Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-11 Thread Dan Sugalski
At 4:45 PM +0200 10/11/02, Tels wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Moin, On 11-Oct-02 H.Merijn Brand carved into stone: On Wed 02 Oct 2002 13:50, "H.Merijn Brand" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: As a start for a `normal' interface to the interperters internals, this time no open hack, bu

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-11 Thread Tels
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Moin, On 11-Oct-02 H.Merijn Brand carved into stone: > On Wed 02 Oct 2002 13:50, "H.Merijn Brand" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> As a start for a `normal' interface to the interperters internals, this >> time >> no open hack, but a neat interface. >> >> Very op

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-11 Thread H.Merijn Brand
On Wed 02 Oct 2002 13:50, "H.Merijn Brand" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > As a start for a `normal' interface to the interperters internals, this time > no open hack, but a neat interface. > > Very open to additions. > > Useful? > > Feedback please Thank you Dan! Devel::Size from Dan Sugalski i

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-08 Thread Nick Ing-Simmons
H.Merijn Brand <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >Ahh, someone on /my/ side. > >I guess most of the discussion boils down to > >- sbrk () being unknown to people not familiar with unix >- Devel::Internals being to wide. [ Gimme another namespace proposal ] >- MemUsed interface to polymorphistic > >So

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-08 Thread Nick Ing-Simmons
Michael G Schwern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >But you're not. You're just exposing sbrk(), which is a gory detail. My >sbrk man page describes sbrk as being used to find "the current location of >the program break" which means nothing to me. Nor does "returns the current >memory top". > >It'l

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Tels
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Moin, On 05-Oct-02 Slaven Rezic carved into stone: > Tels <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> But shouldn't that be just the same, or slightly more (if the memory is >> used in chunks of, let's say 16 bytes, it might alloc up to 15 more).? > > The malloc system wi

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Nicholas Clark
] I did a talk about optimising perl code at YAPC in Munich. I'm going to use this as an opportunity to blatantly plug the fact that I've put it online: http://www.ccl4.org/~nick/P/Fast_Enough/ because it might contain one or two ideas that people haven't thought of. People who saw it

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Slaven Rezic
d, or not) in > >> Devel::MemUses > >> * it doesn't reflect the true usage of a perl structure anyway, it just > >> reports a change in the heap, which might or might not be related. > > > > With "usage of a perl structure", do you mean the si

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Tels
s, since: >> >> * your system might not have it, so you either get nothing, or something >> incompatible (depending on how it is implemented, or not) in >> Devel::MemUses >> * it doesn't reflect the true usage of a perl structure anyway, it just >> rep

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Slaven Rezic
ule to maintain :-) The function is in my private perl function repository, and I thought about creating a public function repository on CPAN... Regards, Slaven > It's a good start though you'll probably want > to do it File::Spec style with Proc::Memory::FreeBS

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Slaven Rezic
Tels <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > > Moin, > > On 05-Oct-02 [EMAIL PROTECTED] carved into stone: > > En op 5 oktober 2002 sprak Ann Barcomb: > >> I hadn't looked in to how I could solve my question, and because > >> it was given to me as a low priority task,

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Slaven Rezic
Nicholas Clark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Thu, Oct 03, 2002 at 02:35:14PM -0400, Benjamin Goldberg wrote: > > > If "what it does" is merely return the value of the C sbrk() function, > > then IMHO, sbrk() is a perfectly good name. > > > > However, as to other possible names -- how about P

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Tels
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Moin, On 05-Oct-02 [EMAIL PROTECTED] carved into stone: > En op 5 oktober 2002 sprak Ann Barcomb: >> I hadn't looked in to how I could solve my question, and because >> it was given to me as a low priority task, I wasn't sure I was going >> to have a chance to

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Andrew . Savige
En op 5 oktober 2002 sprak Ann Barcomb: > I hadn't looked in to how I could solve my question, and because > it was given to me as a low priority task, I wasn't sure I was going > to have a chance to either. But you can count me as someone who will > be very happy about the module :) I noticed C

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread Ann Barcomb
Merijn wrote: > Wait a while. Ann Barcomb is working on this too. Let's collect all this into > one module and not release twenty or so that try to do the same. I'm not actually working on it...I just had need of such a module Thursday, mentioned to Jos what I had been trying to work on, and he s

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread schwern
On Fri, Oct 04, 2002 at 08:24:12PM +0200, Slaven Rezic wrote: > Not a module, but a function which should work on FreeBSD and Linux: Why not package this up and stick it on CPAN? Proc::Memory or something. It's a good start though you'll probably want to do it File::Spec style with Proc::Memory

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-05 Thread H.Merijn Brand
On Sat 05 Oct 2002 01:45, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Fri, Oct 04, 2002 at 08:24:12PM +0200, Slaven Rezic wrote: > > Not a module, but a function which should work on FreeBSD and Linux: > > Why not package this up and stick it on CPAN? Proc::Memory or Wait a while. Ann Barcomb is working on t

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-04 Thread Nicholas Clark
On Thu, Oct 03, 2002 at 02:35:14PM -0400, Benjamin Goldberg wrote: > If "what it does" is merely return the value of the C sbrk() function, > then IMHO, sbrk() is a perfectly good name. > > However, as to other possible names -- how about ProcessSize() ? I'm > not sure if this is really a valid

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-04 Thread Slaven Rezic
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > En op 4 oktober 2002 sprak Michael G Schwern: > > The problem is when you put those two next to each other, one > > promising a friendly interface, one a bare-metal interface, > > it confuses the intent of the module. Is it for Joe End User > > or is it for Joe Core Ha

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-04 Thread Slaven Rezic
Michael G Schwern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Thu, Oct 03, 2002 at 10:43:43AM +0100, Nicholas Clark wrote: > > The reason I'm saying it might not be much use to people unfamiliar with > > the internals of unix is precisely because it does return a precisely defined > > but not directly usefu

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Rafael Garcia-Suarez
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > For a more fine-grained view, you > need hooks into Perl internals (such as the Perl malloc). This sounds like Devel::Peek::mstat(). But I never looked at this before.

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Andrew . Savige
En op 4 oktober 2002 sprak Michael G Schwern: > The problem is when you put those two next to each other, one > promising a friendly interface, one a bare-metal interface, > it confuses the intent of the module. Is it for Joe End User > or is it for Joe Core Hacker? A module to report memory usag

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Benjamin Goldberg
Michael G Schwern wrote: > > On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 01:50:56PM +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > SYNOPSIS > > use Devel::Internals; > > A little broad. Perhaps Devel::Memory? > > > my $end = sbrk (); > > > > my @array = (1..1); > > print "The creation of th

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Thu, Oct 03, 2002 at 10:43:43AM +0100, Nicholas Clark wrote: > The reason I'm saying it might not be much use to people unfamiliar with > the internals of unix is precisely because it does return a precisely defined > but not directly useful value - the highest address on the heap. > If you rea

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Thu, Oct 03, 2002 at 11:39:42AM -0400, Green, Paul wrote: > H.Merijn Brand [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] writes: > > So far, all I got was criticism. I asked for it. But no-one said it was > useful. > > (Or I didn't read between the lines enough). > > In my experience, the phrase "I really liked

RE: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Green, Paul
H.Merijn Brand [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] writes: > So far, all I got was criticism. I asked for it. But no-one said it was useful. > (Or I didn't read between the lines enough). In my experience, the phrase "I really liked your idea and I hope you won't mind if I share a few ideas for improving

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Elizabeth Mattijsen
At 01:01 PM 10/3/02 +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: >So far, all I got was criticism. I asked for it. But no-one said it was >useful. >(Or I didn't read between the lines enough). Well, since I probably have been the person that set this off, I think I should say something here. Ideally, I think

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread H.Merijn Brand
. My initial sbrk probe used --8<--- use Inline C => ' long MemUsed () { return ((long)sbrk (0)); }' -->8--- Then I thought it was very likely that I would use this more than once, so I turned it into a module, but before I installed it, well, you

RE: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Green, Paul
sbrk is very Unixish. It isn't in POSIX at all. Our system is highly POSIX compliant but doesn't have a function that directly maps to sbrk. We do have a way of determining heap max size and heap current usage, but it is a functional (subroutine) interface. If you had a function that just calcul

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Andreas J. Koenig
> On Thu, 03 Oct 2002 13:01:52 +0200, "H.Merijn Brand" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: >> If it only returns the value from sbrk(), damn well call it sbrk. > Ahh, someone on /my/ side. Mee too. > So far, all I got was criticism. I asked for it. But no-one said it was useful. > (Or I didn'

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread H.Merijn Brand
On Thu 03 Oct 2002 11:43, Nicholas Clark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 05:07:20PM -0400, Michael G Schwern wrote: > > On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 10:26:32PM +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > > > > I realize that sbrk() is a familiar concept to deep C programmers on > > > > BSD-s

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-03 Thread Nicholas Clark
On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 05:07:20PM -0400, Michael G Schwern wrote: > On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 10:26:32PM +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > > I realize that sbrk() is a familiar concept to deep C programmers on > > > BSD-style systems, but in order for this to be useful to Perl programmers, > > > or

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-02 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 10:26:32PM +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > > SYNOPSIS > > > use Devel::Internals; > > > > A little broad. Perhaps Devel::Memory? > > My intent was to gather more internal states. Whatever useful. That's a potentially very large number of exported functions and

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-02 Thread H.Merijn Brand
On Wed 02 Oct 2002 22:11, Michael G Schwern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 01:50:56PM +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > SYNOPSIS > > use Devel::Internals; > > A little broad. Perhaps Devel::Memory? My intent was to gather more internal states. Whatever useful. > >

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-02 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 01:50:56PM +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > SYNOPSIS > use Devel::Internals; A little broad. Perhaps Devel::Memory? > my $end = sbrk (); > > my @array = (1..1); > print "The creation of this array used ", > sbrk () - $end,

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-02 Thread Tels
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Moin, On 02-Oct-02 Nicholas Clark carved into stone: > On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 05:06:53PM +0200, Tels wrote: > >> On 02-Oct-02 H.Merijn Brand carved into stone: > > Going to be a bit hard to change, then :-) :-) >> > As a start for a `normal' interface to t

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-02 Thread Nicholas Clark
On Wed, Oct 02, 2002 at 05:06:53PM +0200, Tels wrote: > On 02-Oct-02 H.Merijn Brand carved into stone: Going to be a bit hard to change, then :-) > > As a start for a `normal' interface to the interperters internals, this > > time no open hack, but a neat interface. > > Very open to additions.

RE: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-02 Thread Tels
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Moin, On 02-Oct-02 H.Merijn Brand carved into stone: > As a start for a `normal' interface to the interperters internals, this > time no open hack, but a neat interface. > Very open to additions. > Useful? Is it accurate? > Feedback please > > > NAME >

Re: [ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-02 Thread Roland Giersig
> MemUsed ($msg) > Used in void context reports the number of bytes used since the > previous call to MemUsed with the message passed > > Used in scalar context returns the current sbrk value > > Used in list context returns the values saved on every call Ugh, no, seems ver

[ Memory ] Re: Thought

2002-10-02 Thread H.Merijn Brand
As a start for a `normal' interface to the interperters internals, this time no open hack, but a neat interface. Very open to additions. Useful? Feedback please NAME Devel-Internals - Perl extension for internal interpreter statistics SYNOPSIS use Devel::Internals; my

Re: Thought

2002-09-13 Thread Johan Vromans
Michael G Schwern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Giving read() semantics completely unrelated to reading a filehandle would > be a bad choice of syntax. I wonder what the people who implemented the GNU/Linux "procfs" think about this. -- Johan

Re: Thought

2002-08-30 Thread Elizabeth Mattijsen
At 10:28 AM 8/30/02 -0400, Bryan C. Warnock wrote: >Why not a simple(!) magic hash, or an entire namespace? >print $PROC{"memory used"}; >print $PROC::memory_used; That would work for me... ;-) Liz

Re: Thought

2002-08-30 Thread Bryan C. Warnock
On Fri, 2002-08-30 at 04:30, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > I was thinking about highjacking a standard function: read () > > read filehandle, $var, length [, offset] > > and use it like > > read [ \"PERL_status" ], $mem, "memory"; > > which is very illegal at the moment :) but probably easy to catc

Re: Thought

2002-08-30 Thread Tels
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Moin, On 30-Aug-02 H.Merijn Brand carved into stone: > On Fri 30 Aug 2002 10:33, Elizabeth Mattijsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> At 10:30 AM 8/30/02 +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: >> > > Being able to do so at any point in Perl's execution would be >> > great.

Re: Thought

2002-08-30 Thread H.Merijn Brand
is available to the world. I was just brainstorming with myself about how to trigger runaway memory from smoke to smoke I first thought about an environment variable that, once detected on exit of perl would show the memory use, but that is neither extensible, nor elegant, and I thought of the read

Re: Thought

2002-08-30 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Fri, Aug 30, 2002 at 10:30:22AM +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > I was thinking about highjacking a standard function: read () Giving read() semantics completely unrelated to reading a filehandle would be a bad choice of syntax. So would making it a keyword. Could you do it (mostly) via XS?

Re: Thought

2002-08-30 Thread H.Merijn Brand
On Fri 30 Aug 2002 10:33, Elizabeth Mattijsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > At 10:30 AM 8/30/02 +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > > Being able to do so at any point in Perl's execution would be > > great. Or is > > > there such a thing already and I just don't know about it (and I'm not > > > thin

Re: Thought

2002-08-30 Thread Elizabeth Mattijsen
At 10:30 AM 8/30/02 +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > > Being able to do so at any point in Perl's execution would be > great. Or is > > there such a thing already and I just don't know about it (and I'm not > > thinking about GTop)... >I was thinking about highjacking a standard function: read ()

Re: Thought

2002-08-30 Thread H.Merijn Brand
On Fri 30 Aug 2002 10:15, Elizabeth Mattijsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > At 08:56 AM 8/30/02 +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: > >Would it be a helpful indication to be able to have perl report the upper > >memmory bound on exit? Or better, the memory used: upper- minus lower bound > > Being able to

Re: Thought

2002-08-30 Thread Elizabeth Mattijsen
At 08:56 AM 8/30/02 +0200, H.Merijn Brand wrote: >Would it be a helpful indication to be able to have perl report the upper >memmory bound on exit? Or better, the memory used: upper- minus lower bound Being able to do so at any point in Perl's execution would be great. Or is there such a thing

Thought

2002-08-29 Thread H.Merijn Brand
=1.48 cu=295.17 cs=27.45 scripts=683 tests=69491 cmem=23.567Gb This would make it possible to see the diff in mem usage between with or without debugging, with or without PERLIO=perlio with or without longdoubles and all the other combo's (64bit vs 32bit ain't fair :) This was just

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-17 Thread Piers Cawley
"Kurt D. Starsinic" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Dec 15, Dave Rolsky wrote: >> Ok, so that's a bit off the topic of "why use isa_ok()" but I just don't >> see why people seem to object to the use of Test::More in the core Perl >> tests. I can't see how it couldn't help improve the quality of

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-17 Thread Piers Cawley
>> >> >> >> ok (eval { ref($foo) && $foo->isa('Foo') }); >> > >> > As Kurt already pointed out, you can do: >> > >> > ok( UNIVERSAL::isa($foo, 'Foo') ); >> > >> > but if it fails you

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-17 Thread Gerrit P. Haase
Hallo chromatic, Am 2001-12-16 um 19:09 schriebst du: > On Sunday 16 December 2001 02:10, Gerrit P. Haase wrote: > Thanks for the report. >> ../lib/ExtUtils/MM_Cygwin.# Failed test >> (../lib/ExtUtils/MM_Cygwin.t at line 73) # undef >> # doesn't match '(?-

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-17 Thread Gerrit P. Haase
Hallo Michael, Am 2001-12-16 um 21:20 schriebst du: > On Sun, Dec 16, 2001 at 11:09:29AM -0700, chromatic wrote: >> + like( $$out, qr/could not locate your pod2man/, >> + '... should warn if pod2man cannot be located' ); > Gerrit, do you already have a perl installed in the spot

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-17 Thread Michael G Schwern
a('Foo') }); > > > > As Kurt already pointed out, you can do: > > > > ok( UNIVERSAL::isa($foo, 'Foo') ); > > > > but if it fails you have no idea what $foo was. > > No you can't. Not if you've overridden isa anywhere. (Which is

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-17 Thread Piers Cawley
Michael G Schwern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Sun, Dec 16, 2001 at 02:41:31PM +, Piers Cawley wrote: >> > The equivalent code without isa_ok() would be: >> > >> > my $foo = Foo->new; >> > ok( $foo->isa('Foo') ); >> > >> > except should $foo be unblessed or undef that will explode.

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread chromatic
Hello again Gerrit, You know, I didn't put the MOST important line in the block. Here's a better patch. I blame Jeffrey Friedl. :) Any better? -- c --- lib/ExtUtils/~MM_Cygwin.t Sun Dec 16 11:02:04 2001 +++ lib/ExtUtils/MM_Cygwin.t Sun Dec 16 19:59:44 2001 @@ -69,12 +69,17 @@ $args->{

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread chromatic
On Sun, 16 Dec 2001 19:30:18 -0700, Benjamin Goldberg wrote: > I think that if "all" we know about the returned type is that it is supposed > to provide some specific interface, it would be more robust to test that the > returned thing actually *does* provide the interface. Agreed. You have my

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Sun, Dec 16, 2001 at 09:30:18PM -0500, Benjamin Goldberg wrote: > Suppose we have RandomThing->new which randomly returns an instance of > one of a few dozen different classes, which have no relation at all with > each other except a common interface. In such an odd case, don't use isa_ok().

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread Benjamin Goldberg
Michael G Schwern wrote: > > On Sun, Dec 16, 2001 at 02:41:31PM +, Piers Cawley wrote: > > Nothing wrong with an adaptor/factory returning something that isn't > > a Foo, so long as it has the same interface. > > That's why its isa_ok() and not ref_ok(). > > On the off chance Foo->new is su

Re: lib.t (was Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought)

2001-12-16 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Sun, Dec 16, 2001 at 07:30:37PM +, Nicholas Clark wrote: > > I just thought of a better way. Since all we're testing is that > > lib.pm does the right things to @INC, we can presume that if one of > > require(), do() or use() works, the rest will work. > >

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Sun, Dec 16, 2001 at 02:41:31PM +, Piers Cawley wrote: > Nothing wrong with an adaptor/factory returning something that isn't a > Foo, so long as it has the same interface. That's why its isa_ok() and not ref_ok(). On the off chance Foo->new is supposed to return something that bears no r

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Sun, Dec 16, 2001 at 11:09:29AM -0700, chromatic wrote: > + like( $$out, qr/could not locate your pod2man/, > + '... should warn if pod2man cannot be located' ); Gerrit, do you already have a perl installed in the spot you're about to put this new one? If so, it might be seein

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Sun, Dec 16, 2001 at 04:20:33PM +, Nicholas Clark wrote: > Does that mean that it should have its own tests placed in t/lib, so that > they run before ext/ and lib/? Yes, it would be nice if they ran before the rest, but I really don't want to start shuffling tests around this close to 5.8

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread chromatic
On Sunday 16 December 2001 02:10, Gerrit P. Haase wrote: Thanks for the report. > ../lib/ExtUtils/MM_Cygwin.# Failed test > (../lib/ExtUtils/MM_Cygwin.t at line 73) # undef > # doesn't match '(?-xism:could not locate your pod2man)' > # Failed test (../li

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread Piers Cawley
Michael G Schwern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 04:09:19AM +0200, Jarkko Hietaniemi wrote: >> I don't get all the different (well, only VMS and Cygwin, so far, but >> I like to nip buds) MM_XXX test suites: won't they be testing pretty >> much the same things? > > Yes, b

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-16 Thread Gerrit P. Haase
Hallo Jarkko, Am 2001-12-15 um 20:47 schriebst du: > On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 05:20:24PM -0700, chromatic wrote: >> On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 15:18:43 -0700, Michael G Schwern wrote: >> >> > ExtUtils::MM_Cygwin >> >> Here's a test for that. It could use someone on Cygwin testing it. Tels said >> he

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Michael G Schwern
Thinks like use_ok, require_ok, isa_ok, can_ok, etc... are all functions that I threw into Test::More because I found myself needing them and suspected others did, too. If you prefer to use ok() instead of one of the above special purpose functions, I'm not going to jump up and down and fling poo

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Jarkko Hietaniemi
> Ok, so that's a bit off the topic of "why use isa_ok()" but I just don't > see why people seem to object to the use of Test::More in the core Perl > tests. I can't see how it couldn't help improve the quality of the tests > while providing a standardized way to do the things that all the tests

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Kurt D. Starsinic
On Dec 15, Dave Rolsky wrote: > Ok, so that's a bit off the topic of "why use isa_ok()" but I just don't > see why people seem to object to the use of Test::More in the core Perl > tests. I can't see how it couldn't help improve the quality of the tests > while providing a standardized way to do

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Dave Rolsky
On Sat, 15 Dec 2001, Kurt D. Starsinic wrote: > > my $foo = Foo->new; > > ok( defined $foo && $foo->isa('Foo') ); > > > > which rapidly gets tiresome. > > Or ok(UNIVERSAL::isa(Foo->new, 'Foo')); Under 5.005 it spits out warnings if Foo->new returns undef. Plus you still don't get an

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Kurt D. Starsinic
On Dec 14, Michael Schwern wrote: > Constructors fail often enough that I felt it worthwhile to write a > test function for them. > > You could leave off the test entirely and just trust that you use $foo > later on down in the test and it'll explode there, but its better to > put the point of fa

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Tels
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Moin, On 15-Dec-01 Jarkko Hietaniemi tried to scribble about: >> Ok, so that's a bit off the topic of "why use isa_ok()" but I just don't >> see why people seem to object to the use of Test::More in the core Perl >> tests. I can't see how it couldn't help impr

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 11:48:29PM +0100, Tels wrote: > Te"One day Math::Big* will have more tests than Perl;)"ls One day Perl will have more tests than Bit::Vector. 67255 at last count. -- Michael G. Schwern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>http://www.pobox.com/~schwern/ Perl Quality Assurance

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Paul Johnson
On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 11:46:29PM +, Nicholas Clark wrote: > On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 05:59:22PM -0500, Michael G Schwern wrote: > > On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 11:48:29PM +0100, Tels wrote: > > > Te"One day Math::Big* will have more tests than Perl;)"ls > > > > One day Perl will have more tests

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 02:19:21PM -0800, Kurt D. Starsinic wrote: > On Dec 15, Dave Rolsky wrote: > > Ok, so that's a bit off the topic of "why use isa_ok()" but I just don't > > see why people seem to object to the use of Test::More in the core Perl > > tests. I can't see how it couldn't help i

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 11:46:29PM +, Nicholas Clark wrote: > On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 05:59:22PM -0500, Michael G Schwern wrote: > > On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 11:48:29PM +0100, Tels wrote: > > > Te"One day Math::Big* will have more tests than Perl;)"ls > > > > One day Perl will have more tests

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-15 Thread Jarkko Hietaniemi
On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 05:20:24PM -0700, chromatic wrote: > On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 15:18:43 -0700, Michael G Schwern wrote: > > > ExtUtils::MM_Cygwin > > Here's a test for that. It could use someone on Cygwin testing it. Tels said > he would, but apparently got busy. Thanks, applied. -- $jhi+

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-14 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 05:20:24PM -0700, chromatic wrote: > On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 15:18:43 -0700, Michael G Schwern wrote: > > ExtUtils::MM_Cygwin > > Here's a test for that. It could use someone on Cygwin testing it. > Tels said he would, but apparently got busy. Checks out ok on Cygwin98. --

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-14 Thread chromatic
On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 15:18:43 -0700, Michael G Schwern wrote: > ExtUtils::MM_Cygwin Here's a test for that. It could use someone on Cygwin testing it. Tels said he would, but apparently got busy. -- c --- ~MANIFEST Sun Nov 25 19:50:46 2001 +++ MANIFESTSun Nov 25 21:08:01 2001 @@ -930,6

lib.t (was Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought)

2001-12-14 Thread Michael G Schwern
t; A simple way to trick 'use' is to clear the entry from %INC and then > eval "use Yup". I just thought of a better way. Since all we're testing is that lib.pm does the right things to @INC, we can presume that if one of require(), do() or use() works, the rest will work

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-14 Thread Jarkko Hietaniemi
On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 05:50:16PM -0500, Michael G Schwern wrote: > On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 12:21:08AM +0200, Jarkko Hietaniemi wrote: > > On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 05:18:43PM -0500, Michael G Schwern wrote: > > > The good news is Nick Clark just wrote a test for Benchmark! The bad > > > news is I

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-14 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 02:48:07PM -0800, Brent Dax wrote: > I don't know what directory this should go into, lib/lib.t I guess. > so I'm not providing a > patch, just pasting the body of lib.t in here. Good enough? > > #!./perl > > use Test::More tests => 3; > use lib 'stuff'; > > #create

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-14 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Sat, Dec 15, 2001 at 12:21:08AM +0200, Jarkko Hietaniemi wrote: > On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 05:18:43PM -0500, Michael G Schwern wrote: > > The good news is Nick Clark just wrote a test for Benchmark! The bad > > news is I made the mistake at looking closer at ext/B/ today, so the > > list just g

RE: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-14 Thread Brent Dax
Michael G Schwern: # lib *new* I don't know what directory this should go into, so I'm not providing a patch, just pasting the body of lib.t in here. Good enough? #!./perl use Test::More tests => 3; use lib 'stuff'; #create a directory and a module mkdir('stuff', 0666)

Re: Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-14 Thread Michael G Schwern
On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 02:26:35PM -0800, Russ Allbery wrote: > I forget where the wiki is. WikiHere http://www.pobox.com/~schwern/cgi-bin/perl-qa-wiki.cgi?UntestedModules -- Michael G. Schwern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>http://www.pobox.com/~schwern/ Perl Quality Assurance <[EMAIL PROTECTE

Untested modules update: There's more than we thought

2001-12-14 Thread Michael G Schwern
The good news is Nick Clark just wrote a test for Benchmark! The bad news is I made the mistake at looking closer at ext/B/ today, so the list just got bigger and quite a bit harder. There's still some fruit that's below giraffe-level, lib and re. B::Asmdata *new* B::Assembler