[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
It's=20***ING=20outlook David =20-Original=20Message- =20From:=20Michael=20Harrington=20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20Sent:=2002=20April=202004=2002:56 =20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20A=20Hex=20Markup=20in=20MIME=20:)=20=20Someone=20needs=20to=20fix=20= their=20parser=20:) =20-=20Original=20Message=20- =20From:=20Michael=20Schwarz=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20To:=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20Sent:=20Thursday,=20April=2001,=202004=205:05=20PM =20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20=20Yes =20 =20=20=20-Original=20Message- =20=20=20From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jenck =20=20=20Sent:=20Friday,=20April=2002,=202004=201:53=20AM =20=20=20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20=20 =20=20=20Is=20anyone=20else=20getting=20all=20of=20these=20=3D3D20? =20=20 =20=20=20Mike =20=20 =20=20=20-Original=20Message- =20=20=20From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20On =20=20=20Behalf=20Of=20David=20Stebbings =20=20=20Sent:=20Thursday,=20April=2001,=202004=208:09=20AM =20=20=20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20=20 =20My=3D3D20twopenneth=3D3D20to=3D3D20the=3D3D20open=3D3D20relay=3D3D20de= bate=3D3D20:) =20=20 =20=20=20If=3D3D20I=3D3D20was=3D3D20writing=3D3D20XMail=3D3D20i=3D3D20w= ould=3D3D20mak =20=20=20e=3D3D20priva=3D =20=20=20te=3D3D20addresses=3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=20(as=3D3D20suggested=3D3D20previously)=3D3D20open=3D3D20relays=3D= 3D20(i.e =20=20=20.=3D3D2010.x,=3D =20=20=20=3D3D20192.x=3D3D20an=3D3D =20=20=20d=3D3D20172.x)=3D3D20and=3D3D20everything=3D3D20else=3D3D20res= tricted. =20=20 =20=20=20But=3D3D20I'm=3D3D20not,=3D3D20Davide=3D3D20is,=3D3D20and=3D3D= 20whatever=3D3 =20=20=20D20he=3D3D20s=3D =20=20=20ays=3D3D20is=3D3D20the=3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=20end=3D3D20of=3D3D20the=3D3D20story=3D3D20in=3D3D20my=3D3D20vie= w=3D3D20:) =20=20 =20=20=20I=3D3D20managed=3D3D20to=3D3D20find=3D3D20the=3D3D20open=3D3D2= 0relay=3D3D20w =20=20=20arning=3D3D20=3D =20=20=20in=3D3D20the=3D3D20docs=3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=20when=3D3D20I=3D3D20first=3D3D20looked=3D3D20at=3D3D20it=3D3D20= so=3D3D20it=3D3D =20=20=2020can't=3D3D2=3D =20=20=200be=3D3D20that=3D3D20well=3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=20hidden. =20=20 =20=20=20Cheers=3D3D20again=3D3D20for=3D3D20the=3D3D20program=3D3D20Dav= ide!=3D3D20=3D =20=20=203D20It's=3D3D=3D =20=20=2020class. =20=20 =20=20=20David =20=20 =20=20 =20__= =20=20=20This=3D3D20email=3D3D20has=3D3D20been=3D3D20scanned=3D3D20by=3D= 3D20the=3D3D2 =20=20=200MessageLab=3D =20=20=20s=3D3D20Email=3D3D20Sec=3D3D =20=20=20urity=3D3D20System. =20=20=20For=3D3D20more=3D3D20information=3D3D20please=3D3D20visit=3D3D= 20http://w =20=20=20ww.messagel=3D =20=20=20abs.com/ema=3D3D =20=20=20il=3D3D20 =20=20 =20__= =20=20=20- =20=20=20To=20unsubscribe=20from=20this=20list:=20send=20the=20line=20= unsubscribe =20xmail=20in =20=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20For=20general=20help:=20send=20the=20line=20help=20in=20the=20= body=20of=20a=20message=20to =20=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20=20 =20=20 =20=20 =20=20=20- =20=20=20To=20unsubscribe=20from=20this=20list:=20send=20the=20line=20= unsubscribe =20xmail=20in =20=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20For=20general=20help:=20send=20the=20line=20help=20in=20the=20= body=20of=20a=20message=20to =20=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20 =20=20- =20=20To=20unsubscribe=20from=20this=20list:=20send=20the=20line=20unsu= bscribe=20xmail=20in =20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20For=20general=20help:=20send=20the=20line=20help=20in=20the=20bo= dy=20of=20a=20message=20to =20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20 =20- =20To=20unsubscribe=20from=20this=20list:=20send=20the=20line=20unsubscr= ibe=20xmail=20in [EMAIL PROTECTED] =20For=20general=20help:=20send=20the=20line=20help=20in=20the=20body=20= of=20a=20message=20to [EMAIL PROTECTED] =20__= =20This=20email=20has=20been=20scanned=20by=20the=20MessageLabs=20Email=20= Security=20System. =20For=20more=20information=20please=20visit=20http://www.messagelabs.com= /email =20__= =20 __ This=20email=20has=20been=20scanned=20by=20the=20MessageLabs=20Email=20Sec= urity=20System. For=20more=20information=20please=20visit=20http://www.messagelabs.com/ema= il=20 __ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Set outlook to send as plain text only ! -- Chris L. Franklin -- - Original Message - From: David Stebbings [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 4:03 AM Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide It's=20***ING=20outlook David =20-Original=20Message- =20From:=20Michael=20Harrington=20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20Sent:=2002=20April=202004=2002:56 =20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20A=20Hex=20Markup=20in=20MIME=20:)=20=20Someone=20needs=20to=20fix=20 = their=20parser=20:) =20-=20Original=20Message=20- =20From:=20Michael=20Schwarz=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20To:=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20Sent:=20Thursday,=20April=2001,=202004=205:05=20PM =20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20=20Yes =20 =20=20=20-Original=20Message- =20=20=20From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Jenck =20=20=20Sent:=20Friday,=20April=2002,=202004=201:53=20AM =20=20=20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20=20 =20=20=20Is=20anyone=20else=20getting=20all=20of=20these=20=3D3D20? =20=20 =20=20=20Mike =20=20 =20=20=20-Original=20Message- =20=20=20From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20On =20=20=20Behalf=20Of=20David=20Stebbings =20=20=20Sent:=20Thursday,=20April=2001,=202004=208:09=20AM =20=20=20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20=20 =20My=3D3D20twopenneth=3D3D20to=3D3D20the=3D3D20open=3D3D20relay=3D3D20de= bate=3D3D20:) =20=20 =20=20=20If=3D3D20I=3D3D20was=3D3D20writing=3D3D20XMail=3D3D20i=3D3D20w= ould=3D3D20mak =20=20=20e=3D3D20priva=3D =20=20=20te=3D3D20addresses=3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=20(as=3D3D20suggested=3D3D20previously)=3D3D20open=3D3D20relays=3D = 3D20(i.e =20=20=20.=3D3D2010.x,=3D =20=20=20=3D3D20192.x=3D3D20an=3D3D =20=20=20d=3D3D20172.x)=3D3D20and=3D3D20everything=3D3D20else=3D3D20res= tricted. =20=20 =20=20=20But=3D3D20I'm=3D3D20not,=3D3D20Davide=3D3D20is,=3D3D20and=3D3D= 20whatever=3D3 =20=20=20D20he=3D3D20s=3D =20=20=20ays=3D3D20is=3D3D20the=3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=20end=3D3D20of=3D3D20the=3D3D20story=3D3D20in=3D3D20my=3D3D20vie= w=3D3D20:) =20=20 =20=20=20I=3D3D20managed=3D3D20to=3D3D20find=3D3D20the=3D3D20open=3D3D2= 0relay=3D3D20w =20=20=20arning=3D3D20=3D =20=20=20in=3D3D20the=3D3D20docs=3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=20when=3D3D20I=3D3D20first=3D3D20looked=3D3D20at=3D3D20it=3D3D20= so=3D3D20it=3D3D =20=20=2020can't=3D3D2=3D =20=20=200be=3D3D20that=3D3D20well=3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=20hidden. =20=20 =20=20=20Cheers=3D3D20again=3D3D20for=3D3D20the=3D3D20program=3D3D20Dav= ide!=3D3D20=3D =20=20=203D20It's=3D3D=3D =20=20=2020class. =20=20 =20=20=20David =20=20 =20=20 =20__= =20=20=20This=3D3D20email=3D3D20has=3D3D20been=3D3D20scanned=3D3D20by=3D= 3D20the=3D3D2 =20=20=200MessageLab=3D =20=20=20s=3D3D20Email=3D3D20Sec=3D3D =20=20=20urity=3D3D20System. =20=20=20For=3D3D20more=3D3D20information=3D3D20please=3D3D20visit=3D3D= 20http://w =20=20=20ww.messagel=3D =20=20=20abs.com/ema=3D3D =20=20=20il=3D3D20 =20=20 =20__= =20=20=20- =20=20=20To=20unsubscribe=20from=20this=20list:=20send=20the=20line=20= unsubscribe =20xmail=20in =20=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20For=20general=20help:=20send=20the=20line=20help=20in=20the=20 = body=20of=20a=20message=20to =20=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20=20 =20=20 =20=20 =20=20=20- =20=20=20To=20unsubscribe=20from=20this=20list:=20send=20the=20line=20= unsubscribe =20xmail=20in =20=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=20For=20general=20help:=20send=20the=20line=20help=20in=20the=20 = body=20of=20a=20message=20to =20=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20 =20=20- =20=20To=20unsubscribe=20from=20this=20list:=20send=20the=20line=20unsu= bscribe=20xmail=20in =20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20For=20general=20help:=20send=20the=20line=20help=20in=20the=20bo= dy=20of=20a=20message=20to =20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20 =20- =20To=20unsubscribe=20from=20this=20list:=20send=20the=20line=20unsubscr= ibe=20xmail=20in [EMAIL PROTECTED] =20For=20general=20help:=20send=20the=20line=20help=20in=20the=20body=20= of=20a=20message=20to [EMAIL PROTECTED] =20__= =20This=20email=20has=20been=20scanned=20by=20the=20MessageLabs=20Email=20= Security=20System. =20For=20more=20information=20please=20visit=20http://www.messagelabs.com= /email =20__= =20 __ This=20email=20has=20been=20scanned=20by=20the=20MessageLabs=20Email=20Sec= urity=20System. For=20more=20information=20please=20visit=20http://www.messagelabs.com/ema= il=20
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
It=20***ing=20is!=20:) David =20-Original=20Message- =20From:=20Chris=20L.=20Franklin=20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20Sent:=2002=20April=202004=2011:56 =20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20 =20Set=20outlook=20to=20send=20as=20plain=20text=20only=20! =20 =20--=20Chris=20L.=20Franklin=20-- =20 =20-=20Original=20Message=20- =20From:=20David=20Stebbings=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20To:=20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20Sent:=20Friday,=20April=2002,=202004=204:03=20AM =20Subject:=20[xmail]=20Re:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20 =20=20It's=3D20***ING=3D20outlook =20 =20=20David =20 =20 =20=20=3D20-Original=3D20Message- =20=20=3D20From:=3D20Michael=3D20Harrington=3D20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ria.com] =20=20=3D20Sent:=3D2002=3D20April=3D202004=3D2002:56 =20=20=3D20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=3D20Subject:=3D20[xmail]=3D20Re:=3D20Default=3D20Open=3D20Relay=3D= [EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20=20 =20 =20=3D20A=3D20Hex=3D20Markup=3D20in=3D20MIME=3D20:)=3D20=3D20Someone= =3D20needs =20=3D20to=3D20fix=3D20 =20=3D =20=20their=3D20parser=3D20:) =20=20 =20=20=3D20-=3D20Original=3D20Message=3D20- =20=20=3D20From:=3D20Michael=3D20Schwarz=3D20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=3D20To:=3D20[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=3D20Sent:=3D20Thursday,=3D20April=3D2001,=3D202004=3D205:05=3D20= PM =20=20=3D20Subject:=3D20[xmail]=3D20Re:=3D20Default=3D20Open=3D20Relay=3D= [EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20 =20=20 =20=20=3D20 =20=20=3D20=3D20Yes =20=20=3D20 =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20-Original=3D20Message- =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] al =20f=3D20Of=3D20M=3D20=3D =20=20Jenck =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20Sent:=3D20Friday,=3D20April=3D2002,=3D202004=3D2= 01:53=3D20AM =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20Subject:=3D20[xmail]=3D20Re:=3D20Default=3D20Open=3D= 20Relay=3D [EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20=20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20Is=3D20anyone=3D20else=3D20getting=3D20all=3D20of=3D= 20these=3D20=3D3D3D20? =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20Mike =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20-Original=3D20Message- =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20On =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20Behalf=3D20Of=3D20David=3D20Stebbings =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20Sent:=3D20Thursday,=3D20April=3D2001,=3D202004=3D= 208:09=3D20AM =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20Subject:=3D20[xmail]=3D20Re:=3D20Default=3D20Open=3D= 20Relay=3D [EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20 =20=3D20My=3D3D3D20twopenneth=3D3D3D20to=3D3D3D20the=3D3D3D20open=3D3D3D= 20re =20lay=3D3D3D20de=3D =20=20bate=3D3D3D20:) =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20If=3D3D3D20I=3D3D3D20was=3D3D3D20writing=3D3D3D20XMa= il=3D3D3 =20D20i=3D3D3D20w=3D =20=20ould=3D3D3D20mak =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20e=3D3D3D20priva=3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20te=3D3D3D20addresses=3D3D3D20=3D3D3D =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20(as=3D3D3D20suggested=3D3D3D20previously)=3D3D3D20op= en=3D3 =20D3D20relays=3D3D =20=3D =20=203D20(i.e =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20.=3D3D3D2010.x,=3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20=3D3D3D20192.x=3D3D3D20an=3D3D3D =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20d=3D3D3D20172.x)=3D3D3D20and=3D3D3D20everything=3D3D= 3D20el =20se=3D3D3D20res=3D =20=20tricted. =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20But=3D3D3D20I'm=3D3D3D20not,=3D3D3D20Davide=3D3D3D20= is,=3D3D =203D20and=3D3D3D=3D =20=2020whatever=3D3D3 =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20D20he=3D3D3D20s=3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20ays=3D3D3D20is=3D3D3D20the=3D3D3D20=3D3D3D =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20end=3D3D3D20of=3D3D3D20the=3D3D3D20story=3D3D3D20in=3D= 3D3D20 =20my=3D3D3D20vie=3D =20=20w=3D3D3D20:) =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20I=3D3D3D20managed=3D3D3D20to=3D3D3D20find=3D3D3D20th= e=3D3D3D =2020open=3D3D3D2=3D =20=200relay=3D3D3D20w =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20arning=3D3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20in=3D3D3D20the=3D3D3D20docs=3D3D3D20=3D3D3D =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20when=3D3D3D20I=3D3D3D20first=3D3D3D20looked=3D3D3D20= at=3D3D3 =20D20it=3D3D3D20=3D =20=20so=3D3D3D20it=3D3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D2020can't=3D3D3D2=3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D200be=3D3D3D20that=3D3D3D20well=3D3D3D20=3D3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20hidden. =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20Cheers=3D3D3D20again=3D3D3D20for=3D3D3D20the=3D3D3D2= 0progr =20am=3D3D3D20Dav=3D =20=20ide!=3D3D3D20=3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D203D20It's=3D3D3D=3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D2020class. =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20David =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20=20=3D20=3D20 =20 =20=3D20__ =20=3D =20 =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20This=3D3D3D20email=3D3D3D20has=3D3D3D20been=3D3D3D20= scanne =20d=3D3D3D20by=3D3D=3D =20=203D20the=3D3D3D2 =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D200MessageLab=3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20s=3D3D3D20Email=3D3D3D20Sec=3D3D3D =20=20=3D20=3D20=3D20urity=3D3D3D20System. =20 =20=3D20=3D20=3D20For=3D3D3D20more=3D3D3D20information=3D3D3D20please=3D= 3D3D =2020visit=3D3D3D=3D =20=2020http://w
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
How about putting in smtprelay.tab all non-routable private subnets per RFC or some kind of wildcard or special entry that matches the subnets of all installed network cards in the xmail server? For example, case 1: smtprelay.tab 10.0.0.0/8 169.254.0.0/16 172.16.0.0/12 192.168.0.0/16 or case 2: smtprelay.tab localsubnetsonly hmm just found in http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc3330.html that case 2 maybe should be 0.0.0.0/8 meaning Addresses in this block refer to source hosts on this network. Bill -- From: Davide Libenzi[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 11:02 PM To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay On Tue, 30 Mar 2004, Tim McGarvey wrote: I have to agree. I'll admit this makes me an idiot, but my first installation I accumulated 40,000 bounces in my postmaster inbox between going home on the go-live date and coming in the next morning. At the very least a note in the tab file saying WARNING, the default configuration is an open relay! or some such. I know it's not smart, but I just never imagined that any mail servers defaults would be wide open nowadays. Did you miss this is some way? http://www.xmailserver.org/Readme.html#configuration In particular the step that says 'THIS IS IMPORTANT'. The difference, giving for granted that user do not read the documentation, is that if I close the relay I will receive tons of email saying (subjects in random order): I cannot send message through XMail ... What does relay denied means ... My server does not work, can you configure it for me ... So basically I have to decide who pays. Myself being personally annoied with those cr*p, or ppl that does not read the doc and gets open relay. I'd better stick my the current setup, what do you think? - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
Repeating this response since I didn't get a copy when I sent it this morning. -- How about putting in smtprelay.tab all non-routable private subnets per RFC or some kind of wildcard or special entry that matches the subnets of all installed network cards in the xmail server? For example, case 1: smtprelay.tab 10.0.0.0/8 169.254.0.0/16 172.16.0.0/12 192.168.0.0/16 or case 2: smtprelay.tab localsubnetsonly hmm just found in http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc3330.html that case 2 maybe should be 0.0.0.0/8 meaning Addresses in this block refer to source hosts on this network. Bill -- From: Davide Libenzi[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 5:52 PM To:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay On Wed, 31 Mar 2004, William Denniss wrote: why doesn't my xmail work is better than why am I listed in blacklists? (after sending thousands of spam emails) I feel. For you maybe. It's me that I'll receive personal emails whining about missing capabilities :-/ (note that 70% of XMail users does *not* read the doc, so I prefer the subtle form of RTFM that is a default open relay) - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
I guess I'm not trying to stifle it, but like everyone here, I have my = opinions. I do have to ask how many times does Davide have to say no before people = realize that he's not going to make the change? People may not be being = ungrateful, but beating this dead horse isn't going to make him change it. = It's HIS software (so his decision), yes it's open source, but that = doesn't change the fact that he's the writer/maintainer. Open source also = allowsfor people to change the code any way they see fit, including the = defaults for the smtprelay.tab file. If you're not happy with it change it, isn't THAT the beauty of open = source? If you think the documentation isn't up to snuff, write a howto. There's = one person on this list that writes a great Beginners Guide to... and = even he says to change it. It all comes down to the fact that you can = write it in 72 point text and people still won't RTFM. Dale [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/31/04 10:47PM On Thu, 2004-04-01 at 12:59, Dale Qualls wrote: Okay, color me stupid, but is it so tough to empty the darned smtprelay.t= ab=3D file? no - but I agree it's easy to miss. Even if it was left the way it was and there was a file named IMPORTANT.txt in the root directory of the archive that would suffice IMHO. I have always thought a little more documentation (or a little more well targeted documentation) was appropriate. I'm amazed at everyone bitching over a great product that no one pays = any =3D money for. Yeah this is how software improves isn't it, by everyone keeping their mouths shut. Nobody is being ungrateful, we are just raising issues and offering solutions. I would rather have people email me their concerns about the software I develop than not finding out about them till months later. This is the beauty of open source - the ability to actually have your feedback listened to and acted on. Why you are trying to stifle this valid conversation I do not know. Cheers, Will. --=20 William Denniss - will@ http://tanksoftware.com/=20 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
If open source just means ' please shut up' than closed source would be a much better alternative. I think that as a maintainer you should listen to the people using the software. This does not mean doing everything what people ask but listening. If there are things which the maintainer does not want to do he might delegate it to other people. As far as I can see Davide hates documentation. But that's okay, you should however in that case let other people do that job. In the end we might end up with both a good product AND good documentation. A win win situation so to say Wim -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Dale Qualls [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: donderdag 1 april 2004 15:54 Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Onderwerp: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide I guess I'm not trying to stifle it, but like everyone here, I have my = =3D opinions. I do have to ask how many times does Davide have to say no before people =3D realize that he's not going to make the change? People may = not be being =3D ungrateful, but beating this dead horse isn't going to make him change it. =3D It's HIS software (so his decision), yes it's open source, but that =3D doesn't change the fact that he's the writer/maintainer. Open source also =3D allowsfor people to change the code any way they see fit, including the =3D defaults for the smtprelay.tab file. If you're not happy with it change it, isn't THAT the beauty of open =3D source? If you think the documentation isn't up to snuff, write a howto. There's =3D one person on this list that writes a great Beginners Guide to... and =3D even he says to change it. It all comes down to the fact that you can =3D write it in 72 point text and people still won't RTFM. Dale [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/31/04 10:47PM On Thu, 2004-04-01 at 12:59, Dale Qualls wrote: Okay, color me stupid, but is it so tough to empty the darned=20 smtprelay.t=3D ab=3D3D file? no - but I agree it's easy to miss. Even if it was left the way it was and there was a file named IMPORTANT.txt in the root directory of the archive that would suffice IMHO. I have always thought a little more documentation (or a little more well targeted documentation) was appropriate. I'm amazed at everyone bitching over a great product that no one pays=20 =3D any =3D3D money for. Yeah this is how software improves isn't it, by everyone keeping their mouths shut. Nobody is being ungrateful, we are just raising issues and offering solutions. I would rather have people email me their concerns about the software I develop than not finding out about them till months later. This is the beauty of open source - the ability to actually have your feedback listened to and acted on. Why you are trying to stifle this valid conversation I do not know. Cheers, Will. --=3D20 William Denniss - will@ http://tanksoftware.com/=3D20 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Davide doesn't hate documentation but the users who DON'T READ IT. He just want to make it as simple as possible. Besides, he already stated that he changed his opinion regarding this issue, so now would be a realy good time to close this thread and let the MAN work - what he does best. Matic - Original Message - From: Wim Verveen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 4:51 PM Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide If open source just means ' please shut up' than closed source would be a much better alternative. I think that as a maintainer you should listen to the people using the software. This does not mean doing everything what people ask but listening. If there are things which the maintainer does not want to do he might delegate it to other people. As far as I can see Davide hates documentation. But that's okay, you should however in that case let other people do that job. In the end we might end up with both a good product AND good documentation. A win win situation so to say Wim -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Dale Qualls [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: donderdag 1 april 2004 15:54 Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Onderwerp: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide I guess I'm not trying to stifle it, but like everyone here, I have my = =3D opinions. I do have to ask how many times does Davide have to say no before people =3D realize that he's not going to make the change? People may = not be being =3D ungrateful, but beating this dead horse isn't going to make him change it. =3D It's HIS software (so his decision), yes it's open source, but that =3D doesn't change the fact that he's the writer/maintainer. Open source also =3D allowsfor people to change the code any way they see fit, including the =3D defaults for the smtprelay.tab file. If you're not happy with it change it, isn't THAT the beauty of open =3D source? If you think the documentation isn't up to snuff, write a howto. There's =3D one person on this list that writes a great Beginners Guide to... and =3D even he says to change it. It all comes down to the fact that you can =3D write it in 72 point text and people still won't RTFM. Dale [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/31/04 10:47PM On Thu, 2004-04-01 at 12:59, Dale Qualls wrote: Okay, color me stupid, but is it so tough to empty the darned=20 smtprelay.t=3D ab=3D3D file? no - but I agree it's easy to miss. Even if it was left the way it was and there was a file named IMPORTANT.txt in the root directory of the archive that would suffice IMHO. I have always thought a little more documentation (or a little more well targeted documentation) was appropriate. I'm amazed at everyone bitching over a great product that no one pays=20 =3D any =3D3D money for. Yeah this is how software improves isn't it, by everyone keeping their mouths shut. Nobody is being ungrateful, we are just raising issues and offering solutions. I would rather have people email me their concerns about the software I develop than not finding out about them till months later. This is the beauty of open source - the ability to actually have your feedback listened to and acted on. Why you are trying to stifle this valid conversation I do not know. Cheers, Will. --=3D20 William Denniss - will@ http://tanksoftware.com/=3D20 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Complainers, I do not usually get into these debates, but I know how hard it is developing little pieces of software here and there. So I can only imagine how much Davide has on his plate. Davide has never said, don't write documentation. If you are going to use opensource, than you have to understand what opensource involves. This is not MySQL, that has developers up the wazzu. This is ONE man, with contributors for any other code/projects. IF you have ever gone to xmailserver.org(sarcasm), you would notice that all of contributors links and documentation on the site. On top of it all, this list is very supportive. I haven't ran into one issue that hasn't been solved in this list. I also think it's incredibly rude to assume that Davide is not listening to other peoples ideas and what they want. Do you think that everything in XMail is only stuff that Davide wants, and he hasn't made ANY code for the user? I am going to end with this... Davide is the maintainer of XMail, if you don't like it, than you don't have to use it. Write your own mail server, or go use sendmail, qmail or something... than you can complain to whomever. Take the XMail code and add all you want to it, than release your own opensource project. Who knows, maybe Davide will thank you for getting all the complainers off his back hahaha. Alright, I am done ranting. ben Matic wrote: Davide doesn't hate documentation but the users who DON'T READ IT. He just want to make it as simple as possible. Besides, he already stated that he changed his opinion regarding this issue, so now would be a realy good time to close this thread and let the MAN work - what he does best. Matic - Original Message - From: Wim Verveen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 4:51 PM Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide If open source just means ' please shut up' than closed source would be a much better alternative. I think that as a maintainer you should listen to the people using the software. This does not mean doing everything what people ask but listening. If there are things which the maintainer does not want to do he might delegate it to other people. As far as I can see Davide hates documentation. But that's okay, you should however in that case let other people do that job. In the end we might end up with both a good product AND good documentation. A win win situation so to say Wim -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Dale Qualls [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: donderdag 1 april 2004 15:54 Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Onderwerp: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide I guess I'm not trying to stifle it, but like everyone here, I have my = =3D opinions. I do have to ask how many times does Davide have to say no before people =3D realize that he's not going to make the change? People may = not be being =3D ungrateful, but beating this dead horse isn't going to make him change it. =3D It's HIS software (so his decision), yes it's open source, but that =3D doesn't change the fact that he's the writer/maintainer. Open source also =3D allowsfor people to change the code any way they see fit, including the =3D defaults for the smtprelay.tab file. If you're not happy with it change it, isn't THAT the beauty of open =3D source? If you think the documentation isn't up to snuff, write a howto. There's =3D one person on this list that writes a great Beginners Guide to... and =3D even he says to change it. It all comes down to the fact that you can =3D write it in 72 point text and people still won't RTFM. Dale [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/31/04 10:47PM On Thu, 2004-04-01 at 12:59, Dale Qualls wrote: Okay, color me stupid, but is it so tough to empty the darned=20 smtprelay.t=3D ab=3D3D file? no - but I agree it's easy to miss. Even if it was left the way it was and there was a file named IMPORTANT.txt in the root directory of the archive that would suffice IMHO. I have always thought a little more documentation (or a little more well targeted documentation) was appropriate. I'm amazed at everyone bitching over a great product that no one pays=20 =3D any =3D3D money for. Yeah this is how software improves isn't it, by everyone keeping their mouths shut. Nobody is being ungrateful, we are just raising issues and offering solutions. I would rather have people email me their concerns about the software I develop than not finding out about them till months later. This is the beauty of open source - the ability to actually have your feedback listened to and acted on. Why you are trying to stifle this valid conversation I do not know. Cheers, Will. --=3D20 William Denniss - will@ http://tanksoftware.com/=3D20 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
I think 'complaining' and 'suggesting' are getting confused here. And personally I don't want to use anything else but I think it is in the interest of everyone to have better documentation. Volunteers would be needed to do that. =20 -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Benny [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: donderdag 1 april 2004 17:37 Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Onderwerp: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide =20 Complainers, =20 I do not usually get into these debates, but I know how=20 hard it is developing little pieces of software here and=20 there. So I can only imagine how much Davide has on his=20 plate. Davide has never said, don't write documentation. If=20 you are going to use opensource, than you have to understand=20 what opensource involves. This is not MySQL, that has=20 developers up the wazzu. This is ONE man, with contributors=20 for any other code/projects. IF you have ever gone to=20 xmailserver.org(sarcasm), you would notice that all of=20 contributors links and documentation on the site. On top of=20 it all, this list is very supportive. I haven't ran into one=20 issue that hasn't been solved in this list. I also think=20 it's incredibly rude to assume that Davide is not listening=20 to other peoples ideas and what they want. Do you think that=20 everything in XMail is only stuff that Davide wants, and he=20 hasn't made ANY code for the user?=20 =20 I am going to end with this... Davide is the maintainer of=20 XMail, if you don't like it, than you don't have to use it. =20 Write your own mail server, or go use sendmail, qmail or=20 something... than you can complain to whomever. Take the=20 XMail code and add all you want to it, than release your own=20 opensource project. Who knows, maybe Davide will thank you=20 for getting all the complainers off his back hahaha. =20 Alright, I am done ranting. =20 ben =20 =20 Matic wrote: =20 Davide doesn't hate documentation but the users who DON'T=20 READ IT. He=20 just want to make it as simple as possible. Besides, he=20 already stated=20 that he changed his opinion regarding this issue, so now would be a=20 realy good time to close this thread and let the MAN work -=20 what he does best. Matic - Original Message - From: Wim Verveen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 4:51 PM Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide =20 If open source just means ' please shut up' than closed=20 source would=20 be a much better alternative. I think that as a maintainer=20 you should=20 listen to the people using the software. This does not mean doing=20 everything what people ask but listening. If there are things which=20 the maintainer does not want to do he might delegate it to other=20 people. As far as I can see Davide hates documentation. But that's=20 okay, you should however in that case let other people do=20 that job. In=20 the end we might end up with both a good product AND good=20 documentation. A win win situation so to say Wim -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Dale Qualls [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: donderdag 1 april 2004 15:54 Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Onderwerp: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide I guess I'm not trying to stifle it, but like everyone=20 here, I have my=20 =3D =3D3D opinions. I do have to ask how many times does Davide have to say no before=20 people =3D3D realize that he's not going to make the change? =20 People may=20 =3D not be being =3D3D ungrateful, but beating this dead horse=20 isn't going=20 to make him change it. =3D3D It's HIS software (so his=20 decision), yes=20 it's open source, but that =3D3D doesn't change the fact that=20 he's the=20 writer/maintainer. Open source also =3D3D allowsfor people to = change=20 the code any way they see fit, including the =3D3D defaults for the=20 smtprelay.tab file. If you're not happy with it change it, isn't THAT the=20 beauty of open=20 =3D3D source? If you think the documentation isn't up to snuff, write a howto. There's =3D3D one person on this list that writes a great Beginners = Guide to... and =3D3D even he says to change it. It all=20 comes down to=20 the fact that you can =3D3D write it in 72 point text and=20 people still won't RTFM. Dale =20 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/31/04 10:47PM =20 On Thu, 2004-04-01 at 12:59, Dale Qualls wrote: =20 Okay, color me stupid, but is it so tough to empty the darned=3D20=20 smtprelay.t=3D3D =20 ab=3D3D3D =20 file? =20 no - but I agree it's easy to miss. Even if it was left the way it=20 was and there was a file named IMPORTANT.txt in the root=20 directory=20 of the archive that would suffice IMHO. I have always thought a=20 little more documentation (or a little more well targeted=20 documentation) was appropriate. =20 I'm amazed at everyone bitching over a great
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Well, suggesting turns into complaining. Thats why there are 20+ emails on this issue. Yes, you would need volunteers if you want to make the documentation better. As previously stated by Dale Qualls, there is another effort in documentation, so you could join up with that person to give back to XMail. I am not sure the link on that effort, so if someone could post it, than maybe that might help get the ball rolling for the people that want to contribute. Ben Wim Verveen wrote: I think 'complaining' and 'suggesting' are getting confused here. And personally I don't want to use anything else but I think it is in the interest of everyone to have better documentation. Volunteers would be needed to do that. =20 -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Benny [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: donderdag 1 april 2004 17:37 Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Onderwerp: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide =20 Complainers, =20 I do not usually get into these debates, but I know how=20 hard it is developing little pieces of software here and=20 there. So I can only imagine how much Davide has on his=20 plate. Davide has never said, don't write documentation. If=20 you are going to use opensource, than you have to understand=20 what opensource involves. This is not MySQL, that has=20 developers up the wazzu. This is ONE man, with contributors=20 for any other code/projects. IF you have ever gone to=20 xmailserver.org(sarcasm), you would notice that all of=20 contributors links and documentation on the site. On top of=20 it all, this list is very supportive. I haven't ran into one=20 issue that hasn't been solved in this list. I also think=20 it's incredibly rude to assume that Davide is not listening=20 to other peoples ideas and what they want. Do you think that=20 everything in XMail is only stuff that Davide wants, and he=20 hasn't made ANY code for the user?=20 =20 I am going to end with this... Davide is the maintainer of=20 XMail, if you don't like it, than you don't have to use it. =20 Write your own mail server, or go use sendmail, qmail or=20 something... than you can complain to whomever. Take the=20 XMail code and add all you want to it, than release your own=20 opensource project. Who knows, maybe Davide will thank you=20 for getting all the complainers off his back hahaha. =20 Alright, I am done ranting. =20 ben =20 =20 Matic wrote: =20 Davide doesn't hate documentation but the users who DON'T=20 READ IT. He=20 just want to make it as simple as possible. Besides, he=20 already stated=20 that he changed his opinion regarding this issue, so now would be a=20 realy good time to close this thread and let the MAN work -=20 what he does best. Matic - Original Message - From: Wim Verveen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 4:51 PM Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide =20 If open source just means ' please shut up' than closed=20 source would=20 be a much better alternative. I think that as a maintainer=20 you should=20 listen to the people using the software. This does not mean doing=20 everything what people ask but listening. If there are things which=20 the maintainer does not want to do he might delegate it to other=20 people. As far as I can see Davide hates documentation. But that's=20 okay, you should however in that case let other people do=20 that job. In=20 the end we might end up with both a good product AND good=20 documentation. A win win situation so to say Wim -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Dale Qualls [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: donderdag 1 april 2004 15:54 Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Onderwerp: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide I guess I'm not trying to stifle it, but like everyone=20 here, I have my=20 =3D =3D3D opinions. I do have to ask how many times does Davide have to say no before=20 people =3D3D realize that he's not going to make the change? =20 People may=20 =3D not be being =3D3D ungrateful, but beating this dead horse=20 isn't going=20 to make him change it. =3D3D It's HIS software (so his=20 decision), yes=20 it's open source, but that =3D3D doesn't change the fact that=20 he's the=20 writer/maintainer. Open source also =3D3D allowsfor people to = change=20 the code any way they see fit, including the =3D3D defaults for the=20 smtprelay.tab file. If you're not happy with it change it, isn't THAT the=20 beauty of open=20 =3D3D source? If you think the documentation isn't up to snuff, write a howto. There's =3D3D one person on this list that writes a great Beginners = Guide to... and =3D3D even he says to change it. It all=20 comes down to=20 the fact that you can =3D3D write it in 72 point text and=20 people still won't
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Nobody is complaining. All everybody is doing is suggesting that XMail should not ship as an open relay. The open relay issue is an extremely obvious issue. No email server should ever ship as an open relay, regardless if it is free or paid for. And it is a very easy fix. One line of one tab file needs changed. I agree completely that every sysadmin should read the manual. That is as obvious as the open relay issue. However, a lot of new users don't read the manual because they are too lazy. I agree with the others who have said the lazy newbies should not be allowed to relay mail until they read the manual. That is a better solution than allowing their new XMail servers to become open relays until they read the manual. This is the same thing we all asked Microsoft to do with IIS. With version through IIS5, the web server was totally insecure by default and the sysadmin's job was to secure it. With IIS6, it is the opposite. IIS6 ships so secure that nothing beyond simple static html pages can be served, and the sysadmin's job is to open up the features they need. This was a good change, and a major reason we have not seen the rash of vulnerabilities in IIS6 that we saw in previous versions. Shipping server software so secure that the sysadmin has to actually open things back up to get it to work is a good thing, at least with the crap that goes on these days. An email server's default setup should be no different. Why ship an email server as an open relay? There is no valid reason. Every email server should be shipped as a closed relay, just like we expect every web server should not be shipped with every misc feature under the sun enabled by default. - Original Message - From: Dale Qualls [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 8:59 PM Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide rant Okay, color me stupid, but is it so tough to empty the darned smtprelay.tab= file? I'm amazed at everyone bitching over a great product that no one pays any = money for. I agree that spam is an issue, I block over a million pieces a month, but = for pete's sake people need to take a little responsibility for their own = server and configure the damned thing properly. Leave the poor guy alone (so he can work on 2.0 :-). If you don't like = having to actually configure your own server then go find something else = to use nowhere near as stable as XMail and that you have to pay for. /rant [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/31/04 07:52PM On Thu, 1 Apr 2004, Orion Productions wrote: I really hope you'll reconsider your decision! :-) I did - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
On Thu, 1 Apr 2004, Shiloh Jennings wrote: This is the same thing we all asked Microsoft to do with IIS. You seem to forget that MS (note not $ but S) has quite a few ppl for tech support, and users do not send emails directly to billg when something does not work as they expected. Anyway, this thread lasted enough. I did change smtprelay.tab with the private inet classes. I also created a new distribution list [EMAIL PROTECTED] where I will forward all messages coming from lame users, and your addresses are already subscribed :-) - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
At 10:54 4/1/2004, you wrote: Why ship an email server as an open relay? There is no valid reason. I don't mean to be rude, nor to step on anyone's toes, but... Are you willing to answer the flood of email resulting from people downloading the product and not being able to figure out why they can't make it send email? Including, or even especially, those which are sent to Davide directly? I've worked tech support - I know *exactly* how stupid users can be. And every single one of them will expect to have their hand held all the way through even the simplest operations. Do you seriously expect Davide to spend what could amount to possibly several hours each day responding to such users? I think that seems unreasonable, considering the lack of compensation to him. If all of those users would post to this mailing list, I'd say no problem. But it's the same people who don't read the manual in the first place that would never be able to figure out that this list even exists, much less how to join it and post to it. No, they'd simply dump all their support questions into Davide's mailbox, and expect him to whip out the solutions, customized to their individual configurations (of which no details would be provided in the emails - Davide would have to develop his telepathy for that part of it). Myself, I don't care either way about this issue. Open or closed. What I do care about is having Davide end up so buried in asinine email from people too stupid to look in the manual, and as a result having him decide it's not worth his time. Just a thought. From someone who's been there. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
My=20twopenneth=20to=20the=20open=20relay=20debate=20:) If=20I=20was=20writing=20XMail=20i=20would=20make=20private=20addresses=20= (as=20suggested=20previously)=20open=20relays=20(i.e.=2010.x,=20192.x=20an= d=20172.x)=20and=20everything=20else=20restricted. But=20I'm=20not,=20Davide=20is,=20and=20whatever=20he=20says=20is=20the=20= end=20of=20the=20story=20in=20my=20view=20:) I=20managed=20to=20find=20the=20open=20relay=20warning=20in=20the=20docs=20= when=20I=20first=20looked=20at=20it=20so=20it=20can't=20be=20that=20well=20= hidden. Cheers=20again=20for=20the=20program=20Davide!=20=20It's=20class. David __ This=20email=20has=20been=20scanned=20by=20the=20MessageLabs=20Email=20Sec= urity=20System. For=20more=20information=20please=20visit=20http://www.messagelabs.com/ema= il=20 __ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
At 11:02 4/1/2004, you wrote: I also created a new distribution list [EMAIL PROTECTED] where I will forward all messages coming from lame users, and your addresses are already subscribed :-) If this is not simply humor, you can add me to that list. I'm not an expert in every setting or option (not by far) but I can certainly handle the basics of configuration. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
On Thu, 1 Apr 2004, Tracy wrote: If this is not simply humor, you can add me to that list. I'm not an expert in every setting or option (not by far) but I can certainly handle the basics of configuration. It was a joke ;) Actually, since it's Apr 1, I could have done better :-) - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Me too, davide. ben Tracy wrote: At 11:02 4/1/2004, you wrote: I also created a new distribution list [EMAIL PROTECTED] where I will forward all messages coming from lame users, and your addresses are already subscribed :-) If this is not simply humor, you can add me to that list. I'm not an expert in every setting or option (not by far) but I can certainly handle the basics of configuration. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Damnit! I forgot about fools day!!! Yeah, you should have said 2.0 is out! hahaha Maybe not funny at first, but we would have seen the humor. Ben Davide Libenzi wrote: On Thu, 1 Apr 2004, Tracy wrote: If this is not simply humor, you can add me to that list. I'm not an expert in every setting or option (not by far) but I can certainly handle the basics of configuration. It was a joke ;) Actually, since it's Apr 1, I could have done better :-) - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Is anyone else getting all of these =3D20? Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] = On Behalf Of David Stebbings Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 8:09 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide My=3D20twopenneth=3D20to=3D20the=3D20open=3D20relay=3D20debate=3D20:) If=3D20I=3D20was=3D20writing=3D20XMail=3D20i=3D20would=3D20make=3D20priva= te=3D20addresses=3D20=3D (as=3D20suggested=3D20previously)=3D20open=3D20relays=3D20(i.e.=3D2010.x,= =3D20192.x=3D20an=3D d=3D20172.x)=3D20and=3D20everything=3D20else=3D20restricted. But=3D20I'm=3D20not,=3D20Davide=3D20is,=3D20and=3D20whatever=3D20he=3D20s= ays=3D20is=3D20the=3D20=3D end=3D20of=3D20the=3D20story=3D20in=3D20my=3D20view=3D20:) I=3D20managed=3D20to=3D20find=3D20the=3D20open=3D20relay=3D20warning=3D20= in=3D20the=3D20docs=3D20=3D when=3D20I=3D20first=3D20looked=3D20at=3D20it=3D20so=3D20it=3D20can't=3D2= 0be=3D20that=3D20well=3D20=3D hidden. Cheers=3D20again=3D20for=3D20the=3D20program=3D20Davide!=3D20=3D20It's=3D= 20class. David __ This=3D20email=3D20has=3D20been=3D20scanned=3D20by=3D20the=3D20MessageLab= s=3D20Email=3D20Sec=3D urity=3D20System. For=3D20more=3D20information=3D20please=3D20visit=3D20http://www.messagel= abs.com/ema=3D il=3D20 __ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Yup...you're not seeing things. :-) Is anyone else getting all of these =3D20? Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] = On Behalf Of David Stebbings Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 8:09 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide My=3D20twopenneth=3D20to=3D20the=3D20open=3D20relay=3D20debate=3D20:) If=3D20I=3D20was=3D20writing=3D20XMail=3D20i=3D20would=3D20make=3D20priva= te=3D20addresses=3D20=3D (as=3D20suggested=3D20previously)=3D20open=3D20relays=3D20(i.e.=3D2010.x,= =3D20192.x=3D20an=3D d=3D20172.x)=3D20and=3D20everything=3D20else=3D20restricted. But=3D20I'm=3D20not,=3D20Davide=3D20is,=3D20and=3D20whatever=3D20he=3D20s= ays=3D20is=3D20the=3D20=3D end=3D20of=3D20the=3D20story=3D20in=3D20my=3D20view=3D20:) I=3D20managed=3D20to=3D20find=3D20the=3D20open=3D20relay=3D20warning=3D20= in=3D20the=3D20docs=3D20=3D when=3D20I=3D20first=3D20looked=3D20at=3D20it=3D20so=3D20it=3D20can't=3D2= 0be=3D20that=3D20well=3D20=3D hidden. Cheers=3D20again=3D20for=3D20the=3D20program=3D20Davide!=3D20=3D20It's=3D= 20class. David __ This=3D20email=3D20has=3D20been=3D20scanned=3D20by=3D20the=3D20MessageLab= s=3D20Email=3D20Sec=3D urity=3D20System. For=3D20more=3D20information=3D20please=3D20visit=3D20http://www.messagel= abs.com/ema=3D il=3D20 __ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Yes -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of M Jenck Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 1:53 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide Is anyone else getting all of these =3D20? Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] = On Behalf Of David Stebbings Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 8:09 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide My=3D20twopenneth=3D20to=3D20the=3D20open=3D20relay=3D20debate=3D20:) If=3D20I=3D20was=3D20writing=3D20XMail=3D20i=3D20would=3D20mak e=3D20priva= te=3D20addresses=3D20=3D (as=3D20suggested=3D20previously)=3D20open=3D20relays=3D20(i.e .=3D2010.x,= =3D20192.x=3D20an=3D d=3D20172.x)=3D20and=3D20everything=3D20else=3D20restricted. But=3D20I'm=3D20not,=3D20Davide=3D20is,=3D20and=3D20whatever=3 D20he=3D20s= ays=3D20is=3D20the=3D20=3D end=3D20of=3D20the=3D20story=3D20in=3D20my=3D20view=3D20:) I=3D20managed=3D20to=3D20find=3D20the=3D20open=3D20relay=3D20w arning=3D20= in=3D20the=3D20docs=3D20=3D when=3D20I=3D20first=3D20looked=3D20at=3D20it=3D20so=3D20it=3D 20can't=3D2= 0be=3D20that=3D20well=3D20=3D hidden. Cheers=3D20again=3D20for=3D20the=3D20program=3D20Davide!=3D20= 3D20It's=3D= 20class. David __ This=3D20email=3D20has=3D20been=3D20scanned=3D20by=3D20the=3D2 0MessageLab= s=3D20Email=3D20Sec=3D urity=3D20System. For=3D20more=3D20information=3D20please=3D20visit=3D20http://w ww.messagel= abs.com/ema=3D il=3D20 __ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
A Hex Markup in MIME :) Someone needs to fix their parser :) - Original Message - From: Michael Schwarz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 5:05 PM Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide Yes -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of M Jenck Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 1:53 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide Is anyone else getting all of these =3D20? Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] = On Behalf Of David Stebbings Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 8:09 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide My=3D20twopenneth=3D20to=3D20the=3D20open=3D20relay=3D20debate=3D20:) If=3D20I=3D20was=3D20writing=3D20XMail=3D20i=3D20would=3D20mak e=3D20priva= te=3D20addresses=3D20=3D (as=3D20suggested=3D20previously)=3D20open=3D20relays=3D20(i.e .=3D2010.x,= =3D20192.x=3D20an=3D d=3D20172.x)=3D20and=3D20everything=3D20else=3D20restricted. But=3D20I'm=3D20not,=3D20Davide=3D20is,=3D20and=3D20whatever=3 D20he=3D20s= ays=3D20is=3D20the=3D20=3D end=3D20of=3D20the=3D20story=3D20in=3D20my=3D20view=3D20:) I=3D20managed=3D20to=3D20find=3D20the=3D20open=3D20relay=3D20w arning=3D20= in=3D20the=3D20docs=3D20=3D when=3D20I=3D20first=3D20looked=3D20at=3D20it=3D20so=3D20it=3D 20can't=3D2= 0be=3D20that=3D20well=3D20=3D hidden. Cheers=3D20again=3D20for=3D20the=3D20program=3D20Davide!=3D20= 3D20It's=3D= 20class. David __ This=3D20email=3D20has=3D20been=3D20scanned=3D20by=3D20the=3D2 0MessageLab= s=3D20Email=3D20Sec=3D urity=3D20System. For=3D20more=3D20information=3D20please=3D20visit=3D20http://w ww.messagel= abs.com/ema=3D il=3D20 __ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
RaveRod schreef: Are there any other mail servers that ship with an open relay? All the mail servers I've used have closed relays and in the manual/docs/whatever they say that to use a relay you must open it first and that doing so, you should understand the risks. Microsoft Exchange Server :-) -- Peter Lindeman - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
Did you miss this is some way? http://www.xmailserver.org/Readme.html#configuration In particular the step that says 'THIS IS IMPORTANT'. The difference, giving for granted that user do not read the documentation, is that if I close the relay I will receive tons of email saying (subjects in random order): Nope, didn't miss that, and as I say, I'll admit I was stupid. All I'm suggesting is that instead of THIS IS IMPORTANT you say This is important! By default, XMAIL is configured as an Open Relay Server! Saying something is important, and trusting that your users will know what the configuration files mean, may not be the best solution. -Tim - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
=20 -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Michael Schwarz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 10:57 Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Onderwerp: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay =20 RaveRod schreef: =20 Are there any other mail servers that ship with an open relay? All the mail servers I've used have closed relays and in the manual/docs/whatever they =20 Microsoft Exchange Server :-) =20 -- Peter Lindeman - =20 It's not a mailserver, it is a bug! ;-) =20 Michael That is a silly comment. Exchange is a fine product. I'm also wondering if it is really true that exchange 2000 or at least 2003 is an actual open relay from the start. Exchange 5.5 and lower were that way but the whole SMTP interface was changed. Anyway, the help of Exchange 2003 says: Relaying: All except the list below=20 Use this option to prevent a specific list of computers from relaying e-mail messages through the virtual server, while allowing all other computers to connect.=20 Caution If this option is selected, and anonymous access is allowed as an authentication method, any computer on the Internet that is not on the list will be able to relay e-mail messages through the virtual server. This condition is called anonymous relay, and may result in unauthorized users relaying junk e-mail or other unwanted messages through your server. Additionally, operating an anonymous relay may be in violation of your Internet providers' terms of service.=20 This is better than a 'this is important' message. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
RaveRod schreef: Are there any other mail servers that ship with an open relay? All the mail servers I've used have closed relays and in the manual/docs/whatever they Microsoft Exchange Server :-) -- Peter Lindeman - It's not a mailserver, it is a bug! ;-) Michael - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
I originally missed that section in configuration. I was reading in = the SMTPRELAY.TAB section, didn't see anything either way regarding open or closed relay and just moved on. At least put a blurb in that section of = the doc. I didn't mean to cause such an uproar, I thought this was an easy thing = to change. I know what you mean when you say people don't read = documentation, I deal with that a lot. If you really don't want to change the default setting, then at least add more documentation for the few people that do read it. Thanks. -Don -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] = On Behalf Of Davide Libenzi Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 1:13 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay On Wed, 31 Mar 2004, S=F6nke Ruempler wrote: Davide, you should mention it in the doc like=20 =20 h3 style=3Dcolor: redEMPTY SMTPRELAY.TAB OR YOU HAVE AN OPEN = RELAY/h3 I won't help, sadly. Ppl does not read the doc, otherwise they will be=20 reading the configuration section, expecially the 'THIS IS IMPORTANT'=20 thing. - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
Maybe something could be added in some file to prevent xmail from starting if important configuration files hasn't been edited? Eg: $./xmail start Impossible to start the server, RTFM. $ 2cents -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Don Drake Sent: 31 mars, 2004 09:10 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay I originally missed that section in configuration. I was reading in = the SMTPRELAY.TAB section, didn't see anything either way regarding open or closed relay and just moved on. At least put a blurb in that section of = the doc. I didn't mean to cause such an uproar, I thought this was an easy thing = to change. I know what you mean when you say people don't read = documentation, I deal with that a lot. If you really don't want to change the default setting, then at least add more documentation for the few people that do read it. Thanks. -Don -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] = On Behalf Of Davide Libenzi Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 1:13 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay On Wed, 31 Mar 2004, S=F6nke Ruempler wrote: Davide, you should mention it in the doc like=20 =20 h3 style=3Dcolor: redEMPTY SMTPRELAY.TAB OR YOU HAVE AN OPEN = RELAY/h3 I won't help, sadly. Ppl does not read the doc, otherwise they will be=20 reading the configuration section, expecially the 'THIS IS IMPORTANT'=20 thing. - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
As maintainer of the XMail project I am afraid it is your duty to make it a 'safe' server by default. The fact that '70% of the folks don't read docs' only encourages a change in the defaults. Make it a closed relay. Set up mailfilters for your inbox, deleting any mail with the subjects lines you mentioned above ;-) And the Net will get less open relays per day. I must agree completely. Every email server should ship as a closed relay. XMail supports SMTP AUTH by default, so an end user could still relay simply by enabling SMTP AUTH in their email client software. Shipping XMail as an open relay only serves to create more of a problem (email server gets turned into a spam cannon; email server gets blocked by every major ISP). - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
Hello Davide, I read your opinion regarding this issue and read the whole thread. I strongly agree with the fact that it should be a closed relay by default (as most people obviously do), we all should be doing everything we can to decrease the ever-growing plague that is spam! However, I also understand your point-of-view, but am pretty sure that the proposal of including only the private networks would be sufficient to avoid at least 90% of the mails that you are worrying about! 10.0.0.0/8 172.16.0.0/12 192.168.0.0/16 + Beside these, there is Microsoft's 169.254.0.0 range of default IP addresses that are allocated to systems when they are unable to obtain address from a DHCP server. If you include these three or four ranges as default configuration, you'll deal with most dummy users that don't care to read the docs... and provide a good basic configuration for a lot of situations in which XMail is used on the Internet! I really hope you'll reconsider your decision! :-) Best regards, Frederic - Original Message - From: Shiloh Jennings To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 8:19 PM Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay As maintainer of the XMail project I am afraid it is your duty to make it a 'safe' server by default. The fact that '70% of the folks don't read docs' only encourages a change in the defaults. Make it a closed relay. Set up mailfilters for your inbox, deleting any mail with the subjects lines you mentioned above ;-) And the Net will get less open relays per day. I must agree completely. Every email server should ship as a closed relay. XMail supports SMTP AUTH by default, so an end user could still relay simply by enabling SMTP AUTH in their email client software. Shipping XMail as an open relay only serves to create more of a problem (email server gets turned into a spam cannon; email server gets blocked by every major ISP). - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
On Thu, 1 Apr 2004, Orion Productions wrote: I really hope you'll reconsider your decision! :-) I did - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
rant Okay, color me stupid, but is it so tough to empty the darned smtprelay.tab= file? I'm amazed at everyone bitching over a great product that no one pays any = money for. I agree that spam is an issue, I block over a million pieces a month, but = for pete's sake people need to take a little responsibility for their own = server and configure the damned thing properly. Leave the poor guy alone (so he can work on 2.0 :-). If you don't like = having to actually configure your own server then go find something else = to use nowhere near as stable as XMail and that you have to pay for. /rant [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/31/04 07:52PM On Thu, 1 Apr 2004, Orion Productions wrote: I really hope you'll reconsider your decision! :-) I did - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay @ Davide
On Thu, 2004-04-01 at 12:59, Dale Qualls wrote: Okay, color me stupid, but is it so tough to empty the darned smtprelay.tab= file? no - but I agree it's easy to miss. Even if it was left the way it was and there was a file named IMPORTANT.txt in the root directory of the archive that would suffice IMHO. I have always thought a little more documentation (or a little more well targeted documentation) was appropriate. I'm amazed at everyone bitching over a great product that no one pays any = money for. Yeah this is how software improves isn't it, by everyone keeping their mouths shut. Nobody is being ungrateful, we are just raising issues and offering solutions. I would rather have people email me their concerns about the software I develop than not finding out about them till months later. This is the beauty of open source - the ability to actually have your feedback listened to and acted on. Why you are trying to stifle this valid conversation I do not know. Cheers, Will. -- William Denniss - will@ http://tanksoftware.com/ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
On Tue, 30 Mar 2004, Don Drake wrote: Can you update the default distribution to not have 0.0.0.0[TAB]0.0.0.0 as the default value for smtprelay.tab? It makes no sense to distribute the default configuration of the server as an open relay. I forgot to change that file on a second server, fortunately only a few emails slipped by and I was watching my log files. I'll be overfloweth with messages like Why XMail does not send emails? Let me think about it ... - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
I agree also - no need to make it easy for spammers. The doco should also state that this is a closed relay by default, so that we don't get too many I can't relay emails. Rob :-) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of RaveRod Sent: Wednesday, 31 March 2004 10:24 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay I personally think this is a good idea also. David? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Don Drake Sent: Wednesday, 31 March 2004 10:18 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Default Open Relay Can you update the default distribution to not have 0.0.0.0[TAB]0.0.0.0 as the default value for smtprelay.tab? It makes no sense to distribute the default configuration of the server as an open relay. I forgot to change that file on a second server, fortunately only a few emails slipped by and I was watching my log files. How about making the default value 127.0.0.1[TAB]255.255.255.255? Thanks. -Don Donald Drake President Drake Consulting http://www.drakeconsult.com/ 312-560-1574 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
I also agree to close it by default so that it will force people to understand what they are doing before opening. So long as there is a suitable message in the docs, this should be ok. why doesn't my xmail work is better than why am I listed in blacklists? (after sending thousands of spam emails) I feel. Will. On Wed, 2004-03-31 at 11:01, Rob Arends wrote: I agree also - no need to make it easy for spammers. The doco should also state that this is a closed relay by default, so that we don't get too many I can't relay emails. Rob :-) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of RaveRod Sent: Wednesday, 31 March 2004 10:24 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay I personally think this is a good idea also. David? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Don Drake Sent: Wednesday, 31 March 2004 10:18 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Default Open Relay Can you update the default distribution to not have 0.0.0.0[TAB]0.0.0.0 as the default value for smtprelay.tab? It makes no sense to distribute the default configuration of the server as an open relay. I forgot to change that file on a second server, fortunately only a few emails slipped by and I was watching my log files. How about making the default value 127.0.0.1[TAB]255.255.255.255? Thanks. -Don Donald Drake President Drake Consulting http://www.drakeconsult.com/ 312-560-1574 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- William Denniss - will@ http://tanksoftware.com/ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
On Wed, 31 Mar 2004, William Denniss wrote: why doesn't my xmail work is better than why am I listed in blacklists? (after sending thousands of spam emails) I feel. For you maybe. It's me that I'll receive personal emails whining about missing capabilities :-/ (note that 70% of XMail users does *not* read the doc, so I prefer the subtle form of RTFM that is a default open relay) - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
Are there any other mail servers that ship with an open relay? All the mail servers I've used have closed relays and in the manual/docs/whatever they say that to use a relay you must open it first and that doing so, you should understand the risks. I hazard to guess at the amount of people who download XMail and leave the relay open. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Davide Libenzi Sent: Wednesday, 31 March 2004 11:53 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay On Wed, 31 Mar 2004, William Denniss wrote: why doesn't my xmail work is better than why am I listed in blacklists? (after sending thousands of spam emails) I feel. For you maybe. It's me that I'll receive personal emails whining about missing capabilities :-/ (note that 70% of XMail users does *not* read the doc, so I prefer the subtle form of RTFM that is a default open relay) - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
I guess I don't understand the use case of a new installation with a closed-relay not sending email. At least add some more verbiage to the documentation in the SMTPRELAY.TAB mentioning an example line showing how to make it a closed relay. It's only mentioned in one other section of the doc, saying to adjust it to make it a closed relay. Thanks. -Don -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Davide Libenzi Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 7:00 PM To: XMail mailing list Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay On Tue, 30 Mar 2004, Don Drake wrote: Can you update the default distribution to not have 0.0.0.0[TAB]0.0.0.0 as the default value for smtprelay.tab? It makes no sense to distribute the default configuration of the server as an open relay. I forgot to change that file on a second server, fortunately only a few emails slipped by and I was watching my log files. I'll be overfloweth with messages like Why XMail does not send emails? Let me think about it ... - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
A big fat red warning message would be appropriate I think. Not everyone realises the risks (who would find our server in a few days anyway? I'll read the docs and secure it all up next week.) Will. On Wed, 2004-03-31 at 12:58, Don Drake wrote: I guess I don't understand the use case of a new installation with a closed-relay not sending email. At least add some more verbiage to the documentation in the SMTPRELAY.TAB mentioning an example line showing how to make it a closed relay. It's only mentioned in one other section of the doc, saying to adjust it to make it a closed relay. Thanks. -Don -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Davide Libenzi Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 7:00 PM To: XMail mailing list Subject: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay On Tue, 30 Mar 2004, Don Drake wrote: Can you update the default distribution to not have 0.0.0.0[TAB]0.0.0.0 as the default value for smtprelay.tab? It makes no sense to distribute the default configuration of the server as an open relay. I forgot to change that file on a second server, fortunately only a few emails slipped by and I was watching my log files. I'll be overfloweth with messages like Why XMail does not send emails? Let me think about it ... - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- William Denniss - will@ http://tanksoftware.com/ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
I guess I don't understand the use case of a new installation with a closed-relay not sending email. At least add some more verbiage to the documentation in the SMTPRELAY.TAB mentioning an example line showing how to make it a closed relay. It's only mentioned in one other section of the doc, saying to adjust it to make it a closed relay. -Don I have to agree. I'll admit this makes me an idiot, but my first installation I accumulated 40,000 bounces in my postmaster inbox between going home on the go-live date and coming in the next morning. At the very least a note in the tab file saying WARNING, the default configuration is an open relay! or some such. I know it's not smart, but I just never imagined that any mail servers defaults would be wide open nowadays. Tim - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
On Tue, 30 Mar 2004, Tim McGarvey wrote: I have to agree. I'll admit this makes me an idiot, but my first installation I accumulated 40,000 bounces in my postmaster inbox between going home on the go-live date and coming in the next morning. At the very least a note in the tab file saying WARNING, the default configuration is an open relay! or some such. I know it's not smart, but I just never imagined that any mail servers defaults would be wide open nowadays. Did you miss this is some way? http://www.xmailserver.org/Readme.html#configuration In particular the step that says 'THIS IS IMPORTANT'. The difference, giving for granted that user do not read the documentation, is that if I close the relay I will receive tons of email saying (subjects in random order): I cannot send message through XMail ... What does relay denied means ... My server does not work, can you configure it for me ... So basically I have to decide who pays. Myself being personally annoied with those cr*p, or ppl that does not read the doc and gets open relay. I'd better stick my the current setup, what do you think? - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
So basically I have to decide who pays. Myself being personally annoied with those cr*p, or ppl that does not read the doc and gets open relay. I'd better stick my the current setup, what do you think? Davide, you should mention it in the doc like h3 style=color: redEMPTY SMTPRELAY.TAB OR YOU HAVE AN OPEN RELAY/h3 ;-) - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
I agree. An email server admin should now about relaying and configure it appropiatly=20 -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Davide Libenzi [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 9:02 Aan: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Onderwerp: [xmail] Re: Default Open Relay =20 On Tue, 30 Mar 2004, Tim McGarvey wrote: =20 I have to agree. I'll admit this makes me an idiot, but my first=20 installation I accumulated 40,000 bounces in my postmaster inbox=20 between going home on the go-live date and coming in the=20 next morning. =20 At the very least a note in the tab file saying WARNING,=20 the default=20 configuration is an open relay! or some such. I know it's=20 not smart,=20 but I just never imagined that any mail servers defaults=20 would be wide open nowadays. =20 Did you miss this is some way? =20 http://www.xmailserver.org/Readme.html#configuration =20 In particular the step that says 'THIS IS IMPORTANT'. The=20 difference, giving for granted that user do not read the=20 documentation, is that if I close the relay I will receive=20 tons of email saying (subjects in random order): =20 I cannot send message through XMail ... What does relay denied means ... My server does not work, can you configure it for me ... =20 So basically I have to decide who pays. Myself being=20 personally annoied with those cr*p, or ppl that does not read=20 the doc and gets open relay.=20 I'd better stick my the current setup, what do you think? =20 =20 =20 - Davide =20 =20 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] =20 =20 =20 =20 =20 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
On Wed, 31 Mar 2004, Sönke Ruempler wrote: Davide, you should mention it in the doc like h3 style=color: redEMPTY SMTPRELAY.TAB OR YOU HAVE AN OPEN RELAY/h3 I won't help, sadly. Ppl does not read the doc, otherwise they will be reading the configuration section, expecially the 'THIS IS IMPORTANT' thing. - Davide - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
I won't help, sadly. Ppl does not read the doc, otherwise they will be reading the configuration section, expecially the 'THIS IS IMPORTANT' thing. Another idea: Maybe it helps if you just add 127.0.0.1/32 and 192.168.0.0/16 in the smtprelay.tab by default. I guess most people that don't read the doc are home admins with private networks. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[xmail] Re: Default Open Relay
On [Tue, 30.03. 23:02], Davide Libenzi wrote: http://www.xmailserver.org/Readme.html#configuration In particular the step that says 'THIS IS IMPORTANT'. The difference, giving for granted that user do not read the documentation, is that if I close the relay I will receive tons of email saying (subjects in random order): I cannot send message through XMail ... What does relay denied means ... My server does not work, can you configure it for me ... So basically I have to decide who pays. Myself being personally annoied with those cr*p, or ppl that does not read the doc and gets open relay. I'd better stick my the current setup, what do you think? As administrators of mailservers should be security aware it would be better someone _not_ knowing what he/she is doing has to read the docs _before_ anything works. About 1/3 of the mails we recieve nowadays are viri, I do not use a spam filter, so any assumption I make here must be wrong. But I think it must be in the same magnitude. As maintainer of the XMail project I am afraid it is your duty to make it a 'safe' server by default. The fact that '70% of the folks don't read docs' only encourages a change in the defaults. Make it a closed relay. Set up mailfilters for your inbox, deleting any mail with the subjects lines you mentioned above ;-) And the Net will get less open relays per day. just my opinion Goesta -- Wiener Hilfswerk - EDV 1072 Wien, Schottenfeldgasse 29 Tel: 512 36 61 DW 407 / Fax 512 36 61 33 -- Attached file included as plaintext by Ecartis -- -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iQEVAwUBQGpyNeEKFiIqAG4fAQKoUAf/VewHepjITCKIipFmgrVVygRkHnkrS3mN jR/EqVbIPRid4W5lzZDkk+4VFKSaC/hiuwYNrXHxUx7X/fcJtHf2Uv6Uf3TLxcUN PnYAI2PT5i7Jx2xgg/eo0JVqqHWXSONnbgGFHX69I+8fkuHzuE+u4/VcaFziQ6I3 oCP/PVErt5ux4aJJoU0RmpnE0QRbUVGd/J+BV8WrpaCTaZshSFgjusToExkMYvoN A/ZGteDg10EXHaMdgWcrMg8iZJxPEDNgrE0pyW8AspIECS/SQw8aLkOdanNyEdpV 0dNYJJMOECwlPwtJS0NkGGZEhXy49a+jKxFxrPV3d0YphV1GaKSzoA== =/6qJ -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe xmail in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For general help: send the line help in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
