Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
Birgit This is late as I have been away in Finland for three weeks. I like your proposal as I have often searched the wiki for something like this. I have taken the liberty of adding a voting section to your proposal page and adding my vote in favour as the first entry. Hope this is OK! Mike Harris -Original Message- From: Birgit Huesken [mailto:birgit.hues...@web.de] Sent: 17 July 2009 09:35 To: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home The object of this proposal is to add a new value residential_home to the amenity-tag amenity=residential_home. There are places where people, who for different reasons can't stay alone or in their families, live. The idea is to create a tag/amenity that covers these places in general and which can be specified in more details by adding additional tags e.g. according to the people who live there. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Residential_home It's my first proposal so I hope I did everything the correct way so far. Glad for any hints... Birgit ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
David's summary is imho a good one. There are subtle but not hard-and-fast distinctions between 'sheltered accommodation' for those who can manage in their own place but need a warden around (and perhaps a community room or a public kitchen) and 'nursing home' for those in need of greater care, including nursing care. The normal progression is from 'sheltered accommodation' to 'nursing home' (to cemetery!). David and Birgit are correct to distinguish 'shelter' - which in British English - is quite different from 'sheltered accommodation' and is indeed a more temporary arrangement for people, e.g. homeless, victims of domestic violence etc. who need a temporary place to go while sorting out their lives. I.e. people entering 'sheltered accommodation' usually leave it only for a 'nursing home' (or the grave) while most people entering a 'shelter' will sooner or later resume a more normal lifestyle. As per previous message, I have voted yes. Mike Harris -Original Message- From: David Earl [mailto:da...@frankieandshadow.com] Sent: 17 July 2009 11:14 To: Birgit Huesken Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home Birgit Huesken wrote: There are places where people, who for different reasons can't stay alone or in their families, live. The idea is to create a What you are describing is normally known (at least here) as shelters. For homeless people and domestic violence victims etc. If I understood you correctly, shelters are something like emergency places or homes where people stay for a comparably short time. What I mean are places where people really _live_ instead of staying alone or with their families, not for emergency reasons but following a decision well thought over. Don't know if this sounds a bit pathetic but I don't know how to describe it in a better way at the moment. Residential Home in the UK is definitely a term to describe a place where usually elderly people, but vulnerable people in general, live communally, usually involving professional care and sometimes advanced medical care (though this is often called a Nursing Home; the distinction is not a hard one). So I think your tag is an appropriate description. Emergency shelters are something else. (And in many cases will not be recognisable from the street as they often need to be discreet - e.g. refuges) David ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
Mike Harris mik...@googlemail.com writes: David's summary is imho a good one. There are subtle but not hard-and-fast distinctions between 'sheltered accommodation' for those who can manage in their own place but need a warden around (and perhaps a community room or a public kitchen) and 'nursing home' for those in need of greater care, including nursing care. The normal progression is from 'sheltered accommodation' to 'nursing home' (to cemetery!). David and Birgit are FWIW in the US we use assisted living for what I think you mean by sheltered accomodation, and also use nursing home. The difference is that the help in assisted living is not 'medical care'. (I'm not trying to argue with the name - but I often find wiki pages that say things that might look like residential=sheltered_accomodation : Use this for a sheltered accomodation. to be not all that useful, since people either know what the words mean or they don't. A lot of UK terms aren't obvious to us Yanks, and I'm sure it's the other way around. correct to distinguish 'shelter' - which in British English - is quite different from 'sheltered accommodation' and is indeed a more temporary arrangement for people, e.g. homeless, victims of domestic violence etc. who need a temporary place to go while sorting out their lives. I.e. people entering 'sheltered accommodation' usually leave it only for a 'nursing home' (or the grave) while most people entering a 'shelter' will sooner or later resume a more normal lifestyle. We use 'shelter' in the same sense, more or less. pgphTLMIbZY1Z.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
Hi Greg Thanks for useful input - agree that US 'assisted living' = UK 'sheltered accommodation'. Medical care (or at least nursing care) is indeed the key difference. Although a Brit I have lived twice in the USA (as well as briefly in Germany) so am reasonably au fait with the THREE ((;) totally different languages! I even own a British-American American-British bilingual dictionary! But I still make mistakes - like asking an American lady business visitor once (when checking her into a hotel) when she would like to be knocked up in the morning ... Also did media training in the US (as a conversion course from doing PR in the UK) - and that was a real eye-opener! Cheers! -Original Message- From: Greg Troxel [mailto:g...@ir.bbn.com] Sent: 06 August 2009 13:01 To: Mike Harris Cc: 'David Earl'; 'Birgit Huesken'; talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home Mike Harris mik...@googlemail.com writes: David's summary is imho a good one. There are subtle but not hard-and-fast distinctions between 'sheltered accommodation' for those who can manage in their own place but need a warden around (and perhaps a community room or a public kitchen) and 'nursing home' for those in need of greater care, including nursing care. The normal progression is from 'sheltered accommodation' to 'nursing home' (to cemetery!). David and Birgit are FWIW in the US we use assisted living for what I think you mean by sheltered accomodation, and also use nursing home. The difference is that the help in assisted living is not 'medical care'. (I'm not trying to argue with the name - but I often find wiki pages that say things that might look like residential=sheltered_accomodation : Use this for a sheltered accomodation. to be not all that useful, since people either know what the words mean or they don't. A lot of UK terms aren't obvious to us Yanks, and I'm sure it's the other way around. correct to distinguish 'shelter' - which in British English - is quite different from 'sheltered accommodation' and is indeed a more temporary arrangement for people, e.g. homeless, victims of domestic violence etc. who need a temporary place to go while sorting out their lives. I.e. people entering 'sheltered accommodation' usually leave it only for a 'nursing home' (or the grave) while most people entering a 'shelter' will sooner or later resume a more normal lifestyle. We use 'shelter' in the same sense, more or less. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
On Thu, Aug 6, 2009 at 2:20 PM, Mike Harrismik...@googlemail.com wrote: Thanks for useful input - agree that US 'assisted living' = UK 'sheltered accommodation'. Medical care (or at least nursing care) is indeed the key difference. Although a Brit I have lived twice in the USA (as well as briefly in Germany) so am reasonably au fait with the THREE ((;) totally different languages! I even own a British-American American-British bilingual dictionary! But I still make mistakes - like asking an American lady business visitor once (when checking her into a hotel) when she would like to be knocked up in the morning ... Also did media training in the US (as a conversion course from doing PR in the UK) - and that was a real eye-opener! Is there room in this scheme for the concept of a hospice where one might go to live out the remainder (usually short) of one's life comfortably after medical care has failed to cure/treat an illness? Cheers, Adam Cheers! -Original Message- From: Greg Troxel [mailto:g...@ir.bbn.com] Sent: 06 August 2009 13:01 To: Mike Harris Cc: 'David Earl'; 'Birgit Huesken'; talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home Mike Harris mik...@googlemail.com writes: David's summary is imho a good one. There are subtle but not hard-and-fast distinctions between 'sheltered accommodation' for those who can manage in their own place but need a warden around (and perhaps a community room or a public kitchen) and 'nursing home' for those in need of greater care, including nursing care. The normal progression is from 'sheltered accommodation' to 'nursing home' (to cemetery!). David and Birgit are FWIW in the US we use assisted living for what I think you mean by sheltered accomodation, and also use nursing home. The difference is that the help in assisted living is not 'medical care'. (I'm not trying to argue with the name - but I often find wiki pages that say things that might look like residential=sheltered_accomodation : Use this for a sheltered accomodation. to be not all that useful, since people either know what the words mean or they don't. A lot of UK terms aren't obvious to us Yanks, and I'm sure it's the other way around. correct to distinguish 'shelter' - which in British English - is quite different from 'sheltered accommodation' and is indeed a more temporary arrangement for people, e.g. homeless, victims of domestic violence etc. who need a temporary place to go while sorting out their lives. I.e. people entering 'sheltered accommodation' usually leave it only for a 'nursing home' (or the grave) while most people entering a 'shelter' will sooner or later resume a more normal lifestyle. We use 'shelter' in the same sense, more or less. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
--- On Fri, 17/7/09, Birgit Huesken birgit.hues...@web.de wrote: There are places where people, who for different reasons can't stay alone or in their families, live. The idea is to create a What you are describing is normally known (at least here) as shelters. For homeless people and domestic violence victims etc. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
2009/7/17 John Smith delta_foxt...@yahoo.com: --- On Fri, 17/7/09, Birgit Huesken birgit.hues...@web.de wrote: There are places where people, who for different reasons can't stay alone or in their families, live. The idea is to create a What you are describing is normally known (at least here) as shelters. For homeless people and domestic violence victims etc. Yes and Retirement Homes/Old People Homes, Homes for the Disabled. etc etc. Maybe we need a tag for Day Care, and Drop in Centre as well. A Shelter is a type of Residential Home, not all Residential Home will be Shelters. Peter Childs ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
There are places where people, who for different reasons can't stay alone or in their families, live. The idea is to create a What you are describing is normally known (at least here) as shelters. For homeless people and domestic violence victims etc. If I understood you correctly, shelters are something like emergency places or homes where people stay for a comparably short time. What I mean are places where people really _live_ instead of staying alone or with their families, not for emergency reasons but following a decision well thought over. Don't know if this sounds a bit pathetic but I don't know how to describe it in a better way at the moment. Birgit -- Birgit Hüsken IT Service Management ITSM Hochschule Niederrhein KIS - Kommunikations-/Informationssysteme, Services Niederrhein University of Applied Sciences Communication-/Informationsystems, Services Reinarzstr. 49 D – 47805 Krefeld Telefon: +49 2151 822 3225 birgit.hues...@hs-niederrhein.de http://www.hs-niederrhein.de ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
--- On Fri, 17/7/09, Birgit Huesken birgit.hues...@web.de wrote: If I understood you correctly, shelters are something like emergency places or homes where people stay for a comparably short time. What I mean are places where people really _live_ instead of staying alone or with their families, not for emergency reasons but following a decision well thought over. Don't know if this sounds a bit pathetic but I don't know how to describe it in a better way at the moment. What Peter put Yes and Retirement Homes/Old People Homes, Homes for the Disabled. etc etc. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Residential home
Birgit Huesken wrote: There are places where people, who for different reasons can't stay alone or in their families, live. The idea is to create a What you are describing is normally known (at least here) as shelters. For homeless people and domestic violence victims etc. If I understood you correctly, shelters are something like emergency places or homes where people stay for a comparably short time. What I mean are places where people really _live_ instead of staying alone or with their families, not for emergency reasons but following a decision well thought over. Don't know if this sounds a bit pathetic but I don't know how to describe it in a better way at the moment. Residential Home in the UK is definitely a term to describe a place where usually elderly people, but vulnerable people in general, live communally, usually involving professional care and sometimes advanced medical care (though this is often called a Nursing Home; the distinction is not a hard one). So I think your tag is an appropriate description. Emergency shelters are something else. (And in many cases will not be recognisable from the street as they often need to be discreet - e.g. refuges) David ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
