustus wrote: Keith, u are so right about them being under used. the exceptions for the trek series were Dax and Kira. i even liked Dax's character when she was in the alternate universe. the thing between her and Sisko was too kool! always knew he wanted 2 hit just a little bit. as 4 B5, Claudia Christian as Susan Ivanova was kick ass. smart, sexy, and tough. she was good. Farscape was good too with Claudia Black as Aeryn Sun. but then again, always had a little crush on claudia black (so u know she was my fav when they brought her onto SG-1. Dr. Fate I liked all the women in Farscape but Claudia was fantastic. The show was just the best, period. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
how indeedy? --- On Sat, 1/3/09, Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com wrote: From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 3:14 PM How could I forget Susan Ivanova? -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sat, 03 Jan 2009 19:56:43 - From : Meta hett...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Augustus Augustus wrote: Keith, u are so right about them being under used. the exceptions for the trek series were Dax and Kira. i even liked Dax's character when she was in the alternate universe. the thing between her and Sisko was too kool! always knew he wanted 2 hit just a little bit. as 4 B5, Claudia Christian as Susan Ivanova was kick ass. smart, sexy, and tough. she was good. Farscape was good too with Claudia Black as Aeryn Sun. but then again, always had a little crush on claudia black (so u know she was my fav when they brought her onto SG-1. Dr. Fate I liked all the women in Farscape but Claudia was fantastic. The show was just the best, period. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
For me I thought that Dr. Crusher would become a stronger character when she was in command of the Enterprise. However that fell through. Then it became to me that in every movie her role became less and less. Meaning what was the point in having her in the movies at all. But I have to agree with Mr. Baxter, Jadzia was the best female character out of the whole series. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. From: Tracey de Morsella Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 6:45 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven’s overbearing story on the show. Sigh….. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta hett...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
I thought of her, but wondered if, like Seven, she'd be thrown in the ultra-fem category because of her appearance, job, and initial characterization. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com May I venture to throw in Leeta, also from DS9? She started out as eye candy, being a Dabo girl, but eventually became a strong character. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sat, 03 Jan 2009 06:19:15 + From : keithbjohn...@comcast.net To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. Beverly Crusher was a fav of mine, but she was woefully underused. I guess you'd put Janeway in the ultra butch category, and Seven of Nine and T'Pol in the ultra fem category? What about the women of Deep Space Nine? They seemed to be fairly well-rounded to me. Dax was sexy and attractive, but also smart and tough and serious when needed. She was never too far one way or the other. Same for Kira, who was tough as nails, but allowed to be a woman who could have tender feelings for a man. -- Original message -- From: Meta --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---BeginMessage--- May I venture to throw in Leeta, also from DS9? She started out as eye candy, being a Dabo girl, but eventually became a strong character. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Sat, 03 Jan 2009 06:19:15 From : KeithBJohnson@comcast.net To : scifino...@yahoogroups.com That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. Beverly Crusher was a fav of mine, but she was woefully underused. I guess you'd put Janeway in the "ultra butch" category, and Seven of Nine and T'Pol in the "ultra fem" category? What about the women of Deep Space Nine? They seemed to be fairly well-rounded to me. Dax was sexy and attractive, but also smart and tough and serious when needed. She was never too far one way or the other. Same for Kira, who was tough as nails, but allowed to be a woman who could have tender feelings for a man. -- Original message -- From: "Meta" --- In scifino...@yahoogroups.com, "Tracey de Morsella" wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---End Message---
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Oh yeah, Ivanova on B5 was awesome. I also liked the telepath who was enhanced by the Vorlons and became a sort of agent for Sheridan against the Psi Corps and others. Claudia Black on Farscape was amazing. She was one of the toughest, coolest women in TV scifi I've ever seen. I loved her character on SG-1 too, but gotta admit, it was really jarring seeing the tough Aeryn show up as a seemingly flighty thief! Took a while to get adjusted to that change! -- Original message -- From: Augustus Augustus jazzynupe_...@yahoo.com Keith, u are so right about them being under used. the exceptions for the trek series were Dax and Kira. i even liked Dax's character when she was in the alternate universe. the thing between her and Sisko was too kool! always knew he wanted 2 hit just a little bit. as 4 B5, Claudia Christian as Susan Ivanova was kick ass. smart, sexy, and tough. she was good. Farscape was good too with Claudia Black as Aeryn Sun. but then again, always had a little crush on claudia black (so u know she was my fav when they brought her onto SG-1. Dr. Fate --- On Sat, 1/3/09, keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net wrote: From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net keithbjohn...@comcast.net Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 1:19 AM That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. Beverly Crusher was a fav of mine, but she was woefully underused. I guess you'd put Janeway in the ultra butch category, and Seven of Nine and T'Pol in the ultra fem category? What about the women of Deep Space Nine? They seemed to be fairly well-rounded to me. Dax was sexy and attractive, but also smart and tough and serious when needed. She was never too far one way or the other. Same for Kira, who was tough as nails, but allowed to be a woman who could have tender feelings for a man. -- Original message - - From: Meta hett...@yahoo. com --- In scifino...@yahoogro ups.com, Tracey de Morsella tdli...@... wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta ---BeginMessage--- Keith, u are so right about them being under used. the exceptions for the trek series were Dax and Kira. i even liked Dax's character when she was in the alternate universe. the thing between her and Sisko was too kool! always knew he wanted 2 hit just a little bit. as 4 B5, Claudia Christian as Susan Ivanova was kick ass. smart, sexy, and tough. she was good. Farscape was good too with Claudia Black as Aeryn Sun. but then again, always had a little crush on claudia black (so u know she was my fav when they brought her onto SG-1.Dr. Fate--- On Sat, 1/3/09, KeithBJohnson@comcast.net KeithBJohnson@comcast.net wrote:From: KeithBJohnson@comcast.net KeithBJohnson@comcast.netSubject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, diesTo: scifino...@yahoogroups.comDate: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 1:19 AM That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. Beverly
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Good point on the women behind Trek. And there are the creative forces behind the scenes that shepherded the franchise, such as D.C. Fontana, Melinda Snodgrass (the story runner for a while on TNG), and of course, Majel Roddenberry herself. I only threw in Star Wars to be polite, because I know it does have a massive following. But personally I never put it in the same category of serious scif as Trek, B5, and Farscape. Some of the books and fan fiction deal with it in mature, intelligent ways, but the movies--with the exception of The Empire Strikes Back--are just too Saturday morning for me to discuss much in the same breath with Trek. As for Troi's character, Mirina Sirtis herself was constantly frustrated at Troi's rather vacuous portrayal, especially, the much joked about Someone is planning something Captain, but I can't say who or what usage of her empathic powers. Usually, Troi's empathy was no more helpful than the common sense and ability to read others we humans possess. It became a joke that even my casual fan wife was in on. As for that show where Troi was an undercover Romulan, Sirtis herself talked about that. Remember the later ep when the Enterprise and a Romulan ship were locked together in a temporal bubble? While exploring the cause of the problem, Troi's character tells Picard about how Romulan ships use a micro singularity as the power source for their engines. Sirtis was thrilled to get that line, because it showed she'd gained knowledge about Romulans from that undercover ep, and it finally allowed her character to show some intelligence and utility aside from distracting--er, helping--cr ew members as Ship's Counselor. Seven of Nine always bothered me. Jeri Ryan did okay, but she was no better an actor than other characters on the show that ultimately got short shrift, such as Garrett Wang (Kim), Tim Russ (Tuvok), and Robert Beltran (Chakotay). All suffered in the ridiculous focus on Seven. And while I'm a straight guy who doesn't mind seeing the female form, i hate being manipulated, and the Seven catsuits and high heels were just too ridiculous for me to feel anything but manipulated. The sexiest women in recent Trek all had on more clothing and got my attention way more: Dax, Kira, Cassidy Yates. Having watched Voyager reruns for a while now, I'm amazed at how overt this was. There are at least two shows I can think of, for example, where the crew had to fight to survive. I believe both dealt with that race of hunters, the Hirogin (sp?) In both cases, Tuvok--a century-old Vulcan who is supposed to be a superbly skilled martial artist--was injured, punked, and sat on the sidelines while Seven saved the day. She frankly got on my nerves, and the dynamic between her and Janeway became boring. One of the the most puzzling shows of Voyager is an ep where Janeway takes a personal interest in several crew members who simply aren't fitting in on the ship. They all just do what's needed to get by, but after six or seven years, they're just little known misfits. The show was shocking to me because after that long on a small ship with a crew of around 150, how the hell can the Captain not know everyone intimately? How the hell can all those missions and duties only go to that small co re of people Janeway seems to have hung out with? I thought the writing and the premise was awful, and then seeing how much time was wasted on Janeway developing Seven, it made me even more irritated that she's somehow avoided her duty to take an interest in people who'd been on Voyager since day one. -- Original message -- From: Meta hett...@yahoo.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, keithbjohn...@... wrote: That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? Trek has always had an extremely strong female following. Had it not been for females the whole franchise might have never rearose. Females started the very first drive to bring Trek back when it was in danger of being canceled after season two of TOS as well as keeping the drive going for making the move to film. We also had a strong hand in starting the original fan cons. I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. I didn't start liking Deanna until she started dressing in uniform and I really became a fan after she played the undercover Romulan. Beverly Crusher was a fav of mine, but she was woefully underused. She was a fav of mine as well and they really had not a clue what to do with her,
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Things really hit rock bottom in the film Star Trek: Insurrection, when Troi asked Crusher if her boobs were getting firmer. I liked the possible future timeline when Crusher was shown to be a ship's captain in her own right. -- Original message -- From: Dax nx_31...@yahoo.com For me I thought that Dr. Crusher would become a stronger character when she was in command of the Enterprise. However that fell through. Then it became to me that in every movie her role became less and less. Meaning what was the point in having her in the movies at all. But I have to agree with Mr. Baxter, Jadzia was the best female character out of the whole series. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. From: Tracey de Morsella Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 6:45 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Sevenâs overbearing story on the show. Sigh⦠.. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta hett...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---BeginMessage--- For me I thought that Dr. Crusher would become a stronger character when she was in command of the Enterprise. However that fell through. Then it became to me that in every movie her role became less and less. Meaning what was the point in having her in the movies at all. But I have to agree with Mr. Baxter, Jadzia was the best female character out of the whole series. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. From: Tracey de Morsella Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 6:45 PM To: scifino...@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven’s overbearing story on the show. Sigh….. I know. Sex sells From: scifino...@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin BaxterSent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PMTo: scifino...@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]--Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, diesDate : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 -From : "Meta" hett...@yahoo.comTo : scifino...@yahoogroups.com--- In scifino...@yahoogroups.com, "Tracey de Morsella" wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---End Message---
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
--- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella tdli...@... wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta hett...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Me too. I thought they took a few steps forward with Janeway, but blew it to hell with the way they handled Seven’s overbearing story on the show. Sigh….. I know. Sex sells From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin Baxter Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 1:41 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta hett...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
That's an interesting point: just how big is the female following among Trek? And how does its appeal among women compare with other scifi giants like Babylon 5, Star Wars, Farscape? I agree that the women of Trek weren't very well utilized in the main. I read character sketches on TNG, for example, revealing that Deanna Troi was originally characterized as having a genius level IQ. The only hint of that we saw was one ep where she beat Data playing 3D chess, and even that might be more her ability to think outside his logical box. Beverly Crusher was a fav of mine, but she was woefully underused. I guess you'd put Janeway in the ultra butch category, and Seven of Nine and T'Pol in the ultra fem category? What about the women of Deep Space Nine? They seemed to be fairly well-rounded to me. Dax was sexy and attractive, but also smart and tough and serious when needed. She was never too far one way or the other. Same for Kira, who was tough as nails, but allowed to be a woman who could have tender feelings for a man. -- Original message -- From: Meta hett...@yahoo.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella tdli...@... wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta ---BeginMessage--- --- In scifino...@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella tdli...@... wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta ---End Message---
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Indeed. As I said in another post just now, there were more balanced women on DS9 than any Trek ep. Dax is one of my top fav women of all Trekdom. It's easy to say why so many men on the station fell for her. I loved her lighthearted nature, that smile she always wore, how she could go from hanging with Kira to a romantic date, to a card game at Quarks, then off to pick up a Bat'leth and spar with a Klingon. -- Original message -- From: Martin Baxter truthseeker...@lycos.com IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : Meta hett...@yahoo.com To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Tracey de Morsella wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---BeginMessage--- IMO, Jadzia Dax was in the ballpark. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:47:33 - From : "Meta" hett...@yahoo.com To : scifino...@yahoogroups.com --- In scifino...@yahoogroups.com, "Tracey de Morsella" wrote: I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential Most of the women of Trek had unexplored potential but it seemed for the most part that unless they could be paired with a male any of their other potential was left to the imagination. Trek does not do women well. Its either ultra butch or ultra fem, with very few glimpses of anything in between. They always forget just how strong a female following they have. Meta http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---End Message---
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Yeah, she was good as Troi's mother, although i liked the role better when they allowed her to be serious amidst the seeming cluelessness. -- Original message -- From: Dax nx_31...@yahoo.com I loved her in the role of Troi's mother. She was always good at making Picard cringe at the thought of her coming on board. A member of the cast that will be missed. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 1:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Majel was so far ahead of the times when she was cast as Number One in the first Trek pilot. I have always wondered what she could have done with that role, had she not been knocked down to being not even a doctor, but a nurse assisting Bones. Gene Roddenberry always hated that the networks made him do that, but fortunately she went on to have a long and rich life in acting. And in Star Trek: The Motion Picture, they even took pains to mention that she had finally become a doctor! -- Original message -- From: Daryle Lockhart dar...@darylelockhart.com Hailing frequencies closed, Number One. For me, this is like royalty has passed. The TOS crew is getting small. I think I was the one to break this news to Wil Wheaton via Twitter, which sucks. My heart goes out to Rod, their son. movie #11 is coming out and both his mom and dad are gone. On Dec 18, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: So sorry to read this. My condolences to her family. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : [scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:48:12 -0500 From : brent wodehouse brent_wodeho...@thefence.us To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11263728 Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies The Associated Press Article Launched: 12/18/2008 01:21:50 PM PST LOS ANGELES - Majel Barrett Roddenberry, the widow of Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, has died. She was 76. Family spokesman Sean Rossall says Majel Roddenberry died of leukemia Thursday morning at her home in Los Angeles. Her son, Eugene, was at her side. Roddenberry played Nurse Christine Chapel in the original 1960s TV series and had smaller roles in many of its successors. She also voices the computer in the upcoming Star Trek movie. After her husband's death in 1991, she continued to promote the Star Trek legacy at conventions. She also was the executive producer for two unrelated TV science fiction series, Andromeda and Earth: Final Conflict. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds ---BeginMessage--- I loved her in the role of Troi's mother. She was always good at making Picard cringe at the thought of her coming on board. A member of the cast that will be missed. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. From: KeithBJohnson@comcast.net Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 1:06 AM To: scifino...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Majel was so far ahead of the times when she was cast as Number One in the first Trek pilot. I have always wondered what she could have done with that role, had she not been knocked down to being not even a doctor, but a nurse assisting Bones. Gene Roddenberry always hated that the networks made him do that, but fortunately she went on to have a long and rich life in acting. And in "Star Trek: The Motion Picture", they even took pains to mention that she had finally become a doctor! -- Original message -- From: Daryle Lockhart dar...@darylelockhart.com Hailing frequencies closed, Number One.For me, this is like royalty has passed. The TOS crew is getting small.I think I was the one to break this news to Wil Wheaton via Twitter, which sucks. My heart goes out to Rod, their son. movie #11 is coming out and both his mom and dad are gone.On Dec 18, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: So sorry to read this. My condolences to her family. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : [scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:48:12 -0500 From : "brent wodehouse" brent_wodehouse@thefence.us To : scifino...@yahoogroups.com http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11263728 Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies The Associated Press Article Launched: 12/18/2008 01:21:50 PM PST LOS ANGELES - Majel Barrett Roddenberry, t
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential -Original Message- From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of keithbjohn...@comcast.net Sent: Thursday, January 01, 2009 9:26 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Yeah, she was good as Troi's mother, although i liked the role better when they allowed her to be serious amidst the seeming cluelessness. -- Original message -- From: Dax nx_31...@yahoo.com I loved her in the role of Troi's mother. She was always good at making Picard cringe at the thought of her coming on board. A member of the cast that will be missed. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 1:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Majel was so far ahead of the times when she was cast as Number One in the first Trek pilot. I have always wondered what she could have done with that role, had she not been knocked down to being not even a doctor, but a nurse assisting Bones. Gene Roddenberry always hated that the networks made him do that, but fortunately she went on to have a long and rich life in acting. And in Star Trek: The Motion Picture, they even took pains to mention that she had finally become a doctor! -- Original message -- From: Daryle Lockhart dar...@darylelockhart.com Hailing frequencies closed, Number One. For me, this is like royalty has passed. The TOS crew is getting small. I think I was the one to break this news to Wil Wheaton via Twitter, which sucks. My heart goes out to Rod, their son. movie #11 is coming out and both his mom and dad are gone. On Dec 18, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: So sorry to read this. My condolences to her family. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : [scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:48:12 -0500 From : brent wodehouse brent_wodeho...@thefence.us To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11263728 Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies The Associated Press Article Launched: 12/18/2008 01:21:50 PM PST LOS ANGELES - Majel Barrett Roddenberry, the widow of Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, has died. She was 76. Family spokesman Sean Rossall says Majel Roddenberry died of leukemia Thursday morning at her home in Los Angeles. Her son, Eugene, was at her side. Roddenberry played Nurse Christine Chapel in the original 1960s TV series and had smaller roles in many of its successors. She also voices the computer in the upcoming Star Trek movie. After her husband's death in 1991, she continued to promote the Star Trek legacy at conventions. She also was the executive producer for two unrelated TV science fiction series, Andromeda and Earth: Final Conflict. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds Post your SciFiNoir Profile at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scifinoir2/app/peoplemap2/entry/add?fmvn=mapYa hoo! Groups Links
RE: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Those are the ones I was thinking of too. -- Original message -- From: Tracey de Morsella tdli...@multiculturaladvantage.com I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential -Original Message- From: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of keithbjohn...@comcast.net Sent: Thursday, January 01, 2009 9:26 PM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Yeah, she was good as Troi's mother, although i liked the role better when they allowed her to be serious amidst the seeming cluelessness. -- Original message -- From: Dax nx_31...@yahoo.com I loved her in the role of Troi's mother. She was always good at making Picard cringe at the thought of her coming on board. A member of the cast that will be missed. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 1:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Majel was so far ahead of the times when she was cast as Number One in the first Trek pilot. I have always wondered what she could have done with that role, had she not been knocked down to being not even a doctor, but a nurse assisting Bones. Gene Roddenberry always hated that the networks made him do that, but fortunately she went on to have a long and rich life in acting. And in Star Trek: The Motion Picture, they even took pains to mention that she had finally become a doctor! -- Original message -- From: Daryle Lockhart dar...@darylelockhart.com Hailing frequencies closed, Number One. For me, this is like royalty has passed. The TOS crew is getting small. I think I was the one to break this news to Wil Wheaton via Twitter, which sucks. My heart goes out to Rod, their son. movie #11 is coming out and both his mom and dad are gone. On Dec 18, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: So sorry to read this. My condolences to her family. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : [scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:48:12 -0500 From : brent wodehouse brent_wodeho...@thefence.us To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11263728 Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies The Associated Press Article Launched: 12/18/2008 01:21:50 PM PST LOS ANGELES - Majel Barrett Roddenberry, the widow of Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, has died. She was 76. Family spokesman Sean Rossall says Majel Roddenberry died of leukemia Thursday morning at her home in Los Angeles. Her son, Eugene, was at her side. Roddenberry played Nurse Christine Chapel in the original 1960s TV series and had smaller roles in many of its successors. She also voices the computer in the upcoming Star Trek movie. After her husband's death in 1991, she continued to promote the Star Trek legacy at conventions. She also was the executive producer for two unrelated TV science fiction series, Andromeda and Earth: Final Conflict. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds Post your SciFiNoir Profile at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scifinoir2/app/peoplemap2/entry/add?fmvn=mapYa hoo! Groups Links ---BeginMessage--- I liked her when she did a serious episode with Odo on DS9 and on Next Gen with the guy she fell in love with whose society euthanized elders. Too bad they always used her for comic relief. That character had so much unexplored potential -Original Message- From: scifino...@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scifino...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of KeithBJohnson@comcast.net Sent: Thursday, January 01, 2009 9:26 PM To: scifino...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Yeah, she was good as Troi's mother, although i liked the role better when they allowed her to be serious amidst the seeming cluelessness. -- Original message -- From: Dax nx_31...@yahoo.com I loved her in the role of Troi's mother. She was always good at making Picard cringe at the thought of her coming on board. A member of the cast that will be missed. --Lavender If you don't like
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
I loved her in the role of Troi's mother. She was always good at making Picard cringe at the thought of her coming on board. A member of the cast that will be missed. --Lavender If you don't like vanilla, try some chocolate. From: keithbjohn...@comcast.net Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 1:06 AM To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Majel was so far ahead of the times when she was cast as Number One in the first Trek pilot. I have always wondered what she could have done with that role, had she not been knocked down to being not even a doctor, but a nurse assisting Bones. Gene Roddenberry always hated that the networks made him do that, but fortunately she went on to have a long and rich life in acting. And in Star Trek: The Motion Picture, they even took pains to mention that she had finally become a doctor! -- Original message -- From: Daryle Lockhart dar...@darylelockhart.com Hailing frequencies closed, Number One. For me, this is like royalty has passed. The TOS crew is getting small. I think I was the one to break this news to Wil Wheaton via Twitter, which sucks. My heart goes out to Rod, their son. movie #11 is coming out and both his mom and dad are gone. On Dec 18, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: So sorry to read this. My condolences to her family. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : [scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:48:12 -0500 From : brent wodehouse brent_wodeho...@thefence.us To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11263728 Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies The Associated Press Article Launched: 12/18/2008 01:21:50 PM PST LOS ANGELES - Majel Barrett Roddenberry, the widow of Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, has died. She was 76. Family spokesman Sean Rossall says Majel Roddenberry died of leukemia Thursday morning at her home in Los Angeles. Her son, Eugene, was at her side. Roddenberry played Nurse Christine Chapel in the original 1960s TV series and had smaller roles in many of its successors. She also voices the computer in the upcoming Star Trek movie. After her husband's death in 1991, she continued to promote the Star Trek legacy at conventions. She also was the executive producer for two unrelated TV science fiction series, Andromeda and Earth: Final Conflict. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
If they managed to get all the post-production work done, we will hear Majel one last time, as the voice of the Enterprise computer in the upcoming Star Trek movie. Gonna miss that: she's been doing it for years. Even the Star Trek Technical Manual and show guide CDs I have use her voice for the guided tours and technical narrations. Sad to see her pass on... -- Original message -- From: Daryle Lockhart dar...@darylelockhart.com Hailing frequencies closed, Number One. For me, this is like royalty has passed. The TOS crew is getting small. I think I was the one to break this news to Wil Wheaton via Twitter, which sucks. My heart goes out to Rod, their son. movie #11 is coming out and both his mom and dad are gone. On Dec 18, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: So sorry to read this. My condolences to her family. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : [scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:48:12 -0500 From : brent wodehouse brent_wodeho...@thefence.us To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11263728 Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies The Associated Press Article Launched: 12/18/2008 01:21:50 PM PST LOS ANGELES - Majel Barrett Roddenberry, the widow of Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, has died. She was 76. Family spokesman Sean Rossall says Majel Roddenberry died of leukemia Thursday morning at her home in Los Angeles. Her son, Eugene, was at her side. Roddenberry played Nurse Christine Chapel in the original 1960s TV series and had smaller roles in many of its successors. She also voices the computer in the upcoming Star Trek movie. After her husband's death in 1991, she continued to promote the Star Trek legacy at conventions. She also was the executive producer for two unrelated TV science fiction series, Andromeda and Earth: Final Conflict. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Majel was so far ahead of the times when she was cast as Number One in the first Trek pilot. I have always wondered what she could have done with that role, had she not been knocked down to being not even a doctor, but a nurse assisting Bones. Gene Roddenberry always hated that the networks made him do that, but fortunately she went on to have a long and rich life in acting. And in Star Trek: The Motion Picture, they even took pains to mention that she had finally become a doctor! -- Original message -- From: Daryle Lockhart dar...@darylelockhart.com Hailing frequencies closed, Number One. For me, this is like royalty has passed. The TOS crew is getting small. I think I was the one to break this news to Wil Wheaton via Twitter, which sucks. My heart goes out to Rod, their son. movie #11 is coming out and both his mom and dad are gone. On Dec 18, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: So sorry to read this. My condolences to her family. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : [scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:48:12 -0500 From : brent wodehouse brent_wodeho...@thefence.us To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11263728 Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies The Associated Press Article Launched: 12/18/2008 01:21:50 PM PST LOS ANGELES - Majel Barrett Roddenberry, the widow of Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, has died. She was 76. Family spokesman Sean Rossall says Majel Roddenberry died of leukemia Thursday morning at her home in Los Angeles. Her son, Eugene, was at her side. Roddenberry played Nurse Christine Chapel in the original 1960s TV series and had smaller roles in many of its successors. She also voices the computer in the upcoming Star Trek movie. After her husband's death in 1991, she continued to promote the Star Trek legacy at conventions. She also was the executive producer for two unrelated TV science fiction series, Andromeda and Earth: Final Conflict. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Hailing frequencies closed, Number One. For me, this is like royalty has passed. The TOS crew is getting small. I think I was the one to break this news to Wil Wheaton via Twitter, which sucks. My heart goes out to Rod, their son. movie #11 is coming out and both his mom and dad are gone. On Dec 18, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: So sorry to read this. My condolences to her family. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : [scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:48:12 -0500 From : brent wodehouse brent_wodeho...@thefence.us To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11263728 Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies The Associated Press Article Launched: 12/18/2008 01:21:50 PM PST LOS ANGELES - Majel Barrett Roddenberry, the widow of Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, has died. She was 76. Family spokesman Sean Rossall says Majel Roddenberry died of leukemia Thursday morning at her home in Los Angeles. Her son, Eugene, was at her side. Roddenberry played Nurse Christine Chapel in the original 1960s TV series and had smaller roles in many of its successors. She also voices the computer in the upcoming Star Trek movie. After her husband's death in 1991, she continued to promote the Star Trek legacy at conventions. She also was the executive producer for two unrelated TV science fiction series, Andromeda and Earth: Final Conflict. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds
Re: [RE][scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies
Oh crap. Wil didn't know? :( He's on my Twitter, too ~ Where love and magic meet ~ http://www.adriannebrennan.com Take a bite out of Blood and Mint Chocolates: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/bamc.html Experience the magic of Blood of the Dark Moon: http://www.adriannebrennan.com/botdm.html On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 5:27 PM, Daryle Lockhart dar...@darylelockhart.comwrote: Hailing frequencies closed, Number One. For me, this is like royalty has passed. The TOS crew is getting small. I think I was the one to break this news to Wil Wheaton via Twitter, which sucks. My heart goes out to Rod, their son. movie #11 is coming out and both his mom and dad are gone. On Dec 18, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Martin Baxter wrote: So sorry to read this. My condolences to her family. -[ Received Mail Content ]-- Subject : [scifinoir2] Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies Date : Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:48:12 -0500 From : brent wodehouse brent_wodeho...@thefence.us To : scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11263728 Majel Roddenberry, wife of 'Trek' creator, dies The Associated Press Article Launched: 12/18/2008 01:21:50 PM PST LOS ANGELES - Majel Barrett Roddenberry, the widow of Star Trek creator Gene Roddenberry, has died. She was 76. Family spokesman Sean Rossall says Majel Roddenberry died of leukemia Thursday morning at her home in Los Angeles. Her son, Eugene, was at her side. Roddenberry played Nurse Christine Chapel in the original 1960s TV series and had smaller roles in many of its successors. She also voices the computer in the upcoming Star Trek movie. After her husband's death in 1991, she continued to promote the Star Trek legacy at conventions. She also was the executive producer for two unrelated TV science fiction series, Andromeda and Earth: Final Conflict. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQdwk8Yntds Post your SciFiNoir Profile at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scifinoir2/app/peoplemap2/entry/add?fmvn=mapYahoo! Groups Links
