Re: CS antibiotics ??????
Have you tried oxygen therapies? Not yet but plan to in the future if I get a chance. I have tryed peroxide baths and that does help. With out it I become a shuffling, shaking, hurting, sleeping reck that can't even remember what I done 10 minutes before. I don't have the answer for the reason that CS caused the combination of antibotics that I take to quit working but it did. Floxin has been singled out on one of the major news shows for the neurological damage that can and does occur. I expect you feel untired because of some of this effect. I took one and it was wired to the ceiling time. Be careful of all the fluoroquinilones. There was more to it than just being tired. That was just one of the problems. I know that floxin or any antibotic isn't good for a person if they have to take it long term but I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place. With out them I run the risk of having another heart attack, can't function enough to carry on my daily life, and it just eats my nerves up. It's so bad at times that I can't stand sound or light. Take Care Reid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics ??????
With out it I become a shuffling, shaking, hurting, sleeping reck that can't even remember what I done 10 minutes before. I don't have the answer for the reason that CS caused the combination of antibotics that I take to quit working but it did. Floxin has been singled out on one of the major news shows for the neurological damage that can and does occur. I expect you feel untired because of some of this effect. I took one and it was wired to the ceiling time. Be careful of all the fluoroquinilones. There was more to it than just being tired. That was just one of the problems. I know that floxin or any antibotic isn't good for a person if they have to take it long term but I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place. With out them I run the risk of having another heart attack, can't function enough to carry on my daily life, and it just eats my nerves up. It's so bad at times that I can't stand sound or light. What if the CS made you tired from die off of candida or???, have you been tested for yeast? Sorry, just trying to help. I read candida may be causative for CFS symptoms. Deb Debbie McDonald I've considered yeast as a posibility for some of my problems. God knows as much antibotics that I've had ran through me that I should have a massive yeast infection. The one thing that rules that out is that I was 90%+ cured a little while back with IV clafrin. The bug that has me is right under my skin. It's a fiberglass fealing that is slowly working it's way into my muscles and other parts of my body. I know that it has an effect on my nerves and veins. I believe that it shrinks my veins and possability causes them to harden. I know it does that to my nerves because the more moving around that I do the works it gets. I can take some thing to make me sleep for a few days and some of my pain and problems go away or atleast lessen. That non movement of the nerves gives them time to mend some. The area that the infection (soft tissue) makes it hard to cure with antibotics or anything for that matter. I think that is why the floxin works so good on me because it gets to the nerves. Take Care Reid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics ??????
Have you tried oxygen therapies? At 01:46 PM 10/9/98 -0500, you wrote: With out it I become a shuffling, shaking, hurting, sleeping reck that can't even remember what I done 10 minutes before. I don't have the answer for the reason that CS caused the combination of antibotics that I take to quit working but it did. Floxin has been singled out on one of the major news shows for the neurological damage that can and does occur. I expect you feel untired because of some of this effect. I took one and it was wired to the ceiling time. Be careful of all the fluoroquinilones. There was more to it than just being tired. That was just one of the problems. I know that floxin or any antibotic isn't good for a person if they have to take it long term but I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place. With out them I run the risk of having another heart attack, can't function enough to carry on my daily life, and it just eats my nerves up. It's so bad at times that I can't stand sound or light. What if the CS made you tired from die off of candida or???, have you been tested for yeast? Sorry, just trying to help. I read candida may be causative for CFS symptoms. Deb Debbie McDonald I've considered yeast as a posibility for some of my problems. God knows as much antibotics that I've had ran through me that I should have a massive yeast infection. The one thing that rules that out is that I was 90%+ cured a little while back with IV clafrin. The bug that has me is right under my skin. It's a fiberglass fealing that is slowly working it's way into my muscles and other parts of my body. I know that it has an effect on my nerves and veins. I believe that it shrinks my veins and possability causes them to harden. I know it does that to my nerves because the more moving around that I do the works it gets. I can take some thing to make me sleep for a few days and some of my pain and problems go away or atleast lessen. That non movement of the nerves gives them time to mend some. The area that the infection (soft tissue) makes it hard to cure with antibotics or anything for that matter. I think that is why the floxin works so good on me because it gets to the nerves. Take Care Reid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics ??????
With out it I become a shuffling, shaking, hurting, sleeping reck that can't even remember what I done 10 minutes before. I don't have the answer for the reason that CS caused the combination of antibotics that I take to quit working but it did. Floxin has been singled out on one of the major news shows for the neurological damage that can and does occur. I expect you feel untired because of some of this effect. I took one and it was wired to the ceiling time. Be careful of all the fluoroquinilones. What if the CS made you tired from die off of candida or???, have you been tested for yeast? Sorry, just trying to help. I read candida may be causative for CFS symptoms. Deb -- Debbie McDonald mailto:lullw...@flash.net -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics ??????
Sorry to prove you wrong but it did cancel out the effects of the antibotics in me and I had to quit taking the CS. The way that I know is the antibotics that I take give me energy and wake me up plus other things. With out them I sleep all the time. After about 2 weeks I started going down hill and the antibotics wasn't working any more. About 2-3 days after I stopped the CS they started working again. Some people haven't had problems with mixing the two and I think that it makes a difference in the type of antibotics that the person is taking. Myself I was on floxin and zithromax at the time. Reid, There are lots of possible explanations. You say acidophillus cause intestinal bleeding in you? Gasto-intestinal disturbances are the most frequently reported adverse affects of zithromax. You are concurrently using the EMEM-2? The acidophillus bleeding problem was before I even knew about the EMEM-2 device or Rife. I took it as advized by my doctor and 1-2 days later I was bleeding. The bleeding stopped when I quit taking the acidophillus. What other meds, diet changes, electrobiophysical experimentations are you doing? Floxin and Zithromax have somewhat overlapping toxicities to the kidneys. 25% of Floxin is bound to plasma protein. Ag precipitates plasma protein. The normal dose for Zithromax is one day. Occassionally it is give 3 or even 4 days. Thats pushing it. One patient took it for nine days and suffered irreversible renal failure (Mansoor GA,et al. Azithromycin-induced acute interstitial nephritis. Ann Intern Med 1993; 119: 636-7). Perhaps you were experiencing a die-off rxn? Did you run any tests (liver function, kidney function, blood chem, stools) to zero in on what is really going on? Reid, I'd have to see something more than energy levels in one person. I've seen nothing in the literature as to an interaction of any antibiotic and CS, nor can I think I think up a plausible counteraction. On the other hand, in many cases they may work in an additive fashion. I am not an apologist for CS and don't sell it. My comments are intended in a constructive spirit. Regards, Vincent The doctor at the time gave me a pad of antibotics and said try each one for a few days then try combinations of them and see what helps. I went through each one for a week at a time and none helped alot. Then after a few combinations of both I found floxin and zithromax worked. At the time I was sleeping from 14 to 18 hours a day. I found that if I took that combination at 6:00am and went back to sleep that at 9:00am I would wake up and feal good. I had energy, didn't hurt, and was able to carry on with daily tasks. That's been over 7 years ago and the only thing that has kept me going. With out it I become a shuffling, shaking, hurting, sleeping reck that can't even remember what I done 10 minutes before. I don't have the answer for the reason that CS caused the combination of antibotics that I take to quit working but it did. Take Care Reid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics ??????
Vincent: Your posts are excellent - to see where we are heading re. pharmaceuticals the following site is must see. Once you get into it you won't be able leave it... Check out the BERLIN TRIBUNAL http://www.rath.nl/GB/hot1.htm Chris Gupta At 12:38 PM 10/7/98 -0700, VGammill wrote: [snip] Ask yourself if it is in the interest of the pharmaceutical giants to cure you at a reasonable price, or keep you paying through the nose forever. Ask yourself if it is in the interest of those who mind the government coffers for you to live forever in perfect health collecting those benefits, or is it in their interest for you to keel over at age 65. I would not be surprised to learn that the government and the pharmaceutical industry are toying around with chronic diseases of the future to protect themselves against the nightmarish eventuality that everyone has learned to wipe out their own cancer, heart disease, c.. On the other hand that would be a perfect excuse to raise the allowable amounts on all the carcinogens in our food, air, and water. Lets keep our fingers crossed that natural antibiotics such as CS and usnea will prove their mettle in the political-economic healthcare wars to come. Vincent Gammill -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics ??????
Mike Devour writes: Hello Vincent! You just saw the perfect example of why we *never* spout absolutes in this forum. Well, maybe not *never!* GRIN There is so much diversity of experience among our members that there will be exceptions to nearly every assumption you can make. Mike, What may have come across as pontification re the combination of CS and antibiotics was actually an effort to keep things simple and straightforward for people who may not have a lot of time on their hands to mull over technical matters. CS does not negate any of the usual antibiotics by any of the known routes by which antibiotic work. But, all prescription antibiotics have a plethora of unwanted side effects. Likewise, all the transition metals (even CS) have unwanted effects in high dosages. These unwanted effects can be compounded. I do not have strong biases pro or con CS. But laying cards on the table--pro: It would be wonderful to have a simple natural antibiotic without significant side effects that can be kept forever in the hands of the people and forever out of the hands of the pharmaceutical giants and the FDA. And, con: The existence of CS antedates the sulfa drugs and penicillin. It did nothing that I know of to help in the flu epidemic of 1918, nor did it help in syphilis, TB, and polio. I don't want to confuse issues by discussing antibiotics and antiseptics in the same message, but Ag is very effective as such. I've seen AgNO3 used to irrigate an infected thorasic cavity after coronary bypass surgery. So many of the other antiseptics that have been in common use are very very harmful--ortho phenylphenol which was used in Lysol, not to mention all the quaternary ammonium compounds that are now used with so little concern. There are other everyday chemicals in common use I suspect cause enormous harm, but it would be not be sensible to discuss them without serious proof--not when major industries would be harmed and perhaps unfairly. I would like to see the whole pharmaceutical industry wither away for the simple reason that their patent medicines aren't need or wanted. But can that happen when the profits are so addictive? All of allopathic medicine came together last century for simple purpose of quashing their homeopathic and botanic low-dollar competitors. Ask yourself if it is in the interest of the pharmaceutical giants to cure you at a reasonable price, or keep you paying through the nose forever. Ask yourself if it is in the interest of those who mind the government coffers for you to live forever in perfect health collecting those benefits, or is it in their interest for you to keel over at age 65. I would not be surprised to learn that the government and the pharmaceutical industry are toying around with chronic diseases of the future to protect themselves against the nightmarish eventuality that everyone has learned to wipe out their own cancer, heart disease, c.. On the other hand that would be a perfect excuse to raise the allowable amounts on all the carcinogens in our food, air, and water. Lets keep our fingers crossed that natural antibiotics such as CS and usnea will prove their mettle in the political-economic healthcare wars to come. Vincent Gammill -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics ??????
There was some discussion of whether or not CS antibiotics cancel each other out. Did this question ever get answered definitively? Shelly, CS and antibiotics do not cancel each other out. This is definitive. You can take it to the bank. SNIP Vincent Gammill Sorry to prove you wrong but it did cancel out the effects of the antibotics in me and I had to quit taking the CS. The way that I know is the antibotics that I take give me energy and wake me up plus other things. With out them I sleep all the time. After about 2 weeks I started going down hill and the antibotics wasn't working any more. About 2-3 days after I stopped the CS they started working again. Some people haven't had problems with mixing the two and I think that it makes a difference in the type of antibotics that the person is taking. Myself I was on floxin and zithromax at the time. Take Care Reid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics ??????
Shelly asked: There was some discussion of whether or not CS antibiotics cancel each other out. Did this question ever get answered definitively? Vincent Gammill replied: CS and antibiotics do not cancel each other out. This is definitive. You can take it to the bank. Reid retorted: Sorry to prove you wrong but it did cancel out the effects of the antibotics in me and I had to quit taking the CS. ... Hello Vincent! You just saw the perfect example of why we *never* spout absolutes in this forum. Well, maybe not *never!* GRIN There is so much diversity of experience among our members that there will be exceptions to nearly every assumption you can make. You wrote: What is the usual metabolic fate of CS? We've got clues that it ultimately clears the body in the feces... How long does it last until it is oxidized to Ag+ ?? And then does it preferentially form an oxide ... , an ionic salt ... , lock on to any endogenous chelating anions or diols c., or is it simply snatched up by albumin or other protein? I don't think we know for sure what chemical form it is in even in the *bottle*, let alone once it gets into our systems. Scary, huh? How would it attack various microorganisms of interest--especially those that are cell wall deficient? There is generally reported some mumo-jumbo about interfering with enzymes involved in oxygen uptake, mumble, mumble... hands waving fitfully in the air, eyes opening wide... G What about the odd oxidation states of Tetrasil (+2 and +4) as the oxide and is it truly antiviral? I've never heard of Tetrasil. As to being antiviral, some anecdotal evidence points that way, some doesn't. I know that viral infections like colds run their normal course in me once they get started, but they *do not* advance to secondary bacterial infections. So the outcome is generally much improved by CS use. You'll frequently hear from folks who say they can stop a cold if they hit it with CS when they *first* note symptoms. Silver salts can be reduced into several allotropes. Is there a difference in physiological effects? I can give a pretty good guess at some of these answers. Is there anyone else out there who'd like to sort it all out? Vince, we're mostly non-professional inquirers here. We've all stumbled on this colloidal silver stuff that, despite the hype and disinformation on both sides, seems to work, sometimes pretty remarkably. We're doing our best to separate fact from fiction and share what we've learned. The marketers have muddied the waters with hype and unfounded claims. On the other side are self appointed debunkers whose fear-mongering does not hold up under even minimal scrutiny. What's left is the accounts of the folks who have had CS work wonders for them. *That* is why I'm here, trying to help unravel the mess. There is no contemporary, organized body of scientific research on CS. The mainstream establishment has mostly ignored it as part of the fringe, and sometimes has acted to suppress the information. There are a few tendrils of modern research that relate to what we know, but they're few and show no signs of being well funded or gaining any significant following in the scientific community. The bulk of the data we have is anecdotal testimony and some minimal experimental trials and analyses. Any insight you wish to share with us is welcome. Bear in mind that some of us have at least workable scientific and technical backgrounds, while others are not so trained. Many have a lot of experience with CS and other alternatives, and have seen what they will do. In any case, you'll recieve a respectful reception if you want to help us figure it all out. The long term goal is understanding, both scientific and clinical. Near term, we want to be sure the best information is availabe to those who need it. Be well, Mike Devour list owner [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] [mdev...@mail.id.net ] [Speaking only for myself... ] -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics ??????
Shelley Charlesworth charleswo...@access1.netwrites: To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CS antibiotics Date: Tuesday, October 06, 1998 10:32 AM There was some discussion of whether or not CS antibiotics cancel each other out. Did this question ever get answered definitively? Shelly, CS and antibiotics do not cancel each other out. This is definitive. You can take it to the bank. I do have a question or two for all you shinolas out there in Listland. What is the usual metabolic fate of CS? How long does it last until it is oxidized to Ag+ ?? And then does it preferentially form an oxide (thereby making it an excellent redox catalyst), an ionic salt (e.g., to Cl-), a ligand, lock on to any endogenous chelating anions or diols c., or is it simply snatched up by albumin or other protein? Or even by GSH (reduced glutathione)? How would it attack various microorganisms of interest--especially those that are cell wall deficient? What about the odd oxidation states of Tetrasil (+2 and +4) as the oxide and is it truly antiviral? Silver salts can be reduced into several allotropes. Is there a difference in physiological effects? I can give a pretty good guess at some of these answers. Is there anyone else out there who'd like to sort it all out? Vincent Gammill -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: CS antibiotics
There was some discussion of whether or not CS antibiotics cancel each other out. Did this question ever get answered definitively? Shelley -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
