On Fri, Sep 9, 2011 at 6:29 AM, Kragen Javier Sitaker <kra...@canonical.org> wrote: > On Fri, Sep 09, 2011 at 01:52:13AM +0200, Srini RamaKrishnan wrote: [...]
>> http://cheeni.posterous.com/whats-the-role-of-consumerism-in-the-modern-w > > That's very interesting! Ack, thanks. > I'm not sure what capitalism has to do with being free. Isn't capitalism the > economic system in which investors own the means of production in order to > save > their wealth, while workers are alienated from their meaningless labor, while > the price of everything is set by supply and demand so that the prices of > commodities are the same everywhere, except for tiny variations? How does > that > make people more or less free? I wonder if I need to answer this question, perhaps you've already understood why. It's quite obvious if you think for a moment. Consider for example http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercantilism And then read this if you need more context http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_economic_thought Progressively free markets have transformed Capitalism towards greater and greater "freedom". It's an illusion ultimately, but it undeniably gets more and more sophisticated every day. > I don't know that I agree that "we hate [the idea of a tribe] deep down, to > the > last human being." Certainly conflict between the interests of the individual > and of the collective is a universal part of the human condition; but many > people yearn for more connection to a tribe, not less. Maybe you and the > people you know best happen to be in a situation where you yearn for less, not > more, but I assure you that's not a universal part of the human condition. > Think about old people in nursing homes, for example. You need to contrast Idealism vs Practicality. Fundamentally every human being is selfish. This is biology we are talking about. There's a Tamil saying which loosely translated goes, "the mother and infant may be of the same organism, but there are now two mouths to feed". No man stops to admire a painting or helps a lady with her bags when he's desperately hunting for a toilet. An old person desires to be among human company in a nursing home because of practical constraints. If there was an elixir of youth there'd be very few hanging about in nursing homes. This too is selfishness, grandpa hangs about in nursing homes with other old people, not because he likes old people, but because he himself is old. If people could find peace within themselves, they wouldn't look outside. >> And then where would we go? What's the alternative? TBH, this is a rhetorical question. > Aren't there a lot of alternatives to consumerism? You can study under a > sadhu, live in an ashram, move to a kibbutz, turn into a housewife, become a > Mennonite, go raise goats, work a 9-5 job and bequeath your riches to a > scholarship fund instead of spending them during your lifetime, live alone in > the forest on saved money, etc. None of these free you from the task of > balancing individual with collective desires. Exactly...so none of these are the answer. Look further. I am merely looking at consumerism's popularity in my short text, there's a lot of background agreement in knowledge assumed. This short text I've shared is like an extract from the middle of a book, it's to whet your appetite - not to answer all questions. If / when the book is completed there should be a reasonably well rounded set of ideas to consider as a whole. If you already have the surrounding pieces of the tetris puzzle in your head, this blog post is like the block that completes a level. If this is the first block on a new level, you need to gather the remaining blocks from elsewhere. It's not very efficient for me to answer question by question; I'd rather spend more time writing out some more ideas. I don't yet have all the ideas either. If Knuth has his TAOCP project for the rest of his life, this is my project. The diploma will be my tombstone, as Eartha Kitt said. > Myself, I aspire to servitude to a tribe, the tribe of humanity, but I don't > think consumerism is a very good way to do it, both because it would make me > unhappy and because it doesn't have a solution to many of the biggest problems > we're facing today. Consumerism didn't stop Hosni Mubarak and it won't stop > Naxals or Marines or Lashkar-e-Taiba or global warming. Consumer boycotts are > usually ineffective. Yes, so it is iterative. Penicillin doesn't help always, but it's a life saver when it works. >> I have similar texts but in various states of edibility in my head and >> laptop, if this goes down well I may be tempted to bake them for >> general consumption over time. > > That would be great! Thanks. Cheeni
