Hey, your email address doesn't say tripwire, you sneaky tripwire
representatives...
On 14/12/2010 10:14 AM, AJ Collins wrote:
I'm going to say yes. I don't think it would be possible to get that amount
of concurrent players unless there was a price drop or a free weekend.
On Mon, Dec 13,
This isn't the case when using certain virtualization software and decent hardware,
while giving dedicated resources to the servers.
And until the day every other VPS provider follows this mindset, VPS's will
always be unsuitable for the demand a high-usage game server will put on it.
It's
I have had nothing but problems trying to get either of the L4D games to
work properly with NAT'ed networks.
Good luck.
On 29/10/2010 9:45 AM, Fernando Sanchez wrote:
Im hosting a dedicated server on 192.168.1.10:27015
Im playing from within the same LAN on 192.168.1.50
When I use
On a side-note. What is with these names being added to the subject lines?
On 28/10/2010 12:53 PM, Jeff Sugar wrote:
I believe we just got the same thing. Two crashes so far on cp_manor_event.
Anyone else?
On Wed, Oct 27, 2010 at 7:29 PM, G. Hutchinsonhu...@halsplayground.comwrote:
SetSteamID( [A:1:0:0] )
It's a clue! :)
On 6/09/2010 6:12 AM, MeZelf wrote:
SetSteamID( [A:1:0:0] )
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Another useful HLDS Windows thread.
You people should be banned.
On 21/08/2010 11:42 PM, MjrNuT wrote:
Nobody needs your fuckin' ball. So take it home and gtfo! But, remember
that ball was not paid for...
I concur, this made msleeper's party crashing benign. Thanks for the cvar
msleeper.
If you are running Linux servers I highly recommend learning iptables,
or having your GSP pick up the slack.
On 11/08/2010 5:57 AM, adam chance wrote:
How do I block packets that begin with \xFF\xFF\xFF\xFF\x6C? It apparently stops
the A2C_PRINT Spam?
Ja, or something like that.
Although I promise we'll get very annoyed if you don't send english as well.
On 29/07/2010 3:32 PM, T. Koehler wrote:
Hallo
Das ist ein test...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Thomas Köhler
UNITED COLO GmbH
Sonntagsanger 1
96450 Coburg
Germany
Tel : ++49 9561 871145
Liar (yes it worked).
On 8/07/2010 1:26 PM, Bryn Moslow wrote:
Just testing.
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I'd like it if it weren't posted on the list.
On 25/06/2010 5:35 AM, Mark P wrote:
yes
2010/6/24 HL-SDK Synthssyntron...@gmail.com
Like as well
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 5:05 PM, Saul Rennisonsaul.renni...@gmail.com
wrote:
Like.
Thanks,
- Saul.
On 24 June
How is updating a firewall to secure a server a pain in the ass?
Perhaps you should of said normal server owners are slack? Windows is
point and click and iptables is one line of text (a lot shorter than
this email). I'd also imagine pretty much damn near all GSP's use a
static IP system, and
HLDSUpdateTool runs with the privileges of the current user, did you
check to make sure the directory and file were writeable?
On 25/05/2010 1:42 PM, Dominic Marciano wrote:
Glad i could help.
Date: Tue, 25 May 2010 06:38:45 +0200
From: rikard.brem...@warzone.nu
To:
Luckily, the Linux list still remains untouched by the drooling masses.
Kids, this isn't a forum. Stop having unrelated discussions on these
mailing lists. There are many real-deal, professional game server
providers and server administrators that don't want to have to trawl
through piles of
Asking Linux or Windows is like comparing apples to oranges. Both have
their pros and cons.
If it's just one server I'd go Windows.
On 27/03/2010 10:27 PM, Jake Eisenman wrote:
Just curious. Personally I use Linux because I know how to setup
everything quickly from ssh
Sent from my iPod
Only thing I can think of is seeing if the srcds console has some sort
of scripting (as in, seta var value, inc var e.t.c).
Otherwise I'm sure there's a server-side SM plugin that does what you
want :)
On 13/03/2010 5:21 PM, Christoffer Pedersen wrote:
Hi there
Im trying to make my source
List Policing: You're doing it wrong.
I've actually seen this bug replicated on some servers I play on on
other maps (like goldrush and badwater). Have a feeling it might have
something to do with a plugin.
On 12/03/2010 11:14 PM, Joel R. wrote:
Oh, and this isn't the right place for this
Best advice ever given. There is absolutely no reason to run any
software under a root/Administrator account. In both Linux and Windows,
security policies are *very* customisable. It's not too hard to create a
gameadmin account, with network binding access policies. The only thing
you should
Who are you?
This list is a resource relating to hlds/srcds administration,
primarily. It's secondary purpose would be discussion of related
material. Common Sense would dictate what is and isn't appropriate for
this list. Here's an example, this thread isn't appropriate.
On 22/02/2010 6:28
It's easier to use the motdfile and hostfile commands in your server.cfg
It will save you a lot of heartache, and gives you better control over
your servers anyway.
On 20/02/2010 4:23 PM, -xL-Trinidad wrote:
that doesnt work for me. They are still overwritten.
- Original Message -
to mention that writeprotecting does not work
since the update runs propably with admin rights and can overwrite the files
anyway.
- Original Message -
From: Shane Arnold
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list
Sent: Saturday, February 20, 2010 9:34 AM
Sorry, just realised again that I'm on the Windows list. The same
principle should apply however.
On 20/02/2010 9:45 PM, Shane Arnold wrote:
The update runs with rights of the user that invoked the script. So, you
could just give the file group read permissions, and deny the owner
any rights
Sounds to me like a good way of doing business. That way the GSP doesn't
have to fuck around because some douchebag customer broke their own server.
On 21/02/2010 12:24 PM, Cc2iscooL wrote:
Sounds like all but #2 support ticket would be useless in most any other
host.
On Sat, Feb 20, 2010 at
While I'm all for helpful discussion, he's right. Off-topic posts on a
mailing list serve no purpose other than to shit up what is otherwise a
concise and useful resource relating to server administration. Leave
topics like these and others to the relevant places. I recommend
www.srcds.com and
Log files are ANSI encoded. Saul wins!
On 7/02/2010 7:59 PM, Saul Rennison wrote:
If it's not UTF-8, then I could only think of it being ANSI
Thanks,
- Saul.
On 7 February 2010 09:35, -xL-Trinidadtrini...@extreme-losers.org wrote:
Hi,
does anyone know what encoding SRCDS uses to
Saxton Hale's first attempt at using email. From an iPhone of all
things. I'm impressed.
On 6/02/2010 9:25 PM, Chris Murphy wrote:
Sent from my iPhone
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Most consumer-grade DSL/Internet hardware routers with built-in
firewalls and DDoS protection with fuck with the server browser, as
the connection literally gets flooded with responses. As for servers
being blacklisted on a community-based database, I'd had to be the one
yelling told you so.
Makes perfect sense other than the dramatisation. VALVe are completely
dropping the ball when it comes to server protection. Fair call that
they are primarily game designers, but surely they can spent some
manhours at least making their product able to withstand the most basic
of DoS and
Thankyou,
Someone sees reason...
On 17/01/2010 7:46 AM, w4rezz wrote:
sv_allow_voice_from_file 0
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But *you* are not *everyone*. It only takes one malicious/incorrect
entry to start screwing things up.
On 7/01/2010 10:42 PM, Spencer 'voogru' MacDonald wrote:
If you have a centralized blacklist that people trust, maintain it and
verify submitted servers to prevent abuse, I think it's better
In my experience, srcds binds to whatever IP address the local hostname
resolves to. So you need to specify this (or your interface metrics) in
your hosts file or networking configuration.
On 26/12/2009 3:02 PM, Blood Letter wrote:
Redirect all traffic at the NIC level?
From:
ScanServers
christof...@scanservers.eu
www.scanservers.eu
-Original Message-
From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com
[mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Shane Arnold
Sent: 26. december 2009 11:17
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list
Subject: Re
Installation from hldsupdatetool/steam is usually just one command... so
yes?
Learning to create scripts in Linux and Windows is suprisingly easy.
Google is your friend.
On 25/12/2009 9:29 PM, Peter Powell wrote:
Hi,
Is there any way to run the server installer in unattended mode? I
wish
.
Just the package Valve distributes it in is an installer. Once
installed
it's the same as the linux version (essentially).
On 26/12/2009 12:56 AM, Shane Arnold wrote:
Sorry I just realised it would be more difficult on Windows (being
a GUI
installer
I wonder what you people are thinking when you see
hlds@list.valvesoftware.com.
Maybe hlds stands for Help Lamers Do Shit.
Client issues belong @ https://support.steampowered.com
These lists are primarily for hlds/srcds/server administration issues.
On 19/12/2009 2:11 PM, Don Williams wrote:
Version 122 of what?
Tried disabling plugins?
Cuttting the message body out really doesn't help.
On 18/12/2009 11:14 AM, Shawn Somers wrote:
windows servers with version 122 are crashing on map change...
Shawn
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Likewise, running fine. Not using MM or SM though, so like always, I'm
going to blame the mods.
On 11/12/2009 11:10 AM, Steven Sumichrast wrote:
My Linux tf2 server is running fine. MM:S 1.8 and latest SM 1.3 build
I believe with a bunch of plugins.
On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 9:06 PM, Jake
I am interested in knowing the impact of having word-filters enabled on
the player count. I don't agree with the practice, but then again it's
not my server(s).
On 10/12/2009 4:12 AM, Ook wrote:
I only ban those that refuse to follow the rules, and my ban list is quite
small. Those that can't
Haha, oh ouch.
Anyway, as msleeper said, server owners can do what they like with their
servers.
On 10/12/2009 5:31 AM, Phillip Vector wrote:
Yeah. it's not like he's running some kind of list of people he feels
are cheaters and making it seem they deserve to be banned from all the
servers
I have a problem with community-created banlists, and their adoption by
server owners (i.e Sourcebans). For example, for my short duration on
these lists I have seen entire groups, associated groups and their
members banned due to the wrong-doings of one person. Not only this, but
some of
the owner of a myg0t steam group or calling server
admins names a bannable offense, but that is were community based
bannings are great.
On Thu, 2009-12-10 at 06:09 +0800, Shane Arnold wrote:
I have a problem with community-created banlists, and their adoption by
server owners (i.e
and don't want to sync your banfiles, since again it is
all done through MySQL.
SteamBans is the public ban software, where admins have to apply to be
able to submit bans and such things.
On Thu, 2009-12-10 at 06:51 +0800, Shane Arnold wrote:
Absolutely right, I didn't realise
Thankyou for your insightful and helpful post. At least he remains
somewhat on topic.
Welcome to my spam list bw_bloodlet...@hotmail.com
On 10/12/2009 7:02 AM, Blood Letter wrote:
Msleeper shits up the list again.
Truth.
Filesystems are only as good as the drivers driving them.
I daresay though that most of the NTFS rocks comments are those that
haven't used a *NIX system with items such as Reiser/XFS and ext4 ;)
Ook wrote:
I remember a while ago one of our certified techs bragging about how
bullet
Not a Server/srcds/hlds issue. Better off contacting Steam Support.
https://support.steampowered.com
Midnight wrote:
Was it a limited time thing? A friend of mine wanted to try it.
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Shell/RDP account. Cryptography key. RCON port blocked/filtered to a
specific IP.
Winrar.
Michael Krasnow wrote:
wait, so this means anyone can go on a server and download a server.cfg?
time to bury my rcon in a crap load of exec files lol
On Sun, Nov 29, 2009 at 7:49 AM, Saul Rennison
Remove/rename config_arena.cfg? If it's empty you don't need it anyway.
Nick Turner wrote:
How does one run multiple Arena servers from a single install directory?
When I comment out the mapcyclefile entry in config_arena.cfg the server
loads arena_mapcycle.txt no matter what.
I have
-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Shane Arnold
Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 5:08 PM
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list
Subject: Re: [hlds] TF2 Arena Configs - mapcyclefile
Remove/rename config_arena.cfg? If it's empty you don't need it anyway.
Nick Turner wrote
Or even chmod 000. All you need to do by the sounds of it it stop srcds
from being able to overwrite it or even read the contents. If I was
going to do a dodgy hack on Windows, I'd just give the file no
permissions for the current user I suppose :P
Shane Arnold wrote:
chmod 444? Unless
to any
file/directory you don't want the process to read or change.
-Original Message-
From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com
[mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Shane Arnold
Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 4:34 AM
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing
is for sandboxing of
different users on a shared host. And we run them from separate installs
just to make the configs easier
-Original Message-
From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:hlds-
boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Shane Arnold
Sent: 23 November 2009 14:07
-
From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com
[mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Shane Arnold
Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 5:38 PM
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list
Subject: Re: [hlds] TF2 Arena Configs - mapcyclefile
Or even chmod 000. All you need to do
two mods beetles and SM. Can you do this with both mods? I never
considerd having multiple configs but only using one set of game files. It
would certainly reduce the headaches!
Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
-Original Message-
From: Shane Arnold clontar...@iinet.net.au
Date
Unfortunately that's not the issue, as the servers are receiving the
lobby reservations and accepting them fine. The problem is when on a NAT
network, somewhere in the lobby reservation part of things it forgets
which client reserved the lobby, and whenever the reserving client tries
to
The issue seems to have something to do with lobby reservation. I don't
know if you see this too, but if you create a lobby on the NAT side of
things, the server will complain about bogus payload data, and then show
the reservation. I can confirm that reserving the lobby from outside the
NAT
Yes, on a Linux server. Are you running it behind a NAT firewall? We
were told that using mm_dedicated_force_servers public|private would
fix this, but it doesn't. Test this for me, if you start with +sv_lan 1
does it then work flawlessly?
Blood Letter wrote:
Anyone getting this?
Windows.
I have it on good authority that the release time for the Left4Dead2
server files will be
THIS EMAIL HAS BEEN CENSORED BY THE AUSTRALIAN GOVERNMENT.
Chris Greening wrote:
If the demo was any indication, you'll most likely have the server files
around dinner time on Monday (relative to EST's
Vanilla installs here don't show these issues.
Tried a verify game files within Steam? In any case this isn't a server
issue, it's a client issue and doesn't really belong on this list ;)
CLAN RCR wrote:
So, it's been awhile since I've posted to the HLDS list, but I've had an
issue for the
I could be wrong but the achievements (other than the Ghastly Gibbus)
are all map-dependant. Therefore it would be the onus of the server
operator to fix their own map lists.
m...@bestgn.net.au wrote:
How do they plan on removing a map? Whats stopping anyone from keeping a
copy.
A Valve
A lot of the functions contained in that script do not have native windows
counterparts. Even more reason why you should all be using linux-based servers
;)
Rick Payton wrote:
wut, no windows port? :P
--mauirixxx
-Original Message-
From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com
mail.google.com/support/
Yep.
David Bello wrote:
So while we're waiting anyone know how to make gmail make a sound when a new
mail arrives. Please, no You've Got Mail shit
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A man after my own heart Olly, but I'd cut some slack being a rather large
event ;)
Olly wrote:
HLDS = Server mailing list
2009/10/28 Mark Goldie markgol...@gmail.com
the client release has just been pushed back another hour
2009/10/28 Jonah Hirsch crazydog...@gmail.com
Christoffer:
127.0.1.1 is just the localhost that some *nix distributions use for localhost
(as opposed to 127.0.0.1 for windows machines). I'm pretty sure it will bind to
localhost by default if you don't specify an IP in the startup line.
Additionally, L4D actually binds to the hostname localhost. So
Hi,
Thanks for your spam.
Regards,
HLDS Server Mailing List
D3vilfish wrote:
With the recent announcement from IW to not include dedicated server files
for their latest release of CoD MW2 shortly to be released through steam.
There has been pressure from the CoD clan and online gaming
), except
this is for an FPS. I only ever played Hardcore, 40+ player servers.
Well that's no more. Great. High five, IW, for pissing off the PC
community.
Thanks,
- Saul.
On 24 Oct 2009, at 10:33, Shane Arnold clontar...@iinet.net.au wrote:
Hi,
Thanks for your spam.
Regards
even tho it is kinda spam
Shane Arnold wrote:
It's neither HLDS, SRCDS or VALVe related.
Looks a lot like spam to me.
Saul Rennison wrote:
That isn't spam. It's an issue that made me so unbelievably angry
the game isn't worth buying, nor pirating. It's like L4D
matchmaking
move north
attack grue
msleeper wrote:
You shouldn't have any problems upgrading to 1.2.4 if you aren't using
any zany plugins.
This isn't an RPG, by the way.
On Tue, 2009-10-06 at 17:38 -0700, Ook wrote:
Dang...when did that come out?
I downloaded 1.2.3 10/2/2009. Ahh...1.2.4 came
mysteriousjus...@gmail.com wrote:
lmao...
On Sun, Sep 27, 2009 at 12:18 PM, Shane Arnold clontar...@iinet.net.au
wrote:
Dear VALVe,
Shit's broken. Please fix it.
Regards.
Octo wrote:
I'm very glad I asked then, I wouldn't want to get the wrong people.
You can send me
I think you may find it's been around a *lot* longer than the 15th.
Ben Williams wrote:
It's been a bug since the update on the 15th.
I'm hoping Valve are working on it.
It can be very annoying and the only way is to disable team 'Unassigned'
Cheers
Smashman
OK let me rephrase.
It has been around for a very, very long time. I should know, I've used
this flaw many many times.
Regards.
Ben Williams wrote:
Nope.
I've only ever heard about this exploit since the 15th.
Everything that Octo linked to is POST 15th.
It happend in the September
that is a relatively minor issue).
But I do appreciate your concern regarding my use of a flaw in the game
Octo, and I will quite happily provide you with my STEAMID so you can
ban me from servers I will never play on. Ever.
Kind Regards and Happy Posting!
- Shane Arnold, Games/Systems Administrator
notifying vendors about problems in their software when you're wearing
your system admin hat.
-octo
On Sun, Sep 27, 2009 at 11:51:06PM +0800, Shane Arnold wrote:
At the risk of taking this email thread completely off topic, I am
neither of those two accounts you have linked to (I'm
+1
While I'm sure his intentions are honest, would be much nicer if we
could have the source please. Especially seeing it's not signed.
Spencer 'voogru' MacDonald wrote:
How about the source so we can compile it on our own?
I don't know about you but im not into running random exe files.
How many packets, let alone routed IPs, do you think pass through even
just one router on an ISP backbone. 80k packets in 5 minutes is so
ridiculously small it wouldn't even warrant a raised eyebrow.
Best thing to do with DDoS'ers is wait till they get bored and move on.
Kenny Loggins wrote:
Did you notice this is a Half-life dedicated Win32 server mailing list
and has nothing to do with the Steam Client?
Thanks.
AJ King wrote:
I Know this may sound strange but has anyone had their steam client, erroring
and closing when going on steam groups. When i go on them the content is
I hate people that don't include what message/quote they are talking
about...
Violent Crimes wrote:
Anyone going to guess when they will fix this for mods and css. 3 months?
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The issue being reported is definitely as a result of the netcode
changes. I have witnessed this behaviour on many servers (both DOD:S and
TF2), report by many players, and not solved by turning off the in-game
overlay. For some people it is very sporadic, for others running higher
rates it is
What he said. The SM team develops for TF2, not the other way around.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse
sm_deadtalk?
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse, the messenger was lost. For want of a messenger
until a map
change or mp_match_end_at_timelimit win condition is met.
Makes for good friendly Team Deathmatch fun, but should probably be fixed :)
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe
Do bad things to his pet dog.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse, the messenger was lost. For want
however, for the record.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse, the messenger was lost. For want of a messenger
Thanks for the update news Dayle, DLC looks interesting :)
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse, the messenger
servers on both Linux and MS and have never had
this issue either.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse
I'm surprised there isn't a database/wiki already up somewhere with this
info...
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want
Get off the list.
Now.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse, the messenger was lost. For want of a messenger
Not related to the Half-Life dedicated Win32 server at all? I'd be
posting on VALVe's forums or sending them a support ticket.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want
Why do you use sv_cheats 1?
ms_force does not require it (is not a cheat cvar).
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want
Turn off all firewalls and internet security suites and try again.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse
It's only a guess. I deal with Linux servers, not Windows. A 10054
usually means the connection was dropped.
Bad coding I suppose.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost
Slightly off topic, but.
Holy s**t that's a lot of plugins loaded...
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse
...
Please tell me you haven't done grade 6 science.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse, the messenger
Run a vanilla server and see if it crashes.
My money is on SM.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse
I'm putting money on Chris attaching a metafile to a text-only mailing
list :D
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want
1nsane wrote
It doesn't look like Valve wants to add a server browser. LFD has
been out for a while.
openserverbrowser
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want
).
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse, the messenger was lost. For want of a messenger,
the message was not delivered. For want
:P
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse, the messenger was lost. For want of a messenger,
the message
Thanks for the heads up, looking forward to the changes list.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=Team+FORtress+2+CVAR+List
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=SUdDen+DeAth+MOD
You can thank me later ;)
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost
I miss Jason. Eric doesn't sound like a greek name. We've been lied to.
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse
R.I.P 06/06/09
___
Shane Arnold- clontar...@iinet.net.au
For want of a nail, the horseshoe was lost. For want of a horseshoe, the horse
was lost. For want of a horse, the messenger was lost. For want of a messenger
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