Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Co-Chair selection

Hi, On Tue, May 07, 2024 at 11:37:10AM +0200, Markus de Brün wrote: > Brian is willing to accept his nomination. Tobias and I are happy to > continue to work with him. It would be great to hear from you if you support > Brian as well. Support! (I could add more words of praise and embarrass

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Reverse DNS delegations

st 2002) via the DB entry, and I'm assured it still works that way. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Ingo Lalla, Karin Schuler Joseph-

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Reverse DNS delegations

d PTRs) Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Ingo Lalla, Karin Schuler Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Reverse DNS delegations

eir time in rolling out IPv6... so maybe a bit more patience will get you there. (This said, sending mails over IPv6 is a bit of hit and miss anyway, with Google inventing new requirements on IPv6 connections that are not there for IPv4...) Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you en

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Bulletproof servers causing mischief on the internet

Hi, On Fri, Jan 19, 2024 at 09:42:08AM +, Carlos Friaças wrote: > On Fri, 19 Jan 2024, Gert Doering wrote: > > > So there is LIR contact data in the RIPE DB which is not properly validated > > - and that should certainly be brought to the NCC's attention, and fixed. >

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Bulletproof servers causing mischief on the internet

oys, without spurring anyone into corrective action. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Mue

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Is the LoA DoA for Routing? - article at FIRST blog

r played any role in authorizing route announcements here (not even fax). Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culeman

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Bulletproof servers causing mischief on the internet

Hi, On Thu, Jan 18, 2024 at 04:04:03AM +, Suresh Ramasubramanian wrote: > If the database is filled with nonsensical information that anyone can hand > in and get themselves a large netblock there isn???t much point to the entire > exercise. This claim has, as usual, no bas

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Draft RIPE87 Minutes for Consideration

set bad examples. > What format do you propose be used? Anything open. PDF, or plain text. It's not like we're going to edit that .doc document... Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. B

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Draft RIPE87 Minutes for Consideration

ve a comment... and that is "can we have this in a reasonable and nonproprietary format, not known as a transport for viruses of all sorts"? We *do* train people to not klick on random attachments in e-mail. thanks, Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

than "the mail is delivered just fine, but then ignored" - nothing in these proposals will force the receiver to deal with the mail properly, so getting abounce actually sends a clear signal "please just block this target network" instead of raising hopes. Gert Doering

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

atter how often this is re-started. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

your proposal magically achieve that? no. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

naming this an "extra charge" *without* being very clear that it's not going to change the overall budget (= by implication, the individual charges on model A, B, C, D need to become lower) does, indeed, suggest that it will be "more expensive". *sigh* Time for retirement, Gert Doer

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

might cost money at some point" in your contracts - and in that case, the extra costs directly go to the end customers wanting the ASN. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Em

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

fund all the toys, so drama"). Politics and smoke filled rooms at its best. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsra

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

im "looks unused" ASNs. Guess how I know. "Here's my 50 bucks, I claim I need this for another year" is so much less lifetime wasted on all sides. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Se

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

Hi, On Wed, Nov 01, 2023 at 07:44:45PM +0100, U.Mutlu wrote: > Thank you for your interesting analysis. > > Is then RIPE not a "partner in crime" for such criminal companies? "RIPE" is the community, all of us, including you. So yes. But not the

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

d explain a > fraction > of them. Unfortunately the RIPE members at the last general meeting still preferred to have ASNs free of charge... this would have helped at least get them back, without spending NCC people's lifetime in chasing them. But what do I know... Gert Doering

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

ing! better than nothing!". No, something needs to be provably *effective* before being *forced* on everybody. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Boge

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Abuse Report ignored. What to do as next?

munity did not like - added bureaucracy with no provable gain. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culema

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Unanimity

ached is judged by the WG chairs, and sometimes this is a very tough job (if there have been lengthy and heated discussions on some side aspects, for example). For RIPE's address policy WG, I used to point at RFC7282, which describes the goals for "IETF consensus" (https://datatracker.ietf.

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Adding a "Security Information" contact?

changing the implementation easier, as it's "just one place" - but in the end, "it needs to be done" which was the point I tried to make ;-) ) Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebasti

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Adding a "Security Information" contact?

ly returns one abuse e-mail), but that's implementation $ whois 195.30.0.1 % Abuse contact for '195.30.0.0 - 195.30.0.255' is 'ab...@space.net' Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard,

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Adding a "Security Information" contact?

attribute) This... so, what would you suggest? Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Adding a "Security Information" contact?

pecific query. Or > reference it separately with a "sec-c:" attribute. Agree, this would be one of the options. But then, what is admin-c: and tech-c: intended to be used for, today? (Expecting no answers, just pointing out that there is lack of clear understanding) Gert Doering

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Adding a "Security Information" contact?

ident reporting (which might warrant a similarily fast reaction, but from a different team). So, no clear answer, just seconding that we might need to do a bit of work here. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] RIPE NCC Anti-Abuse Training: Next Steps & WG Input!

with cookie banners, insanely big graphics, and weird scrolling stuff - but I guess most web developers would not agree to that) Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Doll

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Potential New Chair: Introduction & Next Steps

ndling, getting ISPs on-board, etc., which helps a lot in these discussions. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Cu

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Potential New Co-Chair

Hi, On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 10:04:21AM +, Brian Nisbet wrote: > What we are now proposing is that this person is introduced to > the WG as a potential Co-Chair (likely with a term technically > starting at RIPE 83) and the WG can either accept them or not. This > is your choice, of course.

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Anti-Abuse Training: Questions for the WG

eering to write something - sorry, already too many competing voluntary projects) Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsra

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] RIPE Abusing the Abuse contact check

matic validation test: x > > There was a transient network fault on the path to the mail server. I have seen this one ("transient network fault") as well. Sounds like an over-eager script to me. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? S

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] UCEPROTECT DNSBL possibly abusive practice and RIPEStat Blacklist entries widget

s why uceprotect is listed there, not because "RIPE endorses it". Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Report & Co-Chair's Decision on Proposal 2019-04

G chairs had quite a difficult task on their hands, and the summary is very detailed and I find it well representing the voices I can remember (thanks!). If you feel misrepresented, you can always point out where you spoke up otherwise - everything is archived. Gert Doering -- w

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Fwd: Re: botnet controllers

Could you please let me know your IP ranges so I can block them at our borders? We are not interested in communicating with networks that knowingly permit abuse coming from their customers. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, On Mon, May 11, 2020 at 10:46:51AM -0700, Randy Bush wrote: > > If this is about "do you want a mail address or a web form for > > reporting abuse?", no, routing and networking people do not really > > care much. > > depends. will the bikeshed be magenta? magenta bikesheds are only

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

rking people are most highly affected. If this is about "do you want a mail address or a web form for reporting abuse?", no, routing and networking people do not really care much. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

uch cases. There is no voting. It's either "there is sufficient support and counterarguments have been adequately addressed" or "no consensus, rewrite or withdraw". Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Spamming LIR accounts

elevant bits are the Terms and Conditions for the RIPE NCC association. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Cule

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Spamming LIR accounts

, I'll stop now GDPR is not ok with spamming people's personal mail addresses for a NCC board voting campaign, though. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bo

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

ons if they do not behave in a way that corresponds with these people's idea of "not abusive", while no community has ever been able to come up with a conclusive decision on what considers "abuse"... Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

n both sides - and [as I've said before...] you don't get orgs that do not care to magically expend resources on abuse handling by introducing more mailbox verification procedures. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorsta

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

handle abuse reports, they do so today already (and if they mess up their mail reception, the NCC will check this today already, and let them know). If people *do not want* to handle abuse reports, this proposal will not make them. Failing the stated mission, abandon. Gert Doering -- Net

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

the automatic de-registering of the IP address/resources, and the immediate > sale of that IPv4 address/space to the highest bidder. And *this* is exactly why this proposal is the beginning of a slippery slope that leads to "no way!" land. Mail system misconfigurations happen, even for the

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

box would be bouncing for 10+ years is unlikely to happen in RIPE land. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Cule

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, On Tue, Apr 28, 2020 at 08:27:32PM +0100, Nick Hilliard wrote: > The proposal needs to be abandoned. Yep. gert -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] @EXT: RE: RIPE NCC Executive Board election

but you imply "I want the RIPE *NCC* do something". Different bodies. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Gr

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Fw: Re: @EXT: RE: RIPE NCC Executive Board election

you trust and that are willing to do the job. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Periodic Reminder: List Conduct

encompassing legitimate business but also abusers who have become part > of that community. Since I am opposing the proposal on the table, this statement seems to make me an "abuser". Right? Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] @EXT: RE: working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

is always interesting. Not > you Randy but many other posters in this thread. I do receive mail to ab...@space.net and ensure that it's being worked on. Just this morning I clicked a RIPE abuse-c: mail address verification URL... Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on som

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

gt; abuse reports" is to add clarity at a high level. Works for me. Mine is "absence signals disinterest", while yours is "explicitly stating disinterest", which is indeed a much clearer signal that can not be confused with "oh, we never came around to register an abuse-c

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

o I think the balance is hugely positive. Nobody has been able to demonstrate why it would have a positive effect at all. So how can the balance be "hugely positive"? E-Mail addresses *are* validated today. Just not in an as labour-intensive way on the receipient like the proposers wan

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

ight thing today* (with extra verification hoops) should be balanced against "will it change the situation wrt orgs that do not care". And I think the balance is negative - extra work for the good guys, and no relevant incentive for the bad guys to actually *act on* their ab

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

; any network infrastructure. If this is not the case, what's the purpose > of a registry then? "a known contact" and "an *abuse-handling* contact" is not the same thing. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG V

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, On Tue, Jan 14, 2020 at 03:10:53AM -0700, Fi Shing wrote: > weak imbeciles such as those on this list. Wow. That's a new one on my list of things I've been called. So thankful. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

tor responsibility is to deal with > abuse cases, but happy to follow what we all decide. I do think that an operator should handle abuse reports (and we do), but *this* is not a suitable vehicle to *make him*. And if it's not going to have the desired effect, do not waste time

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, On Tue, Jan 14, 2020 at 10:38:28AM +0100, Gert Doering wrote: > On Tue, Jan 14, 2020 at 10:36:10AM +0100, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via > anti-abuse-wg wrote: > > So it is not just easier to ask the abuse-c mailboxes that don't want to > > process to setup an autoresponde

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

This is an automated convirmation that you reached the correct abuse-c > mailbox, but we don't process abuse cases, so your reports will be discarded." I would support that. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vo

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] working in new version of 2019-04 (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

which they can acknowledge the reports - only to then > delete those reports without doing anything. > > It creates hope for reporters and wastes the RIPE NCC's and the > reporters' resources by forcing unwilling organizations to spend > cycles on unproductive activity. This. Gert Doering

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] [routing-wg] An arrest in Russia

validate it? IRR data is authenticated by registry data in RIPE land, if the resource holder chooses so. Short story. So, nobody can create routes for, say, my address space unless I authorize that. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? Sp

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] [routing-wg] An arrest in Russia

h a ???we are not the internet > police??? position. On everything registry-related, the NCC does huge amounts of due dilligence. This has nothing to do whatsoever with *routing* police'ing, though. Gert Doering -- member, and occasionally on the wrong end of the due dilligence -- have you

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

increase the workload for people handling abuse mailbox, for questionable results. The general idea fails the most basic test "will it have a positiv effect, or will it just cause extra hurdles for those that already do the right thing". So, I do not agree with this proposal. Gert Doering

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

have more paperwork!" please take > > a step back and explain a) what is wrong with the current validation > > process, and b) why this proposal would improve this. > > Gert Doering > > -- NetMaster > > because, IRL (in real life) things do not remain &qu

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

on process, and b) why this proposal would improve this. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Cul

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

hit review phase (since it's the proposer's decision, this is to be expected), and I consider them to be not sufficiently addressed yet. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, it's nice how you can decide on your own how the (very real) extra costs incurred to *15.000+* LIR abuse desks plus the RIPE NCC are "negilible", claiming that the (unfounded) saving on the costs on the side of abuse reporters would outweigh that. Please back with actual numb

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, indeed, and this is why we should just not go there. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, you are comparing the claimed cost savings on the side of the reporters with the very real extra costs incurred on the side of the abuse handlers. You can't do that, and come up with a positive result. (Well, you can, but that approach is very one-side and flawed at that) Gert Doering

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, the whole point of your policy is the underlying assumption that people are *not* acting in good faith, so why all of a sudden assume they are? Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, you cannot know if someone complies with the policy in good faith or not. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

d be any different in the second half of 2019. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culeman

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

n the least with the case you bring forward. If someone is fraudulently heaping up LIRs but has a nicely responsive abuse desk (and individual mails for each LIR) - how is "have all the other LIRs do more work" going to help in this case? Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

f human lifetime on your challenge. And *that* can be nicely outsourced. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grund

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

elf, hopefully. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

> > > We do have abuse-mailbox verification, and we do have ARCs. > > > > Why do we need more process? > > We might not need more processes, but hopefully improved processes :-) There is no indication that the complications Jordi is proposing are an actual improve

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

faute de mieux.. Let's just close down all LIRs. It will do away with all abuse coming from LIRs. No? That's about the level of "why would this proposal help" that you are argueing on. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something tod

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

t the correct communication style on plattform two. (And be careful with "Internet planet", because *that* planet has had a given quoting and communication style, long before you youngfolks came on board and started being impolite and ignorant) Gert Doering -- NetMaster --

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

aging war in the past, it > is the very last assumption you must base your policies on, let alone mailing > list arguments. And this proposal helps with this "major crime and corruption problem" in exactly *which* way? Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enable

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

do" = "follow local customs" And Outlook *can* do that. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grund

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

on fixing abuse in their network*. Your proposal steals life time from these guys, while not helping at all with folks that just ignore mails sent to their (working and verified!) abuse mail address. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today..

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

from this continuos abuse of my eyes!) Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

round 4.5%. But this means the existing efforts from the RIPE NCC are showing an effect, and we do *NOT NEED* a new policy with lots of extra complications. We do have abuse-mailbox verification, and we do have ARCs. Why do we need more process? Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you ena

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

Hi, On Thu, May 16, 2019 at 04:53:25PM +0200, Gert Doering wrote: > This will encourage me to build a robot that monitors our abuse mailbox > and clicks on everything that comes in. In case this was not obvious: I oppose this policy proposal. It will have no positive effect what

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 New Policy Proposal (Validation of "abuse-mailbox")

me to build a robot that monitors our abuse mailbox and clicks on everything that comes in. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsrat

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] AS24940 Hetzner -- non-role contact wanted

quot;plonk" is the sound an e-mail address makes when it's landing on a blacklist. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plonk_(Usenet) Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Micha

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] AS24940 Hetzner -- non-role contact wanted

inside your network. > You, in your childish innocence (ignorance) wants to complain to a > network provider and you refuse that the network provider sends your > complaint to the service provider. Maybe you need to upgrade your knowledge on what Hetzner actually does? Gert Doering

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 New Policy Proposal (BGP Hijacking is a RIPE Policy Violation)

priate jurisdiction, it consists a valid requirement for IPv4 space. The RIPE NCC can not and MUST NOT decide what is "appropriate" use of IP address space. There is laws and courts to do that (and if a LIR is convicted of criminal activity, they will be closed down). But you know all thi

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 New Policy Proposal (BGP Hijacking is a RIPE Policy Violation)

meone configures their router correctly cannot construct a liability for the NCC. Now, if the NCC neglects to secure their *registry*, and people can use this neglect to attack others, this might be a valid case to bring forward... Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 New Policy Proposal (BGP Hijacking is a RIPE Policy Violation)

not in this proposal). mce_style="font-size: 12pt;" style=""> HTML-mails, top posted, on a mailing list that has a different mail style. Very impolite and unconsiderate. But anyway: the point that Randy is making that this policy is neither common sense, nor effecti

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Mysteries of the Internet: AS65000

t to install proper as-path filters. Private ASes should *never* be expected from a downstream session. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollin

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] On +1s and Policy Awareness AND Astro... something...

ing a given style, just ignoring local conventions and doing your personal preference is unconsiderate and rude". Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] On +1s and Policy Awareness AND Astro... something...

And please follow accepted quoting style of the forum you're participating. Single top posts in a civilized debate are so highly unconsiderate that it should be sanctioned in itself. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] anti-abuse-wg Digest, Vol 89, Issue 15

g the wrong crowd. A few willing Tier1 ISPs would have way more effect than all policies we do in RIPE land against a rogue ISP that might not even *be* a RIPE member (or a member of any LIR). Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 New Policy Proposal (BGP Hijacking is a RIPE Policy Violation)

Hi, On Mon, Apr 01, 2019 at 03:29:16PM +, Ángel González Berdasco wrote: > Gert Doering writes: > > On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 01:54:42PM -0700, Ronald F. Guilmette wrote: > > > To say that any such funds now being paid to RIPE are "tainted" would be a >

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 New Policy Proposal (BGP Hijacking is a RIPE Policy Violation)

Hi, On Mon, Apr 01, 2019 at 04:01:53PM +0200, Nick Hilliard wrote: > Let's start with political dissent Now, I disagree on this. Disagreeing with the voice of reason in the anti-abuse WG should certainly be reason for public flogging, and possibly instant LIR closure. Gert Doering -- h

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 New Policy Proposal (BGP Hijacking is a RIPE Policy Violation)

lk about, i.e. the rather inconvenient fact that RIPE, due > to its intransigent lethargy, is quite apparently doing business, even > as we speak, with known and well-identified cyber-criminals. So, your local supermarket is also not allowed to sell anything to a convicted criminal? Sorry, th

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 New Policy Proposal (BGP Hijacking is a RIPE Policy Violation)

it ISPs to strengthen the message "we want *you* to filter your customer BGP sessions, because that's the proper way to run a network!". Sometimes just agreeing on a written-down message already helps on other fronts. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 and over-reach

a contract. B does something C does not like (but which is legal). Why should that affect A? Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsic

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 New Policy Proposal (BGP Hijacking is a RIPE Policy Violation)

the formal document https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-710 Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Michael Emmer Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundn

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-03 New Policy Proposal (BGP Hijacking is a RIPE Policy Violation)

und times and possibly easier to sort out language misunderstandings - but at least for APWG, only statements on the list are considered relevant wrt RIPE policy making. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebast

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