He summed it up that to 22" deflector it's just normal obstructed construction. Doesn't matter what the construction type is. If you have a situation where the 22" won't work because something is lower and too close to spray under then if it's tee construction you can evaluate for the special application. Along with stem spacing, deflector position and baffling you might have an option to go as far down as 31" deflector. I agree the sheet you mention IMHO is a little confusing. 6 weeks ago I bid this same project with your interpretation and did not use EC because we thought the baffling would be more expensive in the end. I revisited yesterday after finding my beloved competition $60k less on my $165k of work. So I started revisiting assumptions to see where I could be that wrong. With this in theory I could lower my price $9k but it would add a draft curtain between this area and an ESFR area. Regular coverage QR ec SR. So I'm left looking for $55k (which if my guys would work for free I can find).
Chris -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Geoff Dyce Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 8:50 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Tyco EC 14 & Double Tee's Hey Chris. Not a problem I guess when it comes from the company. I just completed a job almost identical to this string. My tees were only 22" deep but were 60-0 in lgth. I went to Tyco literature and it pretty much disagrees with what they told you on the phone. I followed their submittal data.......TYCO-Tech Data-Extended Coverage-TFP220 (EC14's)-pg 4-Concrete tees item #1. Tell me I'm wrong because I would love to use EC hds but I interpret this spec for what it says. Thanks Geoff -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chris Cahill Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 9:40 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Tyco EC 14 & Double Tee's Well all I relayed is what Tyco told me < 2 hours ago. A 58' long tee's in my case with only a 22" stem would not require baffles with the use of EC14's. Ken was quick and certain like he fielded this question before. Chris -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Geoff Dyce Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 8:33 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Tyco EC 14 & Double Tee's Chris. Over 32 ft in lgth, with EC heads, you will need baffles. Says so in the specs! It does not say this for 5.6 or 8.0 std or QR sprks. I believe the 32-0 lgth is the deciding factor for EC heads. G -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chris Cahill Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 8:51 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Tyco EC 14 & Double Tee's Just got off the phone with Tyco. FYI if you can keep a 22" deflector you do not need to look at the special application stuff. So depending on stem oc dimensions you might get to 22-24" deep before you have to go with baffles. Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: [email protected] Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Geoff Dyce Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 7:37 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Tyco EC 14 & Double Tee's Just an opinion but EC hds. require the baffles as noted for, I believe, all mfgrs. EC heads in concrete tee construction. If you look at regular QR sprks and not EC, it does not appear that you need baffles. G -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chris Cahill Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 5:05 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Tyco EC 14 & Double Tee's In the Design Criteria these heads are listed for the generic obstructed construction. Great, 1-6" down 22" max etc. But then there is a special application for concrete tee's that gives you up to 31" down if you meet all the other criteria. Think baffles 32' o.c. So the question is if I can hold the 22" and meet the normal obstruction rules can I use these under tee's like normal obstructed construction or do I still have to use the special application requirements? (Tyco is closed for the day) I think the answer is yes. I think the special application is only for an exception to the "exception" that allows 22" down compared to the normal 1-12". But I can read it either way. In this case I'd like to stick with 22" because I can with the particulars on the job. So I have a biased opinion. And I'm only bidding so not in a pinch (yet). Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: [email protected] Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
