Re: [Vo]:Strangeness with cold water
thanks for the reminders; I'll sleep on it Z On Jul 19, 2007, at 10:56 PM, leaking pen wrote: the expansion is due to crystal lattice forming, and many compounds exhibit it in different ranges, just not many that are that simple. the energy of compression, to a point, can actually go towards helping teh phase change, as i recall, but during that phase change, temp isnt going to change until its complete, one way or another, right? On 7/19/07, David Jonsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Since water has a negative thermal expansion coefficient in the region from 0-4 degrees Celsius one can wonder what happens if water in these conditions is compressed. Will it cool down? Where is the internal energy going? This is contrary to common understanding of physics. David -- That which yields isn't always weak.
Re: [Vo]:Strangeness with cold water
the expansion is due to crystal lattice forming, and many compounds exhibit it in different ranges, just not many that are that simple. the energy of compression, to a point, can actually go towards helping teh phase change, as i recall, but during that phase change, temp isnt going to change until its complete, one way or another, right? On 7/19/07, David Jonsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Since water has a negative thermal expansion coefficient in the region from 0-4 degrees Celsius one can wonder what happens if water in these conditions is compressed. Will it cool down? Where is the internal energy going? This is contrary to common understanding of physics. David -- That which yields isn't always weak.
Re: [Vo]:Strangeness with cold water
by definition, wouldnt increasing pressure change where the triple point is? On 7/19/07, Zachary Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I've wondered this, too. I was illumined to consider a paper on sonomagnetism, a phenomena seen in the boundary layer of the oceanic thermocline. The motion of electrolytic fluid carries and electromotive force that generates photonic emissions (presumably which were being confusing the interpretation of submarine transmissions). I think it's another entry in the library of radiant transduction to coherent energy. To hypothesize on your question, if you compressed water near it's triple point I think you'd see a quantized heat dissipation curve in sync with photonic emissions in directions characterized by [some kind of dissipation-turbulence function] Zak On Jul 19, 2007, at 8:49 AM, David Jonsson wrote: > Since water has a negative thermal expansion coefficient in the region > from 0-4 degrees Celsius one can wonder what happens if water in these > conditions is compressed. Will it cool down? Where is the internal > energy going? This is contrary to common understanding of physics. > > David > -- That which yields isn't always weak.
Re: [Vo]:Strangeness with cold water
I've wondered this, too. I was illumined to consider a paper on sonomagnetism, a phenomena seen in the boundary layer of the oceanic thermocline. The motion of electrolytic fluid carries and electromotive force that generates photonic emissions (presumably which were being confusing the interpretation of submarine transmissions). I think it's another entry in the library of radiant transduction to coherent energy. To hypothesize on your question, if you compressed water near it's triple point I think you'd see a quantized heat dissipation curve in sync with photonic emissions in directions characterized by [some kind of dissipation-turbulence function] Zak On Jul 19, 2007, at 8:49 AM, David Jonsson wrote: Since water has a negative thermal expansion coefficient in the region from 0-4 degrees Celsius one can wonder what happens if water in these conditions is compressed. Will it cool down? Where is the internal energy going? This is contrary to common understanding of physics. David
Re: [Vo]:Re: [Vo] Lithium titanate battery
In reply to Horace Heffner's message of Thu, 19 Jul 2007 11:08:37 -0800: Hi, [snip] >It's stuck in the >polyethylene oxide? Hmmm... I wonder what the anode reaction is >then. I'm utterly confused - but it still seems worth posting because >O18 might play some role in all this. It will be interesting to see >if the lithium titanate battery continues to have some heating >problems despite replacement of the cathode. [snip] I think chemical exchange mechanisms occur at the atomic rather than the nuclear level. IOW whole atoms or ions of the same element simply bump one another aside as the energy required to break the old chemical bond matches that released by formation of the new bond. That means that normal thermal energy is enough to bring about the exchange. However slight binding energy differences between isotopes could easily lead to enrichment over time, especially if the binding energy of the heavier isotope to the electrode material is slightly greater than that of the respective lighter isotope. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk The shrub is a plant.
Re: [Vo]:centripetal force question
Imagine a ferris wheel (absent the carriages for simplicity) which is initially at rest. As the world turns, the ferris wheel will complete one revolution in a day (assuming no friction) with respect to an observer standing beside it. Yes? No? ...or? Harry On 15/7/2007 5:17 PM, Michel Jullian wrote: > Hi Thomas, > > The (fictitious, or apparent) force you're talking about is a function of > _rotations_ (not revolutions) per second, and also of your mass and of your > distance from the axis > (force=mass*(2*pi*rotations_per_second)^2*radius_of_the_earth assuming you > stand on the equator), nothing to do with distance traveled by the planet, and > it is not centripetal (going towards the center) but centrifugal (think of > fugitive = going away from the center), if it was centripetal it would not > subtract from but add to actual weight, which is the actual centripetal force. > > Michel > > - Original Message - > From: "thomas malloy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: > Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2007 10:02 PM > Subject: [Vo]:centripital force question > > >> I'm subject to weight loss produced by the centripital force produced by >> the earth's rotation, I'm wondering if centripetal force is a function >> of revolutions per time unit, or total distance traveled as the planet >> travels? >> >> >> --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! -- >> http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! --- >> >
[Vo]:Re: Secret Exchanges - was: Lithium titanate battery
corrections and addenda: H2OD2O Temp max density (°C) 4.0 11.6 Viscosity (at 20°C ) 1.005 1.25 had them reversed, and: Coors discovered an ice filtration method for beer which provides the other missing ingredient. Without a good supply of Molson's, most of this 'secret' info would be water under a bridge... so to speak. Maybe that is where it should have remained. Time will tell. Coincidentally, Coors and Molsons are now one: http://www.molsoncoors.com/ BTW I gave up beer many years ago, as well as most other immoderate habits - but can hardly mention a cold Molsons today without fond filtered remembrances of an old friend
Re: [Vo]:Secret Exchanges - was: Lithium titanate battery
The one missing item from most such tables is this factoid Comparison of an interesting but largely neglected physical property which can be exploited in enriching heavy water: H2OD2O melting point 0 C 3.84 C compare that spread with the most used separation properties: boiling point 100 C 101.41 C density 1.01.106 Geeze Loise !!! How could the yanks have missed this! OK found this additional item: Temp max density (°C) 4.0 11.6 Viscosity (at 20°C ) 1.25 1.005 ... which offers yet another plausible separation factor to use in a combined enrichment scheme. The idea is that in the future, when wealth is shared to a degree that terrorism is no longer a threat - heavy water will be used, and 'home-made' by individuals who can in theory make it and their own energy from it - if they live near a large body of water. SIDE NOTE: betcha didn't know this: Heavy water is 10+% more dense than ordinary water, a difference which is nearly impossible to notice in a sample which otherwise looks and tastes exactly like normal water. But do not taste it. One of the few ways to demonstrate heavy water's different properties without equipment is to freeze and drop a cube into normal water. Normal ice floats, but ice made from heavy water sinks in normal water! Coors discovered an ice filtration method for beer which provides the other missing ingredient. Jones
[Vo]:Secret Exchanges - was: Lithium titanate battery
Horace Heffner wrote: You are maybe thinking of the term "exchange reaction", e.g.: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen-deuterium_exchange Yes, thanks. The H-D is a version of the more general chemical exchange reaction. I am not sure how many elements have isotopes which can be enriched this way. There are several including lithium, carbon, oxygen, nitrogen, and so on. Urey developed the N(15) method. Perhaps there is a threshold level of mass difference which must exist as the covalent bond strength does not seem to matter much. Here is a patent on enrichment of carbon(12) and (13) which is said to have been widely used. Supposedly, it took the Russians years to figure out why our graphite reactors worked so much better than theirs. http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4406870.html I cannot find a patent for oxygen, but it would not surprise me if there was one. The Canadians had a number of trade secrets for H-D that they did not patent at all! Jones BTW - I was planning a separate post on a few 'anecdotal' Candu trade secrets which I have recorded from an old fried, now departed. My notes are riddled with inconsistencies, however. The most amazing purported secret - for enriching heavy water is so obvious, it defies imagination that others have not realized that in the Canadian winters, COLDNESS is not only cheap but highly effective. Here are some known "Representative Separation Factors" for important nuclear isotopes. H/DC-12/13U-235/238 Chemical Exchange 1.2-3 1.02 1.0015 Distillation 1.05-1.6 1.01 nil Gaseous Diffusion 1.2 1.03 1.00429 Centrifuge (250 m/sec) 1.011.01 1.026 Centrifuge (600 m/sec) 1.233 Electrolysis7 The total number of stages in a cascade is given by: Ln[R[N_p]/R[N_w]]/Ln[s] - 1 where N_p and N_w are the isotope concentrations in the feed and waste, s is the separation factor, and R[N] = N/(1 - N). This is from Sublette's excellent site. The one missing item from most such tables is this factoid Comparison of an interesting but largely neglected physical property which can be exploited in enriching heavy water: H2OD2O melting point 0 C 3.84 C compare that spread with the most used separation properties: boiling point 100 C 101.41 C density1.0001.106 Geeze Loise !!! How could the yanks have missed this! Do you see it ?? Think "cold filtered" ;-) HDO freezes at closer to 0 than to 3.8 but accurate temperature control is s easy and cheap from September to March around the Great Lakes! ...once HDO becomes a significant fraction, heavy water will naturally become more prevalent in the mix as water molecules trade hydrogen atoms frequently. The three have different magnetic properties to boot, which are used in conjunction with cold and chemicals. To produce heavy water by distillation or electrolysis requires a large cascade and consumes vast amounts of power, so chemical methods are preferred - even with free waste heat - but the Canadians (reportedly) developed a "trade secret" magnetic/chemical/freezing method, extremely cheap, which uses the higher melting point in combination with other factors - for at least many levels of enrichment, but I'm not sure which levels. I suspect that the Candu actual cost for heavy water was pennies on the dollar - over what was the "official line" and the sales price. Good for them. It probably kept the Arabs away from heavy water manufacture for years, and even now, the Iranians probably use the expensive method. Jones
[Vo]:TEST OF GRAVIMAGNETISM VS GR
The position in my paper is that virtual photons can not carry gravimagnetic charge. Therefore, electric fields, i.e. near field effects, are readily transmitted from a black hole, and readily transmitted two ways across the event horizon. This means that black holes can exhibit charge. This is not of any practical consequence except maybe when the size of the black hole is very small, as for those generated in the Large Hadron Collider. Large black holes will quickly neutralize any large net charge by creation of charge from the vacuum or by attraction of charged particles from space. What is really important here about the virtual photon's lack of gravitational charge is that black holes can exhibit magnetic fields. This would be utterly impossible if either (a) GR effects are due to space warping or (2) virtual photons carried gravitational mass. This, then, provides a means of comparing gravimagnetic theory to that of GR. It should be possible, through spectral analysis, to see if polar jets from and near black holes are in a strong magnetic field, one too strong to be accounted for using accretion mass. Such a test should thus be made using a black hole with minimal accretion. It is notable that no polar jets should be present at all (under GR) if there is no accretion disk. The presence of polar jets without an accretion disk also eliminates GR as a possibility, because there is no feasible source for the polar jet matter. Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:Re: Lithium titanate battery
A high electron density can be achieved using either a high voltage or by use of sharp points. Maybe achieving CF is a simple as raising D fugacity to the point of forcing D atoms to the surface of a highly negatively charged needle point. This then opens the possibility of surface or space fusion, and thus the elimination of the ash disposal problem. Hmmm... this is starting to sound like Claytor's negative wire thing. He simply loads the wire from the vacuum side in gas mode. The electron fugacity idea provides a reason and a means to really soup up Claytor's approach. Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:Re: Lithium titanate battery
On Jul 19, 2007, at 11:47 AM, Jones Beene wrote: > The higher mass would make diffusion of the O18 slower than O16, so it would take longer to diffuse to and accumulate near the anode. Whoops, the oxygen doesn't move in such batteries? It's stuck in the polyethylene oxide? Not really. Anytime there is mass exchange at the molecular level like this, the isotopes interchange as if there was magically no chemical bond at all! This is demonstrated in any number of reactions where isotopes can be traced. There is a term for it, which I cannot recall at the moment. If time permits, I will supply some references later today. You are maybe thinking of the term "exchange reaction", e.g.: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen-deuterium_exchange I would expect such a reaction to be due to mutual tunneling, because in such a mutual exchange not much happens to the overall molecular energy, thus it is feasible. One problem with this hydrogen nucleus "exchange" tunneling notion in my head is that the nuclei have to be in fairly close proximity to tunnel. The main proton conduction means in water electrolytes is tunneling to/from H2O+ hydronium ions. To perpetuate the chain of tunneling in the electrolyte to make conduction, the hydronium ion has to rotate 180 degrees in each transfer in order to make the tunneling distance feasible. If two nuclei can exchange places then it seems a bit strange they can't also fuse - except that one nucleus tunneling to the other's location is *not* a favorable reaction due to the charge void left behind, and the charge excess momentarily created at the joint nucleus location. Interesting! The key to cold fusion is clearly making the tunneling of D or D and T to a mutual fusion site energetically neutral, or even favorable. However, and this is amazing, it merely needs to be as neutral or favorable as an ordinary exchange reaction. I guess we kind of knew that though. That's why electron catalysis works so well. The key is achieving the high deuterium density, the high fugacity, and then providing energetically feasible tunneling possibilities. A high mass negative particle provides just such a condition, but those are both fleeting in existence and energetically costly. Maybe another condition works as well, one involving a three way tunneling of two positive charges and one negative, if some way is found to make that likely. One way I can think of to attempt that is to raise a D2 loaded electrode to a very high negative voltage, possibly a few million volts. The fusion reactions would not be due to kinetics, but rather due to catalysis by the excess highly "pressurized" electrons at the surface. The surface of the loaded electrode would then have simultaneously two kinds of fugacity - electron and nuclear. The problem then might simply be feeding the nuclei to the electrode surface slow enough so as to maintain vacuum insulation of the electrode surface. This might be achieved using a surface coating on the electrode to slow hydrogen diffusion. The HV electrode can be loaded with D2 continually, possibly using electrolysis, from the "back" side. He4, He3, and T removal might be a problem to engineer through regarding the surface coating. Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:Re: Lithium titanate battery
On Jul 19, 2007, at 11:47 AM, Jones Beene wrote: > The higher mass would make diffusion of the O18 slower than O16, so it would take longer to diffuse to and accumulate near the anode. Whoops, the oxygen doesn't move in such batteries? It's stuck in the polyethylene oxide? Not really. Anytime there is mass exchange at the molecular level like this, the isotopes interchange as if there was magically no chemical bond at all! This is demonstrated in any number of reactions where isotopes can be traced. There is a term for it, which I cannot recall at the moment. If time permits, I will supply some references later today. You are maybe thinking of the term "exchange reaction", e.g.: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen-deuterium_exchange I would expect such a reaction to be due to mutual tunneling, because in such a mutual exchange not much happens to the overall molecular energy, thus it is feasible. One problem with this hydrogen nucleus tunneling notion in my head is that the nuclei have to be in fairly close proximity to tunnel. The main proton conduction means in water electrolytes if tunneling to/from H2O+ hydronium ions. To perpetuate the chain of tunneling in the electrolyte to make conduction, the hydronium ion has to rotate 180 degrees in each transfer in order to make the tunneling distance feasible. If two nuclei can exchange then it seems a bit strange they can't also fuse - except that one nucleus tunneling to the other's location is *not* a favorable reaction due to the charge void left behind, and the charge excess momentarily created at the joint nucleus location. Interesting! The key to cold fusion is clearly making the tunneling of D or D and T to a mutual fusion site energetically neutral, or even favorable. I guess we knew that though. That's why electron catalysis works so well. The key is achieving the high deuterium density, the high fugacity, and then providing energetically feasible tunneling possibilities. A high mass negative particle provides just such a condition, but those are both fleeting in existence and energetically costly. Maybe another condition works as well, one involving a three way tunneling of two positive charges and one negative, if some way is found to make that likely. One way I can think of to attempt that is to raise a D2 loaded electrode to a very high negative voltage, possibly a few million volts. The fusion reactions would not be due to kinetics, but rather due to catalysis by the excess highly "pressurized" electrons at the surface. Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
[Vo]:Re: Lithium titanate battery
Horace, I don't recall the mechanism you have suggested for CF extracting energy from O18 interactions. Good reason for that, as there is nothing firm or even gelled, which has been vetted to any degree. Some thoughts have been tossed out about very slow neutrons coming from the distorted nucleus - which would be a metastable variety of 18O (the posting called Newton's Cradle and Nuclear Sausage) which hypothesis gathered many yawns (which may be a good thing). But there are too many loose ends there to even proceed until more data is available. It just occurred to me that O has little interaction at the cathode, and none inside the cathode. Wouldn't O18 interactions take place at an anode? Mitchell Swartz indicated to me, and I hope my memory of this is not in error - but he said that in the photo-enhanced version of his Phusor - in the paper he presented in Boston, that the reaction seems to occur outside the metal altogether. I should check that detail, as maybe I got it wrong, and it could turn out to be important. If O18 is involved in energy release in CF, then maybe it is involved in energy release in polyethylene oxide (PEO) electrolyte batteries. Yes - good point. > The higher mass would make diffusion of the O18 slower than O16, so it would take longer to diffuse to and accumulate near the anode. Whoops, the oxygen doesn't move in such batteries? It's stuck in the polyethylene oxide? Not really. Anytime there is mass exchange at the molecular level like this, the isotopes interchange as if there was magically no chemical bond at all! This is demonstrated in any number of reactions where isotopes can be traced. There is a term for it, which I cannot recall at the moment. If time permits, I will supply some references later today. Jones
Re: [Vo]:Requesting comments to this comment
Steven Krivit quoted an anonymous source: The ERAB council "proved" that cold fusion isn't DD fusion. I should know better than to comment on theory, but as far as I know, cold fusion is DD fusion. It produces helium at the ratio to heat as plasma DD fusion does, so what else could it be? I expect there is a continuum from cold fusion to plasma fusion, and the two are fundamentally the same. My late friend Chris Tinsley used to say that plasma fusion and cold fusion are analogous to an open flame and metabolism. Both are oxidation, and both have the same starting and ending products. 18th and early 19th century scientists must have found it difficult to believe they were the same phenomenon. Chris used to image someone from 1780 protesting: "How can they be the same? Are you saying there is a flame inside the body!" Regarding ERAB, I have read the report and I do not think it proves anything. By the way, I now have a complete copy of the report at LENR-CANR, which includes my own snide editorial remarks at the beginning. See: http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/ERABreportofth.pdf - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Re: [Vo] Lithium titanate battery
On Jul 19, 2007, at 6:13 AM, Jones Beene wrote: Michel Jullian wrote: The differences with traditional Li Ion are outlined here: http://www.altairnano.com/documents/NanoSafeBackgrounder060920.pdf As a side note: The cross connection between Li ion anomalous overheating of batteries, and LENR has been been mentioned here on a number of occasions. Overheating is often resulting in catastrophic failures in laptop computers, which problem has been going on now for two decades -- and this despite millions of dollars of high-tech engineering from the very best companies, like Sony, Toshiba, IBM, etc. [snip] Jones, my memory is not very good. I don't recall the mechanism you have suggested for CF extracting energy from O18 interactions. It just occurred to me that O has little interaction at the cathode, and none inside the cathode. Wouldn't O18 interactions take place at an anode? If O18 is involved in energy release in CF, then maybe it is involved in energy release in polyethylene oxide (PEO) electrolyte batteries. The higher mass would make diffusion of the O18 slower than O16, so it would take longer to diffuse to and accumulate near the anode. Whoops, the oxygen doesn't move in such batteries? It's stuck in the polyethylene oxide? Hmmm... I wonder what the anode reaction is then. I'm utterly confused - but it still seems worth posting because O18 might play some role in all this. It will be interesting to see if the lithium titanate battery continues to have some heating problems despite replacement of the cathode. Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
[Vo]:Requesting comments to this comment
Someone (who wishes to be anon) wrote the following to me recently. I'm interested in the thoughts and comments in response to it from Vortexians: -Steve The ERAB council "proved" that cold fusion isn't DD fusion. The point is, "So what?", there are a zillion nuclear reaction paths that are exothermic, other than DD (well, there are a large number and basically every path that takes a neutron from a deuteron and gives it to any other atom is exothermic...including by the way, if it goes to a heavy nucleus above iron, that is also exothermic, something many people don't realize given that we are told that fusion above iron is endothermic...iron plus iron is endothermic, but iron plus a neutron is exothermic in the Fe (d,p) Fe +1 reaction path. I have had nuclear fusion scientists be confused by this one until they thought about it for a while. So, proving that cold fusion wasn't DD fusion was a trivial and silly accomplishment. It absolutely didn't prove that cold fusion wasn't nuclear. And, IMO, cold fusion is neither cold nor low energy...it is some sort of blazing hot high energy nuclear reaction path just like every other nuclear reaction.
Re: [Vo]:How To Access Usenet -was: Gravimagnetics & thought police
On Jul 19, 2007, at 7:19 AM, Mark S Bilk wrote: On Wed, Jul 18, 2007 at 12:51:54PM -0800, Horace Heffner wrote: Thank you very much for checking this out. It will probably be a bit embarassing to folks like me who kept posting the same stuff over and over - when it eventually all comes to the surface. You're very welcome! You may be able to delete the extra posts. Usenet has a "cancel" mechanism for doing that. [snip wonderfully useful information (to me anyway)] I just posted a response to you not having read this post. This is really great stuff. Thanks again. Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:Re: Gravimagnetics & thought police
Ah, I think I finally understand what you are saying. Google groups runs it's own usenet server(s). The problem is thus indeed *all* with google. Looks like google ran out of disk space for their usenet server. That phone number should come in handy in the future. On Jul 18, 2007, at 9:43 AM, Mark S Bilk wrote: The Google Groups website was not getting updated. The last posts in talk.politics.misc and comp.os.linux.advocacy, both high-volume newsgroups, were dated about 7am 7/17 -- yesterday. The last post showing in sci.astro was dated 5:28am yesterday. The last post in the Gravimagnetics thread is yours from 5:26am yesterday. This happens every couple of months. I finally got through to a phone operator, who wouldn't tell anyone that Groups has not been updated for 27 hours. Of course she treated it as my problem and said they don't give phone support. She told me to go to Groups Support on the website, and it turns out that the only way to tell them about anything is to post a message in one of the support groups, which of course doesn't work. I told the operator over and over again that it's a recurring problem with Google that they need to fix, and that I'm a computer engineer and I didn't need any personal help. She finally said she would tell someone, but I don't know if that was just to get rid of me. But in any case, I think someone has fixed it. The latest articles in those three newsgroups are now from about 7:40am yesterday. It will take many hours for the system to catch up and show recent posts. Google's phone number is 650-623-4000. Mark Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:Mr. Lowrance's choice of words: "You people..."
OrionWorks wrote: [snip] You have called the Vortex participants "You people...", that we "...can't get past [our] emotions," that we "...continue to kill each other..." Thanks for pointing that out. To be more accurate, this statement "can't get past emotions" is referring to present tense. Sorry for the lack of clarity. There is great potential in all people, which is why I also wrote, "One day you will awaken and see your true self." My post was by no means directed toward any individual. The word "you" is used as in the plural sense, and it's directed toward nearly 7 billion people. "You people..." Really? Indeed, that's based on a great deal of my unbiased research in analyzing thousands people in detail. I'm still searching for that one person who exhibits a true mental state over emotional dominance over 90% of their waking life. Such people are out their, somewhere. Unfortunately I've *yet* to meet such a person.
[Vo]:Mr. Lowrance's choice of words: "You people..."
To Paul Lowrance: The following personal comment is strictly OT. I can well imagine that many on this list will chose to bypass the thread. Can't say I blame'em. Regarding some revealing comments you recently made: You people can't get past your emotions, which passively dominate your consciousness. You continue to kill each other, cycle after cycle, and time after time you find what I refer to as fuzzy logic to justify your actions, referring to such wars as defense or preemptive strike. Please wake up! FWIW, I do my best to face my emotions every single day of the week, twenty-four hours a day. On the good days I can observe them as they pass across my awareness, some good some bad. I do my best to recognize them for what they are, the enjoyable alongside the not-so-enjoyable. On the not-so-good days, I can get lost in my emotions, the unpleasant ones, especially the ones that for some ignorant reason I've judged to be incorrect, to be bad. Fortunately, I seem to be getting better at recognizing this folly. Slowly I'm beginning to realize that emotions are what they are: Emotions. They certainly aren't to be feared, compartmentalized, or demonized. You have called the Vortex participants "You people...", that we "...can't get past [our] emotions," that we "...continue to kill each other..." "You people..." Really? I strongly urge you take assessment of the strong prejudice, the thin veil of bigotry packed in those two simple little words. Do not kid yourself, Paul. Your recent posting behavior suggests to me that you are not being governed by the principals of truth and logic that you have been preaching to all those "You people..." * * * PS: To R. Macaulay, I hope I can find my way to the Dime Box saloon some fateful day. I'll leave my sawed off at the sheriff's office. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com
[Vo]:Strangeness with cold water
Since water has a negative thermal expansion coefficient in the region from 0-4 degrees Celsius one can wonder what happens if water in these conditions is compressed. Will it cool down? Where is the internal energy going? This is contrary to common understanding of physics. David
Re: [Vo]:VORTEX MODERATOR: P. Lowrance use of personal attacks
Suggestion, Peace among friends. We need each other. Steel sharpens steel. A little practice with self discipline gains. Paul, don't leave the group. Your input is respected. Just remember the bartender at the Dime Box saloon keeps a sawed off shotgun under the bar for the unruly. Busting a sawed off across the head can surely curdle the milk of human kindness. Dont risk it. Richard
Re: [Vo]:Re: [Vo] Lithium titanate battery
Jones wrote.. Too bad that some inventive researcher from Mitsubishi - where LENR has been investigated, seen and announced - does not avail himself of all the recalled Sony lithium batteries (for pennies on the dollar) and run them to failure using CR-39 film to detect the radiation. My bet is that there will be ample radiation to be found at failure. Stand clear - molten lithium is nasty stuff. Howdy Jones, Proves the value of this group. Thinking !!. Ideas pop up in this group. The question becomes.. how to transmit ideas on to people in such a way to stimulate their interest and action. Surely Mitsubishi has conceived of the idea of testing for radiation... OR.. have they? Richard
[Vo]:How To Access Usenet -was: Gravimagnetics & thought police
On Wed, Jul 18, 2007 at 12:51:54PM -0800, Horace Heffner wrote: >Thank you very much for checking this out. It will probably be a bit >embarassing to folks like me who kept posting the same stuff over and >over - when it eventually all comes to the surface. You're very welcome! You may be able to delete the extra posts. Usenet has a "cancel" mechanism for doing that. When the posts finally show up, you can see if there's a way to cancel them from the Google Groups web interface. Currently Google is running about 16 hours behind, down from about 27 hours yesterday, so it's catching up. You can measure Google's delay like this: 1. Go to a high-volume newsgroup like talk.politics.misc . 2. Hit the reload button on your browser. 3. Click on the top thread in the display, which is the one in the newsgroup to which an article has been added most recently. 4. When the thread's page comes up, click on "Sort by date" in the article index on the left. 5. Scroll down to the very bottom of the article index. 6. Click on the bottom (most recent) article in the index. 7. When that article comes up (you may have to scroll down in the article display to see it), look at its date/time. 8. Subtract that from the current date/time to get the delay. Google's web interface has a problem in that the righthand 25% or so of the article display page is taken up by ads. A blocker like Adblock Plus with Filterset.G for Firefox removes the ads but doesn't recover the space. Greasemonkey (another Firefox extension) should be able to remove the righthand pane and extend the center pane to make it easier to read wide articles, and to use a larger font size. Greasemonkey runs Javascript programs of your choosing on web pages coming in from whatever sites you select, so you can systematically modify those pages any way you want before your browser displays them. Someone may already have written the Javascript to fix the Google article interface. http://www.nivi.com/blog/article/greasemonkey-and-business-models http://www.greasespot.net/ http://userscripts.org/ >Say, it just occurred to me, aren't the sci groups on servers that >google doesn't own? In other words doesn't google just provide an >interface to the usenet servers? Absolutely! Usenet newsgroups are on many servers around the world, and are unaffected by delays in Google Groups. You can buy access to Usenet for about $8/month for 20 GB of download (which should suffice unless you want to pull down a lot of music or videos), or you may have 1 GB/month or so of access for free from your ISP. Here are some Usenet providers: NewsgroupDirect - $20/15/8 unl/60/20G - 70 days Thundernews $20/15 unl/60G - 70days EasyNews $10/20G 30 day Giganews $25/13 unl/25G - 70 days Ngroups.NET - $15/mo unl, 71 dy, global binary search UsenetHost.com $25/10 unl/10G 23dy The parameters (collected about a year ago) are dollars per month, download limit in gigabytes per month for each payment level (unl means unlimited), and days retention time. These sites retain articles for only a few months at the most, unlike Google, which keeps them forever, and provides a very good search facility for all of them. But Google doesn't have any binary file Usenet articles (music, movies, etc.) at all. When I have time and disk space for binaries, I subscribe to Ngroups.net; they are quite reliable and responsive. I just use Google for text articles. For reading text articles from a Usenet provider, you'll need a newsreader program. Pan runs on Linux, Mac, and MS-Windows: http://pan.rebelbase.com/ http://pan.rebelbase.com/download/ http://pdb.finkproject.org/pdb/package.php/pan If you do want to download binaries, another company, Newzbin, will create an "NZB file" for you containing the message-IDs of all the Usenet articles that comprise any binary (or set of binaries, e.g., an album of songs) that you choose from Newzbin's excellent listings (which can be searched in a variety of ways). You download the NZB file with your browser while viewing Newzbin's website. Newzbin costs $2/month and is well worth it. http://v3.newzbin.com/ http://docs.newzbin.com/index.php/Newzbin_Documentation:FAQ http://v3.newzbin.com/account/signup/ http://docs.newzbin.com/index.php/Newzbin:Premium_Membership http://docs.newzbin.com/index.php/Newzbin:Payment_FAQ You'll also need an NZB-capable download program like hellanzb (a free Python program -- you'll need a Python interpreter), which runs under Linux and BSD Unix, and the Darwin system on Mac OSX. If you're using MS-Windows, you'll have to find some other NZB downloader, but if you're using MS-Windows, you have much worse problems than that! Ah, apparently Pan can utilize NZB files, and also act as a downloader without a graphic interface. http://www.hellanzb.com/trac/ http://www.hellanzb.com/distfiles/ http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/pan-users/2006-03/msg00030.html http://cos
Re: [Vo]:VORTEX MODERATOR: P. Lowrance use of personal attacks
I was defending an individual, Dr. Mike. Horace should not publicly post an individuals email address on a list without permission. He should have sent the email address in private to the person requesting the email. Instead, Horace argued and argued about the topic knowing full well he was wrong. Spammers subscribe to a great deal of lists for the purpose of collecting emails. That's correct. They receive the exact unfiltered Vortex-l emails you receive. We don't know if Dr. Mike is subscribed to Vo. It appears he's not subscribed, but the point is we should first ask Dr. Mike for permission. Better yet, just send Dr. Mikes email in private to the person who requested it. Spammers prey on the ignorance of people such as Horace. I would be more than happy to be a martyr and get band for the sake of Dr. Mike! :-) I'll debate you or anyone on your claim that I'm a dick or whatever else you feel. Sorry, I can only live by truth and logic, and if it infuriates people that I'm blunt and the fact they cannot strike emotions in me then that's an issue they need to deal with. Hey folks, this may be my last post, LOL. As they say, all good things *must* eventually come to an end. If so, then it's been great keeping you all on your toes. Allow your mind to govern your emotions! Unconditional love is not an emotion, but often such emotions along with physical tears is a side effect. Unconditional love is a Soul quality. Never give up hope! Please, consider spending a few days analyzing and logging your every occurring thought, emotion, and action in extreme detail. One day you will awaken and see your true self. To Truth & Logic!!! :-))) Kind Regards, Paul Lowrance William Beaty wrote: Anyone can fall into uncivil behavior during a heated debate. A civilized person catches most of their own misbehavior and apologizes to those they've insulted. But anyone who uses repeated and unapologetic personal attacks is a different problem, and I will remove such people from this forum. Wikipedia: DON'T BE A DICK http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Don%27t_be_a_dick
[Vo]:Re: [Vo] Lithium titanate battery
Michel Jullian wrote: The differences with traditional Li Ion are outlined here: http://www.altairnano.com/documents/NanoSafeBackgrounder060920.pdf As a side note: The cross connection between Li ion anomalous overheating of batteries, and LENR has been been mentioned here on a number of occasions. Overheating is often resulting in catastrophic failures in laptop computers, which problem has been going on now for two decades -- and this despite millions of dollars of high-tech engineering from the very best companies, like Sony, Toshiba, IBM, etc. Obviously they do not believe in LENR, nor the hydrino - so they have not even investigated the cross-connection. One detail which may have escaped notice is this report from two of Michel's countrymen: Jean-Paul Biberian and Georges Lonchampt DEUTERIUM GAS LOADING OF PALLADIUM USING A SOLID STATE ELECTROLYTE The 9th International Conference on Cold Fusion. 2002. Beijing, China: http://www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/BiberianJPdeuteriumg.pdf In which the solid state electrolyte which is being used is polyethylene oxide (PEO) containing deuteriated phosphoric acid. It is a deuteron conductor. The authors then state without much fanfare: "This electrolyte is *used in lithium batteries,* and operate between 70 °C and 120 °C." One assumes that the PEO in batteries is not initially deuterated over natural water (one part in 6000) - but, even so, one hypothetical reason for the consistent failures in these batteries *after extended usage* can be surmised: The PEO could itself be effectively enriching and concentrating the natural deuterium found in the acids being used in these batteries, up to a higher level. (or else the reaction does not demand deuterons) OK - Here is the problem with that assessment - Biberian et al. developed the technique for loading and measuring deuterium in palladium. In this report, however, they have not observed excess heat. "However in previous experiments with a less accurate calorimeter we have observed temperature anomalies that we wish to confirm with this new system. This was in 2002. I have not seen an update. Perhaps in both this experiment and in lithium batteries the heat anomaly does not appear until there has been an extended period of build up time - or perhaps there is a hydrino reaction, which is stimulated by the PEO - actually that would be expected from some of Mills' data - due to the presence of oxygen radicals. Hydrino reactions do not need or benefit from Pd anyway. Too bad that some inventive researcher from Mitsubishi - where LENR has been investigated, seen and announced - does not avail himself of all the recalled Sony lithium batteries (for pennies on the dollar) and run them to failure using CR-39 film to detect the radiation. My bet is that there will be ample radiation to be found at failure. Stand clear - molten lithium is nasty stuff. Jones PS It should be noted that the fact that we are seeing this overlap between batteries - and LENR cells - also portends one way in which the excess energy may some day be used.
Re: [Vo]:Banned from Steorn
thomas malloy wrote: Horace Heffner wrote: On Jul 17, 2007, at 3:54 PM, Paul Lowrance wrote: Horace Heffner wrote: > I think you missed my point. If you don't want something public then > don't make it so yourself. Actually it appears you did miss something. If you are so concerned and you want your address protected from web crawlers then you should post them on your web site in a cryptic form, not out in the clear as you have on you web page. You can add obvious spaces for example. Getting Spam is a necessary evil of accessibility. My ISP has a Spam filter, which works quite well. I get about 200 per day. I know this because I have to look it over, One day I found a message from a talk show host, on another Cyril Chuckanov. I hear that all the time from friends, family, people on the Internet. My poor aunt gets a lot more. Perhaps just lucky, but after being online since the mid 1990's still I only get about a few dozen spams per day. Maybe they don't like me, LOL.
[Vo]:Galaxy Zoo
I just had an introduction to Galaxy Zoo, a cooperative effort similar to CETI online. It is fun. http://galaxyzoo.org/ This is a chance to see some anomalies first, and first hand, so to speak. I am amazed at the large number of black "satellite tracks" that show up in the photos. I would have thought they would be lit up (some are), not black. The other odd thing is I've seen black tracks that are dashed lines - i.e with blank spaces between the dashes. How does *that* happen!? One photo was Galaxy ref 588017705073639478, but I don't know how to retrieve that photo. Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:VORTEX MODERATOR: P. Lowrance use of personal attacks
Does this mean he's gone? LOL! (not really, just couldn't resist it...).
[Vo]:VORTEX MODERATOR: P. Lowrance use of personal attacks
Anyone can fall into uncivil behavior during a heated debate. A civilized person catches most of their own misbehavior and apologizes to those they've insulted. But anyone who uses repeated and unapologetic personal attacks is a different problem, and I will remove such people from this forum. Wikipedia: DON'T BE A DICK http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Don%27t_be_a_dick (( ( ( ( ((O)) ) ) ) ))) William J. BeatySCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb at amasci com http://amasci.com EE/programmer/sci-exhibits amateur science, hobby projects, sci fair Seattle, WA 425-222-5066unusual phenomena, tesla coils, weird sci
[Vo]:Re: Lithium titanate battery (was Re: Cheap solar a couple years away?)
If I understand correctly they are a new breed of Li ion, with titanate nanoparticles instead of graphite as the negative electrode. The differences with traditional Li Ion are outlined here: http://www.altairnano.com/documents/NanoSafeBackgrounder060920.pdf Michel - Original Message - From: "thomas malloy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2007 8:26 AM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Lithium titanate battery (was Re: Cheap solar a couple years away?) > Michel Jullian wrote: > >>More on these miracle batteries: >> >>Quote: >> >>"Power comes from 900 pounds of Altair NanoSafe lithium titanate batteries. >>Vehicle integration and testing are by Boshart Engineering. >> >> > I this the same thing as a Li ion battery? > > > --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! -- > http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! --- >
