Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[alan c]

Paul Roach wrote:
>> The moral I take from this is - the more Ubuntu is used, anywhere, the
>> closer we get to the tipping point.
>>
>> I have introduced three friends in recent months to  Linux Emporium,
>> because they wanted an Ubuntu only Laptop from a retail friendly
>> source. Three  purchases.  LE is giving an impressive service, I can
>> recommend them.
>>
> 
> I'd second that Alan - I found a desktop via the LE for a friend, and the
> service was first class and the product was excellent - very good for people
> who want to use an alternative OS, but don't want the usual argument with
> suppliers about refunding OS fees and invalidating warranty due to changing
> the OS...
> 
> I've personally found that the less pre-requisite Windows experience people
> have had, the easier they adapt to Linux - people who have to forget the
> previous knowledge to learn anew have a harder time than those who are just
> learning something... this has been true for friends and elderly relatives
> alike

Yes. The most recent purchase from LE - an elderly lady who has been
aware of Ubuntu for at least a year, but has not really run it at all,
intends to continue using windows and even OE for a short time while
she gets a bit more used to Ubuntu.

I had to do some encouraging and persuading to get her to phone me
with the initial few questions - One Q was how do I turn the laptop
volume up more, it is too low? LE could have answered this I am sure
no problem, but contact with them is better left  for more significant
matters if possible -  the Volume Control window (mixer) with its
several sliders is not obvious to a long time Windows user. Another Q
was how to install AVG  (!) and Flash? - easy to explain all taken
care of and why.

Incidentally, this friend has poor eyesight, and LE also installed
vinux (formerly named vibuntu) as dual boot, free of charge.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!

[Simon Osborne]

2009/10/27 Rob Beard :
> Sean Miller wrote:
>> Why do none of these programmes ever mention Wine?
>>
>> It's simply not true that you can't run Microsoft programs on Ubuntu
>> -- is the BBC sponsored by Apple and Microsoft or what???
>>
>> Sean
>>
>>
> Well wine isn't perfect.  A fair few applications don't work very well
> or not at all, so it's not really a perfect solution.  Dual booting with
> Windows or running Windows in a virtual machine would probably be the
> better solution.
>
> But on the other hand, I guess it is worth mentioning that iTunes works
> on CrossOver (although not owning an iPod, I haven't a clue which
> version works and if it's compatible with the latest iPods and iPhones).
>
> Rob

Only version 7 though, which actually runs on vanilla Wine 1.2 also.

Simon

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Paul Roach]

> The moral I take from this is - the more Ubuntu is used, anywhere, the
> closer we get to the tipping point.
>
> I have introduced three friends in recent months to  Linux Emporium,
> because they wanted an Ubuntu only Laptop from a retail friendly
> source. Three  purchases.  LE is giving an impressive service, I can
> recommend them.
>

I'd second that Alan - I found a desktop via the LE for a friend, and the
service was first class and the product was excellent - very good for people
who want to use an alternative OS, but don't want the usual argument with
suppliers about refunding OS fees and invalidating warranty due to changing
the OS...

I've personally found that the less pre-requisite Windows experience people
have had, the easier they adapt to Linux - people who have to forget the
previous knowledge to learn anew have a harder time than those who are just
learning something... this has been true for friends and elderly relatives
alike
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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[alan c]

Alan Lord (News) wrote:
> On 27/10/09 08:13, Daniel Drummond wrote:
> 
>> If that guy was from Canonical, perhaps they should think about retraining:-
>>
>> /"For the first time in 20 years you can buy Ubuntu pre-installed from
>> more than one manufacturer," he said. "That's an extraordinary story."
>>
>> /A stupid statement considering Ubuntu hasn't been around for 20 years.
> 
> Nit picking is not really helpful. GNU/Linux has been around for that long.
> 
>> and
>>
>> /"Some of the security is through obscurity but it's also better by
>> design," he said./
>>
>> Just doesn't make sense at all.  Surely as it is an open-source system,
>> there is no obscurity.  I think he means to say that Ubuntu is a smaller
>> target for crackers than some others.
> 
> Thinking about the audience for this perhaps it could have been phrased 
> better but it is a very encouraging sign. That's the first time I've 
> *ever* seen a Linux distro get mainstream coverage in a positive rather 
> than derogatory light.
> 
> Chris does work for Canonical. He's in charge of OEM deals worldwide and 
> is quite senior in the company.

Note that a significant fact is the interview was run by BBC Radio
5-Live's Gary Parkinson, who immediately says

"I have been running Ubuntu on this netbook for over a year now"

As Ubuntu and other alternatibves to the Windows monopoly increase in
general use, there will be people like Gary Parkinson who, whatever
job they do, get to use Ubuntu regularly and find they like it. Gary
is in an influential position. His Ubuntu experiences are apparently
personal ones, not corporate.

The moral I take from this is - the more Ubuntu is used, anywhere, the
closer we get to the tipping point.

I have introduced three friends in recent months to  Linux Emporium,
because they wanted an Ubuntu only Laptop from a retail friendly
source. Three  purchases.  LE is giving an impressive service, I can
recommend them.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Dean Sas]

On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 12:57, Daniel Drummond  wrote:
> Dean Sas wrote:
>> Daniel Drummond wrote:
>>
 2009/10/27 Philip Stubbs :

> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8326264.stm?ls
>
>>
>>
>>> /"Some of the security is through obscurity but it's also better by
>>> design," he said./
>>>
>>>
>>> Just doesn't make sense at all.  Surely as it is an open-source system,
>>> there is no obscurity.  I think he means to say that Ubuntu is a smaller
>>> target for crackers than some others.
>>>
>>
>> It makes perfect sense, he said exactly what you said he meant to say.
>>
>> Obscurity doesn't just mean the "hidden" or opaqueness. It also means
>> little known.

> An unfortunate choice of phrase though, considering the negative
> connotations it has with respect to security.

Perhaps, I'm not sure that the one sentence mention of "open source
software" followed by "obscurity" four paragraphs later will make BBCs
general audience think about security and open vs closed software.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Michael Holloway]

On Tue, 2009-10-27 at 12:45 +, Gordon wrote:
> Actually not so in my experience. MS seems to have tsken a leaf out of
> Ubuntu's book. The only driver that did NOT come with Windows 7 for my 2
> y/o Toshiba Satellite was my printereverything else justworked!
> 

I will second that. Everything worked on my machine from a fresh win7
install.

But I think its worth pointing out that a Win7 installation in 2 years
time will have the same driver problems as Vista/XP now. The reason that
Linux always has "good" support for drivers is that its updated/released
so often (6 months in Ubuntu's case). If windows was released that often
it would be the same.

Of course, who would be willing to fork out £200 every six months :)
 



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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Daniel Drummond]

Dean Sas wrote:
> Daniel Drummond wrote:
>   
>>> 2009/10/27 Philip Stubbs :
>>>   
 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8326264.stm?ls
 
>
>   
>> /"Some of the security is through obscurity but it's also better by 
>> design," he said./
>>
>>
>> Just doesn't make sense at all.  Surely as it is an open-source system, 
>> there is no obscurity.  I think he means to say that Ubuntu is a smaller 
>> target for crackers than some others.
>> 
>
> It makes perfect sense, he said exactly what you said he meant to say.
>
> Obscurity doesn't just mean the "hidden" or opaqueness. It also means
> little known.
>
>
> Dean
>
>   
An unfortunate choice of phrase though, considering the negative 
connotations it has with respect to security.


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Johnathon Tinsley]

Gordon wrote:
> Thomas Ibbotson wrote:
> 
>> -Then you'll have to find those drivers for your hardware (if they 
>> exist) and install them,
> 
> Actually not so in my experience. MS seems to have tsken a leaf out of
> Ubuntu's book. The only driver that did NOT come with Windows 7 for my 2
> y/o Toshiba Satellite was my printereverything else justworked!
> 

Er.. I had it a bit worse. Couldn't get online wirelessly, but when I
linked the machine to the wired net, it downloaded drivers for my wifi
and sound card. Ubuntu is ahead in drivers out-of-the-box, shame about
my audio card not working fully in Ubuntu


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Gordon]

Thomas Ibbotson wrote:

> -Then you'll have to find those drivers for your hardware (if they 
> exist) and install them,

Actually not so in my experience. MS seems to have tsken a leaf out of
Ubuntu's book. The only driver that did NOT come with Windows 7 for my 2
y/o Toshiba Satellite was my printereverything else justworked!


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!

[Rob Beard]

Sean Miller wrote:
> Why do none of these programmes ever mention Wine?
>
> It's simply not true that you can't run Microsoft programs on Ubuntu
> -- is the BBC sponsored by Apple and Microsoft or what???
>
> Sean
>
>   
Well wine isn't perfect.  A fair few applications don't work very well 
or not at all, so it's not really a perfect solution.  Dual booting with 
Windows or running Windows in a virtual machine would probably be the 
better solution.

But on the other hand, I guess it is worth mentioning that iTunes works 
on CrossOver (although not owning an iPod, I haven't a clue which 
version works and if it's compatible with the latest iPods and iPhones).

Rob



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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Rob Beard]

Lucy wrote:
> 2009/10/27 Philip Stubbs :
>   
>> 2009/10/21 James Milligan :
>> 
>>> Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?
>>>
>>> Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
>>> Safari open on ubuntu.com
>>>
>>> Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.
>>>
>>> James
>>>   
>> I have not had time to read it yet,
>>
>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8326264.stm?ls
>> 
>
> It's good. There's a 3 minute interview with someone from Canonical.
> Would have been nicer if it'd been a little bit longer. They just
> about explained what open source was and gave a tour of the OS. It was
> also mentioned that you couldn't run Windows or Mac OS programs on it,
> but didn't mention that there are usually equivalent programs
> available (while it's a good thing to say, I don't remember such a big
> emphasis when Macs are discussed). Unfortunately, I think Ubuntu
> looked a little sad on screen compared to the latest shiney Windows
> release; I'm looking forward to an improved default theme and a revamp
> of Gnome.
>
>   
Yes, as much as I like the new themes on Ubuntu (and it briefly showed 
Compiz switching desktops) maybe they could have chosen a different 
desktop background.

They also referred to a PC as a Windows PC, and referred to Ubuntu as an 
Ubuntu Computer.  It's almost as if it would make people think they 
needed to buy a whole new computer.  I would have liked it if they had 
mentioned that it will run on a PC or modern Mac alongside your existing 
copy of MacOS X or Windows.

Still it's a start.  I would have liked if they could have mentioned 
that it's possible to get it free from www.ubuntu.com on CD.
> I'm thinking we should invite BBC people to the many launch parties
> that are happening this week! Theydo  seem to be really trying to be
> balanced and informative.
>   
Sounds like a good idea.  Later on this week I'm going to be finishing 
off a PC for a local charity which should get some newspaper coverage.  
The PC is running Ubuntu (it'll be running Karmic, it's running 9.04 at 
the moment) and I'm hopefully going to be able to mention that the Devon 
& Cornwall LUG are happy to help folks get Ubuntu installed on their PCs.

Rob


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!

[Alan Bell]

Sean Miller wrote:
> Why do none of these programmes ever mention Wine?
>
> It's simply not true that you can't run Microsoft programs on Ubuntu
> -- is the BBC sponsored by Apple and Microsoft or what???
>
> Sean
>
>   
Well I don't think you can blame the BBC for that one. Chris Kenyon is
Canonical's OEM team manager, he most certainly does know about Wine.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Dean Sas]

Daniel Drummond wrote:
>> 2009/10/27 Philip Stubbs :
>>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8326264.stm?ls

> /"Some of the security is through obscurity but it's also better by 
> design," he said./
> 
> 
> Just doesn't make sense at all.  Surely as it is an open-source system, 
> there is no obscurity.  I think he means to say that Ubuntu is a smaller 
> target for crackers than some others.

It makes perfect sense, he said exactly what you said he meant to say.

Obscurity doesn't just mean the "hidden" or opaqueness. It also means
little known.


Dean

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Lord (News)]

On 27/10/09 08:48, Sean Miller wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 8:26 AM, Alan Lord (News)  
> wrote:
>> On 27/10/09 08:13, Daniel Drummond wrote:
>> 
>>> If that guy was from Canonical, perhaps they should think about retraining:-
>>>
>>> /"For the first time in 20 years you can buy Ubuntu pre-installed from
>>> more than one manufacturer," he said. "That's an extraordinary story."
>>>
>>> /A stupid statement considering Ubuntu hasn't been around for 20 years.
>>
>> Nit picking is not really helpful. GNU/Linux has been around for that long.
>
> Now I'm nit picking... it's actually 18 years since first version of
> Linux kernel was released, not 20.  And only 17 since it became
> GNU/Linux.

Nice ;-)




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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Sean Miller]

On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 8:26 AM, Alan Lord (News)  wrote:
> On 27/10/09 08:13, Daniel Drummond wrote:
> 
>> If that guy was from Canonical, perhaps they should think about retraining:-
>>
>> /"For the first time in 20 years you can buy Ubuntu pre-installed from
>> more than one manufacturer," he said. "That's an extraordinary story."
>>
>> /A stupid statement considering Ubuntu hasn't been around for 20 years.
>
> Nit picking is not really helpful. GNU/Linux has been around for that long.

Now I'm nit picking... it's actually 18 years since first version of
Linux kernel was released, not 20.  And only 17 since it became
GNU/Linux.

Sean

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!

[Dean Sas]

Sean Miller wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Sean Miller  wrote:
>> Why do none of these programmes ever mention Wine?
> 
> Come to think of it, why isn't Wine installed by default??

I don't know if there are any "official" reasons, but here are some
possibilities

* It's ugly
* It doesn't always work
* It introduces another method of installing software
* Political: Why write a Linux version of something when you can just
write the Windows software and have it work via wine?

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Lord (News)]

On 27/10/09 08:13, Daniel Drummond wrote:

> If that guy was from Canonical, perhaps they should think about retraining:-
>
> /"For the first time in 20 years you can buy Ubuntu pre-installed from
> more than one manufacturer," he said. "That's an extraordinary story."
>
> /A stupid statement considering Ubuntu hasn't been around for 20 years.

Nit picking is not really helpful. GNU/Linux has been around for that long.

> and
>
> /"Some of the security is through obscurity but it's also better by
> design," he said./
>
> Just doesn't make sense at all.  Surely as it is an open-source system,
> there is no obscurity.  I think he means to say that Ubuntu is a smaller
> target for crackers than some others.

Thinking about the audience for this perhaps it could have been phrased 
better but it is a very encouraging sign. That's the first time I've 
*ever* seen a Linux distro get mainstream coverage in a positive rather 
than derogatory light.

Chris does work for Canonical. He's in charge of OEM deals worldwide and 
is quite senior in the company.

Al


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Daniel Drummond]

Lucy wrote:
> 2009/10/27 Philip Stubbs :
>   
>> 2009/10/21 James Milligan :
>> 
>>> Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?
>>>
>>> Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
>>> Safari open on ubuntu.com
>>>
>>> Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.
>>>
>>> James
>>>   
>> I have not had time to read it yet,
>>
>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8326264.stm?ls
>> 
>
> It's good. There's a 3 minute interview with someone from Canonical.
> Would have been nicer if it'd been a little bit longer. They just
> about explained what open source was and gave a tour of the OS. It was
> also mentioned that you couldn't run Windows or Mac OS programs on it,
> but didn't mention that there are usually equivalent programs
> available (while it's a good thing to say, I don't remember such a big
> emphasis when Macs are discussed). Unfortunately, I think Ubuntu
> looked a little sad on screen compared to the latest shiney Windows
> release; I'm looking forward to an improved default theme and a revamp
> of Gnome.
>
> I'm thinking we should invite BBC people to the many launch parties
> that are happening this week! Theydo  seem to be really trying to be
> balanced and informative.
>
>   
If that guy was from Canonical, perhaps they should think about retraining:-

/"For the first time in 20 years you can buy Ubuntu pre-installed from 
more than one manufacturer," he said. "That's an extraordinary story."

/A stupid statement considering Ubuntu hasn't been around for 20 years.

and

/"Some of the security is through obscurity but it's also better by 
design," he said./


Just doesn't make sense at all.  Surely as it is an open-source system, 
there is no obscurity.  I think he means to say that Ubuntu is a smaller 
target for crackers than some others.

Dan

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!

[Sean Miller]

On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 8:00 AM, Sean Miller  wrote:
> Why do none of these programmes ever mention Wine?

Come to think of it, why isn't Wine installed by default??

Sean

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!

[Sean Miller]

Why do none of these programmes ever mention Wine?

It's simply not true that you can't run Microsoft programs on Ubuntu
-- is the BBC sponsored by Apple and Microsoft or what???

Sean

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Sean Miller]

I agree about the theme... why can't Ubuntu install something that is
at least slightly pleasant on the eye??

Sean

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[ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!

[Gordon]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8327082.stm


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Lucy]

2009/10/27 Philip Stubbs :
> 2009/10/21 James Milligan :
>> Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?
>>
>> Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
>> Safari open on ubuntu.com
>>
>> Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.
>>
>> James
>
> I have not had time to read it yet,
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8326264.stm?ls

It's good. There's a 3 minute interview with someone from Canonical.
Would have been nicer if it'd been a little bit longer. They just
about explained what open source was and gave a tour of the OS. It was
also mentioned that you couldn't run Windows or Mac OS programs on it,
but didn't mention that there are usually equivalent programs
available (while it's a good thing to say, I don't remember such a big
emphasis when Macs are discussed). Unfortunately, I think Ubuntu
looked a little sad on screen compared to the latest shiney Windows
release; I'm looking forward to an improved default theme and a revamp
of Gnome.

I'm thinking we should invite BBC people to the many launch parties
that are happening this week! Theydo  seem to be really trying to be
balanced and informative.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Philip Stubbs]

2009/10/21 James Milligan :
> Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?
>
> Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
> Safari open on ubuntu.com
>
> Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.
>
> James

I have not had time to read it yet,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8326264.stm?ls

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Rob Beard]

Paul Sutton wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Samuel Toogood wrote:
>   
>> --- Original message ---
>> 
>>> From: Jon Reynolds 
>>> To: ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com
>>> Sent: 24.10.'09,  10:50
>>>
>>> Am I thinking about this wrong or is it true that using a live CD, one
>>> can just boot into the live environment and then mount the host
>>> computer's hard drive and browse its contents. Isn't that a really bad
>>> security issue?
>>>
>>> Jon Reynolds
>>>
>>>   
>> No that's perfectly correct. It's one of the reasons Ubuntu offers home 
>> directory encryption.
>>
>> Sam 
>>
>> 
> I think this has been said before once you have physical access to a
> computer it is vulnerable,  however if you disable boot from cdrom, as a
> bios option, and probably from usb as well.  Password protect the bios
> then you do add some sort of security,
>
>   
It's possible to take the machine apart to reset the CMOS settings, or 
in some cases a BIOS password can be easily got round with a simple 
backdoor password (I vaguely remember AMI and Award BIOSes having such a 
feature).  Worst one I found though was on a Dell Latititude D600 which 
I had to strip the machine down to the motherboard and find a chip and 
short two legs of the chip to reset the password.  It was a bit worrying 
attacking it with a paperclip but it worked.
> of course if its a server then you would probably want to remove the cd
> drice anyway, (however that seems a little extreme),
>
>   
Depends, a lot of servers I've seen come with lockable covers.  Not to 
mention, if it's a server why isn't it physically locked away with 
limited access? (although I've seen cases of the servers being easily 
accessed on full view, such as at one of the radio stations I used to 
support).

Rob


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Rob Beard]

Jon Reynolds wrote:
> Am I thinking about this wrong or is it true that using a live CD, one
> can just boot into the live environment and then mount the host
> computer's hard drive and browse its contents. Isn't that a really bad
> security issue?
> 's 
> Jon Reynolds
>   
Depends on how you look at it.  From a support point of view, it's 
really handy (I often do this for recovering data from screwed up 
XP/Vista installations), but then I guess from a personal data point of 
view, yes it could be a bit of a security issue.

Rob


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Paul Sutton]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Samuel Toogood wrote:
> --- Original message ---
>> From: Jon Reynolds 
>> To: ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com
>> Sent: 24.10.'09,  10:50
>>
>> Am I thinking about this wrong or is it true that using a live CD, one
>> can just boot into the live environment and then mount the host
>> computer's hard drive and browse its contents. Isn't that a really bad
>> security issue?
>>
>> Jon Reynolds
>>
> No that's perfectly correct. It's one of the reasons Ubuntu offers home 
> directory encryption.
> 
> Sam 
> 
I think this has been said before once you have physical access to a
computer it is vulnerable,  however if you disable boot from cdrom, as a
bios option, and probably from usb as well.  Password protect the bios
then you do add some sort of security,

of course if its a server then you would probably want to remove the cd
drice anyway, (however that seems a little extreme),

is home directory encryption available in 8.10 or later editions ?

Paul

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Ubuntu 9.10 out 29th October 2009 - www.ubuntu.com
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Samuel Toogood]

--- Original message ---
> From: Jon Reynolds 
> To: ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com
> Sent: 24.10.'09,  10:50
>
> Am I thinking about this wrong or is it true that using a live CD, one
> can just boot into the live environment and then mount the host
> computer's hard drive and browse its contents. Isn't that a really bad
> security issue?
>
> Jon Reynolds
>
No that's perfectly correct. It's one of the reasons Ubuntu offers home 
directory encryption.

Sam 

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Tony Pursell]

On 24 Oct 2009 at 10:50, Jon Reynolds wrote:
> 
> Am I thinking about this wrong or is it true that using a live CD, one
> can just boot into the live environment and then mount the host
> computer's hard drive and browse its contents. Isn't that a really bad
> security issue?
> 
> Jon Reynolds
> 

Yep! That's why you should consider encryption!

Tony



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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Jon Reynolds]

Am I thinking about this wrong or is it true that using a live CD, one
can just boot into the live environment and then mount the host
computer's hard drive and browse its contents. Isn't that a really bad
security issue?

Jon Reynolds

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 10:05:25AM +0100, Alan Pope wrote:
> 
> Which could be achieved with one of many Linux based Live CDs or USB keys:-
> 

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Rob Beard]

doug livesey wrote:
>
> I don't know the Enquirer -- how respected a journal is it?
It's the Inquirer at www.theinquirer.net

It was started by Mike Magee who was also involved with The Register 
(www.theregister.co.uk).  Both are fairly respected.

Rob



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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Sean Miller]

On Fri, Oct 23, 2009 at 5:57 AM, Rowan Berkeley
 wrote:
> Actually, the possessive pronoun WAS spelled with an apostrophe (which
> is quite logical, since others are) until the contraction for 'it is'
> became unavoidably common. Eighteenth-century printers wrote it with
> one; I know this because I recently read the facsimile edition of Bishop
> George Berkeley's "Alciphron" (1735) on Google Books, and there it was.

Hmmm... not sure if that was necessarily a standard across the English
language...

Sean

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Rowan Berkeley]

On Thu, 2009-10-22 at 22:44 +0100, Christopher Swift
:
> Alan, since we've gone onto the topic of both spelling and grammar,
> you will find that according to the Oxford English Dictionary, the
> past participle of the verb to spell is indeed "spelt".  We are not
> living in America on this thread.  View here as an example of the
> usage of the verb to spell in the past particple.
> http://www.askoxford.com/asktheexperts/faq/aboutwords/palindromes?view=uk
> I do agree however with the points regarding apostrophes.
> Regards,
> Chris.

Actually, the possessive pronoun WAS spelled with an apostrophe (which
is quite logical, since others are) until the contraction for 'it is'
became unavoidably common. Eighteenth-century printers wrote it with
one; I know this because I recently read the facsimile edition of Bishop
George Berkeley's "Alciphron" (1735) on Google Books, and there it was.


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[doug livesey]

> Although I have no hard evidence ... the truth is out there.

No offense, but by speculating like they do on government's spying in on us
through our computers whilst offering no hard evidence, they rather run the
risk of coming across a little tin-foil hat.
I don't know the Enquirer -- how respected a journal is it?
There are plenty of sound usability, technical, financial, ethical,
political, and security-related reasons to both reject M$ & embrace Ubuntu
with lots of hard evidence to back them -- so many that I doubt I'll ever
get around to worrying on account of article as heavy on paranoia & thin on
corroborating facts as that first link!
Interesting second article, though, cheers.
   Doug.

2009/10/22 David King 

> Although I have no hard evidence, it was years ago that I heard about
> the US govt/FBI having  a backdoor into Windows, and that all antivirus
> software by law cannot be allowed to detect what the FBI, etc., put onto
> people's computers.
>
> It might be true, it might be partially true. But the fact is that,
> AFAIK, this kind of spyware can exist on Windows PCs, but not so much in
> Linux.
>
>
>
> http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1025684/us-government-snoops-used-vista-to-spy-on-me
>
>
>
> As for WGA, this is the Windows Genuine Advantage tool, that checks if
> the Windows you are using is valid or not, and if not, reports back to
> Microsoft. It is a type of spyware which might also be used to report
> other information to MS.
>
> http://news.zdnet.co.uk/software/0,100121,39277823,00.htm
>
> This article suggests that early versions of WGA did report to Microsoft
> at every startup time, but later versions were modified not too after
> people complained about it.
>
> At least two of the people who replied to that article wrote that they
> switched to linux, and the WGA was one of the main reasons why I
> personally decided to return to linux and try to use it full time at home.
>
>
> As in all things, I expect the truth is out there.
>
>
> David King
>
>
>
>
> Alan Pope wrote:
> > 2009/10/22 Alan Lord (News) :
> >
> >> There was a story (poss. last year or earlier) about a FBI(or Police)
> >> conference in the US where MS apparently handed out a USB key to all
> >> delegates that had "backdoors" into Windows. If I get chance I'll try to
> >> search for it.
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Interesting, I'd not heard about that. Google turned up this:-
> >
> > http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20080429/095514977.shtml
> >
> > "Apparently, they're giving out special USB keys that simply get
> > around Microsoft's security, allowing the holder of the key to very
> > quickly get forensic information (including internet surfing history),
> > passwords and supposedly encrypted data off of a laptop."
> >
> > ...
> >
> > "Update: Some folks in the comments, and Ed Bott, claim that this post
> > is a misreading of the original story. The USB key includes a bunch of
> > standard tools, not access to a "backdoor." The confusion, on my part,
> > was due to the original article claiming that the device "can decrypt
> > passwords and analyze a computer's Internet activity, as well as data
> > stored in the computer." In saying so, it appeared that the device
> > must have access to a backdoor to decrypt the password -- but an
> > update claims that it's merely "password security auditing
> > technologies.""
> >
> > Which could be achieved with one of many Linux based Live CDs or USB
> keys:-
> >
> >
> http://www.darknet.org.uk/2006/03/10-best-security-live-cd-distros-pen-test-forensics-recovery/
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Al.
> >
> >
>
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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[David King]

Although I have no hard evidence, it was years ago that I heard about 
the US govt/FBI having  a backdoor into Windows, and that all antivirus 
software by law cannot be allowed to detect what the FBI, etc., put onto 
people's computers.

It might be true, it might be partially true. But the fact is that, 
AFAIK, this kind of spyware can exist on Windows PCs, but not so much in 
Linux.


http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1025684/us-government-snoops-used-vista-to-spy-on-me



As for WGA, this is the Windows Genuine Advantage tool, that checks if 
the Windows you are using is valid or not, and if not, reports back to 
Microsoft. It is a type of spyware which might also be used to report 
other information to MS.

http://news.zdnet.co.uk/software/0,100121,39277823,00.htm

This article suggests that early versions of WGA did report to Microsoft 
at every startup time, but later versions were modified not too after 
people complained about it.

At least two of the people who replied to that article wrote that they 
switched to linux, and the WGA was one of the main reasons why I 
personally decided to return to linux and try to use it full time at home.


As in all things, I expect the truth is out there.


David King




Alan Pope wrote:
> 2009/10/22 Alan Lord (News) :
>   
>> There was a story (poss. last year or earlier) about a FBI(or Police)
>> conference in the US where MS apparently handed out a USB key to all
>> delegates that had "backdoors" into Windows. If I get chance I'll try to
>> search for it.
>>
>> 
>
> Interesting, I'd not heard about that. Google turned up this:-
>
> http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20080429/095514977.shtml
>
> "Apparently, they're giving out special USB keys that simply get
> around Microsoft's security, allowing the holder of the key to very
> quickly get forensic information (including internet surfing history),
> passwords and supposedly encrypted data off of a laptop."
>
> ...
>
> "Update: Some folks in the comments, and Ed Bott, claim that this post
> is a misreading of the original story. The USB key includes a bunch of
> standard tools, not access to a "backdoor." The confusion, on my part,
> was due to the original article claiming that the device "can decrypt
> passwords and analyze a computer's Internet activity, as well as data
> stored in the computer." In saying so, it appeared that the device
> must have access to a backdoor to decrypt the password -- but an
> update claims that it's merely "password security auditing
> technologies.""
>
> Which could be achieved with one of many Linux based Live CDs or USB keys:-
>
> http://www.darknet.org.uk/2006/03/10-best-security-live-cd-distros-pen-test-forensics-recovery/
>
> Cheers,
> Al.
>
>   

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[jim.cameron]

Tony Pursell:
> Use of the word 'program'  for computer program was in a book
> I used to have with a title something like 'British Standard
> Terms in Data Processing', published by the BSI back in
> the1960s!.  And people still get it wrong...

I remember correcting my primary school teacher on this point in about
1980. It's a common problem with texts localised from the US,
though--they tend to replace 'program' with 'programme' globally, not
realising that UK English has adopted the American spelling in the
specific sense of a computer program.

jim
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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Lord (News)]

On 22/10/09 16:28, Christopher Swift wrote:

>> --
> Alan, since we've gone onto the topic of both spelling and grammar,
> you will find that according to the Oxford English Dictionary, the
> past participle of the verb to spell is indeed "spelt".  We are not
> living in America on this thread.  View here as an example of the
> usage of the verb to spell in the past particple.
> http://www.askoxford.com/asktheexperts/faq/aboutwords/palindromes?view=uk
>
> I do agree however with the points regarding apostrophes.

Thanks for pointing out my error and please accept my humble apologies.

As has been mentioned on IRC I probably spend too much time around 
yanks/reading American docs.

Al



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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Christopher Swift]

2009/10/22 Alan Lord (News) :
> On 21/10/09 23:26, Tony Pursell wrote:
>> On 21 Oct 2009 at 22:29, LeeGroups wrote:

>>> That page got right up my nose
>>>
>>> --
>>> Firstly, "computer program" isn't spelt "programme", that would be a
>>> "television programme".
>
> Not to be picky but "spelt" is a type of wheat grain used to make flour
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spelt).
>
> A word is 'spelled' incorrectly.
>
> And in this sentence:
>
> "Given Dells position in the market place and it's support of Ubuntu,
> the contents of this page appear to be somewhat skewed in Microsofts
> direction."
>
> Dells should be Dell's, it's should be its[1] and Microsofts should be
> Microsoft's.
>
> If you are going to criticise spelling I would suggest getting your own
> in order would lend more weight to your argument.
>
> Al
>
> [1] http://www.future-perfect.co.uk/grammartips/grammar-tip-its.asp
>
>
> --
Alan, since we've gone onto the topic of both spelling and grammar,
you will find that according to the Oxford English Dictionary, the
past participle of the verb to spell is indeed "spelt".  We are not
living in America on this thread.  View here as an example of the
usage of the verb to spell in the past particple.
http://www.askoxford.com/asktheexperts/faq/aboutwords/palindromes?view=uk

I do agree however with the points regarding apostrophes.

Regards,
Chris.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[David Restall - System Administrator]

Hi,

> Alan Lord (News) wrote:
> > On 21/10/09 23:26, Tony Pursell wrote:
> >> On 21 Oct 2009 at 22:29, LeeGroups wrote:
> >>> That page got right up my nose
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Firstly, "computer program" isn't spelt "programme", that would be a
> >>> "television programme".
> > 
> > Not to be picky but "spelt" is a type of wheat grain used to make flour 
> > (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spelt).
> > 
> > A word is 'spelled' incorrectly.

Speaking as an old fuddy-duddy who bemoans the practice of not pulling
up poor spelling at skool :-)

People should be wary of quoting an encyclopedia when they should
be consulting a dictionary... :-



which is almost verbatim what my paper Concise OED says.

Spelt is spelt correctly and used correctly.

I'll agree with the dodgy apostrophes though :-)

TTFN



D
ubuntu/uk-2009-10-21.txubuntu-uk
++
| Dave Restall, Computer Nerd, Cyclist, Radio Amateur G4FCU, Bodger  |
| Mob +44 (0) 7973 831245  Skype: dave.restall Radio: G4FCU  |
| email : d...@restall.net Web : Not Ready Yet :-(   |
++
| In the stairway of life, you'd best take the elevator. |
++


> > And in this sentence:
> > 
> > "Given Dells position in the market place and it's support of Ubuntu, 
> > the contents of this page appear to be somewhat skewed in Microsofts 
> > direction."
> > 
> > Dells should be Dell's, it's should be its[1] and Microsofts should be 
> > Microsoft's.
> > 
> > If you are going to criticise spelling I would suggest getting your own 
> > in order would lend more weight to your argument.
> > 
> > Al
> > 
> > [1] http://www.future-perfect.co.uk/grammartips/grammar-tip-its.asp
> > 
> > 
> 
> Now everyone replying to this thread will be ultra-self-conscious about 
> their spelling (and grammar) -- lol.
> 
> Tom
> 
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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Bell]

Thomas Ibbotson wrote:
>
> Quoting from the website:
> -Spend lots of money for Windows 7 for every computer in your organisation,
> -First you will need to take very careful backups of everything (not 
> just files but emails, favourites, settings etc),
> -Format your machine's hard disk and install Windows 7 as a fresh 
> installation,
> -Then you'll have to find those drivers for your hardware (if they 
> exist) and install them,
> -Re-install all your application software (if it still works on Windows 
> 7 and you have the CDs and license keys etc),
> -Activate and register your computer on your network,
> -Copy back all that carefully backed up data and make sure it goes into 
> the right places.
>
> It seems to me that you are suggesting that these steps would not be 
> necessary with Ubuntu, but if you were to migrate to Ubuntu from Windows 
> XP you would still have to perform steps 2,3,5,6?? and 7. With the added 
> problems of trying to import your data to new, different programs and 
> learning an unfamiliar desktop environment.
>
> I'm all for Ubuntu and FOSS, but this just struck me as a bit dishonest. 
>   I'll just go and get my ceramic shield
>
> Tom
>
>   
I don't think we are suggesting these steps are not necessary (well
apart from the license keys), the point is that it is a disruptive rip
and replace upgrade anyway so you might as well spend the price of a
single license looking at an alternative. For £229 you can get a copy of
Windows 7 and a piece of paper telling you what you are not allowed to
do with it, or you can get a copy of Ubuntu and three hours of on site
training.
It is a little opportunistic, but I don't think it is wrong. In fact up
to yesterday Microsoft were advising people with XP not to upgrade
without expert help. Anyone have a backup of this page:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/get/upgrade-advisor.aspx

Alan.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Pope]

2009/10/22 Alan Lord (News) :
> There was a story (poss. last year or earlier) about a FBI(or Police)
> conference in the US where MS apparently handed out a USB key to all
> delegates that had "backdoors" into Windows. If I get chance I'll try to
> search for it.
>

Interesting, I'd not heard about that. Google turned up this:-

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20080429/095514977.shtml

"Apparently, they're giving out special USB keys that simply get
around Microsoft's security, allowing the holder of the key to very
quickly get forensic information (including internet surfing history),
passwords and supposedly encrypted data off of a laptop."

...

"Update: Some folks in the comments, and Ed Bott, claim that this post
is a misreading of the original story. The USB key includes a bunch of
standard tools, not access to a "backdoor." The confusion, on my part,
was due to the original article claiming that the device "can decrypt
passwords and analyze a computer's Internet activity, as well as data
stored in the computer." In saying so, it appeared that the device
must have access to a backdoor to decrypt the password -- but an
update claims that it's merely "password security auditing
technologies.""

Which could be achieved with one of many Linux based Live CDs or USB keys:-

http://www.darknet.org.uk/2006/03/10-best-security-live-cd-distros-pen-test-forensics-recovery/

Cheers,
Al.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Lord (News)]

On 22/10/09 09:22, Alan Pope wrote:
> 2009/10/22 David King:
>> That's a good way to describe it -- Software with Secrets. Including a
>> backdoor so that US govt agencies can spy on you,
>
> [[citation needed]]

There was a story (poss. last year or earlier) about a FBI(or Police) 
conference in the US where MS apparently handed out a USB key to all 
delegates that had "backdoors" into Windows. If I get chance I'll try to 
search for it.

>
>> as well as the WGA
>> tool to report back any activity on your PC to Microsoft.
>>
>
> [[citation needed]]
>
> I'd be interested in seeing proof of those two statements..
>
> Cheers,
> Al.
>



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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Lord (News)]

On 22/10/09 08:54, Thomas Ibbotson wrote:
> Alan Bell wrote:
>> Paul Sutton wrote:
>>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>>> Hash: SHA1
>>>
>>> Linux got a mention on the lunch time news,  well it showed tux, and the
>>> google and apple logos, as alternatives,  but didn't say much about em
>>>
>> well it is Microsoft's big day (well it is tomorrow, they seem to have
>> jumped the gun slightly) so it is natural they are talking about it. We
>> too are celebrating the launch of Windows 7 with a special upgrade
>> promotion. http://www.theopenlearningcentre.com/windows-7-upgrade-promotion
>> Next week with the launch of Karmic Koala is the time to talk about
>> Linux, hopefully the BBC will join in the conversation.
>
> Quoting from the website:
> -Spend lots of money for Windows 7 for every computer in your organisation,
> -First you will need to take very careful backups of everything (not
> just files but emails, favourites, settings etc),
> -Format your machine's hard disk and install Windows 7 as a fresh
> installation,
> -Then you'll have to find those drivers for your hardware (if they
> exist) and install them,
> -Re-install all your application software (if it still works on Windows
> 7 and you have the CDs and license keys etc),
> -Activate and register your computer on your network,
> -Copy back all that carefully backed up data and make sure it goes into
> the right places.
>
> It seems to me that you are suggesting that these steps would not be
> necessary with Ubuntu, but if you were to migrate to Ubuntu from Windows
> XP you would still have to perform steps 2,3,5,6?? and 7. With the added
> problems of trying to import your data to new, different programs and
> learning an unfamiliar desktop environment.

Well no it isn't quite the same.

2. When installing Ubuntu on an existing computer does offer to import 
the majority of a Windows XP's system settings and your data.

3. It does not require you to format the hdd, it will offer to make 
space and repartition the drive for you and run alongside Windows.

5. Most widely used apps are pre-installed on Ubuntu and there is no 
digging around for Cds and license keys etc.

6. There is no Activiation or registration required with Ubuntu.

7. See 2.

> I'm all for Ubuntu and FOSS, but this just struck me as a bit dishonest.
>I'll just go and get my ceramic shield

It isn't dishonest in the slightest. If you upgrade from Vista to 
Windows 7 then you can do an in-situ upgrade. But from XP it is a royal 
PITA. That's why Gartner (who tend to be pro MS) even found it will cost 
a *lot* to actually do the upgrade.

HTH

Alan


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Pope]

2009/10/22 David King :
> That's a good way to describe it -- Software with Secrets. Including a
> backdoor so that US govt agencies can spy on you,

[[citation needed]]

> as well as the WGA
> tool to report back any activity on your PC to Microsoft.
>

[[citation needed]]

I'd be interested in seeing proof of those two statements..

Cheers,
Al.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[David King]

That's a good way to describe it -- Software with Secrets. Including a 
backdoor so that US govt agencies can spy on you, as well as the WGA 
tool to report back any activity on your PC to Microsoft.


David King



alan c wrote:
>
>
> Not least, Windows is Software with Secrets!
> That regime is not for me, at any price, thanks.
>   

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Thomas Ibbotson]

Alan Lord (News) wrote:
> On 21/10/09 23:26, Tony Pursell wrote:
>> On 21 Oct 2009 at 22:29, LeeGroups wrote:
>>> That page got right up my nose
>>>
>>> --
>>> Firstly, "computer program" isn't spelt "programme", that would be a
>>> "television programme".
> 
> Not to be picky but "spelt" is a type of wheat grain used to make flour 
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spelt).
> 
> A word is 'spelled' incorrectly.
> 
> And in this sentence:
> 
> "Given Dells position in the market place and it's support of Ubuntu, 
> the contents of this page appear to be somewhat skewed in Microsofts 
> direction."
> 
> Dells should be Dell's, it's should be its[1] and Microsofts should be 
> Microsoft's.
> 
> If you are going to criticise spelling I would suggest getting your own 
> in order would lend more weight to your argument.
> 
> Al
> 
> [1] http://www.future-perfect.co.uk/grammartips/grammar-tip-its.asp
> 
> 

Now everyone replying to this thread will be ultra-self-conscious about 
their spelling (and grammar) -- lol.

Tom

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Thomas Ibbotson]

Alan Bell wrote:
> Paul Sutton wrote:
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Linux got a mention on the lunch time news,  well it showed tux, and the
>> google and apple logos, as alternatives,  but didn't say much about em
>>   
> well it is Microsoft's big day (well it is tomorrow, they seem to have 
> jumped the gun slightly) so it is natural they are talking about it. We 
> too are celebrating the launch of Windows 7 with a special upgrade 
> promotion. http://www.theopenlearningcentre.com/windows-7-upgrade-promotion
> Next week with the launch of Karmic Koala is the time to talk about 
> Linux, hopefully the BBC will join in the conversation.

Quoting from the website:
-Spend lots of money for Windows 7 for every computer in your organisation,
-First you will need to take very careful backups of everything (not 
just files but emails, favourites, settings etc),
-Format your machine's hard disk and install Windows 7 as a fresh 
installation,
-Then you'll have to find those drivers for your hardware (if they 
exist) and install them,
-Re-install all your application software (if it still works on Windows 
7 and you have the CDs and license keys etc),
-Activate and register your computer on your network,
-Copy back all that carefully backed up data and make sure it goes into 
the right places.

It seems to me that you are suggesting that these steps would not be 
necessary with Ubuntu, but if you were to migrate to Ubuntu from Windows 
XP you would still have to perform steps 2,3,5,6?? and 7. With the added 
problems of trying to import your data to new, different programs and 
learning an unfamiliar desktop environment.

I'm all for Ubuntu and FOSS, but this just struck me as a bit dishonest. 
  I'll just go and get my ceramic shield

Tom

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Lord (News)]

On 21/10/09 23:26, Tony Pursell wrote:
> On 21 Oct 2009 at 22:29, LeeGroups wrote:
>>>
>> That page got right up my nose
>>
>> --
>> Firstly, "computer program" isn't spelt "programme", that would be a
>> "television programme".

Not to be picky but "spelt" is a type of wheat grain used to make flour 
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spelt).

A word is 'spelled' incorrectly.

And in this sentence:

"Given Dells position in the market place and it's support of Ubuntu, 
the contents of this page appear to be somewhat skewed in Microsofts 
direction."

Dells should be Dell's, it's should be its[1] and Microsofts should be 
Microsoft's.

If you are going to criticise spelling I would suggest getting your own 
in order would lend more weight to your argument.

Al

[1] http://www.future-perfect.co.uk/grammartips/grammar-tip-its.asp


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Tony Pursell]

On 21 Oct 2009 at 22:29, LeeGroups wrote:
> >   
> That page got right up my nose
> 
> --
> Firstly, "computer program" isn't spelt "programme", that would be a 
> "television programme".

Use of the word 'program'  for computer program was in a book I used 
to have with a title something like 'British Standard Terms in Data 
Processing', published by the BSI back in the1960s!.  And people still 
get it wrong...

Tony




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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[LeeGroups]

it may be worth clicking on feedback adn commenting,


  

That page got right up my nose

--
Firstly, "computer program" isn't spelt "programme", that would be a 
"television programme".
Secondly, given the number of Windows users who use Open Office, Firefox 
and Thunderbird, a new user of Ubuntu won't necessarily have to learn 
new programs.
Thirdly, 99% of Ubuntu users aren't "interested in open source 
programming", they just want an Operating System that works and doesn't 
get riddled with malware/viruses/trojans on a daily basis, so this point 
would seem at odds with reality.


Given Dells position in the market place and it's support of Ubuntu, the 
contents of this page appear to be somewhat skewed in Microsofts direction.


I would appreciate it corrected at your earliest convenience.
-

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Jamie Bennett]

On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 19:08 +0100, Alan Bell wrote:
> also go to any conference on anything. Look at the percentage of Macs in 
> the audience, look at the percentage of laptops that get put on the 
> podium that are Macs. It is going up. Linux is too, but Macs are more 
> spottable.

At the ELC (embedded linux conference) in Grenoble last week *every* mac
laptop was running some flavour of Linux. Just because you see the
hardware don't presume its running Mac OS. Its nice hardware for running
Ubuntu ;)

> -- 
> Alan Bell
> The Open Learning Centre

Regards,
Jamie.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Alan Bell]

Paul Sutton wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Linux got a mention on the lunch time news,  well it showed tux, and the
> google and apple logos, as alternatives,  but didn't say much about em
>   
well it is Microsoft's big day (well it is tomorrow, they seem to have 
jumped the gun slightly) so it is natural they are talking about it. We 
too are celebrating the launch of Windows 7 with a special upgrade 
promotion. http://www.theopenlearningcentre.com/windows-7-upgrade-promotion
Next week with the launch of Karmic Koala is the time to talk about 
Linux, hopefully the BBC will join in the conversation.

Alan.
> regarding product placement you notice how you see more macs on TV
> programmes, these days,
>   
also go to any conference on anything. Look at the percentage of Macs in 
the audience, look at the percentage of laptops that get put on the 
podium that are Macs. It is going up. Linux is too, but Macs are more 
spottable.
> Paul
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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> Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
>
> iEYEARECAAYFAkrfQ8oACgkQaggq1k2FJq3qlQCeObBs+m231CGy3ikumcmOo6G2
> +OMAn3/B735Du3PAulwIEQuxPtOrqS6Q
> =mqu7
> -END PGP SIGNATURE-
>
>   


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Mob: +44 (0)7736 778908
Tel: +44 (0)8444 3576000 

The Open Learning Centre is a trading name of Bell Lord Ltd,
a company registered in England and Wales #05868943.
VAT Registration #GB 901 4715 55



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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Paul Sutton]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Linux got a mention on the lunch time news,  well it showed tux, and the
google and apple logos, as alternatives,  but didn't say much about em

regarding product placement you notice how you see more macs on TV
programmes, these days,

Paul
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+OMAn3/B735Du3PAulwIEQuxPtOrqS6Q
=mqu7
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Liam Wilson]

Paul Sutton wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Liam Wilson wrote:
>   
>> Neil Greenwood wrote:
>> 
>>> 2009/10/21 James Milligan :
>>>   
>>>   
 Apologies - sent that a little early!

 He did go on to talk about it a little bit, but it did come across as
 a geek OS, he said that 'people' just want something that works, and
 don't have to fuss about with it.

 All in all, I do have to say that Windows 7 is very nice compared to
 Vista.

 James

 
 
> Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?
>
> Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
> Safari open on ubuntu.com
>
> Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.
>
> James
>
>   
>   
>>> On BBC Breakfast, Rory Cellan-Jones was demonstrating multi-touch on
>>> Windows 7. He said he normally uses a different system, then went on
>>> to say that Apple were trying to spoil the launch by announcing new
>>> products recently, and that free software was going to celebrate the
>>> launch of a new Ubuntu version next week (he pronounced it right too)!
>>>
>>> Cofion,
>>> Neil.
>>>
>>>   
>>>   
>> Yeah, but he also sort of played it down a bit by just dismissing it as 
>> "A bunch of enthusiasts trying to persuade us..." and then basically 
>> just dismissing it completely!
>>
>> I also noticed dell has done this a little on thier Windows Vs. Ubuntu page:
>> http://www1.euro.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/windows_or_ubuntu?c=uk&cs=ukdhs1&l=en&s=dhs
>>
>> I also noticed it spelt programs wrong xD
>>
>> 
> it may be worth clicking on feedback adn commenting,
>
> This seems more like MS FUD, than facts, but by commenting we can set
> the record straight, open office can load / save office 07 files for
> example, Ubuntu is for more than just programming, even though that
> option is nice, something I can't use windows for unless i buy more
> software.
>
> Ubuntu may not be able to run MS office directly but it can using
> crossover office,  or install Open office which I assume by 3.1 can now
> open / save office 07 file format.  Odf is also an ISO standard, so that
> may be significant, or pushing it a bit too far for them to cope with.
>
> Perhaps we can work out what to write here, submit that,
>
> Paul
>
> - --
> Paul Sutton
> www.zleap.net
>
> Ubuntu 9.10 out 29th October 2009 - www.ubuntu.com
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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>
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> HpUAn2+HVjsZSQ34BGrqEyz70sbXKbV2
> =7Nof
> -END PGP SIGNATURE-
>
>   
Yeah, I noticed there was feedback button, so I posted:

[I noticed on the Windows Or Ubuntu page, you stated that "Ubuntu is not 
compatible with Microsoft Office Software". I would like to inform you 
that Ubuntu is compatible with Microsoft Office files, and I think it 
would be worthwhile putting this on the webpage.

Also, you Spelt Programs wrong.]

It also say's on the Dell Ubuntu page, that you can _ONLY_ use FOSS 
software. I shall too ask for this to be changed. I sound picky, but it 
bugs me!

Liam.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Paul Sutton]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Liam Wilson wrote:
> Neil Greenwood wrote:
>> 2009/10/21 James Milligan :
>>   
>>> Apologies - sent that a little early!
>>>
>>> He did go on to talk about it a little bit, but it did come across as
>>> a geek OS, he said that 'people' just want something that works, and
>>> don't have to fuss about with it.
>>>
>>> All in all, I do have to say that Windows 7 is very nice compared to
>>> Vista.
>>>
>>> James
>>>
>>> 
 Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?

 Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
 Safari open on ubuntu.com

 Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.

 James

   
>> On BBC Breakfast, Rory Cellan-Jones was demonstrating multi-touch on
>> Windows 7. He said he normally uses a different system, then went on
>> to say that Apple were trying to spoil the launch by announcing new
>> products recently, and that free software was going to celebrate the
>> launch of a new Ubuntu version next week (he pronounced it right too)!
>>
>> Cofion,
>> Neil.
>>
>>   
> Yeah, but he also sort of played it down a bit by just dismissing it as 
> "A bunch of enthusiasts trying to persuade us..." and then basically 
> just dismissing it completely!
> 
> I also noticed dell has done this a little on thier Windows Vs. Ubuntu page:
> http://www1.euro.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/windows_or_ubuntu?c=uk&cs=ukdhs1&l=en&s=dhs
> 
> I also noticed it spelt programs wrong xD
> 
it may be worth clicking on feedback adn commenting,

This seems more like MS FUD, than facts, but by commenting we can set
the record straight, open office can load / save office 07 files for
example, Ubuntu is for more than just programming, even though that
option is nice, something I can't use windows for unless i buy more
software.

Ubuntu may not be able to run MS office directly but it can using
crossover office,  or install Open office which I assume by 3.1 can now
open / save office 07 file format.  Odf is also an ISO standard, so that
may be significant, or pushing it a bit too far for them to cope with.

Perhaps we can work out what to write here, submit that,

Paul

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Ubuntu 9.10 out 29th October 2009 - www.ubuntu.com
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=7Nof
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Liam Wilson]

Neil Greenwood wrote:
> 2009/10/21 James Milligan :
>   
>> Apologies - sent that a little early!
>>
>> He did go on to talk about it a little bit, but it did come across as
>> a geek OS, he said that 'people' just want something that works, and
>> don't have to fuss about with it.
>>
>> All in all, I do have to say that Windows 7 is very nice compared to
>> Vista.
>>
>> James
>>
>> 
>>> Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?
>>>
>>> Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
>>> Safari open on ubuntu.com
>>>
>>> Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.
>>>
>>> James
>>>
>>>   
>
> On BBC Breakfast, Rory Cellan-Jones was demonstrating multi-touch on
> Windows 7. He said he normally uses a different system, then went on
> to say that Apple were trying to spoil the launch by announcing new
> products recently, and that free software was going to celebrate the
> launch of a new Ubuntu version next week (he pronounced it right too)!
>
> Cofion,
> Neil.
>
>   
Yeah, but he also sort of played it down a bit by just dismissing it as 
"A bunch of enthusiasts trying to persuade us..." and then basically 
just dismissing it completely!

I also noticed dell has done this a little on thier Windows Vs. Ubuntu page:
http://www1.euro.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/windows_or_ubuntu?c=uk&cs=ukdhs1&l=en&s=dhs

I also noticed it spelt programs wrong xD

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[alan c]

Paul Sutton wrote:
> James Milligan wrote:
>> Apologies - sent that a little early!
> 
>> He did go on to talk about it a little bit, but it did come across as  
>> a geek OS, he said that 'people' just want something that works, and  
>> don't have to fuss about with it.
> 
> so do I hence I use Linux
> 
>> All in all, I do have to say that Windows 7 is very nice compared to  
>> Vista.
> 
> I can understand this, but at what price,  Windows 7 still costs money
> and can't be installed on unlimited number of computers, lower versions
> lack features,  where as there is non of this home basic, home premium
> and other naming nonsense.

Not least, Windows is Software with Secrets!
That regime is not for me, at any price, thanks.
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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Paul Sutton]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

James Milligan wrote:
> Apologies - sent that a little early!
> 
> He did go on to talk about it a little bit, but it did come across as  
> a geek OS, he said that 'people' just want something that works, and  
> don't have to fuss about with it.

so do I hence I use Linux

> All in all, I do have to say that Windows 7 is very nice compared to  
> Vista.
> 
I can understand this, but at what price,  Windows 7 still costs money
and can't be installed on unlimited number of computers, lower versions
lack features,  where as there is non of this home basic, home premium
and other naming nonsense.

Paul

> James
> 
>> Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?
>>
>> Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
>> Safari open on ubuntu.com
>>
>> Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.
>>
>> James
>>
>> --
>> James Milligan
>> lak...@lake54.com
>> www.lake54.com
>> www.facebook.com/lake54
>> www.twitter.com/lake54
>>
>> -- 
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>> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
> 


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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[Neil Greenwood]

2009/10/21 James Milligan :
> Apologies - sent that a little early!
>
> He did go on to talk about it a little bit, but it did come across as
> a geek OS, he said that 'people' just want something that works, and
> don't have to fuss about with it.
>
> All in all, I do have to say that Windows 7 is very nice compared to
> Vista.
>
> James
>
>> Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?
>>
>> Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
>> Safari open on ubuntu.com
>>
>> Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.
>>
>> James
>>

On BBC Breakfast, Rory Cellan-Jones was demonstrating multi-touch on
Windows 7. He said he normally uses a different system, then went on
to say that Apple were trying to spoil the launch by announcing new
products recently, and that free software was going to celebrate the
launch of a new Ubuntu version next week (he pronounced it right too)!

Cofion,
Neil.

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Re: [ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[James Milligan]

Apologies - sent that a little early!

He did go on to talk about it a little bit, but it did come across as  
a geek OS, he said that 'people' just want something that works, and  
don't have to fuss about with it.

All in all, I do have to say that Windows 7 is very nice compared to  
Vista.

James

> Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?
>
> Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with
> Safari open on ubuntu.com
>
> Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.
>
> James
>
> --
> James Milligan
> lak...@lake54.com
> www.lake54.com
> www.facebook.com/lake54
> www.twitter.com/lake54
>
> -- 
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[ubuntu-uk] Ubuntu on the BBC!!!

[James Milligan]

Did anyone else watch BBC News this morning?

Whilst showing off Windows 7, the tech correspondent showed a Mac with  
Safari open on ubuntu.com

Didn't actually mention the name etc, but said about other OSes.

James

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www.twitter.com/lake54

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