Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Michael Richardson
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Brian == Brian E Carpenter Brian writes: With http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-07#section-7.2 I tried to stay within the lines of RFC 3697 as you also defend in your mail. I think the question we have now

RE: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
Hi Brian: On 2010-08-09 22:17, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: Hi Michael: With http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-07#section-7.2 I tried to stay within the lines of RFC 3697 as you also defend in your mail. I think the question we have now is not whether that

RE: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
Salut Rémi, Please see below: Pascal -Original Message- From: Rémi Després [mailto:remi.desp...@free.fr] Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 1:50 PM To: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) Cc: 6man 6man; Michael Richardson; r...@ietf.org; Carsten Bormann Subject: Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable

Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Michael Richardson
Pascal == Pascal Thubert (pthubert) pthub...@cisco.com writes: On 2010-08-09 22:17, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote: Hi Michael: With http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-roll-rpl-07#section-7.2 I tried to stay within the lines of RFC 3697 as you also defend

Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Rémi Després
Hi Pascal, More comments below. Le 10 août 2010 à 16:24, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) a écrit : Salut Rémi, Please see below: Pascal -Original Message- From: Rémi Després [mailto:remi.desp...@free.fr] Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 1:50 PM To: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) Cc: 6man

Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Michael Richardson
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Joel == Joel M Halpern j...@joelhalpern.com writes: Joel Off-list, although you may decide that my confusion is wider, and take it Joel back to the list: okay, I think it's worthwhile. Joel When a ROLL network is talking to the rest

Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Michael Richardson
Rémi == Rémi Després remi.desp...@free.fr writes: Rémi RFC 3697 isn't concerned with ASes, and doesn't need to be. Rémi The proposal is only that, where load balancing is performed, Rémi 0 FLs MAY be replaced by meaningful values for this purpose. Rémi A FL, once set to a non

Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Michael Richardson
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Carsten == Carsten Bormann caboc...@gmail.com writes: Carsten On Aug 10, 2010, at 14:57, Michael Richardson wrote: The only case where there is a problem is when there is a packet that arrives from the outside, to a ROLL border router

Re: [Roll] Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Philip Levis
On Aug 10, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Michael Richardson wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Carsten == Carsten Bormann caboc...@gmail.com writes: Carsten On Aug 10, 2010, at 14:57, Michael Richardson wrote: The only case where there is a problem is when there is a packet

Consensus call on adopting:draft-krishnan-6man-rs-mark-06.txt

2010-08-10 Thread Brian Haberman
6MAN WG, This is a consensus call on adopting: Title : Line identification in IPv6 Router Solicitation messages Author(s) : S. Krishnan, et al. Filename : draft-krishnan-6man-rs-mark-06.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2010-08-04 as a 6MAN working

Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Fred Baker
I would find that surprising. There are ample cases where the originator of a high data rate flow (sensor data from a radio telescope to a number cruncher, to pick one example) might want to use the flow label to send data from one session down multiple paths. Multi-path TCP would be another

Re: [Roll] Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Carsten Bormann
On Aug 10, 2010, at 14:57, Michael Richardson wrote: The rational for lots of bits would be to encourage random allocation such that in the event that two uncoordinated ROLL networks happened to merge (even for a few minutes!!!) that the likelyhood of cross talk would be reduced. Hmm. If

Re: [Roll] Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Carsten Bormann
RPL networks consists of leafs and routers. Both typically act as hosts. Routers are just hosts that happen to be between other nodes. (Although, some hosts are too weak to be routers) OK, I'm not talking of host as in originates or terminates traffic, but host in the sense of does not

Re: [Roll] Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Michael Richardson
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Philip == Philip Levis p...@cs.stanford.edu writes: Philip I feel like we're running in circles, in part due to Philip different expectations of how RPL will be used. Philip It's clear that in proprietary or vertically integrated

Re: [Roll] Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Michael Richardson
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Carsten == Carsten Bormann caboc...@gmail.com writes: RPL networks consists of leafs and routers. Both typically act as hosts. Routers are just hosts that happen to be between other nodes. (Although, some hosts are too weak to be

Re: [Roll] Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Fred Baker
On Aug 10, 2010, at 11:21 AM, Carsten Bormann wrote: OK, I'm not talking of host as in originates or terminates traffic, but host in the sense of does not participate in routing. It appears there is no such thing inside a RPL world then. A RPL or Manet world doesn't have the

Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Mark Smith
Hi Pascal, On Tue, 10 Aug 2010 16:24:42 +0200 Pascal Thubert (pthubert) pthub...@cisco.com wrote: Salut Rémi, Please see below: Pascal -Original Message- From: Rémi Després [mailto:remi.desp...@free.fr] Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 1:50 PM To: Pascal Thubert (pthubert)

ROLL choice to not use the Flow Label

2010-08-10 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Thanks for all the enlightment about ROLL. My personal conclusion is that the ROLL considerations are too complex and too subtle to be compatible with using a general-purpose IPv6 header field (i.e. the flow label) for ROLL purposes. They seem to be an extreme case of the challenges of defining a

Re: [Roll] Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Philip Levis
On Aug 10, 2010, at 1:09 PM, Michael Richardson wrote: I guess I don't see the problem to be as big a deal as you suggest. I'm happy if flow label 0 gets some default RPLinstanceID. It would be convenient if the rules were relaxed such that on ingress, the RPL edge router could *set*

Re: Flow Label: 12 bits mutable and 8 bits immutable

2010-08-10 Thread Michael Richardson
Fred == Fred Baker f...@cisco.com writes: Fred I would find that surprising. There are ample cases where the Fred originator of a high data rate flow (sensor data from a radio Fred telescope to a number cruncher, to pick one example) might Fred want to use the flow label to send