--- Jon Gabriel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >From: Deborah Harrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Personally Not A Thrill-Seeker, Except For Riding
> >Arabians* Maru
> >
> >*This would make Quarter Horse owners LOL, but is
> >probably incomprehensible to almost everyone else.
> :)
>
> Arabians are hard
Deborah Harrell wrote:
>
> Ping?
Pong. I'm waiting to hear from Nick as to just what happened there.
Julia
who was out for over 4 hours and missed most of the interruption (and
who had a good time this evening)
___
http://www.mccmedia.com/mai
Ray Ludenia wrote:
>
> Bryon Daly wrote:
>
> > Julia, the ESPN web site has some coverage of the TdF here:
> > http://espn.go.com/oly/tdf2003/index.html
> >
> > It's not extensive, but you can get all the stage results and standings
> > there, along with a smattering of articles.
>
> Another sit
Subject: Lifesize Han in carbonite in Lego10,000 bricks
and the insanity.
Date:Wed, 09 Jul 2003 21:38:32 -0500
From:Bill Perry <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
you...you've gotta see this
http://www.brickshelf.com/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi?f=48970
_
From: Deborah Harrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: God, Religion, and Sports Medicine
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 13:55:37 -0700 (PDT)
--- William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Deborah Harrell wro
Ping?
__
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
http://sbc.yahoo.com
___
http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
>Debbi wrote-
>No, it isn't - unless the blind folks' technology is
>advanced enough to detect a soaring condor (I admit I
>was thinking 'plain villagers' in my scenario, so no
>radar), there is no way for them to verify that a
>creature with a 10+ foot wingspan is passing hundreds
>of feet above
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>The full paragraph from the press release reads:
>In Advent Rising, a common legend pervades the galaxy - that of a
>powerful, ancient race that will one day unite the
>universe.
Ancient precursors aren't exactly a new idea in SF. Sounds more like a ripoff of Star
Contr
Deborah Harrell wrote:
> --- Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Deborah Harrell wrote:
>>
>>> I've already re-posted my original question from
>> my original post,
>>> and I asked about the _structure_ as a basis for
>> designing a cable of
>>> _carbon nanotubules_ -- although the idea of
Bryon Daly wrote:
>> From: Julia Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>
>> BTW, I've been watching the rerun of TDF coverate on OLM from 7:30 to 10
>> in the evening, but I won't be able to tonight. If anyone who is
>> following the Tour wants to privately shoot me info on how Lance's team
>> does toda
http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns3916
Nanotechnology may create new organs
18:30 08 July 03
NewScientist.com news service
Scientists have built a minute, functioning vascular system - the
branching network of blood vessels which supply nutrients and oxygen to
tissu
"Robert J. Chassell" wrote:
> We may have interpreted the configuration differently. I interpreted
> C as meaning a torus, or donut, or `like the inner tube of a tire'.
Agreed.
> The short columns must have the same pressure distribution as
> the long columns in the spokes,
William T. Goodall wrote:
It seems to me it makes more sense to be agnostic about whether woolly
mammoths are extinct than about whether god(s) exist. After all, we have
evidence that woolly mammoths *did* survive until relatively recently, and
the world is a big place...
There is no evidence a
Debbi wrote:
If "novelty-seeking" is a genetic trait that has
become widespread because of some advantages that it
confers (I can think of many, from utilizing new food
sources to finding new places to live -- as well as
little problems from being _overly_ curious, like
fatal poisonings and discove
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 01:31:40PM -0700, Deborah Harrell wrote:
> No, they don't: http://www.hawk-conservancy.org/priors/george.shtml
> "In common with all New World (American) vultures, the Andean Condor
> is, to all intents and purposes, silent. It does utter wheezes,
> suppressed coughs and g
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 11:23 pm, Jon Gabriel wrote:
It is impossible to prove that God either exists or does not exist
somewhere, anywhere in the universe with the exception of anecdotal
examples. Therefore, both belief *and* nonbelief in God are the
result of faith and not scientific
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 06:23:55PM -0400, Jon Gabriel wrote:
> So, one may accurately say that both Atheists and Theists rely on
> faith to support their conclusions.
No, I don't think that is true for any but the most extreme atheists.
Saying that
for h
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 11:27 pm, Jon Gabriel wrote:
From: William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: On the topic of atheism.
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 21:30:19 +0100
On Wednesday, July
From: William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: On the topic of atheism.
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 21:30:19 +0100
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 05:42 pm, John D. Giorgis wrote:
---Original
From: William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: On the topic of atheism.
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 21:01:33 +0100
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 08:18 pm, Jon Gabriel wrote:
From: William T Goodal
--- Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Deborah Harrell wrote:
>
> > I've already re-posted my original question from
> my original post,
> > and I asked about the _structure_ as a basis for
> designing a cable of
> > _carbon nanotubules_ -- although the idea of a
> composite seems to have
>
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 02:44:25PM -0700, Deborah Harrell wrote:
> I've already re-posted my original question from my original post,
> and I asked about the _structure_ as a basis for designing a cable of
> _carbon nanotubules_ -- although the idea of a composite seems to have
> merit.
No you di
--- Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Deborah Harrell wrote:
>
> > That *wasn't* my question;
>
> Yes, it was.
I've already re-posted my original question from my
original post, and I asked about the _structure_ as a
basis for designing a cable of _carbon nanotubules_ --
although the ide
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 01:38:07PM -0700, Deborah Harrell wrote:
> That *wasn't* my question;
Yes, it was.
--
"Erik Reuter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.erikreuter.net/
___
http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 01:31:40PM -0700, Deborah Harrell wrote:
> Um, how could a blind person shoot a silent moving target, especially
> so high up?
Not the blind person, silly.
--
"Erik Reuter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.erikreuter.net/
From: Julia Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
BTW, I've been watching the rerun of TDF coverate on OLM from 7:30 to 10
in the evening, but I won't be able to tonight. If anyone who is
following the Tour wants to privately shoot me info on how Lance's team
does today, or tell me where to go to get that
The full paragraph from the press release reads:
In Advent Rising, a common legend pervades the galaxy
- that of a powerful, ancient race that will one day
unite the universe. Millions of cultures from vastly
distant worlds revere and hallow these mythological
beings known as humans. One race, th
>Tom Beck: Who says a playoff series doesn't begin until the home team
>loses? I've never heard that. Is it in pro basketball, which isn't a real
>sport? Do they mean the team with the home team advantage, or the home team
>for each game? I suspect they mean the first but it's still a silly
>st
Talk about rip-off season. Orson Scott Card wrote the story for
this video game, for which he is also writing a novelization. Not a
direct duplicate of Uplift, but close ... even the title:
"In Advent Rising, a common legend pervades the galaxy - that of a
powerful, ancient race that will one
--- William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Deborah Harrell wrote:
> >
> > If "novelty-seeking" is a genetic trait that has
> >become widespread because of some advantages that
it
> > confers (I can think of many, from utilizing new
> food sources to finding new places to live -- as
well
> >
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 07:27 pm, Reggie Bautista wrote:
It *is* possible that I missed the resolution of this issue, but I
find it very unlikely especially since the question is still currently
being debated onlist by Michael Harney, among others.
Maybe they weren't paying attention eit
--- Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Deborah Harrell wrote:
>
> > Kindly Use What I ACTUALLY Said, Not What You Want
> To Pretend That I Said! Maru
>
> Kindly don't misinterpret what I wrote.
Slightly better retort. ;)
But I *didn't* misinterpret what you wrote, which was:
"> > and to
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 07:00 pm, Deborah Harrell wrote:
If "novelty-seeking" is a genetic trait that has
become widespread because of some advantages that it
confers (I can think of many, from utilizing new food
sources to finding new places to live -- as well as
little problems from being
--- Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Deborah Harrell wrote:
>
> > No, it isn't - unless the blind folks' technology
> is advanced enough
> > to detect a soaring condor (I admit I was thinking
> 'plain villagers'
> > in my scenario, so no radar), there is no way for
> them to verify that
>
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 05:42 pm, John D. Giorgis wrote:
---Original Message---
From: William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
So what does 'the Dodo is extinct' mean?
What does "the coelacanth is extinct" mean?
And what did it mean 100 years ago?
Exactly! You seem to have grasped t
--- Reggie Bautista <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It *is* possible that I missed the resolution of
> this issue, but I find it
> very unlikely especially since the question is still
> currently being debated
> onlist by Michael Harney, among others.
No, no resolution, although it's been stated
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 08:18 pm, Jon Gabriel wrote:
From: William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
So what does 'the Dodo is extinct' mean?
The sentence is an assumption and not a proven fact because it is
currently impossible to scientifically show that all Dodos, everywhere
in the unive
I spent way too much time replying this morning. Damn you Brin-L! But now
at work I can waste as much time as I want.
If other's did reply to you off list Julia, could I ask those others to
send their opinions to me? Just want to read what others are thinking.
I don't want to say I'm a fanatic, b
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 06:16 pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
So what does 'the Dodo is extinct' mean?
It means you haven't read "The Ugly Chickens". ;)
I have!
--
William T Goodall
Mail : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web : http://www.wtgab.demon.co.uk
Blog : http://radio.weblogs.com/0111221/
F
--- "Robert J. Chassell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
[I wrote:]
> Of course, here I am presupposing that there IS
> something to be sensed, ...
>
> How can this be a presupposition? It as much truth
> of human nature as
> mothers loving their children, but being prepared,
> in the appropriate
---Original Message---
From: William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>So what does 'the Dodo is extinct' mean?
What does "the coelacanth is extinct" mean?
And what did it mean 100 years ago?
JDG
___
http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-
http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0328/shachtman.php
The Pentagon's Plan for Tracking Everything That Moves
Big Brother Gets a Brain
by Noah Shachtman
July 9 - 15, 2003
The cameras are already in place. The computer code is being developed at
a dozen or more major companies and universities. And
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> >Don't forget we totally beat the French!
>
> Speaking only for myself, I'm not rooting *against* anyone - I'm
> rooting *for* Lance Armstrong.
So'm I. He's the only reason I got interested in TDF in the first
place. For that, and geographical reasons, I'll be root
This is just a quick reminder that the Wednesday Brin-L
chat is scheduled for 3 PM Eastern/2 PM Central time in
the US, or 7 PM Greenwich time, so it's just starting.
There will probably be somebody there to talk to for at
least eight hours after the start time. See my instruction
page for help get
From: William T Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: On the topic of atheism.
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 18:11:55 +0100
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 05:31 pm, Jon Gabriel wrote:
I don't know where I sa
Matt Grimaldi wrote:
>
> John D. Giorgis wrote:
> >
> > In practice, I think that many, if not most,
> > agnostics are simply "honest atheists." Since
> > true atheism would require a matter of faith -
> > since a negative cannot be proved, many people who
> > might casually be thought of as "at
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 11:08:22AM -0700, Deborah Harrell wrote:
> Kindly Use What I ACTUALLY Said, Not What You Want To Pretend That I
> Said! Maru
Kindly don't misinterpret what I wrote.
--
"Erik Reuter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.erikreuter.net/
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 11:00:25AM -0700, Deborah Harrell wrote:
> No, it isn't - unless the blind folks' technology is advanced enough
> to detect a soaring condor (I admit I was thinking 'plain villagers'
> in my scenario, so no radar), there is no way for them to verify that
> a creature with a
William T. Goodall wrote:
Yes it has. Apparently you were not paying attention.
I replied:
Cite, please?
William T.G. responded:
So (a) you are implying I am a liar and (b) although *you* weren't paying
attention you want *me* to look it up for you.
I don't think so.
No, I'm not implying that you
hehehe... Robert, welcome to the Baghdad Bob's of the Brin list club! Your
membership was accepted! Dues are waived.
Chad (who is top posting out of spite!)
>-Original Message-
>From: Robert Seeberger [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2003 8:35 PM
>To: Killer Bs Discus
> From: "Erik Reuter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > I posted formulas, materials properties, an
> article from a respected
> > scientific journal editor, and links to a number
> of sites about
> > materials properties, stress/strain curves, etc.
> to support my statement
> > and to answer a question abo
--- Erik Reuter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Deborah Harrell wrote:
>
> > It is not a comfortable one: the "tb's" lose the
> specialness of being
> > Graced by the Gift of Faith, and the "aa's" simply
> are unable to
> > 'sense the spiritual,' rather like being unable to
> distinguish red from gre
>So what does 'the Dodo is extinct' mean?
It means you haven't read "The Ugly Chickens". ;)
--
Tom Beck
www.prydonians.org
www.mercerjewishsingles.org
"I always knew I'd see the first man on the Moon. I never dreamed I'd see the last." -
Dr Jerry Pournelle
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 05:31 pm, Jon Gabriel wrote:
I don't know where I saw it, but I've seen this argument referred to
in the past as the 'universal existential negative' argument, which
basically says you cannot prove that something (God) doesn't exist.
So what does 'the Dodo is exti
From: "Michael Harney" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Killer Bs Discussion" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: On the topic of atheism.
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 00:05:37 -0600
Show me scientific proof that no god exists. It can't be done. You can't
prove a
> You can't prove a negative scientifically. Oops.
Actually, you can prove a negative. For example, I can state that
there are no large, visible pink elephants in the room with me right
now, and you and others can come and look; and if you do, you and the
others will not see any large, visib
[We agree for A and B.]
> c) wheel like, with only the rim having air, the spokes
> separate from the rim
>
> In this configuration, the relevant maximum height is, I think,
> the ceiling. Perhaps I am wrong -- does someone know?
I'm not sure what you are
Of course, here I am presupposing that there IS something to be
sensed, ...
How can this be a presupposition? It as much truth of human nature as
mothers loving their children, but being prepared, in the appropriate
culture, to attempt infanticide under certain conditions, as was done
wit
>Don't forget we totally beat the French!
Speaking only for myself, I'm not rooting *against* anyone - I'm rooting *for* Lance
Armstrong.
--
Tom Beck
www.prydonians.org
www.mercerjewishsingles.org
"I always knew I'd see the first man on the Moon. I never dreamed I'd see the last." -
Dr
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Matt Grimaldi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> So why bring up a topic such as religion when you
> have already concluded that there is nothing you
> could say and nothing they could say that would
> put both sides on the same page?
I have concluded no such thing.
> I can
>-Original Message-
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2003 8:17 AM
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: TDF
>
>
>I watched the team time trial of the Tour De France today, and
>the US Postal Service team (incl. Lance Armstrong) came from
>way back
I watched the team time trial of the Tour De France today, and the US Postal Service
team (incl. Lance Armstrong) came from way back to not only win but shatter the
course, building up speed with every klick, eventually winning by 30 seconds. It was a
stirring achievement to watch, because they
John D. Giorgis wrote:
>
> In practice, I think that many, if not most,
> agnostics are simply "honest atheists." Since
> true atheism would require a matter of faith -
> since a negative cannot be proved, many people who
> might casually be thought of as "atheists" tend to
> self-characterize t
William T Goodall wrote:
>
> So why are US Conservatives against same-sex
> marriage? Do they want to force same-sex couples
> to live in sin?
>
Good joke, though you need a rimshot sound effect.
-- Matt
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On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 01:30 am, Reggie Bautista wrote:
And what you've learned about me from reading this is that I followed
both Angel and Xena closely enough to know the names of actors who
played roles that didn't get them into the opening credits...
:-)
Some people don't?
--
Willia
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 12:13 pm, Erik Reuter wrote:
If you replaced "proves" with "provides support for", then I would
agree
completely.
That's all 'scientific proof' means anyway, isn't it?
--
William T Goodall
Mail : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web : http://www.wtgab.demon.co.uk
Blog : http://
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Doug Pensinger
...
> That gives me the impression that you think we're some kind of science
> experiment.
I don't think that's a logical conclusion. The point is that solving one
mystery, such as the or
Erik Reuter wrote:
>
> On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 10:01:36PM -0500, Robert Seeberger wrote:
>
> > But if one is describing a being that is omnipotent, omniscient,
> > eternal, and infinite, then minds such as ours could not encompass
> > even the scope of such a being.
>
> Speak for yourself, man!
Kevin Tarr wrote:
>
> At 01:33 AM 7/9/2003 -0400, you wrote:
> >>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>In a message dated 7/8/2003 6:09:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, Julia
> >>Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> >> >Speaking of sports, anyone else following the Tour de France? If anyone
> >> >who knows m
>http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A29766-2003Jul8.html?nav=hptop_ts
>
>"Former Vermont governor Howard Dean said, "The credibility of the U.S.
>is a precious commodity. We should all be deeply dismayed that our
>nation was taken to war and our reputation in the world forever tainted
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 06:39:50AM -0400, Erik Reuter wrote:
> Perhaps part of our disagreement here is semantics, if you do not
> agree that unreasonable and delusional are the same in this context.
I should clarify what delusional means when I use it.
Suppose I were to claim that I am constant
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 11:48:18AM +0100, William T Goodall wrote:
> Science proves negatives all the time. That's what experiments are
> for. No evidence for X *is* evidence against X.
I would agree with the last statement, but not the first. Science
does not PROVE negatives, how is it possible
On Tuesday, July 8, 2003, at 09:58 pm, Reggie Bautista wrote:
William T. Goodall wrote:
Yes it has. Apparently you were not paying attention.
Cite, please?
Reggie Bautista
So (a) you are implying I am a liar and (b) although *you* weren't
paying attention you want *me* to look it up for you.
On Wednesday, July 9, 2003, at 07:05 am, Michael Harney wrote:
Show me scientific proof that no god exists. It can't be done. You
can't
prove a negative scientifically. Oops.
Science proves negatives all the time. That's what experiments are for.
No evidence for X *is* evidence against X.
C
On Wed, Jul 09, 2003 at 12:05:37AM -0600, Michael Harney wrote:
> You miss (or deliberately dodge) the whole point of what I wrote.
> Your own words say it: "...science is the *best* way we have of
> understanding and testing reality..." (emphasis added)
No, I understood what you said, it is just
At 01:33 AM 7/9/2003 -0400, you wrote:
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
In a message dated 7/8/2003 6:09:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, Julia
Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>Speaking of sports, anyone else following the Tour de France? If anyone
>who knows more about cycling than I do (which isn't ver
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