At 19:26 9-2-2003 -0600, Ronn Blankenship wrote:
> >Sorry, but I am *sick* of the *.sig file.There's no need for
> >that in polite company.
And while we're at it, I am sick and tired of the meaningless "LEGAL
NOTICE" . . .
Don't know if anyone noticed it, but I had dropped the Legal Noti
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>
> --- "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > Saw a speech by, IIRC, Schroeder recently. He
> > mentioned (paraphrasing) that
> > Germany is opposed against war against Iraq, because
> > the German people,
> > having been in the center of two world wars, realise
At 10:46 AM 2/9/03 -0600, Robert Seeberger wrote:
>
>
> >Sorry, but I am *sick* of the *.sig file.There's no need for that in
> >polite company.
And while we're at it, I am sick and tired of the meaningless "LEGAL
NOTICE" . . .
-- Ronn! :)
Almighty Ruler of the all,
Whose Power exten
- Original Message -
From: "Sonja van Baardwijk-Holten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 4:41 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> Dan Minette wrote:
>
> > Let me get this straight. You are accusing Powel
John Garcia wrote:
> > Do you have a link on that. The financial side of the war is the only
> > thing I'm not able to find Didn't we have a resident expert on the
> > WWs on this list? Hey, are you out there?
> >
> Ask and you shall receive:
>
> Lend-lease was created in March 1941 because by
Robert Seeberger wrote:
> John and Jeroen may be destined to be antagonists toward each other, but I
> think it is only fair that Sonja be excluded from the splatter of the food
> fight.
Pbt, you just had to say that didn't you now I won't be able to look at
any posts from John or Jeroen
At 11:00 AM 2/9/2003 -0600 Julia Thompson wrote:
>Pearl Harbor happened, war between the US and Japan was declared, and then
>Germany declared war on the US. Germany used their U-boats to disrupt US
>shipping on the Eastern Seaboard.
>
>At least, that's my understanding of events.
Actually, Germa
Jon Gabriel wrote:
> Woah did America get attacked by Germany and I missed it? We were
> attacked by Japan. We were *NOT* attacked by Germany. We had no need
> or reason to fight the Germans even then. We could easily have fought a
> one-front war with the Japanese and left the Germans to
- Original Message -
From: "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 5:22 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> At 10:30 8-2-2003 -0500, John Giorgis wrote:
>
> >At 09:22 AM 2/8/2003 -0600 Robert Seebe
J. van Baardwijk wrote:
However, Japan was on the same side as Germany. Before the attack on
Pearl Harbor, AFAIK there weren't any US troops in Europe, fighting
the Germans. If Japan had not attacked Pearl Harbor, thus getting the
US really involved in the war, would the US have done anything,
Jon said:
> Woah did America get attacked by Germany and I missed it? We were
> attacked by Japan. We were *NOT* attacked by Germany.
Despite this lack of German attacks, German U-boats managed to fire on
the USN destroyers Kearney, Reuben James and DuPont in October 1941,
damaging the first
At 02:12 9-2-2003 -0500, Jon Gabriel wrote:
Woah did America get attacked by Germany and I missed it? We were
attacked by Japan.
However, Japan was on the same side as Germany. Before the attack on Pearl
Harbor, AFAIK there weren't any US troops in Europe, fighting the Germans.
If Japan
At 10:30 8-2-2003 -0500, John Giorgis wrote:
At 09:22 AM 2/8/2003 -0600 Robert Seeberger wrote:
>> > JDG - Anybody enjoy getting the image of Jeroen making love on a
>> > daily basis, Maru?
>>
>> Very cheap shot and rather insensitive and hurtfull. :o( Also non of
>> your *beep* business.
Sorry
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
On > Behalf Of Miller, Jeffrey
> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 5:42 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: UK dossier on Iraq
>
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > F
On Saturday, February 8, 2003, at 06:37 AM, Sonja van Baardwijk-Holten
wrote:
"Miller, Jeffrey" wrote:
-Original Message-
From: Sonja van Baardwijk-Holten [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 02:26 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: UK dossier on
- Original Message -
From: "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 7:21 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> At 17:14 7-2-2003 -0600, Robert Seeberger wrote:
>
> > > >But no one denies tha
On Sat, Feb 08, 2003 at 10:30:40AM -0500, John D. Giorgis wrote:
>
> Sorry, there is a missing comma up there..
>
> Anybody enjoy getting the image of Jeroen making love*,* on a daily basis,
> Maru?
All, you, have, to, say, for, that, travesty, is, sorry? I, am, quite,
offended, by, missin
At 09:22 AM 2/8/2003 -0600 Robert Seeberger wrote:
>> > JDG - Anybody enjoy getting the image of Jeroen making love on a daily
>> > basis, Maru?
>>
>> Very cheap shot and rather insensitive and hurtfull. :o( Also non of your
>> *beep* business.
Sorry, there is a missing comma up there..
An
- Original Message -
From: "Sonja van Baardwijk-Holten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 4:47 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> "John D. Giorgis" wrote:
>
> > JDG - Anybody enjoy getting the imag
At 14:36 8-2-2003 +0100, I wrote:
At 21:31 7-2-2003 -0500, John Giorgis wrote:
JDG - Anybody enjoy getting the image of Jeroen making love on a daily
basis, Maru?
Quite a statement for someone who has never been involved in such an act
(and who, given his specs for a mate, may very well neve
At 08:51 8-2-2003 -0500, John Giorgis wrote:
>Personally, I find it terrifying that the president of the most
>powerful nation in the world believes that international conflict is
>a GAME...
Actually, it was Hussein that thinks this international conflict is a
game.
It was Bush who said "the g
At 02:38 PM 2/8/2003 +0100 J. van Baardwijk wrote:
>Personally, I find it terrifying that the president of the most powerful
>nation in the world believes that international conflict is a GAME...
Actually, it was Hussein that thinks this international conflict is a game.
JDG - Hide-and-go-Seek M
At 11:53 8-2-2003 +0100, Sonja van Baardwijk wrote:
I believe Schoeders comment to Bush's '... the game is over... ' nicely
depicts
the sentiments between the US and Germany. Schroeder responded with '...it
isn't
a game, and it is far from over...'.
Personally, I find it terrifying that the pr
At 21:31 7-2-2003 -0500, John Giorgis wrote:
JDG - Anybody enjoy getting the image of Jeroen making love on a daily
basis, Maru?
Quite a statement for someone who has never been involved in such an act
(and who, given his specs for a mate, may very well never get involved in it).
And why shou
At 21:31 7-2-2003 -0500, John Giorgis wrote:
>OK. I want to call attention to this statement. Now, Jeroen, there's
>a striking fact about the German people "having been in the center of
>two world wars."
>Which is, of course, that they started them.
The fact that they now say "war is never th
At 17:14 7-2-2003 -0600, Robert Seeberger wrote:
> >But no one denies that the Hussein government employs a level of
> >brutality and terror like only a few regimes in history
>
> Undoubtedly true. However, brutality is not the reason why the US wants
> to invade Iraq. The reason given for the wa
"Miller, Jeffrey" wrote:
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Sonja van Baardwijk-Holten [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 02:26 AM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> >
> >
>
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
> --- "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > Saw a speech by, IIRC, Schroeder recently. He
> > mentioned (paraphrasing) that
> > Germany is opposed against war against Iraq, because
> > the German people,
> > having been in the center of two world wars, realise
>
Jon Gabriel wrote:
>
> With that attitude, someone *should* invade them as soon as possible. After
> all, no offense or danger will be too great to make them go to war! Germany
> should disband their armies, sell their weaponry and leave their front doors
> unlocked. Oh, and they might consid
"John D. Giorgis" wrote:
> JDG - Anybody enjoy getting the image of Jeroen making love on a daily
> basis, Maru?
Very cheap shot and rather insensitive and hurtfull. :o( Also non of your
fucking business. [If you will pardon me the crudity of that pun :o)]
Sonja
Dan Minette wrote:
> Let me get this straight. You are accusing Powell of fabricating evidence?
> Its all made up because the poor misunderstood Mr Hussein, who is trying so
> hard to lead his Republic into a bright new future is being slanded by the
> big bad United States?
Well you must admit
> -Original Message-
> From: Sonja van Baardwijk-Holten [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 02:26 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
>
>
> Jon Gabriel wrote:
>
> > By what I understand of your rea
Jon Gabriel wrote:
> By what I understand of your reasoning, the US should have waited until it was
>
> directly attacked by Germany before entering WWII
Eh... as far as I know that is exactly what the US did, it minded it's own
borders. They did some supplying to the Brittish before they en
At 09:31 PM 2/7/03 -0500, John D. Giorgis wrote:
JDG - Anybody enjoy getting the image of Jeroen making love on a daily
basis, Maru?
Sonja?
-- Ronn! :)
Almighty Ruler of the all,
Whose Power extends to great and small,
Who guides the stars with steadfast law,
Whose least creation fills
At 09:53 AM 2/7/2003 -0800 Doug Pensinger wrote:
>Wednesday February 5, 2003
>
>In 1990 as the US prepared for its first war with Iraq there was heavy
>reliance on the use of "classified" satellite photographs purporting to
>show that in September 1990 -
Sorry, but this article is all wet.
Sau
"John D. Giorgis" wrote:
>
> At 11:27 AM 2/7/2003 -0600 Julia Thompson wrote:
> >If it would be easier to read it as e-mail, I'll be happy to get it e-mailed
> >to you.
>
> Indeed, the link is no longer working - so if someone could e-mail me a
> copy, I would appreciate it.
I think someone alre
At 10:03 AM 2/7/2003 -0800 Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>> Saw a speech by, IIRC, Schroeder recently. He
>> mentioned (paraphrasing) that
>> Germany is opposed against war against Iraq, because
>> the German people,
>> having been in the center of two world wars, realise
>> that going to war is
>> neve
At 11:27 AM 2/7/2003 -0600 Julia Thompson wrote:
>If it would be easier to read it as e-mail, I'll be happy to get it e-mailed
>to you.
Indeed, the link is no longer working - so if someone could e-mail me a
copy, I would appreciate it.
JDG
___
- Original Message -
From: "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 11:26 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> At 08:43 7-2-2003 -0800, Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>
> >But no one denies that the Hus
> > In particular, I wonder how this will influence our
> > view of Germany. If there is any country that should
> > be most enthusiastic for freeing people from a
> > genocidal dictator, it is Germany. Instead of that,
> > though, we see Germany refusing to help under _any_
> > circumstances,
- Original Message -
From: "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 11:03 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> At 07:45 7-2-2003 -0800, Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>
> > > Oh wow. And this fraud wa
- Original Message -
From: "Dan Minette" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 11:03 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Gautam Mukunda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
From: "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 21:22:57 +0100
At 12:49 7-2-2003 -0500, Jon Gabriel wrote:
Ridiculous. This is precisely the type of quote that sounds just g
Some accidentally-pressed key combination caused my reply to be sent before
being finished...
At 12:49 7-2-2003 -0500, Jon Gabriel wrote:
Ridiculous. This is precisely the type of quote that sounds just great as
a sound-bite and reflects nothing about the real world. War is sometimes
necessa
At 12:49 7-2-2003 -0500, Jon Gabriel wrote:
Ridiculous. This is precisely the type of quote that sounds just great as
a sound-bite and reflects nothing about the real world. War is sometimes
necessary. At the risk of repeating myself, one can argue logically and
convincingly that the most i
Jeroen said:
> Saw a speech by, IIRC, Schroeder recently. He mentioned (paraphrasing)
> that Germany is opposed against war against Iraq, because the German
> people, having been in the center of two world wars, realise that
> going to war is never the solution to a problem.
I'd be interested to
--- Dan Minette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I think the point, which you may be in a position to
> address, is that the
> US lied about there being 200k Iraq troops poised on
> the border to invade
> Saudi Arabia, and that this lie is the only reason
> the UN sanctioned Gulf
> War 1. In other wor
--- Dan Minette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Doug just posted it. I actually have a
> verisimilitude question on this.
> By 1991, we were already in the media frenzy phase,
> where even tabloid
> stories quickly made the rounds. If the proof of
> fabrication was evident
> in 1991, why didn't the
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>
> --- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Dan Minette wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >Let me get this straight. You are accusing Powell
> > of fabricating evidence?
> > >
> > Well (this is the article that Rich ghosted)
> >
> > No casus belli? Invent one!
> >
> > As Co
- Original Message -
From: "Gautam Mukunda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 12:10 PM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> Unless someone is claiming that Iraq did not, in
> fact, invade Kuwait, what is the point o
- Original Message -
From: "Gautam Mukunda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 12:04 PM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> I'm cool either way, but I have no idea what piece
> y'all are referring to. I migh
--- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dan Minette wrote:
>
> >
> >Let me get this straight. You are accusing Powell
> of fabricating evidence?
> >
> Well (this is the article that Rich ghosted)
>
> No casus belli? Invent one!
>
> As Colin Powell presents evidence to the UN to
> j
I'm cool either way, but I have no idea what piece
y'all are referring to. I might have deleted the
e-mail by mistake - I'm at work, and so blurring
through them pretty fast while I calculate stuff.
Gautam
--- Julia Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Gautam Mukunda wrote:
> >
> > --- Doug Pe
--- "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> Saw a speech by, IIRC, Schroeder recently. He
> mentioned (paraphrasing) that
> Germany is opposed against war against Iraq, because
> the German people,
> having been in the center of two world wars, realise
> that going to war is
> never the
- Original Message -
From: "Jon Gabriel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 11:49 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
>
> Ridiculous. This is precisely the type of quote that sounds just great
as a
> sound-bite
From: "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 18:26:19 +0100
At 08:43 7-2-2003 -0800, Gautam Mukunda wrote:
But no one denies that the Hussein government employs a level of
brutality and terror like only a few re
Dan Minette wrote:
Let me get this straight. You are accusing Powell of fabricating evidence?
Well (this is the article that Rich ghosted)
No casus belli? Invent one!
As Colin Powell presents evidence to the UN to justify war, Maggie
O'Kane argues that the US's justification for the fi
At 11:21 7-2-2003 -0600, Dan Minette wrote:
Let me get this straight. You are accusing Powell of fabricating evidence?
Its all made up because the poor misunderstood Mr Hussein, who is trying so
hard to lead his Republic into a bright new future is being slanded by the
big bad United States?
I
At 08:43 7-2-2003 -0800, Gautam Mukunda wrote:
But no one denies that the Hussein government employs a level of
brutality and terror like only a few regimes in history
Undoubtedly true. However, brutality is not the reason why the US wants to
invade Iraq. The reason given for the war is "Iraq
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>
> --- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Gautam Mukunda wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >Nothing in the report was exposed as lies or
> > >falsifications, and no one has disputed the
> > accuracy
> > >of what it says.
> > >
> > >
> > And what about the piece Rich posted?
>
- Original Message -
From: "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 11:03 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
> At 07:45 7-2-2003 -0800, Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>
> > > Oh wow. And this fraud wa
--- Dan Minette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Given what you said, and I agree with the lack of
> morality involved in
> the actions of the German companies, what would you
> say about an American
> company that sold him prohibited equipment that
> contained hardware that
> could _very easily_ be
At 07:45 7-2-2003 -0800, Gautam Mukunda wrote:
> Oh wow. And this fraud was made public only *a few days* after Colin
> Powell presented his "evidence" to the UN. It makes me wonder what
> else in the "evidence" will be exposed as lies and falsifications in
> the next few weeks...
>
> Plenty, I g
- Original Message -
From: "Gautam Mukunda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 10:43 AM
Subject: Re: UK dossier on Iraq
>
> In particular, I wonder how this will influence our
> view of Germany. If there is an
--- Doug Pensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Gautam Mukunda wrote:
>
> >
> >Nothing in the report was exposed as lies or
> >falsifications, and no one has disputed the
> accuracy
> >of what it says.
> >
> >
> And what about the piece Rich posted?
> Doug
Haven't seen it, so I can't comment.
Gautam Mukunda wrote:
Nothing in the report was exposed as lies or
falsifications, and no one has disputed the accuracy
of what it says.
And what about the piece Rich posted?
Doug
ROU Disturbing if Accurate
___
http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/
--- "J. van Baardwijk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> Oh wow. And this fraud was made public only *a few
> days* after Colin Powell
> presented his "evidence" to the UN. It makes me
> wonder what else in the
> "evidence" will be exposed as lies and
> falsifications in the next few weeks...
>
> Pl
Jeroen said:
> Oh wow. And this fraud was made public only *a few days* after Colin
> Powell presented his "evidence" to the UN. It makes me wonder what
> else in the "evidence" will be exposed as lies and falsifications in
> the next few weeks...
Along those lines, this is also interesting:
htt
At 11:52 7-2-2003 +, you wrote:
This is interesting reading:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,890916,00.html
Here's some more commentary by Charles Stross:
http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blosxom.cgi/2003/Feb/6#wartime-7
Oh wow. And this fraud was made public only *a few days*
This is interesting reading:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,890916,00.html
Here's some more commentary by Charles Stross:
http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blosxom.cgi/2003/Feb/6#wartime-7
Rich, who's glad that we aren't paying for all those expensive spies and
analysts for nothing..
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