What a horrible waste of time. Hopefully this wasnt your local government
inspector asking this. If so, you should call the mayor and ask to be
reimbursed. Of course you dont need a drain on every sprinkler.
On Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 1:49 PM, Dewayne Martinez <
dmarti...@total-mechanical.com> wrote:
Well, the internal swing check will not function peroperly in a vertical
position
On Wed, Mar 29, 2017 at 7:02 AM, Lévis Blanchet
wrote:
> Concerning FDC installation like a 2-1/2’’ siamese connection Y-pattern,
>
> is there any official reference pertaining to
I did some work on an assisted living facility years ago with this piping.
what do you mean by adapter?
On Tue, Mar 28, 2017 at 12:26 PM, wrote:
> A client of mine has a system that was installed with polybutylene pipe.
> Now some sprinklers need to be relocated. Is there
Years ago, I completed the Fire Pump Technician Certification Training
through Peerless Pump Company at their headquarters, under a great guy
named Pete Noll.
The FireTrol controller rep also trained the students and certified them.
The course was designed for a technician to be competent to
The owner is responsible for maintaining the system, not the contractor.
In your contract, specify that you do not perform the valve exercise and
the owner is responsible.
You can't force a property owner to pay you to exercise the valves.
On Wednesday, January 11, 2017, Roland Huggins
Unfortunately the contractors in this industry have really failed to
collaborate on a standard response to this question.
There was a knowledgeable insurance rep who used to comment on these
questions but he hasn't for some time.
The legal recommendation seems to be to "see no evil hear no evil."
.
Forest Wilson
On Aug 9, 2016 11:17 AM, "David Autry" <da...@mfp-inc.com> wrote:
> If you’re in West Des Moines, IA……. You will protect it, no matter what.
>
>
>
> David Autry
>
>
>
> Meininger Fire Protection
>
> 2521 West L Street, Suite 5
>
>
Provision for forward flow test
On Aug 4, 2016 3:49 PM, "Brian Harris" wrote:
> Seem to be having a brain cramp today. Have an RPZ inside the Riser room
> with the FDC connection downstream with a flow switch and ITC. For some
> reason it just looks weird. For a
Long loose hair is also inadvisable.
In fact the older manufacturer manuals used to specify that only naked bald
persons should operate the machine.
On Jul 22, 2016 9:28 AM, "M.A Nelson" wrote:
> I would also recommend against necklaces/ chains and long loose
I agree. Maybe move the sprinkler head
On Jul 22, 2016 9:25 AM, "Todd Williams" wrote:
> I got a call from someone who has had a problem with a sprinkler in one
> specific area accidentally discharging. This has occurred multiple times.
> It is in a 0 - 14 degree freezer
In addition to this forum, I would also consult the Elevator Code. Maybe
call your state elevator code inspector.
How will you do the stunt trip if you arrange the piping this way?
On Jul 22, 2016 7:47 AM, "Dewayne Martinez"
wrote:
> Can I run pipe into the
The drain test is needed if it is downstream of a valve. Every valve needs
exercised, and a flow test needs conducted after the closed valve is
restored to the open position.
On Jul 18, 2016 1:05 PM, "rongreenman ." wrote:
> John has stated and defended. Mike has stated.
The answer depends on your relationship with the GC.
For example, there is a private owner I have done work for years. We cut
the ceiling tile on his remodels and expansions. I don't think he has even
shopped for another bid in his work.
Others will nickel and dime subs to death. It depends on
Why do you need to demonstrate the flow rate? The purpose of the forward
flow test is to fully operate the back flow valve. A flow at 500 GPM will
not open the valve fully?
On Jul 14, 2016 9:52 AM, "David Williams"
wrote:
> As an engineer who just issued a design
I also compare to the plaque. In at least 2 cases, I found closed street
valves as a result. Acceptance testing is shoddy in many regions.
On Jul 11, 2016 11:14 AM, "Steve Leyton" wrote:
> I’m not sure what’s to disagree with. If you see a static pressure on
> the
I encountered a similar situation a few years ago. I would send a letter to
the ahj and owner explaining what you found and notify them the system may
be impaired.
Suggest lab testing to confirm if needed and then ask the ahj for guidance.
On Jun 16, 2016 8:21 PM, "Jeff Bridges"
Besides a false impression upon building occupants (many of whom don't
notice sprinklers anyway), one must consider false impressions upon first
responders or insurance agents.
On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 6:39 AM, Frans Stoop wrote:
> Gentlemen,
>
> Thank you very much.
> I
Regarding the 5 year gauge replacement, I have seen too much focus on this
component by both contractors and AHJ's.
The gauge replacement is only one item as part of a 5 year maintenance
interval. Internal inspection of piping is much more important than
replacing the cheap, Chinese made plastic
What was the concentration of the propylene glycol you filled with and its
freeze point?
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
937-736-0425
Notice:
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by work product immunity or other legal rules. If you have
I've been in situations where i ask the general contractor to sign a waiver or
argue with the AHJ...and what often ends up happening is the general uses
another sprinkler sub on the next job.
Sure, legal liability is protected. But what about the next job?
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler
Yea but a good practice is to compare the main drain tests to the first test,
not the plaque
Forest Wilson
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I think this happens all the time in jails.
A local county told me that it regularly happens and he intentionally just lets
the water flow a little longer to drench the prisoners that intentionally set
them off.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
forest_wil...@aol.com
Unless it is equipped with the old style sprinklers which spray 40% above the
sprinkler.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
PH: 937-736-0425
forest_wil...@aol.com
-Original Message-
From: MPhelps mphe...@aerofire.com
To: sprinklerforum sprinklerforum
It also depends on what edition of NFPA 13 has been adopted by your
jurisdiction.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
PH: 937-736-0425
forest_wil...@aol.com
-Original Message-
From: rongreenman . rongreen...@gmail.com
To: sprinklerforum sprinklerforum
Just an FYI...when you buy the NFPA forms in electronic format you get all of
these.
Technically, a lot of these cities post these forms online but sometimes it
violates copyright laws.
I have the Owners Cert available on Word from NFPA.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
forest_wil
What do you mean 'installed with sections of pipe?'
Expansion tanks or pressure relief valves are required on antifreeze systems.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
PH: 937-736-0425
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Most Fire Codes allow the Chief to determine the location and criteria of the
FDC.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
forest_wil...@aol.com
-Original Message-
From: Fairchild, Jack jfairch...@ballinger-ae.com
To: sprinklerforum sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Tom,
You have been on here for years.
What's up?
Forest WilsonFire Sprinkler Contractor
forest_wil...@aol.com
-Original Message-
From: Douglas Hicks lt;fire...@eoni.comgt;
To: sprinklerforum lt;sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.orggt;
Sent: Mon, Apr 27, 2015 11:25 pm
Subject: Re:
should be able to provide you guidance on this matter.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
PH: 937-736-0425
forest_wil...@aol.com
-Original Message-
From: Steve Leyton st...@protectiondesign.com
To: sprinklerforum sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Sent: Tue, Apr 14, 2015 12:27 PM
It's interesting. But How is he copyrighting old NFPA literature in his name?
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
forest_wil...@aol.com
-Original Message-
From: David Autry da...@mfp-inc.com
To: sprinklerforum sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Sent: Wed, Mar 11, 2015
If the Project Engineer says they aren't needed then don't install them.
NFPA 13 would require it; However, you can submit a change order down the road
and add them later if the AHJ requires it.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
PH: 937-736-0425
forest_wil...@aol.com
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I agree with all of the other endorsements.
How much does one potential leak cost?
With these there are little room for field error
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
PH: 937-516-8248
forest_wil...@aol.com
-Original Message-
From: Charles Thurston charl...@mbfsg.com
Doug,
You should only use factory pre mixed solutions.
It has been this way for years.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
PH: 937-516-8248
forest_wil...@aol.com
-Original Message-
From: Douglas Hicks fire...@eoni.com
To: sprinklerforum sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Sent
Jody,
For purposes of evaluating existing buildings and their sprinkler systems for
prospective buyers, NFPA 25 will not help you.
Forest Wilson
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Thanks,
Jamie Seidl
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Maybe it's like ordering checks...you never start with number one, usually
a higher number.
On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 12:16 PM, David Blackwell david.blackw...@llr.sc.gov
wrote:
While it doesn't address the NFPA numbering issue [1 vs. lucky 13...]
the following article entitled History Of The
required) is the fabric
sufficient to catch heat for sprinkler activation?
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Ph: 937-736-0425
///WHO
This is at the discretion of the water purveyor.
In most states, the EPA has jurisdiction over the water supply and
containment backflow devices fall under the water purveyor's jurisdiction,
not the building departments (or building code).
On Thu, Oct 2, 2014 at 8:44 PM, Dewayne Martinez
Last weekend, I participated in a local 9/11 Stair Climb in Yellow
Springs, OH.
I highly encourage anyone able and willing to participate in these
events across the country.
The funds raised in these events are used to aid families of disabled
and killed firefighters.
You can find events in
This is really a topic for SprinklerChat but it's gone now so I'm posting
it here.I need names of insurance companies for fire sprinkler contractors.
Please send me the name of your insurer, it is much needed and appreciated.
My current renewal fell through and I'm in a little bind.
Thank you.
I think that UL would be the listing lab.
On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 2:59 PM, Todd - Work t...@fpdc.com wrote:
Is there any progress on developing a listed anti-freeze solution? Who
would be the listing agency?
Todd G Williams, PE
Fire Protection Design/Consulting
Stonington, CT
www.fpdc.com
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I think the original poster was asking about limited area systems of 20 or
fewer heads.
IN OHio, most jurisdictions do not require annual testing of these systems.
This is from the city of Philadelphia website; they also do not require
annual testing:
ISSUE:
Section F-901.6 of the Philadelphia
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These exhauster rebuild kits are now available.
I just bought 2 from local Tyco distributor
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with
annual trip testing of the DPV, draining of the low point drains, etc.
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the use of
dezincification resistant (DZR) alloys.
Sent while mobile.
John Corcoran, Globe Fire Sprinkler Corporation
+989-439-5694
Original Message
From: Forest Wilson
Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2014 10:28 PM
To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Reply To: sprinklerforum
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Yes.
The escutcheons are part of the UL listed assembly.
Forest Wilson
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my iPad
On Apr 2, 2014, at 10:58 AM, Forest Wilson cherokeefire...@aol.com
wrote:
If I were you, I would email Reliable Technical Services and ask them:
Can the Model F1 be installed recessed without the escutcheon and still
maintain the UL listing?
Then take their response and forward
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, Mar 18, 2014 at 1:26 PM, Forest Wilson cherokeefire...@aol.comwrote:
Is your hand really sore and cramping after filling out 2 Hydraulic Plaque
signs?
On 3/18/2014 12:55 PM, Ben Young wrote: I know I can't be the only person
that gets tired of filling out hydraulic placards. My hand starts
.
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I would contact the manufacturer rep and ask for his recommendations in writing
and then send that to the AHJ
Forest Wilson
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Locate per 13 and send a calc sheet only if required in plan review.
Forest Wilson
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Just Change it from NO to NC when you connect the contacts
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Jim McHugh
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NFPA 25, as I recall, used to require same manufacturer but that was
changed a few years ago to Same characteristics/ specs.
I only mentioned same manufacturer in the purpose of this thread, changing
K Factor on obsolete recalled sprinklers.
You would have to look in 25 for clarification.
I do
You are correct.
You do not need to do calcs unless you use a head manufactured by other than
Tyco.
Tycos agreement with the federal government is to replace with a like for
Like model
Forest Wilson
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Ive seen it done.
Just ensure you use the sprinkler orifice size on the ITC.
Most remote area..
Forest Wilson
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sprinklered.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler Contractor
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I dont underatand how a fitting would be considered a pipe nipple.
The prohibition against using 1/2 pipe in earthquake zones should not apply to
the use of street l fittings.
If it did, then the same argument could could made against using any 1/2
fitting.
Forest Wilson
Fire Sprinkler
Question:
Are relocated drops considered modified sprinklers under NFPA 13
definitions?
Project has less than 20 sprinklers (existing branch lines and mains, new
sprinklers are drops installed into new mechanical tees)
More than 20 existing drops are being relocated.
Is a hydrostatic test of 200
Yes. The NFSA, AFSA and NFPA all offer classes
On Jan 14, 2014 12:54 PM, James D. Waite jdwa...@flsamerica.com wrote:
Has anyone used the NTC or FireTech training material for Sprinkler
Inspection Testing? Is it worth it? Is one better than the other? Are
there any other good ones available.
Road
Cantonment, FL 32533
850-937-1850
fax 850-937-1852
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This email was very helpful.
I've had problems for years.
Ironically I preferred AOL for emailing prints, etc but always had problems
with the Forum emails.
I opened up a Gmail account as you suggested.
Thabk you so much for this info.
On Jan 6, 2014 1:04 PM, Maurice Marvi maur...@marvi.org
is the recommended course of action for the owner?
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For clarification, only cellophane bags are permitted.
The common sandwich bags are not cellophane and not acceptable for covering a
sprinkler with.
Forest Wilson
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Keep simple?
4 way every change of direction.
Longitudinal every 80.
Latitudes every 40.
Flexible couplings top and bottom of riser.
These guidelines will satisfy most building departments.
Some will want calculations etc.
Forest Wilson
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thoughts?
Forest Wilson
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I would air test first but I think you will need the water test to find leaks
Sent from my Galaxy S®III
Original message
From: Scott A Futrell sco...@ffcdi.com
Date: 11/20/2013 9:06 AM (GMT-05:00)
To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Subject: RE: resurrecting an
So if they don't hang from the ceilings and instead construct a structure to
hang the bags from the question still exists.
You can visit any ups store or fedex office kinkos and find bags hung from
the ceiling.
Sent from my Galaxy S®III
Original message
From: Thomas
I've encountered this from the recalled sprinkler heads issue and I do believe
that recalled components should be identified.
If the only thing we are willing to conduct and guarantee is a main drain test
then the owners may as well self perform that because a trained monkey can do
that.
The best practice would be to submit the product sheets to the AHJ and ask for
a variance to install the head guards.
If he attaches them to the plywood then that's part of the ceiling and not part
of the head though. And that affects the 18 clearance rule.
Sent from my Galaxy S®III
Im not qualified to answer but my opinion is that much of these standards were
put In place for industry before internet, etc.
So that every job does not need to be reviewed by an engineer.
I was told the 250 lb requirement was to support the weight of the fitter
hanging the pipe. I don't
Ask if you can use FM standards?
Sent from my Galaxy S®III
Original message
From: Damien Shannon dshan...@pscl.ie
Date: 10/23/2013 2:54 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Subject: RE: Missing pages in NFPA 30
Hi Galen.
Thank you for the
I completely agree with Ron concerning the soldering of copper sensing lines.
This scope of work should be performed by a fire sprinkler contractor and not a
plumber.
You can gain these skills through a community college course
Sent from my Galaxy S®III
Original message
Lol.
Replaced with a more reliable rubber seal
It amazes me how people can miss these sprinklers for more than a decade
Sent from my Galaxy S®III
Original message
From: Thomas Watt firesprinklerssaveli...@gmail.com
Date: 10/14/2013 8:27 AM (GMT-05:00)
To:
Quick question on industry practices concerning remodels.
When we remove hard pipe drops and replace with flex heads in a remodel do we
need to perform hydraulic calcs?
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Original message
From: Terri S. Leyton te...@tlcfire.com
Date: 10/09/2013 6:35
I would first rule out the use of clothes hangers
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Original message
From: Phong - Indochine Engineering ph...@indoeng.com
Date: 10/05/2013 9:33 AM (GMT-05:00)
To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Subject: RE: Sprinkler broken in 05 star
This topic was addressed about a month ago on the Forum.
The consensus was that it was outside the scope of NFPA 13 and that the
Engineer of Record should be consulted
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Original message
From: David Bitton dbit...@questlosscontrol.com
Date:
Read 13- 1.2.1. References life and property protection (2010 edition)
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Original message
From: Charles Thurston charl...@mbfsg.com
Date: 09/26/2013 8:53 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: sprinklerfo...@firesprinkler.org
Subject: Life Safety or Property
We are in business to make money and on an issue like this we need to remember
the words of our dear late friend George Church: keep it simple
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Original message
From: rongreenman . rongreen...@gmail.com
Date: 09/24/2013 9:09 PM (GMT-05:00)
To:
I ordered a rebuild kit for a Star Exhauster BB and am having problems getting
a rubber rebuild kit for this valve.
Does anyone have a rebuild kit?
If this valve can't be rebuilt, what options are available? The system was
designed to function with the valve. It already has an accelerator on
I would place it in the same categoryas auxiliary drain valves and I don't
think it needs to be monitored
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Original message
From: Greg McGahan g...@livingwaterfp.com
Date: 09/25/2013 1:33 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: sprinklerfo...@firesprinkler.org
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