Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[Tom Miller]

Maybe I have a problem unit but I measured the supply to the antenna at 3.7 
volts. I have a 5 volt antenna and it still receives sats at the lower 
voltage. Anyone else check this supply?  I wonder if it is a settable 
parameter?


Regards,
Tom

- Original Message - 
From: 
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" 


Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2017 6:39 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware


Cool. Should be interesting to see what you find. I've been hacking at the 
VxWorks side of things, off an on,
but have been distracted by this #wannacry business among other things. 
That TL866 is certainly a good value,

and it seems to work well.

Looking forward to hearing what you turn up. I'll keep poking at VxWorks 
in the mean time.


On 05/17/2017 08:46 PM, Mark Sims wrote:

I got in a TL866A programmer with the complete adapter set,   pulled the 
flash chip from my dead TruePosition, and dumped the chip.   Success 
first time!   Now to go through the ROM dump and see what hidden goodies 
there are.


A quick look seems to show commands for setting  Kalman filter parameters 
and antenna (?) attenuation. Also a GAIN command (maybe EFC gain or 
antenna gain).  There seems to lots of debug modes in it.


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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[ziggy9+time-nuts]

Cool. Should be interesting to see what you find. I've been hacking at the 
VxWorks side of things, off an on,
but have been distracted by this #wannacry business among other things. That 
TL866 is certainly a good value,
and it seems to work well. 

Looking forward to hearing what you turn up. I'll keep poking at VxWorks in the 
mean time.

On 05/17/2017 08:46 PM, Mark Sims wrote:

> I got in a TL866A programmer with the complete adapter set,   pulled the 
> flash chip from my dead TruePosition, and dumped the chip.   Success first 
> time!   Now to go through the ROM dump and see what hidden goodies there are. 
>
> A quick look seems to show commands for setting  Kalman filter parameters and 
> antenna (?) attenuation. Also a GAIN command (maybe EFC gain or antenna 
> gain).  There seems to lots of debug modes in it.
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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[Mark Sims]

I got in a TL866A programmer with the complete adapter set,   pulled the flash 
chip from my dead TruePosition, and dumped the chip.   Success first time!   
Now to go through the ROM dump and see what hidden goodies there are. 

A quick look seems to show commands for setting  Kalman filter parameters and 
antenna (?) attenuation. Also a GAIN command (maybe EFC gain or antenna gain).  
There seems to lots of debug modes in it.
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[Tom Miller]

Has anyone figured out what the two small push buttons do?


- Original Message - 
From: "Ben Hall" 

To: 
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2017 7:30 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware



On 5/8/2017 4:45 PM, Mark Sims wrote:
Anyway, Heather is now doing a pretty good job of working with it. Oh, 
and the seller jacked up the price by $10.


Received one bare board and one LMU today.  The bare board is up and 
running as I type, happily doing a survey.  About 200 ma draw at 14.5 VDC. 
She was reporting a position somewhere in New Jersey when I first powered 
it up.


I'll bet the seller saw a sudden increase in demand and decided to raise 
the price.  Yes - the whole LMU is now cheaper by a few bucks including 
shipping, at least to my house here.


I don't have it on Lady Heather yet but plan to do that soon.  Is the 
version hosted here <http://www.ke5fx.com/heather/readme.htm> have the 
TruePosition code in it?


thanks much,
ben







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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Mark Sims]

Some of the pins could be the Furuno GPS receiver data stream and not the GPSDO 
data stream.
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[ziggy9+time-nuts]

Actually, I speculated that 3 and 4 were an additional serial port but I have 
not observed any data on those pins and I haven’t tried sending data at them. 
They do not follow J2P3 (rxd). It is J1 pins 7 and 8 that BOTH mirror the data 
on the J2 pin 2 (txd). Whether they (J1 7 and 8) are tied together or are 
separate paths I don’t know. But you can overlay the scope traces and watch 
them all toggle together. They are 3.3v though, so if you go the Arduino route 
make sure you use the proper flavor - we don’t know if any of this IO is 5v 
tolerant.

Paul

> On May 9, 2017, at 6:00 PM, Ben Hall  wrote:
> 
> On 5/6/2017 8:13 PM, ziggy9+time-n...@pumpkinbrook.com wrote:
>> A few notes on the GPSDO module:
>> - the 5 pin header near U19, the LM74 temp sensor:
>> - pin 5 or the third pin in the row closest to U19 is the 12v input 
>> (measured). the other 4 are all ground.
>> - the 15 pin header:
>> - pins 1,2,5,6,9,10,13,14 are all ground
>> - pins 3 and 4 are 3.3v ttl level, I’m guessing another serial port
>> - pins 7 and 8 are 3.3v ttl level, and contain the same data as J2 pin 2
>> - pins 11,12 are 1 pps, 10ms, 5v
> 
> Hi Paul and list,
> 
> When you say "pins 3 and 4 are 3.3v ttl level, and contain the same data as 
> J2 pin 2" does that mean that pins 7 and 8 on on the 15 pin header are the 
> RX/TX pair TTL side of the SIPEX TTL-to-RS232 chip?
> +
> One of the things I was hoping for was to find TTL access to the serial port 
> so I don't have to go Arduino TTL to RS232 off-board and then go back from 
> RS232 with the Sipex chip on the board.
> 
> Have taken a look-see on pins 3 and 4 to see if there is any serial data 
> coming in / going out of there?
> 
> thanks much,
> ben
> 
> 
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Ben Hall]

On 5/9/2017 7:03 PM, Ben Hall wrote:


My little TTL-to-serial adapter is wired RX to pin 7, ground to pin 5, 
TX to pin 3.


CORRECTION:  that should be:

My little TTL-to-USB adapter is wired RX to pin 7, ground to pin 5, TX 
to pin 3.


Sorry / thanks,
ben
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Bob kb8tq]

Hi

Often these guys use a “re-branded” driver for this or that. They then stop 
updating / supporting the driver. 
Theirs uses the same files as the “real” driver, but it is hopelessly out of 
date. You have seen the sort of issues
this can cause ….

Bob

> On May 9, 2017, at 7:02 PM, Ben Hall  wrote:
> 
> Good evening Paul and list,
> 
> So I've been working on the LMU300 tonight.
> 
> On 5/6/2017 8:13 PM, ziggy9+time-n...@pumpkinbrook.com wrote:
>> A couple of observations on the LMU300:
>> - the console port is the AEP port, a 6 pin RJ-11 - and you need a 6 pin 
>> connector
>> - the USB port is non-functional
> 
> I decided to verify that the USB was non-functional...just in case your unit 
> had an issue.  Wow I wish I had not!  Win7 started to install a driver, 
> failed to install, then got BSOD.  Reboot...and immediate BSOD. After about 
> an hour of troubleshooting I determined that somehow, and I don't know how 
> this could happen, it corrupted the driver of my Prolific USB-to-Serial 
> converter...as I determined that BSOD only happened when it was plugged in.  
> Had to flush out the driver and reload...and now all is well again.
> 
> My LMU300's GPS never gets past the boot screen...but somehow...the GPS light 
> goes green?  That GPS light must not really be looking at the GPS...or its 
> more akin to a "GPS board seems present" versus "GPS is working, seeing 
> satellites, etc..."
> 
>> - pin 5 or the third pin in the row closest to U19 is the 12v input 
>> (measured). the other 4 are all ground.
> 
> Mine is 12VDC as well - right on the money too.  I thought 15 VDC was odd - 
> the unit has 12VDC fans...why not have one 12 VDC supply and run both the 
> fans and GPS unit from it?
> 
>> - the 15 pin header:
>> - pins 7 and 8 are 3.3v ttl level, and contain the same data as J2 pin 2
> 
> Does this mean that pins 7 and 8 are a TTL serial RX/TX pair that function 
> the same as J2...but without going thru the Sipex TTL-to-RS232 converter?  
> That would be a score for those of us who want to use these things with 
> Arduinos.
> 
> If I get up the courage after my BSOD fun...I may have to try it.
> 
> Time to find that disposable laptop I've got somewhere around here... The 
> LMU300 can BSOD that thing all it wants!  ;)
> 
> thanks much,
> ben
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Ben Hall]

Evening all,

Got brave and decided to experiment...and answered my own question below...

On 5/9/2017 6:02 PM, Ben Hall wrote:
Does this mean that pins 7 and 8 are a TTL serial RX/TX pair that 
function the same as J2...but without going thru the Sipex TTL-to-RS232 
converter?  That would be a score for those of us who want to use these 
things with Arduinos.


And the answer is sort of.

What I didn't understand in the original message is that "pins 7 and 8 
are 3.3V TTL level" meant that pins 7 and 8 are connected together.


So...

Pin 7 and 8 are connected together...and are TTL serial out.
Pin 3 and 4 are connected together...and are TTL serial in.

My little TTL-to-serial adapter is wired RX to pin 7, ground to pin 5, 
TX to pin 3.


There is a catch!  If you've got the jumper on J2 from using a real 
RS-232 port...the TTL serial input won't accept commands.  You've got to 
remove the jumper.


This makes me happy - those of us who want to use Arduinos now don't 
need to mess with going TTL to RS232 serial...can go direct TTL to TTL.


thanks much,
ben
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Ben Hall]

Good evening Paul and list,

So I've been working on the LMU300 tonight.

On 5/6/2017 8:13 PM, ziggy9+time-n...@pumpkinbrook.com wrote:

A couple of observations on the LMU300:
- the console port is the AEP port, a 6 pin RJ-11 - and you need a 6 pin 
connector
- the USB port is non-functional


I decided to verify that the USB was non-functional...just in case your 
unit had an issue.  Wow I wish I had not!  Win7 started to install a 
driver, failed to install, then got BSOD.  Reboot...and immediate BSOD. 
After about an hour of troubleshooting I determined that somehow, and I 
don't know how this could happen, it corrupted the driver of my Prolific 
USB-to-Serial converter...as I determined that BSOD only happened when 
it was plugged in.  Had to flush out the driver and reload...and now all 
is well again.


My LMU300's GPS never gets past the boot screen...but somehow...the GPS 
light goes green?  That GPS light must not really be looking at the 
GPS...or its more akin to a "GPS board seems present" versus "GPS is 
working, seeing satellites, etc..."



 - pin 5 or the third pin in the row closest to U19 is the 12v input 
(measured). the other 4 are all ground.


Mine is 12VDC as well - right on the money too.  I thought 15 VDC was 
odd - the unit has 12VDC fans...why not have one 12 VDC supply and run 
both the fans and GPS unit from it?



- the 15 pin header:
 - pins 7 and 8 are 3.3v ttl level, and contain the same data as J2 pin 2


Does this mean that pins 7 and 8 are a TTL serial RX/TX pair that 
function the same as J2...but without going thru the Sipex TTL-to-RS232 
converter?  That would be a score for those of us who want to use these 
things with Arduinos.


If I get up the courage after my BSOD fun...I may have to try it.

Time to find that disposable laptop I've got somewhere around here... 
The LMU300 can BSOD that thing all it wants!  ;)


thanks much,
ben
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Ben Hall]

Good evening all,

Apologies for the rash of posts coming from me this evening.

I did hear back from Gary WA2OMY, one of the PackRat guys.  He sent me 
the hex files for both versions of the PackRat.  If y'all sent him and 
e-mail and he didn't get back with you, holler at me and I'll e-mail 
them off-list.


thanks,
ben
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Ben Hall]

On 5/6/2017 8:13 PM, ziggy9+time-n...@pumpkinbrook.com wrote:

A few notes on the GPSDO module:
- the 5 pin header near U19, the LM74 temp sensor:
 - pin 5 or the third pin in the row closest to U19 is the 12v input 
(measured). the other 4 are all ground.

- the 15 pin header:
 - pins 1,2,5,6,9,10,13,14 are all ground
 - pins 3 and 4 are 3.3v ttl level, I’m guessing another serial port
 - pins 7 and 8 are 3.3v ttl level, and contain the same data as J2 pin 2
 - pins 11,12 are 1 pps, 10ms, 5v


Hi Paul and list,

When you say "pins 3 and 4 are 3.3v ttl level, and contain the same data 
as J2 pin 2" does that mean that pins 7 and 8 on on the 15 pin header 
are the RX/TX pair TTL side of the SIPEX TTL-to-RS232 chip?

+
One of the things I was hoping for was to find TTL access to the serial 
port so I don't have to go Arduino TTL to RS232 off-board and then go 
back from RS232 with the Sipex chip on the board.


Have taken a look-see on pins 3 and 4 to see if there is any serial data 
coming in / going out of there?


thanks much,
ben


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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Ben Hall]

On 5/9/2017 9:41 AM, Tim Lister wrote:

cables using LMR-100A cable for the two right angle connectors J9 and
J10 which both seem to be fed from what looks like a SMD transformer
with a LT1761 regulator on the other side of the board. Is this a 1PPS
output - there seems to be a testpoint (TP93) nearby which could help
diagnose it.


Hi Tim and list,

I put the scope on mine last night - J9 and J10 are both 10 MHz outputs 
and J8 is 1 PPS.



Does anyone know of a source for
cables for the J2/serial output or is it OK to use mini-grabbers/0.1"
plugs to a RS232 breakout ?


I built my own - had a leftover serial cable from, ironically enough, an 
old GPS unit with a DB9 on it and bare wires on the other.  I installed 
some 2.54mm crimp connectors onto the bare wires and just plugged it in.


It is full-on RS-232 with real RS-232 signal levels, so don't 
accidentally hook it up to TTL-level serial.  I almost did that the 
other day in my excitement to get it up and working.


Personally, I wouldn't use the mini-grabbers...but that's just me...

thanks,
ben

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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Tim Lister]

My TruePosition GPS board arrived yesterday, it seems to be identical
to the ones Bob has received down to the same manufacturer of the
antistatic sticker over the bag. Given that I had N, BNC and SMA
cables already I had hoped I might be in good shape but apparently not
so I've had to order 3 new and different cables for the SMB antenna,
MCX and MMCX connectors along the edge. My board came with two 4" MMCX
cables using LMR-100A cable for the two right angle connectors J9 and
J10 which both seem to be fed from what looks like a SMD transformer
with a LT1761 regulator on the other side of the board. Is this a 1PPS
output - there seems to be a testpoint (TP93) nearby which could help
diagnose it.

Hopefully once the new cables arrive on Saturday I will be in a
position to help out on the Linux side and compile any beta versions
of new code if that is helpful. Does anyone know of a source for
cables for the J2/serial output or is it OK to use mini-grabbers/0.1"
plugs to a RS232 breakout ?

Tim
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[J. L. Trantham]

Mark,

I did not find a datasheet specific for your number but I did find a data sheet 
for the S29JL032H90TFI210, if that might be what you have.  If so, I probably 
have a programmer and socket adapter that can read and program it.  I'll see if 
I can find it this week.

Happy to help if I can.

Joe

-Original Message-
From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Mark Sims
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2017 4:46 PM
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

I cleaned up the chip without removing any of the markings.  It looks like it 
is a Spansion S29JL032H90TFI21.  Hopefully somebody has a reader that can 
handle it.

Looking at the documentation for the LMU unit that these came out of didn't 
reveal anything new.  There is no mention of an antenna elevation mask or 
signal level mask setting...  it's hard to imagine as GPSDO with those 
(particularly the elevation mask).

Anyway, Heather is now doing a pretty good job of working with it.  It would be 
nice to be able to squeeze some more features out of them...

Oh,  and the seller jacked up the price by $10.   I think you can get the 
complete LMU (shipped) for close to that from one of the sellers.

---

> The two digits before the ? are very important. They describe the 
> memory
format. You may want to put it under your microscope.
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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[Mark Sims]

No, the TruePosition and Zyfer Nanosync (and TAPR TICC and HP-5071A) support is 
in the next release.  If you can compile the Linux or Windows code, I can send 
you the latest source code.

Also,  the LMU has been measured to run the board at 12V, not 15V.   I know 
that 23V will kill it...

-

> I don't have it on Lady Heather yet but plan to do that soon.  Is the version 
> hosted here ...
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[Bryan _]

Hi Mark:


My TL866A programmer will read it, or it says it will. Unfortunately I don't 
have the TS0P48 adapter. You are welcome to borrow it, perhaps a adapter can be 
made up. They are commonly available on Ebay.


http://www.ebay.ca/itm/New-V3-TSOP32-TSOP40-SOP44-TSOP48-Adapter-for-TL866A-TL866CS-Programmer-6pcs-lot-/122478573676?hash=item1c844ab86c:g:hYwAAOSwtZJY-CTP





[cid:bdd0f56e-77c5-4d42-b15d-8a567ae837e1]


-=Bryan=-



From: time-nuts  on behalf of Mark Sims 

Sent: May 8, 2017 2:45 PM
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

I cleaned up the chip without removing any of the markings.  It looks like it 
is a Spansion S29JL032H90TFI21.  Hopefully somebody has a reader that can 
handle it.

Looking at the documentation for the LMU unit that these came out of didn't 
reveal anything new.  There is no mention of an antenna elevation mask or 
signal level mask setting...  it's hard to imagine as GPSDO with those 
(particularly the elevation mask).

Anyway, Heather is now doing a pretty good job of working with it.  It would be 
nice to be able to squeeze some more features out of them...

Oh,  and the seller jacked up the price by $10.   I think you can get the 
complete LMU (shipped) for close to that from one of the sellers.

---

> The two digits before the ? are very important. They describe the memory
format. You may want to put it under your microscope.
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[Ben Hall]

On 5/8/2017 4:45 PM, Mark Sims wrote:
Anyway, Heather is now doing a pretty good job of working with it. 
Oh,  and the seller jacked up the price by $10.


Received one bare board and one LMU today.  The bare board is up and 
running as I type, happily doing a survey.  About 200 ma draw at 14.5 
VDC.  She was reporting a position somewhere in New Jersey when I first 
powered it up.


I'll bet the seller saw a sudden increase in demand and decided to raise 
the price.  Yes - the whole LMU is now cheaper by a few bucks including 
shipping, at least to my house here.


I don't have it on Lady Heather yet but plan to do that soon.  Is the 
version hosted here  have the 
TruePosition code in it?


thanks much,
ben







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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[Mark Sims]

I cleaned up the chip without removing any of the markings.  It looks like it 
is a Spansion S29JL032H90TFI21.  Hopefully somebody has a reader that can 
handle it.

Looking at the documentation for the LMU unit that these came out of didn't 
reveal anything new.  There is no mention of an antenna elevation mask or 
signal level mask setting...  it's hard to imagine as GPSDO with those 
(particularly the elevation mask).

Anyway, Heather is now doing a pretty good job of working with it.  It would be 
nice to be able to squeeze some more features out of them...

Oh,  and the seller jacked up the price by $10.   I think you can get the 
complete LMU (shipped) for close to that from one of the sellers.

---

> The two digits before the ? are very important. They describe the memory 
format. You may want to put it under your microscope.
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[Tom Miller]

- Original Message - 
From: "Mark Sims" 

To: 
Sent: Sunday, May 07, 2017 3:03 AM
Subject: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware


One of my TruePosition GPSDOs fried a chip in the power supply when the 
wall wart that was powering it failed and started putting out 23V. It 
apparently ran for a while at that voltage before violently letting the 
magic smoke out.


If somebody can read a Spansion S29JL032H90TFI12? chip (some of the last 
digits are hard to read), I can pull it off the board and send it to you. 
Searching the dump should reveal strings that show more of what the 
command set is.  I believe the chip is a 48 pin TSOP.   I don't have the 
proper adapter for my Data I/O machines.

___


The two digits before the ? are very important. They describe the memory 
format. You may want to put it under your microscope.



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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver firmware

[Mark Sims]

One of my TruePosition GPSDOs fried a chip in the power supply when the wall 
wart that was powering it failed and started putting out 23V. It apparently ran 
for a while at that voltage before violently letting the magic smoke out.

If somebody can read a Spansion S29JL032H90TFI12? chip (some of the last digits 
are hard to read), I can pull it off the board and send it to you.   Searching 
the dump should reveal strings that show more of what the command set is.  I 
believe the chip is a 48 pin TSOP.   I don't have the proper adapter for my 
Data I/O machines.
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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Mark Sims]

I'm using the Packrat info to work out how it works.  The newer board firmware 
seems to support everything the older one does.  

Not sure if the older one has the $EXTSTATUS command that reports the 
temperature.  The newer board has a temperature sensor resolution of 0.032 
degrees.  Any real GPSDO has a temperature sensor.  It might not make that data 
available to the outside world, but all of them that I have seen so far do.

These boards (and the Oscilloquartz Star-4, and especially the Zyfer Nanosync)  
seem to emphasize the GPSDO learning and holdover behavior.   The Zyfer has 
around 6 messages that report holdover related data and performance (several of 
them undocumented, but from the data and message name it is easy to guess what 
it is).

I have an old model of the TruePosition board coming from China... should know 
more in a few weeks.

I really hope we can score some documentation on these because they seem to be 
well thought out and probably have lots of nifty stuff you can control.

---

> Since the boards (and firmware) are very different, I would be careful about 
> taking all
that is said in the previous write ups as valid. Pretty much everything needs 
to be checked. 
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[ziggy9+time-nuts]

I picked up two of the parent units (the LMU300 19” rack mount chassis) and 
have also managed to find a copy of the installation document manual (for 
deployment and installation of the hardware, and system turn up procedures).  
It is of limited use since there is very little you can do with the GPS(DO) 
module besides setting the location and checking satellites. But if you have 
the chassis and want to play with it contact me off list.

A couple of observations on the LMU300:
- the console port is the AEP port, a 6 pin RJ-11 - and you need a 6 pin 
connector
- the USB port is non-functional
- pin 1 (furthest left looking into the jack) is ground, pin 1 (furthest right) 
is LMU300 txd, pin 3 is LMU300 rxd 
- 115200,N,8,1 speed and format
- the unit *will not boot completely* on it’s own due to missing T1/E1 
signaling from the SMLC
- the unit *will not boot completely* without GPS initialization
- both of the above conditions can be bypassed :)
- in spite of the above, both of my units are still unhappy and eventually 
reboot with watchdog timeouts or other errors

A few notes on the GPSDO module:
- the 5 pin header near U19, the LM74 temp sensor:
- pin 5 or the third pin in the row closest to U19 is the 12v input 
(measured). the other 4 are all ground.

- the 15 pin header:
- pins 1,2,5,6,9,10,13,14 are all ground
- pins 3 and 4 are 3.3v ttl level, I’m guessing another serial port
- pins 7 and 8 are 3.3v ttl level, and contain the same data as J2 pin 2
- pins 11,12 are 1 pps, 10ms, 5v

- the 6 pin header, J2:
- pin 1,4 are ground
- pin 2 is output from the module, pin 3 is input?
- pin 5 may be hardware handshake (like CTS/DSR/DCD)
- pin 6 looks like the Furuno data - lots of $PFEC strings

- the unused MCX connector is 1pps, 10ms, 5v buffered by 74AC74

- software wise, what I see so far is similar to the Packrat info. $CLOCK, 
$STATUS messages etc. I did note an $EXTSTATUS message, but that’s the only new 
thing so far. If i discover anything useful/interesting I’ll send an update.

The GPS engine is a Furuno GT-8031, not sure why it hasn’t been findable but 
the manual is on KO4BB’s site:
>

The OCXO on my unit is a CTS 196 series. It’s advertised as ‘low phase noise’. 
Datasheeet here:
>

Again, contact me off list and I’ll send the LMU300 doc or a pointer to it.

Paul - K9MR


> On May 5, 2017, at 11:30 PM, Mark Sims  wrote:
> 
> I got in my Trueposition GPSDO's today and have one running.   These units 
> are a little bit different than the Packrat documentation.  There is no 
> second serial connector.   The first three pins on the 6 pin connector are 
> RS-232 at 9600,8,N,1   You need to jumper pins 4 and 5 to talk to the board.
> 
> The power connector is different.  It is a 5 pin connector on the back of the 
> board.  4 pins are ground and VCC is the other pin.   Check with an ohm meter 
> to make sure you connect up properly...  the GND/GND/15V in the Packrat doc 
> is backwards!   Mine is running just fine on +12V... YMMV.
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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Mark Sims]

It's getting a few more capabilities.   I have worked out how to set the cable 
delay value,  set a position hold location, start/stop a self survey, and 
(probably) save the settings in flash memory.
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Bob kb8tq]

Hi

Digging a bit more into this and that:

The board in this writeup:

http://www.qsl.net/wa2omy/A%20Packrat%20GPS%20Receiver%20Project.pdf 


Has 2005 firmware in it (6 years before our boards). It was built at the end of 
2006 (again about 
6 years earlier). The connectors on the board are nothing like the connectors 
on the 
boards I have. No idea when the earlier board was designed, the area that shows 
that data 
on the later board is blank on the earlier board. 

It is the same board as shown here in the PackRat stuff:

http://www.packratvhf.com/A%20Packrat%20GPS%20Receiver%20Project.pdf 


Since the boards (and firmware) are very different, I would be careful about 
taking all
that is said in the previous write ups as valid. Pretty much everything needs 
to be checked. 
Both the FPGA and the MCU went through major changes between the two boards. 
The 
temperature sensor is very different on the newer design (if it’s even there on 
the old one ..).
They certainly share a common heritage. There are some major differences ( 
three coax
outputs vs 2 …missing connectors …..).

Bob



> On May 6, 2017, at 11:29 AM, Ben Hall  wrote:
> 
> Hi Bob, Mark, and list,
> 
> Thanks for the messages on these units - especially the differences between 
> the PackRat instructions and these boards.  I should have one of the "bare 
> board" units and one of the LMU300 TruePosition rack mount units here on 
> Monday as long as nothing happens in transit.
> 
> I've still had no luck contacting the authors of the PackRat presentation, 
> even after finding a new address for the one that bounced.  I'm hopeful that 
> they are just busy during the week and we may see a reply now that it is the 
> weekend.
> 
> Anyone had time to hook up a serial interface?  I'm curious if you issues 
> something like a "help" command...will the unit tell you what its command set 
> might be?  That would be nice.  I've had ZERO luck finding any information 
> either on the TruePosition unit or the Furuno GPS used.
> 
> thanks much and 73,
> ben, kd5byb
> 
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Ben Hall]

Hi Bob, Mark, and list,

Thanks for the messages on these units - especially the differences 
between the PackRat instructions and these boards.  I should have one of 
the "bare board" units and one of the LMU300 TruePosition rack mount 
units here on Monday as long as nothing happens in transit.


I've still had no luck contacting the authors of the PackRat 
presentation, even after finding a new address for the one that bounced. 
 I'm hopeful that they are just busy during the week and we may see a 
reply now that it is the weekend.


Anyone had time to hook up a serial interface?  I'm curious if you 
issues something like a "help" command...will the unit tell you what its 
command set might be?  That would be nice.  I've had ZERO luck finding 
any information either on the TruePosition unit or the Furuno GPS used.


thanks much and 73,
ben, kd5byb

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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Bob kb8tq]

Hi

The batch I just got in yesterday have a six pin connector on top labeled J2 
and a 
15 pin connector on the back labeled J1. There is no pin at location 14 on J1. 
There
is an unpopulated location for a 10 pin J7 (looks like JTAG). There is also a 
set of
holes in another 10 pin array labeled with “TPxx” numbers on them. There is a 
six
pin connector labeled J4 on the back side by some switching regulators. Pin 6 
is 
missing on this one to key it. 

There are four coax connectors on the board. J6 is the antenna connector. J9 
and 
J10 came with coax cables plugged into them. J8 is just sitting there. 

The copyright on the board is 2010. The Spansion flash(?) chip has a sticker 
that
reads 11-1402A2 U10. There is a second chip with a sticker that reads 11-1401A5
U25. All but one of the OCXO’s on mine are CTS 1960017’s. They have date codes 
from mid 2010 through 2011. I have one with a Bliley NVG47A1282, it is unclear
how they do date codes. That one might be from 2012. All of them have Furuno
GT-8031G’s on them. 

Condition wise, they all look ok. The through hole parts were put on by hand. 
They
*could* have done a better job of cleaning up after they did that process. Some 
of 
the slider joints look a bit oxidized as a result of the “no clean” process. 
SMT stuff
all looks fine to my tired old eyes. 

All of the anti-static bags have the same seal sticker on them. It has “Made in 
Madras,
Oregon, USA The De Leone Corp ASC #274” (= sticker manufacturer). The bags 
themselves are US made by Desco.  They could be original or just what my eBay 
seller
used to pack and ship. 

No idea what any of that means. Good news is that they all appear to have the 
same 2011 firmware in them. It is not at all clear where they have been for the 
last 
five or six years. They might be equipment pulls. Based on the nice bags and 
cables,
I’d bet they sat in a stock room while some obscure company went out of 
business ….

Bob


> On May 5, 2017, at 11:30 PM, Mark Sims  wrote:
> 
> I got in my Trueposition GPSDO's today and have one running.   These units 
> are a little bit different than the Packrat documentation.  There is no 
> second serial connector.   The first three pins on the 6 pin connector are 
> RS-232 at 9600,8,N,1   You need to jumper pins 4 and 5 to talk to the board.
> 
> The power connector is different.  It is a 5 pin connector on the back of the 
> board.  4 pins are ground and VCC is the other pin.   Check with an ohm meter 
> to make sure you connect up properly...  the GND/GND/15V in the Packrat doc 
> is backwards!   Mine is running just fine on +12V... YMMV.
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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Mark Sims]

I got in my Trueposition GPSDO's today and have one running.   These units are 
a little bit different than the Packrat documentation.  There is no second 
serial connector.   The first three pins on the 6 pin connector are RS-232 at 
9600,8,N,1   You need to jumper pins 4 and 5 to talk to the board.

The power connector is different.  It is a 5 pin connector on the back of the 
board.  4 pins are ground and VCC is the other pin.   Check with an ohm meter 
to make sure you connect up properly...  the GND/GND/15V in the Packrat doc is 
backwards!   Mine is running just fine on +12V... YMMV.
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Gregory Beat]

I have had some luck sending inquiries to Furuno USA (who sent query to East 
Asia).
http://www.furunousa.com/Support/Default.aspx

Last time I sent a query,
It was for a Furano GPS receiver used in an integrated timing receiver/outdoor 
antenna.
Received original Japanese spec sheet with some broken English translations.
Fortunately, schematic was included.

greg
w9gb
 
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Ben Hall]

On 5/3/2017 8:59 PM, Mark Sims wrote:

I also sent email to all the people in the Packrat slides.   One
email bounced and I have not heard back from the other 2.


Same here.  I searched around and found another e-mail for Bruce, so 
just got done trying that e-mail out.  So far...no bounces...



So far, I have had no luck finding any info on these devices.


Me neither.  I started trying to find if there was a programming 
reference for the Furuno GPS board it uses...and also failed there too.  :(


Oh well...

thanks much,
ben
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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Mark Sims]

I also sent email to all the people in the Packrat slides.   One email bounced 
and I have not heard back from the other 2.

So far, I have had no luck finding any info on these devices.

--

> I've got an e-mail into the authors of the Packrat GPS Receiver Project 
> slides 
asking about getting my hands on the Arduino code and asking if they 
happened to have a copy of the full programming reference. 
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Ben Hall]

On 5/1/2017 4:35 PM, Gregory Beat wrote:

Interesting surplus GPS receiver / 10 MHz item on eBay 


Lots of parts :-)  


Hi Gregory,

Thanks for the links!  I've got one of each on the way to me.  I've got 
an e-mail into the authors of the Packrat GPS Receiver Project slides 
asking about getting my hands on the Arduino code and asking if they 
happened to have a copy of the full programming reference.  :)


I'll share what I learn with the group.  :)

thanks much and 73,
ben, kd5byb


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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Mark Sims]

Does anybody have any programming information for these devices (beyond what is 
ion the packrat web site)? I have a couple of versions of it on order and would 
like to add support to Lady Heather.

I have added support for the Zyfer Nanosync 380...  mine should arrive in a 
couple of days for testing.
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Re: [time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Bob kb8tq]

Hi

The Furuno receiver on the board is an older model. It’s similar to the M12’s. 
Not quite as 
sensitive as the “modern” stuff, but still very usable. Tough to beat the price 
… hint: the guy
takes offers … hint hint 

Bob

> On May 1, 2017, at 5:35 PM, Gregory Beat  wrote:
> 
> Interesting surplus GPS receiver / 10 MHz item on eBay
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/GPS-Receiver-board-from-TruePosition-GPS-locator/152340314423?
> TruePosition GPS Receiver/10 MHz oscillator, auction number: 152340314423
> 
> Supposedly, this receiver is extracted from Time Position LMU300 model 101333.
> Rack unit used at cellular sites, the LMU Universal system assisted to 
> determine mobile phone location: emergency, 911 systems, etc.
> Lots of parts :-)
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/TruePosition-LMU300-GPS-Navigation-model-101333-/162267042516?hash=item25c7de92d4:g:wEgAAOSwAvJW~UIi
> 
> The Mt. Airy VHF Radio Club ("Pack Rats"), Southampton, PA
> has a technical article 
> http://www.packratvhf.com/techinal.htm
> for adapting a related True Position receiver 
> by Gary, WA2OMY and Bruce, WA3YUE
> http://www.qsl.net/wa2omy/A%20Packrat%20GPS%20Receiver%20Project.pdf
> 
> The Mt. Airy group used an Arduino and other common parts for interfacing.
> 
> greg
> w9gb
> 
> Sent from iPad Air
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[time-nuts] TruePosition GPS Receiver

[Gregory Beat]

Interesting surplus GPS receiver / 10 MHz item on eBay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/GPS-Receiver-board-from-TruePosition-GPS-locator/152340314423?
TruePosition GPS Receiver/10 MHz oscillator, auction number: 152340314423

Supposedly, this receiver is extracted from Time Position LMU300 model 101333.
Rack unit used at cellular sites, the LMU Universal system assisted to 
determine mobile phone location: emergency, 911 systems, etc.
Lots of parts :-)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/TruePosition-LMU300-GPS-Navigation-model-101333-/162267042516?hash=item25c7de92d4:g:wEgAAOSwAvJW~UIi

The Mt. Airy VHF Radio Club ("Pack Rats"), Southampton, PA
has a technical article 
http://www.packratvhf.com/techinal.htm
for adapting a related True Position receiver 
by Gary, WA2OMY and Bruce, WA3YUE
http://www.qsl.net/wa2omy/A%20Packrat%20GPS%20Receiver%20Project.pdf

The Mt. Airy group used an Arduino and other common parts for interfacing.

greg
w9gb

Sent from iPad Air
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