Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 12:02 AM 6/22/2011, Jeff Driscoll wrote: http://www.testosites.de/export/sites/default/datalogger2011/en_INT/local_downloads/brochure_EN.pdf yes, this device, and its probes, measure the relative humidity of *air* . It does not measure steam quality. What is Galantini doing? I don

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

> > Okay, Krivit got a mail from Galantini: > http://blog.newenergytimes.com/2011/06/20/galantini-sends-e-mail-about-rossi-steam-measurements-today/ > > Galantini wrote: > >> Good morning, on the request made to me today, as I have repeatedly >> confirmed to me that many people have requested in th

RE: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

ABD wrote: "By the way, I think I erred when I reported the "operating range" as up to 85% RH, non-condensation. That was referring to the unit itself, not to the probe." That is correct. All instruments that I've ever dealt with, be it $100K microwave analyzers to simply DMMs and temperature

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 03:41 PM 6/21/2011, Jed Rothwell wrote: Jeff Driscoll wrote: I've been trying to say multiple times that the meter measures humidity of air up to 98% humidity. The probe can go to 150 C without being broken but that does not mean that it can measure accurately up to 150 C. But that's for *a

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 03:36 PM 6/21/2011, Jed Rothwell wrote: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: Look, Abd, you need to get real. I honestly have no idea how these meters work. That's right. I can tell you this: the brochure is quite specific as to what is measured, and it ain't enthalpy. What are you talking about?

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 01:46 PM 6/21/2011, Harry Veeder wrote: I don't think the probe is measuring the hot water at all. If they have already determined that the steam exiting the reactor is dry by sight and by feel, it is appropriate to measure the ratio of water-gas to air-gas with a suitable probe. But that'

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 12:44 PM 6/21/2011, Jeff Driscoll wrote: Rossi is dumping the evidence down the drain. Why else would he not dump it into a big tank and measure the temperature rise of the water? Abd says he just wants to confuse people and keep competitors away - I say it's because Rossi is a fraud. Just

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

About 8N/cm^2, or 10psi, a usual pressure for tires. I guess you feel that if you hold an automatic pneumatic hose to fill the a bicycle's tire.

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

1, 2011 3:47:44 PM > Subject: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam > > Sorry, I cannot see what is wrong with the steam measurements. It is > perfect according to the specification of all instruments. Even 2% > won't make a meaningful difference. What I want to see addressed >

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

- Original Message > From: Stephen A. Lawrence > To: vortex-l@eskimo.com > Sent: Tue, June 21, 2011 1:57:55 PM > Subject: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam > > > On 11-06-21 01:46 PM, Harry Veeder wrote: > > - Original Message > >&g

RE: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

One more important thing which may be happening this week - "behind the scenes". Defkalion has bought the rights to this device in Europe. It is possible that they did not agree to share with Rossi advances which they independently make. This could create a bit of friction in the future. Rossi is

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Sorry, I cannot see what is wrong with the steam measurements. It is perfect according to the specification of all instruments. Even 2% won't make a meaningful difference. What I want to see addressed properly is a proper calculation of the volume output of the hose, which seems too low.

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Jeff Driscoll wrote: I've been trying to say multiple times that the meter measures humidity of air up to 98% humidity. The probe can go to 150 C without being broken but that does not mean that it can measure accurately up to 150 C. But that's for *air* anyway. We want to know the steam quali

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: Look, Abd, you need to get real. I honestly have no idea how these meters work. That's right. I can tell you this: the brochure is quite specific as to what is measured, and it ain't enthalpy. What are you talking about? The brochure says that it measures, quote:

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

- Original Message > From: Jones Beene > To: vortex-l@eskimo.com > Sent: Tue, June 21, 2011 2:56:38 PM > Subject: RE: [Vo]:Something more on the steam > > -Original Message- > From: Stephen A. Lawrence > > > But it's pointless. >

RE: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

-Original Message- From: Stephen A. Lawrence > But it's pointless. Well, to be honest - this entire wet-steam / dry-steam argument (and the massive bandwidth) could be little more than a diversion now, and is of historical importance only - if and when there is NO required input electric

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

On 11-06-21 01:46 PM, Harry Veeder wrote: - Original Message From: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Tue, June 21, 2011 12:55:05 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam You are right you would not use it to measure the enthalpy of hot water. Bingo! Wet steam

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

- Original Message > From: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax > To: vortex-l@eskimo.com > Sent: Tue, June 21, 2011 12:55:05 PM > Subject: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam > > You are right you would not use it to measure the enthalpy of hot water. > Bingo! >Wet ste

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 09:44 AM 6/21/2011, Jed Rothwell wrote: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: Jed, these devices measure a number of things directly, and others are calculated. I see no sign that the device is designed to measure steam quality. It's not a described application. Yes, it is. The Delta Ohm meter with

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Abd is right, I've been trying to say multiple times that the meter measures humidity of air up to 98% humidity. The probe can go to 150 C without being broken but that does not mean that it can measure accurately up to 150 C. But that's for *air* anyway. We want to know the steam quality. This

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: Jed, these devices measure a number of things directly, and others are calculated. I see no sign that the device is designed to measure steam quality. It's not a described application. Yes, it is. The Delta Ohm meter with an HP474AC probe, the meter is intended to

Re: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

:24 AM Subject: Re: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: The Testo 650 is used for measuring *humidity*, Jed, for, like, food manufacturing and storage, etc. Read that HP literature. The device measures up to 100% humidity, it claims. Wet steam is above

Re: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

doesn't sting and it is invisible it passes the dry steam test.   Harry - Original Message > From: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax > To: vortex-l@eskimo.com > Sent: Tue, June 21, 2011 12:32:21 AM > Subject: Re: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam > > At 11:24 PM 6/20/2011

Re: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 11:24 PM 6/20/2011, you wrote: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax <a...@lomaxdesign.com> wrote: The Testo 650 is used for measuring *humidity*, Jed, for, like, food manufacturing and storage, etc. Read that HP literature. The device measures up to 100% humidity, it claims. W

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 10:38 PM 6/20/2011, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: On 11-06-20 10:11 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: At 04:10 PM 6/20/2011, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: Aw, these reports drive me nuts. I'd not read this one, I think. They have a pump for cooling water, it seems. So when they start up, they are p

Re: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: > The Testo 650 is used for measuring *humidity*, Jed, for, like, food > manufacturing and storage, etc. > > Read that HP literature. The device measures up to 100% humidity, it > claims. Wet steam is above 100% humidity. The literature claims that the > device measure

Re: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

The Testo 650 is used for measuring *humidity*, Jed, for, like, food manufacturing and storage, etc. Read that HP literature. The device measures up to 100% humidity, it claims. Wet steam is above 100% humidity. The literature claims that the device measures: CO2, CO, temperature, and relative

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

On 11-06-20 10:11 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: At 04:10 PM 6/20/2011, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: Aw, these reports drive me nuts. I'd not read this one, I think. They have a pump for cooling water, it seems. So when they start up, they are pumping an estimated 6.47 kg per hour of water. Th

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 04:10 PM 6/20/2011, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: Aw, these reports drive me nuts. I'd not read this one, I think. They have a pump for cooling water, it seems. So when they start up, they are pumping an estimated 6.47 kg per hour of water. They assume that this flow rate remains the same. Wh

Re: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Ah yes. It is right there in the testo.com brochure, isn't it? I vaguely recall that I checked this months ago for the instrument used in the first test: the Delta Ohm model HD37AB1347 IAQ with a high temperature HP474AC SICRAM sensor. I listed that in the news item with a link to the brochure her

Fwd: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

I received this message a few minutes ago. Take it FWIW. Original Message Subject:Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam Date: Mon, 20 Jun 2011 16:21:54 -0400 From: LEGUILLON Robert To: sa...@pobox.com Stephen, I'm not a member of the Vortex forum

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: Aw, these reports drive me nuts. I'd not read this one, I think. They have a pump for cooling water, it seems. So when they start up, they are pumping an estimated 6.47 kg per hour of water. They assume that this flow rate remains the same. Why? It's a constant dis

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

On 11-06-20 03:35 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: At 04:02 PM 6/19/2011, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: I've asserted recently that it was "obvious" to me that the steam was wet, and I've said, several times, that it would take too long to explain why. I've got a few minutes, so I'll see if I can

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 04:02 PM 6/19/2011, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: I've asserted recently that it was "obvious" to me that the steam was wet, and I've said, several times, that it would take too long to explain why. I've got a few minutes, so I'll see if I can fit in a coherent explanation. I think you have

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

At 06:44 PM 6/19/2011, mix...@bigpond.com wrote: If one were trying to reach the operating temperature of the device, wouldn't it make sense to have no water flowing until it was reached (or at least close)? Consider the complications. For a reminder, there are two chambers in the device, a r

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Eh? ALL those people have observed non-natural isotope ratios? That was what I was talking about there. On 11-06-20 09:51 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: Complex explanations have been proposed, ranging from insensitive equipment to bizarre multibody fusion theories. Y

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: Complex explanations have been proposed, ranging from insensitive equipment to bizarre multibody fusion theories. Yet, a very simple explanation covers the result very well: Rossi lies. That is not a "very simple explanation." It would be a very complicated one,

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

- Original Message > From: Stephen A. Lawrence > To: vortex-l@eskimo.com > Sent: Sun, June 19, 2011 9:09:23 PM > Subject: Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam > > > > On 11-06-19 06:44 PM, mix...@bigpond.com wrote: > > In reply to  Stephen A. Lawrence

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

On 11-06-19 06:44 PM, mix...@bigpond.com wrote: In reply to Stephen A. Lawrence's message of Sun, 19 Jun 2011 16:02:22 -0400: Hi, [snip] If the effluent isn't flowing, however, the temperature rise is limited only by the need to heat the thermal mass of the device, which is fixed. The "linea

RE: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

>From Robin, > My own personal impression (for what it's worth) is that Rossi has something > important and knows it, but doesn't understand it completely, and consequently > can't control it perfectly, which makes him a little insecure, so he easily > feels threatened, and says whatever he thinks

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

In reply to Stephen A. Lawrence's message of Sun, 19 Jun 2011 16:02:22 -0400: Hi, [snip] >Complex explanations have been proposed, ranging from insensitive >equipment to bizarre multibody fusion theories. Yet, a very simple >explanation covers the result very well: Rossi lies. My own personal

Re: [Vo]:Something more on the steam

In reply to Stephen A. Lawrence's message of Sun, 19 Jun 2011 16:02:22 -0400: Hi, [snip] >If the effluent isn't flowing, however, the >temperature rise is limited only by the need to heat the thermal mass of >the device, which is fixed. > >The "linearity" argument is very far from conclusive, of