Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Christian Quest]

Le 01/06/2023 à 09:09, Simon Poole a écrit :


Am 31.05.2023 um 22:08 schrieb Christian Quest:


... OSM editors integration.


That was one of the reasons why I was asking, as I have already done 
some work on a STAC layer based on the GeoVisio API.



In that case you've already done Panoramax integration or a big part of 
it :)


I pushed Adrien to implement STAC support some months ago to stay in an 
existing standard.


For example, we're currently looking how to add access to statistics in 
our API, and STAC has statistics extension... so we will at least 
support it as far as possible !


First million pictures should be here is a very short term (combining 
IGN and OSMFR instances).


--
Christian Quest - OpenStreetMap France


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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

> On 31 May 2023, at 00:09, Niels Elgaard Larsen  wrote:
> 
> I often use Wikimedia Commons.
> There is an app that can both upload photos already taken and start a
> photo-app from the commons app.


+1, there is an app for iOS as well
https://apps.apple.com/it/app/wiki-uploader/id1271265731

in OpenStreetMap there is now an established specific tag:
https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/wikimedia_commons#overview___
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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Simon Poole]

Am 31.05.2023 um 22:08 schrieb Christian Quest:


... OSM editors integration.


That was one of the reasons why I was asking, as I have already done 
some work on a STAC layer based on the GeoVisio API.


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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Christian Quest]

Le 31/05/2023 à 09:25, Simon Poole a écrit :

Christian, does this relate in some fashion to Geovisio?

And a, I suppose, obvious observation: key for adoption in OSM would 
be an easy to access API for editing apps. Does that exist/are there 
plans for one?


Simon



Hello Simon,

Geovisio is the reference code base for the Panoramax project (think of 
Geovisio as one of OSM code stacks, and Panoramax as the OSM project as 
a whole).


What we try to do is to set open standards to allow different 
implementation of the common protocols to provide interoperability 
betweens instances. I would love to see local instances setup in the 
future all federated.


We decided to use an existing standard called STAC (Statio Temporal 
Assets Catalog) to avoid creating one more new standard. Geovisio 
originally has its own API, but now moved to STAC which is REST/JSON.


Anybody implementing a STAC API based viewer should be compatible. This 
API allows to search for pictures based on time and location (at least). 
Pictures are organized as collections.



The current work is focused on uploading pictures, bluring them to 
respect privacy, access them thru the STAC API used by the Geovisio viewer.


The additional pieces that would be great to have next are: mobile app 
to capture pictures, usefull object detection for OSM reuse (I'm working 
on road signs), OSM editors integration.



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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Andy Townsend]

On 24/05/2023 13:31, Greg Troxel wrote:

I just got spam from mapilio, implying that I was a "Mapilio
contributor".  This was, to my memory, the first I had heard of them.


Apparently, I am part of the "Mapilio Volunteer Community" according to 
a message I received at about the same time.




Thus, my approach will be to not deal with them at all and just block
their mail.


I am curious if anyone
   - thinks my assessment of the fundamentals is off
   - thinks there is a reasonable way to use their imagery in JOSM
   - anything else similar

There's continuing discussion at 
https://community.openstreetmap.org/t/mapilios-support-for-openstreetmap/99021/14 
.  They may, I guess, come up with something useful; they certainly seem 
to be trying to do so, but appear to have not done so yet.


Best Regards,

Andy




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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Simon Poole]

Christian, does this relate in some fashion to Geovisio?

And a, I suppose, obvious observation: key for adoption in OSM would be 
an easy to access API for editing apps. Does that exist/are there plans 
for one?


Simon

Am 30.05.2023 um 16:01 schrieb Christian Quest:

Le 24/05/2023 à 14:31, Greg Troxel a écrit :

I just got spam from mapilio, implying that I was a "Mapilio
contributor".  This was, to my memory, the first I had heard of them.


I have avoided most street-level imagery schemes as not being
structurally similar to OSM (open source tooling, community project and
licensing scheme).



I'm not answering directly to your post, but I think you may like my 
answer ;)



I'm currently working on the Panoramax project, co-originated by 
OpenStreetMap France and IGN (Institut Géographique National).


In the very near future, we should have a street-level imagery offer 
that matches:


- open source tooling

- community project

- (real) open licensing scheme

as well as...

- decrentralized / federated solution... to avoid having one more time 
a single point of failure with an actor hosting all the pictures !


We have not communicated much so far except in France on 
https://panoramax.fr/ as we're still working on the MVP.





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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Alexander Zatko]

freemap.sk  allows photo uploads, tagging, filtered search 
and more.

> On 31 May 2023, at 00:03, Niels Elgaard Larsen  wrote:
> 
> On Tue, 30 May 2023 20:36:54 +
> Andrew Hain  wrote:
> 
>> Is there an imagery host that offers an OSM-friendly way to support
>> mapping and is suitable for contributions using a smartphone or tablet?
> 
> I often use Wikimedia Commons.
> There is an app that can both upload photos already taken and start a
> photo-app from the commons app.
> 
> https://f-droid.org/en/packages/fr.free.nrw.commons/
> 
> You have to categorize images, but I do not mind that.
> 
> There are some limits to what you should upload to commons, e.g., many
> nearly identical images.
> 
> If the photo has location metadata then from the commons website you
> can open it on the OpenStreetmap website so that you can e.g., create a
> POI in josm or id. That part is not the most elegant, but it works.
> 
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Commons
> 
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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Niels Elgaard Larsen]

On Tue, 30 May 2023 20:36:54 +
Andrew Hain  wrote:

>Is there an imagery host that offers an OSM-friendly way to support
>mapping and is suitable for contributions using a smartphone or tablet?

I often use Wikimedia Commons.
There is an app that can both upload photos already taken and start a
photo-app from the commons app.

https://f-droid.org/en/packages/fr.free.nrw.commons/

You have to categorize images, but I do not mind that.

There are some limits to what you should upload to commons, e.g., many
nearly identical images.

If the photo has location metadata then from the commons website you
can open it on the OpenStreetmap website so that you can e.g., create a
POI in josm or id. That part is not the most elegant, but it works.

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Commons

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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[James]

Mapillary(facebook)

KartaView(was OpenStreetCam aquired by a taxi company)

On Tue, May 30, 2023, 4:43 PM Andrew Hain 
wrote:

> Is there an imagery host that offers an OSM-friendly way to support
> mapping and is suitable for contributions using a smartphone or tablet?
>
> --
> Andrew
> --
> *From:* Greg Troxel 
> *Sent:* 24 May 2023 13:31
> *To:* talk@openstreetmap.org 
> *Subject:* [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)
>
> I just got spam from mapilio, implying that I was a "Mapilio
> contributor".  This was, to my memory, the first I had heard of them.
>
>
> I have avoided most street-level imagery schemes as not being
> structurally similar to OSM (open source tooling, community project and
> licensing scheme).
>
> Looking briefly, it seems like a corporate thing with proprietary
> tooling.  They talk about an app in proprietary app stores but do not
> mention F-Droid :-) The point seems to be to monetize crowdsourced
> contributions, in a gamified/rewards-ish sort of way.
>
> I don't find a JOSM plugin that makes the imagery available in the way
> that their web page implies it is licensed for OSM.
>
> Thus, my approach will be to not deal with them at all and just block
> their mail.
>
>
> I am curious if anyone
>   - thinks my assessment of the fundamentals is off
>   - thinks there is a reasonable way to use their imagery in JOSM
>   - anything else similar
>
>   - has also been spammed (private replies please and I'll post a
> followup if I get a bunch of comments)
>
> Greg
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Andrew Hain]

Is there an imagery host that offers an OSM-friendly way to support mapping and 
is suitable for contributions using a smartphone or tablet?

--
Andrew

From: Greg Troxel 
Sent: 24 May 2023 13:31
To: talk@openstreetmap.org 
Subject: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

I just got spam from mapilio, implying that I was a "Mapilio
contributor".  This was, to my memory, the first I had heard of them.


I have avoided most street-level imagery schemes as not being
structurally similar to OSM (open source tooling, community project and
licensing scheme).

Looking briefly, it seems like a corporate thing with proprietary
tooling.  They talk about an app in proprietary app stores but do not
mention F-Droid :-) The point seems to be to monetize crowdsourced
contributions, in a gamified/rewards-ish sort of way.

I don't find a JOSM plugin that makes the imagery available in the way
that their web page implies it is licensed for OSM.

Thus, my approach will be to not deal with them at all and just block
their mail.


I am curious if anyone
  - thinks my assessment of the fundamentals is off
  - thinks there is a reasonable way to use their imagery in JOSM
  - anything else similar

  - has also been spammed (private replies please and I'll post a
followup if I get a bunch of comments)

Greg

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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Christian Quest]

Le 24/05/2023 à 14:31, Greg Troxel a écrit :

I just got spam from mapilio, implying that I was a "Mapilio
contributor".  This was, to my memory, the first I had heard of them.


I have avoided most street-level imagery schemes as not being
structurally similar to OSM (open source tooling, community project and
licensing scheme).



I'm not answering directly to your post, but I think you may like my 
answer ;)



I'm currently working on the Panoramax project, co-originated by 
OpenStreetMap France and IGN (Institut Géographique National).


In the very near future, we should have a street-level imagery offer 
that matches:


- open source tooling

- community project

- (real) open licensing scheme

as well as...

- decrentralized / federated solution... to avoid having one more time a 
single point of failure with an actor hosting all the pictures !


We have not communicated much so far except in France on 
https://panoramax.fr/ as we're still working on the MVP.



--
Christian Quest - OpenStreetMap France


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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Aimee Knight]

Hello,

>From following some links on their website, I would believe Tom's belief to
be correct, as looking at the Mapilio GitHub repos (
https://github.com/orgs/mapilio/repositories), the ones that are starred
are mostly starred by users from Turkey, including one who mentions being
involved with Visiosoft. They are however formally registered as a UK
Company (
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/13870355)
so if they are improperly contacting users, I would suggest after trying to
reach out to them, if there is no reply, then you can go through the ICO (
https://ico.org.uk/)

Personally from looking at their website and GitHub, I wouldn't trust this
company to handle data as it's not clear what they are actually collecting
and doing with the data. It all seems very vague.

*Aimee - speedbirdsunflower*
OSM Profile  and Wiki
Profile 


On Wed, 24 May 2023 at 20:47, David Haberthür 
wrote:

> Ciao a tutti
>
> > On 24 May 2023, at 14:31, Greg Troxel  wrote:
> >
> > I am curious if anyone
> >  - thinks my assessment of the fundamentals is off
>
> In my opinion not far off at all.
> I’ve tried out their app and immediately noticed some issues:
> - The (Mapbox) map they’re using in the (iOS app) didn’t attribute
> OpenStreetMap ([1], since fixed)
> - Processing a short sequence of 100 images [2] took nearly two weeks and
> several question/messages on their Discord server
> - Two emails sent to their main email were never answered; I’ve notified
> them that in their "Open data with Mapilio” linking to
> https://mapilio.com/openstreetmap they speak of OpenstreetMap (without
> capital S).
> - Their blog post about how to contribute is pure marketing speak and no
> essence.
> - They have a big GDPR page at https://mapilio.com/gdpr, but don’t seem
> to see the ‘export' part of the data very seriously [3]
>
> Greetings from Switzerland,
> Habi
>
> [1]:
> http://forum.mapilio.com/t/how-does-mapilio-contribute-to-openstreetmap/113/2
> [2]: At the moment, the only one in Switzerland at https://mapilio.com/app
> [3]: https://forum.mapilio.com/t/request-data-export/116/
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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[David Haberthür]

Ciao a tutti

> On 24 May 2023, at 14:31, Greg Troxel  wrote:
> 
> I am curious if anyone
>  - thinks my assessment of the fundamentals is off

In my opinion not far off at all.
I’ve tried out their app and immediately noticed some issues:
- The (Mapbox) map they’re using in the (iOS app) didn’t attribute 
OpenStreetMap ([1], since fixed)
- Processing a short sequence of 100 images [2] took nearly two weeks and 
several question/messages on their Discord server
- Two emails sent to their main email were never answered; I’ve notified them 
that in their "Open data with Mapilio” linking to 
https://mapilio.com/openstreetmap they speak of OpenstreetMap (without capital 
S).
- Their blog post about how to contribute is pure marketing speak and no 
essence.
- They have a big GDPR page at https://mapilio.com/gdpr, but don’t seem to see 
the ‘export' part of the data very seriously [3]

Greetings from Switzerland,
Habi

[1]: 
http://forum.mapilio.com/t/how-does-mapilio-contribute-to-openstreetmap/113/2
[2]: At the moment, the only one in Switzerland at https://mapilio.com/app
[3]: https://forum.mapilio.com/t/request-data-export/116/
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Re: [OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Tom Hughes via talk]

On 24/05/2023 13:31, Greg Troxel wrote:


I just got spam from mapilio, implying that I was a "Mapilio
contributor".  This was, to my memory, the first I had heard of them.


There have been a handful of mentions on the forum of various lists
in the last few months.

I too just got spammed by them - quite ironic given the GDPR Compliant
logo at the bottom of every page on their web site.


Looking briefly, it seems like a corporate thing with proprietary
tooling.  They talk about an app in proprietary app stores but do not
mention F-Droid :-) The point seems to be to monetize crowdsourced
contributions, in a gamified/rewards-ish sort of way.


The address on the web site actually appears to be a coffee shop
in Andover so I think we can discount that as a mere correspondence
address. The web site appears to have been created by a non-native
speaker of english which points overseas.

Looking at their "custom iD editor" repository there is actually
a single commit from today to add their imagery which was done by
a user with a visiosoft.com.tr address so possibly they are the
people really behind it?

Tom

--
Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu)
http://compton.nu/


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[OSM-talk] mapilio? (street-level imagery)

[Greg Troxel]

I just got spam from mapilio, implying that I was a "Mapilio
contributor".  This was, to my memory, the first I had heard of them.


I have avoided most street-level imagery schemes as not being
structurally similar to OSM (open source tooling, community project and
licensing scheme).

Looking briefly, it seems like a corporate thing with proprietary
tooling.  They talk about an app in proprietary app stores but do not
mention F-Droid :-) The point seems to be to monetize crowdsourced
contributions, in a gamified/rewards-ish sort of way.

I don't find a JOSM plugin that makes the imagery available in the way
that their web page implies it is licensed for OSM.

Thus, my approach will be to not deal with them at all and just block
their mail.


I am curious if anyone
  - thinks my assessment of the fundamentals is off
  - thinks there is a reasonable way to use their imagery in JOSM
  - anything else similar

  - has also been spammed (private replies please and I'll post a
followup if I get a bunch of comments)

Greg

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