Re: Strange behaviour of my macbook

[Ronni Brown]

> On 25 Jan 2019, at 10:25 am, Rosemary Spark  wrote:
> 
> Hi there,
> I've paid my dues for 2019 today...better late than never!
> 
> For some time my macbook has been behaving weirdly. All of these behaviours 
> together...or one at a time!
> 
> 1) it shuts down for no reason
> 2) it asks to sign into icloud (when already signed in) Then sends messages 
> to my iphone and ipad saying a new device has been connected
> 3) it comes up with a series of boxes saying xxx has to connect to login 
> keychain. I have to enter my login password into these over and over again.
> 
> MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2017, Four Thunderbolt 3 Ports) Mojave 10.14.2
> 
> Cheers
> Rosemary
> 
> Rosemary Spark
> PO Box 781
> South Fremantle WA 6162 Australia
> Phone: + 61 ‭8 6397 6822‬
> Mobile: 0414268043

Hello Rosemary,

What troubleshooting have you tried so far?
Have you done a SMC & PRAM reset? 
Does it happen in Safe Mode?
Does Apple Diagnostic find anything?
Have you run EtreCheckPro.app? You have had Adware before… and you run some 
third party software.
https://etrecheck.com/maspro 
EtreCheckPro 


Follow these instructions for resetting the PRAM/NVRAM:
Reset NVRAM or PRAM on your Mac - Apple Support 

Follow these instructions for resetting the SMC:
How to reset the System Management Controller (SMC) on your Mac - Apple Support 

*Note* For the SMC, follow the instructions under "How to reset the SMC on Mac 
notebooks", and the sub-section "If the battery is non removable"
--
Using Apple Diagnostics:

Step 1. Shut Down Completely
To begin, you’ll need to make sure your Mac is fully turned off—not simply 
asleep. Turn your computer off completely by clicking the Apple icon in the top 
left of your screen and selecting the Shut Down option.

Step 2. Boot Into Apple Diagnostics
To access Apple Diagnostics, press the power button to boot your Mac and then 
immediately press and hold the D key on your keyboard.
Tip: If you have moved your Recovery Partition to an external drive, make sure 
it is connected before you follow the steps.
Connect to the Internet to allow Apple Diagnostics to offer suggestions.

Step 3. Wait for Testing to Complete
Unlike AHT, Apple Diagnostics does not offer any options—there’s only one 
version of the test and it takes about five minutes to complete.

Step 4. Interpret the Results
Unlike the hideous codes offered by AHT, Apple Diagnostics attempts to make the 
information more useful to normal users.

Once your test has completed, you’ll either see a simple No issues found 
message, or you’ll see a screen with the problems listed. Each problem is 
described in simple terms like 
There may be an issue with the onboard memory, and alongside the message you’ll 
see a code that you can give to Apple Support that will help them identify the 
issue.

Important: Don’t forget to make a note of these error codes before proceeding 
any further!

To help you handle the issue, Apple Diagnostics can take you into Recovery Mode 
if you click Get started; this will restart your computer and bring up Safari 
to direct you to the appropriate Support options.


Cheers,
Ronni

13-inch MacBook Air (April 2014)
1.7GHz Dual-Core Intel Core i7, Turbo Boost to 3.3GHz
8GB 1600MHz LPDDR3 SDRAM
512GB PCIe-based Flash Storage

macOS High Sierra 10.13.6

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Re: Strange behaviour

[Adrian Skehan]

Thanks again Ronni,

I tried your suggestions without success but I tracked the problem down to 
duplicated fonts, having deleted them via the Font Book the problen has gone 
away.


Regards,

Adrian
adrianske...@me.com

On 20/09/2010, at 6:13 PM, Ronda Brown wrote:

 
 
 On 20/09/2010, at 3:59 PM, Adrian Skehan wrote:
 
 
 Good afternoon all,
 
 iMac i7 (27') OS 10.6.4, this problem seems to have started while using 
 Microsoft Office 2008 and I think PowerPoint.  
 
 When any item in the main menu bar is selected  a blank page with the word 
 Characters in the header bar and the little rotating wheel (not the coloured 
 ball) in its centre momentarily appears on the screen, there is a delay of a 
 few seconds before the selected item responds.  If an application (any 
 application) is opened it appease several time in rapid succession before it 
 opens.  Office has been removed with the Office uninstaller but the problem 
 persists.
 
 Does anyone have a clue as to what is causing this please?
 
 Hi Adrian,
 
 I would imagine it's something left over from Microsoft Office 2008 has 
 caused this, but you uninstalled Office 2008 using the Uninstaller?
 
 You could try this:
 Go to ~/Library/Preferences then move the com.apple.systemuiserver.plist file 
 to the Trash.
 
 ~ (Tilde) represents your Home Folder.
 
 Restart your iMac.
 
 If that doesn't solve it:
 
 Try booting in Safe Mode:
 
 1.  Be sure the computer is shut down.
 2.  Press the power button.
 3.  Immediately after you hear the startup tone, press and hold the Shift 
 key. 
 Tip: The Shift key should be held as soon as possible after the startup tone 
 but not before.
 4.  Release the Shift key when you see the gray Apple and progress indicator 
 (looks like a spinning gear).
 
 You will see Safe Boot on the login window.
 5. Then login and wait till everything is loaded, then select restart from 
 Apple (at top left corner) drop-down menu.
 
 
 Cheers,
 Ronni
 
 17 MacBook Pro  Intel Core i7
 2.66GHz / 4GB / 1067 MHz DDR3 / 500GB Serial ATA Drive @ 7200rpm
 
 OS X 10.6.3 Snow Leopard
 Windows 7 Ultimate (under sufferance)
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: Strange behaviour

[Ronda Brown]

On 20/09/2010, at 3:59 PM, Adrian Skehan wrote:

 
 Good afternoon all,
 
 iMac i7 (27') OS 10.6.4, this problem seems to have started while using 
 Microsoft Office 2008 and I think PowerPoint.  
 
 When any item in the main menu bar is selected  a blank page with the word 
 Characters in the header bar and the little rotating wheel (not the coloured 
 ball) in its centre momentarily appears on the screen, there is a delay of a 
 few seconds before the selected item responds.  If an application (any 
 application) is opened it appease several time in rapid succession before it 
 opens.  Office has been removed with the Office uninstaller but the problem 
 persists.
 
 Does anyone have a clue as to what is causing this please?

Hi Adrian,

I would imagine it's something left over from Microsoft Office 2008 has caused 
this, but you uninstalled Office 2008 using the Uninstaller?

You could try this:
Go to ~/Library/Preferences then move the com.apple.systemuiserver.plist file 
to the Trash.

~ (Tilde) represents your Home Folder.

Restart your iMac.

If that doesn't solve it:

Try booting in Safe Mode:

1.  Be sure the computer is shut down.
2.  Press the power button.
3.  Immediately after you hear the startup tone, press and hold the Shift key. 
Tip: The Shift key should be held as soon as possible after the startup tone 
but not before.
4.  Release the Shift key when you see the gray Apple and progress indicator 
(looks like a spinning gear).

You will see Safe Boot on the login window.
5. Then login and wait till everything is loaded, then select restart from 
Apple (at top left corner) drop-down menu.


Cheers,
Ronni

17 MacBook Pro  Intel Core i7
2.66GHz / 4GB / 1067 MHz DDR3 / 500GB Serial ATA Drive @ 7200rpm

OS X 10.6.3 Snow Leopard
Windows 7 Ultimate (under sufferance)







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Re: Strange behaviour

[Ian Reid]

On 3 Apr 2009, at 11:05 AM, Ronda Brown wrote:

Hello Ian,

You have not replied to the below message I sent on 30th. March.
Would you please reply so we know your problem is sorted (or not).

Cheers,
Ronni

Hi Ronni

The answers to your specific questions and a summary of recent  
activity are below.



On 30/03/2009, at 7:02 AM, Ronda Brown wrote:


On 29/03/2009, at 9:54 PM, Ian Reid wrote:





3. Did you try Quit Mail, navigate to ~/Library/Mail and drag the
file Envelope Index to the Trash. When you launch Mail again, it'll
tell you that you need to reimport all your messages (just as it
when Ian upgraded to Leopard), it will recreate his envelope index
from scratch, but he won't lose any data.?

I can't remember if this was done.


Please do this as soon as possible. I assumed you had already done
this as I suggested this a few days go.
It doesn't actually Import all your messages, it just creates a new
envelope index from scratch.

I want you to do this because your envelope index‹a special database
that Mail uses to keep track of which messages are in which  
mailboxes‹

and the other files that Mail uses to catalogue messages I think has
become severely damaged.

What I call the subsidiary mailboxes are all back, seemingly OK but  
Inbox

and Sent are empty. Inbox is still offline.


Q.	Do you mean all your Mailboxes (under On My Mac) are back and all  
your messages are in them?


A.	The OMM boxes are OK but not all the messages are in them. See  
Recent Activity below.


To see your Inbox  Sent Mailboxes:
Make sure your account is still in Mail. Go to Preferences  Accounts  
 check your Westnet Account details.

(Remove any Account that should NOT be there)
And In preferences - Accounts - Advanced, the box 'enable this  
account' is ticked on your Westnet Account.


Then Rebuild both Inbox  Sent mailboxes please.

A.	Prior to re-establishing accounts with Westnet, both boxes were  
empty. After rebuild, Inbox was still empty. Rebuild was unavailable  
for Sent inbox. Trash was the only one of MAILBOXES that had any  
content and it seemed to be OK.



Done. Incidently, what is the protocol with long threads? Should one  
send
the whole lot back when commenting about only one or two questions  
as I have

done here.


How you answered was fine Ian.

Recent activity:-	 At the beginning of April I managed to re-establish  
both our accounts with Westnet, and all new emails since then have  
landed correctly in the Mailboxes.  Unfortunately I had changed their  
names slightly, unaware at the time that this would preclude recovery  
from Time Machine. I changed the names back to the originals but, for  
Time Machine, that date became the most recent activity on those  
folders.


Mail Copy, made after the problem was clearly present, was still  
available. It didn't contain any MAILBOXES except Trash but the OMM  
data was still available.So I imported the OMM data into the left  
column of the Mail window, opened the mailboxes and dragged the groups  
of emails to their existing equivalents. The empty import boxes were  
trashed.


I was part way through this process when I was called to lunch,  
leaving 1455 emails spread over 8 to 10 (by memory) imported mailboxes  
still in the list.


When I came back from lunch, the remaining imported folder icons had  
lost their blue colour and could no longer be opened. While I was  
floundering around, trying to think of a way to do this, they suddenly  
disappeared and were replaced by three new, blue icons which turned  
out to be sub-folders of Mail Copy.


Back into Mail Copy, I found the individual emails as serial numbers,  
and then as texts, two and three sub-folder levels further down. To  
move them into the existing OMM folders meant handling them  
individually so I decided to leave them where they were for the  
present. And there the matter stands.


Many thanks to all who have offered help with this problem. I have  
learned a lot.



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Re: Strange behaviour

[Ronda Brown]

Hello Ian,

You have not replied to the below message I sent on 30th. March.
Would you please reply so we know your problem is sorted (or not).

Cheers,
Ronni

On 30/03/2009, at 7:02 AM, Ronda Brown wrote:


On 29/03/2009, at 9:54 PM, Ian Reid wrote:





3. Did you try Quit Mail, navigate to ~/Library/Mail and drag the
file Envelope Index to the Trash. When you launch Mail again, it'll
tell you that you need to reimport all your messages (just as it
when Ian upgraded to Leopard), it will recreate his envelope index
from scratch, but he won't lose any data.?

I can't remember if this was done.


Please do this as soon as possible. I assumed you had already done
this as I suggested this a few days go.
It doesn't actually Import all your messages, it just creates a new
envelope index from scratch.

I want you to do this because your envelope index‹a special database
that Mail uses to keep track of which messages are in which  
mailboxes‹

and the other files that Mail uses to catalogue messages I think has
become severely damaged.

What I call the subsidiary mailboxes are all back, seemingly OK but  
Inbox

and Sent are empty. Inbox is still offline.


Do you mean all your Mailboxes (under On My Mac) are back and all your  
messages are in them?


To see your Inbox  Sent Mailboxes:
Make sure your account is still in Mail. Go to Preferences  Accounts  
 check your Westnet Account details.

(Remove any Account that should NOT be there)
And In preferences - Accounts - Advanced, the box 'enable this  
account' is ticked on your Westnet Account.


Then Rebuild both Inbox  Sent mailboxes please.

Done. Incidently, what is the protocol with long threads? Should one  
send
the whole lot back when commenting about only one or two questions  
as I have

done here.


How you answered was fine Ian.

Cheers,
Ronni



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Re: Strange behaviour

[Ian Reid]

Hi Ronni


On 28/3/09 8:14 AM, Ronda Brown ro...@wn.com.au wrote:

 Hi Ian,
 
 On 28/03/2009, at 12:02 AM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Ronda Brown ro...@wn.com.au
 To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
 Sent: Friday, 27 March, 2009 4:27:33 PM GMT +08:00 Beijing /
 Chongqing / Hong Kong / Urumqi
 Subject: Re: Strange behaviour
 
 
 Did you highlight (click once) each of the Mailboxes first before you
 chose MailboxRebuild?
 
 No. I shift-clicked the lot. I have now done them individually but,
 apart from a couple of minor exceptions, there was no evidence of
 movement, starting, running or finishing the actions. So I assume
 they have been rebuilt.
 
 Shift-clicking all the Mailboxes is fine if you only have one account.
 If you don't have a lot of messages in the Mailbox the rebuild is very
 quick. The messages disappear and return quickly in the Message List
 window.
 
 If you have more than one account, the inbox, drafts,  sent will have
 an arrow you need to click it to open  then click on each mailbox 
 then chose MailboxRebuild
 
 Inbox had a small zigzag-like marker which disappeared on clicking
 but there was no marker on 'Sent'. Whenever I click on 'Sent',
 'Rebuild' fades to grey and is unavailable.
 
 That zigzag (squiggle) beside you Inbox meant that the email account
 was Offline (not connected to the mail server).
 
 
 3. Did you try Quit Mail, navigate to ~/Library/Mail and drag the
 file Envelope Index to the Trash. When you launch Mail again, it'll
 tell you that you need to reimport all your messages (just as it
 when Ian upgraded to Leopard), it will recreate his envelope index
 from scratch, but he won't lose any data.?
 
 I can't remember if this was done.
 
 Please do this as soon as possible. I assumed you had already done
 this as I suggested this a few days go.
 It doesn't actually Import all your messages, it just creates a new
 envelope index from scratch.
 
 I want you to do this because your envelope index‹a special database
 that Mail uses to keep track of which messages are in which mailboxes‹
 and the other files that Mail uses to catalogue messages I think has
 become severely damaged.

 What I call the subsidiary mailboxes are all back, seemingly OK but Inbox
and Sent are empty. Inbox is still offline.
 
 Did you run the OS X 10.5.6 Combo Update?
 
 No.
 
 Wouldn't hurt to download and run it.
 
 I'll try it.
 
 It perhaps would be easier for us to follow you, if you replied to the
 message you are actually referring to.
 
 My apologies for trying to answer two emails with one. I'll do it
 correctly in future, starting with this one.
 
 No apologies necessary Ian, it just gets a bit hard to follow a thread
 especially when it lasts for a few days with lots of messages.
 
 Please do number 3. and let us know how you get on.

Done. Incidently, what is the protocol with long threads? Should one send
the whole lot back when commenting about only one or two questions as I have
done here. 

Regards

Ian 
 Cheers,
 Ronni
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Re: Strange behaviour

[Ronda Brown]

Hi Ian,

On 29/03/2009, at 9:54 PM, Ian Reid wrote:





3. Did you try Quit Mail, navigate to ~/Library/Mail and drag the
file Envelope Index to the Trash. When you launch Mail again, it'll
tell you that you need to reimport all your messages (just as it
when Ian upgraded to Leopard), it will recreate his envelope index
from scratch, but he won't lose any data.?

I can't remember if this was done.


Please do this as soon as possible. I assumed you had already done
this as I suggested this a few days go.
It doesn't actually Import all your messages, it just creates a new
envelope index from scratch.

I want you to do this because your envelope index‹a special database
that Mail uses to keep track of which messages are in which  
mailboxes‹

and the other files that Mail uses to catalogue messages I think has
become severely damaged.

What I call the subsidiary mailboxes are all back, seemingly OK but  
Inbox

and Sent are empty. Inbox is still offline.


Do you mean all your Mailboxes (under On My Mac) are back and all your  
messages are in them?


To see your Inbox  Sent Mailboxes:
Make sure your account is still in Mail. Go to Preferences  Accounts  
 check your Westnet Account details.

(Remove any Account that should NOT be there)
And In preferences - Accounts - Advanced, the box 'enable this  
account' is ticked on your Westnet Account.


Then Rebuild both Inbox  Sent mailboxes please.

Done. Incidently, what is the protocol with long threads? Should one  
send
the whole lot back when commenting about only one or two questions  
as I have

done here.


How you answered was fine Ian.

Cheers,
Ronni




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Re: Strange behaviour

[Ronda Brown]

Hi Ian,

On 27/03/2009, at 2:44 PM, Ian Reid wrote:


Hi Daniel ( Ronni)

I have run the procedure more than once. Each time, at item 6, I get  
back
all the mailboxes except Inbox and Sent. I note that ~Library/Mail/ 
Mailboxes
contains all but these two. I hope that with all the to-ing and fro- 
ing I've

done I haven't lost them.


The Inbox  Sent messages are not in ~Library/Mail/Mailboxes.
Look in  ~Library/Mail/pop-ianre...@westnet.com.au folder, in this  
folder you should have

Deleted Messages.mbox
Drafts.mbox
INBOX.mbox
Junk.mbox
MessageUidsAlreadyDownloaded (this is a plain text file)
Sent Messages.mbox

Re Ronni's Number 2 suggestion, opening Mail and choosing  
MailboxRebuild

currently produces no action.


Did you highlight (click once) each of the Mailboxes first before you  
chose MailboxRebuild?
If you have more than one account, the inbox, drafts,  sent will have  
an arrow you need to click it to open  then click on each mailbox   
then chose MailboxRebuild


Re Number 3, by now ~Library/Mail includes Envelope Indexes 1, 2 and  
3. If I

chuck them all out, is reimporting a simple matter for me?


Are you referring to my Number 3?
3. Did you try Quit Mail, navigate to ~/Library/Mail and drag the  
file Envelope Index to the Trash. When you launch Mail again, it'll  
tell you that you need to reimport all your messages (just as it  
when Ian upgraded to Leopard), it will recreate his envelope index  
from scratch, but he won't lose any data.?


If you feel safer just move the Envelope Index files to your desktop,  
you can trash them later.

When you reopen Mail, it reindexes all messages.
You won't loose any data.
The envelope index is a special database that Mail uses to keep track  
of which messages are in which mailboxes.




Re Number 4, No, but it wasn't discussed.


Are you referring to my Number 4 or Daniel's Number 4?
If it's my number 4: 4. Did you run the OS X 10.5.6 Combo Update?
Wouldn't hurt to download and run it.
http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/apple/macosx_updates/macosx1056comboupdate.html 



It perhaps would be easier for us to follow you, if you replied to the  
message you are actually referring to.


Re inherited problems, you must have good records, Ronni. For me ,  
Panther

days is another life.


Yes, Panther days are gone for me also, but I checked through my WAMUG  
mailbox.


Cheers,
Ronni




On 26/3/09 10:54 PM, Daniel Kerr wa...@macwizardry.com.au wrote:


Hi Peter

Did you try my suggestion I posted the other day, as I've had the  
same thing
happen, and the fix I posted has always worked for me, ...the same  
as what

you've listed happening.

---quote
This was the fix I used for this. See how it goes.

1. Go to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. Move the Mail  
folder to your

desktop.
2. Launch Mail.
3. Mail will ask if you want to import your message. Don't Click  
continue

yet!!
4. Go back to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. You will see a  
new Mail

folder there. Rename that Mail2.
5. Drag your old Mail folder from the Desktop back to this original
location ( Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library)
6. Go to back to Mail and now Click Continue. Everything should be  
there

like normal.
You should now be able to open and use Mail like you used to. You  
can also
then go back and move Mail2 (the one we didn't use from above) to  
the trash.

---end quote---

Posted that to the list Thu, 26 Mar 2009 00:30:19 +0900.
Worth a try. :o)

Kind Regards
Daniel




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Re: Strange behaviour

[James / Hans Kunz]

just my 2c
quit mail
go to
hd/~user/library/mail
there you should find:
Envelope Index
move this file to the desktop  start mail
it should now ask for a rebuild (Envelope Index gets recreated)

cheersJames

On 27/03/2009, at 14:44, Ian Reid wrote:


Hi Daniel ( Ronni)

I have run the procedure more than once. Each time, at item 6, I  
get back
all the mailboxes except Inbox and Sent. I note that ~Library/Mail/ 
Mailboxes
contains all but these two. I hope that with all the to-ing and fro- 
ing I've

done I haven't lost them.

Re Ronni's Number 2 suggestion, opening Mail and choosing  
MailboxRebuild

currently produces no action.

Re Number 3, by now ~Library/Mail includes Envelope Indexes 1, 2  
and 3. If I

chuck them all out, is reimporting a simple matter for me?

Re Number 4, No, but it wasn't discussed.

Re inherited problems, you must have good records, Ronni. For me ,  
Panther

days is another life.

Thanks everybody for their efforts so far.

Ian



On 26/3/09 10:54 PM, Daniel Kerr wa...@macwizardry.com.au wrote:


Hi Peter

Did you try my suggestion I posted the other day, as I've had the  
same thing
happen, and the fix I posted has always worked for me, ...the same  
as what

you've listed happening.

---quote
This was the fix I used for this. See how it goes.

1. Go to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. Move the Mail  
folder to your

desktop.
2. Launch Mail.
3. Mail will ask if you want to import your message. Don't Click  
continue

yet!!
4. Go back to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. You will see a  
new Mail

folder there. Rename that Mail2.
5. Drag your old Mail folder from the Desktop back to this original
location ( Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library)
6. Go to back to Mail and now Click Continue. Everything should be  
there

like normal.
You should now be able to open and use Mail like you used to. You  
can also
then go back and move Mail2 (the one we didn't use from above) to  
the trash.

---end quote---

Posted that to the list Thu, 26 Mar 2009 00:30:19 +0900.
Worth a try. :o)

Kind Regards
Daniel


On 26/3/09 10:42 PM, Peter Hinchliffe  
hinch...@multiline.com.au wrote:




On 25/03/2009, at 11:05 PM, Robert Howells wrote:



Hi Ian

Can you go to your desktop , find the copy of Mail you would have
put there
when I asked you previously

highlight it and then do an Apple plus I
this should give you an information window which will show
what size the folder is .

Hopefully , plenty of Megabytes  --  then tell us what size it is ,
please




I can now contribute usefully to this discussion - well perhaps not
usefully, but I can at least explain exactly what Ian is going  
through.


I visited Ian's place today at his request and saw for myself just
what is happening. It is truly bizarre:

  1. Mail does launch, but Message Viewer does not automatically  
open.


2. Message View can be called up from the Window Menu, but no  
messages

are displayed. There is a full contingent of custom mailboxes listed
in the sidebar, complete with unread message counts. When the
mailboxes are selected, no messages are seen. A look inside ~/ 
Library/

Mail/ shows that all the mailboxes are intact and all the mbox files
and messages are there.

3. Mail does not respond to the Quit command. Force Quit is the only
way out, and of course the new account details that Ian  
painstakingly

enters each time are lost because the preferences are not updated.

4. I deleted com.apple.mail.plist. This simple act alone should be
enough to cause Mail to call for a new account to be set up. Not at
all in this case. Mail simply launches the same way: no Message
Viewer, no messages, and an old iPrimus account listed in the  
Accounts

preferences.

5. Deleting com.apple.mail.plist, all Mail cache files and any other
Mail-related file I can find makes no difference. Mail continues to
behave in exactly the same way. Of course, a new version of
com.apple.mail.plist is automatically created, but is clearly being
ignored by Mail, which continues to show the settings for this old
iPrimus account. It must be reading this stuff from somewhere, but
just where it a total mystery.

6. Perhaps something has gone wrong with Mail itself (maybe  
something
weird has crept into the Mail package), so lets try reverting to  
last

week's copy, which was the one running before this stuff started
happening. We went back to last Thursday and restored Mail.app via
Time Machine. No difference.

Short of performing a complete System Restore, I can't see how to
resolve this. A Clean Install with Archive is likely to be
unsuccessful, since it is apparent that the problem is local to  
Ian's

user account. I have searched for hidden files containing the word
mail in the filename. I admit I'm out of ideas. Perhaps some of  
what

I have outlined above might ring a bell with someone on the list. At
the moment I have Ian running his old Entourage X software, so at
least he can handle email in a comfortable way again, but it's not

Re: Strange behaviour

[Ronda Brown]

Sorry folks my previous email was in reference to this subject .. its  
been a long day, a long week!


James if you have been following this thread I had already suggested  
this in two emails to WAMUG list.


Cheers,
Ronni

On 27/03/2009, at 7:09 PM, James / Hans Kunz wrote:


just my 2c
quit mail
go to
hd/~user/library/mail
there you should find:
Envelope Index
move this file to the desktop  start mail
it should now ask for a rebuild (Envelope Index gets recreated)

cheersJames



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Re: Strange behaviour

[ianreid1]

Hi Ronni,


- Original Message -
From: Ronda Brown ro...@wn.com.au
To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
Sent: Friday, 27 March, 2009 4:27:33 PM GMT +08:00 Beijing / Chongqing / Hong 
Kong / Urumqi
Subject: Re: Strange behaviour


Did you highlight (click once) each of the Mailboxes first before you  
chose MailboxRebuild?

No. I shift-clicked the lot. I have now done them individually but, apart from 
a couple of minor exceptions, there was no evidence of movement, starting, 
running or finishing the actions. So I assume they have been rebuilt. 

If you have more than one account, the inbox, drafts,  sent will have  
an arrow you need to click it to open  then click on each mailbox   
then chose MailboxRebuild

Inbox had a small zigzag-like marker which disappeared on clicking but there 
was no marker on 'Sent'. Whenever I click on 'Sent', 'Rebuild' fades to grey 
and is unavailable.


3. Did you try Quit Mail, navigate to ~/Library/Mail and drag the  
file Envelope Index to the Trash. When you launch Mail again, it'll  
tell you that you need to reimport all your messages (just as it  
when Ian upgraded to Leopard), it will recreate his envelope index  
from scratch, but he won't lose any data.?

I can't remember if this was done.

Did you run the OS X 10.5.6 Combo Update?

No.

Wouldn't hurt to download and run it.

I'll try it.

It perhaps would be easier for us to follow you, if you replied to the  
message you are actually referring to.

My apologies for trying to answer two emails with one. I'll do it correctly in 
future, starting with this one.


 On 26/3/09 10:54 PM, Daniel Kerr wa...@macwizardry.com.au wrote:

 Hi Peter

 Did you try my suggestion I posted the other day, as I've had the  
 same thing
 happen, and the fix I posted has always worked for me, ...the same  
 as what
 you've listed happening.

 ---quote
 This was the fix I used for this. See how it goes.

 1. Go to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. Move the Mail  
 folder to your
 desktop.
 2. Launch Mail.
 3. Mail will ask if you want to import your message. Don't Click  
 continue
 yet!!
 4. Go back to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. You will see a  
 new Mail
 folder there. Rename that Mail2.
 5. Drag your old Mail folder from the Desktop back to this original
 location ( Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library)
 6. Go to back to Mail and now Click Continue. Everything should be  
 there
 like normal.
 You should now be able to open and use Mail like you used to. You  
 can also
 then go back and move Mail2 (the one we didn't use from above) to  
 the trash.
 ---end quote---

 Posted that to the list Thu, 26 Mar 2009 00:30:19 +0900.
 Worth a try. :o)

 Kind Regards
 Daniel



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Re: Strange behaviour

[Ronda Brown]

Hi Ian,

On 28/03/2009, at 12:02 AM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:


- Original Message -
From: Ronda Brown ro...@wn.com.au
To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
Sent: Friday, 27 March, 2009 4:27:33 PM GMT +08:00 Beijing /  
Chongqing / Hong Kong / Urumqi

Subject: Re: Strange behaviour


Did you highlight (click once) each of the Mailboxes first before you
chose MailboxRebuild?

No. I shift-clicked the lot. I have now done them individually but,  
apart from a couple of minor exceptions, there was no evidence of  
movement, starting, running or finishing the actions. So I assume  
they have been rebuilt.


Shift-clicking all the Mailboxes is fine if you only have one account.
If you don't have a lot of messages in the Mailbox the rebuild is very  
quick. The messages disappear and return quickly in the Message List  
window.


If you have more than one account, the inbox, drafts,  sent will have
an arrow you need to click it to open  then click on each mailbox 
then chose MailboxRebuild

Inbox had a small zigzag-like marker which disappeared on clicking  
but there was no marker on 'Sent'. Whenever I click on 'Sent',  
'Rebuild' fades to grey and is unavailable.


That zigzag (squiggle) beside you Inbox meant that the email account  
was Offline (not connected to the mail server).



3. Did you try Quit Mail, navigate to ~/Library/Mail and drag the
file Envelope Index to the Trash. When you launch Mail again, it'll
tell you that you need to reimport all your messages (just as it
when Ian upgraded to Leopard), it will recreate his envelope index
from scratch, but he won't lose any data.?

I can't remember if this was done.


Please do this as soon as possible. I assumed you had already done  
this as I suggested this a few days go.
It doesn't actually Import all your messages, it just creates a new  
envelope index from scratch.


I want you to do this because your envelope index—a special database  
that Mail uses to keep track of which messages are in which mailboxes— 
and the other files that Mail uses to catalogue messages I think has  
become severely damaged.




Did you run the OS X 10.5.6 Combo Update?

No.

Wouldn't hurt to download and run it.

I'll try it.

It perhaps would be easier for us to follow you, if you replied to the
message you are actually referring to.

My apologies for trying to answer two emails with one. I'll do it  
correctly in future, starting with this one.


No apologies necessary Ian, it just gets a bit hard to follow a thread  
especially when it lasts for a few days with lots of messages.


Please do number 3. and let us know how you get on.

Cheers,
Ronni
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Re: Strange behaviour

[Peter Hinchliffe]

On 25/03/2009, at 11:05 PM, Robert Howells wrote:



Hi Ian

Can you go to your desktop , find the copy of Mail you would have  
put there

when I asked you previously

highlight it and then do an Apple plus I
this should give you an information window which will show
what size the folder is .

Hopefully , plenty of Megabytes  --  then tell us what size it is ,  
please





I can now contribute usefully to this discussion - well perhaps not  
usefully, but I can at least explain exactly what Ian is going through.


I visited Ian's place today at his request and saw for myself just  
what is happening. It is truly bizarre:


 1. Mail does launch, but Message Viewer does not automatically open.

2. Message View can be called up from the Window Menu, but no messages  
are displayed. There is a full contingent of custom mailboxes listed  
in the sidebar, complete with unread message counts. When the  
mailboxes are selected, no messages are seen. A look inside ~/Library/ 
Mail/ shows that all the mailboxes are intact and all the mbox files  
and messages are there.


3. Mail does not respond to the Quit command. Force Quit is the only  
way out, and of course the new account details that Ian painstakingly  
enters each time are lost because the preferences are not updated.


4. I deleted com.apple.mail.plist. This simple act alone should be  
enough to cause Mail to call for a new account to be set up. Not at  
all in this case. Mail simply launches the same way: no Message  
Viewer, no messages, and an old iPrimus account listed in the Accounts  
preferences.


5. Deleting com.apple.mail.plist, all Mail cache files and any other  
Mail-related file I can find makes no difference. Mail continues to  
behave in exactly the same way. Of course, a new version of  
com.apple.mail.plist is automatically created, but is clearly being  
ignored by Mail, which continues to show the settings for this old  
iPrimus account. It must be reading this stuff from somewhere, but  
just where it a total mystery.


6. Perhaps something has gone wrong with Mail itself (maybe something  
weird has crept into the Mail package), so lets try reverting to last  
week's copy, which was the one running before this stuff started  
happening. We went back to last Thursday and restored Mail.app via  
Time Machine. No difference.


Short of performing a complete System Restore, I can't see how to  
resolve this. A Clean Install with Archive is likely to be  
unsuccessful, since it is apparent that the problem is local to Ian's  
user account. I have searched for hidden files containing the word  
mail in the filename. I admit I'm out of ideas. Perhaps some of what  
I have outlined above might ring a bell with someone on the list. At  
the moment I have Ian running his old Entourage X software, so at  
least he can handle email in a comfortable way again, but it's not  
really addressing the central problem. For the moment I think it's  
worth waiting for 10.5.7 in the hope that an updated Mail program  
might resolve things. If not, It will be time for that backup and full  
system restore, I'm thinking.


Very strange indeed.

All contributions gratefully accepted.

--

Peter HinchliffeApwin Computer Services
FileMaker Pro Solutions Developer
Perth, Western Australia
Phone (618) 9332 6482Fax (618) 9332 0913

Mac because I prefer it -- Windows because I have to.





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Re: Strange behaviour

[Daniel Kerr]

Hi Peter

Did you try my suggestion I posted the other day, as I've had the same thing
happen, and the fix I posted has always worked for me, ...the same as what
you've listed happening.

---quote
This was the fix I used for this. See how it goes.

1. Go to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. Move the Mail folder to your
desktop.
2. Launch Mail.
3. Mail will ask if you want to import your message. Don't Click continue
yet!!
4. Go back to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. You will see a new Mail
folder there. Rename that Mail2.
5. Drag your old Mail folder from the Desktop back to this original
location ( Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library)
6. Go to back to Mail and now Click Continue. Everything should be there
like normal. 
You should now be able to open and use Mail like you used to. You can also
then go back and move Mail2 (the one we didn't use from above) to the trash.
---end quote---

Posted that to the list Thu, 26 Mar 2009 00:30:19 +0900.
Worth a try. :o)

Kind Regards
Daniel


On 26/3/09 10:42 PM, Peter Hinchliffe hinch...@multiline.com.au wrote:

 
 On 25/03/2009, at 11:05 PM, Robert Howells wrote:
 
 
 Hi Ian
 
 Can you go to your desktop , find the copy of Mail you would have
 put there
 when I asked you previously
 
 highlight it and then do an Apple plus I
 this should give you an information window which will show
 what size the folder is .
 
 Hopefully , plenty of Megabytes  --  then tell us what size it is ,
 please
 
 
 
 I can now contribute usefully to this discussion - well perhaps not
 usefully, but I can at least explain exactly what Ian is going through.
 
 I visited Ian's place today at his request and saw for myself just
 what is happening. It is truly bizarre:
 
   1. Mail does launch, but Message Viewer does not automatically open.
 
 2. Message View can be called up from the Window Menu, but no messages
 are displayed. There is a full contingent of custom mailboxes listed
 in the sidebar, complete with unread message counts. When the
 mailboxes are selected, no messages are seen. A look inside ~/Library/
 Mail/ shows that all the mailboxes are intact and all the mbox files
 and messages are there.
 
 3. Mail does not respond to the Quit command. Force Quit is the only
 way out, and of course the new account details that Ian painstakingly
 enters each time are lost because the preferences are not updated.
 
 4. I deleted com.apple.mail.plist. This simple act alone should be
 enough to cause Mail to call for a new account to be set up. Not at
 all in this case. Mail simply launches the same way: no Message
 Viewer, no messages, and an old iPrimus account listed in the Accounts
 preferences.
 
 5. Deleting com.apple.mail.plist, all Mail cache files and any other
 Mail-related file I can find makes no difference. Mail continues to
 behave in exactly the same way. Of course, a new version of
 com.apple.mail.plist is automatically created, but is clearly being
 ignored by Mail, which continues to show the settings for this old
 iPrimus account. It must be reading this stuff from somewhere, but
 just where it a total mystery.
 
 6. Perhaps something has gone wrong with Mail itself (maybe something
 weird has crept into the Mail package), so lets try reverting to last
 week's copy, which was the one running before this stuff started
 happening. We went back to last Thursday and restored Mail.app via
 Time Machine. No difference.
 
 Short of performing a complete System Restore, I can't see how to
 resolve this. A Clean Install with Archive is likely to be
 unsuccessful, since it is apparent that the problem is local to Ian's
 user account. I have searched for hidden files containing the word
 mail in the filename. I admit I'm out of ideas. Perhaps some of what
 I have outlined above might ring a bell with someone on the list. At
 the moment I have Ian running his old Entourage X software, so at
 least he can handle email in a comfortable way again, but it's not
 really addressing the central problem. For the moment I think it's
 worth waiting for 10.5.7 in the hope that an updated Mail program
 might resolve things. If not, It will be time for that backup and full
 system restore, I'm thinking.
 
 Very strange indeed.
 
 All contributions gratefully accepted.
 
 --
 
 Peter HinchliffeApwin Computer Services
 FileMaker Pro Solutions Developer
 Perth, Western Australia
 Phone (618) 9332 6482Fax (618) 9332 0913
 
 Mac because I prefer it -- Windows because I have to.
 
 
 
 
 
 -- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List --
 Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml
 Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml
 Unsubscribe - mailto:wamug-unsubscr...@wamug.org.au

---
Daniel Kerr
MacWizardry

Phone: 0414 795 960
Email: daniel @ macwizardry . com . au
Web:   http://www.macwizardry.com.au


**For everything Macintosh**



-- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List 

Re: Strange behaviour

[Robert Howells]

On 26/03/2009, at 10:42 PM, Peter Hinchliffe wrote:




I can now contribute usefully to this discussion - well perhaps not  
usefully, but I can at least explain exactly what Ian is going  
through.


I visited Ian's place today at his request and saw for myself just  
what is happening. It is truly bizarre:


1. Mail does launch, but Message Viewer does not automatically open.

2. Message View can be called up from the Window Menu, but no  
messages are displayed. There is a full contingent of custom  
mailboxes listed in the sidebar, complete with unread message  
counts. When the mailboxes are selected, no messages are seen. A  
look inside ~/Library/Mail/ shows that all the mailboxes are intact  
and all the mbox files and messages are there.


3. Mail does not respond to the Quit command. Force Quit is the only  
way out, and of course the new account details that Ian  
painstakingly enters each time are lost because the preferences are  
not updated.


4. I deleted com.apple.mail.plist. This simple act alone should be  
enough to cause Mail to call for a new account to be set up. Not at  
all in this case. Mail simply launches the same way: no Message  
Viewer, no messages, and an old iPrimus account listed in the  
Accounts preferences.


5. Deleting com.apple.mail.plist, all Mail cache files and any other  
Mail-related file I can find makes no difference. Mail continues to  
behave in exactly the same way. Of course, a new version of  
com.apple.mail.plist is automatically created, but is clearly being  
ignored by Mail, which continues to show the settings for this old  
iPrimus account. It must be reading this stuff from somewhere, but  
just where it a total mystery.


6. Perhaps something has gone wrong with Mail itself (maybe  
something weird has crept into the Mail package), so lets try  
reverting to last week's copy, which was the one running before this  
stuff started happening. We went back to last Thursday and restored  
Mail.app via Time Machine. No difference.


Short of performing a complete System Restore, I can't see how to  
resolve this. A Clean Install with Archive is likely to be  
unsuccessful, since it is apparent that the problem is local to  
Ian's user account. I have searched for hidden files containing the  
word mail in the filename. I admit I'm out of ideas. Perhaps some  
of what I have outlined above might ring a bell with someone on the  
list. At the moment I have Ian running his old Entourage X software,  
so at least he can handle email in a comfortable way again, but it's  
not really addressing the central problem. For the moment I think  
it's worth waiting for 10.5.7 in the hope that an updated Mail  
program might resolve things. If not, It will be time for that  
backup and full system restore, I'm thinking.


Very strange indeed.

All contributions gratefully accepted.

--

Peter Hinchliffe



As a Macintouch  reader I found this tonight :-

http://www.macintouch.com/readerreports/leopard/index.html#d25mar2009

Specifically the message about updating to 10.5.6


Bob






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Re: Strange behaviour

[Ronda Brown]

On 26/03/2009, at 10:42 PM, Peter Hinchliffe wrote:


I can now contribute usefully to this discussion - well perhaps not  
usefully, but I can at least explain exactly what Ian is going  
through.


I visited Ian's place today at his request and saw for myself just  
what is happening. It is truly bizarre:


1. Mail does launch, but Message Viewer does not automatically open.

2. Message View can be called up from the Window Menu, but no  
messages are displayed. There is a full contingent of custom  
mailboxes listed in the sidebar, complete with unread message  
counts. When the mailboxes are selected, no messages are seen. A  
look inside ~/Library/Mail/ shows that all the mailboxes are intact  
and all the mbox files and messages are there.


3. Mail does not respond to the Quit command. Force Quit is the only  
way out, and of course the new account details that Ian  
painstakingly enters each time are lost because the preferences are  
not updated.


4. I deleted com.apple.mail.plist. This simple act alone should be  
enough to cause Mail to call for a new account to be set up. Not at  
all in this case. Mail simply launches the same way: no Message  
Viewer, no messages, and an old iPrimus account listed in the  
Accounts preferences.


5. Deleting com.apple.mail.plist, all Mail cache files and any other  
Mail-related file I can find makes no difference. Mail continues to  
behave in exactly the same way. Of course, a new version of  
com.apple.mail.plist is automatically created, but is clearly being  
ignored by Mail, which continues to show the settings for this old  
iPrimus account. It must be reading this stuff from somewhere, but  
just where it a total mystery.


6. Perhaps something has gone wrong with Mail itself (maybe  
something weird has crept into the Mail package), so lets try  
reverting to last week's copy, which was the one running before this  
stuff started happening. We went back to last Thursday and restored  
Mail.app via Time Machine. No difference.


Short of performing a complete System Restore, I can't see how to  
resolve this. A Clean Install with Archive is likely to be  
unsuccessful, since it is apparent that the problem is local to  
Ian's user account. I have searched for hidden files containing the  
word mail in the filename. I admit I'm out of ideas. Perhaps some  
of what I have outlined above might ring a bell with someone on the  
list. At the moment I have Ian running his old Entourage X software,  
so at least he can handle email in a comfortable way again, but it's  
not really addressing the central problem. For the moment I think  
it's worth waiting for 10.5.7 in the hope that an updated Mail  
program might resolve things. If not, It will be time for that  
backup and full system restore, I'm thinking.


Very strange indeed.

All contributions gratefully accepted.



Hello Peter  Ian,

1. Has Ian (or you) tried Daniel Kerr's suggestion?

2. Did you try the normal fixes such as - Selecting all the Mailboxes  
 choose Mailbox  Rebuild?


3. Did you try Quit Mail, navigate to ~/Library/Mail and drag the file  
Envelope Index to the Trash. When you launch Mail again, it'll tell  
you that you need to reimport all your messages (just as it when Ian  
upgraded to Leopard), it will recreate his envelope index from  
scratch, but he won't lose any data.?


4. Did you run the OS X 10.5.6 Combo Update?

I'm suspecting that Ian has an inherited problem from updating his  
system, he has had previous problems of system freezes etc after  
updating back in Panther days.


If all the suggestions that people have contributed have been tried  
without success,I would suggest it is looking like a complete clean  
System Restore.


Cheers,
Ronni



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Re: Strange behaviour

[Ian Reid]

Hi Daniel ( Ronni)

I have run the procedure more than once. Each time, at item 6, I get back
all the mailboxes except Inbox and Sent. I note that ~Library/Mail/Mailboxes
contains all but these two. I hope that with all the to-ing and fro-ing I've
done I haven't lost them.

Re Ronni's Number 2 suggestion, opening Mail and choosing MailboxRebuild
currently produces no action.

Re Number 3, by now ~Library/Mail includes Envelope Indexes 1, 2 and 3. If I
chuck them all out, is reimporting a simple matter for me?

Re Number 4, No, but it wasn't discussed.

Re inherited problems, you must have good records, Ronni. For me , Panther
days is another life.

Thanks everybody for their efforts so far.

Ian



On 26/3/09 10:54 PM, Daniel Kerr wa...@macwizardry.com.au wrote:

 Hi Peter
 
 Did you try my suggestion I posted the other day, as I've had the same thing
 happen, and the fix I posted has always worked for me, ...the same as what
 you've listed happening.
 
 ---quote
 This was the fix I used for this. See how it goes.
 
 1. Go to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. Move the Mail folder to your
 desktop.
 2. Launch Mail.
 3. Mail will ask if you want to import your message. Don't Click continue
 yet!!
 4. Go back to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. You will see a new Mail
 folder there. Rename that Mail2.
 5. Drag your old Mail folder from the Desktop back to this original
 location ( Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library)
 6. Go to back to Mail and now Click Continue. Everything should be there
 like normal. 
 You should now be able to open and use Mail like you used to. You can also
 then go back and move Mail2 (the one we didn't use from above) to the trash.
 ---end quote---
 
 Posted that to the list Thu, 26 Mar 2009 00:30:19 +0900.
 Worth a try. :o)
 
 Kind Regards
 Daniel
 
 
 On 26/3/09 10:42 PM, Peter Hinchliffe hinch...@multiline.com.au wrote:
 
 
 On 25/03/2009, at 11:05 PM, Robert Howells wrote:
 
 
 Hi Ian
 
 Can you go to your desktop , find the copy of Mail you would have
 put there
 when I asked you previously
 
 highlight it and then do an Apple plus I
 this should give you an information window which will show
 what size the folder is .
 
 Hopefully , plenty of Megabytes  --  then tell us what size it is ,
 please
 
 
 
 I can now contribute usefully to this discussion - well perhaps not
 usefully, but I can at least explain exactly what Ian is going through.
 
 I visited Ian's place today at his request and saw for myself just
 what is happening. It is truly bizarre:
 
   1. Mail does launch, but Message Viewer does not automatically open.
 
 2. Message View can be called up from the Window Menu, but no messages
 are displayed. There is a full contingent of custom mailboxes listed
 in the sidebar, complete with unread message counts. When the
 mailboxes are selected, no messages are seen. A look inside ~/Library/
 Mail/ shows that all the mailboxes are intact and all the mbox files
 and messages are there.
 
 3. Mail does not respond to the Quit command. Force Quit is the only
 way out, and of course the new account details that Ian painstakingly
 enters each time are lost because the preferences are not updated.
 
 4. I deleted com.apple.mail.plist. This simple act alone should be
 enough to cause Mail to call for a new account to be set up. Not at
 all in this case. Mail simply launches the same way: no Message
 Viewer, no messages, and an old iPrimus account listed in the Accounts
 preferences.
 
 5. Deleting com.apple.mail.plist, all Mail cache files and any other
 Mail-related file I can find makes no difference. Mail continues to
 behave in exactly the same way. Of course, a new version of
 com.apple.mail.plist is automatically created, but is clearly being
 ignored by Mail, which continues to show the settings for this old
 iPrimus account. It must be reading this stuff from somewhere, but
 just where it a total mystery.
 
 6. Perhaps something has gone wrong with Mail itself (maybe something
 weird has crept into the Mail package), so lets try reverting to last
 week's copy, which was the one running before this stuff started
 happening. We went back to last Thursday and restored Mail.app via
 Time Machine. No difference.
 
 Short of performing a complete System Restore, I can't see how to
 resolve this. A Clean Install with Archive is likely to be
 unsuccessful, since it is apparent that the problem is local to Ian's
 user account. I have searched for hidden files containing the word
 mail in the filename. I admit I'm out of ideas. Perhaps some of what
 I have outlined above might ring a bell with someone on the list. At
 the moment I have Ian running his old Entourage X software, so at
 least he can handle email in a comfortable way again, but it's not
 really addressing the central problem. For the moment I think it's
 worth waiting for 10.5.7 in the hope that an updated Mail program
 might resolve things. If not, It will be time for that backup and full
 system restore, I'm 

Re: Strange behaviour

[ianreid1]

Robert
Rereading your questions I see I didn't fully answer. I trashed 
com.apple.mail.plist and it was replaced without affecting the situation.

Regards

Ian

- Original Message -
From: Robert Howells rhowe...@arach.net.au
To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
Sent: Wednesday, 25 March, 2009 11:19:17 AM GMT +08:00 Beijing / Chongqing / 
Hong Kong / Urumqi
Subject: Re: Strange behaviour


On 25/03/2009, at 10:57 AM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:

 I can't use Mail but fortunately have just discovered that I can use  
 Westnet directly.So here goes.

 My problem is that the Mail window has somehow been minimised  
 without its icon appearing on the RH end of the Dock. Clicking Mail  
 in Applications or in the Dock brings only the Menu Bar to the  
 Desktop. Quit Mail does nothing. Shutting down the computer (2 Ghz  
 Intel Core 2 Duo running 10.5.6) is only possible by Force Quit of  
 Mail. When it is restarted, Mail is still open but only the Menu Bar  
 is available as before.

 While vainly searching for the cause and a solution, I discovered  
 that the computer, in its wisdom, had cancelled the accounts with  
 Westnet and “re-listed” only one of them with an ISP cancelled a  
 year or so ago! This has been fixed but Westnet support couldn’t  
 help with the Mail problem. They suggested that maybe the computer  
 needs servicing.

 I have recently run Cocktail so the housekeeping should be OK. The  
 Mac is about 15 months old. What do you think?


 Ian Reid


First question ;  have you lost mail that you wished to keep ?  To  
make sure you keep
what ever is currently on your hard drive go :-

Hard drive - Users - your name user - library - Mail

and do an Apple + D  which should produce a   Mail Copy 

Drag that  Mail Copy   out on to your desktop ..
you will possibly need to enter password before it will let you do that

Now , you will have a copy if you lose your Mail while dealing with  
Mail accounts .


As for your trouble :  Usually the first move is to delete the  
Preference file and then reboot .

Go to:   Your User - Library - Preferences - com.apple.mail.plist
and drag it out to trash , empty trash , and Restart .

Mail will make a new preference file as it starts up .

Then see what you have !
-- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List --
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Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml
Unsubscribe - mailto:wamug-unsubscr...@wamug.org.au

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Unsubscribe - mailto:wamug-unsubscr...@wamug.org.au

Re: Strange behaviour

[ianreid1]

Hi Rhonda

Thanks for the suggestions. I quit Mail then found and moved the two 
MessageRules documents to the desktop, then re-opened Mail, quit Mail again and 
returned the documents to their usual place in Mail. Nothing had replaced them 
in the meantime and the viewer window of Mail was still not visible.

I then quit Mail again, dragged the documents to the desktop again and reopened 
Mail. I changed the junk mail settings,(there are no Rules to change),and 
checked that no MessageRules replacements had arisen. I later dropped the 
originals back into Mail and am continuing investigations. Every Quit Mail 
still has to be forced and the Viewer window is nowhere to be seen.

 I checked the mailboxes in Mail and all I have left are In, Out and Sent. The 
whereabouts of the mass of others is presently unknown.

Regards

Ian






- Original Message -
From: Ronda Brown ro...@wn.com.au
To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
Sent: Wednesday, 25 March, 2009 2:56:03 PM GMT +08:00 Beijing / Chongqing / 
Hong Kong / Urumqi
Subject: Re: Strange behaviour

Hello Ian,

Am I correct in understanding your problem ... You cannot see the  
viewer window and Mail Application has to be Force Quit?
If this is what is happening in your Mail Application, try this  let  
us know how you get on:

1. Quit Mail  -Force quit Mail if necessary: From the Apple menu,  
choose Force Quit, select Mail in the Force Quit window's list of  
applications, then click Force Quit.

2. From the Finder's Go menu choose Go to Folder.
Go to this location (type or paste the following, then click Go):
~/Library/Mail ( ~ is an abbreviation for your Home folder)

3. Move the items named MessageRules.plist and  
MessageRules.plist.backup to another location, such as your desktop.

4. Open Mail. Note: At this point you can either set your Junk Mail  
settings and re-create your Mail rules manually in Mail preferences,
or follow the next two steps (if you re-create rules and Junk  
settings, do not perform the following steps ... End after step 4)

5. Quit Mail.

6. Place the items named MessageRules.plist and  
MessageRules.plist.backup back in the ~/Library/Mail folder (replace  
any copies that were added to ~/Library/Mail when you opened Mail).

Cheers,
Ronni

On 25/03/2009, at 1:00 PM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:

 Robert

 Thanks for your assistance. I followed your instructions and have a  
 Mail Copy but Mail itself has opened as before, only the Menu Bar is  
 visible. PreferencesAccounts was changed to the ISP that I was  
 using up to eighteen months ago but I have changed it back to the  
 current one and will re-establish my wife's account when we get this  
 fixed.

 Ian



 - Original Message -
 From: Robert Howells rhowe...@arach.net.au
 To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
 Sent: Wednesday, 25 March, 2009 11:19:17 AM GMT +08:00 Beijing /  
 Chongqing / Hong Kong / Urumqi
 Subject: Re: Strange behaviour


 On 25/03/2009, at 10:57 AM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:

 I can't use Mail but fortunately have just discovered that I can use
 Westnet directly.So here goes.

 My problem is that the Mail window has somehow been minimised
 without its icon appearing on the RH end of the Dock. Clicking Mail
 in Applications or in the Dock brings only the Menu Bar to the
 Desktop. Quit Mail does nothing. Shutting down the computer (2 Ghz
 Intel Core 2 Duo running 10.5.6) is only possible by Force Quit of
 Mail. When it is restarted, Mail is still open but only the Menu Bar
 is available as before.

 While vainly searching for the cause and a solution, I discovered
 that the computer, in its wisdom, had cancelled the accounts with
 Westnet and “re-listed” only one of them with an ISP cancelled a
 year or so ago! This has been fixed but Westnet support couldn’t
 help with the Mail problem. They suggested that maybe the computer
 needs servicing.

 I have recently run Cocktail so the housekeeping should be OK. The
 Mac is about 15 months old. What do you think?


 Ian Reid


 First question ;  have you lost mail that you wished to keep ?  To
 make sure you keep
 what ever is currently on your hard drive go :-

 Hard drive - Users - your name user - library - Mail

 and do an Apple + D  which should produce a   Mail Copy 

 Drag that  Mail Copy   out on to your desktop ..
 you will possibly need to enter password before it will let you do  
 that

 Now , you will have a copy if you lose your Mail while dealing with
 Mail accounts .


 As for your trouble :  Usually the first move is to delete the
 Preference file and then reboot .

 Go to: Your User - Library - Preferences - com.apple.mail.plist
   and drag it out to trash , empty trash , and Restart .

 Mail will make a new preference file as it starts up .

 Then see what you have !


-- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List --
Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml
Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist

Re: Strange behaviour

[Robert Howells]

On 25/03/2009, at 9:59 PM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:


Hi Rhonda

Thanks for the suggestions. I quit Mail then found and moved the two  
MessageRules documents to the desktop, then re-opened Mail, quit  
Mail again and returned the documents to their usual place in Mail.  
Nothing had replaced them in the meantime and the viewer window of  
Mail was still not visible.


I then quit Mail again, dragged the documents to the desktop again  
and reopened Mail. I changed the junk mail settings,(there are no  
Rules to change),and checked that no MessageRules replacements had  
arisen. I later dropped the originals back into Mail and am  
continuing investigations. Every Quit Mail still has to be forced  
and the Viewer window is nowhere to be seen.


I checked the mailboxes in Mail and all I have left are In, Out and  
Sent. The whereabouts of the mass of others is presently unknown.


Regards

Ian



Hi Ian

Can you go to your desktop , find the copy of Mail you would have put  
there

when I asked you previously

highlight it and then do an Apple plus I
this should give you an information window which will show
what size the folder is .

Hopefully , plenty of Megabytes  --  then tell us what size it is ,  
please



Bob










- Original Message -
From: Ronda Brown ro...@wn.com.au
To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
Sent: Wednesday, 25 March, 2009 2:56:03 PM GMT +08:00 Beijing /  
Chongqing / Hong Kong / Urumqi

Subject: Re: Strange behaviour

Hello Ian,

Am I correct in understanding your problem ... You cannot see the
viewer window and Mail Application has to be Force Quit?
If this is what is happening in your Mail Application, try this  let
us know how you get on:

1. Quit Mail  -Force quit Mail if necessary: From the Apple menu,
choose Force Quit, select Mail in the Force Quit window's list of
applications, then click Force Quit.

2. From the Finder's Go menu choose Go to Folder.
Go to this location (type or paste the following, then click Go):
~/Library/Mail ( ~ is an abbreviation for your Home folder)

3. Move the items named MessageRules.plist and
MessageRules.plist.backup to another location, such as your desktop.

4. Open Mail. Note: At this point you can either set your Junk Mail
settings and re-create your Mail rules manually in Mail preferences,
or follow the next two steps (if you re-create rules and Junk
settings, do not perform the following steps ... End after step 4)

5. Quit Mail.

6. Place the items named MessageRules.plist and
MessageRules.plist.backup back in the ~/Library/Mail folder (replace
any copies that were added to ~/Library/Mail when you opened Mail).

Cheers,
Ronni

On 25/03/2009, at 1:00 PM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:


Robert

Thanks for your assistance. I followed your instructions and have a
Mail Copy but Mail itself has opened as before, only the Menu Bar is
visible. PreferencesAccounts was changed to the ISP that I was
using up to eighteen months ago but I have changed it back to the
current one and will re-establish my wife's account when we get this
fixed.

Ian



- Original Message -
From: Robert Howells rhowe...@arach.net.au
To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
Sent: Wednesday, 25 March, 2009 11:19:17 AM GMT +08:00 Beijing /
Chongqing / Hong Kong / Urumqi
Subject: Re: Strange behaviour


On 25/03/2009, at 10:57 AM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:


I can't use Mail but fortunately have just discovered that I can use
Westnet directly.So here goes.

My problem is that the Mail window has somehow been minimised
without its icon appearing on the RH end of the Dock. Clicking Mail
in Applications or in the Dock brings only the Menu Bar to the
Desktop. Quit Mail does nothing. Shutting down the computer (2 Ghz
Intel Core 2 Duo running 10.5.6) is only possible by Force Quit of
Mail. When it is restarted, Mail is still open but only the Menu Bar
is available as before.

While vainly searching for the cause and a solution, I discovered
that the computer, in its wisdom, had cancelled the accounts with
Westnet and “re-listed” only one of them with an ISP cancelled a
year or so ago! This has been fixed but Westnet support couldn’t
help with the Mail problem. They suggested that maybe the computer
needs servicing.

I have recently run Cocktail so the housekeeping should be OK. The
Mac is about 15 months old. What do you think?


Ian Reid



First question ;  have you lost mail that you wished to keep ?  To
make sure you keep
what ever is currently on your hard drive go :-

Hard drive - Users - your name user - library - Mail

and do an Apple + D  which should produce a   Mail Copy 

Drag that  Mail Copy   out on to your desktop ..
you will possibly need to enter password before it will let you do
that

Now , you will have a copy if you lose your Mail while dealing with
Mail accounts .


As for your trouble :  Usually the first move is to delete the
Preference file and then reboot .

Go to:   Your User - Library - Preferences

Re: Strange behaviour

[Daniel Kerr]

On 25/3/09 10:57 AM, ianre...@westnet.com.au ianre...@westnet.com.au
wrote:

 I can't use Mail but fortunately have just discovered that I can use Westnet
 directly.So here goes.
 
 My problem is that the Mail window has somehow been minimised without its icon
 appearing on the RH end of the Dock. Clicking Mail in Applications or in the
 Dock brings only the Menu Bar to the Desktop. Quit Mail does nothing. Shutting
 down the computer (2 Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo running 10.5.6) is only possible by
 Force Quit of Mail. When it is restarted, Mail is still open but only the Menu
 Bar is available as before.
 
 While vainly searching for the cause and a solution, I discovered that the
 computer, in its wisdom, had cancelled the accounts with Westnet and
 ³re-listed² only one of them with an ISP cancelled a year or so ago! This has
 been fixed but Westnet support couldn¹t help with the Mail problem. They
 suggested that maybe the computer needs servicing.
 
 I have recently run Cocktail so the housekeeping should be OK. The Mac is
 about 15 months old. What do you think?
 
 
 Ian Reid
 

Hi Ian

Have you recently upgraded to Leopard (10.5.x).
The reason I ask, is what you've described is fairly similar to a lot of
instances I've had call out's for for a few clients. Very similar to what
you've subscribed.

This was the fix I used for this. See how it goes.

1. Go to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. Move the Mail folder to your
desktop.
2. Launch Mail.
3. Mail will ask if you want to import your message. Don't Click continue
yet!!
4. Go back to Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library. You will see a new Mail
folder there. Rename that Mail2.
5. Drag your old Mail folder from the Desktop back to this original
location ( Macintosh HD/Users/yourname/Library)
6. Go to back to Mail and now Click Continue. Everything should be there
like normal. 
You should now be able to open and use Mail like you used to. You can also
then go back and move Mail2 (the one we didn't use from above) to the trash.

That should hopefully fix it for you.

Kind Regards
Daniel

---
Daniel Kerr
MacWizardry

Phone: 0414 795 960
Email: daniel @ macwizardry . com . au
Web:   http://www.macwizardry.com.au


**For everything Macintosh**



-- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List --
Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml
Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml
Unsubscribe - mailto:wamug-unsubscr...@wamug.org.au

Re: Strange behaviour

[Robert Howells]

On 25/03/2009, at 10:57 AM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:

I can't use Mail but fortunately have just discovered that I can use  
Westnet directly.So here goes.


My problem is that the Mail window has somehow been minimised  
without its icon appearing on the RH end of the Dock. Clicking Mail  
in Applications or in the Dock brings only the Menu Bar to the  
Desktop. Quit Mail does nothing. Shutting down the computer (2 Ghz  
Intel Core 2 Duo running 10.5.6) is only possible by Force Quit of  
Mail. When it is restarted, Mail is still open but only the Menu Bar  
is available as before.


While vainly searching for the cause and a solution, I discovered  
that the computer, in its wisdom, had cancelled the accounts with  
Westnet and “re-listed” only one of them with an ISP cancelled a  
year or so ago! This has been fixed but Westnet support couldn’t  
help with the Mail problem. They suggested that maybe the computer  
needs servicing.


I have recently run Cocktail so the housekeeping should be OK. The  
Mac is about 15 months old. What do you think?



Ian Reid



First question ;  have you lost mail that you wished to keep ?  To  
make sure you keep

what ever is currently on your hard drive go :-

Hard drive - Users - your name user - library - Mail

and do an Apple + D  which should produce a   Mail Copy 

Drag that  Mail Copy   out on to your desktop ..
you will possibly need to enter password before it will let you do that

Now , you will have a copy if you lose your Mail while dealing with  
Mail accounts .



As for your trouble :  Usually the first move is to delete the  
Preference file and then reboot .


Go to:   Your User - Library - Preferences - com.apple.mail.plist
and drag it out to trash , empty trash , and Restart .

Mail will make a new preference file as it starts up .

Then see what you have !
-- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List --
Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml
Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml
Unsubscribe - mailto:wamug-unsubscr...@wamug.org.au

Re: Strange behaviour

[ianreid1]

Robert

Thanks for your assistance. I followed your instructions and have a Mail Copy 
but Mail itself has opened as before, only the Menu Bar is visible. 
PreferencesAccounts was changed to the ISP that I was using up to eighteen 
months ago but I have changed it back to the current one and will re-establish 
my wife's account when we get this fixed.

Ian 



- Original Message -
From: Robert Howells rhowe...@arach.net.au
To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
Sent: Wednesday, 25 March, 2009 11:19:17 AM GMT +08:00 Beijing / Chongqing / 
Hong Kong / Urumqi
Subject: Re: Strange behaviour


On 25/03/2009, at 10:57 AM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:

 I can't use Mail but fortunately have just discovered that I can use  
 Westnet directly.So here goes.

 My problem is that the Mail window has somehow been minimised  
 without its icon appearing on the RH end of the Dock. Clicking Mail  
 in Applications or in the Dock brings only the Menu Bar to the  
 Desktop. Quit Mail does nothing. Shutting down the computer (2 Ghz  
 Intel Core 2 Duo running 10.5.6) is only possible by Force Quit of  
 Mail. When it is restarted, Mail is still open but only the Menu Bar  
 is available as before.

 While vainly searching for the cause and a solution, I discovered  
 that the computer, in its wisdom, had cancelled the accounts with  
 Westnet and “re-listed” only one of them with an ISP cancelled a  
 year or so ago! This has been fixed but Westnet support couldn’t  
 help with the Mail problem. They suggested that maybe the computer  
 needs servicing.

 I have recently run Cocktail so the housekeeping should be OK. The  
 Mac is about 15 months old. What do you think?


 Ian Reid


First question ;  have you lost mail that you wished to keep ?  To  
make sure you keep
what ever is currently on your hard drive go :-

Hard drive - Users - your name user - library - Mail

and do an Apple + D  which should produce a   Mail Copy 

Drag that  Mail Copy   out on to your desktop ..
you will possibly need to enter password before it will let you do that

Now , you will have a copy if you lose your Mail while dealing with  
Mail accounts .


As for your trouble :  Usually the first move is to delete the  
Preference file and then reboot .

Go to:   Your User - Library - Preferences - com.apple.mail.plist
and drag it out to trash , empty trash , and Restart .

Mail will make a new preference file as it starts up .

Then see what you have !
-- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List --
Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml
Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml
Unsubscribe - mailto:wamug-unsubscr...@wamug.org.au

-- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List --
Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml
Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml
Unsubscribe - mailto:wamug-unsubscr...@wamug.org.au

Re: Strange behaviour

[Ronda Brown]

Hello Ian,

Am I correct in understanding your problem ... You cannot see the  
viewer window and Mail Application has to be Force Quit?
If this is what is happening in your Mail Application, try this  let  
us know how you get on:


1. Quit Mail  -Force quit Mail if necessary: From the Apple menu,  
choose Force Quit, select Mail in the Force Quit window's list of  
applications, then click Force Quit.


2. From the Finder's Go menu choose Go to Folder.
Go to this location (type or paste the following, then click Go):
~/Library/Mail ( ~ is an abbreviation for your Home folder)

3. Move the items named MessageRules.plist and  
MessageRules.plist.backup to another location, such as your desktop.


4. Open Mail. Note: At this point you can either set your Junk Mail  
settings and re-create your Mail rules manually in Mail preferences,
or follow the next two steps (if you re-create rules and Junk  
settings, do not perform the following steps ... End after step 4)


5. Quit Mail.

6. Place the items named MessageRules.plist and  
MessageRules.plist.backup back in the ~/Library/Mail folder (replace  
any copies that were added to ~/Library/Mail when you opened Mail).


Cheers,
Ronni

On 25/03/2009, at 1:00 PM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:


Robert

Thanks for your assistance. I followed your instructions and have a  
Mail Copy but Mail itself has opened as before, only the Menu Bar is  
visible. PreferencesAccounts was changed to the ISP that I was  
using up to eighteen months ago but I have changed it back to the  
current one and will re-establish my wife's account when we get this  
fixed.


Ian



- Original Message -
From: Robert Howells rhowe...@arach.net.au
To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au
Sent: Wednesday, 25 March, 2009 11:19:17 AM GMT +08:00 Beijing /  
Chongqing / Hong Kong / Urumqi

Subject: Re: Strange behaviour


On 25/03/2009, at 10:57 AM, ianre...@westnet.com.au wrote:


I can't use Mail but fortunately have just discovered that I can use
Westnet directly.So here goes.

My problem is that the Mail window has somehow been minimised
without its icon appearing on the RH end of the Dock. Clicking Mail
in Applications or in the Dock brings only the Menu Bar to the
Desktop. Quit Mail does nothing. Shutting down the computer (2 Ghz
Intel Core 2 Duo running 10.5.6) is only possible by Force Quit of
Mail. When it is restarted, Mail is still open but only the Menu Bar
is available as before.

While vainly searching for the cause and a solution, I discovered
that the computer, in its wisdom, had cancelled the accounts with
Westnet and “re-listed” only one of them with an ISP cancelled a
year or so ago! This has been fixed but Westnet support couldn’t
help with the Mail problem. They suggested that maybe the computer
needs servicing.

I have recently run Cocktail so the housekeeping should be OK. The
Mac is about 15 months old. What do you think?


Ian Reid



First question ;  have you lost mail that you wished to keep ?  To
make sure you keep
what ever is currently on your hard drive go :-

Hard drive - Users - your name user - library - Mail

and do an Apple + D  which should produce a   Mail Copy 

Drag that  Mail Copy   out on to your desktop ..
you will possibly need to enter password before it will let you do  
that


Now , you will have a copy if you lose your Mail while dealing with
Mail accounts .


As for your trouble :  Usually the first move is to delete the
Preference file and then reboot .

Go to:   Your User - Library - Preferences - com.apple.mail.plist
and drag it out to trash , empty trash , and Restart .

Mail will make a new preference file as it starts up .

Then see what you have !



-- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List --
Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml
Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml
Unsubscribe - mailto:wamug-unsubscr...@wamug.org.au

Re: Strange behaviour

[Robert Howells]

On 28/02/2007, at 3:31 PM, Severin Crisp wrote:

I have two Epson printers in regular use and they are both set to  
open when I reboot.  Recently at reboot they both say that the  
printer is not found but just starting Printer Setup Utility makes  
the messages go away and all is well till the next reboot which may  
be a week later.  This is a recent phenomenon which I can not link  
with anything else.

Any one got any ideas, please?
Severin


How are they connected ?

? Powered usb hub ?  How is the power supply ?

What power supply to the printers ?  problem ?

If you clear those ideas you are probably left with a software  
glitch ! ?  Permissions ?



Bob

RE: Strange behaviour

[David Moyle]

Hey

In our wisdom we thought of an idea, that on our computers in the admin
account we would have System Preferences and Print Center open on login
since those are the two main locations we would need to go if it required
maintenance. We find more so on our older machines that Print Centre will
say that there is no printers added and would you like to add them. If we
close it and re-open it they are returned.

We presume that this is because the computer is opening the Print Centre
before logging in and loading the printers sub-system at login. This could
be a similar thing for your issue! What spec is your computer?

Thanks, David Moyle
--
Bertram, Western Australia
E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Confidentiality Notice:
The contents of this email are confid.. Were you meant to recieve this? If
not, delete it. Please?

-Original Message-
From: WAMUG Mailing List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Severin
Crisp
Sent: Wednesday, 28 February 2007 4:32 PM
To: WAMUG Mailing List
Subject: Strange behaviour

I have two Epson printers in regular use and they are both set to  
open when I reboot.  Recently at reboot they both say that the  
printer is not found but just starting Printer Setup Utility makes  
the messages go away and all is well till the next reboot which may  
be a week later.  This is a recent phenomenon which I can not link  
with anything else.
Any one got any ideas, please?
Severin

Assoc Professor R Severin Crisp, FIP, CPhys, FAIP
15 Thomas St, Mount Clarence, Albany, 6330, Western Australia.
 Phone  (08) 9842 1950   (Int'l +61 8 9842 1950)
 email  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
   Web pages http://www.JennyCrisp.com.au
   http://members.westnet.com.au/Crisp




-- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List --
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