DOCTOR BASHING
BRAVO Mike seeing as I was one of the crew that started the DB threads which I have had personal experience of ... I must also say I have known some EXTREMELY good GPs that I would trust with my life and they are very knowledgeable . and a large number of them are turning or using alternatives .. -- Peace and Health to you and may the White Light protect you Barbara and Brian in OZ VK5KBW http://www.senet.com.au/~brains/intro.htm -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Silver Tester
George Martin wrote that Hanna makes a silver tester. YUP. I just looked it up on their web page. http://www.hannainst.com/products/ion/93737.htm You're right. Below is what their web page says. They've gone home for the night, but I wonder if the reagent set is needed. If so, this would be $250 for a silver tester. Ouch. Meanwhile, I got hold of the lab that did the tests for NutriTeam (the GfSE makers). They helped me understand the difference between a microbial challenge test and a Minimim Inhibitory Concentration test. The Microbial Challenge takes a predetermined number of bacteria and checks regularly to see how many are left after being exposed to the bactericidal agent. The Minimum Inhibitory Concentration Test checks to see how effectively the agent prevents growth of the microorganism. The lab said it would charge about $750 for an MIC test. Bob Wells HI 93737 Silver Meter High Sensitivity The Hanna HI 93737 measures silver fro m 0 to 0.6 mg/L in steps of 1/1000th of mg/L. This high resolution ensures better accuracy when keeping a tab on silver discharges. Easy-to-use HI 93737 measures only silver and weighs ab out half a pound so that quick tests can be easily performed even by non-technical staff on-site . Supplied with Starter Kit This instrument comes complet e with 2 cuvets, caps, 9V battery and instruction manual. Suggested Retail Price: HI 93737: $149.00* Reagents Sets HI 93737-01: (Ag) $102.00* HI 93737-03: (Ag) $303.00* Order Information Specifications * (Valid only in USA) Small quantities of silver are bacteriostatic or bactericidal. As a result, it is at times used in disinfection of pools and spas, as well as in water filters. However, presence of silver in water is generally indicative of pollution with film manufacturers and processors on the one hand and the surface finishers on the other as the ma in contributors. In fact, silver levels are closely monitored in these sectors since its presence can have an economic cost and in the body cause discoloration of skin, eyes and mucous membranes. Specifications: HI 93737 (Ag) Range 0 to 0.600 mg/L Resolution 0.001 mg/L Accuracy (@ 68°F/20°C) ±0.005 mg/L ±4% of reading Typical EMC Deviation ±0.001 mg/L Light Source Light Emitting Diode @ 555 nm Light Life Life of the Instrument Light Detector Silicon Photocell Battery Type/Life 1 x 9V / Approx. 40 hours of continuous u se. Auto-shut off after 10 minutes of non-u se Environment 32 to 122°F (0 to 50°C); RH 95% Dimensions 7.1 x 3.3 x 1.8 (180 x 83 x 46mm) Weight 10 oz. (290 grams)
Re: Microbial Challenge Test Fund
Marsha Hallett wrote: Love to all of you, Marsha PS, Oceanside is SOOO nice, stays about 70. Eat your hearts out... :o) How rudeG. Deb 102 here now:( -- Debbie McDonald mailto:lullw...@flash.net -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: TDS-1 What it actually does!
robert.we...@ny.ubs.com wrote: If any of you experts out there has better information, or can give me some direction, I'm anxious to hear from you. I think I had assumed that the TDS-1 would give me an accurate measurement of the ppm in my CS. Have a great weekend everybody. Bob Wells At least they were not too expensive. Should be okay to check the quality of water before the process begins though. As a side thought, has anyone tested their water before and after ozoning it? Just curious. bjs -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Lyme Candida Test
Booklet Page #15 DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH HUMAN SERVICES Public Health Service National Institutes of Health Rocky Mountain Laboratories Hamilton, Montana 59840 (406) 363-3211 FTS (700) 322-8400 January 13, 1995 Dear Sir:* This is to inform you that we have received a sample (12 ml) of your colloidal silver (1,500 ppm) preparation and have evaluated its effectiveness in a preliminary pilot study against Lyme disease spirochete, Borrelia burgdorferi (B31) and against the relapsing fever agent, B. Hermsii (HS-1).* In both tests, BSK cultured spirochetes were treated with 150 and 15 ppm of colloidal silver. When examined 24 hours later, none of the treated cultures contained live spirochetes. Few spirochetes, all dead, were observed at 48 hours. Additional in vitro and in vivo studies are in progress and will be reported as soon as results become available. Sincerely yours, Willy Burgdorfer, Ph.D. Scientist Emeritus Rocky Mountain Laboratories Microscopy Branch Tom G. Schwan, Ph.D. Senior Staff Fellow Laboratory of Microbial Structure and Function WB/TGS:bk Return to Table of Contents Booklet Page #38 TEMPLE UNIVERSITY A Commonwealth University School of Medicine Department of Microbiology and Immunology Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19140 (215) 707-3203 Fax: (215) 707-7788 February 2, 1995 Preliminary studies on your silver preparation (1500 ppm) show it to be effective in inhibiting and killing strains of Candida albicans and Cryptococcus neoformans in-vitro. Four strains of C. Neoformans were tested and they were killed by the preparation at 150-300 ppm. The growth of these strains were inhibited at a concentration as low as 0.3 ppm. Three strains of C. Albicans were tested and they were killed by the preparation at between 46 and 93 ppm. Growth was inhibited at between 0.7 and 1.4 ppm. Additional studies should be done to evaluate in-vivo effectively. Sincerely, Helen R. Buckley, Ph.D. Professor HRB/mm Return to Table of Contents -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
CS Test Results provided by GfSE maker #2
To all readers of my earlier posting on this subject: Please note that the table provided in my last posting is hard to read because of the spacing of the tabs. Therefore, please adjust the spacing so that the numbers line up correctly. If it is too confusing, let me know and I'll try to repost. Bob Wells
CS Test Results provided by GfSE maker
I've taken the time to read through the test results by Bio-Research Laboratories. Here is some of the information from their tests: Method: A microbiological assay was used to evaluate the potency of each sample against five different microorganisms (Candida albicans, Staphylococcus aureus, Salmonella typhi, Streptococcus faccium, Escherichia coli). Each organism was grown as a continuous lawn and zones of inhibition were measured to determine the minimum inhibitory concentration of the products. A zone of less than 10 mm in diameter has been defined as having no inhibition. Procedure: Sterile swabs were used to streak each trypticase soy agar (TSA) plate from a 0.5 McFarland standard of each microorganism. Four agar plugs were then removed from each plate to provide a reservoir for a series of log dilutions made from each sample in sterile deionized water. A series of four dilutions were made from 10^^-1 (0.1 g/ml) to 10^^-4 (0.0001 g/ml). Each agar well was filled with 0.1 ml at each dilution. The agar was allowed to absorb dilutions and plates were incubated face up for 24 hours at 37 degrees C. The zones of inhibition were then measured. All microorganisms tested showed some inhibition to Microdyn with a gradual decline in effect and finally a no effect dilution. At a concentration of 0.01 grams of Microdyn per ml of sterile deionized water, Candida Albicans was not inhibited (e.g. did not maintain at least a 10 mm zone free of the microorganism). Staphylococcus aureus was inhibited in a 10 mm diameter zone, Salmonella typhi was inhibited in a 12 mm zone, Streptococcus faccium was inhibited in a 10 mm zone and Escherichia coli was inhibited in a 14 mm zone. At a concentration of 0.1 grams of Microdyn per ml of sterile deionized water Candida albicans was inhibited in a 20 mm zone, Staphyloccous aureus was inhibited in a 19 mm diameter zone, Salmonella typhi was inhibited in a 25 mm zone, Streptococcus faccium was inhibited in a 16 mm zone and Escherichia coli was inhibited in an 18 mm zone. According to the tests the minimum concentrations required to maintain at least a 10 mm microorganism free zone was as follows: Can Staph Sal Strep Esch Nutri Biotic.001 .0001 .0001 .001 .001 Microdyn Silver .1 .01 .01 .01 .01 Suprayod .01 .01 .01 .1 .1 Clorox .001 .01 .01 .1.01 Maleleuca .01 .01 .01 .1 .01 OK, that's the essence of the report. What I couldn't tell from the test results was the ppm of Microdyn Silver Oxide. For that matter, I'm not even sure that Microdyn Silver Oxide is what we call Colloidal Silver. Is anyone familiar with Microdyn Silver Oxide? It would help if we knew whether it is made essentially the same way we make it and whether it is 5 ppm or 30 ppm, for example. Also, I've never dealt with Suprayod. Many thanks to those of you who explained that Maleleuca is TEA TREE OIL -- an anti-parasitic. The tests on everything but Maleleuca were run in 1995. The Maleleuca test was run early in 1998. So, now you know all that I do. Any comments? Bob Wells
Re: Wound Care - LONG!!
Carl, Only thing I can say is to use 1/2 strength h2o2. In wounds that are open and necrotozing this is better, leave longer then rinse and do more often. Some of the new cells are not impervious to the h2o2 and the full strength would also affect them and since you don't no which is ewhich for a while , well anyway trued and true. Also, in debriding in this way, I believe success is garnered not only in keeping the wound clean and uninfected, but by the blood supply to the area. I don't know how to judge blood supply to the tumor vs blood supply to the healthy tissue, If this tumor is totally lysed and oozing, would it be a consideration to have it surgically debrided first? Full strength h2o2 is good for everything that is outside the body, tho. Life is Fragile. Handle with Prayer Susan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: Doctor bashing summary...
Your summary omitted one item How many thumbs up and how many thumbs down? Dan -Original Message- From: M. G. Devour mdev...@mail.id.net To: silver-list@eskimo.com silver-list@eskimo.com Date: Friday, July 10, 1998 11:20 AM Subject: Doctor bashing summary... On 7 Jul 98 at 17:37, bjs wrote: ... this is not a FDA or AMA oriented newsgroup. Quite the opposite. Most people are here for a variety of reasons, but one common denominator for most being here is a general disenchantment with the mainstream medical monopoly to begin with. In other words, mainstream medical worship and the urge to forgive them for their faults is not deeply entrenched here. First of all, I'd like to compliment everyone who's taken part in this discussion of doctors and doctor bashing. There's been some heat but no nastiness to speak of. I started the thread by responding to Dameon's remarks, but only because it's an issue that's going to keep coming up. I wanted some air and light on the subject. Thank you all. We can't defend the medical monopoly, government policies, and mainstream arrogance that marks conventional health care (or disease management) today. I'm probably ready to go farther than *any* of you to change the system and let doctors and patients earn back their freedom. The fact that some alternative treatments have high success rates and continue to be alternative is damning. The horrendous abuse of power by some bureaucratic agencies and their insistance on trying to run our lives in every possible way are symptoms of far broader and deeper problems than just those affecting medical care. Understanding that, we all know what it's like to talk to people who have never considered alternatives. Everything we know and do is strange, suspect, and frightening for them. All their familiar ideas come from sound bites on the news, articles in the Reader's Digest, and those little pamphlets in the Doctor's waiting room. We've all gone off the deep end, already. They're just sticking a toe in the shallows! Given the dual mission of this list, to help people get started and to further study CS, we're going to always have an audience of people who are not yet convinced that this stuff is real. If we build a good reputation, we'll eventually be one of the first stops people make in exploring this new thing they heard about. So, what about doctor bashing? How do we handle this without hobbling ourselves? I strongly suggest that each of you consider your role that of educator. You may safely recount your experiences and how they made you feel, and let the *facts* speak for themselves. But do *not* generalize to include others in your condemnation, especially someone else on the list. Anyone hearing such things for the first time has enough to overcome without adding personal affront to their shock and denial. Speaking of that, mainstream medicence sure ain't got nothing kind to say about alternative methods. So I don't know how lovey dovey this can all be. We may *never* attract another medical professional or scientist to our group. If so, there'll be no more problem! But the door needs to be open, if for no other reason than their participation can speed things along for us. I don't propose to protect these people from the harsh truth, but I ask the highest level of restraint and understanding from you all. Let's help these people to face the reality of what they're involved in, hoping that at least some will be enlightened enough to stay. And as to arrogance, arrogance is playing at scientist in your kitchen lab in your spare time for six months then proposing to tell men and women who've dedicated their lives to the field that they don't have a clue what they're talking about. I would like to remind you that this one covers more than me here. Both of you are correct, here. Much of modern science and medicine has arisen from just such cranks as you and me. People whose ideas were new at one time or another. Some folks have devoted years to study of alternative treatments and logged dozens or hundreds of successful interventions. To tell them what they're doing doesn't work is quite the act of arrogance. But the bulk of medical and scientific knowledge is valid, period. Anyone who has mastered a significan portion of it *is* to be respected for that, at least. Where we are stuggling is at the vast boundaries with the unknown. It is in how they approach new and different ideas and question established thought that we will be able to measure their character. There is much of politics and personalities and power in the practice of science and medicine today. Access to information, the media, and funding are controlled to the point that those on the outside are at a perpetual disadvantage. To overcome that we must make what friends we can, and use all the advantages we posess to influence as many people as possible. This internet technology is a forceful
TDS-1 Tester-- Unanswered Question...
It was my understanding that this device measures ions. Therefore, we don't know the ppm of all silver in our concoctions, but the ionic ppm of silver, no? Without a standard lab test for total silver content, we're not getting the whole story, are we? May be it's an insignificant amount, but maybe not. Just my 2¢. Sincerely, Nancy B. (Former post from Bob Wells) f you don't know how to get a TDS-1 tester, below is information from a previous post. For the record, I have no connection to Hanna Instruments other than having purchased one of these devices. By the way, don't leave the switch on when you put the device away. The batteries do run down grin. To call Hanna Instruments to order a TDS-1 call: 1-800-HANNAUS or 1-800-426-6287. Bob Lee recently gave an e-mail address for the TDS-1 and there have been some discussion recently regarding results. I became interested enough to decide to buy one and found Hanna Instruments on the web. For those interested, the TDS-1 is for sale for $14.90. For details, check the following URL: http://www.hannainst.com/info/tdspromo.htm -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS or MSP?
Please take note: 3 weeks of antibiotics is grossly inadequate, regardless of use of colloidal silver. If your doctor refuses to prescribe 6 weeks, you need another doctor. Go to http://www.lymenet.org and carefully view Guidelines for Managing Lyme Disease by Dr. Joseph Burrascano for more sound details regarding diagnosis and antibiotic treatment of Lyme disease. There is a lot of old, outdated and harmful information used by too many doctors still regarding treating Lyme disease, resulting in preventable undertreatment, misdiagnosis, and chronic illness. I've had chronic Lyme for who knows how long, and 3/4 of my sons have had it too. One was recently reinfected with no bulls eye rash apparent. Caught early and treated long enough with proper antibiotics (six weeks) there likely will be no relapse for your child. (Of course, reinfection by another tick can occur as did with my youngest child.) Antibiotics were very useful in treating me, but colloidal went beyond what the antibiotics could with my advanced case. Also beware of the possibility of coinfection by another bacteria from the tick. For more info, visit my web pages: http://www.oikourgos.com/trisha and http://www.freeyellow.com/lyme-borreliosis . Also, http://www.freeyellow.com/members2/silver-works for my info page (pros, cons, instructions, my experience with CS for Lyme disease.) Mild silver protein is a type of colloidal silver that is so concentrated that it requires a gelatin type protein to keep the silver evenly distributed, fostering longer shelf life and salability of the product. Home made colloidal silver does not require this because it is used regularly and shelf life is not an issue. There is no need to use salt to make CS. Some people use a tiny bit of salt or baking soda as an electrolyte to get the process started sooner though. Some people caution against using salt because it produces silver chloride. In large quantities, silver chloride could be harmful. At the least, it binds up silver that could have been available in ionic form for CS otherwise. An alternative to speeding the process is to use 1/4 of previously made CS and 3/4 distilled water. Color could be indicative of oxidation of the silver. The faster the silver is made (i.e., by preheating or warming the water), the more this color is apt to occur. Exposure to light can darken CS too, so it should be kept in a glass jar that is either opaque, kept in a box, or cobalt blue or brown glass. Color of CS may also be indicative of larger particles. The paler, supposedly the smaller. Smaller particles can reach more restricted areas of the body and presumably pass out of the body more easily as well. I have reference links to excerpts of Zane Baranowski's Colloidal Silver, the Antibiotic Alternative which has a good discussion on color of colloidal silver and the implications as well as other information about CS on my colloidal silver page. Sincerely, Nancy B. -Original Message- From: Karen Pickel peg...@rapidnet.com To: silver-list@eskimo.com silver-list@eskimo.com Date: Friday, July 10, 1998 1:22 AM Subject: CS or MSP? what is the difference between Collodial Silver and Mild Silver Protein? Also, I have read that when home cooking CS that it should be 1) clear and 2) it should be amber. Also that salt shouldn't be added, and then that salt SHOULD be added...??? Obviously I am new at this. I was just dx with Lyme a week ago (bulleyes rash) and put on antibiotics for 3 weeks. I have heard such good things about CS that I want to give it a try, but these questions have me curious as to what is what. THANKYOUVERYMUCH!! Karen Pickel peg...@rapidnet.com Over The Fence Graphics and Web Design ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ Consciousness: That annoying time between naps. ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: Doctor bashing summary...
RE: Control of Internet -- I sent One Answer to Cancer about 4 times, but it never got through (at least back to my inbox). Go to: http://hills.ccsf.cc.ca.us/~jinouy01 Then go to the topic FREEDOM and click on BOOK 2 after Forbidden Books On Fri, 10 Jul 1998, M. G. Devour wrote: On 7 Jul 98 at 17:37, bjs wrote: (snip) There is much of politics and personalities and power in the practice of science and medicine today. Access to information, the media, and funding are controlled to the point that those on the outside are at a perpetual disadvantage. To overcome that we must make what friends we can, and use all the advantages we posess to influence as many people as possible. This internet technology is a forceful weapon, one over which the powerful have yet to gain control. It is here that many people on the inside are going to come face to face with outsiders for the first time. Let's help make their experience a fruitful one. Be well, my friends. Mike Devour list-owner -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: Microbial Challenge Test Fund
robert.we...@ny.ubs.com wrote: Since I started this, I'm certainly good for $50. I'll let Doug keep the tally of commitments and will be happy to follow up on the lab side. What I think I'd like to do is talk to several labs to make sure we understand what we are paying for and what we expect to get. This will happen before any money gets collected. I think that all those making a monetary contribution ought to agree on the lab choice and on the procedure. By the way, I received a fax from Nutri Team, the company that makes the GfSE. It includes test results on Nutri Biotic Liquid Disinfectant (GfSE), Microdyn Silver Oxide Suspension (I presume this is CS, but somebody help me out here), Suprayod Germicide (anybody know what this is?), I can help with this one... Melaleuca Alternifolia is TEA TREE OIL -- its an anti-parasitic. The one I have says 100% Australian Tea Tree Oil - Malaleuca Alternifolia. Fidget -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS Lab Tests
On July 9 chuckwil wrote: What a wonderful thing that we're willing to put our money where our mouths are. Since this test has now been done twice, I suggest some other project. And Bob seems to be a natural leader. I nominate him Secretariat/National Treasure/Presidio. How 'bout if we send him (or whomever we elect) money-- whatever we're comfortable with-- and then come to a consensus about how to spend it. I would, however, suggest that we do as we've done on this: wait till we do a pretty thorough investigation to see if we can obtain whatever information we're after without cost. With money in hand, we'll be able to expedite this thing. Thanks for the vote of confidence, but I hate taking personal responsibility for other people's money. Therefore, as mentioned in an earlier post, commitments are fine, but no money should be sent to anyone until there is a consensus about how it is to be used. Furthermore, even then, make sure you know who you're dealing with. (If and when it comes to collecting money, if I'm involved, I'll be sure to make it easy for you to know how to find me and ruin my career in finance if I'm irresponsible. ) I'm still catching up on the huge volume of e-mail from the past week and haven't had time to review the various test results that have been suggested. I'll try to get to it before the end of the day, but I'm supposed to be making money for my employer. Bob Wells
Re: Microbial Challenge Test Fund
Since I started this, I'm certainly good for $50. I'll let Doug keep the tally of commitments and will be happy to follow up on the lab side. What I think I'd like to do is talk to several labs to make sure we understand what we are paying for and what we expect to get. This will happen before any money gets collected. I think that all those making a monetary contribution ought to agree on the lab choice and on the procedure. By the way, I received a fax from Nutri Team, the company that makes the GfSE. It includes test results on Nutri Biotic Liquid Disinfectant (GfSE), Microdyn Silver Oxide Suspension (I presume this is CS, but somebody help me out here), Suprayod Germicide (anybody know what this is?), Melaleuca Alternifolia, Aroma Vera Brand (again, I'm clueless here) and Clorox Bleach (I do know what this is grin. The tests were run by Bio Research Laboratories, Inc. in Redmond, WA. Some of the results appear to be from 1995 and others from 1998. I don't think I have all the pages I need to make an informed assessment of the information. I'll try to call them later today to discuss these results and talk to them about running our test for us. This should begin to get us some useful information about testing. I'll be happy to forward a copy of the fax to a few of you, but for cost reasons I reserve the right to send it only to those who are willing to make a commitment of at least $10 to helping pay for lab tests. I'll pay for all phone charges for faxing so no committed funds will be used to pay for faxing, but I think it only fair that I not have to fax it to everyone. It does get expensive to fax 8 pages. grin. Again, no money will be collected until we agree on the lab, the testing process, etc. If you want the fax, make your financial commitment publicly to the list or to Doug and then send me your fax and phone number privately. I'll make sure you get my numbers in the fax. Are we creating a team, or what! Bob Wells Graphic image not retained dmcmu...@o1=nyux/DD.RFC-822=dmcmurtr\ on 07/07/98 09:25:58 AM To: silver-l...@o1=nyux/dd.rfc-822=silver-li...@eskimo.com @ omgw cc: dmcmu...@o1=nyux/dd.rfc-822=dmcmur...@bellatlantic.net @ omgw Subject: Microbial Challenge Test Fund Well, it seems that there's been some positive response to the idea of getting CS tested in a bio lab to help quantify its effects. Bob Wells had received an estimated cost of $400.00 to have the testing done. Maybe we can proceed like this. We'll keep a running list of pledges and when we hit the mark then we can send the funds to one person who could then pay the company. I'll repost the list every few days until either we get the funds pledged or interest is lost. Perhaps Bob Wells would consider being the final facilitator when we get the funds collected since he did the original research and made the necessary contacts at the lab? A firm number on cost would also be helpful. Whaddaya say Bob? Between now and then there are some additional issues to consider as Dameon so rightly points out. The basic question is What should we test? i.e. what source of CS, concentration, etc. Thoughts on this please. For now the fund stands as follows: Marsha Hallettliah...@pacbell.net - $20.00 Dameonlikow...@earthlink.net - $10.00 Douglas McMurtrie dmcmu...@bellatlantic.net - $50.00 __ Total to Date $80.00 Note to Wil, Thanks for your kind message. I'm taking your wise advice. Best to all, Doug. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: Doctor bashing summary...
Hi Joyce! I just checked the list-ower account on eskimo and I can see the problem right away. The message is over 50 kilobytes. The limit on message size is about 40k. To send something that big it would have to be broken into at least two parts. Even still, some folks get irked when they have to download *really* big messages they are not interested in, so brevity is a virtue. (So says the one who can't even say hello briefly! grin) The better alternative would be to list the web link, just as you did here. A good idea would be to include just enough of the article in your message to get people started on it! grin Thanks, Joyce. I'll take the time to read it. Be well, Mike D. On 10 Jul 98 at 9:17, Joyce wrote: RE: Control of Internet -- I sent One Answer to Cancer about 4 times, but it never got through (at least back to my inbox). Go to: http://hills.ccsf.cc.ca.us/~jinouy01 Then go to the topic FREEDOM and click on BOOK 2 after Forbidden Books -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
What are we making?
Hello chc, and welcome to the list! Let me take a stab at helping you make use of the gift you received... On 8 Jul 98 at 18:47, chc wrote: We were given a small battery operated CS generator. It has (4) 9 V batteries and 3 silver wires, ~ 14 gauge and the are apart and into the water. There is so much sediment, it scares me to drink it! Of course no directions came with it. What are we making? It doesn't look anything like the stuff I've bought at the store. Yes we are using distilled water. Thanks in advance for any insights. chc First of all, you don't *want* to drink the sediment. If you have already I wouldn't freak out, but let's not make it a habit, okay!? grin You say it has 3 silver wires. Really? Please describe how they're laid out a little more carefully so we can be sure what's going on. Getting started: Okay, let's start by helping you make a good batch just with distilled water. If your water is well distilled, it ought to have only a very few ppm of contaminants. If so, then you won't see anything at all happening for a while after you put the electrodes in the water. This is because the current flowing is very low and the silver ions or particles being pulled off are very slowly increasing the water's ability to conduct. Just watch for a while, maybe 10, 20, even 30 minutes, and you'll eventually see very tiny bubbles rising from the negative electrode. These are hydrogen, I believe. About the same time, you'll notice the positive electrode start to turn dark, while the negative electrode turns more grey. When all this starts to happen, look closely, perhaps with the help of a flashlight held behind and to the side of the glass, and you'll be able to see wispy clouds of silver particles coming off the positive electrode. This is the good stuff! Dealing with sludge: After the silver particles have been visible for a while, you'll start to see a fluffy grey deposit start to build up on the negative electrode. These are silver particles that have clung to the wire and lost their positive charge. They are no longer part of the colloidal suspension you're trying to make. The best way to deal with the sludge, in my opinion, is to leave it alone. An alternative is to remove the electrodes from time to time and wipe them off on a clean tissue. In either case, if you're careful when you remove the electrodes, the fluff won't break off and get into the CS. If it does, don't worry, as it'll just settle out and you can pour off the liquid. There are some subtleties I've noticed about whether you should wipe the electrodes or not, stir the water or not, etc. They're too arcane to go into here, but I'd just suggest you don't stir the water, or if you do, do it only after you've wiped the electrodes off. Lastly, you can pour the final product through stacked coffee filters as another way to remove any visible flakes or sediment. Be sure to use the cheaper kind, as some of the name brands, like Mr. Coffee, have added flavor enhancers to their filters! How long to run it: You should start timing your batch from the point when the tiny bubbles and wispy clouds first appear. The startup time tends to vary quite a bit from batch to batch, for reasons that might include temperature, water purity, and maybe even the state of the tides. (Yes, lunar influences have been seriously suggested as having an effect on the process. The material I've seen looks more interesting than I would have expected and I don't know enough to disprove it. In any case, we're adjusting the process just so we don't have to worry about any of these things. grin) How long should you let it run? Well, I can make about 10-12 ppm in 32 oz of water in under an hour *after* the wisps first appear. If you make it 8 or 16 ounces at a time, it'll take less time, of course. The specifics will be different if your electrode length or spacing is different from mine. How much different? We haven't studied it enough to know yet. The product: Up to a few ppm or so, the CS will be perfectly clear. At 10-15 ppm it's a light straw color. Much beyond that and it starts to get seriously yellow, golden, or even a deep amber color, if you get well above 20 ppm. It will gradually darken a little bit over the first day or so, depending at least in part how much light it gets. Keep your CS in the dark, away from strong electric and/or magnetic fields, in closed containers of glass or certain kinds of plastic, such as the bottles peroxide comes in from the drug store. How good is CS made this way? Well, folks have used it successfully, and nobody has had serious problems that we've heard of. As with all CS preparations, you'll have to watch for herxheimer reactions if you manage to kill off a lot of pathogens quickly. And some folks have had minor problems with their digestion and bowels, due to disruption of the intestinal flora. There are techniques to deal with these
Doctor bashing summary...
On 7 Jul 98 at 17:37, bjs wrote: ... this is not a FDA or AMA oriented newsgroup. Quite the opposite. Most people are here for a variety of reasons, but one common denominator for most being here is a general disenchantment with the mainstream medical monopoly to begin with. In other words, mainstream medical worship and the urge to forgive them for their faults is not deeply entrenched here. First of all, I'd like to compliment everyone who's taken part in this discussion of doctors and doctor bashing. There's been some heat but no nastiness to speak of. I started the thread by responding to Dameon's remarks, but only because it's an issue that's going to keep coming up. I wanted some air and light on the subject. Thank you all. We can't defend the medical monopoly, government policies, and mainstream arrogance that marks conventional health care (or disease management) today. I'm probably ready to go farther than *any* of you to change the system and let doctors and patients earn back their freedom. The fact that some alternative treatments have high success rates and continue to be alternative is damning. The horrendous abuse of power by some bureaucratic agencies and their insistance on trying to run our lives in every possible way are symptoms of far broader and deeper problems than just those affecting medical care. Understanding that, we all know what it's like to talk to people who have never considered alternatives. Everything we know and do is strange, suspect, and frightening for them. All their familiar ideas come from sound bites on the news, articles in the Reader's Digest, and those little pamphlets in the Doctor's waiting room. We've all gone off the deep end, already. They're just sticking a toe in the shallows! Given the dual mission of this list, to help people get started and to further study CS, we're going to always have an audience of people who are not yet convinced that this stuff is real. If we build a good reputation, we'll eventually be one of the first stops people make in exploring this new thing they heard about. So, what about doctor bashing? How do we handle this without hobbling ourselves? I strongly suggest that each of you consider your role that of educator. You may safely recount your experiences and how they made you feel, and let the *facts* speak for themselves. But do *not* generalize to include others in your condemnation, especially someone else on the list. Anyone hearing such things for the first time has enough to overcome without adding personal affront to their shock and denial. Speaking of that, mainstream medicence sure ain't got nothing kind to say about alternative methods. So I don't know how lovey dovey this can all be. We may *never* attract another medical professional or scientist to our group. If so, there'll be no more problem! But the door needs to be open, if for no other reason than their participation can speed things along for us. I don't propose to protect these people from the harsh truth, but I ask the highest level of restraint and understanding from you all. Let's help these people to face the reality of what they're involved in, hoping that at least some will be enlightened enough to stay. And as to arrogance, arrogance is playing at scientist in your kitchen lab in your spare time for six months then proposing to tell men and women who've dedicated their lives to the field that they don't have a clue what they're talking about. I would like to remind you that this one covers more than me here. Both of you are correct, here. Much of modern science and medicine has arisen from just such cranks as you and me. People whose ideas were new at one time or another. Some folks have devoted years to study of alternative treatments and logged dozens or hundreds of successful interventions. To tell them what they're doing doesn't work is quite the act of arrogance. But the bulk of medical and scientific knowledge is valid, period. Anyone who has mastered a significan portion of it *is* to be respected for that, at least. Where we are stuggling is at the vast boundaries with the unknown. It is in how they approach new and different ideas and question established thought that we will be able to measure their character. There is much of politics and personalities and power in the practice of science and medicine today. Access to information, the media, and funding are controlled to the point that those on the outside are at a perpetual disadvantage. To overcome that we must make what friends we can, and use all the advantages we posess to influence as many people as possible. This internet technology is a forceful weapon, one over which the powerful have yet to gain control. It is here that many people on the inside are going to come face to face with outsiders for the first time. Let's help make their experience a fruitful one. Be well, my friends. Mike Devour list-owner [Mike Devour,
Re: caster oil
From the article by Dr. David G. Williams, M.D.: Castor oil is a triglyceride of fatty acids. Almost 90 percent of its fatty acid content consists of ricinoleic acid. To my knowledge, ricinoleic acid is not found in any other substance except castor oil. Such a high concentration of this unusual, unsaturated fatty acid is thought to be responsible for castor oil's remarkable healing abilities. Ricinoleic acid has been shown to be effective in preventing the growth of numerous species of viruses, bacteria, yeasts and molds. (J Am Oil Chem Soc 61;37.323-325.) I think we'd have heard from the FDA, years ago, if Castor Oil contained the illegal nerve gas 'ricin'. And Edgar Cayce would be listed along with Adolph Hitler and the Unibomber. --Bill --- From: Debbie McDonald lullw...@flash.net To: silver-list@eskimo.com Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 Subj: Re: caster oil Found this on the newsgroupsG Can anyone dispute it with facts or should we do more digging? Deb castor oil contains ricin, one of the most potent poisons known. A single molecule will kill a cell (by chewing up ribosomes if memory serves). The oil is used as a cathartic. Not sure whether this is a true stimulant cathartic a class of drugs that too many women only learn to avoid after they have to consult a doctor because their colon doesn't work anymore. Avoid castor oil, if someone tells you it is healthful, see if they are also taking DDT pills and ask for a reputable reference. Robert Read, DVM, PhD Looked up ricin. Toxic indeed!! LD50 .001 ug/gram! But why do women seem to fall victim to this? They just happen to use it more? And is there really damage to the colon, given the 3-day turnaround time for the lining? -- Debbie McDonald mailto:lullw...@flash.net -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re; Deer Tick
Reading this kinda' late, but watched a video of a presentation by a very well respected doctor in the lyme community. He said the spirochetes will make their way into the CNS and all tissues within 4 weeks, so waiting to test is not a good idea. Better to treat preventively and for a LONG time. My daughter was treated with 10 days amoxicillan when she was 3 for bulls-eye rash. Now she is 9 and sick with chronic lyme disease. Lynn I totally agree, why wait? Err on the side of caution! Other researchers who work with neuroborrellia I have spoken with as recently as last evening, tell me that the Bb is in the brain in 48 hours! Also the tests are all so unreliable. Why would someone with a bullseye rash wait for a result. I'd say that test + enough. Who cares about an inaccurate test result?? Next, knowing what I know about antibiotics, why do that one either?? They don't work! I know, I went into kidney failure anyway..Thanks guys.. Does anyone on this list know of one person who got immediate antibiotics after a tick bite w/ rash and never had another Lyme symptom again Lastly, correct me if I am wrong. But the tests that do show positive aren't accurate at all until 1-2 weeks!! Yikes!! Man, I am so sorry I did not know about CS and this list, oh about 30 something years ago. My life might have been a whole lot less painful, literally!! Thanks for letting me share. chc Stupidity is doing the same thing, and expecting different results. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
MCT Fund Update
For CHC and any other newcomers: We are collecting pledges to handle the cost of laboratory testing of CS at different concentrations against different pathogens Are we talking about in petri dishes? Like doing Lab Culture Sensitivity studies??? Who will do the tests? Thanks for the clarification guys. I am just trying to get up to speed. Does anyone know, or has anyone read anything about HOW the CS works? Colloidal Silver was used for years for different problems, infections, diseases, etc, do you think dosage and treatment info would be available in archives somewhere Does anyone have any ideas about this???. Thank you in advance. chc -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
