Re: [Crm-sig] NEW ISSUE: Statements about Statements.

uot;However, reification has no formal semantics, and leads to a high increase in the number of triples, hence, it does not scale well. " I agree with your proposals. Prov-O mapping is

Re: [Crm-sig] PC0_Typed_CRM_Property in CRMpc

Opinions? Best, Martin On 5/9/2023 10:37 PM, Francesco Beretta via Crm-sig wrote: Dear Christian-Emil, All, For the reasons I detailed in my other email, I totally agree with your point of view and would like to raise all possible caveats to this kind of mixing up quick and dirty implementat

Re: [Crm-sig] PC0_Typed_CRM_Property in CRMpc

Dear Christian-Emil, All, For the reasons I detailed in my other email, I totally agree with your point of view and would like to raise all possible caveats to this kind of mixing up quick and dirty implementation solutions and consistent conceptual modelling. If we need more classes, even o

Re: [Crm-sig] ISSUE 588 Implementing the .1 Properties of Base and Extensions in RDF

Cs (classes vs properties, etc etc) - why not directly using the standard RDF reification vocabulary <https://www.w3.org/TR/rdf-schema/#ch_reificationvocab>, where properties can be attached to statements/triples. I will include your comments in the working document of Issue 588, with a suggestion to open a

Re: [Crm-sig] Issue 624, linguistic Appellation

ies. It can further be made compatible with the RDF labels with a language tag, which are domain instance specific and not range specific, and of course can represent the TGN language attributes. For VIAF, we would need a "national" context, i.e., the national library. Be

Re: [Crm-sig] ISSUE 588 Implementing the .1 Properties of Base and Extensions in RDF

Dear Pavlos, all reconsidering this question of the properties of properties and the proposed solution of the properties-classes remain some doubts and interrogations to me, in particular in relation with the best practices in the field of serialization of conceptual models in RDF. Metadata

Re: [Crm-sig] Homework for Issue 624

Dear all, Reconsidering the whole exchanges in this issue, and the examples, notably those by Martin on November 9th, it appears that the information we want to model is: this instance of E41 Appellation (i.e. a name as identifier of an entity) is *used* in this language (E56) — formerly or

Re: [Crm-sig] error in RDFS for 7.1.1 for the class that is a subclass of E41 and E33

Dear Martin, all Sorry to intervene so late in this interesting exchange, I was away for some days and I'm going through my emails now. I encountered the same questions while working a few years ago in a history project interested in the evolution of the use of names and surnames. The appr

[Crm-sig] Modelling metereological data

Dear All, are you aware of projects that have used CIDOC CRM & family to model meteorological data? or of alignments between CRMsci and ontologies of meteorological observation? and of publications or documentation on these issues? Any indication will be very welcome, with my thanks and best

Re: [Crm-sig] CALL FOR E-VOTE ISSUE 581

able) but it is not an observation. Rgds SdS Stephen Stead Tel +44 20 8668 3075 Mob +44 7802 755 013 E-mail ste...@paveprime.com <mailto:ste...@paveprime.com> LinkedIn Profile https://www.linkedin.com/in/steads/ <https://www.linkedin.com/in/steads/> *From:*Crm-sig *On Behalf

Re: [Crm-sig] CALL FOR E-VOTE ISSUE 581

e one raised in issue 581, to fall under issues 504 and 580. Hoping to have answered your question in this way, with my best regards Francesco Dr. habil. Francesco Beretta Chargé de recherche au CNRS, Chargé d'enseignement à l'Université de Neuchâtel Axe de recherche en histoire numér

Re: [Crm-sig] CALL FOR E-VOTE ISSUE 581

Dear Martin, dear Franco, I assume that the same question by Franco (Issue 581) is raised by page 25 ? " What goes on in our minds or is produced by our minds is also regarded as part of the *material reality*, as it becomes materially evident to other people at least by our utterances, behavi

[Crm-sig] Considerations about : Issue 580: CRMsoc redefinition of scope

project, and thus improve the integration of CRMsoc with the standard by refining and enlarging it. But it should be considered that this process is happening, and will continue to evolve, anyway.Let's not miss theprovided opportunity. With all my best wishes Francesco Dr. h

Re: [Crm-sig] Issue 580: CRMsoc redefinition of scope

g, no extension can be characterized as "opposed to" another, it would violate its logical foundations. All the best, Martin On 2/1/2022 2:13 PM, Francesco Beretta via Crm-sig wrote: Dear all, Please find in attachment the homework of George Bruseker and myself concerning "Issue

[Crm-sig] Issue 580: CRMsoc redefinition of scope

Dear all, Please find in attachment the homework of George Bruseker and myself concerning "Issue 580: CRMsoc redefinition of scope" for presentation at the next SIG. All the best, Francesco What is CRMsoc_20220201.docx Description: MS-Word 2007 document

Re: [Crm-sig] Foundational perspectives of CRMbase and CRMsoc (was : Re: Modelling an Event's General Outcome Ideas? Properties?)

-- Message transféré Sujet : Re: [Crm-sig] Foundational perspectives of CRMbase and CRMsoc (was : Re: [Crm-sig] Modelling an Event's General Outcome Ideas? Properties?) Date : Mon, 10 Jan 2022 17:04:45 +0200 De :Martin Doerr Pour : Francesco Beretta , crm-sig@ics.forth.g

[Crm-sig] Foundational perspectives of CRMbase and CRMsoc (was : Re: Modelling an Event's General Outcome Ideas? Properties?)

tood, we need to discuss this *face-to-face *with enough time. The necessary explanations and disambiguations definitely exceed my writing capacities. Looking forward to a substantial face-to-face discussion and resolution of any misunderstanding, Best wishes, Martin On 1/6/2022 9:03 PM, Frances

Re: [Crm-sig] Modelling an Event's General Outcome Ideas? Properties?

n be regarded as continuation of the offer. What if someone offers an object that is not his?, this happens. I maintain that "outcome" is too narrow for reality. Cheers, Martin On 1/6/2022 2:47 PM, Francesco Beretta via Crm-sig wrote: Dear George, Martin, Let's take an exemple:

Re: [Crm-sig] Modelling an Event's General Outcome Ideas? Properties?

Dear George, Martin, Let's take an exemple: there is a negotiation that results in a sale, i.e. a change of ownership of some physical object. The negotiation belongs to the physical, human space: it is an event of type negotiation. It can result, or not, in a speech act changing the ownersh

Re: [Crm-sig] RDFS, XML and more

There was unfortunately a copy-paste issue in my email. Le 09.09.21 à 17:35, Francesco Beretta a écrit : The P1 is identified by (identifies) <https://ontome.net/property/1/namespace/1> property has E41 Appellation as range. This class is subclass of Symbolic Object and Legal

Re: [Crm-sig] RDFS, XML and more

Dear Rob, all, >> I'm curious also as to your thoughts on the rdfs:label / P1_identifies issue? /À propos/: there is a question that has been on my mind for some time, perhaps you can give me some insights. The P1 is identified by (identifies) pr

Re: [Crm-sig] Linked Places mapping

Dear Richard, Notwithstanding a more authoritative response, we have developed the ontome.net application precisely for coping with this kind of issues – and providing in the end a RDF (XML-OWL) export of the mapping. So, if you're interested, we can exchange on this. Best wishes Francesco

Re: [Crm-sig] E-vote for issue 384 (template for family models)

YES Le 21.06.21 à 15:47, George Bruseker via Crm-sig a écrit : YES On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 4:24 PM Øyvind Eide via Crm-sig mailto:crm-sig@ics.forth.gr>> wrote: YES Am 18.06.2021 um 11:56 schrieb Athanasios Velios via Crm-sig mailto:crm-sig@ics.forth.gr>>: Dear all, Th

Re: [Crm-sig] E-vote for issue 493 (example templates)

YES Le 21.06.21 à 15:48, George Bruseker via Crm-sig a écrit : YES On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 4:25 PM Øyvind Eide via Crm-sig mailto:crm-sig@ics.forth.gr>> wrote: YES Am 18.06.2021 um 11:47 schrieb Athanasios Velios via Crm-sig mailto:crm-sig@ics.forth.gr>>: Dear all, Th

Re: [Crm-sig] Issue 419: Activity plans

Dear Achille, Thanasis, all In my opinion, your discussion raises two questions, a specific and a general one. The specific: In which part of the CRM family is it better to have the activity plans ? You have good arguments for the third option proposed by Thanasis – waiting since years wit

Re: [Crm-sig] 511 e-vote

further enhance the value of all the work that has been done over the years to develop the robust model that we know and cherish. With all my thanks and best wishes Francesco --- Dr. habil. Francesco Beretta Chargé de recherche au CNRS, Axe de recherche histoire numérique, Laboratoire de

Re: [Crm-sig] 511 e-vote

, Francesco Beretta via Crm-sig wrote: Dear all, as already stated in the SIG meeting, I'm concerned with monotonicity, and more largely with substantially changing the substance of a class without changing its identifier: E16 remains E16 but "measuring the nominal monetary value of a col

Re: [Crm-sig] 511 e-vote

Dear all, as already stated in the SIG meeting, I'm concerned with monotonicity, and more largely with substantially changing the substance of a class without changing its identifier: E16 remains E16 but "measuring the nominal monetary value of a collection of coins" is now _excluded_. So w

Re: [Crm-sig] Is P181 has amount different from P90 has value?

Dear Rob, all, I agree with you and wonder why this property was added. Best wishes Francesco Le 06.12.19 à 21:48, Robert Sanderson a écrit : Dear all, Is P181_has_amount really a useful property, compared to its super-property of P90_has_value? They both take numbers, 181 is a subproper

[Crm-sig] CRM 6.2.9 published ? – Re: New Erlangen OWL Version based on CIDOC CRM 6.2.9

Dear Mark, all, Considering the documentation about the CRM 6.2.9 version, I see that it is mentioned as published on the website, but there's no RDF(S) file available there (unusual for a published version) and in the PDF you can still read: "Editorial Status: In Progress since [30/04/2020]",

Re: [Crm-sig] Modelling an Actor carrying out an action at the Behest of Another

also: in fact the quality or mission does not belong to the role, but to the actor, so this kind of modelling is somewhat artificial. Both solutions seem to work technically but reveal the difficulty of expressing a complex reality and specific points of view with simple constructs. Best wishes

Re: [Crm-sig] Membership PLEASE VOTE

I vote YES. Francesco Beretta Le 30.01.20 à 18:27, Martin Doerr a écrit : Dear All, We are glad to announce that Swiss Art Research Infrastructure (SARI) would like to become member of CRM-SIG: "The Swiss Art Research Infrastructure (SARI), hosted by the University of Zurich and part

[Crm-sig] Call for papers: Data for History 2020 - Modelling Time, Space, Agents

ffer a limited number of bursaries for PhD students and early-career scholars presenting at the conference. Scientific committee * Francesco Beretta (CNRS/Université de Lyon) * George Bruseker (Takin.solutions) * Arianna Ciula (King's College London) * Sebastiaan Derks (Huygens In

Re: [Crm-sig] CIDOC CRM URI management

Dear all, This very interesting conversation was up to now focusing on CRMbase. But what about the extensions family ? Often pointing from one extension to antoher ? One major point for having machine actionable, consistent ontologies is to have a mechanism to point to the versions of each m

[Crm-sig] CIDOC CRM URI management

Dear all, I have a question about CIDOC CRM URI management. The last published version of CRMbase is 6.2.1. If I take the RDF serialization, I find this base URI: http://www.cidoc-crm.org/cidoc-crm/ If I sent this URI in the web: http://www.cidoc-crm.org/cidoc-crm/E92_Spacetime_Volume I

Re: [Crm-sig] ISSUE P114-P120 VOTE

ig on behalf of Francesco Beretta Sent: 12 January 2020 11:54 To: crm-sig@ics.forth.gr Subject: Re: [Crm-sig] ISSUE P114-P120 VOTE Dear Martin and Christian-Emil, 1. is there any replacement foreseen for these quite useful properties in CRMbase ? 2. for the sake of clear documentation and lega

Re: [Crm-sig] ISSUE P114-P120 VOTE

Dear Martin and Christian-Emil, 1. is there any replacement foreseen for these quite useful properties in CRMbase ? 2. for the sake of clear documentation and legacy the vote proposal should be associated with the list and links to the correspondent issues, shouldn't it ? 3. I'm quite in f

[Crm-sig] HW of ISSUE 422 – Substance of Phase

Dear All, Following the discussion of yesterday, here a proposal for the definition of Phase. We all know that the methodological exclusive choice in favour of events was driven by issues related to merging data from different sources (cf. Issue 245). But insofar as many projects use the CRM

[Crm-sig] HW of ISSUE 422

Dear All In attachment a proposition (in the sense of a graphical representation of open questions) concerning phases -> HW on issue 422:  http://www.cidoc-crm.org/Issue/ID-422-phases A link to Issue 245: Start/End vs Period of Existence should be added in my opinion at the bottom of issue 4

Re: [Crm-sig] part of HW for Issue 412

g and somewhat unusual. Best Francesco Le 20.10.19 à 12:31, Francesco Beretta a écrit : Hi, I agree with the addition proposed by Thanasis. I'd propose on my side to add the few words between * * in the text below belonging to the "What is the idea ?" section. "C

Re: [Crm-sig] part of HW for Issue 412

Hi, I agree with the addition proposed by Thanasis. I'd propose on my side to add the few words between * * in the text below belonging to the "What is the idea ?" section. "CRMsoc can be used to describe **characteristics of individuals or groups**, economic transactions, rights held by peo

[Crm-sig] HW issue 412 : CRMsoc definition

Dear all, In attachement you'll find a proposal for the CRMsoc presentation on the CIDOC CRM website . Let us discuss it in Paris. All the best Thanasis, George, Vincent and Francesco CRMsoc-web-intro_proposal.odt Description: application/vnd.oasis.opendo

Re: [Crm-sig] PLEASE VOTE: Issue Man-Made

YES Le 24.04.19 à 22:11, Martin Doerr a écrit : Dear All The proposal is to replace in all CRM labels "Man-Made" by "Human-Made" Please vote "YES" if you agree, "NO" if not, by: Mai 10, 2019 Kind regards, Martin -- Dr. Martin Doerr

Re: [Crm-sig] Space time volumes

-span, Place and Dimension, at the same time freeing E4 from dependence from it: E4 would occupy some E94, not be it. Best, Franco Il giorno gio 21 mar 2019 alle 08:30 Francesco Beretta mailto:francesco.bere...@cnrs.fr>> ha scritto: Dear Dan, Franco, all, in a nu

Re: [Crm-sig] Space time volumes

Dear Dan, Franco, all, in a nutshell: Period – E4 P4 has time-span E52 Time-Span P7 took place at E53 Place Spacetime Volume – E92 P160 has temporal projection E52 Time-Span P161 has spatial projection E53 Place Period – E4 (phenomenal) Pxx has projection in Spacetime Volume – E92 (‘r

Re: [Crm-sig] issue 336 and spacetime volumes

Dear Martin, all, Applying the principles we generally use in conceptual modelling, a model of « CRM top hierarchy and space&time » like the one you’ll find in attachment seems plausible. I’ll comment the slides from the top to the bottom, for the sake of clarity. Let’s start from the basic

Re: [Crm-sig] Issue 369

Dear Thanasis Le 18.02.19 à 22:38, Athanasios Velios a écrit : I like this scope note but my only concern is that an observer cannot tell when one phase ends and the next one begins. How can we explain that a phase is no longer? The whole discussion concerning 'phases' (to avoid the unclear

Re: [Crm-sig] Issue 369

Hi, I agree with Martin's definition of phase and point of view of not "connecting a discussion about "phases of ideas" with "phases of Physical Things". I earlier thought myself that ideas, in some ways, could have 'phases' but it seems more suitable, in the way of modeling adopted by the C

[Crm-sig] HTML Page – identifiable portion of the HTML page / of a manuscript

Dear all, * How would you model in CRM 6.2 a HTML page that you can retrieve by entering a URL in a web browser (and is therefore identified by the URL at a given date) ? As a E90 Symbolic Object or a E73 Information Object ? * And if in this page I identify a spot, or arbitrarily de

[Crm-sig] Quantification P96 by mother

Hi, In the CRM version 6.2. and 6.2.1 I read: P96 by mother (gave birth) Domain: E67 Birth Range: E21 Person [...] Quantification: many to one, necessary (1,1:0,1) Shouldn't the quantification be 1,1:0,*n* ? All the best Francesco

Re: [Crm-sig] ISSUE Label-free RDF classes PLEASE VOTE

Dear all, I also vote YES. Furthermore, I'd also like to stress the importance to distinguish between the identifier, which must be stable during the whole life of a class, or property, and the label(s), which can be multiple, multilingual and evolve, as everyone knows. The meaning of the c

[Crm-sig] Homework Issue 358: CRMsoc

best Francesco Beretta Chargé de recherche au CNRS, Responsable du Pôle histoire numérique, Laboratoire de recherche historique Rhône-Alpes CNRS UMR 5190 LARHRA, I.S.H., 14, Avenue Berthelot 69363 LYON CEDEX 07 + 33 (0)6 51 84 48 84 Le Pôle histoire numérique <http://larhra.

Re: [Crm-sig] ISSUE: CRMsoc and scope of CRM modules

h limited temporal validity, to provide a general view on this issue that could be used by the whole community. Have a good start in the SIG meeting and see you tomorrow. Best Francesco Beretta - Chargé de recherche au CNRS, Responsable du Pôle histoire numérique, Laboratoire de recher

[Crm-sig] Populated places

Dear all, One of the basic place type in geonames.org is : PPL    populated place    a city, town, village, or other agglomeration of buildings where people live and work A populated place in this sense means different things : 1. an agglomerat

Re: [Crm-sig] Passive Activities

nion the current discussion shows that there's probably a more general need of deeper study concerning this kind of social-legal-economic phenomena which exists, and last in time, independently from the point of view of the observer. Best Francesco - Francesco Beretta Chargé de r

Re: [Crm-sig] ISSUE: Scholarly Reading.

Dear All, Here some interesting documentation about the Factoid model: http://factoid-dighum.kcl.ac.uk/fpo-factoid-prosopography-ontology/# Best Francesco Le 30.03.17 à 17:10, martin a écrit : Dear All, My colleague Athina found the following paper: Michele Pasin, John Bradley; Factoid-bas

Re: [Crm-sig] ISSUE: Scholarly Reading.

be more on this side. I'm not (yet) so trained in the CRM to be able to tell if this alignement is accurate but in any case this paper raises very interesting issues we have to discuss (and are discussing) in the domain of an extension of the CRM for historical data. And are certainly worth