Yes, that's it in a nutshell, Jeff- none of the others apply. The AHJ should NOT go to the NRC guidelines for pipe protection to apply to our apt building.
Also, the UCC section chief at L&I in Harrisburg agrees with me, also. We sized the nail plates by buying em from Caddy. glc From: Balson, Jon [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 11:01 AM To: '[email protected]' Subject: RE: UCC, IPC, IMC and spkrs George: We would say that he/she is wrongly interpreting/applying the code, but if he/she persists, the only statutorily provided means of resolving this is to file an appeal with the local appeals board (L&I was given no authority to render binding interpretations, except where the Department has jurisdiction.) We base our position on the following: The IPC-2006 scoping section says the following at section 101.2: The provisions of this code shall apply to the erection, installation, alteration, repairs, relocation, replacement, addition to, use or maintenance of plumbing systems within this jurisdiction. This code shall also regulate nonflammable medical gas, inhalation anesthetic, vacuum piping, nonmedical oxygen systems and sanitary and condensate vacuum collection systems. The installation of fuel gas distribution piping and equipment, fuel-gas-fired water heaters and water heater venting systems shall be regulated by the International Fuel Gas Code. Provisions in the appendices shall not apply unless specifically adopted. [Note: no mention of sprinkler systems or fire-protection systems, etc.] Further, Chapter 3 of the IPC-2006 defines "plumbing" as: The practice, materials and fixtures utilized in the installation, maintenance, extension and alteration of all piping, fixtures, plumbing appliances and plumbing appurtenances, within or adjacent to any structure, in connection with sanitary drainage or storm drainage facilities; venting systems; and public or private water supply systems. [Note: no mention of sprinkler systems or fire-protection systems, etc.] The scope of the IMC-2006 is defined at section 101.2 as: This code shall regulate the design, installation, maintenance, alteration and inspection of mechanical systems that are permanently installed and utilized to provide control of environmental conditions and related processes within buildings. This code shall also regulate those mechanical systems, system components, equipment and appliances specifically addressed herein. [Underlining added for emphasis. Note also that the IMC does not address sprinkler systems.] Jon C. Balson | Chief, UCC Division Bureau of Occupational & Industrial Safety PA Department of Labor & Industry 651 Boas Street | Harrisburg, PA 17121 Phone: 717.346.2729 | Fax: 717.787.8363 www.dli.state.pa.us/codes Auxiliary aids and services are available on request to individuals with disabilities. Equal Opportunity Employer/Program -----Original Message----- From: George Church [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 9:57 AM To: Balson, Jon Subject: UCC, IPC, IMC and spkrs Jon: Is it the intent of the PA UCC that the IPC and IMC apply to sprinkler piping in a building? I could understand the backflow and in some cases, the incoming service coming under the IPC. But I have a 3rd party AHJ that is attempting to invoke 305.8 from the IPC and 301.8 from the IMC, and I'm quite surprised that if these codes applied to our work, I'd know about it by now. I'd think that at some point- the control valve isolating the sprinkler system from a combined service, for example- the rules and regs of the IPC and/or IMC would no longer apply and the IFC and applicable NFPA installation standard- in this case NFPA #13R- would apply. Am I correct it is NOT the intent of the PA UCC to apply the IMC and IPC to sprinkler piping in buildings? George L. Church, Jr. President Rowe Sprinkler Systems, Inc. 7993 US Hwy 522 PO Box 407 Middleburg, PA 17842 570-837-7647 570-837-6335 fax [email protected] -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jeff Hewitt Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 11:40 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: IMC, IPC and nail plates I think you are missing the point. You have found the references within each Code, but do the Codes apply to Fire Suppression piping? Read the SCOPE of each document and you will find that it does NOT include Fire Suppression piping. Jeff Hewitt, PE, SET, SFPE (Professional Member) Corporate Engineer Bi-State Fire Protection Corporation 241 Hughes Lane St. Charles, MO 63301 636-946-0011 636-946-5172 (fax) 314-574-6989 (cell) Fire Sprinklers Save lives. Can You Live Without Them? -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Thom McMahon Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 10:28 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: IMC, IPC and nail plates IPC 2006 305.8 Protection against physical damage. In concealed locations where piping, other than cast-iron or galvanized steel, is installed through holes or notches in studs, joists, rafters or similar members less than 1.5 inches (38 mm) from the nearest edge of the member, the pipe shall be protected by shield plates. Protective shield plates shall be a minimum of 0.062-inch-thick (1.6 mm) steel, shall cover the area of the pipe where the member is notched or bored, and shall extend a minimum of 2 inches (51 mm) above sole plates and below top plates. IMC 2006 305.5 Protection against physical damage. In concealed locations where piping, other than cast-iron or steel, is installed through holes or notches in studs, joists, rafters or similar members less than 1.5 inches (38 mm) from the nearest edge of the member, the pipe shall be protected by shield plates. Protective shield plates shall be a minimum of 0.062-inch-thick (1.6 mm) steel, shall cover the area of the pipe where the member is notched or bored, and shall extend a minimum of 2 inches (51 mm) above sole plates and below top plates. Here's how we deal with this. We nail plate the sole plates(one or up to 3 depending on the construction, houses with gypcrete floors typically have an extra plate or two depending upon how thick the gyp is.) and slip a steel sleeve around the riser coming thru the plate.(We find we have enough scrap pipe around to keep a constant supply of 8" sleeves. We use 8" because we have base moldings here that go to 10" high on occasion.) Most walls we see are double plates at the top. Only the upper plate is the actual "Top Plate" the second plate has a name I forget right now. Any way we nail plate both plates and have our "Nominal" 2" below the top plate. We've never had any problem with doing this from any inspector. Thom McMahon, SET Firetech, Inc. 2560 Copper Ridge Dr P.O. Box 882136 Steamboat Springs, CO 80488 Tel: 970-879-7952 Fax: 970-879-7926 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of George Church Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 7:59 AM To: [email protected] Subject: IMC, IPC and nail plates Had an interesting encounter with an AHJ this week. He stopped by a jobsite where we're installing CPVC in walls, and found fault with the nail plates we're using. I called to follow up on why he didn't like them, and asked for a code reference. He replied even if it wasn't in the code, he'd enforce nailplates extending further than ours as a safety issue. So I reminded him that his authority was to enforce the PA UCC as adopted, not safety issues he took a personal liking to. His code reference arrived by USPS this AM. He cited the IPC and IMC as applicable to sprinkler piping, which I disagree with. Any thoughts or previous rulings by other AHJs? George Church Rowe Sprinkler _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
