Please refer to:
http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/linux390/whatsnew.html
... for the 2009-03-20 change summary:
snIPL V2.1.5 with changes
* end of message
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Kind regards
Gerhard Hiller
Hello Listers,
We are in the process of adding some new linux guests. Now in the past
we had some issues with sharing DASD in our VSE environment, the DASD
must be set to shared to be able to run VSE on shared DASD. A few
linuxguests also run on shared DASD that actually has been set SHARED. I
2009/3/23 van Sleeuwen, Berry berry.vansleeu...@atosorigin.com:
A reason for having DASD not set to shared is to make use of MDC (our
selling point is that we do not want guests to cache filesystem data
because we have MDC). But when guests are running in multiple VM systems
would this hurt
Hello Rob,
Perhaps I didn't put the question as I should have. I do not want to
share minidisks, so RO or RW is not the issue here. These are all
private RW minidisks. It is the sharing of DASD volumes with multiple
minidisks that is of concern here. For instance we have 10 guests, each
with an
2009/3/23 van Sleeuwen, Berry berry.vansleeu...@atosorigin.com:
Perhaps I didn't put the question as I should have. I do not want to
share minidisks, so RO or RW is not the issue here. These are all
private RW minidisks. It is the sharing of DASD volumes with multiple
minidisks that is of
OK, so MDC is perhaps even not desired in our systems. The minidisks in
question are several parts of the base filesystem, such as /var, /tmp,
/var, /boot etc. Our datavolumes usually are placed in LVM and the LVM
contains 3338 cylinder volumes. And CMS is very little in use, if MDC
would be
2009/3/23 van Sleeuwen, Berry berry.vansleeu...@atosorigin.com:
Now let's look at the sharing of DASD volumes and with multiple
(non-CMS) minidisks on them. What, if any, would be the penalty if the
DASD is shared on multiple VM's with linux minidisks? Like I stated
before, VSE can't handle
Andrew Wiley wrote:
Andrew,
Unless you already have a release of VM on this hardware, you can't get
a VM that will run on this hardware anymore. So you are pretty much out
of luck.
IBM does have an academic initiative which provides incentives for
higher education on System z:
Well, this
Rob van der Heij wrote:
When your Linux virtual servers share certain disks (a common r/o file
system) then you must not write to them. If you do, both Linux page
cache and MDC may give you out-of-date data and cause data corruption.
Just don't write to them. Use some approach where you
van Sleeuwen, Berry wrote:
Hello Rob,
Perhaps I didn't put the question as I should have. I do not want to
share minidisks, so RO or RW is not the issue here. These are all
private RW minidisks. It is the sharing of DASD volumes with multiple
minidisks that is of concern here. For instance we
So regardless of MDC settings, it doesn't matter where the guest runs
when IO is required. Only when moving guests around MDC could be a
potential problem. That is not the case, at least not at the moment.
Thanks, Berry.
-Original Message-
From: Linux on 390 Port
Hi John,
VSE minidisks are VM file too, but I'd not like to run them without DASD
set to SHARED. Tha last time I did all 10 VSE systems were in fact
useless to us. Only when the DASD was set to shared VSE could run again.
So to put this into linux scope, if linux would do RESERVE/RELEASE, or
It is very true, however, that you can run several LPARs with
Linux/390 on them. Also, MVS is available for free nowadays, as well
as several other major components that run on the pre-Z
360-derivatives. So although you won't be able to teach your kids VM
you CAN show them what IBM big iron can
Andrew --
If your principle interest is linux rather than VM you might like to
investigate if a mainframe emulator like Hercules would suit your needs
better. I suspect it would be rather cheaper to run and have less maintenance
issues.
I'm running centos 4.5 on mine
i
-- Original
Good luck with that. My management here too is going to throw out the
mainframe. We (IT) were establishing working relationships with Marist, IBM,
and the ERP vendor to get our new university ERP system to run under z/Linux
but upper management caught wind of it and made us stop. Marist I
On Mon, Mar 23, 2009 at 2:26 PM, John Summerfield
deb...@herakles.homelinux.org wrote:
In the VM context, Linux is just another program. Minidisks are just VM
files, so it's VM question you ask, not Linux.
Really, the application or Operating System does make a difference.
When done right, CMS
Amazingly,a consistent story. The same has happened here as we are going
from an IBM environment to a SUN Solaris and/or Windows environment to
run our ERP system(s).
Dodds, Jim wrote:
Good luck with that. My management here too is going to throw out the
mainframe. We (IT) were establishing
Well, trying to look on the bright side of things, this might produce TOC/TOA
data between
Marist and KSU that is directly comparable. My money is on Marist coming out
on top in
such a comparison.
Dodds, Jim wrote:
Good luck with that. My management here too is going to throw out the
Yes you are on the same ERP system we have because I have talked to your
school in the past. It's funny that we were going to join Marist, who
has IBM assisting in this venture, to get the new ERP system to run on
Z/Linux. After they get it to work and I am sure they will and in a few
years the
Exactly but by that time it will be too late. Management here will not
go back because that would mean they made a bad decision. No we would
have to wait about 7-10 more years or the administration changes. Either
way it wont happen because by then no one will want to change or rock
the boat.
Jim
-Original Message-
From: Linux on 390 Port On Behalf Of Dodds, Jim
Yes you are on the same ERP system we have because I have talked to
your
school in the past. It's funny that we were going to join Marist, who
has IBM assisting in this venture, to get the new ERP system to run on
Oh my gosh don't get me started on that No we just elected a
governor whose main platform was to increase budget for Education ...
guess what one week into office and universities in the state have to
pay money back to the state. Our larger universities had to give back in
the range of 20-30
Wouldn't it be great if things like MVS were totally no-strings
attached Free? You can download MVS along with TCO for hercules, but
you aren't allowed to run them on an ESA/390 for free. This is
despite the fact that IBM wil not sell you support on any of these
products (including the ESA/390
If you believe the rumors SUN will soon be IBM. And Z/SOLARIS will be supported.
-Original Message-
From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:linux-...@vm.marist.edu]on Behalf Of Joe
O'Brien
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 10:02 AM
To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
Subject: Re: Old IBM Mainframe - Still
That SUN Solaris could become IBM Solaris if the deal goes through.
Mark T. Regan, K8MTR
CTO1 USNR-Retired (1969-1991)
- Original Message
From: Joe O'Brien jiobr...@tcnj.edu
To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 11:02:02 AM
Subject: Re: Old IBM Mainframe - Still
-Andrew Wiley wrote: -
I'm trying to research the usefulness of an older IBM mainframe in a
computer science class. The mainframe in question is an IBM 9672 RB6,
which, as I understand it, was first sold in 1998. So it's reasonably
old. Would this machine be able to run a few VM's of
Chase, John wrote:
It may or may not be feasible to try to educate your legislators. If
KY is anything like IL, the mantra seems to be, The more money we spend
per student, the better the education they will get. I.e., education
is _THE_ sacred cow.
Similar thinking here. I work part time
Rob van der Heij wrote:
On Mon, Mar 23, 2009 at 2:26 PM, John Summerfield
deb...@herakles.homelinux.org wrote:
In the VM context, Linux is just another program. Minidisks are just VM
files, so it's VM question you ask, not Linux.
Really, the application or Operating System does make a
The electrical bill isn't worth the box.
You can buy a used MP3000 with integrated dasd for a few thousand. And it uses
way less power.
Of course, the licensing issues still remain.
Multiprise 3000--Dollars
--
7060-H30$3,800
7060-H50$4,300
Dodds, Jim wrote:
... So now we are planning on spending close to $200,000 on Dell
hardware and Microsoft server software. ...
Has any looked at reliability? Some hardware/sofware combinations are
boringly reliable, some not so. Does anyone care?
--henry schaffer
Hi guys .. I'm going to ask a question half crazy but I want to know if
you can virtualize Windows on a Linux on z / VM and if any place any
evidence of this.
Thanks
Hugo Luis Vitelli
Mainframe Server Management
System Support - Solutions
It's just a PC we can buy another, you know PCs are cheap. Hell they
are running Windows we can just hire college grads that will save us a
bundle of money on staff. As for reliability everyone else is buying one
do you think that if it didn't work they would buy it says the pointy
haired boss.
My two cents. I worked for two companies that bought the bs about ERP and
WINDOZE replacing the mainframe.. Company one declared bankrupcy and went out
of buisness after spending 50 million dollars (some $35 mil over budget) on the
project. Company number two hit the budget ($20 mil) and now
Not a chance unless:
1) there's a Z port of WIndows, which I doubt
2) there's an Intel emulator that runs under Z. Not heard of one.
Richard
- -
Richard J Moore - FIET, FBCS, CEng, CITP
Senior Certified IT Specialist
IBM z/VM CP Development
MOBEX: 37264807; Mobile (+44) (0)7739-875237
Office:
Could Xen run on z/Linux? I don't see why not. But to be completely
honest, a mainframe is a strange place to run Windows. I mean... you
could go and buy an 8086 and run Andy Tananbaum's Minix 3, and that
would make a LOT more sense to me, at least you can learn something
about operating
Check out the IBM-Main list concerning the Mantissa announcement.
--- e...@uptownmilitia.com wrote:
From: Erik N Johnson e...@uptownmilitia.com
To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
Subject: Re: Windows an linux under z/VM
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 15:10:27 -0500
Could Xen run on z/Linux? I don't see why
Look at http://www.mantissa.com/ and follow their development of z/Vos
It is windoze stuff on Z.
-Original Message-
From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:linux-...@vm.marist.edu]on Behalf Of
Erik N Johnson
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 3:10 PM
To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
Subject: Re: Windows an
On 3/23/09 3:59 PM, Richard J Moore richardj_mo...@uk.ibm.com wrote:
1) there's a Z port of WIndows, which I doubt
There was one in the NT 3.51 days. IBM and Microsoft couldn't agree on some
things so it was never released. Talk to Jim Porell about it. He's good for
at least an hour rant on
This is totally amazing to me: There is z/Linux and not z/BSD because
way back at the dawn of time there was a lawsuit involving 4.4BSD and
so GNU/Linux became the flagship open source operating system (when
Linux came out it was a toy, and BSD was a serious software product.)
Now, despite the
Lately I've been reading a lot about the speculation regarding IBM
taking Sun over. As a graduate of an IBM preferred University whose
curriculum had IBM mainframes at its core, and a java developer, I
have a big interest in what might happen here. What I'm really
interested in, though, is the
What was presented at SHARE.
9162 - x86 Virtualization Technology for System z
http://ew.share.org/proceedingmod/abstract.cfm?abstract_id=19229
-Original Message-
Richard Pinion
Check out the IBM-Main list concerning the Mantissa announcement.
Hugo Luis Vitelli
Hi guys .. I'm
Well, at this large financial institution, we found it hard enough
getting some vendors to support Linux on z. Solaris on z would probably
won't be happening here any time soon because of that.
Now, if you are a university or some place where you don't have as much
vendor stuff ... Well maybe
On Mar 23, 2009, at 2:59 PM, Richard J Moore wrote:
Not a chance unless:
1) there's a Z port of WIndows, which I doubt
2) there's an Intel emulator that runs under Z. Not heard of one.
Richard
Bah.
#2 is old news.
http://www.fsf.net/~adam/NT-on-390-desktop.png
Back in 2002.
You *can*
On Mar 23, 2009, at 3:03 PM, Erik N Johnson wrote:
Microsoft doesn't know how to write software for professionals. Their
best stuff has always been targeted at people who want their computer
as easy to use (and as functional) as a toaster oven.
Unfortunately Mac OS X does the ease of use
Hi, Richard.
Richard J Moore wrote:
Not a chance unless:
1) there's a Z port of WIndows, which I doubt
Not that I am aware of in any case...
2) there's an Intel emulator that runs under Z. Not heard of one.
Mantissa Corp (http://www.mantissa.com/) has made some significant progress on
Okay, you've given me a lot to consider.
My first question is about Linux/390. I'm an avid linux user and I assumed
from my experiences that the difference in underlying platforms is handled
entirely by the kernel; userspace programs, with only a few exceptions,
compile and operate similarly no
On Mar 23, 2009, at 4:58 PM, Andrew Wiley wrote:
Okay, you've given me a lot to consider.
My first question is about Linux/390. I'm an avid linux user and I
assumed
from my experiences that the difference in underlying platforms is
handled
entirely by the kernel; userspace programs, with only a
Erik writes:
... Right now Microsoft has a choice. Rework M$
Office such that it will happily and effectively inter-operate with
other office productivity suites, or stop selling M$ Office in Europe.
Difficult decision, since an inter-operable M$ Office is an M$ Office
your company can
Huegel, Thomas wrote:
-Original Message-
From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:linux-...@vm.marist.edu]on Behalf Of
Erik N Johnson
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2009 3:10 PM
To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
Subject: Re: Windows an linux under z/VM
Could Xen run on z/Linux? I don't see why not. But
Hi guys .. I'm going to ask a question half crazy but I want to know if
you can virtualize Windows on a Linux on z / VM and if any place any
evidence of this.
If you want virtualization under *zLinux*, that appears to count out the
(so far) vapourware from Mantissa.
A few months back Redhat
On 3/23/2009 at 4:10 PM, Erik N Johnson e...@uptownmilitia.com wrote:
Could Xen run on z/Linux? I don't see why not.
Not in it's current state. It started out too Intel/AMD focused. Now that
Power development is ongoing, that's changed somewhat, but nothing has been
done to make it work
On 3/23/09 8:12 PM, Shane Ginnane sginn...@isi.com.au wrote:
A few months back Redhat bought Qumranet - that gave them access to the
Solid ICE product. No reason I can imagine it couldn't run (suitably
adapted) on zLinux.
See http://www.redhat.com/rhel/virtualization/Solid_ICE/
Interesting,
This is also being cross posted to the VM390 group. In your organization, do
you support the zLinux distribution as well as z/VM, or are there separate
groups in place, one to support z/VM and one for zLinux? Thanks.
Ross
--
For
Interesting, but requires Xen or KVM to work in current form, and relies
on
being able to just pass through instructions to the base hardware for
things
that don't require privileged ops.
I don't see that as an intrinsic problem.
Remove z/VM from the equation and ... ?
No doubt Mark is
On Mon, Mar 23, 2009 at 5:09 PM, Adam Thornton athorn...@sinenomine.netwrote:
On Mar 23, 2009, at 4:58 PM, Andrew Wiley wrote:
Okay, you've given me a lot to consider.
My first question is about Linux/390. I'm an avid linux user and I
assumed
from my experiences that the difference in
On Mon, Mar 23, 2009 at 5:48 PM, John Summerfield
deb...@herakles.homelinux.org wrote:
Really, the application or Operating System does make a difference.
When done right, CMS applications have no problem to operate in a
I was not thinking anyone meant to share the minidisk, just the volume
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