William Hubbs closed bug #409385[1] as fixed, introducing
virtual/service-manager and adding it to the @system set, and dropping
OpenRC from baselayout's post dependencies.
Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only
systemd, with no OpenRC installed. Since that was the rais
On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> William Hubbs closed bug #409385[1] as fixed, introducing
> virtual/service-manager and adding it to the @system set, and dropping
> OpenRC from baselayout's post dependencies.
>
> Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov wrote:
> On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> > Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only
> > systemd, with no OpenRC installed.
>
> Really? Bug 373219 is still open.
>
Sorry, I missed your explanatio
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:09 AM, Pavel Volkov wrote:
> On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>> William Hubbs closed bug #409385[1] as fixed, introducing
>> virtual/service-manager and adding it to the @system set, and dropping
>> OpenRC from baselayout's post dependencies.
>>
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Pavel Volkov wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov wrote:
>>
>> On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>> > Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only
>> > systemd, with no OpenRC installed.
>>
>> Reall
Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Pavel Volkov wrote:
> > On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov wrote:
> >>
> >> On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> >> > Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only
> >> > syste
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:53 PM, wrote:
> Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>
>> On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Pavel Volkov wrote:
>> > On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov wrote:
>> >>
>> >> On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>> >> > Therefore, as of today, anyo
Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:53 PM, wrote:
> > Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> >
> >> On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Pavel Volkov wrote:
> >> > On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov
> >> > wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez
There is going to be resistance. Two months ago there was a huge
thread in gentoo-dev, because a package maintaner complained that his
co-maintainer added a systemd unit to the package:
http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.devel/85792
In the end, the maintainer rage-quit:
http://article.gm
On 07/30/2013 05:40 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> There is going to be resistance. Two months ago there was a huge
> thread in gentoo-dev, because a package maintaner complained that his
> co-maintainer added a systemd unit to the package:
>
> http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.devel/85
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:24 AM, Daniel Campbell wrote:
> On 07/30/2013 05:40 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>> There is going to be resistance. Two months ago there was a huge
>> thread in gentoo-dev, because a package maintaner complained that his
>> co-maintainer added a systemd unit to the pac
Top-posting because my question is about something in the linked threads...
In one comment was said the following:
Can I ask the systemd people to design a working solution for opting out? I
can't support this initiative without such a solution and I would be happy
to work with the systemd peo
On Wed, 31 Jul 2013 07:34:22 -0400, Tanstaafl wrote:
> Where is this 'INSTALL_MASK' option for opting out of systemd
> completely documented?
man make.conf
--
Neil Bothwick
If at first you don't succeed, redefine success.
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On 2013-07-31 8:22 AM, Neil Bothwick wrote:
On Wed, 31 Jul 2013 07:34:22 -0400, Tanstaafl wrote:
Where is this 'INSTALL_MASK' option for opting out of systemd
completely documented?
man make.conf
Thanks but... I didn't see one word mention of systemd.
So, how should this be used to 'opt o
On 31/07/13 at 08:30am, Tanstaafl wrote:
> So, how should this be used to 'opt out of systemd completely'?
from main make.conf
"Use this variable if you want to selectively prevent certain
files from being copied into your file system tree. .."
You can use it to prevent ebuilds from insta
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 7:30 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
> On 2013-07-31 8:22 AM, Neil Bothwick wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, 31 Jul 2013 07:34:22 -0400, Tanstaafl wrote:
>>
>>> Where is this 'INSTALL_MASK' option for opting out of systemd
>>> completely documented?
>>
>>
>> man make.conf
>
>
> Thanks but... I d
On 2013-07-31 8:41 AM, Yohan Pereira wrote:
On 31/07/13 at 08:30am, Tanstaafl wrote:
So, how should this be used to 'opt out of systemd completely'?
from main make.conf
"Use this variable if you want to selectively prevent certain
files from being copied into your file system tree. ..
On 2013-07-31 11:20 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
If you don't use the systemd USE flag (and never install anything that
depends on systemd), you will not get systemd installed, but many
packages will install systemd unit files in /urs/lib/systemd/system.
This unit files are little non-executab
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 10:26 AM, Tanstaafl wrote:
> On 2013-07-31 11:20 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>>
>> If you don't use the systemd USE flag (and never install anything that
>> depends on systemd), you will not get systemd installed, but many
>> packages will install systemd unit files in
On 31/07/13 at 11:26am, Tanstaafl wrote:
> On 2013-07-31 11:20 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> > If you don't use the systemd USE flag (and never install anything that
> > depends on systemd), you will not get systemd installed, but many
> > packages will install systemd unit files in /urs/lib/sy
On 07/31/2013 11:20 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>
> For the record, I now think it's a waste of time trying to stop the
> installation of tiny files that basically do nothing, either in
> /usr/lib/systemd/system or in /etc/init.d, but you have the option if
> you so desire.
The nice thing abou
On 2013-07-31 11:45 AM, Yohan Pereira wrote:
The "one true way" is to set -systemd in your useflags. However anything
that hard depends on systemd will pull it in like AFAIR gnome. Trying to
opt-out of systemd in these cases is not supported and probably not
trivial.
Ok, I misread some things
On 31/07/2013 17:36, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> No, because the *exact same* situation occurs for Bash completion
> scripts... and logrotate scripts... and cron jobs... and...
>
> The devs decided (and I agree with them) that the important thing is
> to cover the necessities of the majority of u
On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> ...
> Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but whinging
> about some data files is not. Anyone who does is letting their OCD show
> in ways they really should be keeping private.
Hmmmn, it's a bit freaking weird - if I'm under
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 12:56 PM, Stroller
wrote:
>
> On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>> ...
>> Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but whinging
>> about some data files is not. Anyone who does is letting their OCD show
>> in ways they really should be keeping
On 31/07/2013 19:56, Stroller wrote:
>
> On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>> ...
>> Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but whinging
>> about some data files is not. Anyone who does is letting their OCD show
>> in ways they really should be keeping private.
>
On 31/07/13 at 06:56pm, Stroller wrote:
> Hmmmn, it's a bit freaking weird - if I'm understanding correctly some of the
> statements made here about systemd - that there will be files installed to
> /etc/init.d/ that don't actually do anything.
If your refering to what I think your refering to t
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 01:09:03PM -0500, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> >
> > Hmmmn, it's a bit freaking weird - if I'm understanding correctly some of
> > the statements made here about systemd - that there will be files installed
> > to /etc/init.d/ that don't actually do anything.
>
> If you u
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:09 PM, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> On 31/07/2013 19:56, Stroller wrote:
>>
>> On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>>> ...
>>> Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but whinging
>>> about some data files is not. Anyone who does is letting their O
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:21 PM, Bruce Hill
wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 01:09:03PM -0500, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>> >
>> > Hmmmn, it's a bit freaking weird - if I'm understanding correctly some of
>> > the statements made here about systemd - that there will be files
>> > installed to /
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:09 PM, Alan McKinnon
> wrote:
>> On 31/07/2013 19:56, Stroller wrote:
>>>
>>> On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
...
Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but whingi
On 31 July 2013, at 19:09, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 12:56 PM, Stroller
> wrote:
>>
>> On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>>> ...
>>> Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but whinging
>>> about some data files is not. Anyone who does
On 31 July 2013, at 19:09, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> On 31/07/2013 19:56, Stroller wrote:
>>
>> On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>>> ...
>>> Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but whinging
>>> about some data files is not. Anyone who does is letting their OCD s
On 31 July 2013, at 19:24, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>>> ...
>>> If you use systemd, all the files installed in /etc/init.d (except
>>> functions.sh) don't actually do nothing.
>>
>> In English "don't actually do nothing" means "do something"; i.e. "don't
>> actually do anything" != "don't actu
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:59 PM, Stroller
wrote:
>
> On 31 July 2013, at 19:24, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
...
If you use systemd, all the files installed in /etc/init.d (except
functions.sh) don't actually do nothing.
>>>
>>> In English "don't actually do nothing" means "do somethi
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:54 PM, Stroller
wrote:
>
> On 31 July 2013, at 19:09, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 12:56 PM, Stroller
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
...
Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but
On 31 July 2013, at 20:03, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:59 PM, Stroller
> wrote:
>>
>> On 31 July 2013, at 19:24, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> ...
> If you use systemd, all the files installed in /etc/init.d (except
> functions.sh) don't actually do nothing
On 31/07/2013 20:54, Stroller wrote:
>
> On 31 July 2013, at 19:09, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 12:56 PM, Stroller
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
...
Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but whinging
>>
On Wed, 31 Jul 2013 19:54:54 +0100, Stroller wrote:
> > If you use systemd, all the files installed in /etc/init.d (except
> > functions.sh) don't actually do nothing.
>
> Right, which is a bit freakin' odd, because on most every previous
> distro and other *nix system, that's where the system
On 31 July 2013, at 20:09, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> … if you used systemd, and tried to run "/etc/init.d/whatever start",
> …
> Nowadays you get the following warning:
>
> * You are attempting to run an openrc service on a
> * system which openrc did not boot.
> *...
>
> So it's pretty harm
On 31/07/2013 20:54, Stroller wrote:
>
> On 31 July 2013, at 19:09, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>
>> On 31/07/2013 19:56, Stroller wrote:
>>>
>>> On 31 July 2013, at 18:23, Alan McKinnon wrote:
...
Whinging about systemd binaries being installed is valid, but whinging
about some data file
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 01:24:29PM -0500, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:21 PM, Bruce Hill
> wrote:
> > On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 01:09:03PM -0500, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Hmmmn, it's a bit freaking weird - if I'm understanding correctly some
> >> > of the s
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 01:22:21PM -0500, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
>
> acero ~ # du -sh /usr/share/man
> 82M /usr/share/man
> acero ~ # du -sh /usr/lib/systemd/
> 3.6M /usr/lib/systemd/
>
> And /usr/share/doc is 2.5G in my laptop.
That's due to USE=doc rather than USE=-doc
--
Happy Penguin Co
On 31 July 2013, at 20:38, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>> ...
>> Heck! Even according to yourself, in the same email, I'm not understanding
>> it wrong!
>>
>>
>> I've asked you this before - would you stop wrongly telling people they're
>> wrong, please?
>>
>> Would you please just stop and think "c
On 31/07/2013 23:22, Stroller wrote:
>
> On 31 July 2013, at 20:38, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>>> ...
>>> Heck! Even according to yourself, in the same email, I'm not understanding
>>> it wrong!
>>>
>>>
>>> I've asked you this before - would you stop wrongly telling people they're
>>> wrong, please?
On 31 July 2013, at 22:43, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> ...
> Are we OK on this for now, or is there more to discuss?
Yes, that's great. I'm glad we can be open and honest when we've got these
kinds of problems.
On other occasions I've worried that you might have driven away someone who was
seeking
On 31 July 2013, at 20:28, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>>
>> Right, which is a bit freakin' odd, because on most every previous distro
>> and other *nix system, that's where the system administrator goes to start
>> and stop services.
>>
>> If they're not used, in this case, I don't think they shoul
On 01/08/2013 00:25, Stroller wrote:
>
> On 31 July 2013, at 22:43, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>> ...
>> Are we OK on this for now, or is there more to discuss?
>
> Yes, that's great. I'm glad we can be open and honest when we've got these
> kinds of problems.
>
> On other occasions I've worried tha
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 02:00:23AM -0500, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote
> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:24 AM, Daniel Campbell wrote:
> You need an OpenRC use flag to install OpenRC init scripts? That's
> simply a lie.
An apology to Daniel might be in order. I start my USE flag with "-*".
During a re
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 06:11:02PM +0530, Yohan Pereira wrote
> On 31/07/13 at 08:30am, Tanstaafl wrote:
> > So, how should this be used to 'opt out of systemd completely'?
>
> from main make.conf
> "Use this variable if you want to selectively prevent certain
> files from being copied into
On Thu, 1 Aug 2013 06:24:17 -0400, Walter Dnes wrote:
> > You can use it to prevent ebuilds from installing unit files
> > or open-rc scripts from doing so (based on what you want to opt-out
> > of).
>
> From the man page...
> > INSTALL_MASK = [space delimited list of file names]
>
> I
On Thu, Aug 1, 2013 at 4:43 AM, Walter Dnes wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 02:00:23AM -0500, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote
>> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:24 AM, Daniel Campbell wrote:
>
>> You need an OpenRC use flag to install OpenRC init scripts? That's
>> simply a lie.
>
> An apology to Daniel m
Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 1, 2013 at 4:43 AM, Walter Dnes wrote:
> > On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 02:00:23AM -0500, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote
> >> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:24 AM, Daniel Campbell wrote:
> >
> >> You need an OpenRC use flag to install OpenRC init scripts? That's
> >> s
On 28.07.2013 10:22, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote:
> William Hubbs closed bug #409385[1] as fixed, introducing
> virtual/service-manager and adding it to the @system set, and dropping
> OpenRC from baselayout's post dependencies.
>
> Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only
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