Re[2]: Newsreading with Bat?

[tracer]

Hello Marck D. Pearlstone,
On Tue, 25 Jan 2000 07:15:30 + GMT your local time,
which was Tuesday, January 25, 2000, 2:15:30 PM (GMT+0700) my local time,
Marck D. Pearlstone wrote:

Marck> Hi tracer,

Marck> I'll tell you what I think: you already have this facility by corectly
Marck> placing the %CURSOR macro following the %QUOTES in your reply template
Marck> :-).

I suppose that works if one wants to replay to a msg at the end of ONE
quoted piece..
Ah well, I suppose it means trying to change habbits(g)

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tracer

Using theBAT 1.39 
mail to : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Tue, 25 Jan 2000 08:59:27 +0700, tracer wrote:

[..snip..]

> Not sure what Steve thinks: system adding blank lines(g). Maybe we need
> some tab called netiquette where all that sort of stuff is set

AutoCorrectors, Grammatik, etc. They all get in the way IMHO. The most
infuriating is the autocapitalizer which insists that a capital letter
should follow a 'period'.  This blank line proposition is up the same
street.  I say shake it, and take the time to develop good habits. It's
not that much time either, especially when one is *really* motivated to
change. :)

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Januk Aggarwal]

Hello Marck,


On  Monday, January 24, 2000  at  07:15:30 GMT + (which was 11:15 PM where I
live) [EMAIL PROTECTED] typed:

> I'll tell you what I think: you already have this facility by corectly
> placing the %CURSOR macro following the %QUOTES in your reply template
> :-).

Ah, but you can't have more than one %CURSOR in your template, not to
mention the fact that it doesn't help when you're mixing your comments
into the quoted text. :) But I agree, I don't think a forced line
separator is something that should be *added* to The Bat! It causes
more problems than it solves.

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 Januk
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Using The Bat! 1.39
 under Windows 98 4.10 Build   A 

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Marck D. Pearlstone]

Hi tracer,

On  25 January 2000  at  08:59:27 GMT +0700 (which was 01:59 where I
live) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote and made these points:

Keith>> Might be a possibility. Have you submitted the suggestion?

t> Since the programmers are reading this list I am sure they take any
t> good suggestion without submission and dump bad ones even if
t> submitted(g)

t> Not sure what Steve thinks: system adding blank lines(g).
t> Maybe we need some tab called netiquette where all that sort of stuff
t> is set

I'll tell you what I think: you already have this facility by corectly
placing the %CURSOR macro following the %QUOTES in your reply template
:-).

-- 
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.\\arck

Marck D. Pearlstone, Consultant Software Engineer
Co-moderator TBUDL / TBBETA
www: http://www.silverstones.com
PGP key: 

*---
| Using The Bat! 1.39 S/N 14F4B4B2
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Re[4]: Newsreading with Bat?

[tracer]

Hello Keith Russell,
On Mon, 24 Jan 2000 11:08:47 -0700 GMT your local time,
which was Tuesday, January 25, 2000, 1:08:47 AM (GMT+0700) my local time,
Keith Russell wrote:

Keith> Hello, fellow Bat-lovers.

Keith> That's better! Once it becomes a habit, you won't have to think to
Keith> remember 8-). Seriously, I do it without thinking

t>> Since when editing its shown as a different colour the bat knows its a
t>> quoted text and should be easily able to force this blanc line.
t>> It would besides fix peoples bad habits maybe also make sure that
t>> those new to the net donot get them

Keith> Might be a possibility. Have you submitted the suggestion?

Since the programmers are reading this list I am sure they take any
good suggestion without submission and dump bad ones even if
submitted(g)

Not sure what Steve thinks: system adding blank lines(g).
Maybe we need some tab called netiquette where all that sort of stuff
is set

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tracer

Using theBAT 1.39 

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Re[3]: Newsreading with Bat?

[Keith Russell]

Hello, fellow Bat-lovers.

On Monday, 24 January, 2000, 12:00:47 AM, tracer wrote:

t> Hello Keith Russell,
t> On Sun, 23 Jan 2000 20:54:19 -0700 GMT your local time,
t> which was Monday, January 24, 2000, 10:54:19 AM (GMT+0700) my local time,
t> Keith Russell wrote:

Keith>> It frustrates me that I and several others have asked you to put lines
Keith>> between quotes, and that even in responding to such a request, you
Keith>> don't put a line! Please don't take this personally, because you've
Keith>> been really helpful to me and to many others on the list.

t> I am willing but problem is that in working through loads of mails its
t> very hard to remember doing it..

That's better! Once it becomes a habit, you won't have to think to
remember 8-). Seriously, I do it without thinking

t> Also in corresponding with people one to one it was never a real
t> problem.
t> On the other hand the cure is simple, optionally have the system
t> FORCE that blank line or separator.

t> Since when editing its shown as a different colour the bat knows its a
t> quoted text and should be easily able to force this blanc line.
t> It would besides fix peoples bad habits maybe also make sure that
t> those new to the net donot get them

Might be a possibility. Have you submitted the suggestion?

Thanks for trying 8-).

-- 
 Keith Russell
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re[2]: Newsreading with Bat?

[tracer]

Hello Keith Russell,
On Sun, 23 Jan 2000 20:54:19 -0700 GMT your local time,
which was Monday, January 24, 2000, 10:54:19 AM (GMT+0700) my local time,
Keith Russell wrote:

Keith> It frustrates me that I and several others have asked you to put lines
Keith> between quotes, and that even in responding to such a request, you
Keith> don't put a line! Please don't take this personally, because you've
Keith> been really helpful to me and to many others on the list.

I am willing but problem is that in working through loads of mails its
very hard to remember doing it..
Also in corresponding with people one to one it was never a real
problem.
On the other hand the cure is simple, optionally have the system
FORCE that blank line or separator.
Since when editing its shown as a different colour the bat knows its a
quoted text and should be easily able to force this blanc line.
It would besides fix peoples bad habits maybe also make sure that
those new to the net donot get them



Best regards,
 
tracer

Using theBAT 1.39 

mail to : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
using FireTalk: 321338
LOCAL phone: 271194

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Keith Russell]

Hello, fellow Bat-lovers.

On Saturday, January 22, 2000, 5:07:34 AM, tracer wrote:

t> Hello Jast,
t> On Sat, 22 Jan 2000 05:36:20 +0100 GMT your local time,
t> which was Saturday, January 22, 2000, 11:36:20 AM (GMT+0700) my local time,
t> Jast wrote:


Jast>>  Not  every (net) community has the same standards and rules, and in some good
Jast>>  message  trimming  and  formatting might not be so important. But it is here,
Jast>>  and  I'd  prefer  if  sir tracer would trim his mails a little and put a line
Jast>>  after the quotes . . . please?
t> Spmeone told me that one really should have a separator line as a
t> feature of the bat when quoting, or a blank line.
t> Anyway, I donot see lines after quotes in your msg so I do
t> musunderstand it?
t> I thought its obvious when quoting since the name of the person quoted
t> is still there...

Tracer, it may be "obvious," but it's still hard to read. This is all
about making e-mail reading more convenient for list subscribers, all
of whom, I am sure (if they're at all like me), are struggling to keep
on top of truckloads of messages.

Look at the line (two, actually) separating the four 't>' lines and
the quote from Jast, versus the lines from Jast and your response,
which are just jammed together. Sure, you can tell by looking closely
that these were written by different people, but it isn't obvious at
first glance; it takes a little extra mental effort.

And if someone doesn't have sender information enabled in their
quotes, the difference between >, >>, and >>> is even harder to see.

It frustrates me that I and several others have asked you to put lines
between quotes, and that even in responding to such a request, you
don't put a line! Please don't take this personally, because you've
been really helpful to me and to many others on the list. But e-mail
is so time consuming as it is, that when I see messages that are hard
to read, whether it be because of poor formatting, numerous spelling
errors, failure to use mixed case, or overuse of "shorthand" terms, I
tend to skip over them. And this is a shame, because sometimes I miss
good content; but I just don't have the time.


-- 
 Keith Russell
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Using The Bat! 1.39 under Windows 98 4.10 Build 1998 on a Pentium II 233 with 64 MB.

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Sat, 22 Jan 2000 16:23:40 +1100, Lone-Wolf wrote:

[..snip..]

> Perhaps if anyone could tell me how to use Xnews off line I would be
> eternally grateful (well, at least grateful, don't know about eternal)

I've been unable to use X-News offline in any meaningful manner. I
guess that you could connect, open the desired groups. Queue the desired
headers for download, download them, disconnect and then read them.

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Re[2]: Newsreading with Bat?

[Lone-Wolf]

Newsreading with Bat?
Hello Nick,

Wednesday, January 19, 2000, 8:18:32 PM, you wrote:

NA> On Tuesday, January 18, 2000, 2:02:43 PM, Allie Martin wrote:

>>  Yes, I used the Agent
>> combo for sometime myself but realized that Agent failed quite
>> substantially on the e-mail side. It also fails quite markedly on the news
>> side as well with it's inability to support multiple servers without
>> having to run multiple instances . enter X-News. :)

NA> I have the same feelings toward Agent, and although I haven't tried
NA> X-News as yet, I am currently trying Gravity 2.2. It configures multiple
NA> servers easily, and has scoring as well. Have you tried this Program yet
NA> Allie?

NA> Nick



>From my limited experience with X News - not an off line reader, and
with Gravity - at present a bug (design feature) that when you look at
headers off line it tries to connect for each header!  Have been
advised by Gravity that this will be fixed in next upgrade ($$?)
Perhaps if anyone could tell me how to use Xnews off line I would be
eternally grateful (well, at least grateful, don't know about eternal)

-- 

Keep Canada beautiful.  Swallow your beer cans.


Using The Bat1.39  Windows 98  Build

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Jast]

Morning tracer,

> Spmeone told me that one really should have a separator line as a
> feature of the bat when quoting, or a blank line.
> Anyway, I donot see lines after quotes in your msg so I do
> musunderstand it?

 Looks  like it :-) As you can see, I left a blank line between the quotes and
 my  text.  It  just  makes it easier to read, even with named quotation marks
 color coding...


-- 
+--Jast
|on Windows 98 4.10 Build  A 
:with The Bat! 1.39



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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Sat, 22 Jan 2000 16:39:53 +0100, Jast wrote:

>> Spmeone told me that one really should have a separator line as a
>> feature of the bat when quoting, or a blank line. Anyway, I donot see
>> lines after quotes in your msg so I do musunderstand it?

>  Looks  like it :-) As you can see, I left a blank line between the quotes and
>  my  text.  It  just  makes it easier to read, even with named quotation marks
>  color coding...

... and Tracer:

this:

> If I remember, I installed it and started using it. Only thing going
> wrong was import of my old mail and that was my stupid mistake...
> Admittedly I am not using the Bat  in anyway upto its max but its does
> what I want in most ways.

is easier to read than this:

> If I remember, I installed it and started using it.
> Only thing going wrong was import of my old mail and that was my
> stupid mistake...
> Admittedly I am not using the Bat  in anyway upto its max but its does
> what I want in most ways.

All it took was Alt+L or simply using the autoformat option. :)

-- 
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Re[2]: Newsreading with Bat?

[tracer]

Hello Jast,
On Sat, 22 Jan 2000 05:36:20 +0100 GMT your local time,
which was Saturday, January 22, 2000, 11:36:20 AM (GMT+0700) my local time,
Jast wrote:


Jast>  Not  every (net) community has the same standards and rules, and in some good
Jast>  message  trimming  and  formatting might not be so important. But it is here,
Jast>  and  I'd  prefer  if  sir tracer would trim his mails a little and put a line
Jast>  after the quotes . . . please?
Spmeone told me that one really should have a separator line as a
feature of the bat when quoting, or a blank line.
Anyway, I donot see lines after quotes in your msg so I do
musunderstand it?
I thought its obvious when quoting since the name of the person quoted
is still there...



Best regards,
 
tracer

Using theBAT 1.39 
mail to : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
using FireTalk: 321338



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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Jast]

Morning Allie Martin,

> The netiquette rules are global.

 Not   necessarily...   I'm   involved  in  a community where shouting is just
 another  way  of  expressing irony or used for fun, were you greet each other
 with  "BITCH"  and  the  likes and a song consisting only of cusswords is the
 typical  creative  output... These aren't bad, unfriendly or stupid people to
 be with, they just behave differently (and weird :) among themselves.

 Not  every (net) community has the same standards and rules, and in some good
 message  trimming  and  formatting might not be so important. But it is here,
 and  I'd  prefer  if  sir tracer would trim his mails a little and put a line
 after the quotes . . . please?


-- 
+--Jast
|on Windows 98 4.10 Build  A 
:with The Bat! 1.39



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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Fri, 21 Jan 2000 11:29:47 -0800, Nick Andriash wrote:

> I have my storage options set to zero seeing as I've got cable, and am
> always on-line. However, if you store articles with Xnews, it doesn't
> make sense to have to quickly go on-line to retrieve them... should they
> not be "stored" as the feature suggests?

They *are* stored as the feature says. I have my messages stored and
set to be purged after 7 days. It's just that you have to open the group
to get at the message listing and the group will not open unless you're
connected.

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Fri, 21 Jan 2000 09:21:53 -0800, Steve Lamb wrote:

> Also who said colors are for news.  Personally I find black on white
> blinding.  I am upset at Windows for tying certain color values together
> which force people to use a dark on light color scheme than a light on
> dark. Configuring editor colors could mean just having comfortable
> colors to work with.

This is what I was referring to.

> BTW, yes, I did modify your text to prove your point.  Will you
> forgive me?  :)

I'll think about it. :)


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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Nick Andriash]

On Friday, January 21, 2000, 8:44:59 AM, Allie Martin wrote:

> Yes, but I can't seem to get at these stored messages without first
> going online and opening the group with the connection going. You could
> however disconnect after having opened the group and continue reading
> offline.

I have my storage options set to zero seeing as I've got cable, and am
always on-line. However, if you store articles with Xnews, it doesn't
make sense to have to quickly go on-line to retrieve them... should they
not be "stored" as the feature suggests?

Nick

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Steve Lamb]

Friday, January 21, 2000, 8:30:16 AM, Nick wrote:
> I was thinking more about this Steve, and remembered that Xnews has a
> storage feature. Would not storing of bodies serve the same purpose as
> running Hamster with Xnews? Are they not one in the same, only using
> different Folders basically?

Uhm, partially.  You'd have to download all the messages each time.  I
dunno if XNews can do that (I barely use it as it is).  Off-line reading in
the other packages involves marking messages to be downloaded and then read on
the next pass through the news server.

*shrug*  Mongo have cable.  Mongo always connected.  Mongo no need
off-line news reading.  Mongo not know how it works.  Ungh.

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Steve Lamb]

Friday, January 21, 2000, 2:56:11 AM, Allie wrote:
> trimmed) is far more than what I have written and if I'm sure that I still
> want to send? Now tell me 

In Gravity (IIRC) there is an option to set a threshold on that warning.
IE, messages under x lines don't get checked on the quote ratio.

>> I never reformat my news

> Well, you should,
> especially if it needs to
> be to make it easier for people
> to read
> it. :)

No why would anyone do that?  ;)

> Well, you should, especially if it needs to be to make it easier for people
> to read it. :)

Oh, that, ok.  :)

 :) You cannot paste as quote and you cannot configure the editors
 color scheme.

>> I donot use colours for news

> That's you. :)

Also who said colors are for news.  Personally I find black on white
blinding.  I am upset at Windows for tying certain color values together which
force people to use a dark on light color scheme than a light on dark.
Configuring editor colors could mean just having comfortable colors to work
with.

> I do. I just gave my opinion, remember? I didn't declare that no-one should use it. 
>I take my message formatting seriously since I strongly feel that
> it's good courtesy to make your reader comfortable.

Now why would you want that?

> I do. I just gave my opinion, remember? I didn't declare that no-one should
> use it. I take my message formatting seriously since I strongly feel that
> it's good courtesy to make your reader comfortable.

Oh, right, that too.  :)

BTW, yes, I did modify your text to prove your point.  Will you forgive
me?  :)

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Fri, 21 Jan 2000 08:30:16 -0800, Nick Andriash wrote:

>> Wild guess, Hamster is a local news server.  XNews doesn't have true
>> offline reading capabilities so it needs a local news server to do that.

> I was thinking more about this Steve, and remembered that Xnews has a
> storage feature. Would not storing of bodies serve the same purpose as
> running Hamster with Xnews? Are they not one in the same, only using
> different Folders basically?

Yes, but I can't seem to get at these stored messages without first
going online and opening the group with the connection going. You could
however disconnect after having opened the group and continue reading
offline.

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Nick Andriash]

On Thursday, January 20, 2000, 8:01:43 AM, Steve Lamb wrote:

> Thursday, January 20, 2000, 7:54:19 AM, Nick wrote:
>> I'm just curious, but what purpose would be served by trying to run
>> Xnews with Hamster? What added functionality would it serve that is not
>> already present in Xnews?

> Wild guess, Hamster is a local news server.  XNews doesn't have true
> offline reading capabilities so it needs a local news server to do that.

I was thinking more about this Steve, and remembered that Xnews has a
storage feature. Would not storing of bodies serve the same purpose as
running Hamster with Xnews? Are they not one in the same, only using
different Folders basically?



Nick

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Fwd: Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Thomas Fernandez]

Hello TBUDL!



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Ciao,
Thomas  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Generated with The Bat! 1.39
under Chinese Windows 98 4.10 Build 1998  
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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Fri, 21 Jan 2000 18:35:51 +0700, tracer wrote:

Allie>> Well, you should, especially if it needs to be to make it easier for
Allie>> people to read it. :)

> It is easy, I start a sentence at the begin of a line and goto the
> next one before its gets to long.
> I may add a paragraph or so where required but I rarely post long
> pieces of proza...

:)

> I know, I havent seen them either, all my Agent msgs come in as black...
> except for links! (I may even be wrong about the colour...)

I was speaking of my end and what *I* see. Not what I send to the
recipient.

> As you say its personal but on the groups where I post it would be a
> total waste...

Why's that?

>  Anyway, I understand why you want it and different newsgroups have
> different users/requirements...

With respect to good formatting of messages and appropriate trimming?
I think not. The netiquette rules are global.

Allie>> I copy text from the client into 'message cleaner' which cleans up the
Allie>> formatting for me. I don't have to use it with TB! provided the '>' quote
Allie>> prefix is used.

> (g)
> Different usage as you say..

Take for example. Your quotation above has an 83 character limit. Not
good. TB! allows me to easily fix that.

> I want my news to transfer fast and thus save money, be multiple
> server and be convenient to use.

If people would appropriately trim their quotes it would be even
faster. :)

> Admittedly Agent isnt all I would want but the editor part has never
> bothered me.

I like it myself except for it's inability to reflow quoted material.

> ONLY time I ever had problem was that I didnt know that every window
> can set its own scroll lock so it that keys gets pressed in the wrong
> window it can cause a lot of headscratching. Luckily their support
> sorted it out fast

The scroll-lock support is nice.

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Re[2]: Newsreading with Bat?

[tracer]

Hello Allie Martin,
On Fri, 21 Jan 2000 05:56:11  -0500 GMT your local time,
which was Friday, January 21, 2000, 5:56:11 PM (GMT+0700) my local time,
Allie Martin wrote:

Allie> On Thu, 20 Jan 2000 18:52:26 +0700, tracer wrote:

(snip)
\  X-News gives a  reformat facility. Agent says nothing on the matter.

>> I never reformat my news

Allie> Well, you should, especially if it needs to be to make it easier for
Allie> people to read it. :)
It is easy, I start a sentence at the begin of a line and goto the
next one before its gets to long.
I may add a paragraph or so where required but I rarely post long
pieces of proza...

 :) You cannot paste as quote and you cannot configure the editors
 color scheme.

>> I donot use colours for news

Allie> That's you. :)
I know, I havent seen them either, all my Agent msgs come in as
black... except for links! (I may even be wrong about the colour...)

 I can't imagine how the editor can be like this and there is no
 facility (unless it's hidden) to use an external editor.

>> But I donot NEED one. Adimittedly its a bit like typing the old 80*24
>> line monitors but who minds...

Allie> I do. I just gave my opinion, remember? I didn't declare that no-one
Allie> should use it. I take my message formatting seriously since I strongly
Allie> feel that it's good courtesy to make your reader comfortable.
As you say its personal but on the groups where I post it would be a
total waste...
Anyway, I understand why you want it and different newsgroups have
different users/requirements...


 When I copy and paste text to 'message cleaner' it's done in a buggy
 fashion as well (that's unbelievable. I didn't know such a thing could
 happen).

>> Whats mesg cleaner? never used it...

Allie> I copy text from the client into 'message cleaner' which cleans up the
Allie> formatting for me. I don't have to use it with TB! provided the '>' quote
Allie> prefix is used.
(g)
Different usage as you say..
I want my news to transfer fast and thus save money, be multiple
server and be convenient to use.
Admittedly Agent isnt all I would want but the editor part has never
bothered me.
ONLY time I ever had problem was that I didnt know that every window
can set its own scroll lock so it that keys gets pressed in the wrong
window it can cause a lot of headscratching. Luckily their support
sorted it out fast


Best regards,
 
tracer

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Thu, 20 Jan 2000 18:52:26 +0700, tracer wrote:

>>> Yes, but considering that I have to pay for the damn thing, the
>>> editor is UTTERLY unacceptable. How can you create a popup message
>>> saying that the flow of text is too long and that some readers may
>>> have problems reading the message without providing a solution?!!

>  I never have that problem, I set it to the default.. Probably 80 or
>  so

When the comment is made on text flow, it is usually about the quoted
material and not what I had written. In TB! one can easily reformat quoted
text. In Agent and Gravity you can't. My question is why put this prompt
in my face asking me if I'm sure I want to send the message with lines too
long without giving a solution? Another prompt that is annoying occurs
when your follow-up message has only a few responding words. A popup
message appears saying that the amount of quoted material (even though
trimmed) is far more than what I have written and if I'm sure that I still
want to send? Now tell me 

\>>>  X-News gives a  reformat facility. Agent says nothing on the matter.

> I never reformat my news

Well, you should, especially if it needs to be to make it easier for
people to read it. :)

>>> :) You cannot paste as quote and you cannot configure the editors
>>> color scheme.

> I donot use colours for news

That's you. :)

>>> I can't imagine how the editor can be like this and there is no
>>> facility (unless it's hidden) to use an external editor.

> But I donot NEED one. Adimittedly its a bit like typing the old 80*24
> line monitors but who minds...

I do. I just gave my opinion, remember? I didn't declare that no-one
should use it. I take my message formatting seriously since I strongly
feel that it's good courtesy to make your reader comfortable.

>>> When I copy and paste text to 'message cleaner' it's done in a buggy
>>> fashion as well (that's unbelievable. I didn't know such a thing could
>>> happen).

> Whats mesg cleaner? never used it...

I copy text from the client into 'message cleaner' which cleans up the
formatting for me. I don't have to use it with TB! provided the '>' quote
prefix is used.


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Re[2]: Newsreading with Bat?

[tracer]

Hello Allie Martin,
On Thu, 20 Jan 2000 06:20:52  -0500 GMT your local time,
which was Thursday, January 20, 2000, 6:20:52 PM (GMT+0700) my local time,
Allie Martin wrote:

Allie> On Thu, 20 Jan 2000 01:29:54 +0100, Christopher J. Trybowski wrote:

>> [Gravity]
>>> Yes, but considering that I have to pay for the damn thing, the editor
>>> is UTTERLY unacceptable. How can you create a popup message saying
>>> that the flow of text is too long and that some readers may have problems
>>> reading the message without providing a solution?!! X-News gives a
>>> reformat facility. Agent says nothing on the matter. :) You cannot paste
>>> as quote and you cannot configure the editors color scheme. I can't
>>> imagine how the editor can be like this and there is no facility (unless
>>> it's hidden) to use an external editor.  When I copy and paste text to
>>> 'message cleaner' it's done in a buggy fashion as well (that's
>>> unbelievable. I didn't know such a thing could happen).
all I know is that in the long and distant past I used gravity for a
month, then tried Agent. I never ever went back to Gravity or to
another one.
Ok, I ran a fully featured Agent 0.99 with a given key for 6 months and then
decided to pay.
Kind of stimulated as the new version came out and my newsreader
stopped working but for me the choice was clear, I liked it and had
my own code in a few hours.
Agent may not be the best, it sure ismt what it could be BUT it doesnt
cause me any problems

Best regards,
 
tracer

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Re[2]: Newsreading with Bat?

[tracer]

Hello Christopher J. Trybowski,
On Thu, 20 Jan 2000 01:29:54 +0100 GMT your local time,
which was Thursday, January 20, 2000, 7:29:54 AM (GMT+0700) my local time,
Christopher J. Trybowski wrote:

Christopher> Hello Allie,
Christopher> On Wednesday, January 19, 2000 you wrote:

Christopher> [Gravity]
>> Yes, but considering that I have to pay for the damn thing, the editor
>> is UTTERLY unacceptable. How can you create a popup message saying
>> that the flow of text is too long and that some readers may have problems
>> reading the message without providing a solution?!!
 I never have that problem, I set it to the default.. Probably 80 or
 so
\>>  X-News gives a  reformat facility. Agent says nothing on the matter.
I never reformat my news
\>> :) You cannot paste
>> as quote and you cannot configure the editors color scheme.
I donot use colours for news
>> I can't
>> imagine how the editor can be like this and there is no facility (unless
>> it's hidden) to use an external editor.
But I donot NEED one. Adimittedly its a bit like typing the old 80*24
line monitors but who minds...
>> When I copy and paste text to
>> 'message cleaner' it's done in a buggy fashion as well (that's
>> unbelievable. I didn't know such a thing could happen).
Whats mesg cleaner? never used it...

Christopher> Oh,  come  on,  this program is a winner as far as bugs are concerned.
Christopher> Too  long  lines  is  one of them. But there are plenty of others, and
Christopher> plenty  of  lacking features (like Base64 and Quoted Printable support
Christopher> for  8 bit characters, code pages converting). I'm still using it, but
Christopher> only  because  I'm  yet  too lazy to switch to XNews. But I will soon!
Christopher> XNews + Hamster :-)


Best regards,
 
tracer

Using theBAT 1.39 
mail to : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
using FireTalk: 321338



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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Nick Andriash]

On Thursday, January 20, 2000, 8:01:43 AM, Steve Lamb wrote:

> Wild guess, Hamster is a local news server.  XNews doesn't have true
> offline reading capabilities so it needs a local news server to do that.

Oh right... yeah, I forgot about the off-line reading issue. Thanks. :o)


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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Nick Andriash]

On Thursday, January 20, 2000, 3:20:52 AM, Allie Martin wrote:

>I didn't give it enough of a chance to discover other problems. Upon
> using it to post a couple messages, the decision was clear. If certain
> basic things/issues are not properly addressed, I don't care about the
> rest of the apps abilities. It's simple canned.

Sorry Allie, but I'm coming in on this thread a little late. Are you
referring to Gravity 2.2, or Xnews? What are some of these "basic"
issues you're referring to that are not present in Gravity, but are in
Xnews? I've just started using Xnews, and am presently trying to digest
all the info on the Perl Regular Expression Tutorial. :o)

Nick


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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Steve Lamb]

Thursday, January 20, 2000, 7:54:19 AM, Nick wrote:
> I'm just curious, but what purpose would be served by trying to run
> Xnews with Hamster? What added functionality would it serve that is not
> already present in Xnews?

Wild guess, Hamster is a local news server.  XNews doesn't have true
offline reading capabilities so it needs a local news server to do that.


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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Nick Andriash]

On Wednesday, January 19, 2000, 4:29:54 PM, Christopher J. Trybowski wrote:

> Oh,  come  on,  this program is a winner as far as bugs are concerned.
> Too  long  lines  is  one of them. But there are plenty of others, and
> plenty  of  lacking features (like Base64 and Quoted Printable support
> for  8 bit characters, code pages converting). I'm still using it, but
> only  because  I'm  yet  too lazy to switch to XNews. But I will soon!
> XNews + Hamster :-)

I'm just curious, but what purpose would be served by trying to run
Xnews with Hamster? What added functionality would it serve that is not
already present in Xnews?


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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Thu, 20 Jan 2000 01:29:54 +0100, Christopher J. Trybowski wrote:

> [Gravity]
>> Yes, but considering that I have to pay for the damn thing, the editor
>> is UTTERLY unacceptable. How can you create a popup message saying
>> that the flow of text is too long and that some readers may have problems
>> reading the message without providing a solution?!! X-News gives a
>> reformat facility. Agent says nothing on the matter. :) You cannot paste
>> as quote and you cannot configure the editors color scheme. I can't
>> imagine how the editor can be like this and there is no facility (unless
>> it's hidden) to use an external editor.  When I copy and paste text to
>> 'message cleaner' it's done in a buggy fashion as well (that's
>> unbelievable. I didn't know such a thing could happen).

> Oh,  come  on,  this program is a winner as far as bugs are concerned.
> Too  long  lines  is  one of them. But there are plenty of others, and
> plenty  of  lacking features (like Base64 and Quoted Printable support
> for  8 bit characters, code pages converting). I'm still using it, but
> only  because  I'm  yet  too lazy to switch to XNews. But I will soon!
> XNews + Hamster :-)

I didn't give it enough of a chance to discover other problems. Upon
using it to post a couple messages, the decision was clear. If certain
basic things/issues are not properly addressed, I don't care about the
rest of the apps abilities. It's simple canned.

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Christopher J. Trybowski]

Hello Allie,
On Wednesday, January 19, 2000 you wrote:

[Gravity]
> Yes, but considering that I have to pay for the damn thing, the editor
> is UTTERLY unacceptable. How can you create a popup message saying
> that the flow of text is too long and that some readers may have problems
> reading the message without providing a solution?!! X-News gives a
> reformat facility. Agent says nothing on the matter. :) You cannot paste
> as quote and you cannot configure the editors color scheme. I can't
> imagine how the editor can be like this and there is no facility (unless
> it's hidden) to use an external editor.  When I copy and paste text to
> 'message cleaner' it's done in a buggy fashion as well (that's
> unbelievable. I didn't know such a thing could happen).

Oh,  come  on,  this program is a winner as far as bugs are concerned.
Too  long  lines  is  one of them. But there are plenty of others, and
plenty  of  lacking features (like Base64 and Quoted Printable support
for  8 bit characters, code pages converting). I'm still using it, but
only  because  I'm  yet  too lazy to switch to XNews. But I will soon!
XNews + Hamster :-)

-- 
Christopher J. Trybowski 
===
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 http://www.trybik.i.krakow.pl --- pgp-keys: 0xB92EEE69 0x9382700B 
===( get-pgp-keys: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Subject=send_key )===

Using The Bat! 1.39 [reg] under Windows 98 4.10 build 1998.

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Pasquale J. Festa Sr.]

Hello Grant,

January 18, 2000, 8:10:22 AM, you wrote:

GB> I'm a long time user of Agent, and have to admit that this is the
GB> first program to come along in _years_ that turned my head at all! I
GB> really like the functionality of the Bat. However, mail is probably
GB> only 1/4 of my needs. The other 3/4 is newsgroups. Are there any plans
GB> to add newsgroup functionality to the Bat? Is there a timeframe? TIA

GB> grant



Like you, I have been using Agent for news and mail and in all honesty
if  it  rendered HTML that would be all I need I would keep the Bat as
is,  and use Agent just for news.The only time I use Agent for mail is
when  I  send  large attachments (the bat seems to go nuts and hang my
computer).

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Wed, 19 Jan 2000 01:18:32 -0800, Nick Andriash wrote:

[..snip..]

> I have the same feelings toward Agent, and although I haven't tried
> X-News as yet, I am currently trying Gravity 2.2. It configures multiple
> servers easily, and has scoring as well. Have you tried this Program yet
> Allie?

Yes, but considering that I have to pay for the damn thing, the editor
is UTTERLY unacceptable. How can you create a popup message saying
that the flow of text is too long and that some readers may have problems
reading the message without providing a solution?!! X-News gives a
reformat facility. Agent says nothing on the matter. :) You cannot paste
as quote and you cannot configure the editors color scheme. I can't
imagine how the editor can be like this and there is no facility (unless
it's hidden) to use an external editor.  When I copy and paste text to
'message cleaner' it's done in a buggy fashion as well (that's
unbelievable. I didn't know such a thing could happen). I therefore
ditched it without hesitation. X-News is better IMHO and it's free.

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Nick Andriash]

On Tuesday, January 18, 2000, 2:02:43 PM, Allie Martin wrote:

>  Yes, I used the Agent
> combo for sometime myself but realized that Agent failed quite
> substantially on the e-mail side. It also fails quite markedly on the news
> side as well with it's inability to support multiple servers without
> having to run multiple instances . enter X-News. :)

I have the same feelings toward Agent, and although I haven't tried
X-News as yet, I am currently trying Gravity 2.2. It configures multiple
servers easily, and has scoring as well. Have you tried this Program yet
Allie?

Nick


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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Allie Martin]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2000 16:16:58 -0500, Grant Baxter wrote:

[..snip..]

> No, not really. Anyone (like me) that has interests in things that
> span both newsgroups and maillists, would like (as I do) to be able to
> file pertinent info from both newsgroups _and_ maillists into the same
> folder. For example, I build robots. There are some enlightening
> messages in both the robotics newsgroup, and the BasicX maillist
> pertaining to sonar detection. I would like to file both sets of
> messages into the "Sonar Solutions" folder.

Er, import export operations perhaps? Sounds tedious but two dedicated
specialized apps work far better than one happy combo. This is a rule that
doesn't seem to be breakable. Some feel that TB! may be the first. I don't
think so. Hey Steve, I decided to give X-News a 'longer length of rope'
and it was worth it. :)

The rewards of two separate apps will outweigh the hassle of moving
keeping similar mail and news together through regular import/export
operations. TB! imports Agent messages with ease. :) Yes, I used the Agent
combo for sometime myself but realized that Agent failed quite
substantially on the e-mail side. It also fails quite markedly on the news
side as well with it's inability to support multiple servers without
having to run multiple instances . enter X-News. :)

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Steve Lamb]

Tuesday, January 18, 2000, 1:16:58 PM, Grant wrote:
> No, not really.

Use Outlook, it does both.  Agent does both, from what I hear.  I'd much
rather prefer to keep this specialized client specialized since it is so
damned hard to find a good specialized client in this madness to include
everything into every program possible.

Netscape does both as well, use that.

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Grant Baxter]

On Tue, 18 Jan 2000 11:49:09 -0800, you wrote:

>GB> I'm a long time user of Agent, and have to admit that this is the
>GB> first program to come along in _years_ that turned my head at all! I
>GB> really like the functionality of the Bat. However, mail is probably
>GB> only 1/4 of my needs. The other 3/4 is newsgroups. Are there any plans
>GB> to add newsgroup functionality to the Bat? Is there a timeframe? TIA
>
>Use Agent for newsgroups and The Bat! for mail.
>
>Problem solved.  ;)
>
No, not really. Anyone (like me) that has interests in things that
span both newsgroups and maillists, would like (as I do) to be able to
file pertinent info from both newsgroups _and_ maillists into the same
folder. For example, I build robots. There are some enlightening
messages in both the robotics newsgroup, and the BasicX maillist
pertaining to sonar detection. I would like to file both sets of
messages into the "Sonar Solutions" folder.

grant

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Tom Plunket]

GB> I'm a long time user of Agent, and have to admit that this is the
GB> first program to come along in _years_ that turned my head at all! I
GB> really like the functionality of the Bat. However, mail is probably
GB> only 1/4 of my needs. The other 3/4 is newsgroups. Are there any plans
GB> to add newsgroup functionality to the Bat? Is there a timeframe? TIA

Use Agent for newsgroups and The Bat! for mail.

Problem solved.  ;)

-tom!

--
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The Bat! user since January 15
Hopin' this said *something* useful, [EMAIL PROTECTED] out.

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Steve Lamb]

Tuesday, January 18, 2000, 5:10:22 AM, Grant wrote:
> I'm a long time user of Agent, and have to admit that this is the
> first program to come along in _years_ that turned my head at all! I
> really like the functionality of the Bat. However, mail is probably
> only 1/4 of my needs. The other 3/4 is newsgroups. Are there any plans
> to add newsgroup functionality to the Bat? Is there a timeframe? TIA

Unfortunately yes.  Now go away.  *grumble*

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Re: Newsreading with Bat?

[Jast]

Morning Grant Baxter,

> I'm a long time user of Agent, and have to admit that this is the
> first program to come along in _years_ that turned my head at all! I
> really like the functionality of the Bat. However, mail is probably
> only 1/4 of my needs. The other 3/4 is newsgroups. Are there any plans
> to add newsgroup functionality to the Bat? Is there a timeframe? TIA

 Although  The Bat is a mailer and many users here prefer it to stay with just
 that  (what  it  is  good  at)  RIT  recently stated that version 2 of TB may
 contain a newsreader anyway, probably (hopefully) as plugin.


-- 
+--Jast
|on Windows 98 4.10 Build  A 
:with The Bat! 1.38e



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Newsreading with Bat?

[Grant Baxter]

I'm a long time user of Agent, and have to admit that this is the
first program to come along in _years_ that turned my head at all! I
really like the functionality of the Bat. However, mail is probably
only 1/4 of my needs. The other 3/4 is newsgroups. Are there any plans
to add newsgroup functionality to the Bat? Is there a timeframe? TIA

grant


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